This guy gets it........

[Liverpooldawg]

http://maroonandwhitenation.com/2015/10/20/stop-asking-to-take-the-football-away-from-dak-prescott/

[MSUDawg4Life]

Stupid article.

Nobody is trying to take the ball out of Dak's hands. Folks are just saying Dak, our offense and ultimately our whole team would be better if we had a semblance of a running game.

[Liverpooldawg]

But we don't, that's his point.

[Taog Redloh]

Terrible article. No one one wants to take the ball out of Dak's hands, they want to take it out of Shumpert's and to an extent, Holloway's.....at least when it comes to hand-offs.

I have not seen ONE SOLITARY PERSON, whether it's a message board idiot or an irate fan at the fan, say we should take the ball out of Dak's hands. Shit most of us want to see him run it MORE.

Stop being dumb Liverpooldawg. You and Justin Strawn.

[CadaverDawg]

Strawn seems like a really good dude, so I hope he doesn't take it personal, but that's a terrible article. I should have known better when I saw who linked it. Shame on me.

Like MSUD4L and Goat said...that is nowhere close to what 99% of the fans are asking for.

[Liverpooldawg]

Well, if we are running the ball with anyone other than Dak we ARE taking the ball out of his hands. That fact is indisputable. People ARE saying we are throwing the ball too much. People ARE saying that two untested freshmen need to get it more running the ball. What he is saying and I have been saying is we are what we are. We can't run the ball with a any consistantcy but we are pretty good at throwing the ball. Why be bullheaded and keep on doing what we can't do? That's Coomesqe.

[War Machine Dawg]

Terrible article. No one one wants to take the ball out of Dak's hands, they want to take it out of Shumpert's and to an extent, Holloway's.....at least when it comes to hand-offs.

I have not seen ONE SOLITARY PERSON, whether it's a message board idiot or an irate fan at the fan, say we should take the ball out of Dak's hands. Shit most of us want to see him run it MORE.

Stop being dumb Liverpooldawg. You and Justin Strawn.

He's really gotten a case of the stupids lately.

[Liverpooldawg]

Y'all missed the point of the article entirely. He is calling for more passing. At least that's the way I took it. He has a point about the running game, if it ain't showed up by now what makes you think it's going to magically appear in the last 5 games? Do you continue to try to do it or do you adapt?

[CadaverDawg]

Well, if we are running the ball with anyone other than Dak we ARE taking the ball out of his hands. That fact is indisputable. People ARE saying we are throwing the ball too much. People ARE saying that two untested freshmen need to get it more running the ball. What he is saying and I have been saying is we are what we are. We can't run the ball with a any consistantcy but we are pretty good at throwing the ball. Why be bullheaded and keep on doing what we can't do? That's Coomesqe.

Jamies Winston was a great QB...did FSU run it? Mariota was great...did they run it? Derrick Henry is great...does Bama throw it? Your point is childishly close-minded on so many levels. It doesn't matter how good your QB is, you still have to show SOME runs to keep a defense honest or you can't maximize your offense. Hell, Baylor even runs the ball. People are simply saying that WHEN we run it with a RB, as we should, put our best RB's in to carry it.

People who think we should "abandon the run, pass only", or "Don't let a RB carry it, just Dak", have no business discussing football, because you don't get it. Defense wins over time when you are 1 dimensional. I feel dumb even having to explain this.

[Liverpooldawg]

Jamies Winston was a great QB...did FSU run it? Mariota was great...did they run it? Derrick Henry is great...does Bama throw it? Your point is ****ing childishly stupid on so many levels. It doesn't matter how good your QB is, you still have to show SOME runs to keep a defense honest or you can't maximize your offense. Hell, Baylor even runs the ball. People are simply saying that WHEN we run it with a RB, as we should, put our best RB's in to carry it.

People who think we should "abandon the run, pass only", or "Don't let a RB carry it, just Dak", have no business discussing football, because you don't get it. Defense wins over time when you are 1 dimensional. I feel dumb even having to explain this.

Of course they ran it. They could run it and run it fairly well. We can't. You do have to run it some as you said. But it does not need to be a point of emphasis for this team. We just aren't very good at it and to maximize our chances of winning we have to pass way more than run. If you think I'm happy saying this you are nuts. I HATE pass happy offense. I grew up watching Nebraska run the option out of the I, Oklahoma, Texas, and Alabama, running the wishbone, USC running student body right, and Rocky Felker running the veer. My MSU student days were The John Bond and Micheal Haddix days. Nothing makes me happier than seeing MSU load it up and run it at and around people. That being said you have to adapt to what you can do. This year that means we have to go pass happy. It is what it is.

