Baseball vs. MVSU cancelled

[mstatefan91]

Hadn't seen it posted yet. Tomorrow's game is cancelled and to be rescheduled. Use the same ticket stub that was meant for tomorrow

[maroonmania]

Why are we playing so many SWAC school games? Don't we play AL A&M this weekend, and Alcorn the next week? They are RPI killers, one SWAC game total would be plenty.

[smootness]

Why are we playing so many SWAC school games? Don't we play AL A&M this weekend, and Alcorn the next week? They are RPI killers, one SWAC game total would be plenty.

David Murray suggested we may have canceled it for that reason. He said after winning all 4 games this weekend, we don't want the RPI hit but that it may be rescheduled if the team starts struggling some. Said they scheduled it so that if we struggled this weekend, they could get a win on the record.

[messageboardsuperhero]

I hope we reschedule with a decent team later. There is absolutely no sense in playing more than one SWAC team per year. It does absolutely nothing but kill your RPI- ask Arkansas circa 2013. Hell, I've been wanting us to cut them totally out of our schedule for a couple of years now...

[State82]

Only SWAC teams we should ever play are JSU (and they are pushing it with the attitude), Alcorn & Valley. Two games with Alabama A&M and one with Ark.-Pine Bluff should never happen. Ever. I would be ok with a game each with Alcorn and Valley but that should be it.

[Todd4State]

The reason we are playing so many SWAC teams is because a tournament in New Orleans was cancelled and we pulled out of the Houston baseball tournament and had to scramble for opponents.

My SWAC policy is pretty much the same as 82's. We should play a max of three SWAC regular season games and those should be against in state schools.

I would be surprised if we make this game up whether we "struggle" or not. We don't have much to gain by playing Valley either way.

[engie]

Good. One less RPI killer.

This was a terrible schedule. Let's not kid ourselves. Our OOC intended SOS this year - 192. Cohen should have never pulled out of the Minute Maid Classic.
Across the conference:
Auburn - 122
Ole Miss - 60
Georgia - 63
Tennessee - 76
Kentucky - 118
Arkansas - 133
Florida - 127
Vandy - 128
Bama - 167
aTm - 158
LSU - 165
USCe - 176
Mizzou - 254

So, we play the (intended) second-weakest non-conference SOS in the SEC. We've got to win 40+ to have a chance to host IMO. Can't afford to lose to any of the bad teams -- and have to do really well in conference to make up the SOS ground. We need a couple of these teams to be alot better than they are expected to be.

[MSUDawg4Life]

Only SWAC teams we should ever play are JSU (and they are pushing it with the attitude), Alcorn & Valley. Two games with Alabama A&M and one with Ark.-Pine Bluff should never happen. Ever. I would be ok with a game each with Alcorn and Valley but that should be it.

What if Alabama State has been the best SWAC baseball team over the past few years and is expected to be the same this year. If the concern is RPI, shouldn't we want to play the school that will mostly likely end up with the highest RPI?

[engie]

What if Alabama State has been the best SWAC baseball team over the past few years and is expected to be the same this year. If the concern is RPI, shouldn't we want to play the school that will mostly likely end up with the highest RPI?

The best SWAC RPI in the past couple of years is #165. That is still bad enough to be very hurtful to our RPI. The only reason anybody is OK with playing the MS SWAC schools period is the ideal that we're helping those schools out monetarily. With the Jackson St stink last year, I really don't care if we ever play any of them. Especially in Starkville. Give one of them a neutral site game as a part of a weekend tournament in Pearl/Memphis/Biloxi and call it a day.

[maroonmania]

The reason we are playing so many SWAC teams is because a tournament in New Orleans was cancelled and we pulled out of the Houston baseball tournament and had to scramble for opponents.



Was there ever a decent explanation for why we pulled out of that Houston tournament? Makes it even more of a bad decision to pull out if it forced us into a bunch of SWAC games. We've given ourselves almost ZERO wiggle room if we want to host this year.

[messageboardsuperhero]

Good. One less RPI killer.

This was a terrible schedule. Let's not kid ourselves. Our OOC intended SOS this year - 192. Cohen should have never pulled out of the Minute Maid Classic.
Across the conference:
Auburn - 122
Ole Miss - 60
Georgia - 63
Tennessee - 76
Kentucky - 118
Arkansas - 133
Florida - 127
Vandy - 128
Bama - 167
aTm - 158
LSU - 165
USCe - 176
Mizzou - 254

So, we play the (intended) second-weakest non-conference SOS in the SEC. We've got to win 40+ to have a chance to host IMO. Can't afford to lose to any of the bad teams -- and have to do really well in conference to make up the SOS ground. We need a couple of these teams to be alot better than they are expected to be.

