Football recruiting and '16 team

[msstate7]

Looking at our roster, cb's and dline seem to be the weakest positions for next season. Do we plan to fill these positions thru recruiting this year or do we have players on our roster?

I realize Dak will leave a huge hole, but I think staley/fitz will do a nice job.

[Interpolation_Dawg_EX]

The only CB we have committed that can possibly play immediately is Durr and at DT we signed Trey Brown to hopefully provide depth. I thought Deon Pope would be in the class as well, but I saw he was now on the 2017 class list. I'm kind of confused by our recruiting this year. I was expecting a little bump from our run last year, but we're pretty average so far. I know we can improve that IF some of the big in state guys choose us.

[smootness]

Jiles, Cleveland, and Graham will still be around at CB, then we have Rayford, Stamps, and Smitherman behind them. I actually think our talent will be fine there, but we don't know how long it will take them to get comfortable. Durr will help, as Interpolation said, and there's a chance we add a freshman who can step right in (Knott specifically, though unlikely).

I'm more concerned about the d-line. Hopefully Chris Jones and Ryan Brown are the only guys we lose there. If that's the case we should be fine. Jefferson, Coleman, Calvin, Harris, Joseph, and Mullins is a pretty good DE group, and James, Adams, Adams, Thomas, Hoyett, Kendell Jones is a solid group at DT as well. It may take a year or two before that group is a true impact group, but I don't think it's a major concern unless Jefferson and/or James leave as well. Brown is a depth addition, and Kobe Jones may play right away. Simmons would absolutely play immediately and might start by the end of the year.

[maroonmania]

The only CB we have committed that can possibly play immediately is Durr and at DT we signed Trey Brown to hopefully provide depth. I thought Deon Pope would be in the class as well, but I saw he was now on the 2017 class list. I'm kind of confused by our recruiting this year. I was expecting a little bump from our run last year, but we're pretty average so far. I know we can improve that IF some of the big in state guys choose us.

True, given the great run we had last year to #1 you would have thought that we would have gotten much more of a bump with this recruiting class but so far that hasn't happened. We've got guys like Simmons, Brown, K. Jones and Lashley that are all big time recruits right in our backyard that could have pulled the trigger for us in the Summer and been key assets as recruiters for us on other guys but wouldn't do it for whatever reason. We may end up with even all of them eventually but the thing that pulled together the depth of last year's class was the fact we got guys like Peters, Dear, D. Jones and others that were highly rated guys that got in the boat early and worked on other guys to join. Our football program should be the most attractive its ever been to HS recruits so I'm not sure why we haven't made more headway with some of these guys by now. Especially guys that are right on our doorstep.

[BB30]

Yea, its been interesting to see. I think next year should be a very good class for us. If we can finish this year's class with most of the local guys we will be ok but next year seems to be setting up nicely for us. Very talented group in state next year and several ins for us. I would love to add Knott to the class but with his injury I don't know how much of an immediate impact he would be able to make next year, especially since we bring young guys along a littler slower. I really hope we can add the DL and OL prospects left on our board as there is some good talent there and we have a shot at most of them. I don't know why we have such a hard time closing on guys that are so close to the program. You can look back to Adams last year and a few others. Those guys close to the program holding out and delaying their commitment doesn't help.

[CadaverDawg]

maroonmania and BB30, I totally agree. I know at the end of the day, it only matters that we DO get those local guys you're talking about....but it sure would help make the class more dynamic if we could get guys like Simmons, Brown, and Lashley on board and have them recruiting for us to try and get guys like Knott and others.

I always hear that we purposefully tell some of those guys to wait to commit, but that makes no sense to me.

[msstate7]

May be better for us if these top in-state guys commit to us early, but probably more beneficial to them to wait... Better leverage in a deal.

[Ifyouonlyknew]

I agree as far as public perception that it would help if some of the local guys were to commit. The thing is that these guys talk with each other all the time so they know what's going on in each others recruitments way sooner than fans, reporters, & a lot of time coaches do. These guys tweet & group text each other all the time so they know what's going on with each other.

[msstate7]

I agree as far as public perception that it would help if some of the local guys were to commit. The thing is that these guys talk with each other all the time so they know what's going on in each others recruitments way sooner than fans, reporters, & a lot of time coaches do. These guys tweet & group text each other all the time so they know what's going on with each other.