By the way, does calling people childish make you feel more like an adult? Just wondering.��

[Taog Redloh]

We can't. You do have to run it some as you said. But it does not need to be a point of emphasis for this team. We just aren't very good at it and to maximize our chances of winning we have to pass way more than run.
Not exactly sure where you are disagreeing. Nobody is advocating making the run game a point of emphasis. We simply want to not suck at it....ie make the defense respect it moderately.

[Liverpooldawg]

Not exactly sure where you are disagreeing. Nobody is advocating making the run game a point of emphasis. We simply want to not suck at it....ie make the defense respect it moderately.

And you think I don't? There is nothing I'd like to see more than it become respectable. I'm just being objective and honest in saying I see little sign of that happening at the moment. I agree that The freshmen look better, but that is only a matter of degree. The running game isn't respectable right now now matter who is in the backfield. It is what it is.

[Taog Redloh]

If we can't run the ball then Alabama is going to beat us by 30. That's just the beginning.

Dak isn't good enough to beat great teams through the air ONLY. Period.

[Homedawg]

If we can't run the ball then Alabama is going to beat us by 30. That's just the beginning.

Dak isn't good enough to beat great teams through the air ONLY. Period.

Well then they are going to beat us by 30 then. Nothing we can do this year is going to change that. Not that I don't want us to run- we just can't.

[Coach34]

Y'all missed the point of the article entirely. He is calling for more passing. At least that's the way I took it. He has a point about the running game, if it ain't showed up by now what makes you think it's going to magically appear in the last 5 games? Do you continue to try to do it or do you adapt?

Yes- we have to have some semblance of a running game to win big games- not throw the ball more. Shit- Phillip Rivers threw for 500 yards Sunday and still lost- why? They couldnt run the ball and keep the D honest. Quit being a Tard

[Coach34]

. Not that I don't want us to run- we just can't.

The right people can. Shump and Holloway cant

[sleepy dawg]

I think there is a bit of misunderstandings here... perhaps not, but that's the way I'm reading several of the responses.
While I don't agree that the answer is for Dak to pass more; the writer (and lpd) are trying to convey that our entire RB situation (and I guess run blocking) are not as good as we are with Dak most of the time. The article isn't saying abandon the run entirely, it's just saying our best chance to win is with the ball in Dak's hands most times because they think our running game won't really ever come close to what Dak can do. The inverse of this thought would be that we have Fournette, so we're going to run him 100 times a game because no one else on offense can produce anywhere close to that level.

This line of thought is basically saying we're much better off using just this one guy regardless if teams know exactly what's coming because even with that particular disadvantage, we're still better there than the alternative. Maybe y'all are seeing this too, but it seems like everyone wasn't seeing it that way.

It's not saying don't take it out of Shumps and Holloways hands and give those carries to Lee or Williams. That completely misses the point too. They are saying it's irrelevant who runs it. (Mostly directed at Taog, as there are definitely people saying we should be passing less.. again, I'm not saying I agree with the article entriely).

From the writer and lpd it comes down to a belief that we won't be able run the ball effectively this year, and we have the best QB ever, so let's just stilk with the QB 75% of the time (made up percentage). To me this is the differences in what everyone is arguing about.

Answer these questions:
Is it possible to have an effective run game this year?
If you knew it was not possible to have an effective run game this year, how would you want your offense executed with Dak at QB?

All that said, I believe it's obvious that Dontavian Lee can run the ball quite effectively, and should be getting at least 15 carries a game until he f*cks it up, but if if Lee, Williams, and probably even Dear were to get injured, I'd probably be right in line with this article because I do believe we'd be better off passing the ball far more than running it with Shump and Holloway at this point.

Also, I have no idea why I spent this much time on this thread that no one will probably read again.

[sleepy dawg]

I see y'all have now started to come to this conclusion too now.

[sleepy dawg]

I also will say that even in the event that I do believe we should go all out passing, I think it would cost us games, but you have to do what you think gives you the best shot, and if you think your run game is that terrible, then in the end it should cost you less games to pass very frequently (assuming you're much better at passing of course).

[MSUDawg4Life]

How do we know we can't have a running game when our best rusher doesn't get the ball until late in the fourth quarter? Yet, Holloway gets to run the ball up the middle 5 times for FIVE YARDS against aTm, 5 times for SEVEN YARDS against freakin' Troy and a whopping 8 times for an incredible FOURTEEN yards against LaTech.

