Kicker?

[rrog17]

Any news on bringing in a kicker? Surely there's a juco guy out there who can make PATs and a 45 yarder!

[Howboutdemdogs]

This would be my only major concern for next year, the kicking game. Couple this with special teams. We have to address this, we don't have to hold our breaths on extra points and field goals.

[cheewgumm]

I thought Starkville Hogj had this bad ass kicker we were going to get this year. What happens to him?

[Dawgowar]

Yeah, way past frustrated with the lack of a consistent 45 yard capable kicker. Cannot understand for a moment that you do not address this major weakness of ST in general and kicker specifically the last couple of years. Not angry just don't understand how they do nothing to fix the issue. We all see it. We all hold our breath when they trot out to attempt the routine. It's f'ng epically ridiculous.

[rrog17]

I totally agree! You can't tell me there's not a capable juco kicker who would love to kick in the SEC!

[jumbo]

Paul has said "we'll know more in the spring" when asked about kickers. that says to me there's a walkon possibility.

[War Machine Dawg]

We all just need to accept the fact that Mullen doesn't believe STs are a priority and an important part of the game. We've got 6 years of evidence at this point. You would think someone like JWS could talk some sense into him on the subject, but it's apparent it can't be done. Otherwise why do we continue to leave Mullen's bff Sallach on the field instead of moving him to an administrative position and using his spot to get a legit ST coach? Sure, Mullen may get pissed in the moment when our STs take a dump on the field and cost us a game, but he doesn't do anything to address the problem. He just continues to trot out the same shitty KR/PR guys, same weak legged Ks who make up for it by being inaccurate, etc. The only thing we do well on STs is punt and cover.

And say what you will about Knox being the "ST Coordinator," but it was always a farce designed to a) take heat off Mullen with the fans for our shitastic STs by giving him someone to blame and b) give Knox an extra title to get him a little extra money. I saw all I needed to during the SEC Network launch when they had video of Mullen still actively "coaching" our kickers. That was always a title only move, as I suspected the moment it was announced.

I'll continue beating the drum for legitimate changes in our approach to STs in hopes that eventually it will change, but I won't hold my breath on it. Mullen is a stubborn bastard and clearly thinks the key to winning is scoring more points on offense and giving up fewer points on D, without realizing that we'd score more points if we had Ks who were accurate from 40 and in and KR/PR guys who were legit threats and didn't cost us field position. It's harder to score when your offense is having to constantly drive a long field. Mullen may give lip service to STs, but all the evidence is that he doesn't really believe in them. Until he does believe in STs, I'm afraid 10 wins will be our hard ceiling.

[thunderclap]

We all just need to accept the fact that Mullen doesn't believe STs are a priority and an important part of the game. We've got 6 years of evidence at this point. You would think someone like JWS could talk some sense into him on the subject, but it's apparent it can't be done. Otherwise why do we continue to leave Mullen's buff Sallach on the field instead of moving him to an administrative position and using his spot to get a legit ST coach? Sure, Mullen may get pissed in the moment when our STs take a dump on the field and cost us a game, but he doesn't do anything to address the problem. He just continues to trot out the same shitty KR/PR guys, same weak legged Ks who make up for it by being inaccurate, etc. The only thing we do well on STs is punt and cover.

And say what you will about Knox being the "ST Coordinator," but it was always a farce designed to a) take heat off Mullen with the fans for our shitastic STs by giving him someone to blame and b) give Knox an extra title to get him a little extra money. I saw all I needed to during the SEC Network launch when they had video of Mullen still actively "coaching" our kickers. That was always a title only move, as I suspected the moment it was announced.

I'll continue beating the drum for legitimate changes in our approach to STs in hopes that eventually it will change, but I won't hold my breath on it. Mullen is a stubborn bastard and clearly thinks the key to winning is scoring more points on offense and giving up fewer points on D, without realizing that we'd score more points if we had Ks who were accurate from 40 and in and KR/PR guys who were legit threats and didn't cost us field position. It's harder to score when your offense is having to constantly drive a long field. Mullen may give lip service to STs, but all the evidence is that he doesn't really believe in them. Until he does believe in STs, I'm afraid 10 wins will be our hard ceiling.

