The only bball thread on the front page is Coach34's 'beat a dead Stansbury' post'?

[MadDawg]

Didn't we win a game this weekend? A road game at that?

[msstate7]

Yep. Wasn't a good team, but it was a good win. Let's get another thurs to ruin om's season and get to .500 (6-7 in sec)

[DawgHouseUnited]

Also interesting that I didn't see a thread mention of the airplane incident. Maybe been covered somewhere and I just didn't see it though.

[TheRef]

Also interesting that I didn't see a thread mention of the airplane incident. Maybe been covered somewhere and I just didn't see it though.

I mentioned it....also, the company we use to charter from is about to be shut down by the USDOT.

http://maroonandwhitenation.com/2015/02/16/airline-used-missouri-trip-fire-feds/

[sleepy dawg]

I think it's pretty safe to say that everyone is just really glad baseball is here. At this point, I'm just tired of talking about basketball. I'm glad we're improving and all, but we've beat the shit out of that horse.

[DawgHouseUnited]

I mentioned it....also, the company we use to charter from is about to be shut down by the USDOT.

http://maroonandwhitenation.com/2015/02/16/airline-used-missouri-trip-fire-feds/

Yikes. Thanks for the info Ref! Isn't that the second accident we've had with transportation lately? Wasn't it a bus last time?

[TheRef]

Yikes. Thanks for the info Ref! Isn't that the second accident we've had with transportation lately? Wasn't it a bus last time?

Correct....one of the buses following the Egg Bowl couldn't hit the brakes fast enough and had a rear-ender. Luckily, it was only full of media and athletic department staff, none of the players. They got another bus and went back to campus safely, however the driver got into another wreck after dropping everyone off. I have a feeling he won't be driving for MSU anymore since he had two wrecks in one night.

[quickstrike2]

I think it's pretty safe to say that everyone is just really glad baseball is here. At this point, I'm just tired of talking about basketball. I'm glad we're improving and all, but we've beat the shit out of that horse.

I agree with this. The sour taste of some bad losses early in the season, along with losing to Alabama is still lingering with me. Having said that, I am happy we beat Missouri, but I'm not going to get giddy over much at this point regarding basketball. Baseball is the talking point now, and deservedly so.

[DawgHouseUnited]

Correct....one of the buses following the Egg Bowl couldn't hit the brakes fast enough and had a rear-ender. Luckily, it was only full of media and athletic department staff, none of the players. They got another bus and went back to campus safely, however the driver got into another wreck after dropping everyone off. I have a feeling he won't be driving for MSU anymore since he had two wrecks in one night.

Definitely an odd year for athletic transportation...

[Saltydog]

big accomplishment for a 3rd year coach..........

[msstate7]

big accomplishment for a 3rd year coach..........

While I agree it isn't a big accomplishment, most of you give no credit for the other 4 sec wins either. Ray is in a cant win with most here

I'll add a little more...

When we win, it's we won in spite of coaching even though the same people say we have no talent.

[quickstrike2]

[QUOTE=msstate7;333606]While I agree it isn't a big accomplishment, most of you give no credit for the other 4 sec wins either. Ray is in a cant win with most here

Well, I do give him credit for his SEC wins. However, I give him more credit for his bad and really bad losses (Upstate, McNease, and Alabama minus some starters.) Ray could win with me, but when looking at it as fair as I can, he simply has not won with me. I would fire him, but I know that's not going to happen.

[Coach007]

Yeah.... Gotta love it when a person has to lie to get people on his side. It's a great character trait. High level of integrity.

[msstate7]

[QUOTE=msstate7;333606]While I agree it isn't a big accomplishment, most of you give no credit for the other 4 sec wins either. Ray is in a cant win with most here

Well, I do give him credit for his SEC wins. However, I give him more credit for his bad and really bad losses (Upstate, McNease, and Alabama minus some starters.) Ray could win with me, but when looking at it as fair as I can, he simply has not won with me. I would fire him, but I know that's not going to happen.

I'm certainly not sold on ray. I was all for firing him before we showed some spark in sec play. Ray has picked up recruiting. I'm still very much in doubt that he can lead us where we need to be. That said he's gonna be back. Why just keep bashing the guy? Let this season and next play out. If he fails, he'll be gone. Until then though we should try to help him some. If your a recruit and read these boards, would you come here? I just think we should back off him some. He won Saturday, yet the bashing continues. He did what he was supposed to say. Why rip him for that?

/soapbox

[Coach34]

Yeah.... Gotta love it when a person has to lie to get people on his side. It's a great character trait. High level of integrity.

Ok- one last chance buddy. Don't call me a lair again.

If you want to point out something you think I'm wrong about- feel free and back up your point. Otherwise- stfu.

[Coach007]

Don't last chance me "buddy"! Lol, I have given examples. Each and everything. Deal with the Rodney Hood lie, then we can move on from there. You know, the ills of the program that we had vs what we have or don't have now.

[Coach34]

There is no Hood lie. I quoted an article with him and his dad. If you refuse to accept it? That's on you

[Coach34]

http://cdispatch.com/sports/article.asp?aid=17665#ixzz2vVwWlS8N

[codeDawg]

While I agree it isn't a big accomplishment, most of you give no credit for the other 4 sec wins either. Ray is in a cant win with most here

I'll add a little more...

When we win, it's we won in spite of coaching even though the same people say we have no talent.

Hard to credit coaching when you barely get 40 on Arkansas, rank 231 in offensive efficiency, rank 320 out of 341 in turnover margin, on and on. These are not just areas we need to improve in, they are areas that are worse than a huge number of exceptionally bad teams.

[Coach007]

http://cdispatch.com/sports/article.asp?aid=17665#ixzz2vVwWlS8N


Not a single word in that article states he was leaving regardless of what happened. Nothing. He did not give a reason on why in that article. However, he did in the link I provided.

Why not just take the guy at HIS WORD in why he transferred instead of suggesting some how that your link gives a reason? Why claim that your article is a revelation into what was going on? Are we to read between the lines to some sort of message that you want to be there.... Do I need a decoder ring? What box of cereal can I find that in?

[msstate7]

Hard to credit coaching when you barely get 40 on Arkansas, rank 231 in offensive efficiency, rank 320 out of 341 in turnover margin, on and on. These are not just areas we need to improve in, they are areas that are worse than a huge number of exceptionally bad teams.

Arent we 5th in the sec in points allowed? That must be something coaching isnt responsible for

[Coach34]

Because of what the poster in the other thread mentioned? Hood trying to get out of his LOI? Rumors of him wanting out in Feb and looking for other options? You do realize the word was out about Hood not returning even before Stands was let go right?

[codeDawg]

Arent we 5th in the sec in points allowed? That must be something coaching isnt responsible for

Wow. We aren't the worst in the NCAA in something. Great job Ray! Have an extension.

[Liverpooldawg]

nevermind

[msstate7]

Wow. We aren't the worst in the NCAA in something. Great job Ray! Have an extension.

This is your patented response.

We won a game sat and Sunday morning you start a thread about how terrible we are. You know if we had coach k sat the win wouldnt have counted for any more than ray's did.

