Too funny- the Bruce Pearl groupies and the Stands Lovers

[Coach34]

are kicking their dogs right now. How in the hell could Rick Ray do this to them????

Latest smoke is Keenum and Strick are bunkering in to to stay with Ray. March is gonna be interesting. ME? I'm just laughing at all the Bruce Pearl groupies that thought for sure he would handle Ray. Too damn funny.

[BeardoMSU]

I'm glad we won, but I'm not overreacting. It's Auburn, Bruce Pearl or not.

So after beating Auburn, and ending a 22 game road losing streak, your "sources" are saying our administration is ready to "bunker down" and ride this Rick Ray thing out???? That's 17ing stupid if true.

[Irondawg]

I'm not a pearl groupie but the difference is coaching half court offense was very apparent to me. AU got great looks all second half with a lot of nice off ball movement and that handoff play.

We hit a fair amount of more difficult shots to pull it out.

This is getting to be a dilemma with what to do with Ray.

[msstate7]

This is getting to be a dilemma with what to do with Ray.

If Ray does get another year, I hope he's encouraged to shake up his staff. Ray needs a good X's and O's guy to help him out

[Coach34]

So after beating Auburn, and ending a 22 game road losing streak, your "sources" are saying our administration is ready to "bunker down" and ride this Rick Ray thing out???? That's 17ing stupid if true.

I really dont know what to make of all of this in basketball. I hear one day Ray is done- then I hear from some higher ups Keenum and Strick are locking themselves in and saying 2 more years. This is the most divided Ive seen our people in all my years. Basketball has turned into an ugly battleground

[maroonmania]

I really dont know what to make of all of this in basketball. I hear one day Ray is done- then I hear from some higher ups Keenum and Strick are locking themselves in and saying 2 more years. This is the most divided Ive seen our people in all my years. Basketball has turned into an ugly battleground

Before the last 2 games it was the most united I've seen our fanbase in years, and not in a good way for Rick Ray. But hey, all anyone wants is a reasonably competitive program. If Ray gets this thing turned around and we finish the year strong he probably deserves one more year to see this through. I still think he's got to win around 6 SEC games minimum though but after tonight's win that is starting to look very attainable. We will see.

[scottycameron]

Ray will get next year for sure (barring something terrible). If we are on the right track next year, trending up and building, he'll be back, if not next year is the last. And to be clear, I don't like it either, just what I've been told.

[messageboardsuperhero]

Ray's going to have to show me way more than a two game winning streak for me to want him back next year.

Play at the level we played tonight consistently for the rest of the season- then we can talk.

[BeardoMSU]

a two game winning streak

Against Vandy and Auburn; not exactly world beaters. I'm with you, in that I want to see a lot more. You want to blow my skirt up, Rick? Beat Arky, OM, Florida, TN, KY.

[dawgs]

Bruce pearl is in year 1 of a major rebuild. Rick ray is in year 3 with a core of juniors that should know the system backwards and forwards. If we champion tonight as Rick ray > bruce pearl, then we deserve to have Rick Ray for the next 20 years. Pearl won't be struggling to finish .500 overall in year 3 at auburn.

[Dawgface]

I really dont know what to make of all of this in basketball. I hear one day Ray is done- then I hear from some higher ups Keenum and Strick are locking themselves in and saying 2 more years. This is the most divided Ive seen our people in all my years. Basketball has turned into an ugly battleground

Committed to two more frigging years? Keenum and SS are f?$king crazy as hell then. I admit, the results have been better over the last handful of games. But that in no way means we should commit to 2 more years. If our play continues to be positive the remainder of the year, then I can see the one more year thinking. But not two.

[TrueMaroon]

Bruce pearl is in year 1 of a major rebuild. Rick ray is in year 3 with a core of juniors that should know the system backwards and forwards. If we champion tonight as Rick ray > bruce pearl, then we deserve to have Rick Ray for the next 20 years. Pearl won't be struggling to finish .500 overall in year 3 at auburn.




http://replygif.net/i/1235.gif

[TheDogFather]

are kicking their dogs right now. How in the hell could Rick Ray do this to them????

Latest smoke is Keenum and Strick are bunkering in to to stay with Ray. March is gonna be interesting. ME? I'm just laughing at all the Bruce Pearl groupies that thought for sure he would handle Ray. Too damn funny.

A man spends $2 per day for 32 days on a lottery ticket. Two days in a row he scratches of a $2 prize. The man immediately brags to his friends about how lucky he is, and how his bosses are bunkering down to keep him from quitting his job because he is so rich.

[TheDogFather]

I really dont know what to make of all of this in basketball. I hear one day Ray is done- then I hear from some higher ups Keenum and Strick are locking themselves in and saying 2 more years. This is the most divided Ive seen our people in all my years. Basketball has turned into an ugly battleground

Maybe your "higher ups" aren't high enough.

[M.Fillmore]

Charlie Shira won some too.

[codeDawg]

I'll take Perl over just about anybody in college hoops any day. I would take Stands over what I've seen from Ray, but I don't really want either of them.

[Political Hack]

our basketball program is fine. nothing to be concerned about here.***

I'd take Bruce Pearl 8 times a week over what we're putting on the floor right now.

[MadDawg]

are kicking their dogs right now. How in the hell could Rick Ray do this to them????

Latest smoke is Keenum and Strick are bunkering in to to stay with Ray. March is gonna be interesting. ME? I'm just laughing at all the Bruce Pearl groupies that thought for sure he would handle Ray. Too damn funny.

And right on cue the Rick Ray lovers are all out bragging about the first road win in over 2 years. To them, this is the proof the last 3 years have been worth it. Cute bunch they are.

[drunkernhelldawg]

Lotta man love goin' on here. Huba huba huba

[FlabLoser]

I'm glad we won, but I'm not overreacting. It's Auburn, Bruce Pearl or not.


I'm happy that the team got a road win and broke a losing streak.

That said, let's pump the brakes. Sly Croom beat Nick Saban.

[quickstrike2]

I really dont know what to make of all of this in basketball. I hear one day Ray is done- then I hear from some higher ups Keenum and Strick are locking themselves in and saying 2 more years. This is the most divided Ive seen our people in all my years. Basketball has turned into an ugly battleground

2 more year commitment would be so flipping stupid. I can see another year if the team builds on this 2 game stretch, but no way I could see saying give him 2 years. Its all performance based now, win or get going, there is no excuses and no rebuilding talk. I would really have to question our administrations ability and motives toward basketball if we handed him 2.

[MetEdDawg]

This has turned into one of the more odd situations I've seen with us. In the most recent years, we all knew it was pretty much time for Polk and Croom to go. Most of us knew it was time for Stansbury to go if we were willing to deal with the rebuilding process.

But this situation is so strange. We were all 100% on board two weeks ago for Ray to be gone. Then he beats Stallings at home and Pearl on the road and now all of a sudden this ship might be turned around. But to what degree no one knows because there is still a lot of ball left to be played. Even so, being all in for 2 more years at this junction makes less than zero sense to me and I can't believe the President and AD of a major university like ours would think that based on where we are currently at.

Here's what I will say. We should all want Rick Ray to succeed. It means MSU is succeeding and we have to make that our #1 priority and evaluate the situation appropriately based on that fact. If Ray turns this around and get us to 7 conference wins, he has to stay and ride this group of kids out that he started with. I was all in on Ray when he got here, then after non conference play I was all in on it's time to make a change. Now we've turned it around a little bit and we are in wait and see mode.