Said it yesterday and I'll say it again- our pre-SEC nonconference schedule is a complete joke. I'm still pissed we pulled out of the Minute Maid Classic... We've totally screwed ourselves to the point where we need to have a stellar record to host- it can definitely be done but we've put ourselves in a very non-advantageous situation. I know Cohen wanted to build confidence in the young players, but we're just too damn talented to be playing some of the teams we're playing right now.

Hopefully we learn our lesson.

[messageboardsuperhero]

Was there ever a decent explanation for why we pulled out of that Houston tournament? Makes it even more of a bad decision to pull out if it forced us into a bunch of SWAC games. We've given ourselves almost ZERO wiggle room if we want to host this year.

That decision looks even worse now than I thought it was then... And I thought it was pretty ****ing stupid at the time.

Some of these games we've scheduled are just a waste of time. Period.

[Coach34]

Our SEC schedule will cure all. It really doesnt matter who we play OOC. We certainly need to play another major P5 school OOC every year- but a few SWAC schools doesnt mean shit. We need to win 19-20 SEC games and that shit wont ever matter

[MsStateBaseball]

He pulled out last spring BC he didn't know how good we are. I think getting Smith and Reynolds late really helped.

[engie]

Yep. I love OM's schedule. Losing on the road to good teams in the noncon doesn't hurt you much -- and it prepares you for the SEC schedule. OM goes to UCF for 3 this year, to Louisville for 2, and to USM for 1. Play @ Arky St. Play us, Memphis, and USM at a neutral site. Had a team that's averaged a 50 RPI over the past 2 years in for the opening weekend, an improving Wright St in week 2, a traditionally pretty good Stetson program in week 4, 2 at home against a pretty good UAB team, etc... The only true pushovers on their whole schedule is a single SWAC game(Arkansas Pine Bluff) and UT Martin(if they are who they are expected to be)...

OM has 10 remaining games against teams with losing records after week 1. 3 of which are against a good Tennessee team that struggled in week 1.
MSU has 16 remaining games against teams with losing records in week 1. 3 of which are against that same Tennessee team...

[engie]

Our SEC schedule will cure all. It really doesnt matter who we play OOC. We certainly need to play another major P5 school OOC every year- but a few SWAC schools doesnt mean shit. We need to win 19-20 SEC games and that shit wont ever matter

We won 18 last year and didn't sniff hosting. Far closer to a 3 seed than a host. Arkansas didn't sniff hosting 2 years ago at 18-11 in the SEC. Every game against the SWAC hurts us just as much as a game against a quality SEC opponent helps us. It's strange how opposite you approach this in comparison to how you approached basketball for years and years.

[Todd4State]

He pulled out last spring BC he didn't know how good we are. I think getting Smith and Reynolds late really helped.

No, it was because otherwise we were going to have only two weekends of pre-SEC home games and then the NOLA tournament pulled the plug on us. We should have just played Houston and pulled the plug on NOLA in hindsight.

There aren't enough weekends to please what all of our fans want. We can't play in a ton of tournaments, play a bunch of Saturday double headers, play a bunch of power five teams on the road without running out of spots on the schedule quickly. Oh- and get young guys playing time and figure out our lineup.

[Todd4State]

We won 18 last year and didn't sniff hosting. Far closer to a 3 seed than a host. Arkansas didn't sniff hosting 2 years ago at 18-11 in the SEC. Every game against the SWAC hurts us just as much as a game against a quality SEC opponent helps us. It's strange how opposite you approach this in comparison to how you approached basketball for years and years.

If you play cupcakes, you have to beat them. That's the lesson there.

[engie]

Better to lose to great teams at neutral sites than to beat terrible teams at home... If Cohen is placing blame for last season on the trip to Arizona, he's misplacing it. The real RPI daggers came from Holy Cross inside Dudy Noble...

[messageboardsuperhero]

Yep. I love OM's schedule. Losing on the road to good teams in the noncon doesn't hurt you much -- and it prepares you for the SEC schedule. OM goes to UCF for 3 this year, to Louisville for 2, and to USM for 1. Play @ Arky St. Play us, Memphis, and USM at a neutral site. Had a team that's averaged a 50 RPI over the past 2 years in for the opening weekend, an improving Wright St in week 2, a traditionally pretty good Stetson program in week 4, 2 at home against a pretty good UAB team, etc... The only true pushovers on their whole schedule is a single SWAC game(Arkansas Pine Bluff) and UT Martin(if they are who they are expected to be)...

