So how many yards does LF have next week?

[RC3]

I set the over/under at 165

[msstate7]

Under.

I'm more worried about lsu hitting play action passes deep. LF will get around 100. If we limit big plays in the passing game, I think we win

[Todd4State]

If we tackle like last night- 200. Cecil Collins 2.0.

[RC3]

I'm more worried about lsu hitting play action passes deep.


This looks likely to happen as well

[RC3]

If we tackle like last night- 200. Cecil Collins 2.0.

My brother said "240" while watching that hot garbage tackling last night

[GreenheadDawg]

Next week your gonna think your watching Bo Jackson and Johnny Manziel on the same team. I hope it gets rained out too

[msstate7]

Next week your gonna think your watching Bo Jackson and Johnny Manziel on the same team. I hope it gets rained out too

We certainly didn't play well, but what inspires all this confidence in lsu? The last game I saw lsu play, ND zone read them to death. They'll be missing their perhaps best defensive player (mills). Brandon Harris has made 2 starts in his career (at auburn and last night). Here's the total stats from those games...

4/16 54 yards 0 td

[maroonmania]

Yes, we had a few missed tackles but most every defense does, especially the first game. What I was more concerned about was the scheme on pass defense. We never seemed to actually cover a receiver last night. The strategy seemed to be to play off the receivers and then just try to make the tackle after the catch to, I guess, not give up a home run play. I'm very concerned about that strategy in SEC play. USM defenders were often draped all over our receivers to the point there was nowhere for Dak to put the ball. You sure didn't see that on our side. And heck, did we have more than one 3 and out on them all night?

[bulldawg28]

85 yards

[Todd4State]

We certainly didn't play well, but what inspires all this confidence in lsu? The last game I saw lsu play, ND zone read them to death. They'll be missing their perhaps best defensive player (mills). Brandon Harris has made 2 starts in his career (at auburn and last night). Here's the total stats from those games...

4/16 54 yards 0 td

Leonard Fournette plus our safeties.

[Todd4State]

Yes, we had a few missed tackles but most every defense does, especially the first game. What I was more concerned about was the scheme on pass defense. We never seemed to actually cover a receiver last night. The strategy seemed to be to play off the receivers and then just try to make the tackle after the catch to, I guess, not give up a home run play. I'm very concerned about that strategy in SEC play. USM defenders were often draped all over our receivers to the point there was nowhere for Dak to put the ball. You sure didn't see that on our side. And heck, did we have more than one 3 and out on them all night?

It's because we're literally playing without safeties. And we refuse to play our best safeties because they are freshmen and the upperclassmen are nice kids who work hard in practice.

[GreenheadDawg]

We certainly didn't play well, but what inspires all this confidence in lsu? The last game I saw lsu play, ND zone read them to death. They'll be missing their perhaps best defensive player (mills). Brandon Harris has made 2 starts in his career (at auburn and last night). Here's the total stats from those games...

4/16 54 yards 0 td

I guess the confidence comes from a 5'7 170 pound back gaining 5 and 6 yards a pop between the ****ing tackles and their QB playing 7 on 7 football with their receivers in the middle of the field because nobody was anywhere around. It's not confidence in LSU, it's lack thereof in us. It's been a long time since I've felt this way about state football. Yes I know it was the first game, it was there super bowl, all the other excuses but we looked slow and unathletic. I just don't know what else to say

[Dawgface]

Over 165.

[Smitty]

LF goes for 136

Brandon Harris 23-32 251 yds

They'll have a pick 6 the way Dak looked last night. Probably return a Shump fumble too.

LSU 41 MSU 20

Back to reality for this series. They have a bunch of SEC caliber players. We have way too many that aren't yet still play. And that's the bottom line.

[RC3]

I guess the confidence comes from a 5'7 170 pound back gaining 5 and 6 yards a pop between the ****ing tackles and their QB playing 7 on 7 football with their receivers in the middle of the field because nobody was anywhere around. It's not confidence in LSU, it's lack thereof in us. It's been a long time since I've felt this way about state football. Yes I know it was the first game, it was there super bowl, all the other excuses but we looked slow and unathletic. I just don't know what else to say

Exactly how I feel

[msstate7]

I guess the confidence comes from a 5'7 170 pound back gaining 5 and 6 yards a pop between the ****ing tackles and their QB playing 7 on 7 football with their receivers in the middle of the field because nobody was anywhere around. It's not confidence in LSU, it's lack thereof in us. It's been a long time since I've felt this way about state football. Yes I know it was the first game, it was there super bowl, all the other excuses but we looked slow and unathletic. I just don't know what else to say

Usm had 36 rushes for 102 yards (2.8 per carry), but don't let stats get in the way of a good melt.

[GreenheadDawg]

Usm had 36 rushes for 102 yards (2.8 per carry), but don't let stats get in the way of a good melt.

Don't let reason and common sense get in the way of your sunshine pump. Tell you what.. If we stop LF I will gladly eat crow and admit that I was wrong.

[ShotgunDawg]

Usm had 36 rushes for 102 yards (2.8 per carry), but don't let stats get in the way of a good melt.

This

I was curious why people thought the run defense was a problem last night

[msstate7]

Don't let reason and common sense get in the way of your sunshine pump. Tell you what.. If we stop LF I will gladly eat crow and admit that I was wrong.

We're not gonna stop LF. We just have to slow him down and make Harris beat us. We're gonna score at least 24-28 points so we just have to hold them to less than that.

[ShotgunDawg]

Don't let reason and common sense get in the way of your sunshine pump. Tell you what.. If we stop LF I will gladly eat crow and admit that I was wrong.

Why don't you think we can stop him?

In a game where we played flat, I didn't see a problem with run defense last night. I've seen good MSU run defenses struggle with stopping the running game in non-conference games.