Again, I'm certainly on the fence with ray. Tues night ray deserved criticism. He didn't for a win on Saturday

[Liverpooldawg]

My stance on Ray right now is wait and see. After the early losses I wanted him gone. To me in the third year of this project he needs to finish .500 or better to get another year. It didn't look like he had a snowball's chance a month ago. The recent wins get him in reach of that mark. We will see.

[codeDawg]

This is your patented response.

We won a game sat and Sunday morning you start a thread about how terrible we are. You know if we had coach k sat the win wouldnt have counted for any more than ray's did.

Again, I'm certainly on the fence with ray. Tues night ray deserved criticism. He didn't for a win on Saturday

Well, you can point out all the corn in the turd you like, but I'm still not going to call it cornbread.

[Coach007]

Because of what the poster in the other thread mentioned? Hood trying to get out of his LOI? Rumors of him wanting out in Feb and looking for other options? You do realize the word was out about Hood not returning even before Stands was let go right?

The article you posted said nothing of his reasons. Not one word of that article mentions a reason.

Hood, himself, stated why he transferred. End of that lie.

Second lie in the hood statement is the rumor. Nowhere in your article does it state a time. It does not say that in February. In fact, it does flat out state that he came home for a weekend. That press release was dated in April.... Jan, February, March, April. Stansbury left in March.

[TheDogFather]

While I agree it isn't a big accomplishment, most of you give no credit for the other 4 sec wins either. Ray is in a cant win with most here

I'll add a little more...

When we win, it's we won in spite of coaching even though the same people say we have no talent.

People don't have to say much. Performances have said enough. Most of the talking is done by those trying to prop up a broken program by exaggerating what little success has been seen. Also by starting threads about how Stansbury sucks and anyone who disagrees sucks too.

[mstatefan91]

If you can't see improvement then you're willingly blind. The team has improved despite a lot of adversity including injuries, lack of fan support... etc.

Is this where we want our program to stay? No

Do we want to be an NCAA tournament contender again? Yes

Is Ray the answer? Yet to be seen

[msstate7]

Also by starting threads about how Stansbury sucks and anyone who disagrees sucks too.

Don't you do the same thing except plug ray's name in for stansbury?

[Coach007]

Don't you do the same thing except plug ray's name in for stansbury?

Actually, no. Ray's work stands on its own, for better or worse.

[tcdog70]

http://cdispatch.com/sports/article.asp?aid=17665#ixzz2vVwWlS8N

The pitiful Comercial Disgrace. That is your source? You might as well have linked the National Enquirer with an article about Bigfoot. But you discount an article where out of Rodney's mouth he said his coach left , that is the reason.

[tcdog70]

Actually, no. Ray's work stands on its own, for better or worse.

Not really. Until Stans recruits leave we have not the true shittyness of Rick Ray. Out of the 77 points last game Stans boys scored 56.

[quickstrike2]

[QUOTE=quickstrike2;333611]

I'm certainly not sold on ray. I was all for firing him before we showed some spark in sec play. Ray has picked up recruiting. I'm still very much in doubt that he can lead us where we need to be. That said he's gonna be back. Why just keep bashing the guy? Let this season and next play out. If he fails, he'll be gone. Until then though we should try to help him some. If your a recruit and read these boards, would you come here? I just think we should back off him some. He won Saturday, yet the bashing continues. He did what he was supposed to say. Why rip him for that?

/soapbox

I agree for the most part. I myself am not ripping him for the win, but I won't forget the home lose to Bama. I do support the program and would actually like Ray to turn this thing around and get us back to consistent competitiveness. I don't care who coaches the team, as long as we win.

[msstate7]

[QUOTE=msstate7;333616]

I agree for the most part. I myself am not ripping him for the win, but I won't forget the home lose to Bama. I do support the program and would actually like Ray to turn this thing around and get us back to consistent competitiveness. I don't care who coaches the team, as long as we win.

I agree

[Coach34]

Not really. Until Stans recruits leave we have not the true shittyness of Rick Ray. Out of the 77 points last game Stans boys scored 56.

The only player Stands ever coached on this team is Roq. The rest are Ray's boys. If you havent coached them for 1 second- they cant be yours

[TheDogFather]

Is Ray the answer? Yet to be seen

http://static.gamespot.com/uploads/original/1534/15341624/2398769-2816409325-lemmi.jpg

[tcdog70]

The only player Stands ever coached on this team is Roq. The rest are Ray's boys. If you havent coached them for 1 second- they cant be yours

shit what coaching have they gotten from Ray-not much. they don't know how to inbound the Ball. If their recruiting was left up to Ray they wouldn't be at State for Ray to Coach. But since you posted it , it must be gospel--Because Coach is the Bill Laimbeer of the message boards---right

[msstate7]

shit what coaching have they gotten from Ray-not much. they don't know how to inbound the Ball. If their recruiting was left up to Ray they wouldn't be at State for Ray to Coach. But since you posted it , it must be gospel--Because Coach is the Bill Laimbeer of the message boards---right

I'll give ray credit for one player anyway. Johnson was absolutely horrid when ray got here. Johnson is very serviceable now

[Dawg61]

I'll give ray credit for one player anyway. Johnson was absolutely horrid when ray got here. Johnson is very serviceable now

I'll give Ray credit for Ware too atleast partially. No way Ware has the same body transformation under Stansbury unless that's just all Ware's self motivation and then neither coach gets credit.

[mstatefan91]

http://static.gamespot.com/uploads/original/1534/15341624/2398769-2816409325-lemmi.jpg

Whatever. The team has improved. If there is no tournament bid (NIT at least) after next season then he needs to go.

[msstate7]

Whatever. The team has improved. If there is no tournament bid (NIT at least) after next season then he needs to go.

I agree.

[engie]

Not really. Until Stans recruits leave we have not the true shittyness of Rick Ray. Out of the 77 points last game Stans boys scored 56.

The only "Stans recruit" on this team is Roq Johnson -- who Ray has developed from surefire attrition candidate under Stans once he locked up Sword -- into a generally serviceable player. The 3 you are giving Stansbury credit for -- Thomas, Sword, and Ware -- all had the ability to walk away from their scholarship offer without issue or penalty and be immediately eligible wherever they wanted to go in the exact same way Josh Gray did. They didn't. The fact that Ray managed to keep them given everything that transpired makes them Ray recruits -- or at the very least MSU recruits.

[HoopsDawg]

The only "Stans recruit" on this team is Roq Johnson -- who Ray has developed from surefire attrition candidate under Stans once he locked up Sword -- into a generally serviceable player. The 3 you are giving Stansbury credit for -- Thomas, Sword, and Ware -- all had the ability to walk away from their scholarship offer without issue or penalty and be immediately eligible wherever they wanted to go in the exact same way Josh Gray did. They didn't. The fact that Ray managed to keep them given everything that transpired makes them Ray recruits -- or at the very least MSU recruits.

We released Gray of his scholarship. We obviously didn't make that proposal to the other 3 guys.

[engie]

We released Gray of his scholarship. We obviously didn't make that proposal to the other 3 guys.

And what makes Gray's situation any different than the other 3 guys? Nothing. They all had the opportunity to walk the exact same way that Gray did.

[HoopsDawg]

And what makes Gray's situation any different than the other 3 guys? Nothing. They all had the opportunity to walk the exact same way that Gray did.

