A sobering thought as we are about to enter Spring Practice

[Coach34]

We saw this past season how a sub-par OL can keep a really good team from winning 10 or more games.

Star rating composiye averages for the SEC West entering 2016:

Avg star

Alabama 4.0
LSU 3.6
Texas A&M 3.6
Arkansas 3.5
Auburn 3.5
Northern Miss 3.3
State 2.9

[Jack Lambert]

We saw this past season how a sub-par OL can keep a really good team from winning 10 or more games.

Star rating composiye averages for the SEC West entering 2016:

Avg star

Alabama 4.0
LSU 3.6
Texas A&M 3.6
Arkansas 3.5
Auburn 3.5
Northern Miss 3.3
State 2.9




Based on record and who we have beaten the past several years it doesn't look to be that much difference tween 3.5 to 2.9.

[Jacksondevildog]

Good thing that is the one position that star ratings usually get somewhat wrong, unless a sure fire 5 star.

[Coach34]

Based on record and who we have beaten the past several years it doesn't look to be that much difference tween 3.5 to 2.9.

disagree- last 4 years:

LSU- 1-3
A&M- 1-3
Northern Miss- 1-3
UPig- 3-1
Auburn- 3-1

9-11 overall

[Barkman Turner Overdrive]

We saw this past season how a sub-par OL can keep a really good team from winning 10 or more games.

Star rating composiye averages for the SEC West entering 2016:

Avg star

Alabama 4.0
LSU 3.6
Texas A&M 3.6
Arkansas 3.5
Auburn 3.5
Northern Miss 3.3
State 2.9




We good. Hevesey is a master at developing OL talent.***********

[Bully13]

Surprised unm isn't higher. But that was one of their weaknesses like ours last year.

[Barkman Turner Overdrive]

disagree- last 4 years:

LSU- 1-3
A&M- 1-3
Northern Miss- 1-3
UPig- 3-1
Auburn- 3-1

9-11 overall

Pretty sure we are 4-0 over the last 4 against UPig.

[chef dixon]

disagree- last 4 years:

LSU- 1-3
A&M- 1-3
Northern Miss- 1-3
UPig- 3-1
Auburn- 3-1

9-11 overall

Yea sorry coach but you kinda proved his point right there

but yes, it is an issue if you want to beat elite teams

[Johnson85]

We saw this past season how a sub-par OL can keep a really good team from winning 10 or more games.

Star rating composiye averages for the SEC West entering 2016:

Avg star

Alabama 4.0
LSU 3.6
Texas A&M 3.6
Arkansas 3.5
Auburn 3.5
Northern Miss 3.3
State 2.9




How many linemen are included in that rating? I know it's just an indication but that could be pretty misleading depending on how those stars are distributed. If you have 12 OL on scholarship, you're going to have 4 OL that are basically meaningless as far as how things go on the field, unless you just have major injury issues.

Not sure if that is likely to make us look better or worse. Probably a little worse since several of our "highly rated" guys haven't panned out and we're going to be relying on a couple of guys that were barely recruited at all. Big thing for us is making sure our weak link is relatively strong, because I think we know that we won't have any standouts on the OL this year.

[mic]

With no juco's or impact freshman coming in. ... We will get a good look what our 2 deep will look like this spring..
Rankin better be the real deal at one of Tackles

[Coach34]

It's an average rating of every OL player for each team moving forward

[Commercecomet24]

disagree- last 4 years:

LSU- 1-3
A&M- 1-3
Northern Miss- 1-3
UPig- 3-1
Auburn- 3-1

9-11 overall

We are 4-0 against Arkansas last 4 years

[NCDawg]

We good. Hevesey is a master at developing OL talent.***********

And what is even more disconcerting, Mullen refuses to make a change with the OL coach because of his close friendship, even though the OL has underperformed for the past several years. In view of Mullen's stubbornness, I don't have great expectations for the coming year.

[Coach34]

Yea sorry coach but you kinda proved his point right there

but yes, it is an issue if you want to beat elite teams

Not when we have been getting our ass handed to us by 3 of the 5 teams. Piling up wins vs the 2 weakest ones isn't about even. Auburn and UPig are the only teams to finish last in the West the last 4 years

[Bully13]

Keep in mind too that we had the best qb in the conference. A great mask for your ugly OL. I hate to think what last year would have been like with a mediocre QB Make that the last 2 yrs.

[Coach34]

We are 4-0 against Arkansas last 4 years

my bad on that. Still doesn't change we have owned the cellar dweller the last 4 years. 4-0 vs the West cellar dweller- 6-10 vs the rest

[Coach34]

But aside from that- that's an average going forward- not what's been happening the last 4 years

[chef dixon]

Not when we have been getting our ass handed to us by 3 of the 5 teams. Piling up wins vs the 2 weakest ones isn't about even. Auburn and UPig are the only teams to finish last in the West the last 4 years

Yea but he was saying difference between 2.9 and 3.5, which is the teams we have beaten

[Commercecomet24]

my bad on that. Still doesn't change we have owned the cellar dweller the last 4 years. 4-0 vs the West cellar dweller- 6-10 vs the rest

I agree that for us to take the next step our OL play defintely has to change. That being said our OL has really only struggled against the truly elite defenses(which most teams do). Unfortunately for us they're several elite defenses in our division. We will continue to beat the mediocre to good teams, but will struggle against the elites until we get better OL.

