Msu-Osu part 2 [Archive]

engie

06-19-2013, 11:27 PM

Supposedly they arent going to throw Moore

Rumor is they are either going with a lefty that is 0-1 with an 8.31 ERA that has barely thrown any this year...or a righty that is 4-1 with a 3.29 ERA... Here's the stat lines for both of them.

http://my.jetscreenshot.com/12222/m_20130620-xcwa-110kb.jpg

Pollodawg

06-20-2013, 12:27 AM

I am just really glad that they have to beat us twice, and we only have to win once. Those early wins are huge now.

Will James

06-20-2013, 07:30 AM

Supposedly they arent going to throw Moore

Bwahaha I sure hope so. Look at that K/BB rate for the righty in Engies post. And the lefty has 4 innings.

msstate7

06-20-2013, 07:44 AM

Bwahaha I sure hope so. Look at that K/BB rate for the righty in Engies post. And the lefty has 4 innings.

I'm calling bs. They may start 1 of those, but I think we see more Moore than either

Bo Darville

06-20-2013, 07:58 AM

I think Ross Mitchell always stands a good chance of pitching, even though they have seen him already. We will have to see about who is DH. Even though not everyone agrees, with Porter it is about more than just stats from a stat log. His vision/eye health is part of the decision making process.

SaltyDawg

06-20-2013, 08:07 AM

Bwahaha I sure hope so. Look at that K/BB rate for the righty in Engies post. And the lefty has 4 innings.

I know you don't believe this, but stats don't make every coaching decision. Are you a robot?

PMDawg

06-20-2013, 08:07 AM

I wonder if Girodo isn't the first one out of the pen since they haven't seen him yet. I kind of get the feeling it will go Pollo, Girodo, Holder (if it's a save situation).

SaltyDawg

06-20-2013, 08:09 AM

Girodo threw an awful lot of pitches on Monday.

TrueMaroon

06-20-2013, 08:11 AM

I wonder if Girodo isn't the first one out of the pen since they haven't seen him yet. I kind of get the feeling it will go Pollo, Girodo, Holder (if it's a save situation).

I may be wrong, but I don't see Cohen going to a second lefty after Pollo. I get a feeling we would see Ben Bracewell go through the order once and then bring back Girodo.

Bo Darville

06-20-2013, 08:12 AM

Girodo threw an awful lot of pitches on Monday.

He went over 100 pitches on Monday. If Girodo pitches Friday, it would be a short stint. I think we probably sit Girodo. Cohen seems to like him in tandem with Fitts. Of course, this is tournament time, so nothing is out of the question.

PMDawg

06-20-2013, 08:19 AM

Girodo threw an awful lot of pitches on Monday.

that's a good point. While it seems like forever since we last played, it's only 3 days rest. 100+ pitches = probably resting tomorrow. What about Gentry? He's been awfully quiet since his performance in the SECT? We still have Bracewell and Lindgren too. Or is Lindgren done for the season? Is he worth a chance out of the BP? If we can use pitchers only out of the following pool tomorrow: Pollo, Bracewell, Gentry, Lindgren, Fitts....then IF we have to play again on Saturday we would have all of our big arms: Graveman, R Mitchell, Girodo, & Holder. Of course, I'm far from an expert on this type of stuff, so I'll just sit back and listen.

SaltyDawg

06-20-2013, 08:21 AM

I'd say Bracewell first out of the pen, followed by Ross if we need him. Girodo could come in for a tight situation to get an out, but I don't see him throwing to more than 2-3 batters.

SaltyDawg

06-20-2013, 08:24 AM

that's a good point. While it seems like forever since we last played, it's only 3 days rest. 100+ pitches = probably resting tomorrow. What about Gentry? He's been awfully quiet since his performance in the SECT? We still have Bracewell and Lindgren too. Or is Lindgren done for the season? Is he worth a chance out of the BP? If we can use pitchers only out of the following pool tomorrow: Pollo, Bracewell, Gentry, Lindgren, Fitts....then IF we have to play again on Saturday we would have all of our big arms: Graveman, R Mitchell, Girodo, & Holder. Of course, I'm far from an expert on this type of stuff, so I'll just sit back and listen.