Huge reach to give Ray credit for Sword, Thomas and Ware. Major reach. I bet Ray doesn't even take credit for signing them.

[engie]

Huge reach to give Ray credit for Sword, Thomas and Ware. Major reach. I bet Ray doesn't even take credit for signing them.

Pick a stance and stick with it. First -- you imply we ran off Gray and wouldn't let Sword, Thomas, and Ware leave. Then this.

Gray left. Totally free to do as he pleased. Signed with Texas Tech. The other 3 had that option. They knew they had that option. They watched one of their fellow signees follow through with that option. Yet, they decided to stick with MSU and Rick Ray. Ray may not get full credit for them -- as I already said "...or at the very least MSU recruits" -- but Stansbury doesn't get full credit for them either.

[Barking 13]

Well, you can point out all the corn in the turd you like, but I'm still not going to call it cornbread.

you owe me a keyboard and a sweet tea... lmao

[TheDogFather]

Whatever. The team has improved. If there is no tournament bid (NIT at least) after next season then he needs to go.

Yeah. That's the spirit. An NIT bid after four years.

[HoopsDawg]

Pick a stance and stick with it. First -- you imply we ran off Gray and wouldn't let Sword, Thomas, and Ware leave. Then this.

Gray left. Totally free to do as he pleased. Signed with Texas Tech. The other 3 had that option. They knew they had that option. They watched one of their fellow signees follow through with that option. Yet, they decided to stick with MSU and Rick Ray. Ray may not get full credit for them -- as I already said "...or at the very least MSU recruits" -- but Stansbury doesn't get full credit for them either.

Wordy Reach

[msstate7]

Yeah. That's the spirit. An NIT bid after four years.

Just curious... When would you have SS fire ray?

[engie]

Was required after your wordy agenda-skew.

[Homedawg]

Let me ask this of the Stan's guys, what were your expectations of him each and every year? Just curious.

[shannondawg]

That's stretching it a bit Eng.


The only "Stans recruit" on this team is Roq Johnson -- who Ray has developed from surefire attrition candidate under Stans once he locked up Sword -- into a generally serviceable player. The 3 you are giving Stansbury credit for -- Thomas, Sword, and Ware -- all had the ability to walk away from their scholarship offer without issue or penalty and be immediately eligible wherever they wanted to go in the exact same way Josh Gray did. They didn't. The fact that Ray managed to keep them given everything that transpired makes them Ray recruits -- or at the very least MSU recruits.

[bluelightstar]

Yeah. That's the spirit. An NIT bid after four years.

+1

[I seen it dawg]

Let me ask this of the Stan's guys, what were your expectations of him each and every year? Just curious.

This should be good...

[Homedawg]

This should be good...

Yea, I ask a question, an honest question and its like Bader-Ginsburg at the state of the Union.

[Liverpooldawg]

Let me ask this of the Stan's guys, what were your expectations of him each and every year? Just curious.

A winning record first and foremost. To be in contention for a NCAA bid till at least late in the season. That would have been the "expectation"

[msstate7]

Yeah. That's the spirit. An NIT bid after four years.

Good thing we didn't fire Richard Williams for just making the nit his 4th year.

RW's 1st year = 7-21 (3-15)
2nd year = 14-15 (6-12)
3rd year = 13-15 (7-11)
4th year = 16-14 (7-11) nit
5th year = 20-9 (13-5) ncaa

[Liverpooldawg]

Richard took over a program that hadn't been to the NCCA tourney but once and that had been over 20 years before. I was at MSU during the Bob Boyd years just prior to Richard. It was routine for Kentucky to have more fans than we did at the Hump when they came. UM and Alabama sometimes approached that. Richard took over a program that was dead and other than a few flutters hadn't had a heartbeat in years. Nobody cared. Richard got the job by default. We were paying off Emory Bellard's contract at the time and there was no money to go out and really get in the market. It was a different time and a different era.

[msstate7]

Richard took over a program that hadn't been to the NCCA tourney but once and that had been over 20 years before. I was at MSU during the Bob Boyd years just prior to Richard. It was routine for Kentucky to have more fans than we did at the Hump when they came. UM and Alabama sometimes approached that. Richard took over a program that was dead and other than a few flutters hadn't had a heartbeat in years. Nobody cared. Richard got the job by default. We were paying off Emory Bellard's contract at the time and there was no money to go out and really get in the market. It was a different time and a different era.

I was too young to remember those teams, but I have a hard time believing Williams' 1st roster was worse than ray's.

[Coach34]

Richard took over a program that hadn't been to the NCCA tourney but once and that had been over 20 years before. I was at MSU during the Bob Boyd years just prior to Richard. It was routine for Kentucky to have more fans than we did at the Hump when they came. UM and Alabama sometimes approached that. Richard took over a program that was dead and other than a few flutters hadn't had a heartbeat in years. Nobody cared. Richard got the job by default. We were paying off Emory Bellard's contract at the time and there was no money to go out and really get in the market. It was a different time and a different era.

It's not all that different considering what kind of roster Ray was left with and the stench around the program from Sidney.

It took Williams 5 years to get to the NCAA Tourney- and that was with a Sr team that he and Brady had recruited 4 years earlier.
It took Stands 4 years to make the NCAA's- and he was left with a very good roster that he had helped recruit when Williams resigned. Williams would have put that 1st team Stands had in the NCAA's had he been able to stay and coach it.

Rebuilds take time- especially when starting at Ground Zero like Ray did. Next year's roster will be better than this year's. Recruiting is getting better. We shall see.

[mstatefan91]

Yeah. That's the spirit. An NIT bid after four years.

Yeah that's the spirit. Let's just ignore the injuries, players kicked off because of off court issue, and total rebuild of the program.

:)

[Liverpooldawg]

It's not all that different considering what kind of roster Ray was left with and the stench around the program from Sidney.

It took Williams 5 years to get to the NCAA Tourney- and that was with a Sr team that he and Brady had recruited 4 years earlier.
It took Stands 4 years to make the NCAA's- and he was left with a very good roster that he had helped recruit when Williams resigned. Williams would have put that 1st team Stands had in the NCAA's had he been able to stay and coach it.

Rebuilds take time- especially when starting at Ground Zero like Ray did. Next year's roster will be better than this year's. Recruiting is getting better. We shall see.

The biggest differences were that nobody really cared, we had little to no money, and we hadn't really done anything other than one NIT first round exit in 20 years. His immediate predecessor was 55-87. Richard had to do a build, not a rebuild. Ray may have started with similar talent, although from what I have seen and I saw what Richard had, I think Ray had more. Ray certainly had more recent history to point to in recruiting than Richard did. I don't know how old you were at the time Richard took over but I'm old enough to have been there. The fans didn't really care and neither did the athletic department. Richard had LESS than no reputation too. I was rooming with a former player under Boyd at the time. He said Williams was a hardcase that didn't know much and we would never win under him. Richard had the harder job by a MILE.

