A 4th starting pitcher is useless once you get past your regional......

[Taog Redloh]

Whatever Houston did last night, it needs to translate to the bullpen, where we will need help in the postseason. I see a thread on 6pack saying how great it is that we found a 4th starter. Damn people, this isn't February.

[msstate7]

Or maybe the 3rd game of the regional, we face a heavy rh hitting team and use Houston.

[Liverpooldawg]

Whatever Houston did last night, it needs to translate to the bullpen, where we will need help in the postseason. I see a thread on 6pack saying how great it is that we found a 4th starter. Damn people, this isn't February.

You have to get past the regional.

[shoeless joe]

Stay in the winners bracket and it won't matter...but nice to think we could survive an extra game if needed. But one great game does not a starting pitcher make! Consistency is what makes or breaks a ball player.

[Taog Redloh]

You have to get past the regional.

We are a national seed. Can't lose in your own regional. If we do that means our top guys didn't get it done, not the 4th pitcher.

[the59dawg]

We are a national seed. Can't lose in your own regional. If we do that means our top guys didn't get it done, not the 4th pitcher.

If you do lose a game in the regional, you have to have a 4th pitcher. We will probably start Houston in the regional against the #4 seed.

[MarketingBully]

If we go through to the CWS and stay in the winner's bracket, a fourth starting pitcher is crucial so you can setup your weekend rotation for the championship series. Did you not learn anything from UCLA and 2013? They took a calculated risk started a fourth starter, setup their weekend rotation and kicked our ass in the championship series.

[PassInterference]

Isn't it good to for our starters to rest if we can get it done in the SECT with depth?

[Taog Redloh]

If we go through to the CWS and stay in the winner's bracket, a fourth starting pitcher is crucial so you can setup your weekend rotation for the championship series. Did you not learn anything from UCLA and 2013? They took a calculated risk started a fourth starter, setup their weekend rotation and kicked our ass in the championship series.

Disagree. You're wrong on two counts. UCLA started a 3rd starter, and had they lost a game in the Finals, they likely lose the whole thing. Second, it's not even necessary to do that. You can get to the Finals just like we did, using your ace twice. Then, the ace can come back on Game 2 (or 3, if you lose) of the Finals.

You don't seem to understand that we HAD to win either Game 1 or 2. It didn't matter what UCLA did.

[Taog Redloh]

If you do lose a game in the regional, you have to have a 4th pitcher. We will probably start Houston in the regional against the #4 seed.

A national seed's 3rd or 4th pitchers have to be able to beat a loser's bracket team's 4th or 5th pitcher, and on the road no less.

[HardyStreetAlumniClub]

It takes 5 games to come out of the losers bracket in Omaha and advance to the championship round. You have to beat the winners bracket team twice on the last day. Even if you are in the winners bracket until the last day, it could take 4 games to finish them off.

So yes, it's great that we found a 4th starter. We need a 5th just in case.

[MarketingBully]

Disagree. You're wrong on two counts. UCLA started a 3rd starter, and had they lost a game in the Finals, they likely lose the whole thing. Second, it's not even necessary to do that. You can get to the Finals just like we did, using your ace twice. Then, the ace can come back on Game 2 (or 3, if you lose) of the Finals.

You don't seem to understand that we HAD to win either Game 1 or 2. It didn't matter what UCLA did.

Savage took a calculated risk and started a non-weekend starter to setup his rotation. They had all three weekend pitchers at their disposal for our championship series with them. He even talked about that being a point of emphasis in his post game press conference. You don't pitch your ace if you have other great arms you can throw out there when you have another game to play with. We did and UCLA didn't and that was the biggest difference in the championship series. With this team starting pitching is a strength, so given the same circumstances we would pitch a Houston to setup Hudson to start the championship series. That gives us the best chance to win a National Championship and why having four and even five starting pitchers (including Cyr) is crucial to win in Omaha.

[Taog Redloh]

It takes 5 games to come out of the losers bracket in Omaha and advance to the championship round. You have to beat the winners bracket team twice on the last day. Even if you are in the winners bracket until the last day, it could take 4 games to finish them off.