Yep.

[Percho]

NFL History - Points Leaders

1 Morten Andersen 2,544
2 Gary Anderson 2,434
3 Jason Hanson 2,150
4 ADAM VINATIERI 2,146
5 John Carney 2,062
6 Matt Stover 2,004
7 George Blanda 2,002
8 Jason Elam 1,983
9 John Kasay 1,970
10 Norm Johnson 1,736
11 DAVID AKERS 1,721
12 Nick Lowery 1,711
13 Jan Stenerud 1,699
14 Ryan Longwell 1,687
15 Lou Groza 1,608
16 Eddie Murray 1,594
17 Al Del Greco 1,584
18 SEBASTIAN JANIKOWSKI 1,574
19 Olindo Mare 1,555
20 PHIL DAWSON 1,519


What pos. did these guys play?

[Bullmutt]

NFL History - Points Leaders

1 Morten Andersen 2,544
2 Gary Anderson 2,434
3 Jason Hanson 2,150
4 ADAM VINATIERI 2,146
5 John Carney 2,062
6 Matt Stover 2,004
7 George Blanda 2,002
8 Jason Elam 1,983
9 John Kasay 1,970
10 Norm Johnson 1,736
11 DAVID AKERS 1,721
12 Nick Lowery 1,711
13 Jan Stenerud 1,699
14 Ryan Longwell 1,687
15 Lou Groza 1,608
16 Eddie Murray 1,594
17 Al Del Greco 1,584
18 SEBASTIAN JANIKOWSKI 1,574
19 Olindo Mare 1,555
20 PHIL DAWSON 1,519


What pos. did these guys play?


We obviously need to find a kicker named Anderson.***

[MSUDawg4Life]

Even our kicker was the leading scorer on the team last year.

Total points:

Evan Sobiesk 92 points
Dak Prescott 90 points
Josh Robinson 72 points

It's important.

[Really Clark?]

I thought Starkville Hogj had this bad ass kicker we were going to get this year. What happens to him?

He didn't have a good senior year, missed too many kicks. I think is going JUCO for kicker and soccer.

[defiantdog]

I think we're waiting on Bell's scholarship to open before we offer another kicker a scholarship. Cook is also on scholarship..... just sucks that our 2 scholarship kickers are both punters.

[yjnkdawg]

We all just need to accept the fact that Mullen doesn't believe STs are a priority and an important part of the game. We've got 6 years of evidence at this point. You would think someone like JWS could talk some sense into him on the subject, but it's apparent it can't be done. Otherwise why do we continue to leave Mullen's bff Sallach on the field instead of moving him to an administrative position and using his spot to get a legit ST coach? Sure, Mullen may get pissed in the moment when our STs take a dump on the field and cost us a game, but he doesn't do anything to address the problem. He just continues to trot out the same shitty KR/PR guys, same weak legged Ks who make up for it by being inaccurate, etc. The only thing we do well on STs is punt and cover.

And say what you will about Knox being the "ST Coordinator," but it was always a farce designed to a) take heat off Mullen with the fans for our shitastic STs by giving him someone to blame and b) give Knox an extra title to get him a little extra money. I saw all I needed to during the SEC Network launch when they had video of Mullen still actively "coaching" our kickers. That was always a title only move, as I suspected the moment it was announced.

I'll continue beating the drum for legitimate changes in our approach to STs in hopes that eventually it will change, but I won't hold my breath on it. Mullen is a stubborn bastard and clearly thinks the key to winning is scoring more points on offense and giving up fewer points on D, without realizing that we'd score more points if we had Ks who were accurate from 40 and in and KR/PR guys who were legit threats and didn't cost us field position. It's harder to score when your offense is having to constantly drive a long field. Mullen may give lip service to STs, but all the evidence is that he doesn't really believe in them. Until he does believe in STs, I'm afraid 10 wins will be our hard ceiling.

