Cardinal fans (mlb)

[msstate7]

Jim Bowden ?@JimBowden_ESPN 23s24 seconds ago
Wainwright season probably over after achilles injury..McCarthy elbow barking?RedSox rotation bad?Ruben Amaro happy?866-MLB-ONXM XM 8

That's a really tough injury to deal with

[BrunswickDawg]

Yup, my fantasy team just went in the tank. Hate it because he is such a good guy, does a lot of charity work here. Just seems to be snake bit on the injury side.

[DudyDawg]

Thought he was just on 15 day DL? Been slacking on watching the cards this year. I thought it was one of those things that will either drag on for the season and we shut him down or maybe he gets better. Any clue?

[msstate7]

Thought he was just on 15 day DL? Been slacking on watching the cards this year. I thought it was one of those things that will either drag on for the season and we shut him down or maybe he gets better. Any clue?

Think it's pretty standard to put a guy on 15- day dl until it's certain that he's done

[missouridawg]

Thought he was just on 15 day DL? Been slacking on watching the cards this year. I thought it was one of those things that will either drag on for the season and we shut him down or maybe he gets better. Any clue?

When he gets back to STL, an MRI will tell us what it is. All signs currently pointing towards an Achilles tear/rupture. The 15 day DL move was done to allow someone else to be called up and fill that spot. He is, at a minimum, done for a month or so. I'm prepared for the worst though... I expect him to be done for the year.

[Todd4State]

Don't worry- Marco Gonzalez. Should have made the team anyway.

[msstate7]

Scherzer and wainwright go down batting... Here comes DH

[msstate7]

Don't worry- Marco Gonzalez. Should have made the team anyway.

I'm sure he's good, but really?

How's jhey btw?

[Todd4State]

Really on Marco. Cardinals are cheap and keep players in AAA too long. Heyward hurt his groin today.

[HereComesTheSpiral]

i hope this doesn't turn out to be like Ryan Howards injury.

[msstate7]

i hope this doesn't turn out to be like Ryan Howards injury.

Don't tell me (Braves' fan) something is wrong with Howard. That dude still killing us

[Todd4State]

i hope this doesn't turn out to be like Ryan Howards injury.

It could be career ending IMO. Pitchers use their legs so much to plant or push off of the rubber, I don't know how it will affect Wainwright's velocity. On the other hand, Wainwright's arm is not 100%- and a year off may not be the worst thing in the long run.

[War Machine Dawg]

Scherzer and wainwright go down batting... Here comes DH

DH is coming whether you like it or not. It's been inevitable for a while. Personally, I'm all for it. DH is probably the biggest reason the AL has been so much better than the NL.

[Dawg61]

DH is coming whether you like it or not. It's been inevitable for a while. Personally, I'm all for it. DH is probably the biggest reason the AL has been so much better than the NL.

Tell the Cardinals, Phillies and Giants that. Seems like they've won a couple WS in the last decade. DH will get stiff opposition. It won't happen for another twenty years. Too many traditionalists in the NL. I'm a NL fan first. When you DH you get pus$ies like Yordano Ventura that never have to face the music.

[War Machine Dawg]

Tell the Cardinals, Phillies and Giants that. Seems like they've won a couple WS in the last decade. DH will get stiff opposition. It won't happen for another twenty years. Too many traditionalists in the NL. I'm a NL fan first. When you DH you get pus$ies like Yordano Ventura that never have to face the music.

I know it's an exhibition game, but there's a reason the AL had something like a 10 year win streak at the all-star game. And winning the WS isn't the only way to determine dominance between leagues. The inter-league record is/was pretty abysmal at one point. Say what you will, but the DH is happening within 10 years. Probably less. The push for it is growing. The traditionalists can get on board or get run over, because the train has left the station.

[Dawg61]

I know it's an exhibition game, but there's a reason the AL had something like a 10 year win streak at the all-star game. And winning the WS isn't the only way to determine dominance between leagues. The inter-league record is/was pretty abysmal at one point. Say what you will, but the DH is happening within 10 years. Probably less. The push for it is growing. The traditionalists can get on board or get run over, because the train has left the station.

