Turnover

[BrunswickDawg]

http://www.clarionledger.com/story/sports/college/mississippi-state/2016/02/23/*******-staff-turnover-not-turbulent-miles-saban/80806742/

But nobody has turnover like Mullen***

[#660000]

STARKVILLE — Mississippi State lost its fourth defensive assistant of the offseason on Tuesday. A source told the Clarion-Ledger, MSU’s defensive line coach David Turner would become the new defensive tackles coach for Texas A&M.

The fourth hire will be the most MSU coach Dan Mullen has ever had to make in a single offseason. For now, though, it appears to be an outlier. When looking at Mullen's seven-year tenure compared to other Southeastern Conference program’s, MSU has endured fewer staff changes.

The next defensive coordinator will be Mullen’s 14th hire since 2010. It will be his 23rd coach since assembling a staff in 2009.

There are only two coaches who have been in the league since 2009: Alabama’s Nick Saban and LSU’s Les Miles. Alabama has made 17 hires in the last six years. LSU has made 16.

While Miles and Saban have never had to make four coaching moves in an offseason, overall they’ve dealt with more turnover. Since 2009, Miles has had 26 coaches within his staff. Saban has overseen 27.

Of Mullen’s 23 changes, two were promotions within the program. Alabama and LSU each made one internal change.

Mississippi State went through the most turnover at defensive coordinator. Peter Sirmon's addition in January was the sixth change at defensive coordinator for MSU since 2009. At LSU, the revolving door centered around the wide receivers coach with five changes. Alabama has gone through four defensive back coaches since 2009.

Miles and Saban have had at least three coaches at five positions since 2009. Mullen has had at least three coaches at four positions. Mississippi State, on the other hand, has had three coaches, John Hevesy, Greg Knox and Scott Sallach, remain with all seven years with Mullen.

Saban has kept the same associate head coach and running backs coach, Burton Burns, since 2009. Miles has made at least two changes at every spot that's been a full-time position since 2009.

Here’s a look at the turnover with the three programs.

MSU (23 overall coaches since 2009)

OC (2)– Les Koenning 2009-13; John Hevesy/Billy Gonzales 2014-Pres*.

DC (6)– Carl Torbush 2009; Manny Diaz 2010; Geoff Collins/Chris Wilson 2011-12; Geoff Collins 2013-14*; Manny Diaz 2015; Peter Sirmon Pres.

WR (3) – Mark Hudspeth 2009-10; Angelo Mirando 2011-12; Billy Gonzales 2013-Pres.

CB (3) – Melvin Smith 2009-12; Deshea Townsend 2013-15; Terrell Buckley Pres.

OL (1) – John Hevesy 2009-Pres.

DL (4) – David Turner 2009; Chris Wilson 2010-12; David Turner 2013-15; ?

S (2) – Tony Hughes 2009-15; Mauice Linguist Pres.

RB (1) – Greg Knox 2009-Pres.

TE (1) – Scott Sallach 2009-Pres.

LSU (26 overall coaches since 2009)

OC (3) – Gary Crowton 2009-10; Greg Studrawa 2011-12*; Cam Cameron 2013-Pres.

DC (3) – John Chavis 2009-2014; Kevin Steele 2015; Dave Aranda Pres.

WR (5) – D.J. McCarthy 2009; Billy Gonzales 2010-11; Adam Henry 2012-14; Tony Ball 2015; Dameyune Craig Pres.

DB (2) – Ron Cooper 2009-11; Corey Raymond 2012-Pres.

OL (2) – Greg Studrawa 2009-13; Jeff Grimes 2014-Pres.

DL (2) – Brick Haley 2009-2014; Ed Orgeron 2015-Pres.

TE (2) – Don Yanowsky 2009; Steve Ensminer 2010-Pres.

RB (3) – Larry Porer 2009; Frank Wilson 2010-2015; Jabbar Juluke Pres.

ST (3) – Joe Robinson 2009-10; Thomas McGaughey 2011-13; Bradley Dale Peveto 2014-Pres.

QB (1) – Steve Kragthorpe 2011-2012

Alabama (27 overall coaches since 2009)

OC (3) – Jim McElwain 2009-11; Doug Nussmeier 2012-13; Lane Kiffin 2014-Pres.

DC (2) – Kirby Smart 2009-15; Jeremy Pruitt Pres.

RB (1) – Burton Burns 2009-Pres.

WR (3) – Curt Cignetti 2009-10; Mike Groh 2011-12; Billy Napier 2013-Pres.

OL (3) – Joe Pendry 2009-10; Jeff Stoutland 2011-12; Mario Cristobal; 2013-Pres.