Still feel good about Simmons, lashley, Davis, and jones?

Are mason and dickens takes?

[Ifyouonlyknew]

Still feel good about Simmons, lashley, Davis, and jones?

Are mason and dickens takes?

Yes

I don't think either could call & commit today.

[Coach007]

2016 will be a contender season for us. We will be better and a lot of then younger talent we have this year will be good to go.

We will be improved at Lb. That's huge for us. Remember that we play not to give up huge plays and safeties are key. We are solid there. The speed and talent improvement at lb... Key.

Offense.... Love what Dak has done, but we have 2 with higher upsides and one of them will break some of Daks records. The Rbs are coming along now and we don't lose any of them. We also have great wrs and a future NFL Te.

That's not giving up on this season.... Just saying what I see for next.

[Interpolation_Dawg_EX]

2016 will be a contender season for us. We will be better and a lot of then younger talent we have this year will be good to go.

We will be improved at Lb. That's huge for us. Remember that we play not to give up huge plays and safeties are key. We are solid there. The speed and talent improvement at lb... Key.

Offense.... Love what Dak has done, but we have 2 with higher upsides and one of them will break some of Daks records. The Rbs are coming along now and we don't lose any of them. We also have great wrs and a future NFL Te.

That's not giving up on this season.... Just saying what I see for next.

Uh no...maybe 2017, but 2016 is the rebuilding year. Now, we could surprise a few people and look better than expected, but we will not compete for the west.

[smootness]

Uh no...maybe 2017, but 2016 is the rebuilding year. Now, we could surprise a few people and look better than expected, but we will not compete for the west.

Totally agree. We will lose Dak, probably De'Runnya, and 2 starters on the OL. Our offense won't be better next year, though it can still be good. But while the safeties should be improved with experience, we will take a significant step back at CB, which will hurt quite a bit. Our LB play may be excellent, but losing Brown and Jones on the DL will hurt as well.

I certainly don't see how we take a step forward next year and will probably take a slight step back. But 2017 should be set up very well. Fitzgerald/Staley at QB with a full year under his belt, pretty much all our RBs still around, and Gray and AJ Brown could be an excellent tandem at WR. On defense, we could throw out a DL with Fletcher Adams, Cory Thomas, Jeffrey Simmons, Kobe Jones, Grant Harris, Keith Joseph, Mullins, etc. Green and Gray will still be around at LB, along with Leo Lewis, Tim Washington, Dez Harris, and Traver Jung. Our safety trio of Peters/McLaurin/Bryant should be excellent, and our young CBs will have had time to gain the necessary experience to excel.

The issues that year will be a potentially inexperienced OL (will lose all 5 starters over the next 2 years) and DL. But we should have plenty of talent at both spots.

[Todd4State]

I think personally like Durr and Jiles at CB, but I'm pretty sure Cleveland will start. I think Chris Stamps has the highest ceiling though. Three- four years from now people will talk about where the heck did MSU get that guy from?

D-line just totally depends on if James leaves for the NFL. I like the young talent we have in Fletcher Adams and Cory Thomas.

[Ifyouonlyknew]

I think personally like Durr and Jiles at CB, but I'm pretty sure Cleveland will start. I think Chris Stamps has the highest ceiling though. Three- four years from now people will talk about where the heck did MSU get that guy from?

D-line just totally depends on if James leaves for the NFL. I like the young talent we have in Fletcher Adams and Cory Thomas.

Keith Joseph & Anfernee Mullins are 2 guys who are going to be really good at MSU before they leave.

[Todd4State]

Keith Joseph & Anfernee Mullins are 2 guys who are going to be really good at MSU before they leave.

Joseph is another one who was highly underrated. Mullins is just raw but he could be really good in a couple of years.

[Coach007]

Totally agree. We will lose Dak, probably De'Runnya, and 2 starters on the OL. Our offense won't be better next year, though it can still be good. But while the safeties should be improved with experience, we will take a significant step back at CB, which will hurt quite a bit. Our LB play may be excellent, but losing Brown and Jones on the DL will hurt as well.