But, the guy who has gotten seven yards a carry can't buy a touch until the game is almost over because he fumbled - once.

We're supposed to give up and just pass the ball when we have DLee, AWilliams and Malik Dear on the team.

GTFOHWTBS.

[THE Bruce Dickinson]

The lost because they played one of the 2 best teams in football on the road.

[TUSK]

If we can't run the ball then Alabama is going to beat us by 30. That's just the beginning.

Dak isn't good enough to beat great teams through the air ONLY. Period.

I'd have Dak run it 10 and throw it at least 40 times... IMO...

[Barking 13]

Even the mantra last year was RT17FB... I still say it boils down to line play, no matter who runs it... but it's painfully obvious to everyone (except CDM) that Holloway and Shump ain't the answer, and even Dak ain't, because everybody can see that if we can't run it, either Dak is going to run and they load the box, or pass, and they send the house. Then there's the freshmen "fumblers"... If we had just a semblance of a 4 yd consistent RB up the gut, we wouldn't be having this conversation. And that is up to the big guys up front (and Hev) to get it done.

[FISHDAWG]

Strawn seems like a really good dude, so I hope he doesn't take it personal, but that's a terrible article. I should have known better when I saw who linked it. Shame on me.

Like MSUD4L and Goat said...that is nowhere close to what 99% of the fans are asking for.

isn't he the same guy that was just complaining about the lasers @ Kyle Field ???

[FISHDAWG]

Even the mantra last year was RT17FB... I still say it boils down to line play, no matter who runs it... but it's painfully obvious to everyone (except CDM) that Holloway and Shump ain't the answer, and even Dak ain't, because everybody can see that if we can't run it, either Dak is going to run and they load the box, or pass, and they send the house. Then there's the freshmen "fumblers"... If we had just a semblance of a 4 yd consistent RB up the gut, we wouldn't be having this conversation. And that is up to the big guys up front (and Hev) to get it done.

even Dak has fumbled on more than one occasion #freedontavianlee # turnmalikdearloose

[BB30]

Lee should be getting more touches no doubt. That still will not fix our running game it might benefit us against Ky, maybe ark and depending on injuries OM. Which would be significant. But, for those of you that say we will get run out of the stadium if D Lee doesn't carry the ball a bunch against Bama I just can't see it. There D line is going to eat our O line up I don't care if we had Adrian Peterson he would not be able to run with our O line against Bama. We are going to have to throw the ball probably 60% of the time in that game if not more to win. Hopefully Dak figures out that he has some chances to scramble and we use that plus short passing game as our run threat. There are other ways to keep the defense honest then just running with a back between the tackles. I think what has been most frustrating for me as a fan is the fact that we have always had at least an above average rushing threat and now we don't even when we were horrible we had Norwood and Dixon.

[CadaverDawg]

even Dak has fumbled on more than one occasion #freedontavianlee # turnmalikdearloose

#NothingRunsLikeADear

[Liverpooldawg]

Yes- we have to have some semblance of a running game to win big games- not throw the ball more. Shit- Phillip Rivers threw for 500 yards Sunday and still lost- why? They couldnt run the ball and keep the D honest. Quit being a Tard

I want to win the lottery too. It's the only way I can ever afford to travel like I'd like too. I'm still trying to win it by buying a ticket every now and then but that doesn't mean I'm planning my life around something that isn't likely to happen. That's kind of where we are in the running game now. It's not THAT unlikely that we will suddenly find one in the last 5 games, but the odds are still against it. I'm not arguing that you aren't right, you are. I'm just arguing that it isn't likely to happen this year and we need to act accordingly. I'm just being realistic.

[Liverpooldawg]

I think there is a bit of misunderstandings here... perhaps not, but that's the way I'm reading several of the responses.
While I don't agree that the answer is for Dak to pass more; the writer (and lpd) are trying to convey that our entire RB situation (and I guess run blocking) are not as good as we are with Dak most of the time. The article isn't saying abandon the run entirely, it's just saying our best chance to win is with the ball in Dak's hands most times because they think our running game won't really ever come close to what Dak can do. The inverse of this thought would be that we have Fournette, so we're going to run him 100 times a game because no one else on offense can produce anywhere close to that level.

This line of thought is basically saying we're much better off using just this one guy regardless if teams know exactly what's coming because even with that particular disadvantage, we're still better there than the alternative. Maybe y'all are seeing this too, but it seems like everyone wasn't seeing it that way.

