Mark Schlabach leaves MSU out of pre-season top 25

[ShotgunDawg]

http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/12138345/tcu-leads-2015-way-too-early-top-25-rankings

Well, here we go again I guess. I have no idea why this keeps happening. I'm at a loss.

[Coach34]

The mantra is we lost too many "starters" to be any good next year- and Mullen doesn't recruit well enough to overcome it. I laughed reading that shit on Bafoom.

They are too stupid to realize that Jones, Redmond, Ross, etc weren't listed as starters but were the best players at their position.

[ShotgunDawg]

The mantra is we lost too many "starters" to be any good next year- and Mullen doesn't recruit well enough to overcome it. I laughed reading that shit on Bafoom.

They are too stupid to realize that Jones, Redmond, Ross, etc weren't listed as starters but were the best players at their position.

I agree, but this, again, shows the pure laziness of the media. Anything can happen, but, with Dak returning, it's absolutely ridiculous to say we aren't a top 25 team.

[Dawgface]

Has Dak officially announced he's coming back? Many may think he's not coming back.

[CadaverDawg]

Hell, after what I saw once we became #1, I'll take being overlooked to start the season. We proved we can climb the ladder by winning, so I'd prefer us not having a target on our back to start the year.

[ShotgunDawg]

Has Dak officially announced he's coming back? Many may think he's not coming back.

Possibly, he did officially start grad school yesterday though. It wouldn't have been difficult to figure out he's coming back if someone cared in the slightest.

[ShotgunDawg]

Hell, after what I saw once we became #1, I'll take being overlooked to start the season. We proved we can climb the ladder by winning, so I'd prefer us not having a target on our back to start the year.

True, but my issue is that this is our perception and how recruits look at us as well. Ole Miss is #11 on the list and they don't have a quarterback, lost good players on defense, and cannot run the ball. However, for some reason, their perception is different.

There is a missing ingredient in the soup that promotes MSU football. For this to keep happening means that something simply isn't right.

[Bothrops]

When I saw OM at #11 l clicked her off.

[CadaverDawg]

When I saw OM at #11 l clicked her off.

Yea, Ole Miss at 11 is ridiculous. These media guys can't see football outside of what's on a piece of paper. their mindset...

"Ole Miss had a top 5 recruiting class 3 years ago, so all those guys will be Juniors....they should be really really good". Most of these guys probably think Wallace returns next season. They clearly do little to no homework.

[bluelightstar]

True, but my issue is that this is our perception and how recruits look at us as well. Ole Miss is #11 on the list and they don't have a quarterback, lost good players on defense, and cannot run the ball. However, for some reason, their perception is different.

There is a missing ingredient in the soup that promotes MSU football. For this to keep happening means that something simply isn't right.

Oh that's easy -- our recruiting classes aren't flashy. That's a good way to start every season ranked.

[codeDawg]

That may be the least informed top 25 list I have ever read. Seriously. Complete garbage. Somebody needed some page views.

[Coach34]

Fredo has road trips to Fla, Bama, Auburn, and Starkville. They won't be close to 11th

[CadaverDawg]

I think people are underestimating Georgia Tech next year too. 18 is too low. I have seen a lot of option in my day, but what Paul Johnson showed against us and FSU, was amazing. They return a lot next year, and I wouldn't be a bit surprised to see them win the ACC. That offense is extremely difficult to stop.

[HSVDawg]

Possibly, he did officially start grad school yesterday though. It wouldn't have been difficult to figure out he's coming back if someone cared in the slightest.

I think Dak might be waiting on Mariota to make his move before deciding. If Mariota returns, Dak's worst case scenario if he left early would be him getting taken as the 3rd QB off the board (behind Winston and Hundley) which would put him as a 2nd to 3rd rounder depending on his combine performance. The only sure thing is that Mariota will be the first QB taken whichever year he decides to leave. The other QB's are a crapshoot and could easily raise or lower their stock at the combine. It's in Dak's best interest to not be in the same draft as Mariota. So if MM returns, don't be surprised if Dak bolts. He can still withdraw from grad school without penalty between now and Thursday, so that's not really the issue.