[maroonmania]

The problem with a star average that low is that you've got way too many guys that aren't expected to help you at a high level in the SEC until they are AT LEAST RS JRs. The reason we had our best OL under Mullen in 2014 was that you had guys like Day, Clausell and Beckwith that were lower rated players but had been in the program for many years "developing". Last year we had guys we hadn't had 3 or 4 years in the program before being counted on and we were bad along the OL, real bad. Of course the difference really shows up when we go against teams with elite DLs. We are able to scheme around a lot of our problems when we are playing teams with mediocre DLs.

[Commercecomet24]

The problem with a star average that low is that you've got way too many guys that aren't expected to help you at a high level in the SEC until they are AT LEAST RS JRs. The reason we had our best OL under Mullen in 2014 was that you had guys like Day, Clausell and Beckwith that were lower rated players but had been in the program for many years "developing". Last year we had guys we hadn't had 3 or 4 years in the program before being counted on and we were bad along the OL, real bad. Of course the difference really shows up when we go against teams with elite DLs. We are able to scheme around a lot of our problems when we are playing teams with mediocre DLs.

This is correct. I'll even say we play well against good DL's too, its just the truly Elite D's that we struggle against. Unfortunately for us we do play several of those.

[Tripp McNeely]

But aside from that- that's an average going forward- not what's been happening the last 4 years

Don't have time to do the research, and not even sure if I could, but I would wager pretty heavily that gap between us and Bama, or even between us and Ark/Aubie, was MUCH wider 4 years ago.

[maroonmania]

We saw this past season how a sub-par OL can keep a really good team from winning 10 or more games.

Star rating composiye averages for the SEC West entering 2016:

Avg star

Alabama 4.0
LSU 3.6
Texas A&M 3.6
Arkansas 3.5
Auburn 3.5
Northern Miss 3.3
State 2.9




Also, I think this shows why Scott Lashley, a very talented but very raw OL, took a big risk by signing with Bama. Bama has so many top OL prospects signing with them, most much more polished than Lashley, that there is a higher likelihood that Lashley isn't given the development time and attention he needs and is lost in the shuffle of a lot of talented players. Bama doesn't need to wait on guys to develop the same way that we do. Bama overall probably signs the highest average rated OL prospects in the nation.

[maroonmania]

This is correct. I'll even say we play well against good DL's too, its just the truly Elite D's that we struggle against. Unfortunately for us we do play several of those.

Well last year, we struggled only against Elite DLs in PASS BLOCKING. We couldn't even block a Troy level DL to run the ball. Our run blocking last year was truly pathetic and among the worst I've ever seen at MSU in any era.

[Tbonewannabe]

disagree- last 4 years:

LSU- 1-3
A&M- 1-3
Northern Miss- 1-3
UPig- 3-1
Auburn- 3-1

9-11 overall

With the win/loss record, you also have to look at our shitty Oline vs their Dline and their Oline vs our pretty good Dline. For the most part Upig and Auburn has not had a very good Dline when we have beaten them. Our Dline has been top half of the league the past few years. We have only had a marginally good Oline in 2014. Other than 2014, our Oline has gotten wrecked vs the better Dlines.

[Commercecomet24]

Well last year, we struggled only against Elite DLs in PASS BLOCKING. We couldn't even block a Troy level DL to run the ball. Our run blocking last year was truly pathetic and among the worst I've ever seen at MSU in any era.

I will agree with you on that. It was the first time in Mullen's tenure that we didn't run the ball well. It's really hard to tell though, because it seems like all of our backs not named Shumpert were able to find holes at times. It was an odd year on the offensive side of the ball.

[Commercecomet24]

I've rewatched every game and looked at OL play. When Jenkins and Calhoun were in the game our run game and holes for our backs to run thru were noticeably better and both of those players were just getting their feet wet. I don't feel as bad about the OL after watching how effective we were when those 2 were playing. Still OL has got to catch up with the rest of the team.

[HoopsDawg]

But aside from that- that's an average going forward- not what's been happening the last 4 years

It's not just O-line. We have roster issues heading into this year and the next year. We are about to go thru a little down cycle.

[mic]

It's not just O-line. We have roster issues heading into this year and the next year. We are about to go thru a little down cycle.

Besdies Oline... Explain.....

[msstate7]

Besdies Oline... Explain.....

I'm guessing he'll say dline and db... I think we shored up dline some with Simmons being a day 1 guy. Need smitherman, durr, and/or stamps to be ready this year

[maroonmania]

Besdies Oline... Explain.....

IMO, DL, CB and RB are all pretty iffy at the moment. QB is unproven but I like the candidates we have and trust Mullen at that position.

[msstate7]

IMO, DL, CB and RB are all pretty iffy at the moment. QB is unproven but I like the candidates we have and trust Mullen at that position.

Ready to see Gibson at Rb... I think he's gonna be good

[Coach34]

Don't have time to do the research, and not even sure if I could, but I would wager pretty heavily that gap between us and Bama, or even between us and Ark/Aubie, was MUCH wider 4 years ago.

I don't know- we had Jake Thomas and Damien Robinson help the star power the last 4 years- although they never lived up to their rating

[Coach34]

Besdies Oline... Explain.....

we have huge questions to be answered at RB, CB, and DL

[HoopsDawg]

Besdies Oline... Explain.....

O-line, DB, RB, unproven at QB, pass rushers, and just overall talent drop on the roster. Even at WR, I'm not thrilled with our outside guys unless Ross moves out there. We haven't recruited particularly well and the 2012 and really the 2013 class is going to make it very difficult for us this year.