[mstatefan91]

The biggest differences were that nobody really cared, we had little to no money, and we hadn't really done anything other than one NIT first round exit in 20 years. His immediate predecessor was 55-87. Richard had to do a build, not a rebuild. Ray may have started with similar talent, although from what I have seen and I saw what Richard had, I think Ray had more. Ray certainly had more recent history to point to in recruiting than Richard did. I don't know how old you were at the time Richard took over but I'm old enough to have been there. The fans didn't really care and neither did the athletic department. Richard had the harder job by a MILE.

Maybe he did. Maybe he didn't. Not as much stress when there are no expectations...

[Bully13]

too much stress? well bless yo haaht.

[Liverpooldawg]

Maybe he did. Maybe he didn't. Not as much stress when there are no expectations...

It was a different world. When Richard came in there were no expectations, with ALL that entails.

[mstatefan91]

too much stress? well bless yo haaht.
I'm saying that it's apples to oranges. I don't think the comparison works at all


It was a different world. When Richard came in there were no expectations, with ALL that entails.

See above

[Liverpooldawg]

Richard took over a program where nobody thought you could win big anymore. Ray took over one where people know it can be dome. That may raise expectations but it makes the actual job easier.

[mstatefan91]

Richard took over a program where nobody thought you could win big anymore. Ray took over one where people know it can be dome. That may raise expectations but it makes the actual job easier.

That's your opinion. I think if Ray comes in with a full roster and no expectations that we'd be further along right now (can't know for sure).

As it is, he came in with no roster and huge expectations with a lack of genuine support from the fan base. The fan base then acted all surprised when we didn't any games and blamed it on Ray instead of who it should have been blamed on. Now certain sectors of the fan base openly want him to fail which in itself is pretty shitty. But it doesn't just effect him. It effects the attitude of the team. Those guys are 18-22 years old and a large portion of the fan base wants to see them lose the rest of this season's games so that Ray will be gone.

It's a shit show that Richard never had to deal with. Again, I think it's apples to oranges.

[Liverpooldawg]

S
That's your opinion. I think if Ray comes in with a full roster and no expectations that we'd be further along right now (can't know for sure).

As it is, he came in with no roster and huge expectations with a lack of genuine support from the fan base. The fan base then acted all surprised when we didn't any games and blamed it on Ray instead of who it should have been blamed on. Now certain sectors of the fan base openly want him to fail which in itself is pretty shitty. But it doesn't just effect him. It effects the attitude of the team. Those guys are 18-22 years old and a large portion of the fan base wants to see them lose the rest of this season's games so that Ray will be gone.

It's a shit show that Richard never had to deal with. Again, I think it's apples to oranges.


A lot of that could apply to another recent coach of ours. The big difference between the support Richard got and what Ray gets is institutional support. When Richard came in there wasn't much. The fan support was about equal.

[Coach34]

Richard took over a program where nobody thought you could win big anymore. Ray took over one where people know it can be dome. That may raise expectations but it makes the actual job easier.

Whaaaaaaaaaat? Nothing about having a very divided fanbase, discipline and drug problems, injuries, and a shit roster he inherited plus a down couple of years in Mississippi HS basketball has made Ray's job easier.

[Dawg61]

That's your opinion. I think if Ray comes in with a full roster and no expectations that we'd be further along right now (can't know for sure).

As it is, he came in with no roster and huge expectations with a lack of genuine support from the fan base. The fan base then acted all surprised when we didn't any games and blamed it on Ray instead of who it should have been blamed on. Now certain sectors of the fan base openly want him to fail which in itself is pretty shitty. But it doesn't just effect him. It effects the attitude of the team. Those guys are 18-22 years old and a large portion of the fan base wants to see them lose the rest of this season's games so that Ray will be gone.

It's a shit show that Richard never had to deal with. Again, I think it's apples to oranges.

Nobody had "huge expectations" for Ray. Forty point beat downs and flying all the way to Hawaii with seven players tends to raise red flags though.
Nobody is actively rooting for Ray to lose out either. That's absurd.

[engie]

Nobody had "huge expectations" for Ray. Forty point beat downs and flying all the way to Hawaii with seven players tends to raise red flags though.
Nobody is actively rooting for Ray to lose out either. That's absurd.

Everyone that wants him gone right now, this year, are actively rooting for Ray to lose out -- and hoping he gets embarrassed at home on Thursday night. Otherwise, their position at this juncture is absurd after what's happened in the past 6 weeks.

Stansbury put us on that plane to Hawaii. Not Ray.

[Dawg61]

Everyone that wants him gone right now, this year, are actively rooting for Ray to lose out -- and hoping he gets embarrassed at home on Thursday night. Otherwise, their position at this juncture is absurd after what's happened in the past 6 weeks.

Stansbury put us on that plane to Hawaii. Not Ray.

Absurd logic. I want Ray gone this very second but I sure as shit am not rooting for MSU to lose EVER. That's ****ing ridiculous to imply that. It's petty as **** really.

Stansbury had been fired for nine ****ing months when Ray flew from MS to HI with 7 scholarship players. Ray had plenty of time to fill 13 scholarships and chose not to. Then he worked his players too hard and 2-4 got injured and then he kicked off two players. Ray gutted his own team and then cried for three seasons about it.

[engie]

No one believes you.

[Liverpooldawg]

Whaaaaaaaaaat? Nothing about having a very divided fanbase, discipline and drug problems, injuries, and a shit roster he inherited plus a down couple of years in Mississippi HS basketball has made Ray's job easier.

We pretty much didn't HAVE a fan base for basketball when Richard came in. That lasted a while after he got here too. I bought season tickets in the 6th row in 1989 one week before the season started. That was before I ever joined the Bulldig Club. They got so excited when I called to buy them. My guess is you are too young to remember the roster Richard inherited or you would have NEVER mention that in this context. His first team was horrible. If you think drugs weren't around then too you are deluding yourself.

[Liverpooldawg]

Everyone that wants him gone right now, this year, are actively rooting for Ray to lose out -- and hoping he gets embarrassed at home on Thursday night. Otherwise, their position at this juncture is absurd after what's happened in the past 6 weeks.

Stansbury put us on that plane to Hawaii. Not Ray.

That's absurd.

[Homedawg]

Absurd logic. I want Ray gone this very second but I sure as shit am not rooting for MSU to lose EVER. That's ****ing ridiculous to imply that. It's petty as **** really.

Stansbury had been fired for nine ****ing months when Ray flew from MS to HI with 7 scholarship players. Ray had plenty of time to fill 13 scholarships and chose not to. Then he worked his players too hard and 2-4 got injured and then he kicked off two players. Ray gutted his own team and then cried for three seasons about it.
He worked his players too hard???? God forbid a coach makes em work!! They got hurt. Injuries happen. They weren't playing smear the queer in the middle of the floor man. Come on.

[engie]

That's absurd.

So, you are pulling for our coach to win -- yet still in favor of firing him at 8-10 or 9-9 in the SEC? You think we're f'ing Kentucky -- or would otherwise be able to cherrypick a good hire after firing a coach under those improvement circumstances? Good Lord, the process of that search would be even worse than the last one.

There's a tremendous gap in logic on the Ray haters side that doesn't make a damn bit of sense. Pulling for him to win and still wanting to fire him this year is far more idiotic than wanting him to crash and burn so we can start over this year. But, like I already said, the vocal "Fire Ray" crowd denying that they want us to lose out are either extremely dumb -- or liars.