[engie]

If Mariota returns, Dak's worst case scenario if he left early would be him getting taken as the 3rd QB off the board (behind Winston and Hundley) which would put him as a 2nd to 3rd rounder depending on his combine performance.
That is not even remotely close to his worst case scenario.

[Coach34]

No- Dakota is returning-100%

[MetEdDawg]

True, but my issue is that this is our perception and how recruits look at us as well. Ole Miss is #11 on the list and they don't have a quarterback, lost good players on defense, and cannot run the ball. However, for some reason, their perception is different.

There is a missing ingredient in the soup that promotes MSU football. For this to keep happening means that something simply isn't right.

It's a repeating cycle that we have not be able to overcome. Typically Top 25 teams get respect, but we never get the hype of being in the Top 25 Preseason to have anyone talk about us and get the exposure. So then the cycle repeats because the recruiting stays down.

We will have to earn respect because the recruiting aspect is currently not in our favor. There is so much stock put into recruiting in these preseason polls that teams like us that haven't had high ranking recruiting classes have to have consecutive years of finishing in the Top 25 to prove that we deserve to be there. It sucks but it's our path and we have to embrace it for what it is.

My problem is that we do NEED experience with the target on our backs. We did play better this year as the underdog, but I don't want that to be our mantra. We should all want the target to be on our back because that means there are expectations of the players and the program to perform at a high level, which is what we are trying to get to. If we can string together a good class this year and next year while finishing in the Top 25 again next year, I think we will have earned the respect we've been looking for and built something sustainable. It sucks that this is the way it is, but like I said, we've got to embrace it for what it is and force people to change their minds. If we keep winning, people can't keep us down forever.

[thf24]

I think Dak might be waiting on Mariota to make his move before deciding. If Mariota returns, Dak's worst case scenario if he left early would be him getting taken as the 3rd QB off the board (behind Winston and Hundley) which would put him as a 2nd to 3rd rounder depending on his combine performance. The only sure thing is that Mariota will be the first QB taken whichever year he decides to leave. The other QB's are a crapshoot and could easily raise or lower their stock at the combine. It's in Dak's best interest to not be in the same draft as Mariota. So if MM returns, don't be surprised if Dak bolts. He can still withdraw from grad school without penalty between now and Thursday, so that's not really the issue.

Dak would be nowhere near the 3rd QB on the board right now. I don't even know who specifically is up there, but I don't need to look because there's no way a QB who is inconsistent at best throwing deep and struggles at times reading defenses at the college level is 3rd on the board. It is highly unlikely he leaves, and if he does it would be a tremendous mistake, period. Regardless of what other QB's are on the board.

[ShotgunDawg]

We have finished ahead of Ole Miss in the SEC standing for 5 straight years, and I'll tell you right now that, when you look at schedule for next season, MSU will likely finish ahead of Ole Miss again. However, this doesn't seem to stop the media from continually projecting them ahead of MSU.

The problem is that top 25 teams get all he publicity in the off season, and, when we aren't in them, we are treated like we don't exist, which hurts our perception and recruiting

[Bama_Dawg]

Hell, after what I saw once we became #1, I'll take being overlooked to start the season. We proved we can climb the ladder by winning, so I'd prefer us not having a target on our back to start the year.

^^This. If we "come out of nowhere" again in 2015, we should get the respect (we'll have done enough to earn it). Hopefully then the national media will then figure out we aren't "Mississippi" we are "Mississippi State"

[ShotgunDawg]

Here is another one.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/ncaaf/2015/01/13/early-top-25-2015-college-football-ohio-state-auburn-tcu-oregon-alabama-florida-state/21517063/

Yet, on the same day there are 2 preseason top 25 polls without MSU, Vegas has made MSU 25/1 to win the 2015 National Championship

Brett McMurphy ‏@McMurphyESPN 12m12 minutes ago
Next year’s title odds: OhioSt 6/1 TCU 15/2 Bama 10/1 Aub, Ore 14/1 FSU, LSU, MichSt, Bay 16/1 ND, USC 20/1, MissSt OU 25/1 via @BovadaLV

BTW, Ole Miss is 33/1 by Vegas, but their ranked 9 & 11 in these rankings and we aren't ranked.