My how our expectations have changed. I think when people look back at previous seasons or memories in their life, they typically only remember the highs & lows and rarely the actual reality.

[HoopsDawg]

Usm had 36 rushes for 102 yards (2.8 per carry), but don't let stats get in the way of a good melt.

how does it look when you take out the sacks?

[HancockCountyDog]

Run defense was not a problem. Anyone that says otherwise is just full of shit. Now, we were going up against a pretty awful OL and were stacking the line at time, so there shouldn't be holes, but anyone that somehow thinks that we are awful in the run game is just full of shit.

Our problem is that our second team DL is a problem. When they came in, USM got a decent push and started moving the ball. Im a little worried that Fournette will be able to run the ball, but Im much more worried about LSU's WR's who are much, much more talented than anything we saw last night where we struggled to cover a converted DE.

[Dawgfan77]

Run defense was not a problem. Anyone that says otherwise is just full of shit. Now, we were going up against a pretty awful OL and were stacking the line at time, so there shouldn't be holes, but anyone that somehow thinks that we are awful in the run game is just full of shit.

Our problem is that our second team DL is a problem. When they came in, USM got a decent push and started moving the ball. Im a little worried that Fournette will be able to run the ball, but Im much more worried about LSU's WR's who are much, much more talented than anything we saw last night where we struggled to cover a converted DE.

Torrey dale was playing nose Torrey dale. Where was Cory Thomas or Hoyett??

[Saltydog]

nt

[msstate7]

how does it look when you take out the sacks?

32 for 131 (4.1 attempt)

Take out the 1 run for 44 and its 31 for
87 yards (2.8)

[HancockCountyDog]

32 for 131 (4.1 attempt)

Take out the 1 run for 44 and its 31 for
87 yards (2.8)

Im not worried about the run defense, but I am worried about our inability to run the ball consistently. We gained 125 of our 205 rushing yards on 4 carries. that means on the other 24 we averaged a little over 3 ypc. That is troublesome. We had way too many plays where they were getting penetration and making plays in the backfield.

[msstate7]

Im not worried about the run defense, but I am worried about our inability to run the ball consistently. We gained 125 of our 205 rushing yards on 4 carries. that means on the other 24 we averaged a little over 3 ypc. That is troublesome. We had way too many plays where they were getting penetration and making plays in the backfield.

More than a couple of those were when Dan wasn't letting Dak hold on his read. There was a lot of shump outside the tackle too. Shump needs to be getting more carries between the tackles

[Really Clark?]

[QUOTE=HoopsDawg;406670]how does it look when you take out the sacks?[/

Nm

[RC3]

More than a couple of those were when Dan wasn't letting Dak hold on his read. There was a lot of shump outside the tackle too. Shump needs to be getting more carries between the tackles

And holloway needs less between the tackles. Seems so simple but our coaching staff routinely seems to forget what personel is on the field. Been that way for years

[maroonmania]

32 for 131 (4.1 attempt)

Take out the 1 run for 44 and its 31 for
87 yards (2.8)

Yea, I thought our run defense was one of our lone bright spots along with maybe our FG kicker. I was relieved every time they ran it and concerned when they were throwing. Outside of the one long run that we had the 15 yard penalty on they little to nothing on the ground.

[RC3]

Starting d-line was successful at stuffing the run. The second d-line group saw a large drop off. It will be more noticeable next week against lsu

[Sacrifice]

We're gonna kick LSU's ass next week, no way Dak plays that bad 2 weeks in a row. Calhoun will be back on D, we're at home so I say UNDER...I don't think LF gets 100 on us. Our guys will come to play next week.

[Coach34]

I guess the confidence comes from a 5'7 170 pound back gaining 5 and 6 yards a pop between the ****ing tackles and their QB playing 7 on 7 football with their receivers in the middle of the field because nobody was anywhere around. It's not confidence in LSU, it's lack thereof in us. It's been a long time since I've felt this way about state football. Yes I know it was the first game, it was there super bowl, all the other excuses but we looked slow and unathletic. I just don't know what else to say

Did we watch the same game?

They had 36 carries for 102 yards- 2.8 per carry. And that included a 40 yard run in the mix

[BulldogBear]

Why don't you think we can stop him?

In a game where we played flat, I didn't see a problem with run defense last night. I've seen good MSU run defenses struggle with stopping the running game in non-conference games.

My how our expectations have changed. I think when people look back at previous seasons or memories in their life, they typically only remember the highs & lows and rarely the actual reality.

Mine havent. I still believe the score next week will be very close to the same... and yes, with us winning. Classic trap game. People need to calm down.

[Coach34]

32 for 131 (4.1 attempt)

Take out the 1 run for 44 and its 31 for
87 yards (2.8)

33 for 131- we had 3 sacks

3.96 per carry

[defiantdog]

Forget Fournette, we have to worry about Dural, Diarse, Dupre, and Quinn. Supposedly Quinn needed contacts, and now he can see the ball. That's kind of crazy for a kid that holds all of Louisiana's high school receiving records. We need to pressure Harris and force turnovers. Hopefully then, the mad hatter will start shuffling qb's so they lose all rhythm. Home field advantage and deafening cowbells will be our best defense on Saturday.

[BulldogBear]

There is absolutely nothing, including xfactors the points to an LSU win next week barring a 200 yard day by LF by himself. That may give them a 50/50 shot. If we lose to LSU under all the considerable circumstances it will be perhaps he worst sh***ting of the bed in th Mullen era. We aren't even a 6-6 team if we let a questionable QB come into the hostile of a environment, one no player at LSU has ever played in, without having played a snap this season, beat us through the air because.... we are probably going to stop the run more or less. Our performance last night, while horrific, has doomed LSU. They will likely either come in overconfident (but don't have to) nd are a typical blue blood team that will fold when it becomes evident they are not winning the title. They're same typical blueblooders that collapsed last season when they got a couple of losses. They don't seem the kinD of individuals that can handle getting punched in the mouth at night in a rowdy DWS by a team that is suppose to be the worst in the SEC this year.