Keith Mixon could be that kr and pr, if they don't decide to redshirt him.

[DawgFromOxford]

Is it that hard to go pick up a kid in Australia? Seems like everyone is doing that these days

[War Machine Dawg]

Keith Mixon could be that kr and pr, if they don't decide to redshirt him.

Donald Gray could also be a factor. And I haven't given up on Smokey Graham, either. The problem is we've had guys in the program that are capable, but Mullen refuses to give them a chance. And he does so to try to boost someone's NFL value or to play favorites with upperclassmen. Look no further than Perkins, Tubby, and RoJo. None of them were ever a return threat, but we were forced to live with them their entire careers.

It isn't about a lack of talent for most of our STs. It's about Mullen not believing they are important and not knowing what the hell he's doing with them. Our schemes are bloody awful. Who else employs a "lead blocker" on KR and thereby wastes the chance to put two return threats back deep? As bad as Holloway was at PR, I still think he has value on KR. The only part of STs that is a "talent" issue is Kicker. Everything else boils down to Mullen's disregard and incompetence in that area.

And I'll add this: If the NCAA allows an extra coach next year, I will be PISSED if we don't use it for a true ST guy. As a fan base we should raise absolute hell if Mullen uses it for anything else.

[Percho]

We obviously need to find a kicker named Anderson.***

What is crazy is George Blanda was a pretty good QB and I would assume his total would also include his QB points and he is still 7th.

[B4its2L8]

Any news on bringing in a kicker? Surely there's a juco guy out there who can make PATs and a 45 yarder!

There are JUCO's available, but most schools are offering scholarships. As much as a kid may want to PAY $20,000+ per year to kick for MSU, he can accept offers from most D1 schools and have everything paid! Not every school uses their 3 special teams scholarships for a long snapper and 2 punters.

[jumbo]

this guy has a preferred walkon spot allegedly

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3PL_Ar6fVRY&feature=youtu.be

[maroonmania]

There are JUCO's available, but most schools are offering scholarships. As much as a kid may want to PAY $20,000+ per year to kick for MSU, he can accept offers from most D1 schools and have everything paid! Not every school uses their 3 special teams scholarships for a long snapper and 2 punters.

To have 2 guys that only punt on scholarshjp at the same time is totally freakin' ridiculous. And I had no idea we have a long snapper on football scholarship. That's just goofy as well. We should have one punter and one FG kicker on scholly with one of those guys being able to handle kickoff duties as well and that's it.

[Bama_Dawg]

Heck guys, at this point, I'd say go get our biggest lineman, tie the toe of his shoe back with the laces and straight on kick. 'Time we go old school.***

[Really Clark?]

To have 2 guys that only punt on scholarshjp at the same time is totally freakin' ridiculous. And I had no idea we have a long snapper on football scholarship. That's just goofy as well. We should have one punter and one FG kicker on scholly with one of those guys being able to handle kickoff duties as well and that's it.

Tenn, LSU, Ohio State, etc all signed a LS this week. And it's not uncommon for guys to walk on and earn scholly as a LS at nearly every program.

[maroonmania]

Tenn, LSU, Ohio State, etc all signed a LS this week. And it's not uncommon for guys to walk on and earn scholly as a LS at nearly every program.

Yea, if a guy walks on and shows his worth there I'm ok with giving that guy a scholarship. Still don't under stand the reasoning of signing a HS punter to a scholarship and then 2 years later another HS punter while totally neglecting the FG kicking spot.

[B4its2L8]

We have to remember that FG kickers have to have a different mindset. They have to be a bit squirrelly. Almost like a closer in baseball. Anyone can learn to kick FG's on a practice field, it's what they do with a crowd, when the game's on the line that counts. That's the problem with recruiting a high school kicker. I personally prefer the JUCO route, whether it's one or two years of JUCO experience. They are more mature, more seasoned, and have more experience kicking directly off the ground.

