So, how does MSU football find their 'All-In'?

[Taog Redloh]

Have to hand it to the rebels and specifically Freeze, and give credit where it is due. They are united at the moment. With all the stuff with their chancellor, traditions, and sucking in general, Freeze has come in and gotten them 'all-in' from the network to the students. They are all speaking the same language, and they are playing to their strengths. They are all about the image/perception, and they are attracting the type of students/players that feed off of that. So, just like the grove, there are certain things the bearsharks do well that are worth copying. And not to pump their ego or anything. Yeah they criticize Freeze's coaching and in-fight from time to time, but by and large they are pulling the same direction because their mission statement is to win the press conference/party, not the football game. So, they are good with a 9-3 season in their highest of peaks since integration (let's keep it in perspective here, we have actually accomplished more, regardless of the last 2 egg bowls).

What is our 'way'? Auburn, Texas A&M and Clemson seem to be good models to copy. Seems we have a natural tie toward salt-of-the-earth people from MS who are more interested in results rather that getting the credit (see Ole Miss). But what is 'Our State'/Grindin'/Strain? Figuring this out may be the missing link in our recruiting. Honestly, we've got a very young fanbase so new traditions can be established, such as saying 'Hail State' to each other, even though that sounds foreign to me. We are the People's University, and our name says MISSISSIPPI State, so it's not like we're a regional school.

Just thinking out loud here, since we see all the in-fighting among fans, cigar boys, etc. Everyone seems to be in this stuff for themselves, rather than Mississippi State. That goes for Dan Mullen too. It can't just be 'winning cures everything'. No, we need to be pulling in one direction ALL the time, not just during the good times. Winning is a product of that.

[jumbo]

let me guess...recruit more JUCOs?

[Taog Redloh]

let me guess...recruit more JUCOs?
Aside from your smart-assery (sort of the point of the post), yes, that's one thing. I'm not trying to go all Malcolm Portera or anything, but JUCOs should be a big part of what MSU does, academically and athletically.

[engie]

Wait -- you use Ole Miss as an example of "all in" -- then turn it as if they are always like that regardless of results on the field? No school in the country eats their own faster than they do when things don't go according to plan.

Mullen's first two years are as united as we can possibly be. You'll never unite our fanbase without both winning at our current clip and beating Ole Miss more often than not.

And we don't "in fight" any more than they do -- we just march it out on front street on public message boards -- while they, at bare minimum, do it behind paywalls.

[Taog Redloh]

Wait -- you use Ole Miss as an example of "all in" -- then turn it as if they are always like that regardless of results on the field? No school in the country eats their own faster than they do when things don't go according to plan.
Freeze has them performing about as well as possible right now. On the other hand, I do not think we are reaching our potential. That's the point, regardless of the points on the scoreboard.


Mullen's first two years are as united as we can possibly be. You'll never unite our fanbase without both winning at our current clip and beating Ole Miss more often than not.
I hope you are wrong on this. I'm more concerned with the foundation, not the results. The results can't be the foundation, or it will crack....as we have recently.


And we don't "in fight" any more than they do -- we just march it out on front street on public message boards -- while they, at bare minimum, do it behind paywalls.
This is sort of what unity is all about. A healthy amount of conflict is a good thing, and best to keep it in private.

[engie]

This is sort of what unity is all about. A healthy amount of conflict is a good thing, and best to keep it in private.

Then the very foundation of this board in it's current iteration needs reevaluation. Because the idea of steering the narrative in the direction of actually helping MSU in whatever microscopic manner is actually possible thru this medium has been lost along the way.

[Taog Redloh]

Then the very foundation of this board in it's current iteration needs reevaluation. Because the idea of steering the narrative in the direction of actually helping MSU in whatever microscopic manner is actually possible thru this medium has been lost along the way.
We agree.

