CBS say deal likely today

[BrunswickDawg]

http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/eye-on-college-basketball/25119372/mississippi-state-expected-to-finalize-deal-to-make-ben-howland-coach

[Coach34]

Noooooo- don't listen to C34 and the rest of the Elitedawgs- we're always wrong and a bunch a lunatics

[sbcmortgageman]

The deal is imminent fellas.

[cheewgumm]

This is the best place for 1) breaking news, 2) intense debate ... Concerning miss state athletics. It's not close.

[messageboardsuperhero]

Damn Coach, you nailed this one... Down to one of Howland's assistants.

https://twitter.com/awireman/status/579986417591328768

[BeardoMSU]

Damn Coach, you nailed this one... Down to one of Howland's assistants.

https://twitter.com/awireman/status/579986417591328768

Hot damn! What kind of an impact will McCray have on recruiting?

[TheRef]

Hot damn! What kind of an impact will McCray have on recruiting?

Coached at LSU after leaving UCLA...there's a southern recruiter.

[rabbitthedawg]

I'm excited about this hire. Guess I'll pony up with season tickets again.

[ScottH]

Hot damn! What kind of an impact will McCray have on recruiting?

Kind of a mystery.

Played and coached at Mercer. Coached at Chipola.

He was a big part of UCLA's recruiting his two years there.

Didn't meet expectations his one year at LSU. Resigned last summer.

Didn't coach this past season.

[RossDawg82]

Any chance that a recruit or 2 follows McCray to Starkville?

[mparkerfd20]

If all this shakes out, this was probably the absolute best case scenario for Mississippi State. Rare to see things like this ever work out for us. I'm pumped!

[Thompson92]

Coached at LSU after leaving UCLA...there's a southern recruiter.

His LSU staff page said he helped get the No.1 class at UCLA in 2012. Not bad...

Man, this is good news. MSU sports has been pretty frustrating since mid-November.

[Coach34]

Damn Coach, you nailed this one... Down to one of Howland's assistants.

https://twitter.com/awireman/status/579986417591328768


Preacher heard something was up 2 weeks ago. ShannonDawg broke it first yesterday then more news started trickling. IfYouOnlyKnew- aka Dan- also had info on McCray. Elitedawg team effort

[Ifyouonlyknew]

McCray is from Atlanta. His dad is the co-founder of the famed Atl Celtics AAU team. Tookie & Simonds both played for the celtics. They usually have the best players in Georgia on that team.

[Liverpooldawg]

Noooooo- don't listen to C34 and the rest of the Elitedawgs- we're always wrong and a bunch a lunatics

Rick Ray is still out coach, right? LOL.

[missouridawg]

McCray is from Atlanta. His dad is the co-founder of the famed Atl Celtics AAU team. Tookie & Simonds both played for the celtics. They usually have the best players in Georgia on that team.

This would probably help us keep Simonds, hopefull.

[Dawg61]

McCray is from Atlanta. His dad is the co-founder of the famed Atl Celtics AAU team. Tookie & Simonds both played for the celtics. They usually have the best players in Georgia on that team.

McCray coached Dwight Howard and John Wall

[Coach007]

Damn Coach, you nailed this one... Down to one of Howland's assistants.

https://twitter.com/awireman/status/579986417591328768



Faster the better! Put him to work today!

[msstate7]

McCray is from Atlanta. His dad is the co-founder of the famed Atl Celtics AAU team. Tookie & Simonds both played for the celtics. They usually have the best players in Georgia on that team.

So simonds may still be in play?

[Political Hack]

free site = on the money
pay site = waste of money

[I seen it dawg]

I'm excited about this hire. Guess I'll pony up with season tickets again.

You do that. Hope nobody makes you mad again to make you abandon the school.

[maroonmania]

But, but, but Gene said....

[Coach34]

Rick Ray is still out coach, right? LOL.

nobody claimed to be perfect

[engie]

Simonds is absolutely still in play....

[MaxedOutMaroon]

Excited about this possibility!

[smootness]

Simonds is absolutely still in play....

Yep, he said he loves the campus and that we're still a 'top choice' for him.

[engie]

I'd think this puts Malik back in play -- and also puts Kegler into the equation at least somewhat...

"Oh, sure, I coached Kevin Love. We stay in touch. Would you like to speak with him? See that assistant sitting across the table from me -- he 'grew up' coaching Dwight Howard. Do you believe we can get you to the NBA from right here at home in MS?"