[Tbonewannabe]

Well last year, we struggled only against Elite DLs in PASS BLOCKING. We couldn't even block a Troy level DL to run the ball. Our run blocking last year was truly pathetic and among the worst I've ever seen at MSU in any era.

Dak covered up any lack of blocking by not holding the ball very long. Tyler Russell would have probably been killed at some point last year.

[Tbonewannabe]

we have huge questions to be answered at RB, CB, and DL

Dline has at least pretty good "star" power. Most of the guys that are unproven are 4 star guys with Simmons being a 5 star. If AJ Jefferson takes another step up like Preston Smith did then he is going to be pretty damn good.

[Political Hack]

I like the discussion of the OL importance to a teams W-L record, but stars don't mean Bo Didley. Especially on the OL. I do agree our OL doesn't look great right now compared to others, but for every Derrick Sherrod there is a Dillon Day. And then there are the Damien Robinson's of the world (love that kid by the way. Has one of the most heart warming stories I've ever heard shortly after his arrival at state, but he wasn't the Army AA on the field everyone expected).

We've got a lot of work to do on the OL but the supporting cast around them is good.

[Coach34]

O-line, DB, RB, unproven at QB, pass rushers, and just overall talent drop on the roster. Even at WR, I'm not thrilled with our outside guys unless Ross moves out there. We haven't recruited particularly well and the 2012 and really the 2013 class is going to make it very difficult for us this year.

I really like our starters at WR and our entire Slot group. Lots of questions after Gray and Brown outside.

[Commercecomet24]

I like the discussion of the OL importance to a teams W-L record, but stars don't mean Bo Didley. Especially on the OL. I do agree our OL doesn't look great right now compared to others, but for every Derrick Sherrod there is a Dillon Day. And then there are the Damien Robinson's of the world (love that kid by the way. Has one of the most heart warming stories I've ever heard shortly after his arrival at state, but he wasn't the Army AA on the field everyone expected).

We've got a lot of work to do on the OL but the supporting cast around them is good.

The voice of reason. To be honest I feel better about this year's OL than last years. Jenkins and Calhoun are gonna be better than what we saw the majority of last year. We do need Rankin to step up.

[Coach34]

Dline has at least pretty good "star" power. Most of the guys that are unproven are 4 star guys with Simmons being a 5 star. If AJ Jefferson takes another step up like Preston Smith did then he is going to be pretty damn good.

AJ is about as good as he is going to get. He is just a physical DE thats not a speed rusher. He'll play very well this Fall. Nick James can hopefully keep getting better- as he was up and down- but overall pretty good in 2015. We have serious questions on depth at DE- should AJ get hurt- we might be ****ed.

DT has lots of names that will play but we need 3 more to really step up with James. Adams is a veteran and will be solid. Simmons will eventually be one of those 3 most likely- so that leaves Thomas, F. Adams, and Big Daddy fighting Simmons for playing time in that 2nd group.

[Commercecomet24]

I really like our starters at WR and our entire Slot group. Lots of questions after Gray and Brown outside.

Coach does anyone know how fast Jamal Couch is? I've seen varying opinions. He could be a great help outside. Of course based on how fast Bear really was he can't be slower lol.

[Commercecomet24]

AJ is about as good as he is going to get. He is just a physical DE thats not a speed rusher. He'll play very well this Fall. Nick James can hopefully keep getting better- as he was up and down- but overall pretty good in 2015. We have serious questions on depth at DE- should AJ get hurt- we might be ****ed.

DT has lots of names that will play but we need 3 more to really step up with James. Adams is a veteran and will be solid. Simmons will eventually be one of those 3 most likely- so that leaves Thomas, F. Adams, and Big Daddy fighting Simmons for playing time in that 2nd group.

I think Calvin is gonna have a big year this year. That guy has a nasty streak and is really fast off the edge. Go back and watch him especially the last half of the year. He's got an edge to him. I like him a lot.

[mic]

O-line, DB, RB, unproven at QB, pass rushers, and just overall talent drop on the roster. Even at WR, I'm not thrilled with our outside guys unless Ross moves out there. We haven't recruited particularly well and the 2012 and really the 2013 class is going to make it very difficult for us this year.

OL been a concern every year.. Nothing new here..

RB was unproven last year.
We lost no one .. So that should be better. And we feel strong about who we have since we didn't go after one RB

DL was a concern last year.
Really only lost one player Chris. Ryan brown will be replaced easy . Depth should be better here and signed 2 of the best 3 in the state.. I agree still need that rush DE .. And I'm glad Tunrer is gone

CB.. For sure will take a fall back.. But it would at any school but Bama and LSU when you lose 2 SR to the draft.. But we have some young guys here that might be very good. Recruited this position good last year and with this class Durr will help immediately and the kid form La is said to be the steal of the class..

QB.. For sure unproven. But far from down cycle.. Never had this much talent top to bottom at this postioton

WR.. Lots of talent.. Not worried about this position..

Saftey.. was a HUGE question mark last year.. We will be vastly improved here

LB..only issue here is getting them all on the field..

I agree we have to replace some key guys... But we played the second most Frosh last year and even tho this class wasn't impressive in the rankings we hit needs everywhere excepting the one glaring position ... OL

[Commercecomet24]

OL been a concern every year.. Nothing new here..

