Baghdad Bob talks Safeties

[Coach34]

https://hailstatebeat.wordpress.com/2015/06/22/four-by-four-assessing-msus-battle-for-starting-safeties/

and literally gives us nothing we didnt already know

[bulldawg28]

If Mullen and the crew want to win putting the vet just because won't cut it this fall. Evans is a special teams player, Coman looks the part but hasn't produced, and Market is the most shown dependable...but he's 5'3. Put the young talent on the field and do what your paid to do with them. ....COACH THEM UP.

[Jack Lambert]

I am more worried about the coaching than I am the talent. Our Safties last year had a lot of talent but consistantly was out of position to make a play. I hope the new defense will help with that.

[Ifyouonlyknew]

Kivon Coman will be our best safety & it won't be close.

[Goldendawg]

Put the best, most prepared to succeed players on the field regardless of class standing. Forget the 1a-1b mass substitutions of 2014. Sub best players to rest best players as needed and keep them ready for 4th quarter and crunch time. Have been going to games since my Dad carried me to 10/10 tie with "Mississippi" in 1963 and family has been season ticket holders since early '70's. Don't consider myself a bluehair but am now a chromedome. Never stopped carrying in or ringing my cowbell(Real noise, not artificial noise). Jackie autographed the bell in 2000 with instructions to carry to ALL games. Late Superdawg Dad had the bell made for me and my brother-in-law (pipe and bell from Iuka Hardware). Do wish we could again use the interlocking MSU. Go State. P.S. I noticed the mass 1b substitution plan led to many immediate scores by our foes in 2014. Glad Dias is back.

[maroonmania]

Kivon Coman will be our best safety & it won't be close.

I agree, its totally off base to say he hasn't produced. Was he perfect last year? Of course not, but neither were Redmond or Calhoun either. I believe Coman will be one starter at Safety, the question is who is the other? I personally don't think Evans is an SEC quality starting safety and I'll be surprised if Market is ready in the early season so we need Bryant to step up big. Is Cleveland a safety now or a corner? Peters will definitely get minutes early if he is as advertised.

[GreenheadDawg]

Kivon Coman will be our best safety & it won't be close.

As long as Evans is nowhere to be found I'll be happy with whoever is out there

[Goldendawg]

Nice to have so many players in the conversation. Our depth and talent are much improved for 2015.

[Ifyouonlyknew]

I agree, its totally off base to say he hasn't produced. Was he perfect last year? Of course not, but neither were Redmond or Calhoun either. I believe Coman will be one starter at Safety, the question is who is the other? I personally don't think Evans is an SEC quality starting safety and I'll be surprised if Market is ready in the early season so we need Bryant to step up big. Is Cleveland a safety now or a corner? Peters will definitely get minutes early if he is as advertised.

Cleveland spent all spring at CB. Irvin-Sills moved to safety but I'm almost positive he's not on campus this summer so I'm not sure he's going to be back next year. That could cause Cleveland to move back to safety but I'd rather keep him at CB if possible & give the younger guys more reps.

[messageboardsuperhero]

I am more worried about the coaching than I am the talent. Our Safties last year had a lot of talent but consistantly was out of position to make a play. I hope the new defense will help with that.

Say what now?

Cox had the measurables, but it didn't always show up on the field.
Hughes was never overly talented and was coming off injury.
I love Market, but he's not all that talented.
Evans just isn't good.
Coman is talented but was inexperienced last year- and was better than our fans give him credit for.

Saftey was by far our least talented position last season.

[Dallas_Dawg]

Coman is a very good tackler and comes up quick in run support. It's his coverage that has to get better and I tend to think the scheme was at fault. Slate is clean for him this year

[CadaverDawg]

https://hailstatebeat.wordpress.com/2015/06/22/four-by-four-assessing-msus-battle-for-starting-safeties/

and literally gives us nothing we didnt already know

I like Bob, and I think he writes some good stuff....but this piece was Cap'n Obvious, Genespage fodder. Not that it wasn't accurate, but it literally brought nothing to the table that you couldn't find out on a message board 4 months ago. Come on, Bob...you're supposed to be close to the program...give us something more than "We have some guys returning, and some talented freshman coming in, so Mullen will have options!!", no shit.

Again, I like Bob, but this article was nothing more than a time filler.

[RiverCityDawg]

Kivon Coman will be our best safety & it won't be close.