I they don't beat us both on the ground and at LOS, the don't beat us. Not a prayer. Hail. State.

[defiantdog]

There is absolutely nothing, including xfactors the points to an LSU win next week barring a 200 yard day by LF by himself. That may give them a 50/50 shot. If we lose to LSU under all the considerable circumstances it will be perhaps he worst sh***ting of the bed in th Mullen era. We aren't even a 6-6 team if we let a questionable QB come into the hostile of a environment, one no player at LSU has ever played in, without having played a snap this season, beat us through the air because.... we are probably going to stop the run more or less. Our performance last night, while horrific, has doomed LSU. They will likely either come in overconfident (but don't have to) nd are a typical blue blood team that will fold when it becomes evident they are not winning the title. They're same typical blueblooders that collapsed last season when they got a couple of losses. They don't seem the kinD of individuals that can handle getting punched in the mouth at night in a rowdy DWS by a team that is suppose to be the worst in the SEC this year.

I they don't beat us both on the ground and at LOS, the don't beat us. Not a prayer. Hail. State.

LSU never really collapsed last year. Auburn destroyed them and Arkansas blanked them. But they took Alabama to OT, beat OM, beat A&M, and embarrassed Kentucky. They would have beat Notre Dame if Jennings remembered how to pass the ball. Also, this is the first year in a long time where LSU didn't lose their entire team to the draft. They return a lot of talent. I hope we punch them in the mouth, repeatedly. But I'm also being realistic that they're an improved and matured team this year.

[RC3]

You people are nuts. If we play anything like we did last night, we will lose by 10

[msstate7]

You people are nuts. If we play anything like we did last night, we will lose by 10

Maybe so. Before we played our first game, everyone just knew we were gonna be great. Maybe we should reserve our crowning of lsu until we actually see them play

[BulldogBear]

You people are nuts. If we play anything like we did last night, we will lose by 10

No. We're saying im effect that those who think we will play like last night are nuts!

Making my score pick for next week official:

We 34, They 16

ETA: there will be no 4th quarter come back against prevent defense

[Boston]

Under

[RougeDawg]

You people are nuts. If we play anything like we did last night, we will lose by 10

And anyone thinking we will play next week like we did last night, is also nuts. How quickly everyone forgets and gets their panties all in a wad over one game?

Does anyone remember South Alabama game last year? How shitty we played? How everyone said LSU was going to destroy us because there no way we can play that way and beat LSU?

Jesus, the need for tampons and Midol around this place lately is at an all time high. We will not play this bad next week. You can take that to the bank. Most of us who actually pay attention to our program and the patterns, understand and realize that Dan likes to pull his cute bullshit in these OOC's. It's who he is and time for everyone to take it for what it is.

Step back from the ledge and think back to previous seasons before crowning LF the next heisman because we played our typical bland vanilla opening OOC game, on the road in their biggest game since the Favre era.

[Treemydawg]

If our run d plays like they did last night LF will set a new NCAA record. I'm going to go with him rushing it 32 times for 1,436,352 yards or 44,886 yards per run. Our season is as good as over***

[RC3]

You may be right. And yes I'm familiar with the OOC eggs we have laid over the years. Outside of our starting DL, I saw very little last night to make me nearly as confident as most of you

[Dawgface]

And anyone thinking we will play next week like we did last night, is also nuts. How quickly everyone forgets and gets their panties all in a wad over one game?

Does anyone remember South Alabama game last year? How shitty we played? How everyone said LSU was going to destroy us because there no way we can play that way and beat LSU?

Jesus, the need for tampons and Midol around this place lately is at an all time high. We will not play this bad next week. You can take that to the bank. Most of us who actually pay attention to our program and the patterns, understand and realize that Dan likes to pull his cute bullshit in these OOC's. It's who he is and time for everyone to take it for what it is.

.

The problem is you are remembering last year as a whole with 10 wins. I'm remembering our shitty performance in our final 2 games last year which has carried over to game one this year. See the trend and reason for concern? If we come out and play well against LSU, you will be right. I certainly hope we do, but I'll believe it when I see it.

[RougeDawg]

And what exactly did we see last year against UAB and South Alabama last year that led anyone to believe we would dominate LSU on the road? Not a damn thing, yet some of us myself included saw through the muddled mess and shit vanilla game plans and knew the switch would be flipped come Baton Rouge.

We get them at our place in their first game of the season. If we do not demolish a most likely 8-4 SEC team, it will be a long season. I said it last year and I'm saying it again. We will beat LSU. Book it. This group of players is special and took us where we've never been. We ran out of gas last year because we have zero experience being a front runner or contender. We've never had to deal with that mental aspect. We have for most of our history been the underdogs and only knew one mentality going into football games "to prove others wrong". Last year when ranked #1 we were, for the first time in our history, Playing to maintain the expectation of being the best team in the nation. How difficult do you think it is to have that pressure put on your backs, when none of our players had ever even Ben in contention for the SECWest, let alone the first NCAA playoffs? It took its toll and we still could have pulled out a W in T-Town had we been able to contain the QB. Let's not forget we were a few plays away from Atlanta in that game. A game played in one of the largest its hostile environments in sports, not just college football.

These players now have that experience and it will show the next few weeks. If I'm wrong I'll be the first to come here and admit. I just have the same feeling this season as last. We will beat LSU once again and be in contention come November.

[Really Clark?]