Best thing we can do is show up to the games, support Ray and the team, and do whatever it is we can to put ourselves on the right track. We need people to show up, we need people to get behind the team, and we just need to watch what unfolds over the next two months. But we need to be all in until it's apparent that a change needs to be made and we aren't at that point currently.

[CadaverDawg]

Bruce pearl is in year 1 of a major rebuild. Rick ray is in year 3 with a core of juniors that should know the system backwards and forwards. If we champion tonight as Rick ray > bruce pearl, then we deserve to have Rick Ray for the next 20 years. Pearl won't be struggling to finish .500 overall in year 3 at auburn.

Exactly.

Overreaction thread.

[CadaverDawg]

our basketball program is fine. nothing to be concerned about here.***

I'd take Bruce Pearl 8 times a week over what we're putting on the floor right now.

Yep

[msstate7]

The turnaround lately is due to players getting healthy imo. Ready and sword had back surgery like a month before the season, but they seem to be getting right now. Ware missed games. Dunlap is out, but that's not a big deal. Since the injury bug bit us at the beginning of the year, we had to count on Daniels, ndoye, bloodman, and black way too much. Now that we're getting healthy, those guys can be role players instead of guys we depended on.

[Jacksondevildog]

If our administration is staying behind Rick Ray, our boosters need to ante up and get Malik Newman.


I really dont know what to make of all of this in basketball. I hear one day Ray is done- then I hear from some higher ups Keenum and Strick are locking themselves in and saying 2 more years. This is the most divided Ive seen our people in all my years. Basketball has turned into an ugly battleground

[engie]

There is zero chance that Strick and Keenum are actually marrying themselves to Ray right now. It makes for good internet chatter -- but that's about it. They are going to publicly support Ray right up until the day they fire him if it comes to that. The team I've seen the last 3 games and particularly last night is good enough to get Ray another year. The one we've seen otherwise was not.

Still no reason to downplay a win in a building we've never won in before. Our last win in Auburn was in 2008. We'd lost 5 straight there -- several(read most) as heavy favorites.

[msstate7]

If our administration is staying behind Rick Ray, our boosters need to ante up and get Malik Newman.

Amen.

[drunkernhelldawg]

This has turned into one of the more odd situations I've seen with us. In the most recent years, we all knew it was pretty much time for Polk and Croom to go. Most of us knew it was time for Stansbury to go if we were willing to deal with the rebuilding process.

But this situation is so strange. We were all 100% on board two weeks ago for Ray to be gone. Then he beats Stallings at home and Pearl on the road and now all of a sudden this ship might be turned around. But to what degree no one knows because there is still a lot of ball left to be played. Even so, being all in for 2 more years at this junction makes less than zero sense to me and I can't believe the President and AD of a major university like ours would think that based on where we are currently at.

Here's what I will say. We should all want Rick Ray to succeed. It means MSU is succeeding and we have to make that our #1 priority and evaluate the situation appropriately based on that fact. If Ray turns this around and get us to 7 conference wins, he has to stay and ride this group of kids out that he started with. I was all in on Ray when he got here, then after non conference play I was all in on it's time to make a change. Now we've turned it around a little bit and we are in wait and see mode.

Best thing we can do is show up to the games, support Ray and the team, and do whatever it is we can to put ourselves on the right track. We need people to show up, we need people to get behind the team, and we just need to watch what unfolds over the next two months. But we need to be all in until it's apparent that a change needs to be made and we aren't at that point currently.

Well said.

[Coach34]

I'm not saying that I want Ray to stay another season
Im not saying I told you so after last night- I'm simply laughing at the haters.

But I am hearing from people that give a lot more money than I do to the school that Keenum and Strick have promised Ray 5 years and that by God they are going to give it. I can't say that it's gospel and we'll see what happens. I'm just passing along what the talk is.

[engie]

Promised 4 -- to promised 5 -- based on?

No chance they've seen enough to up and decide he deserves year 5. Which would mean they'd have to actually go in now and publicly extend him a year, subject to IHL review and public records. Sorry -- doesn't even remotely pass the sniff test. Not at this point in time.

People are talking and everyone has their own agenda -- but this situation is pretty easy to see for what it is when you take a step back.

[maroonmania]

I'm not saying that I want Ray to stay another season
Im not saying I told you so after last night- I'm simply laughing at the haters.

But I am hearing from people that give a lot more money than I do to the school that Keenum and Strick have promised Ray 5 years and that by God they are going to give it. I can't say that it's gospel and we'll see what happens. I'm just passing along what the talk is.

Yea, and LT promised Croom how many years? Apparently Croom thought is was 10.

[Liverpooldawg]

So Coach, now beating AUBURN in basketball is worthy of celebration? You used to go off on Stans when he didn't beat them bad enough. When we lost to them it was the end of the world. I miss those days. Given where we have fallen to that was a nice win but only because of where we are now. Let's not get carried away.

[Ifyouonlyknew]

I like Ray & want Ray to succeed but no final decision on next year has been made let alone 2yrs. Do Stricklin & Keenum want Ray to be successful? No question but these last 2 games haven't earned him 2yrs not even 1yr yet. Contrary to popular belief Stricklin isn't stupid. He's not tying himself down with any statements about Ray's future right now bc nobody knows what this team will do from day to day. Ray has 13-15 more games to figure out what his tenure will be. Stricklin will guage interest for the job all the while hoping Ray gets this thing turned around for good. That's where we are right now.

[Liverpooldawg]

I'm happy that the team got a road win and broke a losing streak.

That said, let's pump the brakes. Sly Croom beat Nick Saban.

Yep.

[MetEdDawg]

So Coach, now beating AUBURN in basketball is worthy of celebration? You used to go off in Stans when he didn't beat them bad enough. When we lost to them was the end of the world. I miss those days. Given where we have fallen to that was a nice win but only because of where we are now. Let's not get carried away.

It's not worthy of celebration, but we lost to worse Barbee Auburn teams with infinitely better Stansbury teams than we have now under Ray. It's not a celebration, but I think there is something to be said in favor of Ray beating a Bruce Pearl led Auburn team as equals on the road while Stansbury lost some road games to Tony Barbee led Auburn teams when we were heavy favorites.

I don't think any of us are saying celebrate and keep Ray 100%. But we are saying that the team is playing better for sure and we need to rally behind that. It's correct that we were upset under Stansbury if he lost to Auburn. But don't let that fool you into saying we should have kept him and we would wish for those days now. I would not wish for those days at all. That situation was toxic and awful and had to be torn down. We can say we wish for days where we had better expectations and better talent, but I wouldn't wish for the state of our program internally back at all and the subsequent underperforming that almost always followed.

[CadaverDawg]

I'm not saying that I want Ray to stay another season
Im not saying I told you so after last night- I'm simply laughing at the haters.

But I am hearing from people that give a lot more money than I do to the school that Keenum and Strick have promised Ray 5 years and that by God they are going to give it. I can't say that it's gospel and we'll see what happens. I'm just passing along what the talk is.

Why would they give a lot of money to the program if they were making idiotic decisions like that?

[PSYCHO(thesis)DEFENSE]

Best thing we can do is show up to the games, support Ray and the team, and do whatever it is we can to put ourselves on the right track. We need people to show up, we need people to get behind the team, and we just need to watch what unfolds over the next two months. But we need to be all in until it's apparent that a change needs to be made and we aren't at that point currently.

THIS is what fans do. Not declare that the season is over before conference play starts, pull all forms of previous support, & stop enjoying wins in fear they might reflect positively on the coaches.