OM has 10 remaining games against teams with losing records after week 1. 3 of which are against a good Tennessee team that struggled in week 1.
MSU has 16 remaining games against teams with losing records in week 1. 3 of which are against that same Tennessee team...

UM has done a much better job of scheduling than we have over the last couple of years. There is no denying that.

[Todd4State]

Yep. I love OM's schedule. Losing on the road to good teams in the noncon doesn't hurt you much -- and it prepares you for the SEC schedule. OM goes to UCF for 3 this year, to Louisville for 2, and to USM for 1. Play @ Arky St. Play us, Memphis, and USM at a neutral site. Had a team that's averaged a 50 RPI over the past 2 years in for the opening weekend, an improving Wright St in week 2, a traditionally pretty good Stetson program in week 4, 2 at home against a pretty good UAB team, etc... The only true pushovers on their whole schedule is a single SWAC game(Arkansas Pine Bluff) and UT Martin(if they are who they are expected to be)...


OM has 10 remaining games against teams with losing records after week 1. 3 of which are against a good Tennessee team that struggled in week 1.
MSU has 16 remaining games against teams with losing records in week 1. 3 of which are against that same Tennessee team...

That's over scheduling IMO. We should play three weeks of decent mid majors in Starkville and then either an elite tournament or a home/home with a power five team in week four. Fill the midweek with neutral site games in Jackson, Biloxi, Memphis, NOLA, and Mobile and the SWAC three.

[Todd4State]

Better to lose to great teams at neutral sites than to beat terrible teams at home... If Cohen is placing blame for last season on the trip to Arizona, he's misplacing it. The real RPI daggers came from Holy Cross inside Dudy Noble...

Holy Cross was worse, but how do we play Arizona and then they are a 100-150 RPI team? That sucked.

[smootness]

Better to lose to great teams at neutral sites than to beat terrible teams at home... If Cohen is placing blame for last season on the trip to Arizona, he's misplacing it. The real RPI daggers came from Holy Cross inside Dudy Noble...

But the point still stands that as long as you essentially sweep your bad competition and have some quality in your OOC, you're fine. The reason Arkansas didn't host wasn't just that they scheduled bad teams non-conference; it's that they lost too many of those games.

Same with Holy Cross last year. If we just don't win the games we lost against bad teams, we would have been fine. For the most part, if you win 40+ as an SEC team with a good SEC record, you're likely to host.

[Coach34]

Our SEC schedule will cure all. It really doesnt matter who we play OOC. We certainly need to play another major P5 school OOC every year- but a few SWAC schools doesnt mean shit. We need to win 19-20 SEC games and that shit wont ever matter

We were also the 5th seed in the SEC Tourney. You have to be in the top 4 to have a real shot to host. The SEC is going to get 4 hosts year in and year out- OOC be damned

[engie]

That's over scheduling IMO. We should play three weeks of decent mid majors in Starkville and then either an elite tournament or a home/home with a power five team in week four. Fill the midweek with neutral site games in Jackson, Biloxi, Memphis, NOLA, and Mobile and the SWAC three.

Not really any such thing as overscheduling when 2/3 of the formula that has been making all of the decisions on host sites for awhile now is SOS. It's only 1/3 based on the games you actually win. Also, huge going on the road for good RPI and winnable games. Takes 2 wins at home to accomplish the same thing as 1 road win in terms of RPI. 2 road losses = 1 home loss as well.

8 of the top 10 RPIs last year had top 20 SOS's. Only exceptions were ULL and Indiana. Then you had teams like Kentucky and Bama that finished well ahead of us in RPI and clearly weren't as good as us because they scheduled better...

[messageboardsuperhero]

No, it was because otherwise we were going to have only two weekends of pre-SEC home games and then the NOLA tournament pulled the plug on us. We should have just played Houston and pulled the plug on NOLA in hindsight.

There aren't enough weekends to please what all of our fans want. We can't play in a ton of tournaments, play a bunch of Saturday double headers, play a bunch of power five teams on the road without running out of spots on the schedule quickly. Oh- and get young guys playing time and figure out our lineup.

There is a much better way to do this than what we're doing right now. If our fans have a problem with us not playing 20+ consecutive home games in a season, then they just need to get over it and understand that this is the direction college baseball is moving.