[RossDawg82]

Anybody in the know heard anything from Malik on the possibility of this hire for us?

[Thick]

Read Korey McCray's quote in the BR paper. He states (paraphrasing) that upon arrival at LSU he did not want to become pigeon hold as a recruiter. He's really not responsible for any of their current players/recruits. Quarterman played on his AAU bball team, the Atlanta Celtics, but had already signed with LSU. He's definitely connected no doubt.

[ScottH]

And Diamond Stone remains uncommitted.

Oh wait, we don't have enough spots.

[Really Clark?]

nobody claimed to be perfect

Patrick Murphy left Alabama, was introduced at LSU and a day later was calling up both schools to return to Alabama. These things can be very fluid but people want to hold your feet to the fire becaue the info you received led you, and alot of others, to believe that Ray was here for another year. The situation changed AFTER that but somehow that makes it that you gave out false info. How are you or anyone really able to know when someone (in this case AD and administration) changes course? You could have still been 100% correct with your info originally. If some says they are bringing me a hamburger to eat and I tell that to someone else but the original party brings me pizza instead, did I lie or give false info?

[Dawg61]

And Diamond Stone remains uncommitted.

Oh wait, we don't have enough spots.

Fred Thomas and Travis Daniels disagree

[smootness]

The connection to the Celtics alone is enough. He would probably at the very least help keep Tookie and get Simonds back. Then Josh Langford and Kobi Simmons, the #1 player in the country for 2016, play for them now.

I doubt we would suddenly get every player from the Celtics, but it would certainly help.

He may not want to be pigeon-holed as a recruiter, but he certainly can recruit.

[ScottH]

Fred Thomas and Travis Daniels disagree

Correct and almost anyone else on the roster also.

[mic]

You do that. Hope nobody makes you mad again to make you abandon the school.

I hope they are behind top row upper tank behind the goal....

[Thick]

I would keep Daniels. Fred is a turnover machine, and absolutely CANNOT make a post entry pass...EVER!

[Coach34]

Also- Thick has had a pretty good pulse on what's been going on. Hopefully he can weigh in about Newman in the next couple days.

[DownwardDawg]

free site = on the money
pay site = waste of money

This all day long!!!! I've missed y'all. Been too busy with work. I love this board and I love that I can watch MSU basketball again!!!

[smootness]

I would keep Daniels. Fred is a turnover machine, and absolutely CANNOT make a post entry pass...EVER!

I would keep both unless you can go get someone legit to replace them. I don't want just another body, even if it's slightly better than Thomas or Daniels. They're both seniors, so you'll be able to replace them next year anyway.

[Coach34]

Patrick Murphy left Alabama, was introduced at LSU and a day later was calling up both schools to return to Alabama. These things can be very fluid but people want to hold your feet to the fire becaue the info you received led you, and alot of others, to believe that Ray was here for another year. The situation changed AFTER that but somehow that makes it that you gave out false info. How are you or anyone really able to know when someone (in this case AD and administration) changes course? You could have still been 100% correct with your info originally. If some says they are bringing me a hamburger to eat and I tell that to someone else but the original party brings me pizza instead, did I lie or give false info?

Thank you Sir. I'm sure more people get it besides you- but just won't admit it. Appreciate the post

[RossDawg82]

Thank you Sir. I'm sure more people get it besides you- but just won't admit it. Appreciate the post

Also, I don't recall any of your posts saying anything was 100% guaranteed. You said over and over that you were passing along messages sent to you. Classic case of don't shot the messenger if you were wrong. But I also commend you for not taking credit on some of this like you probably could have. Whether you were spot on or wrong as possible, you maintained that you were passing along information given to you by another source. +1 on respect points if there were such a thing

[Coach34]

Also, I don't recall any of your posts saying anything was 100% guaranteed. You said over and over that you were passing along messages sent to you. Classic case of don't shot the messenger if you were wrong. But I also commend you for not taking credit on some of this like you probably could have. Whether you were spot on or wrong as possible, you maintained that you were passing along information given to you by another source. +1 on respect points if there were such a thing

I said Strick was not going to fire Ray this year unless forced to do so- he was forced. It wasn't some big showdown- but again- SS didn't spearhead this Ben Howland deal. But our guys- all of them- got this right. That's what is most important

[quickstrike2]

I said Strick was not going to fire Ray this year unless forced to do so- he was forced. It wasn't some big showdown- but again- SS didn't spearhead this Ben Howland deal. But our guys- all of them- got this right. That's what is most important

Very true post, that is the most important thing. Getting what is best for the university and program done.