[Liverpooldawg]

It's not worthy of celebration, but we lost to worse Barbee Auburn teams with infinitely better Stansbury teams than we have now under Ray. It's not a celebration, but I think there is something to be said in favor of Ray beating a Bruce Pearl led Auburn team as equals on the road while Stansbury lost some road games to Tony Barbee led Auburn teams when we were heavy favorites.

I don't think any of us are saying celebrate and keep Ray 100%. But we are saying that the team is playing better for sure and we need to rally behind that. It's correct that we were upset under Stansbury if he lost to Auburn. But don't let that fool you into saying we should have kept him and we would wish for those days now. I would not wish for those days at all. That situation was toxic and awful and had to be torn down. We can say we wish for days where we had better expectations and better talent, but I wouldn't wish for the state of our program internally back at all and the subsequent underperforming that almost always followed.

I miss being upset when we lose. I miss being upset when we didn't win by the ammount we thought we should have. I miss being even close to the bubble. I'm not thrilled with thinking anytime we win over anybody we have done something to get excited about. I have nothing against Ray and I really do hope we have turned the corner. Time will tell on that. it is still "interesting" to see how far some folk's standards have fallen.

[MetEdDawg]

I miss being upset when we lose. I miss being upset when we didn't win by the ammount we thought we should have. I miss being even close to the bubble. I'm not thrilled with thinking anytime we win over anybody we have done something to get excited about. I have nothing against Ray and I really do hope we have turned the corner. Time will tell on that. it is still "interesting" to see how far some folk's standards have fallen.

I will give you the bolded for sure. Two wins in a row doesn't excite me yet. But it does make me reevaluate my stance on the him having to go 100%. The next month of games sucks. Very tough schedule because the SEC is up this year in my opinion, but it's a perfect opportunity to see what this team has and if Ray can build on these two games.

And while I do miss the days of being on the bubble and being in tournaments, I don't miss the almosts and should haves and all the missed opportunities and unreached expectations (which I believe were all very reasonable) we very rarely capitalized on. Those last few years of Stansbury were hard to watch. I don't think I've been more mad than being at the Rider game and watching that unfold.

[engie]

I miss being upset when we lose. I miss being upset when we didn't win by the ammount we thought we should have. I miss being even close to the bubble. I'm not thrilled with thinking anytime we win over anybody we have done something to get excited about. I have nothing against Ray and I really do hope we have turned the corner. Time will tell on that. it is still "interesting" to see how far some folk's standards have fallen.

Being more unhappy now has somehow led you to the conclusion that you actually were happy before?

Just because things got worse doesn't make them all sunshine and rainbows previously. NEITHER is good enough.

[Liverpooldawg]

I wasn't happy, but I wasn't frothing at the mouth with a pitchfork in my hand either. I have seen days like where we are now before in basketball. Perhaps that gave me a different perspective.

[engie]

Seeing us be bad in the distant past doesn't mean we should be ok with being mediocre in the present or future. Perspective has to change when you go from competing with Troy monetarily to being a top 30 revenue athletic department IMO

[Goat from MSU]

Our standards have fallen to a hugh amount ,it like dating a 10 leaving her and going out with the one missing 2 front teeth. 51 times in the past three years we have played a Power 5 team and come out with 12 wins and losing during that time to the likes of Alabama A & M and South Carlonia Upsate. I did not like this hire at all, but let's not get giddy over 2 wins .Let this season played out ,but does he really need 2 more years ?
I miss being upset when we lose. I miss being upset when we didn't win by the ammount we thought we should have. I miss being even close to the bubble. I'm not thrilled with thinking anytime we win over anybody we have done something to get excited about. I have nothing against Ray and I really do hope we have turned the corner. Time will tell on that. it is still "interesting" to see how far some folk's standards have fallen.

[tcdog70]

There is zero chance that Strick and Keenum are actually marrying themselves to Ray right now. It makes for good internet chatter -- but that's about it. They are going to publicly support Ray right up until the day they fire him if it comes to that. The team I've seen the last 3 games and particularly last night is good enough to get Ray another year. The one we've seen otherwise was not.

Still no reason to downplay a win in a building we've never won in before. Our last win in Auburn was in 2008. We'd lost 5 straight there -- several(read most) as heavy favorites.

if we can Play Hard and Smarter like we did Last Night then I can get on Board with this team. Ray's players won that game for Him. We have a Starting 5 that has experience. Ray needs to get out of the Way and let them play. We might win some if they play like last night. Set Ready up and let him shoot. He needs to figure out how to get to the foul line along with Flat-top Fred.

[Coach34]

So Coach, now beating AUBURN in basketball is worthy of celebration? You used to go off on Stans when he didn't beat them bad enough. When we lost to them it was the end of the world. I miss those days. Given where we have fallen to that was a nice win but only because of where we are now. Let's not get carried away.

Well, it was our first win @Auburn is 7 or 8 years...that's something to appreciate

[tcdog70]

I'm not saying that I want Ray to stay another season
Im not saying I told you so after last night- I'm simply laughing at the haters.

But I am hearing from people that give a lot more money than I do to the school that Keenum and Strick have promised Ray 5 years and that by God they are going to give it. I can't say that it's gospel and we'll see what happens. I'm just passing along what the talk is.

People don't hate Ray they Hate his product. MSU fans had grown use to being in every game we played. They had grown accustom to winning 20 games a year. Now we sux. Play like we have the last 2 games and it will all be good.

[dawgs]

if we can Play Hard and Smarter like we did Last Night then I can get on Board with this team. Ray's players won that game for Him. We have a Starting 5 that has experience. Ray needs to get out of the Way and let them play. We might win some if they play like last night. Set Ready up and let him shoot. He needs to figure out how to get to the foul line along with Flat-top Fred.

A starting 5 with experience, exactly. And we still couldn't navigate a crappy non-conference schedule. And what's the ceiling next year when they are a bunch of seniors? NIT? Then we start the cycle over?

[Liverpooldawg]

Seeing us be bad in the distant past doesn't mean we should be ok with being mediocre in the present or future. Perspective has to change when you go from competing with Troy monetarily to being a top 30 revenue athletic department IMO
We were competing with Kentucky and Florida not so long ago and we bitched about it. Now we compete with Carolina Upstate and Auburn and seem to be happy because we beat one of them. I guess that's progress.

[coastdoglover]

You are the only one who loves to stir the pot. As far as Haters, that would only be you during Stansbury's career. Nobody wants Rick Ray to fail, he simply has to show folks he can compete. He has the last 2 games but lets remember how bad Auburn is and this isn't a vintage Vandy team either. If he can split with the Black bears and maybe another decent team in the league, he might give folks hope, but remember, he is playing a team made up mostly of Stansbury recruits. The Ray era has been a financial disaster for basketball and even a dumb AD ought to be able to count the beans and see that. So, you got your fix today and now you can go back to hating. We all get it.





I really dont know what to make of all of this in basketball. I hear one day Ray is done- then I hear from some higher ups Keenum and Strick are locking themselves in and saying 2 more years. This is the most divided Ive seen our people in all my years. Basketball has turned into an ugly battleground

[MetEdDawg]

A starting 5 with experience, exactly. And we still couldn't navigate a crappy non-conference schedule. And what's the ceiling next year when they are a bunch of seniors? NIT? Then we start the cycle over?

I don't think we start the cycle over. We will have Ready as a senior, Dunlap as a junior, N'Doye as a junior, Houston as a junior, Oliver Black as a junior. So we will have some experience there. Plus we have a couple good pieces in this next recruiting class. I think we will have the potential to be decent, then the year after I think we could be very very good.

[engie]

We were competing with Kentucky and Florida not so long ago and we bitched about it. Now we compete with Carolina Upstate and Auburn and seem to be happy because we beat one of them. I guess that's progress.