RB was unproven last year.
We lost no one .. So that should be better. And we feel strong about who we have since we didn't go after one RB

DL was a concern last year.
Really only lost one player Chris. Ryan brown will be replaced easy . Depth should be better here and signed 2 of the best 3 in the state.. I agree still need that rush DE .. And I'm glad Tunrer is gone

CB.. For sure will take a fall back.. But it would at any school but Bama and LSU when you lose 2 SR to the draft.. But we have some young guys here that might be very good. Recruited this position good last year, Durr will help and the kid form La is said to be the still of the class..

QB.. For sure unproven. But far from down cycle.. Never had this much talent top to bottom at this postioton

WR.. Lots of talent.. Not worried about this position..

Saftey.. was a HUGE question mark last year.. We will be vastly improved here

LB..only issue here is getting them all on the field..

I agree we have to replace some key guys... But we played the second most Frosh last year and even tho this class wasn't impressive in the rankings we hit needs everywhere excepting the one glaring position ... OL

Very good assessment. Jenkins and Calhoun are gonna help the OL play. I think Calvin is gonna have a big year at DE, he's really nasty and fast and plays to the echo of the whistle. If you just focus on watching him when he's playing him you will see some good stuff. Our CB's are young but i think will be really good. Durr and don't forget Smitherman and Stamps, young but talented. Got work to do but the players are there.

[Johnson85]

I agree that for us to take the next step our OL play defintely has to change. That being said our OL has really only struggled against the truly elite defenses(which most teams do).
Our OL didn't just struggle against elite defenses, outside of 2014, they have given us no chance to win.



Unfortunately for us they're several elite defenses in our division. We will continue to beat the mediocre to good teams, but will struggle against the elites until we get better OL.


We won't continue to beat mediocre to good teams until we get better OL, we will continue to beat mediocre teams. This year the only 'good' team we beat was Arkansas. We lost to pretty average A&M and LSU teams. We need to get back to where we were in 2014 just to compete against good defenses.

[Johnson85]

The voice of reason. To be honest I feel better about this year's OL than last years. Jenkins and Calhoun are gonna be better than what we saw the majority of last year. We do need Rankin to step up.

Talk about damning with faint praise.

But hopefully the jump we'll get from Jenkins and Calhoun going into their third year will be better than the dropoff we have from losing Malone.

[Mjoelner34]

Another thing to consider when judging the O-line is that a certain RB we have tends to look straight down at his feet when he gets the ball. I remember one particular play last year where he got the ball, took 3 steps and ran right into the back of an O-lineman who was engaged in a block. Meanwhile, there was a gaping hole that a single side step to the right would have found and would have let him walk to the 2nd level untouched. I don't know if that is where the hole was supposed to be but that's where it was and it was huge. Instead, we either got no gain or a loss of 1 and a defender never touched the back. His momentum running into the O-lineman knocked him down.

[Percho]

Well, at least the glass is half full instead of half empty.

[JDog13]

BUT THEY LEAVE 5 STARZ


Right????



Guys??

[Commercecomet24]

We won't continue to beat mediocre to good teams until we get better OL, we will continue to beat mediocre teams. This year the only 'good' team we beat was Arkansas. We lost to pretty average A&M and LSU teams. We need to get back to where we were in 2014 just to compete against good defenses.[/QUOTE]

I disagree on this. The Missouri D was really good, the NC State defense was good, Auburn D was talented and well coached.

[Commercecomet24]

Another thing to consider when judging the O-line is that a certain RB we have tends to look straight down at his feet when he gets the ball. I remember one particular play last year where he got the ball, took 3 steps and ran right into the back of an O-lineman who was engaged in a block. Meanwhile, there was a gaping hole that a single side step to the right would have found and would have let him walk to the 2nd level untouched. I don't know if that is where the hole was supposed to be but that's where it was and it was huge. Instead, we either got no gain or a loss of 1 and a defender never touched the back. His momentum running into the O-lineman knocked him down.

This is why it's hard to tell exactly how bad our OL was run blocking. Shumpert consistently missed holes that were there. I remember one specific play against Auburn I saw after rewatching the game. On a zone read, Dak made the corrrect read and the OL completely sealed off the right side and there was ton of grass in front but instead he cut back to the LEFT and almost ran over Dak and was dropped for a 7 yard loss. He turned what couldve been a 10 yard gain into a 7 yard loss. This happened repeatedly last year and that was not on the OL.

[TimberBeast]

Well the good part of this is that we can again blame our terrible running game next season on the OL instead of the fact that we are starting Holloway and giving him the vast majority of the snaps at RB. I think we would all be amazed at how much our RB position would improve if we would actually use a RB at that position.

[Tbonewannabe]

Well the good part of this is that we can again blame our terrible running game next season on the OL instead of the fact that we are starting Holloway and giving him the vast majority of the snaps at RB. I think we would all be amazed at how much our RB position would improve if we would actually use a RB at that position.

We will definitely see how far Dan's head is up his ass if Shumpert gets more than 2 carries a game. I am not sure I have ever seen a player play that much out of position. He might be a decent Fullback, maybe even have a chance at going to a NFL camp but he is barely a D1 running back. Saying he is a D1 is probably stretching it since most RBs from Troy and UAB looked like they were on a different level.

[EAVdog]

We didn't lose to LSU because of the OL. They did play horrendously in the first half but not why we lost the game. A bad delay of game penalty and poor kick cost us that game.

