It all comes down to this

[Todd4State]

Will Dan give Dontavian Lee a shot at being the running back or not? If the answer is yes- we will be fine. If not- we're going to struggle.

The little bit Dontavian played, I thought he looked pretty good.

[mstatefan91]

I agree. I feel for Shump, but he is not the answer

[msstate7]

I'd have open competition between shump, holloway, Williams, lee, dear, and Gibson. I haven't seen Gibson, but I have a good feeling about him for some reason

[Todd4State]

I'd start Lee, make Shumpert the H-Back/FB that we don't have and find ways to use Dear more. I think Gibson will be good, but I would exhaust our options with the non redshirt candidates before I consider him.

[mstatefan91]

Unfortunately, Dan plays the senior players. Won't happen. Buckle up for a lot of Shump no matter what.

[Todd4State]

Unfortunately, Dan plays the senior players. Won't happen. Buckle up for a lot of Shump no matter what.

That's why I was freaking out last week. I'm sure we will hear the blocking assignments excuse pretty soon with Lee. But not having a reliable running back is hurting us in the option game as well. Do we really want to pitch it to some guy that is going to run into the first thing he sees?

[Dawgface]

Unfortunately, Dan plays the senior players. Won't happen. Buckle up for a lot of Shump no matter what.

I'm afraid this is true. Dan has a problem playing young running backs. Perhaps when the season is 3/4 the way through and they have more experience he will play them more. But will be a little late then.

[Dawgtini]

I'm afraid this is true. Dan has a problem playing young running backs. Perhaps when the season is 3/4 the way through and they have more experience he will play them more. But will be a little late then.
I think I read where a coach - I think Manny - said that the team we field in November may look different than the team we open with at USM. That tells me that they just want to let a few guys get some experience. Game time is the only thing keeping them from being first string.

[Sacrifice]

Shump has had plenty of opportunities to prove what he can do. He's just not a naturally fluid RB and I hate to say that, I was a big fan of his coming out of HS. If lee could get some carries, I have no doubt he would be productive.

[Liverpooldawg]

It really won't matter who is running the ball till we figure out a way to run block, if that is possible.

[msstate7]

It really won't matter who is running the ball till we figure out a way to run block, if that is possible.

Northwestern state could've have come at a better time. We really need to work on ourselves this week

[phatdog]

We need a/some scholarship FG kickers.

[Todd4State]

We need a/some scholarship FG kickers.

I have been pleased with Graves so far. We need to not trust Bell.

[DownwardDawg]

I have been pleased with Graves so far. We need to not trust Bell.

Graves is great. It's awesome to see us making FG's.

[Saltydog]

downs, running in short yardage situations and special teams. He should NOT be our featured tail back.

[sleepy dawg]

I didn't see the game on TV, but from what I could tell in the stadium, it looked like there wasn't shit for running lanes... ever. Dak didn't suddenly become terrible at running the ball. There's a reason we couldn't run... LSU just wasn't having it. They were forcing us to beat them through the air, and it just took us too long to figure that out.

I'm still not saying stay with Shump, but I really don't think having Lee back there means we would've won this game.

[EngineerDawg]

I don't think the problem is shump. Dak is our best RB and he was held to what...-19 yards rushing? That's a problem with the offensive line, not the running back. Are we talking about the dropped passes? I'm just not sure why were aren't talking about th glaring o line problem.

[CadaverDawg]

Well, in Dan's defense, the last time he played a young RB vs LSU, Milton fumbled inside our 20, and it pretty much was the beginning of the end in that game. Not saying that's a reason to never play a redshirt Fr running back, but we only think of the potential positives. What if in practice Lee and Williams are fumble prone, and Dan sticks one of them out there and they fumble, and we never have a chance in the 4th quarter? Not trying to defend Dan, because he pissed me off so bad lastnight....but some of us fans aren't thinking about the things we dont see in practice, and that could turn out disastrous if they dont go the way we imagine in our heads. Dan is responsible for those things.

And for those that keep blaming the OL on Dak's rushing numbers....that is very misleading. Not saying he would have rushed for a hundred yards (i doubt he would bc our OL was bad), but the reason Dak had -19 was because of Sacks, not because he was getting stuffed on designed runs. Truth is, we didnt run but about 3 QB run plays all night, and they were all for positive yardage. We have almost completely abandoned the read option, and especially the QB keeper portion of it. I thought that was supposed to be the base of our offense? Have we abandoned the fundamentals of what defines us as an offense? I digress....but Dak had numerous opportunities to scramble for big yardage when our receivers were covered, and he not ONCE tucked it and ran. That is not an OL issue, that's a Dak and Dan issue.