[Coach34]

Ray had to kick 2 guys off for failed drug tests during the SUMMER- there are no players to be had at that point but walk-ons. Then he lost 2 more after practice had started during the FALL SEMESTER. Then lost more once the season started. So no, there wasnt time to fill out a roster after that. That's 100% bullshit

[Dawg61]

He worked his players too hard???? God forbid a coach makes em work!! They got hurt. Injuries happen. They weren't playing smear the queer in the middle of the floor man. Come on.

Injuries have happened at a much higher rate than normal under Ray. He doesn't get a pass for that. This isn't Gene Hackman in Hoosiers. Ray can't be shooting off his own feet. He has to understand the importance of roster management and yet he STILL doesn't get it three years down the road. He's always been setting himself up for failure by not fully stocking his team up and by running his players too hard in practice to the point of injury. Although lately his team has been healthy so there is improvement there.

[Dawg61]

Ray had to kick 2 guys off for failed drug tests during the SUMMER- there are no players to be had at that point but walk-ons. Then he lost 2 more after practice had started during the FALL SEMESTER. Then lost more once the season started. So no, there wasnt time to fill out a roster after that. That's 100% bullshit

No what's bullshit is Ray knowing he's going to be Billy Badass with his team so he doesn't plan for that by stocking up fully BEFORE the summer starts. Ray knew he was going to be a hardass with his team. He knew he wasn't going to put up with any bullshit and that he'd be kicking off two to three players.

[Dawg61]

So, you are pulling for our coach to win -- yet still in favor of firing him at 8-10 or 9-9 in the SEC? You think we're f'ing Kentucky -- or would otherwise be able to cherrypick a good hire after firing a coach under those improvement circumstances? Good Lord, the process of that search would be even worse than the last one.

There's a tremendous gap in logic on the Ray haters side that doesn't make a damn bit of sense. Pulling for him to win and still wanting to fire him this year is far more idiotic than wanting him to crash and burn so we can start over this year. But, like I already said, the vocal "Fire Ray" crowd denying that they want us to lose out are either extremely dumb -- or liars.

It's called being a fan of the program not the coach. Atlanta Braves fans root for the Braves to win but every damn one of them wants Freddi Gonzalez fired. It's not uncommon at all to root for a team to win and for a new coach to get hired at the same time.

[Coach34]

No what's bullshit is Ray knowing he's going to be Billy Badass with his team so he doesn't plan for that by stocking up fully BEFORE the summer starts. Ray knew he was going to be a hardass with his team. He knew he wasn't going to put up with any bullshit and that he'd be kicking off two to three players.

Wow...so Ray was supposed to know ahead of time they werent going to stop smoking weed and doing drugs when told point blank they would be booted if they didnt?

There's really nothing more to say to you after that

[Dawg61]

Wow...so Ray was supposed to know ahead of time they werent going to stop smoking weed and doing drugs when told point blank they would be booted if they didnt?

There's really nothing more to say to you after that

So Ray didn't know one more failed test and they're both gone ahead of time? Come on man he's gotta have a backup plan in place. Don't just let the bomb blowup in your face when you've got ample warning. Call it like it is. Ray failed to stock his lineup fully in time.

[MadDawg]

Everyone that wants him gone right now, this year, are actively rooting for Ray to lose out -- and hoping he gets embarrassed at home on Thursday night. Otherwise, their position at this juncture is absurd after what's happened in the past 6 weeks.

When you were ready, right then, to fire Mullen a couple seasons ago, were you actively rooting for MSU to lose out in football? Just curious. We all know you changed your mind on Mullen - that's not the issue.

[MadDawg]

So, you are pulling for our coach to win -- yet still in favor of firing him at 8-10 or 9-9 in the SEC? You think we're f'ing Kentucky -- or would otherwise be able to cherrypick a good hire after firing a coach under those improvement circumstances? Good Lord, the process of that search would be even worse than the last one.

There's a tremendous gap in logic on the Ray haters side that doesn't make a damn bit of sense. Pulling for him to win and still wanting to fire him this year is far more idiotic than wanting him to crash and burn so we can start over this year. But, like I already said, the vocal "Fire Ray" crowd denying that they want us to lose out are either extremely dumb -- or liars.

So, like I asked before, were you a liar? Or just dumb?

[TheDogFather]

Yeah that's the spirit. Let's just ignore the injuries, players kicked off because of off court issue, and total rebuild of the program.

:)

We lost to McNeese State. Who subsequently lost to Incarnate Word. Incarnate Word. Stop and let that sink in for a minute before you bloviate another round of excuses. We should be able to beat McNeese State with walk-ons and managers.

http://izquotes.com/quotes-pictures/quote-the-more-a-man-desirous-to-pass-at-a-value-above-his-worth-can-contrast-by-dignified-silence-the-edward-bulwer-lytton-386937.jpg

[Homedawg]

We lost to McNeese State. Who subsequently lost to Incarnate Word. Incarnate Word. Stop and let that sink in for a minute before you bloviate another round of excuses. We should be able to beat McNeese State with walk-ons and managers.

http://izquotes.com/quotes-pictures/quote-the-more-a-man-desirous-to-pass-at-a-value-above-his-worth-can-contrast-by-dignified-silence-the-edward-bulwer-lytton-386937.jpg

Agreed we should, no question. We also should be able to go better than 8-8 in a weak sec and make the NCAA tourney w two future first rounders and an all sec point guard. Just the last example of major underperformance.

[bluelightstar]

Agreed we should, no question. We also should be able to go better than 8-8 in a weak sec and make the NCAA tourney w two future first rounders and an all sec point guard. Just the last example of major underperformance.

I was wrong. I like that "major underperformance" a whole lot better.

[tcdog70]

arguing with tweedle dee and tweedle dum is a useless proposition. they can spin off your valid point and bring John Cohen into the discussion in comparison with Rick Ray. When the only thing they have in common is MSU writes them both a check.They have had an agenda for years and can't leave it alone. It would be ok with me to never have another thread on Stans but hold Rick Ray to the same standards as Stansbury. That is only Fair. Why be a Rick Ray apologist when you hammered Stans for the same shit. There is nobody except for 34 and his minions that doesn't believe if we had kept Stans we would be in the top of the SEC today.

i'll bet that 80% of College Teams have players that smoke dope. If you kicked all the dope smokers off teams you wouldn't have enough to play a game.

[engie]

When you were ready, right then, to fire Mullen a couple seasons ago, were you actively rooting for MSU to lose out in football? Just curious. We all know you changed your mind on Mullen - that's not the issue.

You constantly go down this road -- in spite of me providing examples of you misrepresenting my position at least a half dozen times. You've chosen to believe what you believe in the face of the facts -- and me reposting them for the 7th or 8th time for you isn't going to change that. You'll post one instance where I didn't fully flesh out the position that was already clearly fleshed out for everyone, which everyone here not pushing an agenda will vouch for -- and I'll post 5 times in which I did flesh out the position in the days and weeks surrounding your go-to post -- and we'll rinse and repeat it again in 3 months when you decide to straw man this position of yours into random threads once again...