So yes, it's great that we found a 4th starter. We need a 5th just in case.

Wrong. Omaha games are spaced way out. If we played 5 games out of the loser's bracket we'd go Hudson-Sexton-Pilkington, then back to Hudson and Sexton for the bracket championship. You are talking about Saturday for Game 1, Monday for Game 2, Wednesday for Game 3, then Friday for the 4th game. 5 days rest, plenty to bring back your starter. Then if you make the championship series, you bring your no. 3 out first.

It also depends on your bracket, one side gets an extra day. But that's still 4 days rest.

[Lumpy Chucklelips]

All I know is it doesn't hurt to have found a 4th guy who the meddler and his teammates can trust and who has gained some confidence in himself. One other advantage....if you get a rainout in the 3rd inning and lose Dakota or Sexton from a start, this gives you an advantage from someone who doesn't have the luxury of that 4th guy.

[MarketingBully]

Wrong. Omaha games are spaced way out. If we played 5 games out of the loser's bracket we'd go Hudson-Sexton-Pilkington, then back to Hudson and Sexton for the bracket championship. You are talking about Saturday for Game 1, Monday for Game 2, Wednesday for Game 3, then Friday for the 4th game. 5 days rest, plenty to bring back your starter. Then if you make the championship series, you bring your no. 3 out first.

It also depends on your bracket, one side gets an extra day. But that's still 4 days rest.

And that is why UCLA kicked our ass. They had a brilliant pitching strategy that worked to perfection. I'll take my ace going up against an other team's third starter any day of the week. If you pitch your ace on that last day before the championship series, you aren't winning Omaha.

[QuadrupleOption]

Whatever Houston did last night, it needs to translate to the bullpen, where we will need help in the postseason. I see a thread on 6pack saying how great it is that we found a 4th starter. Damn people, this isn't February.

It may be useless, but it sure as Hell can't hurt.

[Taog Redloh]

Savage took a calculated risk and started a non-weekend starter to setup his rotation. They had all three weekend pitchers at their disposal for our championship series with them. He even talked about that being a point of emphasis in his post game press conference. You don't pitch your ace if you have other great arms you can throw out there when you have another game to play with. We did and UCLA didn't and that was the biggest difference in the championship series. With this team starting pitching is a strength, so given the same circumstances we would pitch a Houston to setup Hudson to start the championship series. That gives us the best chance to win a National Championship and why having four and even five starting pitchers (including Cyr) is crucial to win in Omaha.

Dude stop saying this dumb shit. They started their #3 guy against North Carolina, Grant Watson. The guy had 17 starts that year and he was their Sunday starter.

We also had all 3 starters available for the championship series. Graveman was going to pitch on Wednesday had we won. You do realize that you have to win another game to win a national title, right?

The difference is the championship series for UCLA was clutch hitting and GREAT pitching and defense overall. They simply made ZERO mistakes. They were the best team on that field, in June 2013. Bottom line.

[Taog Redloh]

And that is why UCLA kicked our ass. They had a brilliant pitching strategy that worked to perfection. I'll take my ace going up against an other team's third starter any day of the week. If you pitch your ace on that last day before the championship series, you aren't winning Omaha.

Oh no? Michael Roth says hello.

[Brando]

Or maybe the 3rd game of the regional, we face a heavy rh hitting team and use Houston.

Why this almost makes sense to me! Prolly the best thing I have read. Play the matchups. We now have a legit #3 in either LHP or RHP... we cn pitch whichever we need. The more rest Hudson and Sexton can get the better. It will help down the road.

[MarketingBully]

Oh no? Michael Roth says hello.

When was Michael Roth a third starter?

[Taog Redloh]

Why this almost makes sense to me! Prolly the best thing I have read. Play the matchups. We now have a legit #3 in either LHP or RHP... we cn pitch whichever we need. The more rest Hudson and Sexton can get the better. It will help down the road.

Agreed, msstate7 makes a valid counterargument. And we know Coinz loves matchups.