We're probably going to be an 8 win team again next year but it'll seem better since Dak's gone.

[maroonmania]

I really like our starters at WR and our entire Slot group. Lots of questions after Gray and Brown outside.

Not getting AJ Brown or Zach Farrar really hurt in the recruiting class because one or even both of those guys could have potentially played a lot even this Fall on the outside. Gray and Brown should be fine but nothing behind them that's proven. And we signed Couch but we have no returning WR over 6'2. We are really going to miss the physical mismatch that Bear gave us the past 3 years. I really hope Jesse Jackson has gotten fully back to 100% and has a breakout year this year. He was suppose to be quite the prospect when we signed him.

[Goldendawg]

BTW, who would you consider our signature win in 2015? I never thought I would feel mixed feelings about a 9 win MSU season , but I sure did last year. I didn't move the bar, Dan did. We need to start beating UM again, and be competitive against Bama and LSU to move to the next level. Not beating UM lately is terrible in a 9 win season. I do realize that we now beat the teams we are supposed to beat, but LSU, Bama, UM, and even aTm on the road is another story. I still say we were not ready for Bama or UM the last two years and the lack of a good OL and running game contributed. Dak was our only running game and he's gone.

[Johnson85]

I disagree on this. The Missouri D was really good, the NC State defense was good, Auburn D was talented and well coached.

Mizzou was a good game for us scoring wise, but we scored 17 against Auburn. We played well against NC St but I'm not sure their defense was good. Not terrible but certainly didn't look like even an average SEC D.

But we also scored 19 versus LSU and 17 versus A&M, neither of which were world beaters. We did score 27 against UM, but most of those were scored while UM had a comfortable lead.

[TaleofTwoDogs]

Last year, we had Dak and several unanswered questions about the talent level on the team and we were picked last in the West by the media. This year we have even more questions and no Dak. Is it possible to be picked 8th in the West by the media???? **

[Commercecomet24]

Mizzou was a good game for us scoring wise, but we scored 17 against Auburn. We played well against NC St but I'm not sure their defense was good. Not terrible but certainly didn't look like even an average SEC D.

But we also scored 19 versus LSU and 17 versus A&M, neither of which were world beaters. We did score 27 against UM, but most of those were scored while UM had a comfortable lead.

We defintely have to get better ol play, it's a must. However if you go back and watch the games and just watch the ol and slow it down the play was not as bad as it seems. With Calhoun and Jenkins in the lineup and shumpert not running it there were some good things happening. The line play was much much better with those 2 playing on the line.

[Coach34]

We defintely have to get better ol play, it's a must. However if you go back and watch the games and just watch the ol and slow it down the play was not as bad as it seems. With Calhoun and Jenkins in the lineup and shumpert not running it there were some good things happening. The line play was much much better with those 2 playing on the line.

a better RB would have helped this group- no doubt. But to say we were "sub-par" on the OL in 2015 is a very fair statement.

Calhoun and Jenkins have been labeled as Hev's best OL recruits to date- and as 1st year players- I concur so far. We have 6 linemen we know will play- Senior, Desper, Clayborn, Calhoun, Jenkins, and Rankin. We have got to find another OG to work in the mix with Desper and Calhoun. We need someone to step up as the future at Center. Big questions heading into 2016.

RB is also a huge question. Holloway is good for about 5 carries per Saturday- but we need 15 more out of the RB position. Who is that going to be? It takes RB's damn near half a season to learn how to pass block under Mullen- so counting on much time from the R-Fr early on is a waste of time. That leaves Shump, Williams, and Lee. Has Lee got his shit together yet? I hope so. He is the best of that bunch.

[Commercecomet24]

a better RB would have helped this group- no doubt. But to say we were "sub-par" on the OL in 2015 is a very fair statement.

Calhoun and Jenkins have been labeled as Hev's best OL recruits to date- and as 1st year players- I concur so far. We have 6 linemen we know will play- Senior, Desper, Clayborn, Calhoun, Jenkins, and Rankin. We have got to find another OG to work in the mix with Desper and Calhoun. We need someone to step up as the future at Center. Big questions heading into 2016.

RB is also a huge question. Holloway is good for about 5 carries per Saturday- but we need 15 more out of the RB position. Who is that going to be? It takes RB's damn near half a season to learn how to pass block under Mullen- so counting on much time from the R-Fr early on is a waste of time. That leaves Shump, Williams, and Lee. Has Lee got his shit together yet? I hope so. He is the best of that bunch.

That's a fair assessment. I think ol play will be much better this year. Warren was not good at all. With further development from Jenkins, Calhoun and hopefully Rankin we should see improvement. Darryl Williams is someone who could help(looks like he could help at center or guard). I'm with you on lee, he could help tremendously if he can get it together.

[bulldawg28]

I can't believe guys keep falling for C34's BS with ratings. He's talking as if we're expecting State to contend for the National Title every 2-3 years. Either that or comparing us to Ole Miss that's about to be hammered for cheating. Mullen has made it clear he's a developer and that's his MO here in Mississippi. So you shouldn't expect a ton of 5 stars signed or a guy that's better than highs choose talent by pure size or measurables.

Coach34, if you really want fair discussion look at the classes Mullen has signed since arriving and their contributions. That's the real measure. Compare if Mullen is doing what said. It's easy to see he is.