The problem is you are remembering last year as a whole with 10 wins. I'm remembering our shitty performance in our final 2 games last year which has carried over to game one this year. See the trend and reason for concern? If we come out and play well against LSU, you will be right. I certainly hope we do, but I'll believe it when I see it.

I remember a few years ago this same "trend" was being talked about from the previous year Egg Bowl loss and Gator Bowl showing. This was midway through the bring on Hud season. Glad all the trend soothsayers from then was not listen to.

[Todd4State]

And anyone thinking we will play next week like we did last night, is also nuts. How quickly everyone forgets and gets their panties all in a wad over one game?

Does anyone remember South Alabama game last year? How shitty we played? How everyone said LSU was going to destroy us because there no way we can play that way and beat LSU?

Jesus, the need for tampons and Midol around this place lately is at an all time high. We will not play this bad next week. You can take that to the bank. Most of us who actually pay attention to our program and the patterns, understand and realize that Dan likes to pull his cute bullshit in these OOC's. It's who he is and time for everyone to take it for what it is.

Step back from the ledge and think back to previous seasons before crowning LF the next heisman because we played our typical bland vanilla opening OOC game, on the road in their biggest game since the Favre era.

Hell, I thought we played pretty well against South Alabama to be honest with you. 35 points on the road in their super bowl. Only allowed 3. Yeah, we started off slow and we didn't put up a lot of points in the second half- but it wasn't THAT bad.

[Todd4State]

And what exactly did we see last year against UAB and South Alabama last year that led anyone to believe we would dominate LSU on the road? Not a damn thing, yet some of us myself included saw through the muddled mess and shit vanilla game plans and knew the switch would be flipped come Baton Rouge.

We get them at our place in their first game of the season. If we do not demolish a most likely 8-4 SEC team, it will be a long season. I said it last year and I'm saying it again. We will beat LSU. Book it. This group of players is special and took us where we've never been. We ran out of gas last year because we have zero experience being a front runner or contender. We've never had to deal with that mental aspect. We have for most of our history been the underdogs and only knew one mentality going into football games "to prove others wrong". Last year when ranked #1 we were, for the first time in our history, Playing to maintain the expectation of being the best team in the nation. How difficult do you think it is to have that pressure put on your backs, when none of our players had ever even Ben in contention for the SECWest, let alone the first NCAA playoffs? It took its toll and we still could have pulled out a W in T-Town had we been able to contain the QB. Let's not forget we were a few plays away from Atlanta in that game. A game played in one of the largest its hostile environments in sports, not just college football.

These players now have that experience and it will show the next few weeks. If I'm wrong I'll be the first to come here and admit. I just have the same feeling this season as last. We will beat LSU once again and be in contention come November.

Dan has been vanilla since 2011. He doesn't change. Won't change. We're going to do the same things against LSU, Bama, Ole Miss, etc. And everyone is going to wonder WTF is wrong with him.

I would actually agree with you- but I know that Dan will NOT put the best personnel on the field.

We need Jenkins at LT

We need Green at OLB

We need McLaurin and Peters at S.

We need to play Holloway 90% less at RB and Lee and Williams 25% more at RB.

Gray at PR

If we actually DID that- we would might run the table. (Yes, I said it) But the nice kids are going to cost us a couple of games and then that might cause some changes. Or not.

[Todd4State]

I remember a few years ago this same "trend" was being talked about from the previous year Egg Bowl loss and Gator Bowl showing. This was midway through the bring on Hud season. Glad all the trend soothsayers from then was not listen to.

We came damn close to 4-8 too. We had to beat Arkansas and Ole Miss both in OT. And in large part because of personnel lunacy and special teams mistakes. Thankfully for Dan we had Nikoe to save our and his ass twice in a row.

Who is his Nikoe now?

[Really Clark?]

We came damn close to 4-8 too. We had to beat Arkansas and Ole Miss both in OT. And in large part because of personnel lunacy and special teams mistakes. Thankfully for Dan we had Nikoe to save our and his ass twice in a row.

Who is his Nikoe now?

Yeah but don't let the whole picture change your narrative. #1 QB goes down opening game, change the season gameplan for a totally different type of #2 QB, we also gave A & M all they wanted on the road and could have won that game as well as Auburn on the road in Dak's first road SEC start. Not to mention the weird way LSU ended blowing is out when the game was tight most of the way. We could have been 8-4 as well with the #3 true freshman QB having to play significant minutes late in the season. The trend was incorrect then and it is now especially after a win.

[Todd4State]

Yeah but don't let the whole picture change your narrative. #1 QB goes down opening game, change the season gameplan for a totally different type of #2 QB, we also gave A & M all they wanted on the road and could have won that game as well as Auburn on the road in Dak's first road SEC start. Not to mention the weird way LSU ended blowing is out when the game was tight most of the way. We could have been 8-4 as well with the #3 true freshman QB having to play significant minutes late in the season. The trend was incorrect then and it is now especially after a win.

True. But everyone that loses a game says "well, if this did or didn't happen the we would have won." And maybe vice versa in some cases. I'm sure USM feels like if they would have punched in the ball for TD on our goal line stand the game might have turned out differently for them too.

But the root of the issue despite what actually happens is are we maximizing what we are doing? I don't think we have under Dan even though the results have still be good. Honestly, I don't know that many people do- Alabama fans have to be frustrated with Saban over kickers and special teams as well for example. So, I'm not calling for Dan's head but it's still frustrating as hell.

[Really Clark?]

Dan has been vanilla since 2011. He doesn't change. Won't change. We're going to do the same things against LSU, Bama, Ole Miss, etc. And everyone is going to wonder WTF is wrong with him.

I would actually agree with you- but I know that Dan will NOT put the best personnel on the field.