[Coach34]

It's kind of like the LT- Jackie Wayne deal. We hired Sherrill when LT was the AD. LT didn't make that happen- Dr Z did. But it all worked out and State football was changed forever. That's what we all want

[Bubb Rubb]

And Diamond Stone remains uncommitted.

Oh wait, we don't have enough spots.

There will be a nice bit of attrition, I would think. There usually is in situations like this. Fair or not, coaches would much rather coach their guys than someone else's.

[Bothrops]

Howland is one a hell of a hire and the guy is very impressive to listen to. He will have an instant impact on recruiting. In fact, it might be better than it's ever been in the near future.

And I got all my info right here.

[RougeDawg]

CBS already reporting the deal is done. Saw article on 247.

[smootness]

The attractive thing about this job for somebody with name recognition and recruiting legitimacy is that not only do you inherit a veteran team that you can potentially turn into a decent product, but you also have 4 or 5 seniors on the roster next year, depending on what happens with Zuppardo.

So you also have a chance to turn the roster over quickly with some legitimate talent. Simonds is obviously a guy you want to get back in the fold, and Hicks is probably good enough as well, then even without attrition you have a few more roster spots open to play with.

There won't need to be a ton of attrition, either. The new coach may or may not like guys like Ndoye, Black, and Strugg, but Houston, Ready, Tookie, Weatherspoon, Hicks, and Simonds are all good pieces.

Ready isn't really the type of PG Howland has gone with in the past, but he's good enough to work with.

[chef dixon]

I've seen butthurt tweets from fans of at least 10 different schools about this whole deal.

[BeardoMSU]

Ready isn't really the type of PG Howland has gone with in the past, but he's good enough to work with.

Hopefully Ready will be the backup PG next year, behind whoever else we bring in. We are in desperate need of a play-maker at the point.

[Coach007]

I've seen butthurt tweets from fans of at least 10 different schools about this whole deal.


Yep! Fear has a scent... it's like HONEY!

[chef dixon]

Hopefully Ready will be the backup PG next year, behind whoever else we bring in. We are in desperate need of a play-maker at the point.

Yea he prefers point guards that make over 50% from 3 (Darren Collison)

[Johnson85]

There will be a nice bit of attrition, I would think. There usually is in situations like this. Fair or not, coaches would much rather coach their guys than someone else's.

Who are the people that will possibly be encouraged to go somewhere else? It doesn't look like we have a lot of obvious options.

Houston I presume is safe. Oliver Black, Ndoye, and Dunlap are the other rising sophomores and it seems early to pull the plug on any of them. Mabye Ndoye might be an option except do you really make this team smaller as Ware is getting ready to graduate?

Ready is the only rising junior and I would assume he is safe.

Sword and Ware are obviously safe.

The other rising seniors are Thomas, Daniels, and Zuppardo. I would hope Thomas is safe; I don't think you ask a 4 year senior to move on when there haven't been any work ethic issues. I guess nobody knows what we have in Zuppardo, but I think as a JUCO transfer with only two years to play two you can sort of expect that if you have a major injury you will be at risk if you're not really good. Daniels is sort of similar in that he's a juco guy that tied up a scholarship for a year while he was ineligible. I don't know that there would be anything pushing us to keep Thomas over Daniels except Daniels has already had four years of eligibility and spent one of them at State waiting to play.

So it seems like it would be either seniors or rising sophomores that would be at risk if the new coach had a lot of players of his own to bring in. Just not sure which route would be taken.

[smootness]

I think most of the roster would stay. The thing that favors guys like Ndoye, Black, and Strugg (especially the latter two) is that Howland likes a defensive, physical, rugged style of play. Black and Strugg should fit right into that. Ndoye needs to add strength, but he can defend and rebound.

Dunlap may be a choice for attrition. He's a smaller guy and isn't real physical, so I don't see somebody like Howland seeing him as a great piece.

[RougeDawg]

I've seen butthurt tweets from fans of at least 10 different schools about this whole deal.