DL (3) – Bo Davis 2009-10; Chris Rumph 2011-13; Bo Davis 2014-Pres.

LB (3) – Sal Sunseri 2009-11; Lance Thompson 2012-13; Kevin Steele 2014;

TE/ST (2) – Bobby Williams 2009-15; Brent Key Pres.

OLB (3) – James Willis 2009; Lance Thompson 2014*; Tosh Lupoi 2015-Pres.

DB (4) – Jeremy Pruitt 2010-12; Greg Brown 2013; Mel Tucker 2015; Derrick Ashley Pres.

*Move was within the program

[smootness]

NO MULLEN SUCKS AND EVERYTHING IS TERRIBLE!!!**

[Liverpooldawg]

Don't interrupt a meltdown with facts.

[Commercecomet24]

Here's the crux of the problem, to many of our fans only look at our school and don't pay attention to what's going on in the rest of the sports world. Coaching changes in every sport whether collegiate or professional happen constantly it ain't just at State. But we would rather believe its our Head Coaches fault then deal with the facts of the real world.

[Taog Redloh]

That'll leave a mark....especially coming from that no good bear rag they call the clarion LIAR!!!!

[Commercecomet24]

That'll leave a mark....especially coming from that no good bear rag they call the clarion LIAR!!!!

It is hard to believe they wrote a semi positive article about Mullen. Maybe the checks haven't arrived from the plantation this month lol

[Dawgtini]

Don't interrupt a meltdown with facts.

Dadgum CL and their agenda. **

[HoopsDawg]

Except we aren't winning national championships and recruiting at a high level like these 2 programs and our coaches aren't leaving to be head coaches like Smart, McElwain, Kragthorpe etc. In most cases are guys are leaving for the same job at another program. We even lost our strength coach this offseason.

[Really Clark?]

Except we aren't winning national championships and recruiting at a high level like these 2 programs and our coaches aren't leaving to be head coaches like Smart, McElwain, Kragthorpe etc. In most cases are guys are leaving for the same job at another program. We even lost our strength coach this offseason.

Kragthorpe didn't leave for a HC job. He is not even coaching. Out of all those coaches between the two elite programs you have 3 move up to HC positions if I'm not mistaken. Smart, McElwain, and Wilson at UTSA. Am I missing anyone from those two elite programs. And we have had Hud and Hughes as well take HC jobs during that same time.

[RougeDawg]

It is hard to believe they wrote a semi positive article about Mullen. Maybe the checks haven't arrived from the plantation this month lol

All current checks have been diverted to their legal fees and hush money for those who haven't spilled the beans yet.

[Commercecomet24]

All current checks have been diverted to their legal fees and hush money for those who haven't spilled the beans yet.

That made me laugh! Well done(and probably extremely accurate!)

[bhamdawgfan]

We've had success at a program not known for success. Factor that in with the simple fact that we just don't pay most assistants what the big boys do comparatively and you get turnover. Simple as that.

That said, I don't think more money was the reason for Turner leaving. Could be that Mullen is an ass to work for or it could be something else. It's done.

[HoopsDawg]

Kragthorpe didn't leave for a HC job. He is not even coaching. Out of all those coaches between the two elite programs you have 3 move up to HC positions if I'm not mistaken. Smart, McElwain, and Wilson at UTSA. Am I missing anyone from those two elite programs. And we have had Hud and Hughes as well take HC jobs during that same time.

We lost our entire defensive staff + our strength coach and a key off-field recruiter after a 9-4 season. There's nothing normal about that. Coach34 already pointed out the discrepancy in Defensive coordinator turnover. You could make a strong case that Bama has upgraded with all of their hires, even D-coordinator and it definitely hasn't effected recruiting for either of these schools. I don't care how many assistants leave if you are recruiting at a high level and that's not happening at MSU under Mullen.

[Really Clark?]

We lost our entire defensive staff + our strength coach and a key off-field recruiter after a 9-4 season. There's nothing normal about that. Coach34 already pointed out the discrepancy in Defensive coordinator turnover. You could make a strong case that Bama has upgraded with all of their hires, even D-coordinator and it definitely hasn't effected recruiting for either of these schools. I don't care how many assistants leave if you are recruiting at a high level and that's not happening at MSU under Mullen.

And what does this response have to do with what I posted?

Saban lost just as much after winning a national title with only Smart and Mel taking a higher position. And Mel went to GA with Smart because Saban already said he was bring Pruitt in and not promoting from with in. Miles loses Steele to Auburn after losing Chavis to A & M.

But again my post had nothing to do with that. It was all these supposed HC that Bama and LSU were losing their guys to. It's like 3 between the 2 schools and we have had 2 during the same time frame.