We need Jenkins at LT

We need Green at OLB

We need McLaurin and Peters at S.

We need to play Holloway 90% less at RB and Lee and Williams 25% more at RB.

Gray at PR

If we actually DID that- we would might run the table. (Yes, I said it) But the nice kids are going to cost us a couple of games and then that might cause some changes. Or not.

How can you, with a straight face say those three or four players (not Holloway because we have seen him a good bit) need to be playing over anybody else without ever seeing them play or especially practice. Especially the two true Freshman. They might, but you stating it as a fact the way you do is just an agenda you have about personnel with no knowledge that your opinion is even close to being right. Yeah you are taking reports and inferring stuff but a lot of those same people who you are using to form an opinion have also said Coman is by far the best Safety. Did you notice him chewing on guys and trying to get players in right positions last night. You even brought up Coach 34 earlier about Jenkins and he said as much as he like Jenkins and he may take over at some point this year, Warren is the best option right now and he is not nearly as bad as you are making him out to be. I don't mind opinions, especially when we a have seen players enough to know but you have NOT seen those guys to make any type of informed decision it's just your agenda concerning personnel.

[Really Clark?]

True. But everyone that loses a game says "well, if this did or didn't happen the we would have won." And maybe vice versa in some cases. I'm sure USM feels like if they would have punched in the ball for TD on our goal line stand the game might have turned out differently for them too.

But the root of the issue despite what actually happens is are we maximizing what we are doing? I don't think we have under Dan even though the results have still be good. Honestly, I don't know that many people do- Alabama fans have to be frustrated with Saban over kickers and special teams as well for example. So, I'm not calling for Dan's head but it's still frustrating as hell.

Ok but if everyone has those type of games then it is not some trend to try and infer a downward spiral from the end of last season. You will have peaks and valleys what you are looking for in the program moving forward is that the floor steadily rises. Where your valley is 7-5 and then a decade later your valleys are 8-4 etc.

[Todd4State]

How can you, with a straight face say those three or four players (not Holloway because we have seen him a good bit) need to be playing over anybody else without ever seeing them play or especially practice. Especially the two true Freshman. They might, but you stating it as a fact the way you do is just an agenda you have about personnel with no knowledge that your opinion is even close to being right. Yeah you are taking reports and inferring stuff but a lot of those same people who you are using to form an opinion have also said Coman is by far the best Safety. Did you notice him chewing on guys and trying to get players in right positions last night. You even brought up Coach 34 earlier about Jenkins and he said as much as he like Jenkins and he may take over at some point this year, Warren is the best option right now and he is not nearly as bad as you are making him out to be. I don't mind opinions, especially when we a have seen players enough to know but you have NOT seen those guys to make any type of informed decision it's just your agenda concerning personnel.

My only agenda is putting the best players on the field to give us a better chance to win. I wish Dan shared that agenda instead of hoping his fantasy of the good kids getting what they "deserve" comes true.

I've seen Peters and McLaurin play in high school. Peters is a special talent. The last two players I said that about- Bear Wilson and Chris Jones. McLaurin is better than an injured Market.

It's pretty clear that I was right about Coman. I don't care who he chewed out- he didn't make plays. Maybe he'll be a good coach one day.

Green played last night and is a freak of nature. He's clearly better than Jackson. Dan even started to play him some at LB last night.

Jenkins is the only one I haven't seen, but I trust Coach34's opinion of him.

I've seen these player a little more than you realize.

[Really Clark?]

My only agenda is putting the best players on the field to give us a better chance to win. I wish Dan shared that agenda instead of hoping his fantasy of the good kids getting what they "deserve" comes true.

I've seen Peters and McLaurin play in high school. Peters is a special talent. The last two players I said that about- Bear Wilson and Chris Jones. McLaurin is better than an injured Market.

It's pretty clear that I was right about Coman. I don't care who he chewed out- he didn't make plays. Maybe he'll be a good coach one day.

Green played last night and is a freak of nature. He's clearly better than Jackson. Dan even started to play him some at LB last night.

Jenkins is the only one I haven't seen, but I trust Coach34's opinion of him.

I've seen these player a little more than you realize.

Here is the point where I think you miss the boat. And btw when I say agenda I don't mean it in a negative way necessarily. Everybody has an agenda from their point of view. When I began coaching and talking with other coaches trying to learn. You question everything and all their decisions. I'm sure there are some are out there but the ones I spoke with, especially very successful coaches, loved to be questioned. When it comes to personnel decisions that we from the outside don't understand, most of the time we are wrong or don't have the entire view. When they lay out their thought process it not only makes sense a lot of times but it is usually either the correct decision or its so close that it could go either way. There have been times that they admit they were wrong but with the information they had at the time it was still probably the correct choice. The biggest debate and probably the closest Dan has been to being wrong is the Perkins over Robinson debate. There are very good arguments on both sides but after it has all played out, there were clearly reasons and they showed up late last year of why the decision might have been right. Robinson was the more talented player but he wasn't effective late because of Robinson. This year, for right now, the only personnel question that's close may be Jackson, Gray, and Green and the right combination. I think we have some outstanding LB but we may still be feeling our way with the best combination during games. All indications is Gray and Green are very good. I also think Peters and McLaurin (who both I've seen in person as well numerous times in high school) are extremely talented. I know a lot of people were questioning Market but he was fine last night. And we played a lot of two deep safety coverage as well. How quick do the freshman get ready to play and can overcome their inexperience? That's the question and is very hard to answer right now.