One of those schools in Mississippi?

[War Machine Dawg]

Rick Ray is still out coach, right? LOL.

http://i.imgur.com/SxaUCLY.gif

[tcdog70]

I think our offense might be pretty good with Howland. I'll bet he won't let it fix itself.Thomas and Daniels might look a lot better with a real Coach.

[War Machine Dawg]

I think our offense might be pretty good with Howland. I'll bet he won't let it fix itself.Thomas and Daniels might look a lot better with a real Coach.

I might get crucified for saying this, but I don't think FTF has even scratched the surface of his potential.

[Political Hack]

I might get crucified for saying this, but I don't think FTF has even scratched the surface of his potential.

he hasn't. he hasn't gotten any better. I think he could be a very good SEC player with his length and athleticism but when you have 17 3-men it's hard to get them all in the right place. our roster management the last 3 years has been the worst I've ever seen at any level of basketball.

[smootness]

And I might get crucified for this, but I don't expect our offense to be vastly improved. Our defense, though, could be terrifying.

[War Machine Dawg]

he hasn't. he hasn't gotten any better. I think he could be a very good SEC player with his length and athleticism but when you have 17 3-men it's hard to get them all in the right place. our roster management the last 3 years has been the worst I've ever seen at any level of basketball.

Agreed, he's a freak. Just wish Howland actually had more than 1 season to work with him.

[War Machine Dawg]

And I might get crucified for this, but I don't expect our offense to be vastly improved. Our defense, though, could be terrifying.

Wouldn't surprise me at all. The only way offense significantly improves is if we land Newman and cull the herd for a few other impact freshmen/transfers. But I will say having a healthy Ready & Sword for the entire season should help, especially if we get Sword back to taking it to the hole instead of taking jump shots.

[Bubb Rubb]

Who are the people that will possibly be encouraged to go somewhere else? It doesn't look like we have a lot of obvious options.

Houston I presume is safe. Oliver Black, Ndoye, and Dunlap are the other rising sophomores and it seems early to pull the plug on any of them. Mabye Ndoye might be an option except do you really make this team smaller as Ware is getting ready to graduate?

Ready is the only rising junior and I would assume he is safe.

Sword and Ware are obviously safe.

The other rising seniors are Thomas, Daniels, and Zuppardo. I would hope Thomas is safe; I don't think you ask a 4 year senior to move on when there haven't been any work ethic issues. I guess nobody knows what we have in Zuppardo, but I think as a JUCO transfer with only two years to play two you can sort of expect that if you have a major injury you will be at risk if you're not really good. Daniels is sort of similar in that he's a juco guy that tied up a scholarship for a year while he was ineligible. I don't know that there would be anything pushing us to keep Thomas over Daniels except Daniels has already had four years of eligibility and spent one of them at State waiting to play.

So it seems like it would be either seniors or rising sophomores that would be at risk if the new coach had a lot of players of his own to bring in. Just not sure which route would be taken.

It's not just Howland pulling the plug on guys. It's also guys not liking Howland and his style. Someone will want to leave - it always happens. I kinda hope it doesn't because I'd like to see how much of our problems were coaching vs. personnel. But it pretty much always happens.

[Coach34]

Fred is timid. Fred holds Fred back as much as anyone

[smootness]

There's no doubt that next year's team, with Newman, has a higher ceiling under Howland than they would under Ray.

That may be an obvious statement, but Howland will have a lot to work with on the defensive end, which is his bread and butter. If you add a born scorer like Newman into that mix, along with Sword, who started to become a reliable scorer at the end of last year, you have the potential makings of a pretty good team.

[Political Hack]

And I might get crucified for this, but I don't expect our offense to be vastly improved. Our defense, though, could be terrifying.

our offense will be immensely better. We can't shoot but you'd batter damn we'll believe we can run. We'll push the ball next year with chicken, Fred, IJ, etc... We're going to score in transition, which is the only way our current players really can score.

[blacklistedbully]

I LOVE great defense. Doesn't bore me one bit. I thoroughly enjoy seeing a top-tier defense put massive pressure on an opposing offense. Hell, I like that MORE than watching a shootout.

[Dawg61]

I might get crucified for saying this, but I don't think FTF has even scratched the surface of his potential.

No mental skills and very poor ball-handling and passing skills. Fred is what he is at this point. A great athlete and defender that offers zero on offense besides the occasional spot 3 or fastbreak dunk.