We didn't bitch about competing with Kentucky and Florida at any point in time. Straw man bullshit.

[msstate7]

A starting 5 with experience, exactly. And we still couldn't navigate a crappy non-conference schedule. And what's the ceiling next year when they are a bunch of seniors? NIT? Then we start the cycle over?
Well to be fair, our experienced (best) players haven't been healthy. Sword and ready are both just now starting to be back from back surgery. Ware got injured in ark state game, only played 5 mins against USC upstate, and 0 mins vs mcneese. We're just now getting those 3 healthy and the results are obvious

[engie]

The Ray era has been a financial disaster for basketball and even a dumb AD ought to be able to count the beans and see that.

You did a pretty good job of keeping it factual until you got to this sentence. Then you went off the reservation.

[messageboardsuperhero]

What's been so disappointing to me about this season is that we actually have a fairly veteran team- but still lack a lot of maturity and consistency. We still look like a team of freshmen out there in many respects and are absolutely clueless when anyone handles the ball outside of Ready.

We should be much further along offensively than we are right now. Hopefully Ready and Sword getting healthy turns that around a good bit.

[TheDogFather]

I'm not saying that I want Ray to stay another season
Im not saying I told you so after last night- I'm simply laughing at the haters.

But I am hearing from people that give a lot more money than I do to the school that Keenum and Strick have promised Ray 5 years and that by God they are going to give it. I can't say that it's gospel and we'll see what happens. I'm just passing along what the talk is.

A post brimming with contradiction. If you are not bragging about something, and you are not an advocate for keeping Ray, then what exactly is funny about the "haters"?

This shit never gets old.

[dawgs]

I don't think we start the cycle over. We will have Ready as a senior, Dunlap as a junior, N'Doye as a junior, Houston as a junior, Oliver Black as a junior. So we will have some experience there. Plus we have a couple good pieces in this next recruiting class. I think we will have the potential to be decent, then the year after I think we could be very very good.

In 3 years of playing a ton of minutes, this is where we are with the current core of players, not sure why you'd expect a bunch of lower rated recruits to develop into a "very very good" team after playing a backup role their first few years.

[JohnnyQuid]

This is kinda my problem with all this, not that I'm not happy as hell for the players who're working their butts off they deserve to win, but one of the rallying calls when we were winning 20 games was that we need a coach to take us to the NEXT LEVEL (we're definately on a different level atm, although prolly not that "next" level) / current coach cant get us past 2nd round ncaa / and ofc the off court issues that were a problem and not disputing that. Now we're onto pounding our chest over a 2 game winning streak with our jr laden basketball team over a bad vandy team and auburn in yr 1 of a rebuild. All things being equal if I were one of those ppl aforementioned I'd have a hard time gloating about this current 2 game winning streak or acting like you've been proven right cos of it.

[sandwolf]

You did a pretty good job of keeping it factual until you got to this sentence. Then you went off the reservation.

I am assuming that you are taking issue with the 'disaster' part of the post? Because I would have a hard time believing that the basketball program hasn't taken a pretty good hit financially since Ray took over.

[DudyDawg]

I'm not saying that I want Ray to stay another season
Im not saying I told you so after last night- I'm simply laughing at the haters.

But I am hearing from people that give a lot more money than I do to the school that Keenum and Strick have promised Ray 5 years and that by God they are going to give it. I can't say that it's gospel and we'll see what happens. I'm just passing along what the talk is.

So you've started a thread saying the work is being done to fire him after this year and now you say it'll be two more. I guess you'll be right one way or the other. Truth is, you don't know what you're talking about. None of us do. You're just stirring stuff

As far as last night and vandy, definitely big wins for where we are. In the past it may not have been, but at least in our current situation people have to look at it positively as a good start

[engie]

I am assuming that you are taking issue with the 'disaster' part of the post? Because I would have a hard time believing that the basketball program hasn't taken a pretty good hit financially since Ray took over.

No, my problem was with the revenue part of the post. I've posted the year by year numbers a couple of times already -- publicly available thru equity in athletics data. In only 3 of 14 years under Stansbury did we bring in more $$ than we did in the first 2 disaster years under Ray.

There are plenty of things to take issue with Ray about. Legitimate things. Basketball revenue is not on of this things. People may not be coming to games -- but they are still buying tickets...

[DudyDawg]

No, my problem was with the revenue part of the post. I've posted the year by year numbers a couple of times already -- publicly available thru equity in athletics data. In only 3 of 14 years under Stansbury did we bring in more $$ than we did in the first 2 disaster years under Ray.

There are plenty of things to take issue with Ray about. Legitimate things. Basketball revenue is not on of this things. People may not be coming to games -- but they are still buying tickets...

How much of Ray's tenure revenue has come from the new TV deals?

[engie]

How much of Ray's tenure revenue has come from the new TV deals?

0$. TV money is separated out in the revenue breakdown....

Eta: the money went up significantly with the reseating of the Hump. I'm unsure how NCAA tourney revenue factors, as the sec has gotten smaller and smaller pieces of the pie. But our "Hump revenue" is prettymuch tapped out as is regardless...

People need to understand that concessions, etc are subbed to Aramark. The school doesn't really see that $$ in good times or bad...

[DudyDawg]

0$. TV money is separated out in the revenue breakdown....

Gotcha. Not a money guy.

[coastdoglover]

Yes, about 5000 season tickets but lost a ton of revenue for the actual seat donations. If you can't see the difference in revenue, then you are either blind or someone is cooking the books just like when we draw around 1500 for a game and then put over 5000 as attendance. Lots of folks bailed out on the "money" seats and it is quite evident by watching a game. One game we barely had enough to pay the SEC officials for working the game. Factor in the revenues lost from people who used to travel to Starkville and stay in motels and dine out, it has been a disaster. Not much use arguing it, we have what we have and it is up to the present staff and administration to get it right.



No, my problem was with the revenue part of the post. I've posted the year by year numbers a couple of times already -- publicly available thru equity in athletics data. In only 3 of 14 years under Stansbury did we bring in more $$ than we did in the first 2 disaster years under Ray.

There are plenty of things to take issue with Ray about. Legitimate things. Basketball revenue is not on of this things. People may not be coming to games -- but they are still buying tickets...

[sandwolf]

No, my problem was with the revenue part of the post. I've posted the year by year numbers a couple of times already -- publicly available thru equity in athletics data. In only 3 of 14 years under Stansbury did we bring in more $$ than we did in the first 2 disaster years under Ray.

There are plenty of things to take issue with Ray about. Legitimate things. Basketball revenue is not on of this things. People may not be coming to games -- but they are still buying tickets...


0$. TV money is separated out in the revenue breakdown....

Eta: the money went up significantly with the reseating of the Hump. I'm unsure how NCAA tourney revenue factors, as the sec has gotten smaller and smaller pieces of the pie. But our "Hump revenue" is prettymuch tapped out as is regardless...

People need to understand that concessions, etc are subbed to Aramark. The school doesn't really see that $$ in good times or bad...

Oh ok, I got ya. Never would have guessed that to be the case.

[engie]

Yes, about 5000 season tickets but lost a ton of revenue for the actual seat donations.
Stating it multiple times still isn't going to make it true. We know -- you love Stans. Don't like Strick. Don't like Ray. No need to make up an alternate reality to suit your agenda. Plenty of legitimate stuff to base it in instead of faux bs.


If you can't see the difference in revenue, then you are either blind
Twice you've gone there -- after I explained the hard revenue figures sitting directly in front of me.


someone is cooking the books just like when we draw around 1500 for a game and then put over 5000 as attendance.
A sold ticket is a sold ticket.