Was the OL bad? Resounding yes. But did we even TRY to get our running game going by utilizing our best running weapon? Hell no, and thats where my frustration comes in. People forget that what makes our RB's run game, AND our passing game better is THE THREAT OF THE QB RUNNING. When we don't even attempt to do that, of course they will stuff our RB's, and they'll likely be better against the pass too, because they arent afraid of Dak taking off. So before we go blaming it all on the OL....remember that part of what has made our OL so good in year's past, is the fact that we have 2 running options in the backfield PLUS a passing threat and scramble threat at QB. Dan's play calling and/or Dak's unwillingness to keep on the read or scramble on pass plays, probably played a bigger role in our OL play than anybody is admitting.

Just my opinion.

[msstate7]

Well, in Dan's defense, the last time he played a young RB vs LSU, Milton fumbled inside our 20, and it pretty much was the beginning of the end in that game. Not saying that's a reason to never play a redshirt Fr running back, but we only think of the potential positives. What if in practice Lee and Williams are fumble prone, and Dan sticks one of them out there and they fumble, and we never have a chance in the 4th quarter? Not trying to defend Dan, because he pissed me off so bad lastnight....but some of us fans aren't thinking about the things we dont see in practice, and that could turn out disastrous if they dont go the way we imagine in our heads. Dan is responsible for those things.

And for those that keep blaming the OL on Dak's rushing numbers....that is very misleading. Not saying he would have rushed for a hundred yards (i doubt he would bc our OL was bad), but the reason Dak had -19 was because of Sacks, not because he was getting stuffed on designed runs. Truth is, we didnt run but about 3 QB run plays all night, and they were all for positive yardage. We have almost completely abandoned the read option, and especially the QB keeper portion of it. I thought that was supposed to be the base of our offense? Have we abandoned the fundamentals of what defines us as an offense? I digress....but Dak had numerous opportunities to scramble for big yardage when our receivers were covered, and he not ONCE tucked it and ran. That is not an OL issue, that's a Dak and Dan issue.

Was the OL bad? Resounding yes. But did we even TRY to get our running game going by utilizing our best running weapon? Hell no, and thats where my frustration comes in. People forget that what makes our RB's run game, AND our passing game better is THE THREAT OF THE QB RUNNING. When we don't even attempt to do that, of course they will stuff our RB's, and they'll likely be better against the pass too, because they arent afraid of Dak taking off. So before we go blaming it all on the OL....remember that part of what has made our OL so good in year's past, is the fact that we have 2 running options in the backfield PLUS a passing threat and scramble threat at QB. Dan's play calling and/or Dak's unwillingness to keep on the read or scramble on pass plays, probably played a bigger role in our OL play than anybody is admitting.

Just my opinion.
Speaking of Milton... He had 8 carries
75 yards 1 td yesterday

Wish we had Milton

[CadaverDawg]

Speaking of Milton... He had 8 carries
75 yards 1 td yesterday

Wish we had Milton

Me too, he would easily be our starter.

[BulldogBear]

Dak's a game manager now*****


Not really sure the sarcasterisks are applicable. ..

[Todd4State]

Well, in Dan's defense, the last time he played a young RB vs LSU, Milton fumbled inside our 20, and it pretty much was the beginning of the end in that game. Not saying that's a reason to never play a redshirt Fr running back, but we only think of the potential positives. What if in practice Lee and Williams are fumble prone, and Dan sticks one of them out there and they fumble, and we never have a chance in the 4th quarter? Not trying to defend Dan, because he pissed me off so bad lastnight....but some of us fans aren't thinking about the things we dont see in practice, and that could turn out disastrous if they dont go the way we imagine in our heads. Dan is responsible for those things.

And for those that keep blaming the OL on Dak's rushing numbers....that is very misleading. Not saying he would have rushed for a hundred yards (i doubt he would bc our OL was bad), but the reason Dak had -19 was because of Sacks, not because he was getting stuffed on designed runs. Truth is, we didnt run but about 3 QB run plays all night, and they were all for positive yardage. We have almost completely abandoned the read option, and especially the QB keeper portion of it. I thought that was supposed to be the base of our offense? Have we abandoned the fundamentals of what defines us as an offense? I digress....but Dak had numerous opportunities to scramble for big yardage when our receivers were covered, and he not ONCE tucked it and ran. That is not an OL issue, that's a Dak and Dan issue.