No way. You're talking about half the fans have the league half the owners do not want the DH. I'm a NL fan first. I and we believe not having the DH gives us an advantage come World Series time. That's what baseball is played for. To win the World Series. National League teams believe that by playing without a DH all year their teams are better able to handle a seven game series. That's what has made the All-Star game so important now. You will meet the stiffest of opposition to the NL going DH BY THE NATIONAL LEAGUE. They aren't going to kill their own advantage. It'll never happen imo.

[Todd4State]

I know it's an exhibition game, but there's a reason the AL had something like a 10 year win streak at the all-star game. And winning the WS isn't the only way to determine dominance between leagues. The inter-league record is/was pretty abysmal at one point. Say what you will, but the DH is happening within 10 years. Probably less. The push for it is growing. The traditionalists can get on board or get run over, because the train has left the station.

Both teams use the DH in the All-Star Game. That doesn't have anything to do with the AL using the DH vs. the pitcher in the NL. Personally, I don't think you are right about the DH coming to the NL. I haven't seen it mentioned as far as the CBA is concerned- unless the new commissioner is pushing for it and I am unaware of it.

What I would kind of like to see is teams have 10 player line ups instead of the regular 9 with one of the 10 being a pitcher.

And I'm not anti-DH- I just don't think you are right about it coming to the NL in 10 years.

[Dawg61]

What I would kind of like to see is teams have 10 player line ups instead of the regular 9 with one of the 10 being a pitcher.

Less ABs for the stars. Never happen.

[Smitty]

I'm in favor of the DH. Roosevelt isn't President anymore, pitchers hitting isn't nostalgic it's pathetic.

However I would like to see an NL team radically take their whole staff and then them into bullpen guys, pinch hitting for the pitcher every time. Surely an advantage there than can be exploited some.

[msstate7]

I'm in favor of the DH. Roosevelt isn't President anymore, pitchers hitting isn't nostalgic it's pathetic.

However I would like to see an NL team radically take their whole staff and then them into bullpen guys, pinch hitting for the pitcher every time. Surely an advantage there than can be exploited some.

Not sure you could do that with only a 25 man roster. Interesting idea though

[shoeless joe]

I laugh in the face of someone telling me the DH makes AL teams better! It's merely the fact that at this point the better teams are in the AL. For years and years it was the other way around.

NL plays a better brand of actual baseball IMO. I prefer watching it. I like strategy and forcing the managers hand. There is no reason, that I'm aware of, to believe the DH is coming anytime soon to the NL.

I Hope folks realize that the reason the DH is always used in the all star game is to get another player an opportunity to hit more than once.

[DudyDawg]

NL plays a better brand of actual baseball IMO. I prefer watching it. I like strategy and forcing the managers hand. There is no reason, that I'm aware of, to believe the DH is coming anytime soon to the NL.


The reason is star pitchers getting hurt hitting. That happens to a few more big names, the push for DH in the NL will start growing. From owners. Because losing stars hurts their pockets

[shoeless joe]

The reason is star pitchers getting hurt hitting. That happens to a few more big names, the push for DH in the NL will start growing. From owners. Because losing stars hurts their pockets

Is there some data available about the percentage of pitcher injuries from hitting? And the # of pitcher injuries in AL vs. NL? I would think the higher percentage of high stress pitches in AL would so account for some injury problems...

I'm not disputing I'm just interested in the numbers.

[msstate7]

Is there some data available about the percentage of pitcher injuries from hitting? And the # of pitcher injuries in AL vs. NL? I would think the higher percentage of high stress pitches in AL would so account for some injury problems...

I'm not disputing I'm just interested in the numbers.

I know brave pitchers have arm injuries directly related to pitching. Tim Hudson was an exception, but it was while he was playing defense, not batting

[Dawg61]

The reason is star pitchers getting hurt hitting. That happens to a few more big names, the push for DH in the NL will start growing. From owners. Because losing stars hurts their pockets

Adam Wainwright's injury was totally flukey. It had nothing to do with him batting. Yall looking for any tiny little detail to try and shit on the NL. DH is for the AL only. Get used to it.