I certainly don't see how we take a step forward next year and will probably take a slight step back. But 2017 should be set up very well. Fitzgerald/Staley at QB with a full year under his belt, pretty much all our RBs still around, and Gray and AJ Brown could be an excellent tandem at WR. On defense, we could throw out a DL with Fletcher Adams, Cory Thomas, Jeffrey Simmons, Kobe Jones, Grant Harris, Keith Joseph, Mullins, etc. Green and Gray will still be around at LB, along with Leo Lewis, Tim Washington, Dez Harris, and Traver Jung. Our safety trio of Peters/McLaurin/Bryant should be excellent, and our young CBs will have had time to gain the necessary experience to excel.

The issues that year will be a potentially inexperienced OL (will lose all 5 starters over the next 2 years) and DL. But we should have plenty of talent at both spots.

About the CBs.. Like I said, we are giving up short passes already. Its the play of our safeties that has slowed down the 30-60 yard TD plays. That really helps out the play of the cbs. With a stronger and faster lb group with depth, they can generate the pressure we need and give coverage support. Our DL won't have to be the best. I will eat my crow, but we won't see much difference on defense.

On offense, we will actually take a step forward. The 2 qbs are ready now. What's going to help out will be an early ability to run with e/perienced talented backs. We will have the wrs and TE. Nobody expected Dak to be able to do what he did in his first year as the starter. Nobody. Its not hard to fathom that these guys will be ready too

[BB30]

About the CBs.. Like I said, we are giving up short passes already. Its the play of our safeties that has slowed down the 30-60 yard TD plays. That really helps out the play of the cbs. With a stronger and faster lb group with depth, they can generate the pressure we need and give coverage support. Our DL won't have to be the best. I will eat my crow, but we won't see much difference on defense.

On offense, we will actually take a step forward. The 2 qbs are ready now. What's going to help out will be an early ability to run with e/perienced talented backs. We will have the wrs and TE. Nobody expected Dak to be able to do what he did in his first year as the starter. Nobody. Its not hard to fathom that these guys will be ready too

So you think we won't miss a beat replacing Dak next year?

[HancockCountyDog]

So you think we won't miss a beat replacing Dak next year?

Haven't you heard, according to some Fitz is a better fit for our offense than Dak. Im not sure why CDM is so stubborn and playing the damn senior instead of the young guy*****

[BB30]

Haven't you heard, according to some Fitz is a better fit for our offense than Dak. Im not sure why CDM is so stubborn and playing the damn senior instead of the young guy*****

I hope they are right, I just don't see us being able to replace the best QB in the SEC over the last two years and best QB we have ever had quite that easily. I'm not saying Fitz or Staley won't be good or even great but to think there won't be at least a little drop off is tough.

[Coach007]

So you think we won't miss a beat replacing Dak next year?

Its not that black and white. There are always trade offs. Think about this for a minute. Right now what is the difference between the offense this year and the offense last year? Its the ability to run.

Next season, that won't be the issue. That, in turn, helps the over all production of this offense. Fitz can run. We have all seen it. He can throw.... We have all seen it. He doesn't need to be a super hero for our offense to be improved over this years. See the point?

[BB30]

Its not that black and white. There are always trade offs. Think about this for a minute. Right now what is the difference between the offense this year and the offense last year? Its the ability to run.

Next season, that won't be the issue. That, in turn, helps the over all production of this offense. Fitz can run. We have all seen it. He can throw.... We have all seen it. He doesn't need to be a super hero for our offense to be improved over this years. See the point?

To an extent yes and no. Fitz won't fix all of our running issues. We will have to have a back step up if not it will be more of the same. Dak's ability or lack there of this year is not nearly as much on his ability to run as it is defense's schemes and lack of other threats running the ball. Until we have a back and an O line that can get the job done it could be worse. As far as the difference in our running game this year and last year I actually think we are missing Josh and our O-line more than Dak's lack of running which Fitz cannot fix by himself. We have also seen Fitz run and throw in the Maroon/White game and against Northwestern State not saying he won't be able to step in and be serviceable but to think he will put up the same production as Dak at this time is kind of hard to call.