We should play a weekend away from DNF in February/early March every year. There's really no excuse for us not to. And when we do play in DNF, we should play teams that at the very least have a pulse. Playing two weekend home games against Alabama A&M is a joke. Arizona and San Diego are good teams to play, even though SD doesn't look so great this year. Western Carolina was a good team to bring in last year, even though that was last minute. Mercer, Arkansas State, South Alabama, etc. would all be decent opponents to play in nonconference. There are enough solid OOC teams in our area to be playing some of the garbage teams we're playing this year- the mid-major teams I mentioned above are good enough to test us but we should still be able to experiment some while playing them.

Playing multiple games against SWAC teams and other bad teams is going to kill our RPI this year. We are shooting ourselves in the foot with this schedule.

[engie]

We were also the 5th seed in the SEC Tourney. You have to be in the top 4 to have a real shot to host. The SEC is going to get 4 hosts year in and year out- OOC be damned

Arkansas was the 3-seed in 2013. No host. We were the 5-seed that year. We played the #2 SOS in the country.

[messageboardsuperhero]

We were also the 5th seed in the SEC Tourney. You have to be in the top 4 to have a real shot to host. The SEC is going to get 4 hosts year in and year out- OOC be damned

We were 5th seed in 2013 and also a pretty comfortable host. The ACC had five hosts last year.

Compared to RPI and overall body of work, the committee cares very little about conference finish or giving a fair amount of host sites to each conference- and I think that's the way it should be. OOC counts for a lot more than you think it does.

[messageboardsuperhero]

Arkansas was the 3-seed in 2013. No host. We were the 5-seed that year...

Beat me to it.

[Todd4State]

Not really any such thing as overscheduling when 2/3 of the formula that has been making all of the decisions on host sites for awhile now is SOS. It's only 1/3 based on the games you actually win. Also, huge going on the road for good RPI and winnable games. Takes 2 wins at home to accomplish the same thing as 1 road win in terms of RPI. 2 road losses = 1 home loss as well.

8 of the top 10 RPIs last year had top 20 SOS's. Only exceptions were ULL and Indiana. Then you had teams like Kentucky and Bama that finished well ahead of us in RPI and clearly weren't as good as us because they scheduled better...

We've been scheduling like what I suggested and hosted with no problems two years ago. Ole Miss has scheduled the way you are talking about and has hosted the exact same amount of times we have the past five years. The bottom line is win your OOC games no matter how you schedule.

[messageboardsuperhero]

That's over scheduling IMO. We should play three weeks of decent mid majors in Starkville and then either an elite tournament or a home/home with a power five team in week four. Fill the midweek with neutral site games in Jackson, Biloxi, Memphis, NOLA, and Mobile and the SWAC three.

This is a pretty decent scheduling model- at least it's way better than what we have this year.

I just want us to travel a little more and replace the 200+ RPI games with 75-125 RPI teams.

[Coach34]

I understand that. But year in and year out- the top 4 seeds are going to host. UPig had some absolute awful losses OOC in 2013 and thats why they didnt host- not because their OOC was weak

[engie]

We were 5th seed in 2013 and also a pretty comfortable host. The ACC had five hosts last year.

Compared to RPI and overall body of work, the committee cares very little about conference finish or giving a fair amount of host sites to each conference- and I think that's the way it should be. OOC counts for a lot more than you think it does.

Especially now that all conference schedules aren't created even close to equal. The "SEC Championship" in the regular season in baseball is a joke post-expansion. You miss half the other division every year. Luck of that draw is what is going to decide the champion much moreso than the actual quality of the team...

[smootness]

But again, Arkansas' problem wasn't their schedule alone...it's that they lost to a bunch of those teams. We had a much tougher schedule, but we also had a better record. That's an easy decision.

I would like to see us up the difficulty in the schedule some, but we didn't host last year because we lost to too many bad teams, not just because we played them. You could make a case that turning our bad losses into good losses might have gotten us in as a host, but I'm not so sure about that. If you do well in the SEC and your OOC record is very good, you're going to host almost every time.

The only time a handful of games against bad competition is going to come into play is if your OOC record isn't very good, and the SOS isn't good enough to justify hosting.

[messageboardsuperhero]

I understand that. But year in and year out- the top 4 seeds are going to host. UPig had some absolute awful losses OOC in 2013 and thats why they didnt host- not because their OOC was weak

The premise is that a better schedule is more forgiving to your RPI when you inevitably do lose some games- which as you know ALWAYS happens in baseball. Losing a home game to Holy Cross is far worse than losing a neutral site game to Houston in the Minute Maid Classic... Hell, LOSING a neutral site game to Houston probably is better for our RPI most years more than WINNING a home game against Holy Cross.