I'd feel more comfortable with Will Cox out of pen than Gentry (mainly because Gentry is a freshman- his time will come). I'd be skeptical of bringing Lindgren out of pen just for the fact he hasn't done it all year. I think we can win the whole thing only using Bracewell, Ross, Girodo, and Holder out of pen- sandwiched between our 3 starters (Graveman, Fitts, Pollo).

Hump4Hoops

06-20-2013, 08:24 AM

I had been hoping we'd go Lindy, Ross, Bracewell for an IU rematch, but obviously we can't do that since OSU has seen Ross. Pollo, Bracewell, Holder is probably the plan.

Will James

06-20-2013, 08:31 AM

I know you don't believe this, but stats don't make every coaching decision. Are you a robot?

They are in a must win situation. Their strength is in their starting pitching. If you can justify not going with Moore Id like to hear it. Information does matter. Are you a Luddite? Going with that lefty would be like going with Preston Brown.

SaltyDawg

06-20-2013, 08:42 AM

They are in a must win situation. Their strength is in their starting pitching. If you can justify not going with Moore Id like to hear it. Information does matter. Are you a Luddite? Going with that lefty would be like going with Preston Brown.

I assure you there is a reason they are going with whoever they pitch. I don't know enough about OSU to justify anything. However, I do know that their coach is very aware of their situation and that he is going to pitch the guy who he thinks gives them the best chance to win. Your stats tell you more than their coach knows though, right?

And for the love of God don't bring up some stat from Game 3 in the '87 MLB World Series that you think somehow justifies your argument.

Homedawg

06-20-2013, 09:05 AM

I'd say Bracewell first out of the pen, followed by Ross if we need him. Girodo could come in for a tight situation to get an out, but I don't see him throwing to more than 2-3 batters.

I agree w this. W one exception, girado can go more than 2-3 batters, if we lead and can close them out. Otherwise he's the safety net for Saturday.

Will James

06-20-2013, 09:27 AM

I assure you there is a reason they are going with whoever they pitch.

There may be a reason but it might not be a good one. There is a reason that Croom and Polk II were hired, did that make it right? "A reason" is irrelevant.

I don't know enough about OSU to justify anything.

So look at their production aka stats.

However, I do know that their coach is very aware of their situation and that he is going to pitch the guy who he thinks gives them the best chance to win.

Again, so what.

Your stats tell you more than their coach knows though, right?

I wasn't aware that coaches make the right calls in all situations in every sport.
"Coaches know more about the sport than me so I won't ever form an opinion" - Salty

Yes I can say with 100% certainity that if they start Jace Fry, who has faced 19 batters this season, that it is a bad call.

TexasDawg

06-20-2013, 09:35 AM

msstate7

06-20-2013, 09:38 AM

How can you be 100% sure that is a bad call? There is a reason he has barely pitched this year, he was recovering from injury. If he is back to 100% healthy, as it seems he could be, the kid is a hell of a pitcher. First team freshman All-American last year.

And if ya want stats on a healthy Fry here ya go

2012 as a Frshman- Went 5-3 with a 2.45 ERA in 13 games, all starts ... Struck out 53 in 88 1/3 innings and allowed 68 hits, with seven going for extra bases ... Threw three complete games and one shutout

I don't necessarily think he would be a bad starter for them. My question is how long can they expect him to last after having the whole year off. Would they follow him with Moore or their bullpen?

TexasDawg

06-20-2013, 09:42 AM

My thinking would be that they try to save Moore for Saturday

Will James

06-20-2013, 09:46 AM

How can you be 100% sure that is a bad call? There is a reason he has barely pitched this year, he was recovering from injury. If he is back to 100% healthy, as it seems he could be, the kid is a hell of a pitcher. First team freshman All-American last year.

And if ya want stats on a healthy Fry here ya go

2012 as a Frshman- Went 5-3 with a 2.45 ERA in 13 games, all starts ... Struck out 53 in 88 1/3 innings and allowed 68 hits, with seven going for extra bases ... Threw three complete games and one shutout

Ok so let's put Woodruff out there, he's supposed to be pretty good*

Those 2012 numbers are decent, but what has he done post-tommy john? Not shit.
And this isn't looking at it in a vacuum of if he can merely start, this is a win or go home with their other kid who is 14-1 with a 1.57 ERA in 17 starts, healthy, sitting right there.