You are really accusing the athletics department of committing fraudulent accounting practices on a federal level in order to "lie" about the amount of money it's bringing in under Rick Ray? Seriously?


Lots of folks bailed out on the "money" seats and it is quite evident by watching a game.
How does their failure to attend show that they "bailed" on anything? They are obviously still buying their tickets.


One game we barely had enough to pay the SEC officials for working the game.
geezer pls.


Factor in the revenues lost from people who used to travel to Starkville and stay in motels and dine out, it has been a disaster.
An unattainable number that has no direct effect on our basketball team whatsoever.


Not much use arguing it, we have what we have and it is up to the present staff and administration to get it right.
You obviously feel plenty of use in arguing it. Or you wouldn't have...

[engie]

Revenues - All Sports and Men's
Survey Year Basketball Men's Team Revenue
2003 3563988
2004 4755466
2005 4753245
2006 4460009
2007 5404737
2008 6197698
2009 8205804
2010 6914565
2011 7002963
2012 6744710
2013 6571274

[CadaverDawg]

This is kinda my problem with all this, not that I'm not happy as hell for the players who're working their butts off they deserve to win, but one of the rallying calls when we were winning 20 games was that we need a coach to take us to the NEXT LEVEL (we're definately on a different level atm, although prolly not that "next" level) / current coach cant get us past 2nd round ncaa / and ofc the off court issues that were a problem and not disputing that. Now we're onto pounding our chest over a 2 game winning streak with our jr laden basketball team over a bad vandy team and auburn in yr 1 of a rebuild. All things being equal if I were one of those ppl aforementioned I'd have a hard time gloating about this current 2 game winning streak or acting like you've been proven right cos of it.

Good post

[CadaverDawg]

So you've started a thread saying the work is being done to fire him after this year and now you say it'll be two more. I guess you'll be right one way or the other. Truth is, you don't know what you're talking about. None of us do. You're just stirring stuff


Haha

[Coach34]

So you've started a thread saying the work is being done to fire him after this year and now you say it'll be two more. I guess you'll be right one way or the other. Truth is, you don't know what you're talking about. None of us do. You're just stirring stuff


As I said earlier- been told 2 different things now from 2 different people. I agree in that it sounds like nobody knows at this juncture.

[Dawg61]

You did a pretty good job of keeping it factual until you got to this sentence. Then you went off the reservation.

Engie the Hump has been an embarrassment. An unacceptable home atmosphere for a Power 5 school. How can you argue differently? Did you see Auburn's crowd last night? They had a ****ing DJ in the stands last night. They were sold out, standing and going NUTS against a team that has lost to SC Upstate, McNeese St. and Arkansas St. You keep spitting out cooked books numbers for a half sold out stadium and blatantly lying that MSU makes zero off concessions. BULLSHIT!! MSU splits the money with Aramark. We don't give out prime real estate to food distributors for nothing dude. That thought is going off the reservation. With a half sold out stadium and still clearing 6 mill a year it doesn't take Engie mathstatictics to realize we would be increasing money in the several MILLIONS with a fully sold out stadium. That's not even touching the MILLIONS that the Starkville economy would be bringing in. Our ghost town Hump brings in 6 mill a year yet it has the potential to bring in a shit ton more and you aren't pissed by it? Weird.

[Thick]

Damn, some of you guys live to bash Coach34. Here's the problem, the fanbase wants Ray gone, the bball donors are saying "I told you so", but Stricklin is saying that Ray deserves 2 more years. So after back to back wins, everybody thinks there is a "chance" that the team might be coming around. The season has to play out before anything is done. It all depends on the competitiveness down the stretch, not necessarily wins. Scott is looking for improvement to cement his stance that the program is heading in the right direction under his guy. Keenum will back him unless the wheels come off. If or when this happens, the big donors are going to bypass Scott this time, and go directly to Keenum to make a change.

[engie]

Engie the Hump has been an embarrassment. An unacceptable home atmosphere for a Power 5 school. How can you argue differently?
Nice argument against air. Please show where I said a damn thing about our "atmosphere"?

There's simply a BIG difference between saying "the atmosphere sucks and is a shell of what it should be" and saying "the basketball team is going broke and can't afford to pay referees!1!1!".


Did you see Auburn's crowd last night? They had a ****ing DJ in the stands last night. They were sold out, standing and going NUTS against a team that has lost to SC Upstate, McNeese St. and Arkansas St.
And? I've commented multiple times on how good Auburn's atmosphere was last night.


You keep spitting out cooked books numbers for a half sold out stadium and blatantly lying that MSU makes zero off concessions. BULLSHIT!! MSU splits the money with Aramark.
Show me this split in the contract. Oh wait -- that's right -- you are just making it up as you go.

Aramark pays us a lump sum for our concession business across all sports. MSU doesn't split anything with Aramark. I feel like I've already explained this in such a way that anyone with a shred of common sense would have already understood.

I sure wish we could sell out Humphrey Stadium though**


We don't give out prime real estate to food distributors for nothing dude. That thought is going off the reservation.
Everything you've said in this post has been off the reservation. But that's nothing new.


With a half sold out stadium and still clearing 6 mill a year it doesn't take Engie mathstatictics to realize we would be increasing money in the several MILLIONS with a fully sold out stadium.
Why weren't we raking in "SEVERAL MILLIONS" more when the "stadium" was sold out then?

Because our seating revenue is within about $1mil of being maxed out is why. Do you think we artificially change ticket prices yearly? ALL THE MONEY SEATS ARE SELLING EVERY SINGLE YEAR. Whether people are showing up to sit in them is immaterial to the point I was making. What part of that is impossible for you to understand?


That's not even touching the MILLIONS that the Starkville economy would be bringing in.
Another unquantifiable argument against a point that I never once made.


Our ghost town Hump brings in 6 mill a year yet it has the potential to bring in a shit ton more and you aren't pissed by it? Weird.
I just like to base my arguments in tangible reality rather than ignorance. Although I know better than expecting you to do the same.

[engie]

Basically:

engie - The basketball program lacks alot of stuff -- but financial issues per our own school-released numbers are being drastically overstated.

d61 - The atmosphere sucks and your dubmass is taking up for it!1!1 We get half the money from concessions in Hump Stadium!11!!1

It ****ing pisses me off that some of increase your bitching level ten-fold to the point you are making up an argument in your head to rally against that no one is even saying when it appears things have the potential to go well for us. We can't have that after all.

[Dawg61]

Aramark doesn't ONLY pay a lump sum. That's beyond ****ing retarded business.

[Bama_Dawg]

Hey guys, don't know how pertinent this is, but I found this Aramark Concessions Contract (with the University of Cincinnati) from 2012. I think they are pretty standard, but sure, some alterations can be made. Section 7 goes into who gets what money:

https://www.uc.edu/content/dam/uc/sald/docs/CSB%20Documents/UC_Football_Contract.pdf

I do not know what the contract between Aramark and Mississippi State University contains, but if its close to this one, State gets a percentage of each sale, depending on type of item sold. Again, State may have another agreement. If you know what that agreement is, I think the group would like to know.

[Liverpooldawg]

We didn't bitch about competing with Kentucky and Florida at any point in time. Straw man bullshit.

Yes we did. Every time we got close but didn't beat them. Memories are short.

[engie]

Aramark doesn't ONLY pay a lump sum. That's beyond ****ing retarded business.

Then show me our concession revenue variation over the years.