Was the OL bad? Resounding yes. But did we even TRY to get our running game going by utilizing our best running weapon? Hell no, and thats where my frustration comes in. People forget that what makes our RB's run game, AND our passing game better is THE THREAT OF THE QB RUNNING. When we don't even attempt to do that, of course they will stuff our RB's, and they'll likely be better against the pass too, because they arent afraid of Dak taking off. So before we go blaming it all on the OL....remember that part of what has made our OL so good in year's past, is the fact that we have 2 running options in the backfield PLUS a passing threat and scramble threat at QB. Dan's play calling and/or Dak's unwillingness to keep on the read or scramble on pass plays, probably played a bigger role in our OL play than anybody is admitting.

Just my opinion.

If they're fumble prone in practice, he needs to coach their ass up and correct it in practice. He still needs to give them some playing time to see how they do in an actual game. The two times Lee has touched the ball he has gained 4 and 6 yards- one of those being a pass reception. It also means that Dan is placing too much emphasis on practice and what goes on there.

However, it's interesting that the seniors just so happen to be the ones standing out at practice every year isn't it?

[CadaverDawg]

If they're fumble prone in practice, he needs to coach their ass up and correct it in practice. He still needs to give them some playing time to see how they do in an actual game. The two times Lee has touched the ball he has gained 4 and 6 yards- one of those being a pass reception. It also means that Dan is placing too much emphasis on practice and what goes on there.

However, it's interesting that the seniors just so happen to be the ones standing out at practice every year isn't it?

There's no doubt that he leans towards experienced players...he would even tell you that to your face I'm sure. I'm not defending him, in fact I get pissed about it too at times, I'm just playing devil's advocate because we don't know all the reasoning that Lee and Williams aren't getting more carries.

As for your point about practice....Of course he's going to base a lot on practice. If a guy is fumbling or missing blocks that would get our QB killed in practice, do you really think all the sudden they're going to be better vs LSU? Are you suggesting just throwing them out there even if they aren't doing well in practice all week? That's more of that irrational stuff we argued about last week. I think we need to let some young guys get more reps as well, and some may need to replace veterans....but at the same time you can't just throw a freshman into a key position in a tight LSU game, just to see if he can do it. To me, the mistake was made when we didn't get either of them reps vs USM. Then we could have given them a bigger role vs LSU. That's why I think this NW State game is important to get our guys some live reps, and see what some of these guys can do. It's also a way to build confidence and rhythm, because we need it.

[Todd4State]

There's no doubt that he leans towards experienced players...he would even tell you that to your face I'm sure. I'm not defending him, in fact I get pissed about it too at times, I'm just playing devil's advocate because we don't know all the reasoning that Lee and Williams aren't getting more carries.

As for your point about practice....Of course he's going to base a lot on practice. If a guy is fumbling or missing blocks that would get our QB killed in practice, do you really think all the sudden they're going to be better vs LSU? Are you suggesting just throwing them out there even if they aren't doing well in practice all week? That's more of that irrational stuff we argued about last week. I think we need to let some young guys get more reps as well, and some may need to replace veterans....but at the same time you can't just throw a freshman into a key position in a tight LSU game, just to see if he can do it. To me, the mistake was made when we didn't get either of them reps vs USM. Then we could have given them a bigger role vs LSU. That's why I think this NW State game is important to get our guys some live reps, and see what some of these guys can do. It's also a way to build confidence and rhythm, because we need it.

Practice should be the time to correct and teach- not punish. I think that there are some players that practice well that do not do as well when the lights are on. And I think that there are players that also may need the intensity of an actual game to focus and therefore they perform better in game than they do in practice. Practice is not the same as the game- and it should be valued to an extent.

Basically, I'm saying I don't believe Dan. The odds of the upper classmen being better literally every single time is extremely low.

And definitely agree about Dan needing to get more guys into the game. You have to give people chances to perform.