Count me as another that agrees with this. He's shown flashes of having good instincts and has been a solid tackler (everyone missed tackles against ole miss so please don't point to one play to prove he can't tackle). Great size, good speed and hips for a safety. Looked to have taken it up a level this spring.

Anyone have insight as to Market's recovery? Bob doesn't even mention it in his article, as if it isn't an issue. If healthy, I feel good with him at SS until Peters is ready to go.

[War Machine Dawg]

Count me as another that agrees with this. He's shown flashes of having good instincts and has been a solid tackler (everyone missed tackles against ole miss so please don't point to one play to prove he can't tackle). Great size, good speed and hips for a safety. Looked to have taken it up a level this spring.

Anyone have insight as to Market's recovery? Bob doesn't even mention it in his article, as if it isn't an issue. If healthy, I feel good with him at SS until Peters is ready to go.

No inside info, but I'll say the same thing for Market I said about Nickoe & Hughes: He's never going to be the same player. He'll be back, but he'll be at least 1-2 steps slower. Now he can make up for some of that with instincts and football IQ, which both Nickoe & Hughes were able to do. But he's not going to be as good as he was. It sucks, because he is probably my favorite player on D, but Achilles' injuries are a bitch.

[War Machine Dawg]

Kivon Coman will be our best safety & it won't be close.

I'm not going to say "won't be close", but I do think he's going to be a very, very good player for us. I've been on his bandwagon since early last season. The kid has tools and can play. He made some mistakes, but a) mistakes in the secondary tend to be magnified and b) most of his mistakes were due to inexperience. He didn't screw up because he wasn't good enough to make the play. He's definitely more of a run stopping S, but it takes all types.

[SDDawg]

"Our initial assessment is that they will all die."

[PMDawg]

Didn't we have a guy named Quadry Antoine or something? What ever happened to him?

[Dallas_Dawg]

Didn't we have a guy named Quadry Antoine or something? What ever happened to him?
He's most likely a senior this year. Moved to OLB last I heard but plays mostly special teams. Had a big strip on a kick in one of the games. See "role player"

[Coach34]

In a perfect world- its going to be Coman and Market with Peters and McLaurin backing them up getting plenty of reps for experience. I think the true Freshmen will be ok playing LSU and their offense- but I worry about those young green bastards playing against the Gus Bus in week 4. Thats alot to ask of true Freshmen considering the importance of that game on the West championship.

[Ifyouonlyknew]

In a perfect world- its going to be Coman and Market with Peters and McLaurin backing them up getting plenty of reps for experience. I think the true Freshmen will be ok playing LSU and their offense- but I worry about those young green bastards playing against the Gus Bus in week 4. Thats alot to ask of true Freshmen considering the importance of that game on the West championship.

Gotta have Brandon Bryant in that mix too.

[Ifyouonlyknew]

He's most likely a senior this year. Moved to OLB last I heard but plays mostly special teams. Had a big strip on a kick in one of the games. See "role player"

Quadry is going to miss this season with an injury.

[Coach34]

Gotta have Brandon Bryant in that mix too.

True...but arent he and Peters going to be fighting for 2nd team reps?

[Ifyouonlyknew]

True...but arent he and Peters going to be fighting for 2nd team reps?

I think Peters can play Free or Strong. Honestly Brandon is athletic enough for both too but better suited for Strong.

[Todd4State]

I think safety is going to be kind of a revolving door for us.

If I had to guess it will be Market and Peters sharing reps depending on how healthy Market is and how quickly Peters adjusts and then Coman at the other spot.

It comes down to:

How healthy is Market?
How ready is Peters?
How much has Coman improved in coverage?

And if two or three of those questions are answered with us having some issues, then we get into Bryant/McLaurin territory.

I do think that Manny's defense will help the safeties out because we'll be blitzing linebackers more and hopefully getting more pressure on the QB which will hopefully make us rely less on our safeties.

[War Machine Dawg]

True...but arent he and Peters going to be fighting for 2nd team reps?

It kills me to say it, but I think Bryant starts ahead of Market. Considering how late in the season Market got hurt, I doubt he'll be completely ready until mid-October at best. Market, Peters, and McLaurin will be the ones fighting for 2nd team.

[Coach34]

I think Peters can play Free or Strong. Honestly Brandon is athletic enough for both too but better suited for Strong.