I was in favor of keeping Mullen IF he made a bowl game. He had not won as an underdog in 42 games(which it was clear we would be in the Egg Bowl), nor had we ever won in the state of Arkansas. There was two remaining games, both requiring feats that we either hadn't accomplished at all or hadn't accomplished in a long time. My position was ALWAYS founded on the basis of us losing one or both of those games -- and was clearly spelled out as such MANY times. So, no, I was never in favor of firing Mullen midseason. And my actual position was to wait and see -- while my theoretical desire to move on at the end of the season was based on expected results that he surpassed.

I would say nice try -- but it really wasn't. And I already know you'll try it again soon -- so why bother?

[engie]

- What valid point is that?

- What is my alleged agenda? Where is the link showing that alleged agenda?

- Wait -- you are saying that everyone "except c34 and his minions" believed that a coach that had gone better than 9-7 ONCE in his final 8 years in the SEC(while playing a much weaker in-conference schedule than we face today with the removal of divisions) was going to somehow will us to the top of the conference today? Yeah -- those are the people pushing the agenda**

- Justification for the inmates running the asylum -- in spite of having every opportunity to get their shit together and stay on the team.

Yeah -- you are the unbiased voice of reason here. Everyone else just has outside agendas they are pushing**

[MadDawg]

You constantly go down this road -- in spite of me providing examples of you misrepresenting my position at least a half dozen times. You've chosen to believe what you believe in the face of the facts -- and me reposting them for the 7th or 8th time for you isn't going to change that. You'll post one instance where I didn't fully flesh out the position that was already clearly fleshed out for everyone, which everyone here not pushing an agenda will vouch for -- and I'll post 5 times in which I did flesh out the position in the days and weeks surrounding your go-to post -- and we'll rinse and repeat it again in 3 months when you decide to straw man this position of yours into random threads once again...

I was in favor of keeping Mullen IF he made a bowl game. He had not won as an underdog in 42 games(which it was clear we would be in the Egg Bowl), nor had we ever won in the state of Arkansas. There was two remaining games, both requiring feats that we either hadn't accomplished at all or hadn't accomplished in a long time. My position was ALWAYS founded on the basis of us losing one or both of those games -- and was clearly spelled out as such MANY times. So, no, I was never in favor of firing Mullen midseason. And my actual position was to wait and see -- while my theoretical desire to move on at the end of the season was based on expected results that he surpassed.

I would say nice try -- but it really wasn't. And I already know you'll try it again soon -- so why bother?

"We're last in the SEC in recruiting. And we're damn near full. We're on probation. The 2 teams we've consistently beaten(OM and Kentucky) are mopping the floor with us in recruiting. Coaching sucks. Not only does it suck -- but it's become laxidasical. We're making the same mistakes in year 5 that were made in year 1. And the best part of our team(punting) just got totally mind17ed last night.

When it is "time", it's time. There has been consistently clear regression since 2010 that is only hidden by the joke of a schedule we had last year. And not having it totally bottomed out YET doesn't mean it's not time to make a change." - engie 10/25/13

I'll put you down in the "liar" category. I gave you credit for changing your mind. But on 10/25/13 at 11:10am you were ready to fire Mullen mid-season. "When it's time, it's time". Only you would try to spin this.

[maroonmania]

Question, let's just assume that Ray is going to finish out strong enough to assure himself another year from Keenum and Strick. And I personally think just beating Mizzou at home to go 6-12 will be good enough to get another year. So assuming that, is next year NCAA or bust? Is an NIT bid (assuming no major injuries) enough to bring him back again with the bulk of next year's starters graduating? Where in the SEC would he need to finish? I'm just curious what the fan expectations are for Ray in year 4 to continue on because I believe now he will get that. I am almost thinking the worst outcome may be that Ray gets another year with a VERY veteran team and gets to the NIT which pacifies folks and then we slide back from that in Year 5. If he can keep showing improved recruiting there may be a light at the end of the tunnel for Ray though.

[MadDawg]

When Ray says this is year one, and I've heard it about 4 times now, is that just him saying that, or do you think that's what Strickin is telling him too? If it's from Strick, does that mean Ray really has 3 more years to get us competitive?

[engie]

"We're last in the SEC in recruiting. And we're damn near full. We're on probation. The 2 teams we've consistently beaten(OM and Kentucky) are mopping the floor with us in recruiting. Coaching sucks. Not only does it suck -- but it's become laxidasical. We're making the same mistakes in year 5 that were made in year 1. And the best part of our team(punting) just got totally mind17ed last night.

When it is "time", it's time. There has been consistently clear regression since 2010 that is only hidden by the joke of a schedule we had last year. And not having it totally bottomed out YET doesn't mean it's not time to make a change." - engie 10/25/13

It's funny that I literally told you in advance what you were going to do -- and how it was going to proceed -- and you followed through with it anyway.

I'll just add one killshot from less than 24 hours after your post from a Kentucky meltdown thread you so happily love to take out of context -- and skip over the other dozens of examples of my actual position being fleshed out.
"If he goes 6-6 this year, we've got to keep him. I'm agreeing with that much..." - engie 10/26/13.


I'll put you down in the "liar" category. I gave you credit for changing your mind. But on 10/25/13 at 11:10am you were ready to fire Mullen mid-season. "When it's time, it's time". Only you would try to spin this.
You can put me down in whatever category you want. Pawns will always be pawns. It's funny that you are the one always attempting this call-out -- when you accuse me of taking you out of context on wanting to fire Cohen deep into year 3... Your panties are perpetually in a wad about that one, which I let go a year ago, I guess...

[maroonmania]

When Ray says this is year one, and I've heard it about 4 times now, is that just him saying that, or do you think that's what Strickin is telling him too? If it's from Strick, does that mean Ray really has 3 more years to get us competitive?

Must be nice to have one of the most veteran rosters in the league in "year one".

[Liverpooldawg]

So, you are pulling for our coach to win -- yet still in favor of firing him at 8-10 or 9-9 in the SEC? You think we're f'ing Kentucky -- or would otherwise be able to cherrypick a good hire after firing a coach under those improvement circumstances? Good Lord, the process of that search would be even worse than the last one.

There's a tremendous gap in logic on the Ray haters side that doesn't make a damn bit of sense. Pulling for him to win and still wanting to fire him this year is far more idiotic than wanting him to crash and burn so we can start over this year. But, like I already said, the vocal "Fire Ray" crowd denying that they want us to lose out are either extremely dumb -- or liars.

If he gets to .500 overall he should stay. I've said that numerous times including before the season started. Keeping a coach after three straight overall losing seasons at an SEC school would say something about us that no one should like.

[maroonmania]

If he gets to .500 overall he should stay. I've said that numerous times including before the season started. Keeping a coach after three straight overall losing seasons at an SEC school would say something about us that no one should like.

Well you can probably fire him now by your standard because we would need to finish the last 6 at 4-2 to get to .500 overall and I just don't see that happening. KY is an automatic loss so we have to win 4 of the other 5 and 2 of those 5 are against Top 4 SEC teams.

[engie]

If he gets to .500 overall he should stay. I've said that numerous times including before the season started. Keeping a coach after three straight overall losing seasons at an SEC school would say something about us that no one should like.

That's fair enough...and logical enough...