As far as throwing a player into a game- that's why a coach has to call something conservative in case a player can't do it- to minimize a loss in the event that it gets screwed up. We did that with Lee and we got 6 yards out of it. So, why not let him have another chance? Aeris Williams on the other hand lost 5 yards on his carry. So, let him sit for the time being.

To me it's equally irrational to just assume that the coach is always right in every case and that there is something that none of us are seeing. Some of our insiders certainly would have pointed that out by now.

[Dallas_Dawg]

All last year Paul Jones would interview our players and ask, "who is the most impressive redshirt?" Almost all of them, all throughout the year included Aeris and/or Dontavian in their response.
That is why I was excited about them. I think dan is just being hardheaded and loyal to Shump due to his work ethic and seniority or whatever.
But that's not how the world works. If you aren't the best, then you need to be on special teams.
Zach Jack and Shump are going to have to go sit down, it just really isn't debateable.

[msstate7]

All last year Paul Jones would interview our players and ask, "who is the most impressive redshirt?" Almost all of them, all throughout the year included Aeris and/or Dontavian in their response.
That is why I was excited about them. I think dan is just being hardheaded and loyal to Shump due to his work ethic and seniority or whatever.
But that's not how the world works. If you aren't the best, then you need to be on special teams.
Zach Jack and Shump are going to have to go sit down, it just really isn't debateable.

I definetely wanna see more of the other rb's, but I'm hardly ready to just bench shump. He has value. If we're strictly in pass mode, I want shump out there for his blocking and receiving. I do wanna see the other guys get some of shump's carries though

[HoopsDawg]

Speaking of Milton... He had 8 carries
75 yards 1 td yesterday

Wish we had Milton

He's better than any back on our roster.

[drunkernhelldawg]

I didn't see the game on TV, but from what I could tell in the stadium, it looked like there wasn't shit for running lanes... ever. Dak didn't suddenly become terrible at running the ball. There's a reason we couldn't run... LSU just wasn't having it. They were forcing us to beat them through the air, and it just took us too long to figure that out.

I'm still not saying stay with Shump, but I really don't think having Lee back there means we would've won this game.

I agree it's not all on Shump. I just think Lee could learn to block and that bringing him is some would give us a powerful new dimension.

That said, Shump makes some good plays. Again, I just don't like him every down.

[Todd4State]

All last year Paul Jones would interview our players and ask, "who is the most impressive redshirt?" Almost all of them, all throughout the year included Aeris and/or Dontavian in their response.
That is why I was excited about them. I think dan is just being hardheaded and loyal to Shump due to his work ethic and seniority or whatever.
But that's not how the world works. If you aren't the best, then you need to be on special teams.
Zach Jack and Shump are going to have to go sit down, it just really isn't debateable.

Not to mention Lee looked really good in the spring game.

[TUSK]

I've seen "Shumpert shouldn't play" & "but Dan sticks with SRs".... Isn't Shumpert a JR?

[msstate7]

I've seen "Shumpert shouldn't play" & "but Dan sticks with SRs".... Isn't Shumpert a JR?
Great! Dan's gonna stick with him next year too!**

[Todd4State]

I've seen "Shumpert shouldn't play" & "but Dan sticks with SRs".... Isn't Shumpert a JR?

Yes, but we don't have any senior running backs, so he is the oldest. That's why some people are saying "upperclassmen" as opposed to "seniors" since upperclassmen is more accurate technically.

Now do me a favor and tell Lane to get his head out of his ass and stay on the ground against Ole Miss- for the love of God. Last year was un-excusable on Bama's part.

[TUSK]

Yes, but we don't have any senior running backs, so he is the oldest. That's why some people are saying "upperclassmen" as opposed to "seniors" since upperclassmen is more accurate technically.

Now do me a favor and tell Lane to get his head out of his ass and stay on the ground against Ole Miss- for the love of God. Last year was un-excusable on Bama's part.

Dude, I'm with you... I'd like to see Henry, Drake and Harris carry it 50x, should game conditions allow...

[BayouDawg]

Here's the thing about CDM. He thinks his system is ingenious and that it doesn't matter who's on the field. If you ever get a chance to read Tim Tebow's book it gives some real insight on CDM's arrogance. Tebow said that when he was being recruited by Urban that all Mullen told him was that it didn't matter who was playing qb because his system was so great. I figured that after having Tyson Lee at quarterback would have humbled him and made him realize he didn't invent football. But maybe we'll find our offensive identity and turn out a solid season