Understanding the RPI formula and using it in scheduling is something we need to learn how to do- and it's something that UM and Vandy in particular have been very good at over the past few years. It is crucial if you are a team on the hosting bubble, moreso than if you are a team that is clearly a host caliber team like we were in 2013.

[engie]

We've been scheduling like what I suggested and hosted with no problems two years ago. Ole Miss has scheduled the way you are talking about and has hosted the exact same amount of times we have the past five years. The bottom line is win your OOC games no matter how you schedule.

Two years ago we were blessed with teams being better than they were supposed to be in the noncon. And that schedule had a 115 intended noncon SOS. Still a very far cry from the 192 of this season. And that team went 24-2 in the nonconference without a single sub-50 RPI loss on the season -- hardly something we can set as an expectation going forward...

[engie]

The premise is that a better schedule is more forgiving to your RPI. Losing a home game to Holy Cross is far worse than losing a neutral site game to Houston in the Minute Maid Classic... Hell, LOSING a neutral site game to Houston probably is better for our RPI most years more than WINNING a home game against Holy Cross.

Understanding the RPI formula and using it in scheduling is something we need to learn how to do- and it's something that UM and Vandy in particular have been very good at over the past few years. It is crucial if you are a team on the hosting bubble, moreso than if you are a team that is clearly a host caliber team like we were in 2013.

Exactly...

[maroonmania]

There is a much better way to do this than what we're doing right now. If our fans have a problem with us not playing 20+ consecutive home games in a season, then they just need to get over it and understand that this is the direction college baseball is moving.

We should play a weekend away from DNF in February/early March every year. There's really no excuse for us not to. And when we do play in DNF, we should play teams that at the very least have a pulse. Playing two weekend home games against Alabama A&M is a joke. Arizona and San Diego are good teams to play, even though SD doesn't look so great this year. Western Carolina was a good team to bring in last year, even though that was last minute. Mercer, Arkansas State, South Alabama, etc. would all be decent opponents to play in nonconference. There are enough solid OOC teams in our area to be playing some of the garbage teams we're playing this year- the mid-major teams I mentioned above are good enough to test us but we should still be able to experiment some while playing them.

Playing multiple games against SWAC teams and other bad teams is going to kill our RPI this year. We are shooting ourselves in the foot with this schedule.

I agree that if we are doing this lousy scheduling for the fans then that is stupid. What MSU fan is going to make a stink about one or even two less weekends to freeze your butt off at DNF during February and early March. I doubt very many ESPECIALLY if it gives us a better chance to have an NCAA host spot for EXTRA games at DNF that actually mean something.

[messageboardsuperhero]

Two years ago we were blessed with teams being better than they were supposed to be in the noncon. And that schedule had a 115 intended noncon SOS. Still a very far cry from the 192 of this season. And that team went 24-2 in the nonconference without a single sub-50 RPI loss on the season -- hardly something we can set as an expectation going forward...

Yeah, the way the 2013 schedule set up was kind of an anomaly in that some teams ended up being better than usual and we didn't have a single bad loss. It's not exactly a template we should use for future scheduling.

[War Machine Dawg]

Everyone is also ignoring the comments from the selection committee saying they are trying to send a message to "Southern" teams about playing more road games against quality OOC opponents. More home games against the SWAC is pretty much giving the selection committee the bird. Pulling out of the MMC was a truly terrible decision. If we are truly the elite program we claim to be, then we shouldn't be afraid to go play in elite tournaments no matter how young we are. And if we aren't willing to go play top competition in OOC, then Cohen is talking out of both sides of his mouth. Don't claim to be an elite program if you want to load up the OOC with SWAC schools.

[engie]

But again, Arkansas' problem wasn't their schedule alone...it's that they lost to a bunch of those teams. We had a much tougher schedule, but we also had a better record. That's an easy decision.

I would like to see us up the difficulty in the schedule some, but we didn't host last year because we lost to too many bad teams, not just because we played them. You could make a case that turning our bad losses into good losses might have gotten us in as a host, but I'm not so sure about that. If you do well in the SEC and your OOC record is very good, you're going to host almost every time.

The only time a handful of games against bad competition is going to come into play is if your OOC record isn't very good, and the SOS isn't good enough to justify hosting.

Naturally -- if you win all of your games -- your SOS doesn't matter. That's how ULL was a national seed last year in spite of a #87 SOS. The purpose in smarter RPI scheduling is to increase your margin for error. We've scheduled our margin for error into being razor thin this year...

[messageboardsuperhero]

I agree that if we are doing this lousy scheduling for the fans then that is stupid. What MSU fan is going to make a stink about one or even two less weekends to freeze your butt off at DNF during February and early March. I doubt very many ESPECIALLY if it gives us a better chance to have an NCAA host spot for EXTRA games at DNF that actually mean something.