[dawgday166]

I can't believe guys keep falling for C34's BS with ratings. He's talking as if we're expecting State to contend for the National Title every 2-3 years. Either that or comparing us to Ole Miss that's about to be hammered for cheating. Mullen has made it clear he's a developer and that's his MO here in Mississippi. So you shouldn't expect a ton of 5 stars signed or a guy that's better than highs choose talent by pure size or measurables.

Coach34, if you really want fair discussion look at the classes Mullen has signed since arriving and their contributions. That's the real measure. Compare if Mullen is doing what said. It's easy to see he is.

I thought he said we'd compete for championships. We did very briefly in 14. Does it stop there? Championships is plural isn't it?

I don't really expect us to finish 1 or 2 in SEC W every year. But I don't expect us to finish 4 - 6 either, which is where we always finish, with exception of 14.

[Johnson85]

I thought he said we'd compete for championships. We did very briefly in 14. Does it stop there? Championships is plural isn't it?

I don't really expect us to finish 1 or 2 in SEC W every year. But I don't expect us to finish 4 - 6 either, which is where we always finish, with exception of 14.

I expect us to finish 3-5 usually, with the occasional foray into 6-7 and 1-2 on the peaks and valleys. Those are very high expectations, but still attainable.

Mullen overall has done pretty much what he was supposed to do. It's just disappointing that he has probably locked in a pretty low ceiling for us the next couple of years by not addressing Oline recruiting and it's also disappointing that in a relatively down year for the SECW in 2015, our recruiting at OL and RB situation kept us from taking advantage.

[Political Hack]

Not getting AJ Brown or Zach Farrar really hurt in the recruiting class because one or even both of those guys could have potentially played a lot even this Fall on the outside. Gray and Brown should be fine but nothing behind them that's proven. And we signed Couch but we have no returning WR over 6'2. We are really going to miss the physical mismatch that Bear gave us the past 3 years. I really hope Jesse Jackson has gotten fully back to 100% and has a breakout year this year. He was suppose to be quite the prospect when we signed him.

I agree with you a lot, but I think we're going to be fine here. We are deeper than we've ever been at WR and neither of those guys would've beat out the kids in front of them IMO.

[maroonmania]

I agree with you a lot, but I think we're going to be fine here. We are deeper than we've ever been at WR and neither of those guys would've beat out the kids in front of them IMO.

I would not have expected them to beat out the starters but I could have seen one or both beating out guys to make the 2 deep.

[Barkman Turner Overdrive]

I can't believe guys keep falling for C34's BS with ratings. He's talking as if we're expecting State to contend for the National Title every 2-3 years. Either that or comparing us to Ole Miss that's about to be hammered for cheating. Mullen has made it clear he's a developer and that's his MO here in Mississippi. So you shouldn't expect a ton of 5 stars signed or a guy that's better than highs choose talent by pure size or measurables.

Coach34, if you really want fair discussion look at the classes Mullen has signed since arriving and their contributions. That's the real measure. Compare if Mullen is doing what said. It's easy to see he is.

He's not calling Mullen out directly. Hevesy has been here with Mullen since 2009. Name one player that he recruited, developed, and is playing in the NFL. Every other position coach we have can point to somebody playing on Sunday.

[TUSK]

We saw this past season how a sub-par OL can keep a really good team from winning 10 or more games.

Star rating composiye averages for the SEC West entering 2016:

Avg star

Alabama 4.0
LSU 3.6
Texas A&M 3.6
Arkansas 3.5
Auburn 3.5
Northern Miss 3.3
State 2.9




Coach, what failed to gel with ya'lls OL early last year... I remember you sayin' you thought it'd be ok...

injuries, someone fail to step up, etc?

[Dallas_Dawg]

Coach, what failed to gel with ya'lls OL early last year... I remember you sayin' you thought it'd be ok...

injuries, someone fail to step up, etc?
Not C34 but this is an easy one...
Rufus Warren was a a converted TE who started at LT. We were told he was so good that he was keeping our JUCO all American Martinas Rankin on the bench. That turned out to be BS, Warren was awful. And at LT, the most important position on the line.
Justin Malone was our starting LG who underachieved. He looked much better at RT at the end of the year but we wasted him at guard.
Clay borne at Center wasn't bad.
Devin Desper at RG got his ass whipped routinely. He will be back next year as a starter.
Justin Senior was our RT for the second year in a row but didn't look as good as he did in 2014.

This O-line as a whole looked awful even though we had Dak back there who made them look better than they were. Bama, OM and aTm absolutely manhandled these guys. Nothing I hear makes me think 2016 will be any better. We may be better at LT if Rankin is as good as he is supposed
To be but other than that, we will be the same or worse at ever other OL position.
6-6 here we come

[dawgday166]

Not C34 but this is an easy one...
Rufus Warren was a a converted TE who started at LT. We were told he was so good that he was keeping our JUCO all American Martinas Rankin on the bench. That turned out to be BS, Warren was awful. And at LT, the most important position on the line.
Justin Malone was our starting LG who underachieved. He looked much better at RT at the end of the year but we wasted him at guard.
Clay borne at Center wasn't bad.
Devin Desper at RG got his ass whipped routinely. He will be back next year as a starter.
Justin Senior was our RT for the second year in a row but didn't look as good as he did in 2014.