[engie]

Well you can probably fire him now by your standard because we would need to finish the last 6 at 4-2 to get to .500 overall and I just don't see that happening. KY is an automatic loss so we have to win 4 of the other 5 and 2 of those 5 are against Top 4 SEC teams.

Including the SEC tourney -- where we should win 1 and could easily enough win 2... Some of Ray's best games of coaching at MSU has come in that tournament IMO...
So, we could go 3-3 and 2-1 in the tournament, etc...

[Liverpooldawg]

Well you can probably fire him now by your standard because we would need to finish the last 6 at 4-2 to get to .500 overall and I just don't see that happening. KY is an automatic loss so we have to win 4 of the other 5 and 2 of those 5 are against Top 4 SEC teams.

Unfortunately you are correct. That's why SC Upstate and the others were so bad. If there has been true improvement it's doable though. We could win 2 in the tourney though.

[smootness]

This board would be so much better if every post mentioning Stans was deleted. I get that he's still relevant, but the cons of doing it do not in any way outweigh the pros.

It's unbearable when threads like this suck up all of the posts and it's hard to get discussion going on other topics.

[Liverpooldawg]

That's fair enough...and logical enough...

I'm not anti-Ray. I love MSU basketball no matter who the coach is. I used to go to the games as a student when Bob Boyd was coach. After being away for 4 years after that I was a season ticket holder with my dad for over 20 years, till Dad got too sick to go anymore. It's always been my sport at MSU.

[Dawg61]

When Ray says this is year one, and I've heard it about 4 times now, is that just him saying that, or do you think that's what Strickin is telling him too? If it's from Strick, does that mean Ray really has 3 more years to get us competitive?

Ray is posturing to keep his job and the media is trying to help him do it with the mic and camera put on him during the entire games.

[engie]

Ray is posturing to keep his job and the media is trying to help him do it with the mic and camera put on him during the entire games.

I think the opposite on that last part. The lowest I've been on Ray is when he was mic'd up in a huge home game that he lost, directly off of scoring 9 points in a half against Arkansas, and he states "the offense will take care of itself." I generally have felt better about him after listening to him talk -- that one went the opposite way by alot.

[MadDawg]

It's funny that I literally told you in advance what you were going to do -- and how it was going to proceed -- and you followed through with it anyway.

I realize defending your own comments, especially when you get caught talking out of both sides of your mouth, is not an easy thing to do. If you don't want to, I understand. But don't accuse me of assigning some position to you that you didn't take. There are many more examples. You've never proven any of them wrong because you can't.

So where you pulling for MSU to lose out in football or not?

[Dawg61]

I think the opposite on that last part. The lowest I've been on Ray is when he was mic'd up in a huge home game that he lost, directly off of scoring 9 points in a half against Arkansas, and he states "the offense will take care of itself." I generally have felt better about him after listening to him talk -- that one went the opposite way by alot.

It backfired on Ray and the SECNetwork but that doesn't change that their intentions were to help Ray.

[engie]

I realize defending your own comments, especially when you get caught talking out of both sides of your mouth, is not an easy thing to do.
Yet requires you to talk out of both sides of your mouth in order to travel down this path, Mr FAHRRRR JOHN COHEN!!1!1 You contend that wasn't your actual position -- which I have long since let go -- yet somehow contend that a single pissed off post from me in a game thread was my actual, inclusive position? Gotta love when someone goes full hypocrite in order to call someone else a hypocrite.

Even then, your argument might work -- IF my exact position hadn't been clearly defined countless times on the record. Both in the weeks before and weeks following the post in question.


If you don't want to, I understand. But don't accuse me of assigning some position to you that you didn't take.
You are.


There are many more examples.
Correct. Of me saying he stays if he obtains bowl eligibility. If there were "many more examples", you wouldn't use the same one over and over and over and over again. There are very few examples. And for every one you can take out of context or perhaps more correctly stated -- apply without context -- there are 10 where my exact position is defined in context and with depth that flies in the face of what you are trying to portray.


You've never proven any of them wrong because you can't.
Yet I showed you my actual position from less than 24 hours after your one out of context post. I'm sure I could show the same again from less than 7 days beforehand too. You are right -- there are literally hundreds of examples defining my position.


So where you pulling for MSU to lose out in football or not?
No -- because I didn't want to fire Mullen until he lost to Arky and/or Ole Miss -- under the pretense of him losing one and most likely, at the time, losing both. One pissed off post from a game thread doesn't change the position I held over months -- with countless examples of said position. You get an A for effort -- a D- for execution -- and a zero for originality. You just aren't very good at this. Hence the broken record you played in spite of me telling you and showing you it was broken -- and even telling you that you were going to play it.

[maroonmania]

Question, let's just assume that Ray is going to finish out strong enough to assure himself another year from Keenum and Strick. And I personally think just beating Mizzou at home to go 6-12 will be good enough to get another year. So assuming that, is next year NCAA or bust? Is an NIT bid (assuming no major injuries) enough to bring him back again with the bulk of next year's starters graduating? Where in the SEC would he need to finish? I'm just curious what the fan expectations are for Ray in year 4 to continue on because I believe now he will get that. I am almost thinking the worst outcome may be that Ray gets another year with a VERY veteran team and gets to the NIT which pacifies folks and then we slide back from that in Year 5. If he can keep showing improved recruiting there may be a light at the end of the tunnel for Ray though.

So nobody has any thoughts on what Ray's expectations should be next year?

[MadDawg]

engie, what does "When it's time, it's time" mean?

Funny, I provide exact quotes from you and you tell me that wasn't your "real" position. To prove what your "real" position was, you provide quotes. Why should we believe one quote, and not the other?

Look, engie, I've already stated you changed your mind on Mullen. I'm not trying to beat you over the head for wanting Mullen fired. All I want to know, is that since you stated that anyone wanting Ray fired now must be pulling for MSU to lose every game. Or they are either stupid or a liar.

"Pulling for him to win and still wanting to fire him this year is far more idiotic than wanting him to crash and burn so we can start over this year. But, like I already said, the vocal "Fire Ray" crowd denying that they want us to lose out are either extremely dumb -- or liars." - engie

Since on 10/25/14 at 11:10 am you wanted Mullen fired mid-season, were you pulling for MSU to lose every game?

[engie]

So nobody has any thoughts on what Ray's expectations should be next year?

"Expecations" and "what you want to be" are two different things. This idea really needs it's own thread IMO.
My expectation for next year is the NIT. My "satisfactory level of the program" is the NCAAs. This year was the NIT for me.

Circumstances have caused us to fall short. But at some point, you make your own circumstances. It's easy to admit that we showed progress late this year -- progress that we had been waiting to see -- yet admit that it doesn't yet have us where we wanted to be by this point in time. It's enough to keep the coach -- but not enough to make you truly buy in.

[engie]

engie, what does "When it's time, it's time" mean?

Funny, I provide exact quotes from you and you tell me that wasn't your "real" position. To prove what your "real" position was, you provide quotes. Why should we believe one quote, and not the other?

Look, engie, I've already stated you changed your mind on Mullen. I'm not trying to beat you over the head for wanting Mullen fired. All I want to know, is that since you stated that anyone wanting Ray fired now must be pulling for MSU to lose every game. Or they are either stupid or a liar.