Yes on all counts. I'd much rather not play Alabama A&M in the freezing cold in February if it means increasing our chances of playing meaningful games here in May.

Now getting some of our fans to understand this concept and not flipping out when we don't play 20+ game at DNF to start the season... Some of those people still think a successful schedule means playing as many home games as possible at any cost.

[smootness]

Naturally -- if you win all of your games -- your SOS doesn't matter. That's how ULL was a national seed last year in spite of a #87 SOS. The purpose in smarter RPI scheduling is to increase your margin for error. We've scheduled our margin for error into being razor thin this year...

I agree with you. I'd rather have an expected OOC SOS of about 100-120 or so than what we have this year...but I'd also rather have 100-120 than what Ole Miss is doing as well.

We should also make some decisions based on who we're playing in the SEC that year. And we may have done that this year to some degree. We don't play Vandy, but we play the next 4 toughest teams from the East, and it will end up being a very good overall SOS no matter what. No Georgia or Missouri on the schedule, and there really should be no bad SEC teams that we're playing this year to bring it down outside of maybe Auburn.

The fact that we canceled the MVSU game shows that Cohen understands the argument; he's obviously factoring more than simply potential RPI into the equation when scheduling. I mean, regardless of the fact that we scheduled it, I think Cohen canceling it is a very good sign for the team this year. I think Cohen loved what he saw this past weekend and is trying to do whatever possible now to improve our chances to host or potentially get a national seed.

[chef dixon]

When you're scoring 16 and 19 runs on shitty OOC opponents at least you are likely beating their ass.

[HSVDawg]

Why did we pull out of the Houston tournament? Seems that I remember a year or two ago when it was scheduled that everyone was excited due to it being one of the more prestigious early season tournaments. What gives?

[State82]

Excellent points in this thread all around. Hence the reason this is probably the best message board anywhere you will find when it comes to college baseball (as far as boards dedicated to particular schools). It also brings up something I have said many times over the years regarding a lot of folks' attitudes regarding the ooc, pre-SEC schedule. I have heard many comments that are flippant about this part of the schedule and that have the attitude of " wake me up when conference play starts". Well, we found out how that works out last year. We better dang well be concerned with every game we play or we will get bit in a hurry. Especially when it is the likes of Holy Cross or some semblance thereof.

[Coach34]

Naturally -- if you win all of your games -- your SOS doesn't matter. That's how ULL was a national seed last year in spite of a #87 SOS. The purpose in smarter RPI scheduling is to increase your margin for error. We've scheduled our margin for error into being razor thin this year...

ok- but with our team- we should be fine. aGAIN- it comes down to taking care of bidness.

[HoopsDawg]

ok- but with our team- we should be fine. aGAIN- it comes down to taking care of bidness.

Coach, it looks like you are going to have to refrain from posting on anything but football. First Britton and now your takes in this thread.

[Coach34]

my takes in this thread are dead on- and you know it. Dont ****ing lose in the OOC and there's not a problem. Hell, I'm all for playing UCLA one of the early weekends- but there is nothing wrong with playing some doorknobs and racking up some wins before the SEC schedule.

aGAIN- UPig didnt host in 2013 because they had 5-6 bad OOC losses. Not because of a weak schedule. If they had played a weaker schedule- they would have hosted and not taken the bad RPI hits with the losses. This shit aint hard

[Todd4State]

LSU is a good example of how I think we should schedule. Two lower level power five schools to start off with and then week four they have the tournament in Houston.

[engie]

aGAIN- UPig didnt host in 2013 because they had 5-6 bad OOC losses. Not because of a weak schedule. If they had played a weaker schedule- they would have hosted and not taken the bad RPI hits with the losses. This shit aint hard

So, Stansbury should have scheduled weaker so he could win more and be seeded higher in the NCAAs is what your saying?

It's funny how you are now arguing a complete 180 from the position you argued your ass off about for years and years and years. Yes, baseball is the same exact RPI formula with a slightly different home/road weighting...

[messageboardsuperhero]

my takes in this thread are dead on- and you know it. Dont ****ing lose in the OOC and there's not a problem. Hell, I'm all for playing UCLA one of the early weekends- but there is nothing wrong with playing some doorknobs and racking up some wins before the SEC schedule.

aGAIN- UPig didnt host in 2013 because they had 5-6 bad OOC losses. Not because of a weak schedule. If they had played a weaker schedule- they would have hosted and not taken the bad RPI hits with the losses. This shit aint hard

This isn't realistic though... 2013 was an anomaly for us in that we only lost two OOC games, and they were to a top 50 team. You lose games in baseball you're supposed to win. That's just a fact. It's better for us RPI-wise to go 18-8 in OOC play while playing a solid schedule vs. going 21-5 and losing a couple of home games to Holy Cross type teams. You can't expect your team to not drop a few... That shit happens.