[B4its2L8]

this guy has a preferred walkon spot allegedly

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3PL_Ar6fVRY&feature=youtu.be

That's great news. I've seen this guy kick in high school and JUCO. He would be great in maroon, in either football or baseball (plays SS). He's the real deal, and still has 3 years of eligibility remaining. Whether it's the 51 yard FG he nailed (dead center and plenty of distance to spare) with 17 seconds left to force OT against Ridgeland in his last high school football game in 2013, or the 2 strike, 2 out, 2 RBI line drive single he hit in the top of the 7th (trailing by 1 at the time) to advance his high school baseball team to the next round of the playoffs. He's clutch, and lives for pressure situations. This differentiates him from some of our recent kickers, that don't seem to do too well under pressure. He's adjusted to kicking off the ground, without a block, without any problem.

He won just about every possible "1st Team" all-star award his senior year for BOTH football and baseball (Clarion Ledger, All-District, 5A All-State, MS All-Star Game, etc.). I know we're talking football, but MaxPreps shows he batted .421 his senior year, with a .521 on base %, playing SS in all 32 games. He has continued his dual sport career in the JUCO ranks, and is slated to be the starting SS this spring. I think the challenge will be to convince him to give up baseball and focus on football for just a Preferred Walk On offer. I figure how he does this spring in baseball will play a big role in his decision.

[sandwolf]

To have 2 guys that only punt on scholarshjp at the same time is totally freakin' ridiculous.

I believe that Cooke was signed as both a place kicker and a punter.

[blacklistedbully]

NFL History - Points Leaders

1 Morten Andersen 2,544
2 Gary Anderson 2,434
3 Jason Hanson 2,150
4 ADAM VINATIERI 2,146
5 John Carney 2,062
6 Matt Stover 2,004
7 George Blanda 2,002
8 Jason Elam 1,983
9 John Kasay 1,970
10 Norm Johnson 1,736
11 DAVID AKERS 1,721
12 Nick Lowery 1,711
13 Jan Stenerud 1,699
14 Ryan Longwell 1,687
15 Lou Groza 1,608
16 Eddie Murray 1,594
17 Al Del Greco 1,584
18 SEBASTIAN JANIKOWSKI 1,574
19 Olindo Mare 1,555
20 PHIL DAWSON 1,519


What pos. did these guys play?

Misleading in that kickers will always be up there due to fact they are getting far more opportunities than anyone else on the team. Even the worst kickers on teams are likely to be at or near the top of their team's "points leaders". Stands to reason then, that the all-time leaders would be kickers. They just have to be around long enough.

[MSUDawg4Life]

Misleading in that kickers will always be up there due to fact they are getting far more opportunities than anyone else on the team. Even the worst kickers on teams are likely to be at or near the top of their team's "points leaders". Stands to reason then, that the all-time leaders would be kickers. They just have to be around long enough.

That does not diminish the importance of having good kickers. Many times a missed field goal or extra point is the difference between winning and losing. We want every point a kicker can give us because that helps us win games. Period.

[War Machine Dawg]

I believe that Cooke was signed as both a place kicker and a punter.

So was Bell, and we all see how that's worked out. Neither had really kicked at all in HS. Thinking they can just transition from one to the other is ridiculous. It's a different skill set requiring different mechanics. Not to mention the mental aspects. Frankly, Mullen is totally incompetent when it comes to STs, because he apparently truly believes someone who has kicked maybe 5 FGs ever and has a huge leg punting can transition into a legit SEC kicker. Just go sign a JUCO K who's been doing it and has been kicking off the ground, dammit.