[smootness]

our offense will be immensely better. We can't shoot but you'd batter damn we'll believe we can run. We'll push the ball next year with chicken, Fred, IJ, etc... We're going to score in transition, which is the only way our current players really can score.

It will likely improve, as it essentially has to. And Howland is a better coach than Ray, there's no question about that.

Just saying that offense isn't Howland's specialty. His teams were always 'good enough' offensively, but they won because of their defense.

If he pushes the ball on offense, it will be because he learned and adjusts, as he said he did in his last year at UCLA, not because that's what his natural tendency is.

[BeardoMSU]

It will likely improve, as it essentially has to. And Howland is a better coach than Ray, there's no question about that.

Just saying that offense isn't Howland's specialty. His teams were always 'good enough' offensively, but they won because of their defense.

If he pushes the ball on offense, it will be because he learned and adjusts, as he said he did in his last year at UCLA, not because that's what his natural tendency is.

What is his "style" on offense though? Motion, PicknRoll, etc.? Ray's style of "motion" was unbearable, and I hope we never see it again.

As I've said earlier, our improvement on offense, regardless of scheme, will be dependent on a PG who can make plays, for himself and others. I want a gunner at PG. Whether thats a Russel Westbrook or Dee Bost (big spectrum there, lol), I want a guy who can drive, shoot, and find his teammates. IJ hasn't shown me he can do any of those things. He's gotten better, but still not the answer going forward, IMO.

[smootness]

What is his "style" on offense though? Motion, PicknRoll, etc.? Ray's style of "motion" was unbearable, and I hope we never see it again.

As I've said earlier, our improvement on offense, regardless of scheme, will be dependent on a PG who can make plays, for himself and others. I want a gunner at PG. Whether thats a Russel Westbrook or Dee Bost (big spectrum there, lol), I want a guy who can drive, shoot, and find his teammates. IJ hasn't shown me he can do any of those things. He's gotten better, but still not the answer going forward, IMO.

Tookie can do all of those things, the only question with him is size.

As to his style of offense, I don't know, to be honest. I do know it was a slowed-down style. It was about 'grinding it out' more than flying up and down the court and pushing the action.

He said he learned from that, though, and wishes he has gone more up-tempo sooner, so we might see something slightly different here.

[BeardoMSU]

Tookie can do all of those things, the only question with him is size.

As to his style of offense, I don't know, to be honest. I do know it was a slowed-down style. It was about 'grinding it out' more than flying up and down the court and pushing the action.

He said he learned from that, though, and wishes he has gone more up-tempo sooner, so we might see something slightly different here.

Ah, ok - I'm good with that.

Yeah, Tookie definitely looks like an upgrade at the point.

[smootness]

Just did a little searching, and I saw it described as 'motion' in one article.

Which doesn't necessarily mean much. A lot of coaches run a 'motion' offense, and there is no bigger supporter of it than Bobby Knight.

But under Howland, our offense won't matter a whole lot. We will beat teams up enough physically that we won't need to score in bunches.

[tcdog70]

It will likely improve, as it essentially has to. And Howland is a better coach than Ray, there's no question about that.

Just saying that offense isn't Howland's specialty. His teams were always 'good enough' offensively, but they won because of their defense.

If he pushes the ball on offense, it will be because he learned and adjusts, as he said he did in his last year at UCLA, not because that's what his natural tendency is.

his last team scored 74 points a game and it was up tempo.

[smootness]

his last team scored 74 points a game and it was up tempo.

I know, and he may do the same here.

I'm totally cool if he doesn't, though. He had tons of success with the strategy he was using, so I can deal with a lack of offense if we beat everybody.

[Political Hack]

It will likely improve, as it essentially has to. And Howland is a better coach than Ray, there's no question about that.

Just saying that offense isn't Howland's specialty. His teams were always 'good enough' offensively, but they won because of their defense.

If he pushes the ball on offense, it will be because he learned and adjusts, as he said he did in his last year at UCLA, not because that's what his natural tendency is.

he said in a recent article he will always push the ball now.

[smootness]

he said in a recent article he will always push the ball now.

Yes, I know.

[BulldogDX55]

his last team scored 74 points a game and it was up tempo.

Yeah, he changed styles in his last year at UCLA and said he would use it going forward.