[GreenheadDawg]

How can you, with a straight face say those three or four players (not Holloway because we have seen him a good bit) need to be playing over anybody else without ever seeing them play or especially practice. Especially the two true Freshman. They might, but you stating it as a fact the way you do is just an agenda you have about personnel with no knowledge that your opinion is even close to being right. Yeah you are taking reports and inferring stuff but a lot of those same people who you are using to form an opinion have also said Coman is by far the best Safety. Did you notice him chewing on guys and trying to get players in right positions last night. You even brought up Coach 34 earlier about Jenkins and he said as much as he like Jenkins and he may take over at some point this year, Warren is the best option right now and he is not nearly as bad as you are making him out to be. I don't mind opinions, especially when we a have seen players enough to know but you have NOT seen those guys to make any type of informed decision it's just your agenda concerning personnel.

I have seen Peters play several times and he is not a talent that you sit on the sideline. He is a Tony Connor type talent. I've calmed down today and realized last night should be a learning experience for both players and coaches and we should be ready against LSU. But the fact of the matter is Cleveland, Jackson, Evans, and a post-injury market are NOT SEC players. On no other team except Vandy would those players see the field. You can have all the heart in the world and be the best lockerroom guy on the team but if you cant play to the speed and physicality of the SEC then you don't need to play. I'm not going to judge Coman yet but even he looked bad last night. I will never understand Mullen's need to play the "guy who has put in his time" over the more talented player.

[Really Clark?]

I have seen Peters play several times and he is not a talent that you sit on the sideline. He is a Tony Connor type talent. I've calmed down today and realized last night should be a learning experience for both players and coaches and we should be ready against LSU. But the fact of the matter is Cleveland, Jackson, Evans, and a post-injury market are NOT SEC players. On no other team except Vandy would those players see the field. You can have all the heart in the world and be the best lockerroom guy on the team but if you cant play to the speed and physicality of the SEC then you don't need to play. I'm not going to judge Coman yet but even he looked bad last night. I will never understand Mullen's need to play the "guy who has put in his time" over the more talented player.

No doubt Peters is talented, but Conner was as talented or more and more polished. Not quite the same for a comparison.

[DanDority]

I'm going over with 175.

[GreenheadDawg]

No doubt Peters is talented, but Conner was as talented or more and more polished. Not quite the same for a comparison.

No it is quite the same because I saw both play multiple times. It just doesn't fit your argument so you don't want to listen to it. I will agree with you that he was probably a little better in coverage coming out of high school but as far as overall talent and SEC ready, there is not much difference between the 2.

[msstate7]

No it is quite the same because I saw both play multiple times. It just doesn't fit your argument so you don't want to listen to it. I will agree with you that he was probably a little better in coverage coming out of high school but as far as overall talent and SEC ready, there is not much difference between the 2.

Not disagreeing with you, but how did you account for the difference in talent? TC faced 6A (maybe 5A when he was in school) and peters faced what 2 or 3A?

[Really Clark?]

No it is quite the same because I saw both play multiple times. It just doesn't fit your argument so you don't want to listen to it. I will agree with you that he was probably a little better in coverage coming out of high school but as far as overall talent and SEC ready, there is not much difference between the 2.

My argument, and I already mentioned seeing Peters in high school several times, but I also saw Conner play in person twice and a couple of more times on TV while he was in high school. I think Mancuso is a really good coach but the level of knowledge between the two systems and competition was definitely on Conner's side. He was more ready coming into college and for what UNM was going to do with him. They also have never put Conner in as much coverage situations as we would have to put Peters in our system.

[GreenheadDawg]

Not disagreeing with you, but how did you account for the difference in talent? TC faced 6A (maybe 5A when he was in school) and peters faced what 2 or 3A?

There is definitely a gap in talent they faced. That's why I said I agree that he was more ready in coverage but in speed, instincts, and ball skills they were pretty close

[RougeDawg]

Hell, I thought we played pretty well against South Alabama to be honest with you. 35 points on the road in their super bowl. Only allowed 3. Yeah, we started off slow and we didn't put up a lot of points in the second half- but it wasn't THAT bad.

You prove my point. Last night was the same type of game, with the addition of early costly turnovers on our part and a handful of other fluke plays. If we had had the fumble, muffs, Etc against USA the final score would have been similar.

This is my point. After both games everyone was on the edge of the cliff, and LSU Was going to DDDDDDestroy us. For those of us who didn't have estrogen rushing through our veins, and were able to see things for what they were, we knew what we had as a team and knew we would destroy LSU last season.

[Really Clark?]

There is definitely a gap in talent they faced. That's why I said I agree that he was more ready in coverage but in speed, instincts, and ball skills they were pretty close

But Conner didn't come in as a freshman and play a lot of coverage. Never really has been know for coverage. He was more polished and had better understanding of defenses and UNM still didn't have him out there playing a ton of coverages. Look I really like Peters and McLaurin and am not ruling out them getting more and more time as the year progresses but it is extremely unfair to both of those players to compare them to Conner other than raw ability. But raw ability does not make them worth much if they do not know their role on defense and can execute mentally what their assignment is.

[Todd4State]

Not disagreeing with you, but how did you account for the difference in talent? TC faced 6A (maybe 5A when he was in school) and peters faced what 2 or 3A?

If you can play, you can play. Peters was an Army AA and competed with the best in the country there and held his own.

[Todd4State]

But Conner didn't come in as a freshman and play a lot of coverage. Never really has been know for coverage. He was more polished and had better understanding of defenses and UNM still didn't have him out there playing a ton of coverages. Look I really like Peters and McLaurin and am not ruling out them getting more and more time as the year progresses but it is extremely unfair to both of those players to compare them to Conner other than raw ability. But raw ability does not make them worth much if they do not know their role on defense and can execute mentally what their assignment is.

Conner is definitely more of a LB, but Peters is more of a legit safety. So, it's sort of apples and oranges.