[War Machine Dawg]

That does not diminish the importance of having good kickers. Many times a missed field goal or extra point is the difference between winning and losing. We want every point a kicker can give us because that helps us win games. Period.

http://i.imgur.com/JiC5KOU.gif

[MSUDawg4Life]

So was Bell, and we all see how that's worked out. Neither had really kicked at all in HS. Thinking they can just transition from one to the other is ridiculous. It's a different skill set requiring different mechanics. Not to mention the mental aspects. Frankly, Mullen is totally incompetent when it comes to STs, because he apparently truly believes someone who has kicked maybe 5 FGs ever and has a huge leg punting can transition into a legit SEC kicker. Just go sign a JUCO K who's been doing it and has been kicking off the ground, dammit.

Devin Bell can still kick the crap out of a ball. His problem is mental, not mechanics.


http://youtu.be/mJ6cTt5sgFU

[maroonmania]

So was Bell, and we all see how that's worked out. Neither had really kicked at all in HS. Thinking they can just transition from one to the other is ridiculous. It's a different skill set requiring different mechanics. Not to mention the mental aspects. Frankly, Mullen is totally incompetent when it comes to STs, because he apparently truly believes someone who has kicked maybe 5 FGs ever and has a huge leg punting can transition into a legit SEC kicker. Just go sign a JUCO K who's been doing it and has been kicking off the ground, dammit.

Yes, and then leave him the heck alone before you screw him up!

[Ifyouonlyknew]

Who gets credit for Sobiesk then? No he didn't have the strong leg but he was money from 40 & in which is what yall are asking for. Who gets the pat on the back for that?

[maroonmania]

Devin Bell can still kick the crap out of a ball. His problem is mental, not mechanics.


http://youtu.be/mJ6cTt5sgFU

One thing about FG kicking, it doesn't matter how far the ball goes if it doesn't go through those 2 yellow posts. Over the past umpteen years, how many FGs have we missed left or right compared to how many FGs have we missed short? Distance is not the primary issue so I really don't care about somebody that can kick the crap out of the ball. Just give me a guy that is consistent 45 yards and in and I am happy as a lark. Sobiesk was finally becoming that so I hate it worked out that we lost him with still 2 years of eligibility left.

[Bo Darville]

http://www.elitedawgs.com/showthread.php?27622-WTH-Sobiesk-quit

I mentioned Reed James as a potential kicker last month (see above thread). The staff has talked with him.

[MSUDawg4Life]

One thing about FG kicking, it doesn't matter how far the ball goes if it doesn't go through those 2 yellow posts. Over the past umpteen years, how many FGs have we missed left or right compared to how many FGs have we missed short? Distance is not the primary issue so I really don't care about somebody that can kick the crap out of the ball. Just give me a guy that is consistent 45 yards and in and I am happy as a lark. Sobiesk was finally becoming that so I hate it worked out that we lost him with still 2 years of eligibility left.

Sobiesk wasn't kicking 45 yard field goals though. It seemed we were only comfortable with Sobiesk kicking 30 yards or less.

Bell has the leg to kick those 45 yarders and he can do it accurately. It just seems that the spotlight is too bright for him sometimes. But, he CAN do it. That was my point.

Maybe we need to get Tony Robbins to help Devin Bell get in his practice state of mind when it's time to kick in the game. And I'm only half joking about this ....

[smootness]

I think our ST problems are real yet a little overblown. As some have mentioned, we're very good at punting and in both coverage units. Those are important parts of ST.

And we have been better in the kicking game than some think. 2013 was rough for sure, but last year was pretty good. No, we haven't had any big-time kickers in a while, but our offense has become good enough that it isn't a huge negative for us.

And the return game is something that Mullen simply values fielding the ball cleanly and keeping possession more than he does the potential for a big return. Given the way the return game in college football has been reduced to only the occasional big return, I'm ok with that. And he did give guys a chance last year. He tried Graham there to give us an added dimension, and it bit us. So he switched to Ross, who is sure-handed while still having some ability to break one.

[Ifyouonlyknew]

Sobiesk wasn't kicking 45 yard field goals though. It seemed we were only comfortable with Sobiesk kicking 30 yards or less.

Bell has the leg to kick those 45 yarders and he can do it accurately. It just seems that the spotlight is too bright for him sometimes. But, he CAN do it. That was my point.