"Pulling for him to win and still wanting to fire him this year is far more idiotic than wanting him to crash and burn so we can start over this year. But, like I already said, the vocal "Fire Ray" crowd denying that they want us to lose out are either extremely dumb -- or liars." - engie

Since on 10/25/14 at 11:10 am you wanted Mullen fired mid-season, were you pulling for MSU to lose every game?

There's no possible way you are this dense. I never wanted Mullen fired midseason. You posted one example -- which wasn't meant to imply that I wanted him gone "right then" -- but was always meant with respect to the end of the season. It was a pissed off post from a game thread. Sure -- it could have been taken how you are taking it -- and it might even be effectively argued as my position if that was the only snapshot or example of me ever taking any position on the topic. But, instead, I took a position on the topic probably somewhere well over 100 times between here and SPS -- and defined in great context exactly what I meant and expected. If I'm remembering correctly, I even defined it as I meant it in the very thread that you are quoting. If 99 posts say one thing -- and you interpret the one as meaning something entirely different -- what is more likely -- that I meant the context to be understood as the same way as the other 99 -- or that I was taking a totally different position than I had held consistently? Like I said -- no way you are dense enough to believe that was my actual position. You are trying to skew it into that -- uneffectively, I might add.

I've had literally thousands of "hot seat" posts on my position on every coach in every situation at MSU. Even with Ray at the absolute bottoming out in the nonconference, I've always, 100% of the time, been in favor of giving them till the end of the season to right the ship. There were posts made with the expectation that they would not right the ship -- but I was still always in favor of giving them that chance.

But continue with the hypocrisy of trying to call out hypocrisy, mr Fahrrrr Cohen. Your hard-on for me is both hilarious and sad. Broken record still playing the same verse of the same song. It's all you know apparently.

[maroonmania]

"Expecations" and "what you want to be" are two different things. This idea really needs it's own thread IMO.
My expectation for next year is the NIT. My "satisfactory level of the program" is the NCAAs. This year was the NIT for me.

Circumstances have caused us to fall short. But at some point, you make your own circumstances. It's easy to admit that we showed progress late this year -- progress that we had been waiting to see -- yet admit that it doesn't yet have us where we wanted to be by this point in time. It's enough to keep the coach -- but not enough to make you truly buy in.

Maybe "expectations" is not the correct word. The thought is what does Ray have to ACCOMPLISH next year to have your support going into Year 5? Is it NIT or is it NCAA or bust? I think most are not going to support a Year 5 with a mostly senior team next year that doesn't make any type of post-season. Maybe it does need its own thread.

[MadDawg]

I never wanted Mullen fired midseason.

What does "When it's time, it's time" mean?

What does "And not having it totally bottomed out YET doesn't mean it's not time to make a change" mean?


It was a pissed off post from a game thread

So when you stated:


"I changed my mind on Mullen in weeks 1 and 3 this year -- and took another month to be 100% sure I wasn't being an overly emotional roller coaster fan before taking a stance."

.... you didn't really mean you took almost 2 months to form this opinion? Instead you really meant to say this was just a "pissed off" post from a game thread?

[engie]

Broken record -- nobody is buying what you are selling. Call someone a liar -- while lying about their well-known and consistently-held position. Example #3902843 of your hypocrisy.

I was taking a stance that I didn't think he was the guy any more. And I was consistent in that right up until he won the Egg Bowl. I shut up after the Ole Miss game after I owned being wrong to doubt that he could get it done on BOTH boards exactly like I said I would(in spite of still not being convinced he was the guy) and let things play out. And still wasn't truly convinced until he won in Baton Rouge. Although I loved the offseason staff change, loved the duty shuffling, loved the "winning the press conference" approach to Big Dawg Camp, loved the change in recruiting philosophy, etc. I never ONCE took a stance that I actually wanted him fired midseason -- and no amount of attempted bullshit you could pull from one post that was clearly outside of the context of my actual position is going to make it true. While conveniently overlooking the hundreds of my posts that prove the position in it's entirity.

Shouldn't you be blowing Raffo? Since you wanted him as coach, and even Polk would be better than the dumbass Cohen?***

[MadDawg]

Broken record -- nobody is buying what you are selling. Call someone a liar -- while lying about their well-known and consistently-held position. Example #3902843 of your hypocrisy.

I was taking a stance that I didn't think he was the guy any more. And I was consistent in that right up until he won the Egg Bowl. I shut up after the Ole Miss game after I owned being wrong to doubt that he could get it done on BOTH boards exactly like I said I would(in spite of still not being convinced he was the guy) and let things play out. And still wasn't truly convinced until he won in Baton Rouge. Although I loved the offseason staff change, loved the duty shuffling, loved the "winning the press conference" approach to Big Dawg Camp, loved the change in recruiting philosophy, etc. I never ONCE took a stance that I actually wanted him fired midseason -- and no amount of attempted bullshit you could pull from one post that was clearly outside of the context of my actual position is going to make it true. While conveniently overlooking the hundreds of my posts that prove the position in it's entirity.

Shouldn't you be blowing Raffo? Since you wanted him as coach, and even Polk would be better than the dumbass Cohen?***

You are a joke, engie. A man that won't own up to his own words is a puss. And you are the biggest puss on this board.

And everybody is buying what I am selling. Because I'm merely posting your quotes and asking you to clarify. And all you want to do is somehow claim what you posted wasn't what you really meant. Even though in the posts, you go our of your way to make sure everyone knows this was your well thought out position than took you close to 2 months to be "100% sure".

Be a man, engie. Don't be a damn pussE.

[engie]

You are a joke, engie. A man that won't own up to his own words is a puss. And you are the biggest puss on this board.
Sure thing, hypocrite. I owned up to my position on Mullen. I'm not owning up to shit on a position I didn't actually take.


And everybody is buying what I am selling.
No they aren't -- because they are lies.


Because I'm merely posting your quotes and asking you to clarify.
More lies.


And all you want to do is somehow claim what you posted wasn't what you really meant.
Because what I really meant was clearly stated a hundred times. Hence your straw grab. You -- of all people -- the douche with at least a half dozen "Fire Cohenzzzz" posts on Sixpack. And a couple dozen more trying to tell us Stansbury was a better coach than Cohen....


Even though in the posts, you go our of your way to make sure everyone knows this was your well thought out position than took you close to 2 months to be "100% sure".
Not as far out of my way as you are doing in attempting to skew.


Be a man, engie. Don't be a damn pussE.
I already was a man on this topic. Many times. When you learn not to be a baby -- I'll quit treating you like one.

Until then, I look forward to you bringing this up again in 2 weeks with your one post "proof" -- and we'll keep going down the same path of me proving you ridiculous and petty. Fire Cohenz!1!1 Polk is the man!!!1!1

[MadDawg]

engie, you are a joke. A lying, self-absorbed, insecure excuse for a man. Absolutely no honor. Absolutely no honesty. Pathetic.

You really should look into becoming a politician. Your skills at side-stepping questions, lying about your position and being completely dishonest are incredible. You could make most politicians look like choir boys compared to your complete lack of any semblance of character or honor.

[Coach34]

That'll close the book on Laloosh