[GreenheadDawg]

But Conner didn't come in as a freshman and play a lot of coverage. Never really has been know for coverage. He was more polished and had better understanding of defenses and UNM still didn't have him out there playing a ton of coverages. Look I really like Peters and McLaurin and am not ruling out them getting more and more time as the year progresses but it is extremely unfair to both of those players to compare them to Conner other than raw ability. But raw ability does not make them worth much if they do not know their role on defense and can execute mentally what their assignment is.

So basically we have 2 safeties playing that know the defense and playbook but don't have the talent to execute it. On the other side we have 2 very talented "raw" safeties that have the ability to execute but don't know their role in the defense. Quite the pickle I guess. I'll go with talent all day every day. But I'm not the coach

[Really Clark?]

Conner is definitely more of a LB, but Peters is more of a legit safety. So, it's sort of apples and oranges.

Not disagreeing but I wasn't the one who used Conner as a comparison to begin with. Peters has all the ability but is still raw and in those Allstar games you know that everything is very basic and base. If he was a corner playing man coverage a lot then it's not as critical but as a safety and having to read the offense and make calls, etc. that's a huge part of what he has to do. He's not ready for that and not much of his high school career knowledge is going to be transferable to make the jump. Especially from Bassfield.

[Really Clark?]

So basically we have 2 safeties playing that know the defense and playbook but don't have the talent to execute it. On the other side we have 2 very talented "raw" safeties that have the ability to execute but don't know their role in the defense. Quite the pickle I guess. I'll go with talent all day every day. But I'm not the coach

Well I go with the ones who execute in practice and keep teaching the talent until their ability can overcome their mistakes. It's a sliding scale and talent should never get the automatic nod if their mental mistakes cannot be overcome. I seem to remember this exact same debate about James and Evens needing to start and the coaches were idiots because their talent was better than what we had on the field. The coaches were 100% correct in their descision back then. And the two safeties with "no talent" are probably a lot more talented than you think.

[Smitty]

Gerri Green > Zach Jackson yet……...

[CadaverDawg]

If you can play, you can play. Peters was an Army AA and competed with the best in the country there and held his own.

LOL. This is where you're wrong. You have to know assignments, scheme, and your role. It's not as simple as you think

[GreenheadDawg]

Well I go with the ones who execute in practice and keep teaching the talent until their ability can overcome their mistakes. It's a sliding scale and talent should never get the automatic nod if their mental mistakes cannot be overcome. I seem to remember this exact same debate about James and Evens needing to start and the coaches were idiots because their talent was better than what we had on the field. The coaches were 100% correct in their descision back then. And the two safeties with "no talent" are probably a lot more talented than you think.

Yeh I love those elite practice guys.. You think it helps that they know what the offense is going to run in practice. I sure hope we win practice this week **

[Really Clark?]

Yeh I love those elite practice guys.. You think it helps that they know what the offense is going to run in practice. I sure hope we win practice this week **

If you had a clue about coaching you wouldn't even have made that statement. You think they practice only against our scheme? That there is not film evaluation, class work, installing of our game plan, drilling of that plan, etc. Yeah if you have a team of elite practice guys you will win the majority of your games at high level competition. That was a pretty weak statement trying to change the debate away from what we were discussing.

[Jack Lambert]

85 yards

I am going with this. Our front four are men.

[RC3]

I am going with this. Our starting front four are men.

Fyp

[GreenheadDawg]

If you had a clue about coaching you wouldn't even have made that statement. You think they practice only against our scheme? That there is not film evaluation, class work, installing of our game plan, drilling of that plan, etc. Yeah if you have a team of elite practice guys you will win the majority of your games at high level competition. That was a pretty weak statement trying to change the debate away from what we were discussing.

Never said I had a clue about coaching but I do have common sense. Sorry didn't know I was talking to ****ing Bear Bryant. Sorry Sir. Wake me up when the guys you are defending actually do something other than look like shit. Hope it is saturday and I will be the first one to come on here and say I was wrong. But I'm pretty confident that wont happen

ETA: I never changed the subject of the debate. You wanted to pump these guys up cause they looked good in practice. Are you kidding me? I don't give a shit about practice if you can't transfer it to game day

[BulldogBear]

Fyp

I meant to quote Jack Lambert but quoted you agreeing with him.

I'd probably go with about 100 and then the rest of the team contribute a few passing yards.

Rinse repeat. If LSU doesn't beat us at LOS and on the ground with LF having a Heisman day, then they don't beat us.

We are going to murder them.

[Really Clark?]

Never said I had a clue about coaching but I do have common sense. Sorry didn't know I was talking to ****ing Bear Bryant. Sorry Sir. Wake me up when the guys you are defending actually do something other than look like shit. Hope it is saturday and I will be the first one to come on here and say I was wrong. But I'm pretty confident that wont happen

ETA: I never changed the subject of the debate. You wanted to pump these guys up cause they looked good in practice. Are you kidding me? I don't give a shit about practice if you can't transfer it to game day

Actually you were the one who made the asinine comparison of 2 no talent players who know the playbook vs 2 very talented guys who didn't and you would play talent. I said I would play the ones who executed the best. That means TALENT WITH THE KNOWLEDGE of what to do. When you couldn't argue that you made the snide remark about elite practice guys like it was a disparaging label. Players know who busts it on the practice field and know what to do at this level. I guarantee you that elite practice players are not looked down upon like you did. That's common sense and real sense from the trenches.

[Schultzy]

87; in an MSU win

[TimberBeast]

But the root of the issue despite what actually happens is are we maximizing what we are doing? I don't think we have under Dan even though the results have still be good. Honestly, I don't know that many people do- Alabama fans have to be frustrated with Saban over kickers and special teams as well for example. So, I'm not calling for Dan's head but it's still frustrating as hell.