I guess Adidas and Learfield don't only pay lump sums either. Beyond ****ing retarded business, as you say**

[Liverpooldawg]

Revenues - All Sports and Men's
Survey Year Basketball Men's Team Revenue
2003 3563988
2004 4755466
2005 4753245
2006 4460009
2007 5404737
2008 6197698
2009 8205804
2010 6914565
2011 7002963
2012 6744710
2013 6571274

You are aware that there have been ticket price increases, drastic ones, during that time?

[Dawg61]

Hey guys, don't know how pertinent this is, but I found this Aramark Concessions Contract (with the University of Cincinnati) from 2012. I think they are pretty standard, but sure, some alterations can be made. Section 7 goes into who gets what money:

https://www.uc.edu/content/dam/uc/sald/docs/CSB%20Documents/UC_Football_Contract.pdf

I do not know what the contract between Aramark and Mississippi State University contains, but if its close to this one, State gets a percentage of each sale, depending on type of item sold. Again, State may have another agreement. If you know what that agreement is, I think the group would like to know.

Hmmm real shocker we make more money when more fans show up.**

[engie]

Yes we did. Every time we got close but didn't beat them. Memories are short.

People bitched about the fact that we were good enough to always stay in games with Kentucky and Florida -- while getting thumped and not giving a crap by Rider, East Tennessee St, etc. That isn't "bitching about competing with Kentucky and Florida". That's bitching about NOT competing against the inferior teams that cost us a number of opportunities at dancing and almost always, even in many of our better years, set us up as an 8 or a 9-seed having to go through a 1 or 2 to accomplish our ultimate goal of making it through the opening weekend in the tournament(Stans has the distinction of being longest tenured power(6) head coach without a Sweet16 in the 3+ decades I've looked at).

It's about the total body of work. Total body of work says that Stansbury went RPI:
00 - 140
01 - 34
02 - 12
03 - 27
04 - 8
05 - 30
06 - 108
07 - 59
08 - 41
09 - 66
10 - 61
11 - 121
12 - 83

5 years straight in the top 30 -- to never crack the top 40 in the final 7 and only once crack the top 50. At some point -- you are either happy being a top 100/NIT team -- or you try to be an NCAA team and have an opportunity to make a run -- something the last coach actually did twice.

That doesn't mean hiring Ray was the correct answer. However, Ray did lead in Lexington and was within 1 of Florida at halftime last year playing with 7 guys. So does that put him above reproach in your mind? Given your listed standards, it probably should.

[engie]

You are aware that there have been ticket price increases, drastic ones, during that time?

No, I wasn't aware -- and didn't distinctly lay out what increased the revenue(the Hump reseating) in a previous post in this very thread**

It's always funny how these numbers put the Stansbury guys into a total hissy fit. Why is it so hard to accept that YES there are major issues with our program right now and that YES there is some money being left on the table -- but we actually ARE NOT struggling to keep the lights on and the ACTUAL financial situation isn't NEARLY as dire as it appears by looking at the empty seats? What is so hard to accept that no one is happy with how things have been going -- and argue on that basis rather than made up BS about financial burdens that do not actually exist for today's MSU?

I feel like what I was actually arguing was clear. But a faction of you will, regardless, try to make it into something it isn't. Because you don't like what reality tells you.

[Liverpooldawg]

People bitched about the fact that we were good enough to always stay in games with Kentucky and Florida -- while getting thumped and not giving a crap by Rider, East Tennessee St, etc. That isn't "bitching about competing with Kentucky and Florida". That's bitching about NOT competing against the inferior teams that cost us a number of opportunities at dancing and almost always, even in many of our better years, set us up as an 8 or a 9-seed having to go through a 1 or 2 to accomplish our ultimate goal of making it through the opening weekend in the tournament(Stans has the distinction of being longest tenured power(6) head coach without a Sweet16 in the 3+ decades I've looked at).

It's about the total body of work. Total body of work says that Stansbury went RPI:
00 - 140
01 - 34
02 - 12
03 - 27
04 - 8
05 - 30
06 - 108
07 - 59
08 - 41
09 - 66
10 - 61
11 - 121
12 - 83

5 years straight in the top 30 -- to never crack the top 40 in the final 7 and only once crack the top 50. At some point -- you are either happy being a top 100/NIT team -- or you try to be an NCAA team and have an opportunity to make a run -- something the last coach actually did twice.

That doesn't mean hiring Ray was the correct answer. However, Ray did lead in Lexington and was within 1 of Florida at halftime last year playing with 7 guys. So does that put him above reproach in your mind? Given your listed standards, it probably should.

Oh, so we DID bitch about competing with those guys. What's our RPI now?

[engie]

Oh, so we DID bitch about competing with those guys. What's our RPI now?

No -- we didn't bitch about competing with those guys. You either can't read or you choose not to.

Link where anyone said they were happy with the situation right now? By all means -- keep making up bs talking points in order to argue against yourself though.

[TheDogFather]

Well, it was our first win @Auburn is 7 or 8 years...that's something to appreciate

So I guess the ass whipping Stansbury gave them at Auburn in 2011 doesn't count. Your dribble has become elementary bullshit

[engie]

So I guess the ass whipping Stansbury gave them at Auburn in 2011 doesn't count. Your dribble has become elementary bullshit

I don't know how anyone could have missed that ass whipping**

http://my.jetscreenshot.com/12222/m_20150122-cpgm-57kb.jpg (http://my.jetscreenshot.com/12222/20150122-cpgm-57kb)

[Liverpooldawg]

No -- we didn't bitch about competing with those guys. You either can't read or you choose not to.

Link where anyone said they were happy with the situation right now? By all means -- keep making up bs talking points in order to argue against yourself though.
I read what you wrote. I stand by my statement. Your memory is willfully short. What is our RPI now? YOU brought that up

[TheRef]

Yeah that was our first win at Auburn since February 9, 2008.

[engie]

I read what you wrote. I stand by my statement. Your memory is willfully short. What is our RPI now? YOU brought that up

My memory is willfully short -- or your attention span is willfully short? With all this rampant bitching that went on, I'd expect it would be easy for you to link for us. I'm now asking for the 3rd time -- although I expect more of the same posturing from you.

Since this is the pertinent barometer for success in your eyes -- you feel we should have extended Ray last year, correct? You are making it the foundation of your position, after all...

Our current RPI would only be of relevance if anyone was promoting some idea that people are happy with our current position. No one is doing that. No one is happy. Hence how you are arguing against air.

I get it -- Poor ole MSU LUCKY to be a top 100 regular season team and damn all the idiots that ever would have sought to achieve better than that!11!1** Hey -- Northwestern, Nebraska, Rutgers, South Carolina, Virginia Tech, Oregon St, and Arizona St have longer Sweet 16 droughts among the power 5 than us. 57th of 65 deserves a lifetime contract as long as you are more often than not among the ~ 100 teams that win 20 games every year. Pardon us for expecting more after 15 years -- after Rod f'n Barnes took the boys up the road to the Sweet 16(and somehow managed to NOT get a lifetime contract)...

[Liverpooldawg]

Was our RPI better when we fired Stans or 3 years into the new regime? I was repeatedly told all we had to do was get rid of Stans. I was repeatedly told ANYBODY would be better. Well Stans has been gone 3 years. How has our RPI stacked up since we got rid of "only" thing holding us back? Nobody is arguing we had problems back then, but I would gladly trade the problems we have now for the ones we had back then. We are much farther from where we all want to be now than we were then. Refusing to ackooledge that FACT is what invalidates most arguments like yours now. I hope they prove me wrong. I love MSU basketball. I have ever since I was a student and Bob Boyd was running the four corners.