[Taog Redloh]

When was Michael Roth a third starter?
He wasn't. I replied to this:


If you pitch your ace on that last day before the championship series, you aren't winning Omaha.
Roth in 3rd game of Omaha:
http://www.gamecocksonline.com/sports/m-basebl/stats/2010-2011/sc67_uva.html

Roth in Game 2 of chip series:
http://www.gamecocksonline.com/sports/m-basebl/stats/2010-2011/sc69_uf.html

Tanner used him in Game 2 on 3 days rest, I'd have maybe rested him. But they saw Florida wounded and went for the kill.

[MarketingBully]

Why is it hard not to understand and see that having four to five legitimate starters is a great thing? It seems common sense would dictate this.

[CadaverDawg]

I agree with Goat, we need Houston to do that out of the pen in the postseason.

However, I also was thinking about what msstate7 said, and I totally agree. It also gives you the option of having Houston ready to roll behind Pilk since he rarely goes longer than 5-6. Hell, I wish we could have both Houston and Pilk warm so we can have a quick hook in the postseason. Basically ride the hot hand in that 3rd start. But primarily the matchup idea, and Houston for long relief behind Pilk (or even Hudson/Sexton if they were to struggle early). It just gives you that long relief guy where you don't feel like you HAVE to leave a starter out there if he's struggling in the early to mid-innings.

Definitely isn't a bad thing. But no, we won't need a 4th starter

[Taog Redloh]

Why is it hard not to understand and see that having four to five legitimate starters is a great thing? It seems common sense would dictate this.

I never said this. Nice little switcharoo after I buried you in the other off-shoots.

It's great is February or March. Not as necessary in June.

[Brando]

Here is the problem with Pilk then to Houston. Houston needs to start. He is a headcase out of the pen 50% of time. It would prolly work if Houston started and Pilk then came in. I would rather count on both of them starting a game if need be. I feel comfortable throwing Houston against a SWAC team in the 1st game of a regional.

[Taog Redloh]

Here is the problem with Pilk then to Houston. Houston needs to start. He is a headcase out of the pen 50% of time. It would prolly work if Houston started and Pilk then came in. I would rather count on both of them starting a game if need be. I feel comfortable throwing Houston against a SWAC team in the 1st game of a regional.

I wonder if we brought Houston in at the beginning of an inning, with no situation and from the wind-up, would that help trick his mind? Because yes I agree it's all mental. I mean Rigby, Smith and Brown are all good situational guys. Let them get out of the jams and them let Houston come in with a clean slate.

[MarketingBully]

Here is the problem with Pilk then to Houston. Houston needs to start. He is a headcase out of the pen 50% of time. It would prolly work if Houston started and Pilk then came in. I would rather count on both of them starting a game if need be. I feel comfortable throwing Houston against a SWAC team in the 1st game of a regional.

I agree. Houston has to start and I wouldn't mind him becoming the third starter in the post season if the matchups dictated it. We do need some of the freshmen in the pen to step up. For the most part, I think we should rely on Rigby and Daniel Brown heavily in the post season. That's two long relievers we can trust right and left. Blake Smith is becoming more reliable too. We definitely have the arms to have an effective pen down the stretch. Some of the arms just need more work.

[MarketingBully]

I wonder if we brought Houston in at the beginning of an inning, with no situation and from the wind-up, would that help trick his mind? Because yes I agree it's all mental. I mean Rigby, Smith and Brown are all good situational guys. Let them get out of the jams and them let Houston come in with a clean slate.

Todd had a good read on this situation. Houston has a starter's mentality and it takes a while for him to get warmed up. Bringing him in as a reliever is just going to yield mixed results I am afraid.

[Taog Redloh]

Todd had a good read on this situation. Houston has a starter's mentality and it takes a while for him to get warmed up. Bringing him in as a reliever is just going to yield mixed results I am afraid.

Good point. But knowing what we know, I still think it's worth a shot. I noticed that Houston came out of the pen against Florida on Sunday after Pilkington threw 4 complete innings. Houston went 3.1 and shut them down. Then we abandoned that strategy.

I mean, couldn't we have Houston "warm up" in the pen during the game?