MSU has a clear perception problem with media

[blacklistedbully]

I'm thinking we may be held back in rankings, even when we win, due to the way we have finished in each of the 2 years we've started hot, vaulted into the upper-echelon, then tanked beginning with Bama.

In order for us to get into the Top 4, we had to set a friggin' record with our rapid rise. Will we get the same rise by winning next year, or will, "the SEC be down" and there be an expectation of a fold?

[Jacksondevildog]

If Prescott returns, you bring back the most experienced QB in the SEC and a team that finished in the top 11 in the AP poll. They will bring back nice pieces to have a good season, yet they are nowhere on the radar of people's preseason poll. Ole Miss has an unknown in Kelly and offensive line issues and are preseason top 10 in some blogger's polls. It absolutely makes no sense.

[ShotgunDawg]

I'm thinking we may be held back in rankings, even when we win, due to the way we have finished in each of the 2 years we've started hot, vaulted into the upper-echelon, then tanked beginning with Bama.

In order for us to get into the Top 4, we had to set a friggin' record with our rapid rise. Will we get the same rise by winning next year, or will, "the SEC be down" and there be an expectation of a fold?

Ole Miss was blown off the field in two of their final 3 games and have a tougher schedule next year. Why are they trusted?

[ShotgunDawg]

And another:

http://www.foxsports.com/college-football/story/ohio-state-buckeyes-oregon-ducks-2015-preseason-top-25-ranking-011215

[blacklistedbully]

Ole Miss was blown off the field in two of their final 3 games and have a tougher schedule next year. Why are they trusted?

Because the beat us in their next-to-last game, and because they have always garnered too much respect from the media. Is it because they are that good at propaganda, or that it's a case of what I call, "buying habits"? We've seen tie & again people buying a certain brand, often in the face of first-hand knowledge of another product that is as good or better. This is especially true when they are spending other people's money, so don't have to concern themselves with practical budgets, etc.

[ShotgunDawg]

Because the beat us in their next-to-last game, and because they have always garnered too much respect from the media. Is it because they are that good at propaganda, or that it's a case of what I call, "buying habits"? We've seen tie & again people buying a certain brand, often in the face of first-hand knowledge of another product that is as good or better. This is especially true when they are spending other people's money, so don't have to concern themselves with practical budgets, etc.

I agree. It just doesn't make a ton of sense with them. Vegas obviously likes us better.

I don't want to make this about Ole Miss because it really isn't. There is no excuse for not being ranked by these guys. Fox even has NC State ranked and not MSU. That's embarrassing.

[PMDawg]

That is not even remotely close to his worst case scenario.

thank you. geez....

[HSVDawg]

That is not even remotely close to his worst case scenario.

Ok, other than Mariota, Hundley, and Winston, who else is getting picked ahead of him this year?

[engie]

Ok, other than Mariota, Hundley, and Winston, who else is getting picked ahead of him this year?

You said it was his worst case scenario in the previous post. In this question, you basically turn it into his best case scenario admitting the other 3 are clearly ahead. Hardly the same thing. You win in the NFL by throwing the ball first. Dak was somewhere between the 15th and 30th best passer in college football this year. People think he can be better than that -- and I agree -- but that's what he is right now.

[HSVDawg]

Deleted due to double post.

[maroonmania]

Because the beat us in their next-to-last game, and because they have always garnered too much respect from the media. Is it because they are that good at propaganda, or that it's a case of what I call, "buying habits"? We've seen tie & again people buying a certain brand, often in the face of first-hand knowledge of another product that is as good or better. This is especially true when they are spending other people's money, so don't have to concern themselves with practical budgets, etc.