I almost made a post about this last night but didn't because I wanted to calm down. I have zero coaching experience with football, but like most people here I have watched it obsessively since I was born. What we do out there under Mullen is almost unwatchable for me. It's the complete opposite of everything I know from kickoff to the clock hitting zeroes. I can't argue with it because it does work, he had us #1 in the country for weeks last year so something is very right about it, but I can't help but wonder what we could do if we actually played the game of football at some point in the game. Every time we throw the ball on first down I want to throw my drink through the tv, it's all completely backwards and I'm trying to wrap my head around what we are trying to do every single play. I have two daughters and they are going to grow up with a strange understanding of the game. If I had a son I would absolutely not let him watch our games. Mullen is some kind of an incredible coach to do what he is doing with our team year in and year out so far but I can't help wonder what more we could do.

[CadaverDawg]

I almost made a post about this last night but didn't because I wanted to calm down. I have zero coaching experience with football, but like most people here I have watched it obsessively since I was born. What we do out there under Mullen is almost unwatchable for me. It's the complete opposite of everything I know from kickoff to the clock hitting zeroes. I can't argue with it because it does work, he had us #1 in the country for weeks last year so something is very right about it, but I can't help but wonder what we could do if we actually played the game of football at some point in the game. Every time we throw the ball on first down I want to throw my drink through the tv, it's all completely backwards and I'm trying to wrap my head around what we are trying to do every single play. I have two daughters and they are going to grow up with a strange understanding of the game. If I had a son I would absolutely not let him watch our games. Mullen is some kind of an incredible coach to do what he is doing with our team year in and year out so far but I can't help wonder what more we could do.

Well if "playing football" is what we did during all the shitty years pre-Mullen, and the Mullen version is called tiddlywinks.....I'll take the tiddlywinks. Because what he's doing is working.

Some of the posts I've seen since last night have got me scratching my head and wondering if they're coming from real human beings.

[Really Clark?]

I almost made a post about this last night but didn't because I wanted to calm down. I have zero coaching experience with football, but like most people here I have watched it obsessively since I was born. What we do out there under Mullen is almost unwatchable for me. It's the complete opposite of everything I know from kickoff to the clock hitting zeroes. I can't argue with it because it does work, he had us #1 in the country for weeks last year so something is very right about it, but I can't help but wonder what we could do if we actually played the game of football at some point in the game. Every time we throw the ball on first down I want to throw my drink through the tv, it's all completely backwards and I'm trying to wrap my head around what we are trying to do every single play. I have two daughters and they are going to grow up with a strange understanding of the game. If I had a son I would absolutely not let him watch our games. Mullen is some kind of an incredible coach to do what he is doing with our team year in and year out so far but I can't help wonder what more we could do.

What? You have an issue with throwing on first down at any time? Besides Ga Tech and Army who can you watch and enjoy then? No pro teams and 98% of the college teams. You know we run the ball close to 60% of the time. Last night was something we normally wouldn't do for an entire game. Is it the spread concept and you just like power I football? I think most, even the hardcore Mullen skeptics will admit our offense scheme when ran properly is explosive and pretty fun to watch.

[Dawg61]

LSU is drooling to throw the ball over the middle of the field vs our non-existent coverage. It's too tempting for them not to take the bait when they watch the tape. I hope Mullen deploys some weird 6 man knickle with 4 of the DBs camping middle of the field. We might pick of LSU like they did Henig.

[Political Hack]

This game is the season IMO. LSU can lose and still be ok. We can't. We lose this week, and our shot at a NYD bowl is gone.

They have the most talented skill players in the nation at RB and WR. It's going to make Harris look like an All American, especially with the scheme we're running.

[bulldawg28]

This game is the season IMO. LSU can lose and still be ok. We can't. We lose this week, and our shot at a NYD bowl is gone.

They have the most talented skill players in the nation at RB and WR. It's going to make Harris look like an All American, especially with the scheme we're running.


What scheme are we running? Because they don't know and we didn't run it Saturday. Honestly, LSU not paying was the worst thing that could have happened with them. They'll have all the mistakes plus 1st game winded personnel. If we run the hurry up the way we've practiced all camp we're going to run their team into the ground.

[Where'sWaldo]

[QUOTE=TimberBeast;407108]I almost made a post about this last night but didn't because I wanted to calm down. I have zero coaching experience with football, but like most people here I have watched it obsessively since I was born. What we do out there under Mullen is almost unwatchable for me. It's the complete opposite of everything I know from kickoff to the clock hitting zeroes. I can't argue with it because it does work, he had us #1 in the country for weeks last year so something is very right about it, but I can't help but wonder what we could do if we actually played the game of football at some point in the game. Every time we throw the ball on first down I want to throw my drink through the tv, it's all completely backwards and I'm trying to wrap my head around what we are trying to do every single play. I have two daughters and they are going to grow up with a strange understanding of the game. If I had a son I would absolutely not let him watch our games. Mullen is some kind of an incredible coach to do what he is doing with our team year in and year out so far but I can't help wonder what more we could do.[/QUOTE

I'm confused....you get upset because we throw on first down? I've heard it all. After calming downing from Southern sticking me in the top corner of the stadium and watching our team repeatedly make mistakes I feel ok about our team. IMO there are two real areas that I can't help but be concerned about and that's outside linebacker and running back. We need to find another option outside of ZJ. He may be great in practice but it just doesn't translate to the game and he is a major liability. I've harped on RB all offseason and I prepared myself to watch Shumpert all year but that doesn't make it any easier. D Lee is light years better with the ball in his hands and I've seen Bama trot out true freshman running backs for years so I'm not buying that our redshirt guys aren't ready.

[RC3]

159 bump. So technically under. But the damage was done regardless