[maroonmania]

Here are my thoughts on a few points that makes it easier for them. One, Freeze is projecting the image that he's totally 100% committed to OM and is not really even talking to other programs (true or not). Mullen could learn a lesson there in that recruits have a more secure feeling that Freeze is there for the long haul. Second, from the Network to the administration to the compliance office to the students to whoever, they are all bought in to doing whatever it takes to get the recruits they really want. Makes it much easier to put out the best "offer" and its becoming more obvious that if you circle your wagons the NCAA is an impotent joke to do much of anything to you. We are way too committed to doing things the "right way" to truly be in on a lot of the elite recruits (mostly talking out of State here). Not saying that we don't do a few things here and there to cut corners and compete (particularly in state) like every P5 program does but we aren't "all in" in the recruiting game like they are up North. Third, they are much more willing to take on low lifes that are good at football which gives them another advantage. Character seems to be the last quality that UNM is looking for in a football recruit but nobody can say that taking on a suspect guy like for example Kelly hasn't made them a much better football team.

[Dawg496]

Then the very foundation of this board in it's current iteration needs reevaluation. Because the idea of steering the narrative in the direction of actually helping MSU in whatever microscopic manner is actually possible thru this medium has been lost along the way.

+1. This site unfortunately has become the antithesis of what it promised to be. The personalities are more concerned with being right than they are with helping State. Spreading rumors, and breaking news that is in general bad for us, to get the internet cred points rather that driving a positive message is what it's turning out to be. Still it's the best site for information, but it needs to get back to its roots.

[Taog Redloh]

Here are my thoughts on a few points that makes it easier for them. One, Freeze is projecting the image that he's totally 100% committed to OM and is not really even talking to other programs (true or not). Mullen could learn a lesson there in that recruits have a more secure feeling that Freeze is there for the long haul. Second, from the Network to the administration to the compliance office to the students to whoever, they are all bought in to doing whatever it takes to get the recruits they really want. Makes it much easier to put out the best "offer" and its becoming more obvious that if you circle your wagons the NCAA is an impotent joke to do much of anything to you. We are way too committed to doing things the "right way" to truly be in on a lot of the elite recruits (mostly talking out of State here). Not saying that we don't do a few things here and there to cut corners and compete (particularly in state) like every P5 program does but we aren't "all in" in the recruiting game like they are up North. Third, they are much more willing to take on low lifes that are good at football which gives them another advantage. Character seems to be the last quality that UNM is looking for in a football recruit but nobody can say that taking on a suspect guy like for example Kelly hasn't made them a much better football team.
This is my question for you maroonmania.

Concerning what you just posted above - why can't MSU in general CHOOSE to embrace the 'right' way? Why don't we CHOOSE to embrace character? Look I realize some guys are going to get paid but we do not have to make that our entire mission and/or focal point like Ole Miss does. I mean, that's THEM, it's not really us. It gets back to our image as workers - middle class grinders or whatever cheesy analogy you want to make - rather than buying a bunch of mercenaries to do their work for them, like they do. We tried that with Jackie and it didn't work. We tried that with Stansbury and it didn't work. It doesn't suit us.

[BrunswickDawg]

Not to get sentimental and holier than thou when talking about OM, but......

I think the majority of fans want good kids that are learning to be great adults, and doing their best to win football games (or baseball or any sport for that matter). They want to be competitive and have a a punchers shot, but realize at the end of the day sports isn't the most important aspect of life. They want to feel good about the people representing us and at the same time not be the doormat of the league. Spend time talking to State fans who are not message board jockeys and most will tell you we are in the middle of a golden age for State. Just look at the evidence:
Largest enrollment ever
Campus in best shape ever and growing
Donations growing
Top facilities that we raised money for with relative ease
8-10 win football seasons, with very few character issues
CWS Final
Top 10 Women's Basketball team
Top 20 Softball team
Top 10 Women's Golf
Individual National Champions in Track & Field
Competitive Men's Golf
NCAA Tourney Tennis Teams

I am sure I am missing things. Point being, compare all of those things to the shit show up the road and tell me which school is "all in" and which isn't.

[Taog Redloh]

Excellent points. Perspective....

[maroonmania]

This is my question for you maroonmania.