ETA: And no Arkansas did not have 5-6 bad losses. They had two +200 RPI losses. TWO. They only had four total losses against 100+ RPI teams- two were the ones I just mentioned, one of them was to 124 Tennessee, and the other was to 106 Gonzaga. So realistically, they only had two bad losses all season.

Arkansas ****ed themselves with their schedule, and to avoid the same fate, we can't afford ONE SINGLE bad loss. The schedule we play gives us no margin for error. So yeah, it's technically true that if we don't lose to a single bad team we'll be okay- but if we played better teams, we could drop a few games and be okay. You can't expect us to be perfect... That's why we should build cushion with our schedule.

[Coach34]

So, Stansbury should have scheduled weaker so he could win more and be seeded higher in the NCAAs is what your saying?

It's funny how you are now arguing a complete 180 from the position you argued your ass off about for years and years and years. Yes, baseball is the same exact RPI formula with a slightly different home/road weighting...

Was Stands handling business in the OOC or did he always have losses that killed him? It was the wtf losses every year that killed the bubble. Plus, as you so eloquently pointed out- only 1 time in his last 7-8 years did we go better than 9-7. That's not handling SEC business either. C'mon Engie- you're better than that.

[Coach34]

This isn't realistic though... 2013 was an anomaly for us in that we only lost two OOC games, and they were to a top 50 team. You lose games in baseball you're supposed to win. That's just a fact. It's better for us RPI-wise to go 18-8 in OOC play while playing a solid schedule vs. going 21-5 and losing a couple of home games to Holy Cross type teams. You can't expect your team to not drop a few... That shit happens.

ETA: And no Arkansas did not have 5-6 bad losses. They had two +200 RPI losses. TWO. They only had four total losses against 100+ RPI teams- two were the ones I just mentioned, one of them was to 124 Tennessee, and the other was to 106 Gonzaga. So realistically, they only had two bad losses all season.

Arkansas ****ed themselves with their schedule, and to avoid the same fate, we can't afford ONE SINGLE bad loss. The schedule we play gives us no margin for error. So yeah, it's technically true that if we don't lose to a single bad team we'll be okay- but if we played better teams, we could drop a few games and be okay. You can't expect us to be perfect... That's why we should build cushion with our schedule.

They lost to :

W. Illinois
Gonzaga
Pacific
New Mexico
Nebraska twice

You cant lose some of those games and expect to host- especially when you are losing to other good teams OOC- thats the bottom line.

[engie]

Was Stands handling business in the OOC or did he always have losses that killed him? It was the wtf losses every year that killed the bubble. Plus, as you so eloquently pointed out- only 1 time in his last 7-8 years did we go better than 9-7. That's not handling SEC business either. C'mon Engie- you're better than that.

So, you are saying Stansbury should have scheduled weaker then?

You are still dancing on a total 180* turn from your basketball argument. That you beat everyone over the head with for as long as I've been on these message boards. A sport in which you totally freaked out about the nonconference schedule. Constantly. I realize that you've backed yourself into a corner with this (new, completely different) position -- but at the end of the day, even though you are sharp enough to argue the new position you are taking, I don't even think you can actually talk yourself into believing it.

Only one time in 11 years has the baseball team had a better conference WP than 9-7 provides. That team went on the road to Louisiana Lafayette last year.

[messageboardsuperhero]

They lost to :

W. Illinois
Gonzaga
Pacific
New Mexico
Nebraska twice

You cant lose some of those games and expect to host- especially when you are losing to other good teams OOC- thats the bottom line.

We're talking about bad losses, not total OOC losses.

Western Illinois and Pacific had RPIs of 258 and 245, respectively- these are bad losses.

Gonzaga and New Mexico had RPIs of 106 and 60, respectively- these are NOT bad losses and don't hurt your RPI too much at all. Arkansas also lost to Nebraska, who had an RPI of 33, twice on the road- these two games at Nebraska weren't even remotely considered bad losses and may have actually HELPED Arkansas's RPI to a small extent.