Maybe we need to get Tony Robbins to help Devin Bell get in his practice state of mind when it's time to kick in the game. And I'm only half joking about this ....

I think that was more circumstance than anything on his fg lengths. No we didn't want him kicking many 45-50yd fg's but inside 45 he kicked all the 1's that he had the opportunity to kick. It's not like we had some 4th downs where we could kick inside 45yds & we went for it instead of not letting Sobes kick. It just turned out most of drives stalled inside of 35yds.

[LC Dawg]

I understand the points about having two punters on scholarship but it worked out pretty well for us during the Texas A&M game. Having Cooke available to punt and kickoff at the last minute avoided some potential disasters.

[Alldawg]

To have 2 guys that only punt on scholarshjp at the same time is totally freakin' ridiculous. And I had no idea we have a long snapper on football scholarship. That's just goofy as well. We should have one punter and one FG kicker on scholly with one of those guys being able to handle kickoff duties as well and that's it.

Who is the long snapper on scholarship? Reason I ask is my wife's second or third cousin was a long snapper and thought she said he was currently on the team. Always thought he was a walk on though.

[blacklistedbully]

That does not diminish the importance of having good kickers. Many times a missed field goal or extra point is the difference between winning and losing. We want every point a kicker can give us because that helps us win games. Period.

Didn't mean to suggest kicker isn't important. In fact, I think it is VERY important. Was just suggesting the use of "Points leaders" stats is not a particularly telling stat in that regard.

[maroonmania]

I think that was more circumstance than anything on his fg lengths. No we didn't want him kicking many 45-50yd fg's but inside 45 he kicked all the 1's that he had the opportunity to kick. It's not like we had some 4th downs where we could kick inside 45yds & we went for it instead of not letting Sobes kick. It just turned out most of drives stalled inside of 35yds.

That's why I said Sobiesk was BECOMING that guy that the coaching staff had confidence in from 45 in. No, we didn't have a lot of longer opportunities come up but early in the year its obvious the staff didn't trust Sobiesk from longer range. That's the only reason I could see why they would stick Westin Graves out there to kick a 40+ yard FG when he hadn't kicked all year. Slowly but surely though he did earn that trust and by year's end I felt good about Sobiesk kicking anything that was 40 yards to just over that. Now we are back to square one on finding a guy that is consistently accurate. We've got several guys with booming legs but they are like a long driving golfer that can't find the fairway.

[Todd4State]

I think that was more circumstance than anything on his fg lengths. No we didn't want him kicking many 45-50yd fg's but inside 45 he kicked all the 1's that he had the opportunity to kick. It's not like we had some 4th downs where we could kick inside 45yds & we went for it instead of not letting Sobes kick. It just turned out most of drives stalled inside of 35yds.

Explain Dan going with Bell on the long field goal attempt against Kentucky and going for it on fourth down ad nauseum when in between the 50 and 35.

Sobiesk was accurate within his range- but his range wasn't very long.

I'm not upset with Dan about that- after all, as Clint Eastwood says, a man has got to know his limitations.

[Schultzy]

Twice in this thread I've read that we punted well last season; I remember us punting poorly, a lot.

Also, I heard the staff told high school coaches promoting their kickers before last season that we we were set at FG kicker and not looking for one. So I think they were sold on Cook replacing Sobiesk if and when it was needed.

[MabenMaroon]

Who is the long snapper on scholarship? Reason I ask is my wife's second or third cousin was a long snapper and thought she said he was currently on the team. Always thought he was a walk on though.

Winston Chapman has been our long snapper for the last two years and will be back for his sr. year. He is on full scholly as I understand it. Been pretty consistent and no major mistakes that I can recall.

[Todd4State]

Winston Chapman has been our long snapper for the last two years and will be back for his sr. year. He is on full scholly as I understand it. Been pretty consistent and no major mistakes that I can recall.

Actually, he screws up as much or more than the place kickers.