[Coach007]

Q

[Coach007]

To an extent yes and no. Fitz won't fix all of our running issues. We will have to have a back step up if not it will be more of the same. Dak's ability or lack there of this year is not nearly as much on his ability to run as it is defense's schemes and lack of other threats running the ball. Until we have a back and an O line that can get the job done it could be worse. As far as the difference in our running game this year and last year I actually think we are missing Josh and our O-line more than Dak's lack of running which Fitz cannot fix by himself. We have also seen Fitz run and throw in the Maroon/White game and against Northwestern State not saying he won't be able to step in and be serviceable but to think he will put up the same production as Dak at this time is kind of hard to call.

Oh we agree on that. We have to have a back step up now. I believe we are seeing it happen now. That was my point. If the running game via the backs are solid, there is every reason to believe we will be better on offense.

[Bothrops]

Our front 7 will be better next year, and that's with or without Jones. The second year of Manny's defense will be more refined and tailored to his system.

[Coach 57]

"Coach" the comment you made about how "nobody" knew Dak could do what he's done isn't true at all.

In the 2010 Gator Bowl practices where those that went got to see Tyler Vs Dak (as I did) you could absolutely see it. Lee (Coach 34) & myself were adamant that he WOULD BE the greatest QB in MSU history and often wondered why Mullen continued to play Tyler over him after Relf left. He was essentially the amalgamation of Tyler & Relf. The issue was that when we told everyone nobody believed. Then the 2011 Bowl practices came and again you could see his improvement from a running QB who could throw occasionally to a QB who could do both exceptionally well. Some saw it & shouted from the rooftops but were diagnosed as "typical Mis-take" fans who "always think the best QB is on the bench".

Fitz is the next guy. I believe that he is a better runner than Dak but not AS GOOD a passer. But I honestly feel that we may return to the Relf-coast offense next season due to the simplicity it gives the QB and allows for bigger gashes down the field in the passing game. It would also complement our RBs better as well. Less pass pro issues and allows the OL to be more aggressive, which is easier to coach as well as implementation.


The question looms: "Will it be a step back...or forward?"

I honestly believe ANYTIME you lose a player with the caliber of Dak there will be SOME decline. I think the media will pick us to be 6-6 or worse. But I feel it will be a 8 win season. The reason I don't feel we'll fall that much is because despite what most think CDM is a smart coach and I feel he'll simplify the offense (Relf-coast) and in turn will make us a far more physical team. Doing this will galvanize the defense because it will force them to be tougher because of the aggressive nature they'll face in practice week in and week out.

I don't do recruiting. I have never and won't comment on that much but I'll tell you we'll be just fine.

[BrunswickDawg]

"Coach" the comment you made about how "nobody" knew Dak could do what he's done isn't true at all.

In the 2010 Gator Bowl practices where those that went got to see Tyler Vs Dak (as I did) you could absolutely see it. Lee (Coach 34) & myself were adamant that he WOULD BE the greatest QB in MSU history and often wondered why Mullen continued to play Tyler over him after Relf left. He was essentially the amalgamation of Tyler & Relf. The issue was that when we told everyone nobody believed. Then the 2011 Bowl practices came and again you could see his improvement from a running QB who could throw occasionally to a QB who could do both exceptionally well. Some saw it & shouted from the rooftops but were diagnosed as "typical Mis-take" fans who "always think the best QB is on the bench".

Fitz is the next guy. I believe that he is a better runner than Dak but not AS GOOD a passer. But I honestly feel that we may return to the Relf-coast offense next season due to the simplicity it gives the QB and allows for bigger gashes down the field in the passing game. It would also complement our RBs better as well. Less pass pro issues and allows the OL to be more aggressive, which is easier to coach as well as implementation.


The question looms: "Will it be a step back...or forward?"

I honestly believe ANYTIME you lose a player with the caliber of Dak there will be SOME decline. I think the media will pick us to be 6-6 or worse. But I feel it will be a 8 win season. The reason I don't feel we'll fall that much is because despite what most think CDM is a smart coach and I feel he'll simplify the offense (Relf-coast) and in turn will make us a far more physical team. Doing this will galvanize the defense because it will force them to be tougher because of the aggressive nature they'll face in practice week in and week out.