Well, I totally agree on Bryant being a SS. And I think he can play. But I see Peters being that SS guy too moreso than a Free. Lots of talent at SS and i literally have no concern there- but worried a little about F/S

[Ifyouonlyknew]

Well, I totally agree on Bryant being a SS. And I think he can play. But I see Peters being that SS guy too moreso than a Free. Lots of talent at SS and i literally have no concern there- but worried a little about F/S

Thing is Peters, Bryant, & McLaurin are all athletic enough to play Free even though they may be more suited for Strong. All have the speed & length to be that rangy center fielder that can cover ground & take away the deep 3rd. 1 or 2 may have to play Free in order to get the best guys on the field. Kind of like having the Brown bros & Gerri at LB together sometimes. Gotta play your best.

[mic]

We have a lock down NFL corner so that helps greatly in hiding a safety .. And the other side isn't bad either .
And as of right now what QB is a huge passing threat ??
We will be much better on defense as a whole with Manny.

[bulldawg28]

Thing is Peters, Bryant, & McLaurin are all athletic enough to play Free even though they may be more suited for Strong. All have the speed & length to be that rangy center fielder that can cover ground & take away the deep 3rd. 1 or 2 may have to play Free in order to get the best guys on the field. Kind of like having the Brown bros & Gerri at LB together sometimes. Gotta play your best.


Playing the best should happen without question. What was the depth chart at safety during the spring?

[Ifyouonlyknew]

Playing the best should happen without question. What was the depth chart at safety during the spring?

I'm pretty sure it was

Evans/Bryant
Coman/Irvin-Sills

[maroonmania]

I think Peters can play Free or Strong. Honestly Brandon is athletic enough for both too but better suited for Strong.

Bryant is among the fastest players on the team. Not sure why he wouldn't be a good fit at Free safety?

[Ifyouonlyknew]

Bryant is among the fastest players on the team. Not sure why he wouldn't be a good fit at Free safety?

Oh no doubt he can play Free. His phsyicality at Strong just stands out.

[Dawg61]

Remember when we had Zach "Toast" Smith playing safety? Think about that if you are worried about our safeties today.

[maroonmania]

I like Bob, and I think he writes some good stuff....but this piece was Cap'n Obvious, Genespage fodder. Not that it wasn't accurate, but it literally brought nothing to the table that you couldn't find out on a message board 4 months ago. Come on, Bob...you're supposed to be close to the program...give us something more than "We have some guys returning, and some talented freshman coming in, so Mullen will have options!!", no shit.

Again, I like Bob, but this article was nothing more than a time filler.

Bob is just a PR guy, nothing more. Listen to him some on the B&B show some and its amazing how a guy that is suppose to have "inside access" can provide such little insight. Heck Ifyouonlyknew on this board has 100 times the inside knowledge Carskadon ever thought about having.

[maroonmania]

Remember when we had Zach "Toast" Smith playing safety? Think about that if you are worried about our safeties today.

True, Zach would have fit right in with our secondary last year.

[codeDawg]

And as of right now what QB is a huge passing threat ??

This is a good point. I think everyone is still shell shocked from the South Alabama game, UK game, Arkansas game, etc. where the deep ball just destroyed us.

My hope is that we get better pressure up front by being aggressive and that at least keeps plays in front of us. A lot of long pass plays should have been big sacks last year.

[MSUDawg99]

I'm pretty sure it was

Evans/Bryant
Coman/Irvin-Sills

Yeah about that...

[Todd4State]

This is a good point. I think everyone is still shell shocked from the South Alabama game, UK game, Arkansas game, etc. where the deep ball just destroyed us.

My hope is that we get better pressure up front by being aggressive and that at least keeps plays in front of us. A lot of long pass plays should have been big sacks last year. South Alabama game?

[Johnson85]

Bob is just a PR guy, nothing more. Listen to him some on the B&B show some and its absolutely predictable that a guy employed by the university can provide such little insight. Heck Ifyouonlyknew on this board has 100 times the inside knowledge Carskadon ever thought about having.

Fixed that for you. Bob is a good writer and you can see it in the personal interest stories he does. But he's kind of limited when talking about actual football. If he used his access to give honest, straightforward accounts of where he thought people stood in the depth chart and how they are progressing, he'd probably catch some flak. I seriously doubt the coaches or administration would appreciate him saying anything that could be viewed as at all critical of a player.