[smootness]

Are we seriously arguing over whether it's good or meaningless to establish a good 4th starter? Good gosh, people.

[smootness]

Houston has been good all year, in any role. His walks have been high at times, but other than that, he's been really good.

[Taog Redloh]

Houston has been good all year, in any role. His walks have been high at times, but other than that, he's been really good.
Yeah, I bet he has. He and every other strong arm pitcher.

[Taog Redloh]

Are we seriously arguing over whether it's good or meaningless to establish a good 4th starter?
No, we are arguing over whether or not it's meaningless once past the regional. You know, what I said in the OP.

[HoopsDawg]

No offense to Pilk, but Houston would be my 3rd starter now. Apparently, he made a mechanical adjustment last week and it paid off. Houston just has much better stuff. He actually has the 2nd best stuff on our staff. The bama coach raved and raved about him.

Also, it's hard to argue with 5-0, 1.93 ERA.

[confucius say]

Wrong. Omaha games are spaced way out. If we played 5 games out of the loser's bracket we'd go Hudson-Sexton-Pilkington, then back to Hudson and Sexton for the bracket championship. You are talking about Saturday for Game 1, Monday for Game 2, Wednesday for Game 3, then Friday for the 4th game. 5 days rest, plenty to bring back your starter. Then if you make the championship series, you bring your no. 3 out first.

It also depends on your bracket, one side gets an extra day. But that's still 4 days rest.

If you lose your first or second game in Omaha it will be nice to have a fourth starter. Otherwise you have Hudson on Saturday, sexton on Monday, pilk on Wednesday, Hudson on short rest Friday, sexton on short rest Saturday, pilk on short rest Monday, Hudson very short rest Tuesday, sexton on very short rest Wednesday. Not saying it can't be done, would just be a nice luxury to have a fourth starter.

[Taog Redloh]

If you lose your first or second game in Omaha it will be nice to have a fourth starter. Otherwise you have Hudson on Saturday, sexton on Monday, pilk on Wednesday, Hudson on short rest Friday, sexton on short rest Saturday, pilk on short rest Monday, Hudson very short rest Tuesday, sexton on very short rest Wednesday. Not saying it can't be done, would just be a nice luxury to have a fourth starter.

This is pretty much how teams do it, though. Now, if Houston can maybe replicate that performance again in a regional and we then would have 3 above average starters - sure, take the risk and let him go in Omaha. However a 4th pitcher is not an option. I personally think the decision is between Houston and Pilkington.....one needs to be #3 and one needs to go the pen.

[Dawg61]

No offense to Pilk, but Houston would be my 3rd starter now. Apparently, he made a mechanical adjustment last week and it paid off. Houston just has much better stuff. He actually has the 2nd best stuff on our staff. The bama coach raved and raved about him.

Also, it's hard to argue with 5-0, 1.93 ERA.

This! Houston needs to be our #3 right now not Pilk. Throwing 95mph at pitch 110. We need Houston as a starter not bullpen.

[LC Dawg]

No offense to Pilk, but Houston would be my 3rd starter now. Apparently, he made a mechanical adjustment last week and it paid off. Houston just has much better stuff. He actually has the 2nd best stuff on our staff. The bama coach raved and raved about him.

Also, it's hard to argue with 5-0, 1.93 ERA.

I think this possibility is a big reason Houston pitched yesterday. The staff obviously had a lot of faith in him and wanted to see what the adjustment did for him.
The SEC tourney setup actually presents a scenario that could make this real interesting. If we win tonight and Sexton starts Saturday and we lose then Pilkington won't pitch in the tourney and his last outing was a not so great start against Arkansas. I hope we win out and Pilkington pitches a great game Sunday and our staff has too many starters because that's better than not enough.
All that being said, it really won't surprise me if Houston starts a game in the regional.

[Brando]

Okay, how about this if we win out in the tourney. Hudson tonight, Sexton Sat, Pilk in SEC champ game. If we do that, how do we set the regional rotation? Im thinking for me, Houston gm1, Hudson gm2, Sexton gm3 and can bring in Pill after Sexton if needed.