Arkansas didn't screw themselves by losing to New Mexico and Nebraska twice- they screwed themselves by scheduling 10 OOC teams with RPIs of 245+. That is a SOS KILLER- and since SOS makes up 2/3 of RPI, it is also an RPI killer. Scheduling that many of those teams is what statistically hurt their RPI much more than losing a couple of road games @ #33 Nebraska, and that is what I'm worried about with us this year. There are 8-9 teams currently on our schedule who probably will have RPIs of 200+, and God forbid if we lose a single one of those games, then we'd be ****ed. What I want us to do is schedule better in the future so that when we do inevitably drop a few games, they don't kill us.

OOC scheduling matters a lot when it comes to hosting. I don't really see how you can even attempt to argue against that when the RPI formula is almost 70% made up of who you play and where you play them- and RPI is the tool that the committee uses the most by far when making hosting decisions.

[Coach34]

I wanted Stands to schedule tougher because it would have made him or broken him. He kept playing weak schedules and then doing just enough in the SEC to get to the bubble. Most State fans would whine and complain about our loss in the SEC Tourney- but forget all the bad losses earlier in the year that put us in the position we were in.

We arent in that spot in baseball. And with a team depending on lots of new arms and half of a new position line-up- our schedule is fine. We just need to take care of business. A weaker schedule is only a problem when you have a few wtf losses- and if you are having those- you werent going to do any better vs a tougher schedule anyway.

[War Machine Dawg]

We're talking about bad losses, not total OOC losses.

Western Illinois and Pacific had RPIs of 258 and 245, respectively- these are bad losses.

Gonzaga and New Mexico had RPIs of 106 and 60, respectively- these are NOT bad losses and don't hurt your RPI too much at all. Arkansas also lost to Nebraska, who had an RPI of 33, twice on the road- these two games at Nebraska weren't even remotely considered bad losses and may have actually HELPED Arkansas's RPI to a small extent.

Arkansas didn't screw themselves by losing to New Mexico and Nebraska twice- they screwed themselves by scheduling 10 OOC teams with RPIs of 245+. That is a SOS KILLER- and since SOS makes up 2/3 of RPI, it is also an RPI killer. Scheduling that many of those teams is what statistically hurt their RPI much more than losing a couple of road games @ #33 Nebraska, and that is what I'm worried about with us this year. There are 8-9 teams currently on our schedule who probably will have RPIs of 200+, and God forbid if we lose a single one of those games, then we'd be ****ed. What I want us to do is schedule better in the future so that when we do inevitably drop a few games, they don't kill us.

OOC scheduling matters a lot when it comes to hosting. I don't really see how you can even attempt to argue against that when the RPI formula is almost 70% made up of who you play and where you play them- and RPI is the tool that the committee uses the most by far when making hosting decisions.

Facts are stubborn things.

[smootness]

We're talking about bad losses, not total OOC losses.

Western Illinois and Pacific had RPIs of 258 and 245, respectively- these are bad losses.

Gonzaga and New Mexico had RPIs of 106 and 60, respectively- these are NOT bad losses and don't hurt your RPI too much at all. Arkansas also lost to Nebraska, who had an RPI of 33, twice on the road- these two games at Nebraska weren't even remotely considered bad losses and may have actually HELPED Arkansas's RPI to a small extent.

Arkansas didn't screw themselves by losing to New Mexico and Nebraska twice- they screwed themselves by scheduling 10 OOC teams with RPIs of 245+. That is a SOS KILLER- and since SOS makes up 2/3 of RPI, it is also an RPI killer. Scheduling that many of those teams is what statistically hurt their RPI much more than losing a couple of road games @ #33 Nebraska, and that is what I'm worried about with us this year. There are 8-9 teams currently on our schedule who probably will have RPIs of 200+, and God forbid if we lose a single one of those games, then we'd be ****ed. What I want us to do is schedule better in the future so that when we do inevitably drop a few games, they don't kill us.

OOC scheduling matters a lot when it comes to hosting. I don't really see how you can even attempt to argue against that when the RPI formula is almost 70% made up of who you play and where you play them- and RPI is the tool that the committee uses the most by far when making hosting decisions.

This is a good post, and I understand the point you guys are making. I'll concede that you're right, but I do want to point out again that it's the overall number of OOC games Arkansas lost that killed them that year. When you lose that many games, your schedule strength better be incredible.

The committee doesn't simply look at your RPI. They're going to look at your OOC record and your OOC SOS. If you only lose 2-3 OOC games, it doesn't matter. If you lose as many as Arkansas did that year, it does. Even with an OOC SOS of 120 or so, if you lose as many OOC games as Arkansas did, you're still screwed.

But ultimately, scheduling a little better does give you a little more wiggle room, so I agree that we should probably schedule a little better.