It's not saying don't take it out of Shumps and Holloways hands and give those carries to Lee or Williams. That completely misses the point too. They are saying it's irrelevant who runs it. (Mostly directed at Taog, as there are definitely people saying we should be passing less.. again, I'm not saying I agree with the article entriely).

From the writer and lpd it comes down to a belief that we won't be able run the ball effectively this year, and we have the best QB ever, so let's just stilk with the QB 75% of the time (made up percentage). To me this is the differences in what everyone is arguing about.

Answer these questions:
Is it possible to have an effective run game this year?
If you knew it was not possible to have an effective run game this year, how would you want your offense executed with Dak at QB?

All that said, I believe it's obvious that Dontavian Lee can run the ball quite effectively, and should be getting at least 15 carries a game until he f*cks it up, but if if Lee, Williams, and probably even Dear were to get injured, I'd probably be right in line with this article because I do believe we'd be better off passing the ball far more than running it with Shump and Holloway at this point.

Also, I have no idea why I spent this much time on this thread that no one will probably read again.

I pretty much agree although I don't think anyone, including Dak and Lee, is going to be able to run the ball consistently behind the run blocking we have at the moment. If the blocking gets better then by all means run the ball. I hate pass happy offense.

[CadaverDawg]

I want to win the lottery too. It's the only way I can ever afford to travel like I'd like too. I'm still trying to win it by buying a ticket every now and then but that doesn't mean I'm planning my life around something that isn't likely to happen. That's kind of where we are in the running game now. It's not THAT unlikely that we will suddenly find one in the last 5 games, but the odds are still against it. I'm not arguing that you aren't right, you are. I'm just arguing that it isn't likely to happen this year and we need to act accordingly. I'm just being realistic.

Lee is averaging 8 yds a carry. If Lottery odds were as good as our odds of being able to run the ball SOME with the proper personnel...I'd never work a day in my life and we'd all be loaded.

And again, you're still missing the point. It's not about Lee carrying it 20 times vs Bama and gaining 100 yards. Nobody is saying nor expecting that. But we do have to run the ball some to keep defenses honest. Not run it GREAT some...just run the ball some Attempts. And since we HAVE to do that to maximize our more successful elements like our passing game, we might as well Maximize those 12-15 run attempts every game with a guy that is averaging 8 yards per carry and has shown the ability to gain some yards with our current OL.

And you still are ignoring the fact that even with the above being the case...Lee is averaging 7-8 yds per carry, and Williams 4-5 per carry...so technically we don't KNOW for certain that we can't actually run the ball with some success, Bc we aren't giving ourselves a chance to find out with Lee and Williams on the bench.

So either way, we have to run the ball. Why not maximize your runs? You just throw the "poor OL" thing out there every post, yet Lee and Williams ypc doesn't support your claim. And again, you still have to run the ball some even if you're getting stuffed, or it will be easy as hell to defend our pass.

[Ifyouonlyknew]

And again, you still have to run the ball some even if you're getting stuffed, or it will be easy as hell to defend our pass.

I totally agree with this statement & we've tried to that lately. Our 1st 3 games against FBS opponents we were avg 25rushes/game. Our last 3 games agains FBS opponents we have avg 32rushes/game. We're still not having great success but we are trying to run the football more.

[ScoobaDawg]

Well, if we are running the ball with anyone other than Dak we ARE taking the ball out of his hands. That fact is indisputable. People ARE saying we are throwing the ball too much. People ARE saying that two untested freshmen need to get it more running the ball. What he is saying and I have been saying is we are what we are. We can't run the ball with a any consistantcy but we are pretty good at throwing the ball. Why be bullheaded and keep on doing what we can't do? That's Coomesqe.

Because you don't win in the SEC being one dimensional. Dak can't keep the ball non-stop. Especially since he isn't threatening to run very often..instead checking down to a short pass in the flats to the running back for 3 yards when he could of run for 15.

[ScoobaDawg]

Of course they ran it. They could run it and run it fairly well. We can't. You do have to run it some as you said. But it does not need to be a point of emphasis for this team. We just aren't very good at it and to maximize our chances of winning we have to pass way more than run. If you think I'm happy saying this you are nuts. I HATE pass happy offense. I grew up watching Nebraska run the option out of the I, Oklahoma, Texas, and Alabama, running the wishbone, USC running student body right, and Rocky Felker running the veer. My MSU student days were The John Bond and Micheal Haddix days. Nothing makes me happier than seeing MSU load it up and run it at and around people. That being said you have to adapt to what you can do. This year that means we have to go pass happy. It is what it is.