[Dawg61]

I'm in favor of the DH. Roosevelt isn't President anymore, pitchers hitting isn't nostalgic it's pathetic.

I've seen many a good hitting pitcher. Bumgarner can hit so can Kershaw. Pitchers hitting isn't some Honus Wagner Teddy Roosevelt shit so you can shove those comments. Pitchers hitting has been a part of baseball forever. From a newborn today all the way back to when it got invented. You don't get to change rules to a sport you've never played. This isn't MLB The Show for PS4. You can't just tweak the settings to your liking.

[Todd4State]

I've seen many a good hitting pitcher. Bumgarner can hit so can Kershaw. Pitchers hitting isn't some Honus Wagner Teddy Roosevelt shit so you can shove those comments. Pitchers hitting has been a part of baseball forever. From a newborn today all the way back to when it got invented. You don't get to change rules to a sport you've never played. This isn't MLB The Show for PS4. You can't just tweak the settings to your liking.

Babe Ruth was a pretty good hitting pitcher too. Honestly, I think pitcher was probably his best position in the field, but obviously no one had thought of the DH in the 1920's.

[Todd4State]

Is there some data available about the percentage of pitcher injuries from hitting? And the # of pitcher injuries in AL vs. NL? I would think the higher percentage of high stress pitches in AL would so account for some injury problems...

I'm not disputing I'm just interested in the numbers.

I don't know about data, but I'd bet it's pretty low compared to the number of AB's that they get per year. I'd guess 1% of the time.

[Dawg61]

I don't know about data, but I'd bet it's pretty low compared to the number of AB's that they get per year. I'd guess 1% of the time.

How many injuries do AL pitchers cause because they can plunk batters without ever having to face being plunked themselves? How many times does an AL hitter get hurt by a retaliation pitch caused by his own pitcher throwing at someone? How many players have gotten hurt in brawls started by pitchers that don't have to face for their actions? The biggest deterrent to batters getting hit by pitches is for the pitcher to have to bat himself. It seems to me that there's more fights started in the AL than NL. Probably cause the pitcher doesn't have to bat.

[Smitty]

How many injuries do AL pitchers cause because they can plunk batters without ever having to face being plunked themselves? How many times does an AL hitter get hurt by a retaliation pitch caused by his own pitcher throwing at someone? How many players have gotten hurt in brawls started by pitchers that don't have to face for their actions? The biggest deterrent to batters getting hit by pitches is for the pitcher to have to bat himself. It seems to me that there's more fights started in the AL than NL. Probably cause the pitcher doesn't have to bat.

Uh, retaliation comes against the same player on the other team.. Nobody plunks pitchers. Why the hell would you plunk a guy that hits, on average, .122?

[Really Clark?]

Uh, retaliation comes against the same player on the other team.. Nobody plunks pitchers. Why the hell would you plunk a guy that hits, on average, .122?

I agree with what you are saying, you do not hit the opposing pitcher usually, but the AL averages about 15% more hbp I believe than NL. (Last percentage I recall). There is still a deterrent factor in the NL vs AL.

[Dawg61]

Pitchers get thrown at in the NL. Ask Grienke or Ian Kennedy.

[Todd4State]

Pitchers get thrown at in the NL. Ask Grienke or Ian Kennedy.

Or Pedro Martinez, Juan Marichal, Pascual Perez, etc.

[War Machine Dawg]

There were no fewer than 2 segments on MLB Network's The Rundown earlier today about the DH coming to the NL. Twitterverse was in favor of it. The media has started beating the drum, meaning it's just a matter of time. You can hate it, but it's happening.

[Dawg61]

There were no fewer than 2 segments on MLB Network's The Rundown earlier today about the DH coming to the NL. Twitterverse was in favor of it. The media has started beating the drum, meaning it's just a matter of time. You can hate it, but it's happening.