[Johnson85]

No inside info, but I'll say the same thing for Market I said about Nickoe & Hughes: He's never going to be the same player. He'll be back, but he'll be at least 1-2 steps slower. Now he can make up for some of that with instincts and football IQ, which both Nickoe & Hughes were able to do. But he's not going to be as good as he was. It sucks, because he is probably my favorite player on D, but Achilles' injuries are a bitch.

I'm afraid you're being overoptimistic. Market already relies on having incredible football iq to make up for his lack of size. While he certainly wasn't slow, I don't think he was a burner that could afford to lose a step or two when you take ino account that he already needed to be in good position b/c of his size. I think there's a real possibility that even as smart a player as he is and as good as his instincts are, losing a half step to a step will mean he's not in a good enough position to make a fundamentally sound tackle or can't quite get a hand on the ball or in a receivers face to break up a pass play.

[bulldawg28]

I'm pretty sure it was

Evans/Bryant
Coman/Irvin-Sills

So Coman was playing free?

[Ifyouonlyknew]

So Coman was playing free?

I don't think they ever made the distinction but I would have to assume so.

[Coach34]

Your SS has to be a guy that has some LB'er in him but he can still cover

Your F/S has to be a guy that understands offenses, formations, has some CF'er in him, and remains a cool customer

Thats the difference in those 2 positions- regardless of speed

[codeDawg]

South Alabama game?

Sorry, UAB.

[MSUDawg99]

Exactly! Bob's not at liberty to give inside intel. He works for the school.

[War Machine Dawg]

I'm afraid you're being overoptimistic. Market already relies on having incredible football iq to make up for his lack of size. While he certainly wasn't slow, I don't think he was a burner that could afford to lose a step or two when you take ino account that he already needed to be in good position b/c of his size. I think there's a real possibility that even as smart a player as he is and as good as his instincts are, losing a half step to a step will mean he's not in a good enough position to make a fundamentally sound tackle or can't quite get a hand on the ball or in a receivers face to break up a pass play.

Uhhh, "Mighty Mouse" Tim Nelson was a beast of a safety at 5'7". Market is 5'9" at worst. And note I didn't say that his instincts and football IQ would completely offset his lack of speed. I simply said it would help. Smart football players tend to find ways to make plays. Market has always been more of a run stopping safety anyway, so I don't think losing speed will hurt him as much as it hurt coverage guys like Hughes and Nickoe. But as I said in a different post in this thread, I don't see Market being more than 2nd team this season with the emergence of Coman & Bryant, combined with his injury and how late it happened.

[Johnson85]

Uhhh, "Mighty Mouse" Tim Nelson was a beast of a safety at 5'7". Market is 5'9" at worst. And note I didn't say that his instincts and football IQ would completely offset his lack of speed. I simply said it would help. Smart football players tend to find ways to make plays. Market has always been more of a run stopping safety anyway, so I don't think losing speed will hurt him as much as it hurt coverage guys like Hughes and Nickoe. But as I said in a different post in this thread, I don't see Market being more than 2nd team this season with the emergence of Coman & Bryant, combined with his injury and how late it happened.

Tim Nelson was 5'7" and somewhat of a freak. Market has never struck me as being that explosive, just being a good athlete with incredible fundamentals. So I'm not sure there that comparable, but even so, I'm not sure Nelson could have been effective within one year of an Achilles rupture.

I recognize you weren't saying it would completely offset his lack of speed, I'm just pointing out that he may have a bigger drop off than Nikoe did in his first year back, who experienced a pretty big drop off himself. A lot of Nikoe's was being put in a bad position by Wilson and being unable to change his angles to reflect his slower speed, neither of which should be a problem for Market, so he should have an advantage there. But I still worry that he needed all of his athleticism to be effective in SEC games, and that he might be a liability even as a second team safety.

[maroonmania]

What about JT Gray? Is he stuck at LB? Seems like we have more options at LB than we do at S so is there any chance he would be moved back to Safety? Roster lists him at 6' 196 which sounds a lot more like safety size than LB size.

[Ifyouonlyknew]

What about JT Gray? Is he stuck at LB? Seems like we have more options at LB than we do at S so is there any chance he would be moved back to Safety? Roster lists him at 6' 196 which sounds a lot more like safety size than LB size.

Gray has a legit shot at starting at OLB so I'd say its safe to say he's going to stay at LB.