[Coach34]

I was repeatedly told ANYBODY would be better. .

You got a link for that???

Stands put us in a huge hole. Now I agree Ray should have a better basketball team this year- but Stands left us in a cluster**** that took 2 years to overcome.

[Coach34]

Hell, nobody said Stands couldnt recruit. We spent alot of money over the years making it happen. Alot of that is not happening now. Thus- the drop in recruiting. This shit aint hard to figure out.

What was said alot was that Stands was a shitty bench coach. And he was. And still is. He is a recruiter. Good recruiting hides shitty coaching a good bit until you get to the NCAA Tourney

Ray can coach- but his recruiting to this point has been awful. Its looking better down the road- the only question is whether he can survive long enough to see it to fruition.

[engie]

Was our RPI better when we fired Stans or 3 years into the new regime?
That's got what to do with anything? Stans' last 3 weren't good enough. Ray's first 3 aren't good enough. This isn't nearly as difficult to comprehend as you are making it.


I was repeatedly told all we had to do was get rid of Stans. I was repeatedly told ANYBODY would be better.
Calling bs again. And asking for a link for the FOURTH time now.


Well Stans has been gone 3 years. How has our RPI stacked up since we got rid of "only" thing holding us back?
Hard to know the correct answer when the only person you are actually arguing against is a yourself...


Nobody is arguing we had problems back then, but I would gladly trade the problems we have now for the ones we had back then.
And no one is arguing otherwise. The point remains -- was what we were then "good enough" for you? Because it wasn't for me -- and it wasn't for the majority of our fanbase. It won't be enough a decade from now either. That doesn't make now "good enough".


We are much farther from where we all want to be now than we were then. Refusing to ackooledge that FACT is what invalidates most arguments like yours now.
Except I haven't actually argued that we are "closer" to where we need to be now than we were then. I HAVE NOT REMOTELY SAID ANYTHING THAT CAN EVEN BE CONSTRUED AS SUCH.

Yet another example where you are, again, making up phantom positions so you can argue against yourself while attributing them to everyone else.


I hope they prove me wrong. I love MSU basketball. I have ever since I was a student and Bob Boyd was running the four corners.
You are the only one that wants to win around here and everyone else wants to lose? I don't understand why people feel the need to validate anything like this.

[DudyDawg]

So I guess the ass whipping Stansbury gave them at Auburn in 2011 doesn't count. Your dribble has become elementary bullshit

Ha you loook dumb.

[Liverpooldawg]

You got a link for that???

Stands put us in a huge hole. Now I agree Ray should have a better basketball team this year- but Stands left us in a cluster**** that took 2 years to overcome.

LOL, the bit dog always yelps. I don't file links from three years ago on that other board. I ain't NYOD.

[Liverpooldawg]

That's got what to do with anything? Stans' last 3 weren't good enough. Ray's first 3 aren't good enough. This isn't nearly as difficult to comprehend as you are making it.


Calling bs again. And asking for a link for the FOURTH time now.


Hard to know the correct answer when the only person you are actually arguing against is a yourself...


And no one is arguing otherwise. The point remains -- was what we were then "good enough" for you? Because it wasn't for me -- and it wasn't for the majority of our fanbase. It won't be enough a decade from now either. That doesn't make now "good enough".


Except I haven't actually argued that we are "closer" to where we need to be now than we were then. I HAVE NOT REMOTELY SAID ANYTHING THAT CAN EVEN BE CONSTRUED AS SUCH.

Yet another example where you are, again, making up phantom positions so you can argue against yourself while attributing them to everyone else.


You are the only one that wants to win around here and everyone else wants to lose? I don't understand why people feel the need to validate anything like this.

Not doing the bullet point thing. Who said we were good enough then? I certainly would take then over now based on Wins though. We made a huge mistake if you evaluate it by wins and losses. Maybe you prefer another measure. Maybe we can turn it around. It's going to take more than two wins to do that though.

[Coach34]

LOL, the bit dog always yelps. I don't file links from three years ago on that other board. I ain't NYOD.

they have a search feature...plug in "anybody" and see what comes up since you claim it was said

[Liverpooldawg]

Ok coach, whatever you say, lol. You can dig it up if you want to. Y'all got your wish, you won. it really doesn't matter now. We have to live with where we are.

[engie]

Not doing the bullet point thing. Who said we were good enough then? I certainly would take then over now based on Wins though. We made a huge mistake if you evaluate it by wins and losses. Maybe you prefer another measure. Maybe we can turn it around. It's going to take more than two wins to do that though.

No one is comparing then to now but you...

A failing grade is a failing grade. The fact that it got worse before it eventually gets better is negligible. Either you were happy with where we were and wanted to stay there -- or you wanted to strive for more. Moving on from Stansbury and Stricklin messing up the hiring process are two separate events.

[engie]

Ok coach, whatever you say, lol. You can dig it up if you want to. Y'all got your wish, you won. it really doesn't matter now. We have to live with where we are.

Why would anyone go look for your unicorn for you?

- Make claims about positions that no one actually ever had.
- Argue against stances people actually aren't taking.

Is this real life?

[Liverpooldawg]

Why would anyone go look for your unicorn for you?

- Make claims about positions that no one actually ever had.
- Argue against stances people actually aren't taking.

Is this real life?
When the opposition in any debate brings up unicorns you know you have won. LOL. Y'all won, Stans is long gone. I'm glad you are happy.

[Liverpooldawg]

No one is comparing then to now but you...

A failing grade is a failing grade. The fact that it got worse before it eventually gets better is negligible. Either you were happy with where we were and wanted to stay there -- or you wanted to strive for more. Moving on from Stansbury and Stricklin messing up the hiring process are two separate events.
Strickland did the best he could. NOBODY wanted the job. evidence: we paid over market for what we got. Wait one year and it would have been different.

[dawgs]

My memory is willfully short -- or your attention span is willfully short? With all this rampant bitching that went on, I'd expect it would be easy for you to link for us. I'm now asking for the 3rd time -- although I expect more of the same posturing from you.

Since this is the pertinent barometer for success in your eyes -- you feel we should have extended Ray last year, correct? You are making it the foundation of your position, after all...

Our current RPI would only be of relevance if anyone was promoting some idea that people are happy with our current position. No one is doing that. No one is happy. Hence how you are arguing against air.

I get it -- Poor ole MSU LUCKY to be a top 100 regular season team and damn all the idiots that ever would have sought to achieve better than that!11!1** Hey -- Northwestern, Nebraska, Rutgers, South Carolina, Virginia Tech, Oregon St, and Arizona St have longer Sweet 16 droughts among the power 5 than us. 57th of 65 deserves a lifetime contract as long as you are more often than not among the ~ 100 teams that win 20 games every year. Pardon us for expecting more after 15 years -- after Rod f'n Barnes took the boys up the road to the Sweet 16(and somehow managed to NOT get a lifetime contract)...

Just because we aren't buying back into ray after 2 games doesn't mean we think Stans should've never been fired. That's why I hate these discussions on the boards, everyone gets painted into a pro Stans/never gave ray a chance guy or a Stans hater/ray should have 6 years to turn it around guy.

[dawgs]

Strickland did the best he could. NOBODY wanted the job. evidence: we paid over market for what we got. Wait one year and it would have been different.

We should've gone over market for a proven HC. I would rather us spend $3M for a guy that's built a winning program than spend $1M on a guy that's never been better than an assistant at clemson and Purdue. I refuse to believe that if we'd offered 80% of the mid major coaches tossed around $2+M/season that they all would've walked away from it. When you've ****ed yourself up as bad as we must've, then sometimes you gotta buy your way out of it. Instead we put duct tape over it and crossed our fingers it'd work out.