By the way, does calling people childish make you feel more like an adult? Just wondering.��

YOU Just don't get it. You don't fix a running problem by passing more. We can't run with Holloway and Shumpert. We HAVE to fix the running problem by playing the young players to have a chance.

[Liverpooldawg]

Lee is averaging 8 yds a carry. If Lottery odds were as good as our odds of being able to run the ball SOME with the proper personnel...I'd never work a day in my life and we'd all be loaded.

And again, you're still missing the point. It's not about Lee carrying it 20 times vs Bama and gaining 100 yards. Nobody is saying nor expecting that. But we do have to run the ball some to keep defenses honest. Not run it GREAT some...just run the ball some Attempts. And since we HAVE to do that to maximize our more successful elements like our passing game, we might as well Maximize those 12-15 run attempts every game with a guy that is averaging 8 yards per carry and has shown the ability to gain some yards with our current OL.

And you still are ignoring the fact that even with the above being the case...Lee is averaging 7-8 yds per carry, and Williams 4-5 per carry...so technically we don't KNOW for certain that we can't actually run the ball with some success, Bc we aren't giving ourselves a chance to find out with Lee and Williams on the bench.

So either way, we have to run the ball. Why not maximize your runs? You just throw the "poor OL" thing out there every post, yet Lee and Williams ypc doesn't support your claim. And again, you still have to run the ball some even if you're getting stuffed, or it will be easy as hell to defend our pass.

I'm not arguing against Lee and Williams. Far from it. I've known Shumpert wasn't an SEC back longer than most here because I saw him play in HS. He needs to play OLB, I said that then and I still say it. Holloway does bring a breakaway threat but he is too small to block and he goes down at first contact usually, again because of his size. Lee and Williams are the future but until the line play is better, and I think it will be better down the road, we need to be pass heavy. You can run for a high average and still get stuffed 75% of the time. I just haven't seen any back we have this year be able to consistently run the ball enough to keep the chains moving at this time. Most of our running plays wind up being wasted downs and that puts even more pressure on the passing game. Like the lottery you don't stop trying if you want to win it, but you dang sure better not bank on winning it.

[CadaverDawg]

I'm not arguing against Lee and Williams. Far from it. I've known Shumpert wasn't an SEC back longer than most here because I saw him play in HS. He needs to play OLB, I said that then and I still say it. Holloway does bring a breakaway threat but he is too small to block and he goes down at first contact usually, again because of his size. Lee and Williams are the future but until the line play is better, and I think it will be better down the road, we need to be pass heavy. You can run for a high average and still get stuffed 75% of the time. I just haven't seen any back we have this year be able to consistently run the ball enough to keep the chains moving at this time. Most of our running plays wind up being wasted downs and that puts even more pressure on the passing game. Like the lottery you don't stop trying if you want to win it, but you dang sure better not bank on winning it.

http://i.imgur.com/xhLD3Ou.gif

I'm not even sure you know what you're argument is anymore.

[sleepy dawg]

http://i.imgur.com/xhLD3Ou.gif

I'm not even sure you know what you're argument is anymore.

Side topic: Cadaver's betting has become so easy for him, that he is now toying with everyone else with his amounts... 1818181.

[sleepy dawg]

isn't he the same guy that was just complaining about the lasers @ Kyle Field ???

Yes.

[CadaverDawg]

Side topic: Cadaver's betting has become so easy for him, that he is now toying with everyone else with his amounts... 1818181.

Haha, I didn't notice that.

(Cue Missouridawg showing me up with his Trump-sized "Biilyuunz")

[MadDawg]

Let's clear something up here.

If you are advocating that in order to fix the running game we need to run the ball MORE, then you are indeed taking the ball out of Dak's hands.

However, if you are advocating we fix the running game by simply running the ball more effectively by changing personnel, then you are not taking away Dak's production.

We are averaging 30 rushes and 35 passes a game. Our problem is not balancing the play calling. It's just getting better at running the ball.

Having said all that, do you folks realize we are averaging 4.75 yards per carry? That's not horrible....

[Liverpooldawg]

http://i.imgur.com/xhLD3Ou.gif

I'm not even sure you know what you're argument is anymore.

It's simple......pass more, run less. Most of the running needs to be unplanned by Dak. If we just HAVE to plan it needs to be Lee or Williams. Is that simple and straight forward enough for you to understand? My argument hasn't changed since after the USM game.

[HoopsDawg]

I'd have Dak run it 10 and throw it at least 40 times... IMO...

For sure. #PTGDF