I don't do recruiting. I have never and won't comment on that much but I'll tell you we'll be just fine.
The Relf coast offense is pretty much what Fitz ran in HS and excelled in. While he didn't pass much, he was deadly accurate in the games I saw with the only incompletions being drops by receivers. I think you are spot on about 8 wins.

[CadaverDawg]

"Coach" the comment you made about how "nobody" knew Dak could do what he's done isn't true at all.

In the 2010 Gator Bowl practices where those that went got to see Tyler Vs Dak (as I did) you could absolutely see it. Lee (Coach 34) & myself were adamant that he WOULD BE the greatest QB in MSU history and often wondered why Mullen continued to play Tyler over him after Relf left. He was essentially the amalgamation of Tyler & Relf. The issue was that when we told everyone nobody believed. Then the 2011 Bowl practices came and again you could see his improvement from a running QB who could throw occasionally to a QB who could do both exceptionally well. Some saw it & shouted from the rooftops but were diagnosed as "typical Mis-take" fans who "always think the best QB is on the bench".

Fitz is the next guy. I believe that he is a better runner than Dak but not AS GOOD a passer. But I honestly feel that we may return to the Relf-coast offense next season due to the simplicity it gives the QB and allows for bigger gashes down the field in the passing game. It would also complement our RBs better as well. Less pass pro issues and allows the OL to be more aggressive, which is easier to coach as well as implementation.


The question looms: "Will it be a step back...or forward?"

I honestly believe ANYTIME you lose a player with the caliber of Dak there will be SOME decline. I think the media will pick us to be 6-6 or worse. But I feel it will be a 8 win season. The reason I don't feel we'll fall that much is because despite what most think CDM is a smart coach and I feel he'll simplify the offense (Relf-coast) and in turn will make us a far more physical team. Doing this will galvanize the defense because it will force them to be tougher because of the aggressive nature they'll face in practice week in and week out.

I don't do recruiting. I have never and won't comment on that much but I'll tell you we'll be just fine.

Great post. I totally agree.

Coach, part of the reason I'm critical this year, is because I've never seen a Mullen offense be ultra effective without a running game. Everything about Mullen's O is based on run threat and most importantly "QB run threat", but we don't have it this year. And I know the OL isn't great, but you can't neglect the fundamentals of your offensive philosophy....you have to get more creative to find ways to have effective runs.
Next year, he will somewhat be forced to run it, Bc he is smart enough not to put the load on a first year starter's arm at QB. I too think we'll be better than most think next year Bc of an offensive philosophy change back to the Relf look. This hopefully gets us back to being physical again, Bc this year's team plays soft on both sides IMO. Not saying our players are soft, but they play soft due to soft schemes.

Get Fitz running that Relf offense, and with his arm, we could see some wide open looks in the passing game, Bc teams would be forced to load the box. Relf couldn't make teams pay with his arm the way that Fitz will be able to. It's exciting to think about.

I may be off, but that's my view. Thoughts?

[Taog Redloh]

I honestly believe ANYTIME you lose a player with the caliber of Dak there will be SOME decline. I think the media will pick us to be 6-6 or worse. But I feel it will be a 8 win season. The reason I don't feel we'll fall that much is because despite what most think CDM is a smart coach and I feel he'll simplify the offense (Relf-coast) and in turn will make us a far more physical team. Doing this will galvanize the defense because it will force them to be tougher because of the aggressive nature they'll face in practice week in and week out.
I agree. I will never be accused of being a Dak-lover but he's still a great player no matter what I think. Sometimes things happen when the team stops revolving around the superstar, that can make them better. Last year we used Dak correctly in Mullen's offense and now.....(fill in your own opinions)

I just hope we send Dak out as a winner this year. Really need 8-4 and an Egg Bowl win as a minimum, then win the bowl game.

[RougeDawg]

So you think we won't miss a beat replacing Dak next year?

Depends on which Dak you are talking about? We are already missing the Dak we saw last year, so I'm trying to figure out your question? Last year's Dak (and play calling) and we are 5-0 this year. Staley and Fitz would both be 3-2 right now and finish with 7-8 wins minimum, so please explain.

Not saying you are wrong, just stating that people aren't looking at losing Dak objectively. We aren't using his strengths to our benefit this year so how much will we really lose, other than experience?