Concerning what you just posted above - why can't MSU in general CHOOSE to embrace the 'right' way? Why don't we CHOOSE to embrace character? Look I realize some guys are going to get paid but we do not have to make that our entire mission and/or focal point like Ole Miss does. I mean, that's THEM, it's not really us. It gets back to our image as workers - middle class grinders or whatever cheesy analogy you want to make - rather than buying a bunch of mercenaries to do their work for them, like they do. We tried that with Jackie and it didn't work. We tried that with Stansbury and it didn't work. It doesn't suit us.

I'm not saying we can't embrace it, but to do so means you are recruiting from a significantly smaller pool of TRUE SEC athletes than you would otherwise. Its an admirable thing to recruit, as best you can, guys that are primarily happy just to get a scholarship and who are truly good human beings, and I'm actually proud that our coaches and administration strive for that. HOWEVER, if you place those things above winning, and are not willing to cross certain boundaries you will be at somewhat of a disadvantage on the SEC field athletically especially since we are not a school that traditionally attracts the elite prospects not from MS anyway. UNM has made it abundantly clear that winning is their primary objective and if they have to cut corners big time to get a player that can help them or take someone with questionable character because they are a great athlete then they will do it in a heartbeat to win football games. Its the ugly side of college football but it is what it is.

[MadDawg]

+1. This site unfortunately has become the antithesis of what it promised to be. The personalities are more concerned with being right than they are with helping State. Spreading rumors, and breaking news that is in general bad for us, to get the internet cred points rather that driving a positive message is what it's turning out to be. Still it's the best site for information, but it needs to get back to its roots.

There is always a race here (and other places as well) to be the first poster to come out with their "why our current coach sucks and if you weren't so stupid you would see it too" post. Then it's "all-in" with the coach sucks mantra, attacking anyone who disagrees as "part of the problem" and another idiot "accepting mediocrity". Wash, rinse, repeat.

[DanDority]

To be better at any sport you MUST put ego aside, that goes from the coaches, players handlers, to the players themselves, all the way down to the alumni and fans. End of story.

[Taog Redloh]

I'm not saying we can't embrace it, but to do so means you are recruiting from a significantly smaller pool of TRUE SEC athletes than you would otherwise. Its an admirable thing to recruit, as best you can, guys that are primarily happy just to get a scholarship and who are truly good human beings, and I'm actually proud that our coaches and administration strive for that. HOWEVER, if you place those things above winning, and are not willing to cross certain boundaries you will be at somewhat of a disadvantage on the SEC field athletically especially since we are not a school that traditionally attracts the elite prospects not from MS anyway. UNM has made it abundantly clear that winning is their primary objective and if they have to cut corners big time to get a player that can help them or take someone with questionable character because they are a great athlete then they will do it in a heartbeat to win football games. Its the ugly side of college football but it is what it is.
It's an ugly side of football, that has netted them two 9-3 seasons and undeserved Big 6 bowl game invites (let's be clear, they didn't deserve the Peach last year and they don't deserve the Sugar over Florida this year, but life ain't fair). In that same time span, we are 10-2 and 8-4. Exact same record, doing things our way.

Bottom line - we're ALREADY doing things the right way (as well as you can). It's working. We're recruiting as well as we ever have. I just don't want us to take the OM route due to some perceived desperation, rather than playing our own game.

I propose to keep doing what we're doing, and getting everyone behind it.

[maroonmania]

It's an ugly side of football, that has netted them two 9-3 seasons and undeserved Big 6 bowl game invites (let's be clear, they didn't deserve the Peach last year and they don't deserve the Sugar over Florida this year, but life ain't fair). In that same time span, we are 10-2 and 8-4. Exact same record, doing things our way.

Bottom line - we're ALREADY doing things the right way (as well as you can). It's working. We're recruiting as well as we ever have. I just don't want us to take the OM route due to some perceived desperation, rather than playing our own game.

I propose to keep doing what we're doing, and getting everyone behind it.

I agree that we are probably recruiting as well as we ever have except along the OL. We have GOT to get that corrected to have any chance to really compete for the West. Dak made up for a lot of OL deficiencies this year to get us to 8 wins, not sure if we can do that next year with a new QB if the OL doesn't improve significantly.