This O-line as a whole looked awful even though we had Dak back there who made them look better than they were. Bama, OM and aTm absolutely manhandled these guys. Nothing I hear makes me think 2016 will be any better. We may be better at LT if Rankin is as good as he is supposed
To be but other than that, we will be the same or worse at ever other OL position.
6-6 here we come

Jenkins & Calhoun will be upgrades I believe. When they played last year they looked like the 2 best O-linemen by far IMO. They smack folks and both are pretty quick with their feet too. Senior & Rankin need to step up. Desper ... IMO we need to find another guard.

[state66]

They call Aeris williams a monster in practice and in the weight room. I personally would like to see him as our featured back.

[Dallas_Dawg]

Jenkins & Calhoun will be upgrades I believe. When they played last year they looked like the 2 best O-linemen by far IMO. They smack folks and both are pretty quick with their feet too. Senior & Rankin need to step up. Desper ... IMO we need to find another guard.
Agreed on Calhoun. Forgot about him. Not sure about where Jenkins will fit in.
I guess if he beats out Rankin, we have nothing to worry about***

[Commercecomet24]

Jenkins & Calhoun will be upgrades I believe. When they played last year they looked like the 2 best O-linemen by far IMO. They smack folks and both are pretty quick with their feet too. Senior & Rankin need to step up. Desper ... IMO we need to find another guard.

This is dead on accurate. The line play was totally different when Jenkins and Calhoun were in the lineup. Not only do they do their job but watch both of them, they block to the echo of the whistle and they were just getting their feet wet. Clayborn, Jenkins and Calhoun are very good. Rankin needs to step up and I think he will and your completely right about Desper, which is odd because he played well in 2014.

[Coach34]

Agreed on Calhoun. Forgot about him. Not sure about where Jenkins will fit in.
I guess if he beats out Rankin, we have nothing to worry about***

I fully expect Jenkins to beat out Rankin

[Coach34]

Coach, what failed to gel with ya'lls OL early last year... I remember you sayin' you thought it'd be ok...

injuries, someone fail to step up, etc?

I really cant answer that question. They were never in sync all year. It wasnt just about not being physical enough- the stupid mistakes they made were shocking. 4th year players should have never missed twists and stunts like this group did. It was like they werent even coached.

[Bdawg]

AJ is about as good as he is going to get. He is just a physical DE thats not a speed rusher. He'll play very well this Fall. Nick James can hopefully keep getting better- as he was up and down- but overall pretty good in 2015. We have serious questions on depth at DE- should AJ get hurt- we might be ****ed.

DT has lots of names that will play but we need 3 more to really step up with James. Adams is a veteran and will be solid. Simmons will eventually be one of those 3 most likely- so that leaves Thomas, F. Adams, and Big Daddy fighting Simmons for playing time in that 2nd group.
Anymore talk of Gerri Green being a speed rusher for us? Had some bowl practice there didn't he?

[dawgday166]

I fully expect Jenkins to beat out Rankin

I want one of them to beat out Senior ... unless he plays much better than he did last year.

[dawgday166]

I really cant answer that question. They were never in sync all year. It wasnt just about not being physical enough- the stupid mistakes they made were shocking. 4th year players should have never missed twists and stunts like this group did. It was like they werent even coached.

I agree with this. I sort of attributed that some to communication along the line, which starts with Claiborne. What I've never understood is how you go into a season with a junior center who is just learning the position. In my mind a center is being groomed from the minute he steps onto a practice field as a freshman, seeing how center is the most important and most difficult line position to play.

[dawgday166]

This is dead on accurate. The line play was totally different when Jenkins and Calhoun were in the lineup. Not only do they do their job but watch both of them, they block to the echo of the whistle and they were just getting their feet wet. Clayborn, Jenkins and Calhoun are very good. Rankin needs to step up and I think he will and your completely right about Desper, which is odd because he played well in 2014.

This is what I think too. Maybe move Senior to guard or maybe RSFr Mike Story can step up. His HS video looked like he had a mean streak in him and liked to smack folks. Of course that's a HS video.

I'd rather have someone that makes an occasional mental mistake but smacks folks than someone who gets their ass handed to them physically by every single D lineman & LB on OMs 2-deep & Bama's 4 deep roster. On half the plays last year I'll bet Desper didn't hit a soul. Even on a lot of the good plays we had.

[dawgday166]

I expect us to finish 3-5 usually, with the occasional foray into 6-7 and 1-2 on the peaks and valleys. Those are very high expectations, but still attainable.

Mullen overall has done pretty much what he was supposed to do. It's just disappointing that he has probably locked in a pretty low ceiling for us the next couple of years by not addressing Oline recruiting and it's also disappointing that in a relatively down year for the SECW in 2015, our recruiting at OL and RB situation kept us from taking advantage.

I'll buy this for the most part and you're right about not taking advantage. The SEC W isn't the world beaters the last 2 years everyone has pumped it up to be IMO. Neither Bama team was Saban's best, although their front seven on D this past year were pretty tough. The rest of the west was ok, not great. There were very winnable games that were lost due to poor pre-game preparation and/or poor in-game management by the staff --- Mullen mainly. He the head honcho in charge. The offense seemed to drop off considerably after the 2014 KY game for various reasons too. Moved the ball decent at times, but can't seem to score consistently in red zone.

I thought OM game should've been a slam dunk game in 14. Thought it should've been much closer than it was in 15. LSU & TAM should've both been wins in 15 but at very least should've won 1 of those 2. Bama game in 14 was winnable ... but honestly I understood having the #1 ranking, all the world watching, the pressure having not been there before, etc. Hated to lose it, but understand that was a first for us & Mullen really as a HC.