[Dawg61]

Ray can coach

What the **** are you watching? Ray can coach defense. That's it. He has no semblance of an idea on how to coach offense. Junior High coaches can coach offense better than Ray. It's a major problem and it's never going away with him as HC. We've seen enough. Hiring new assistants won't help. The head man can NOT coach offense. We can sweep it away and ignore it till later but I promise you we will eventually have to get a new head coach. I hate it for Ray because unlike many will believe there's a lot about Ray that I really do like. He's a hard worker. He has brought accountability to the players. We don't hear of marijuana problems anymore. We almost never hear of fights anymore. We don't have players that walk up the court and park their fat asses in the paint anymore. We don't have a coach that claps like a transsexual anymore. We don't have a coach that parades his kids around the Hump like it's their living room anymore. Ray looks sharp in a suit. He has filled the team with athletes and a few ankle biters. I can forgive the ankle biters if Ready gets Chris Paul aggressive and Ray actually brings in deadeye shooters. I was excited for the Auburn game. We won. Now I'm even more excited for Georgia. I think with Ray's team next year and the four players coming in ( counting Zuppardo) we can actually be top 5 SEC buttttt we'll never actually reach our potential EVER because we have an offense ranked 350th in assits. I think the wise move is to let Ray go at the end of this year. The new much much better offensive coach will have a senior laden team to work with and an entire year to recruit and sign as many guys as he likes. With Ray's team and an offensive coach we can make the NCAA next year. It's certainly cutthroat but it's what's eventually going to have to be done. Ray can't coach offense guys.

[DudyDawg]

Ray can coach- but his recruiting to this point has been awful.

Haha. Wuuuuut. His recruiting has been stellar compared to his coaching so far. He's made few in game or in season or in career adjustments that show he can coach. His handling of the press and our effective zone against auburn have been the only effective and noticable coaching adjustments he's made. He, and the team, stood out against them. Other than that, he hasn't shown a thing.

[I seen it dawg]

When the opposition in any debate brings up unicorns you know you have won. LOL. Y'all won, Stans is long gone. I'm glad you are happy.

Typical of rooting for a coach instead of the school. I could give a shit who coaches the team. The team needs is what's inportant. Stains drove the TEAM into a dumpster fire and that can't be argued. Ray isn't getting it out with wins and losses. People need to get over that this is a Stains-Ray thing. We are happy Stains is gone because the program was a shitstorm under his watch at the end.

I wish Ray (who so far isn't the answer) would have been given all the support when he got here that Stains had. Instead the Stains faction (who care more about him than the school) shut down and vanished like a ****ing 3 yr old who won't share their toys. Our program needed help the most at that time and the people it always got it from walked. Crybaby bitches.

[Jack Lambert]

Before the last 2 games it was the most united I've seen our fanbase in years, and not in a good way for Rick Ray. But hey, all anyone wants is a reasonably competitive program. If Ray gets this thing turned around and we finish the year strong he probably deserves one more year to see this through. I still think he's got to win around 6 SEC games minimum though but after tonight's win that is starting to look very attainable. We will see.

wait two more games and it will turn back also if they lose to Ole Miss twice and he is done.

[PSYCHO(thesis)DEFENSE]

Typical of rooting for a coach instead of the school. I could give a shit who coaches the team. The team needs is what's inportant. Stains drove the TEAM into a dumpster fire and that can't be argued. Ray isn't getting it out with wins and losses. People need to get over that this is a Stains-Ray thing. We are happy Stains is gone because the program was a shitstorm under his watch at the end.

I wish Ray (who so far isn't the answer) would have been given all the support when he got here that Stains had. Instead the Stains faction (who care more about him than the school) shut down and vanished like a ****ing 3 yr old who won't share their toys. Our program needed help the most at that time and the people it always got it from walked. Crybaby bitches.

seen that

[engie]

When the opposition in any debate brings up unicorns you know you have won. LOL. Y'all won, Stans is long gone. I'm glad you are happy.
You think you "won" because you made up a bunch of bullshit you can't back up and defeated yourself in an argument?

[engie]

Strickland did the best he could. NOBODY wanted the job. evidence: we paid over market for what we got. Wait one year and it would have been different.
So, you think the job was magically going to become MORE attractive after another year of floundering?

The job wasn't unattractive because of when Stans left(READ: LEFT, RESIGNED, HUNG IT UP. He was NOT fired, nor would he have been fired. He was given an ultimatum of change that he couldn't/wouldn't accept).

It was unattractive because of the condition the program was in. And after over two full rosters of inmates running the asylum, it was VERY apparent that it wasn't going to change.

[engie]

Just because we aren't buying back into ray after 2 games doesn't mean we think Stans should've never been fired. That's why I hate these discussions on the boards, everyone gets painted into a pro Stans/never gave ray a chance guy or a Stans hater/ray should have 6 years to turn it around guy.

No one painted you in any way whatsoever. You weren't quoted. You weren't talked to. You weren't talked about. I painted with a very narrow brush. A direct quote -- to another person(not dawgs) including "you" or some variation thereof at least EIGHT times that I counted -- and you claim personal misrepresentation? This really is the twilight zone.

[Liverpooldawg]

Typical of rooting for a coach instead of the school. I could give a shit who coaches the team. The team needs is what's inportant. Stains drove the TEAM into a dumpster fire and that can't be argued. Ray isn't getting it out with wins and losses. People need to get over that this is a Stains-Ray thing. We are happy Stains is gone because the program was a shitstorm under his watch at the end.

I wish Ray (who so far isn't the answer) would have been given all the support when he got here that Stains had. Instead the Stains faction (who care more about him than the school) shut down and vanished like a ****ing 3 yr old who won't share their toys. Our program needed help the most at that time and the people it always got it from walked. Crybaby bitches.

The reason I cared about how we let Stans go is because I love the school. What we did hurt the basketball program in a BIG way. That much is objectively obvious now. That's the only reason any of us who did not support what happened feel the way we do.

I'll turn one of your statements on it's head. If STANS had been given the type of support the last three years of his career that you wish Ray had got then he would still be here and we would still be winning 20+ games a year. If y'all had worked to support what we had instead of trying for years to bring it down then we might still have it and then some. You let your hate of the coach get in the way of your support of the school. Like it when it's turned back your way?

[Liverpooldawg]

You think you "won" because you made up a bunch of bullshit you can't back up and defeated yourself in an argument?

If you say so man! LOL. Just you think it's bs doesn't mean it is. Same for me.

[maroonmania]

Strickland did the best he could. NOBODY wanted the job. evidence: we paid over market for what we got. Wait one year and it would have been different.

Can someone explain to me why the MSU job would have been so much more attractive if we had waited another year before letting Stans go? I mean other than Strickland might have been more prepared to hire another coach given I don't think when he initially sat down with Stans after that last season he thought it was going to lead to Stans "retiring".

[TheRef]

Endless circle of arguments...nope.

[I seen it dawg]

I
The reason I cared about how we let Stans go is because I love the school. What we did hurt the basketball program in a BIG way. That much is objectively obvious now. That's the only reason any of us who did not support what happened feel the way we do.

I'll turn one of your statements on it's head. If STANS had been given the type of support the last three years of his career that you wish Ray had got then he would still be here and we would still be winning 20+ games a year. If y'all had worked to support what we had instead of trying for years to bring it down then we might still have it and then some. You let your hate of the coach get in the way of your support of the school. Like it when it's turned back your way?

****ing bullshit