Media can sabermetrics till they're blue in the face. They don't own half the league. DH isn't coming any decade soon.

[shoeless joe]

If Ventura had to get in the box he'd prolly learn to shut his mouth real quick.

[Dawg61]

If Ventura had to get in the box he'd prolly learn to shut his mouth real quick.

Exactly!

[DudyDawg]

Adam Wainwright's injury was totally flukey. It had nothing to do with him batting. Yall looking for any tiny little detail to try and shit on the NL. DH is for the AL only. Get used to it.

Not true at all. I'm not only an NL fan, I'm a Cards fan. I'm also trying to be a realist. Don't lump me in as trying to shit on it.
Injuries are only part of it. The youth doesn't watch baseball like they used to. Baseball is trying to change that. I think the DH to the NL is going to be a part of that sooner or later. Kids, for the most part now, don't want to see a pitcher watch three strikes or bunt.

ETA, I hope it doesn't happen before Bartolo Colon retires. I love watching him "hit"

[Dawg61]

Not true at all. I'm not only an NL fan, I'm a Cards fan. I'm also trying to be a realist. Don't lump me in as trying to shit on it.
Injuries are only part of it. The youth doesn't watch baseball like they used to. Baseball is trying to change that. I think the DH to the NL is going to be a part of that sooner or later. Kids, for the most part now, don't want to see a pitcher watch three strikes or bunt.

ETA, I hope it doesn't happen before Bartolo Colon retires. I love watching him "hit"

Putting the DH in the NL isn't going to turn one single kid into a baseball fan if he/she isn't one already. What it will do is piss off half the fans baseball has already. Not a smart move. But it doesn't matter what NL fans say cause those of you wanting a DH in the NL can't hear anything else. I think the NL should go on the offensive and demand the elimination of the DH in the AL. See how they like it.

[DudyDawg]

Putting the DH in the NL isn't going to turn one single kid into a baseball fan if he/she isn't one already. What it will do is piss off half the fans baseball has already. Not a smart move. But it doesn't matter what NL fans say cause those of you wanting a DH in the NL can't hear anything else. I think the NL should go on the offensive and demand the elimination of the DH in the AL. See how they like it.

I don't really want it. But I know it's happening and I'm okay with that.

[Dawg61]

I don't really want it. But I know it's happening and I'm okay with that.

There's much more strategy in the NL. That makes it more entertaining. More offense doesn't necessarily make it a more entertaining product. You know this because you're a huge soccer fan. How pissed would you be if they tried to eliminate offsides in soccer or got rid of bookings? Leave baseball alone. I'm all for eliminating instant replays except on fair or foul HRs too. Bring back the Lou Pinella's of the world throwing 2nd base into the OF and kicking dirt on the home plate. Instant replay has damaged the entertainment value way more than pitchers hitting in the NL.

[War Machine Dawg]

I don't really want it. But I know it's happening and I'm okay with that.

http://i.imgur.com/cuCPKY3.gif

[Smitty]

https://espngrantland.files.wordpress.com/2015/04/mlb-pitcher-wrc.png

[DudyDawg]

There's much more strategy in the NL. That makes it more entertaining. More offense doesn't necessarily make it a more entertaining product. You know this because you're a huge soccer fan. How pissed would you be if they tried to eliminate offsides in soccer or got rid of bookings? Leave baseball alone. I'm all for eliminating instant replays except on fair or foul HRs too. Bring back the Lou Pinella's of the world throwing 2nd base into the OF and kicking dirt on the home plate. Instant replay has damaged the entertainment value way more than pitchers hitting in the NL.

I don't my think that's an equal comparison. A better one, for soccer, would be like making goalies take penalty kicks.

[Dawg61]

It's not happening for a long time if ever. There was already a ton of opposition to it today that I heard just from watching MLBNETWORK. Bumgarner had some strong opinions against changing it and he's getting lots of support for what he said. It takes a majority of the 15 NL owners voting for the DH to change it. That's 8 of 15 owners. Not happening.