As you said ... we didn't take advantage like we should and could have.

[dawgday166]

How do you delete a post ... can't seem to find this button. I accidentally double-posted the reply above and the only way I could figure out how to delete it was editing it and typing this reply.

[Tbonewannabe]

I'll buy this for the most part and you're right about not taking advantage. The SEC W isn't the world beaters the last 2 years everyone has pumped it up to be IMO. Neither Bama team was Saban's best, although their front seven on D this past year were pretty tough. The rest of the west was ok, not great. There were very winnable games that were lost due to poor pre-game preparation and/or poor in-game management by the staff --- Mullen mainly. He the head honcho in charge. The offense seemed to drop off considerably after the 2014 KY game for various reasons too. Moved the ball decent at times, but can't seem to score consistently in red zone.

I thought OM game should've been a slam dunk game in 14. Thought it should've been much closer than it was in 15. LSU & TAM should've both been wins in 15 but at very least should've won 1 of those 2. Bama game in 14 was winnable ... but honestly I understood having the #1 ranking, all the world watching, the pressure having not been there before, etc. Hated to lose it, but understand that was a first for us & Mullen really as a HC.

As you said ... we didn't take advantage like we should and could have.

UM game in 14 is the biggest kick in the nuts to me. We have a chance to get in the playoffs if we win the game. Bro Ballace on a bad ankle and I think maybe Big Softie was out that game. With a chance to get in the playoffs on the line and we looked like we couldn't give a shit any less. Dak gets cheap shotted and flipped on his head and no one even does anything. Jackie Sherrill would have had a Fullback who would have broked that little shit in half on the next play. Somehow Mullen has gotten this team fairly soft on offense. We look more and more finesse like and I don't like it. Our Oline just try to get in the Defense's way rather than rolling over them like Gabe Jackson would. We desperately need to get that mentality back.

[Johnson85]

I want one of them to beat out Senior ... unless he plays much better than he did last year.

Senior had some awful plays, especially in the LSU and A&M game where he appeared to just let blockers go, but I think we need somebody to beat out Desper more.

Really disappointed in the progression of Desper and Senior though. Both seemed to regress this year. Desper I can understand not being as good as expected when moving to a full time starter position, but I can't for the life of me figure out what happened with Senior.

Or I guess Malone for that matter. The whole line last year is perplexing. I understand sucking at left tackle. I don't understand how Malone, Desper, and Senior all either failed to get better or actually got worse.

[dawgday166]

Yea .. I scratched my head some over Senior's regression too.

[Coach34]

I want one of them to beat out Senior ... unless he plays much better than he did last year.

We wont ever replace a 2 year starter under Mullen. Senior will start this Fall

[Coach34]

Well, I dont have much optimism on our back-ups when I hear the best looking back-up during bowl practice is a walk-on from Jackson Academy

[msstate7]

Well, I dont have much optimism on our back-ups when I hear the best looking back-up during bowl practice is a walk-on from Jackson Academy

Better than Williams and rankin? Not sure about that

[Coach34]

Better than Williams and rankin? Not sure about that

This came from an ex-player that was at practice

[HoopsDawg]

This came from an ex-player that was at practice

Sigh....

[Coach34]

Sigh....

I dont get all the hopes of people on Rankin- sure he had star rating, but he couldnt beat out Warren and Jenkins who were terrible. Part of the reason he RS'ed was numbers- but the other was that he couldnt beat out the 2 ahead of him. That frightens the hell out of me. Jenkins will get better and probably be a slightly better Clausell- but thats still adequate- not good enough to win in big games

[HoopsDawg]

I dont get all the hopes of people on Rankin- sure he had star rating, but he couldnt beat out Warren and Jenkins who were terrible. Part of the reason he RS'ed was numbers- but the other was that he couldnt beat out the 2 ahead of him. That frightens the hell out of me. Jenkins will get better and probably be a slightly better Clausell- but thats still adequate- not good enough to win in big games

And Jenkins is better suited for RT. As you have said, Mullen will be starting Senior at RT.

[Johnson85]

Well, I dont have much optimism on our back-ups when I hear the best looking back-up during bowl practice is a walk-on from Jackson Academy

Who is the walk-on from JA?

[dawgday166]

I dont get all the hopes of people on Rankin- sure he had star rating, but he couldnt beat out Warren and Jenkins who were terrible. Part of the reason he RS'ed was numbers- but the other was that he couldnt beat out the 2 ahead of him. That frightens the hell out of me. Jenkins will get better and probably be a slightly better Clausell- but thats still adequate- not good enough to win in big games

I'm hopeful Rankin just needed time to learn the offense. In his JC videos he seemed like he was athletic and had good feet. Sorta like Lashley's athleticism, which always seems to be lacking in our jOL recruits. I'm somewhat concerned with Greg Eiland. When I watched his junior videos I thought "Ugh, he can't move". His senior videos were better tho.

I guess I'm just hopeful in general ... we'll see.

[maroonmania]

No worries, Hevesy gonna get it all fixed for 2016. ***

[bulldawg28]

This came from an ex-player that was at practice


Must be a kicker.

[Coach34]

Must be a kicker.

only kicker I've met was Jeff Walker...wasnt him

[Johnson85]

only kicker I've met was Jeff Walker...wasnt him

I don't suppose the ex-player was saying something along the lines of "The staff found the next 17ing Ben Beckwith" was he?