Another reason is you've got a lot of these media hacks (like Barrett Sallee) that are enamored with recruiting rankings. If you aren't pulling in hot prospects that they know about then, to them, there is no way you will be any good or continue to be good. I've already seen Sallee list us as one of his top candidates in the SEC to regress next year and when asked on BSR why, he simply stated we don't recruit well enough. By the way, recruiting prowess was the reason he said he didn't include OM to regress, nevermind the fact that they currently have nothing proven at QB.

[HSVDawg]

You said it was his worst case scenario in the previous post. In this question, you basically turn it into his best case scenario admitting the other 3 are clearly ahead. Hardly the same thing. You win in the NFL by throwing the ball first. Dak was somewhere between the 15th and 30th best passer in college football this year. People think he can be better than that -- and I agree -- but that's what he is right now.

I don't disagree with that, but I do think he can pull even with at least Hundley at the combine in terms of draft stock, and who knows what could happen with Winston and how teams will evaluate him based on the off the field stuff. My point was, if Mariota returns to school, Dak declares, AND Hundley and Winston are drafted ahead of Dak, he still very likely goes in the top 3 rounds based on what we know now. There are too many teams in the NFL with QB issues for there not to be at least 3 QB's taken in the first 3 rounds. Thats why I asked who else you think would go ahead of him.

[engie]

I don't disagree with that, but I do think he can pull even with at least Hundley at the combine in terms of draft stock, and who knows what could happen with Winston and how teams will evaluate him based on the off the field stuff. My point was, if Mariota returns to school AND Hundley and Winston are drafted ahead of him, he still very likely goes in the top 3 rounds based on what we know now. There are too many teams in the NFL with QB issues for there not to be at least 3 QB's taken in the first 3 rounds. Thats why I asked who else you think would go ahead of him.

I think there's as many as 10-12 guys that have potential to go ahead of him. Obviously, not all of them would. I'm saying that could. Hence why "probably second or third round" isn't even close to a worst case scenario. The most likely scenario and worst case scenario are different things...

Dak by all accounts I've heard is a not a great practice player. That's what allowed Russell to hang on to the starting job longer than any of us would have preferred. Excellent leader -- but he needs the bright lights to perform at a high level. I don't see his stock going up in a combine setting where leadership and scrambling is neutralized and they are going to test accuracy above all else. Guys like Sean Mannion dominate in those scenarios -- and get drafted WAY higher than their college production in many cases would imply they should go.

[smootness]

The mantra is we lost too many "starters" to be any good next year- and Mullen doesn't recruit well enough to overcome it. I laughed reading that shit on Bafoom.

They are too stupid to realize that Jones, Redmond, Ross, etc weren't listed as starters but were the best players at their position.

The funniest thing about that line of thinking is that if we don't recruit well enough to overcome our personnel losses this year, then we certainly don't recruit well enough to go 10-2 in the SEC and be #1 in the country for 5 weeks.

We are continuing to recruit better every year. So regardless of our recruiting rankings, the incoming guys for the past 2-3 years are better than the guys who are leaving this year's team according to those same rankings.

[smootness]

Ole Miss was blown off the field in two of their final 3 games and have a tougher schedule next year. Why are they trusted?

Most of these early preseason polls come down simply to, 'What was your record and how many starters are returning?' Ole Miss has a large number of starters returning, so regardless of who those guys are that are leaving, they will be ranked highly preseason.

Because we lose a comparatively large number of starters (I count 5 on offense and up to 8 on defense), they won't rank us as high. We can sit here and say, 'well, PJ Jones and Kaleb Eulls weren't really starters any more than Chris Jones, Nick James, and Nelson Adams, Jamerson Love being replaced is an upgrade, our safeties didn't play well anyway, etc.' but the media will just look at pure numbers.