[BrunswickDawg]

We lost our entire defensive staff + our strength coach and a key off-field recruiter after a 9-4 season. There's nothing normal about that. Coach34 already pointed out the discrepancy in Defensive coordinator turnover. You could make a strong case that Bama has upgraded with all of their hires, even D-coordinator and it definitely hasn't effected recruiting for either of these schools. I don't care how many assistants leave if you are recruiting at a high level and that's not happening at MSU under Mullen.
And go back and read how so many here have hated our D philosophy, our secondary sucks, the DL gets no push and no rush on edge, our recruiting sucks, our DL is thin in #'s. So, if Mullen sees the same things and moves guys along (regardless of it being up or "lateral") and replaces them with top notch guys that are known recruiters, he's an asshole no one can work for, and we are losing our best coaches???

[HoopsDawg]

And what does this response have to do with what I posted?

Saban lost just as much after winning a national title with only Smart and Mel taking a higher position. And Mel went to GA with Smart because Saban already said he was bring Pruitt in and not promoting from with in. Miles loses Steele to Auburn after losing Chavis to A & M.

But again my post had nothing to do with that. It was all these supposed HC that Bama and LSU were losing their guys to. It's like 3 between the 2 schools and we have had 2 during the same time frame.

B/C I don't think what's going on at Bama and what's going on at MSU under Mullen is an apples to apples comparison.

[Commercecomet24]

And go back and read how so many here have hated our D philosophy, our secondary sucks, the DL gets no push and no rush on edge, our recruiting sucks, our DL is thin in #'s. So, if Mullen sees the same things and moves guys along (regardless of it being up or "lateral") and replaces them with top notch guys that are known recruiters, he's an asshole no one can work for, and we are losing our best coaches???

Are you trying to use a rational, logical thought process on here?***

[HoopsDawg]

And go back and read how so many here have hated our D philosophy, our secondary sucks, the DL gets no push and no rush on edge, our recruiting sucks, our DL is thin in #'s. So, if Mullen sees the same things and moves guys along (regardless of it being up or "lateral") and replaces them with top notch guys that are known recruiters, he's an asshole no one can work for, and we are losing our best coaches???

I can promise you Mullen didn't want to lose Turner, Hughes, or Diaz. So doesn't that make your entire post a moot point?

[Really Clark?]

B/C I don't think what's going on at Bama and what's going on at MSU under Mullen is an apples to apples comparison.

Well you brought them up and named the coaches getting HC jobs. Of which one was incorrect.

[HoopsDawg]

Well you brought them up and named the coaches getting HC jobs. Of which one was incorrect.

Thank you for the correction on Kragthorpe, I was going off memory and I thought he left for the Tulsa job.

[Really Clark?]

Thank you for the correction on Kragthorpe, I was going off memory and I thought he left for the Tulsa job.

I think when LSU removed him from the field he went to a desk job and is still there maybe. He hasn't coached since being the QB coach at LSU.

[HoopsDawg]

I think when LSU removed him from the field he went to a desk job and is still there maybe. He hasn't coaches since being the QB coach at LSU.

He stepped down after getting Parkinson's disease.

[Really Clark?]

He stepped down after getting Parkinson's disease.

That's right. I remember that now. I knew he went off field.

[BrunswickDawg]

I can promise you Mullen didn't want to lose Turner, Hughes, or Diaz. So doesn't that make your entire post a moot point?

Ok - so if you roll with that theory - Dan didn't want to lose them and Manny wants to go home, Hughes wants a shot to run a program, and Turner wanted a place where he might get to move up (or is a nomad, which his career shows). Again, how can you blame any of them or Mullen for that. It's not like we are replacing them with bad coaches either.

[BiscuitEater]

But nobody has turnover like Mullen***

Since 2009, every SEC school has changed Head Coaches at least once .. except MSU, LSU and Bama

[Liverpooldawg]

B/C I don't think what's going on at Bama and what's going on at MSU under Mullen is an apples to apples comparison.
You are quite right. What Mullen has done for the program at MSU is FAR greater than what Saban has done at Bama, if you look at the historical levels of the programs. It's not even close.

[smootness]

We lost our entire defensive staff + our strength coach and a key off-field recruiter after a 9-4 season. There's nothing normal about that. Coach34 already pointed out the discrepancy in Defensive coordinator turnover. You could make a strong case that Bama has upgraded with all of their hires, even D-coordinator and it definitely hasn't effected recruiting for either of these schools. I don't care how many assistants leave if you are recruiting at a high level and that's not happening at MSU under Mullen.

When you have success, other programs generally want your coaches. So yes, it kind of is normal. People act like our coaches are jumping ship, it's ridiculous.