If they start Fry it's 100% dumb and I will be 100% thrilled.

SaltyDawg

06-20-2013, 09:52 AM

There may be a reason but it might not be a good one. There is a reason that Croom and Polk II were hired, did that make it right? "A reason" is irrelevant.

Not only are you bringing in examples college football, but also LT hires? Nice. Way to prove a point, jackass.

I wasn't aware that coaches make the right calls in all situations in every sport.
"Coaches know more about the sport than me so I won't ever form an opinion" - Salty

Their coach has made enough right decisions to get them to the CWS as a #3 national seed. I do form an opinion on a lot of things, but only when I know enough about the situation- unlike you who thinks that stats tell the whole story.

Yes I can say with 100% certainity that if they start Jace Fry, who has faced 19 batters this season, that it is a bad call.

Just like you said with 100% certainty that Chad Girodo wouldn't do anything for us this year in baseball? Ya know, cause stats and production and whatnot. I could link the thread on SPS if you wanted to be embarassed.

TexasDawg

06-20-2013, 09:57 AM

If they start Fry it's 100% dumb and I will be 100% thrilled.

The fact of the matter is that if he is healthy, and only the coaching staff would know, then he is a damn good pitcher. I find it hard to believe that the HC of the #3 national seeded team, and a man who has won 2 National Titles would pitch a guy that would be just about guaranteed to send him home packing. I just tend to believe he knows more about his pitching staff than you do.

Will James

06-20-2013, 10:01 AM

Not only are you bringing in examples college football, but also LT hires? Nice. Way to prove a point, jackass.

Their coach has made enough right decision to get them to the CWS as a #3 national seed. I do form an opinion on a lot of things, but only when I know enough about the situation- unlike you who thinks that stats tell the whole story.

Just like you said with 100% certainty that Chad Girodo wouldn't do anything for us this year in baseball? Ya know, cause stats and production and whatnot. I could link the thread on SPS if you wanted to be embarassed.

I'm still waiting on an actual reason why Fry would be a good start in a win or go home over Moore. I doubt I will get one from you. Embarrassed? I ate my crow on Girodo. Unlike you I'm not afraid to have an opinion, as it will be right way more often than not.

Will James

06-20-2013, 10:08 AM

I just tend to believe he knows more about his pitching staff than you do.

Oh my God can we ban this phrase?

Anytime I have an opinion on here you trolls come out from under your bridge with this "well he's a coach so he knows". Make your own damn points if you disagree with me don't fall back on that. Its a cop-out.

I just want to know from somebody why Fry is a better option than Moore? and PS saving him for Saturday doesn't count, not in a win or go home. We have the luxury of saving Kendall if we want to.

SaltyDawg

06-20-2013, 10:12 AM

I'm still waiting on an actual reason why Fry would be a good start in a win or go home over Moore. I doubt I will get one from you. Embarrassed? I ate my crow on Girodo. Unlike you I'm not afraid to have an opinion, as it will be right way more often than not.

Fry might go 1 inning and give way to Moore. Like I said, you have no clue what they are going to do because you are not informed. Meaning you are forming an opinion based on a K/BB ratio? Give me a ****ing break.

TexasDawg

06-20-2013, 10:20 AM

I never said Fry was a better option. What I was getting at is that it is ****ing stupid to say you are 100% positive that Fry is a terrible choice. When healthy he has proven that he can sling it. Now I don't know if he's healthy, and you don't know if he's healthy. The coaching staff sure as hell knows though. It is just very hard to believe a two time National Champion would pitch somebody who is a hindrance to his team.

Will James

06-20-2013, 10:24 AM

Fry might go 1 inning and give way to Moore. Like I said, you have no clue what they are going to do because you are not informed. Meaning you are forming an opinion based on a K/BB ratio? Give me a ****ing break.

See, you can't even follow. The K/BB ratio was talking about Child, not Fry.

Tell me why it would be smart to let Fry get one inning? All Im asking of you is to justify how Fry over Moore is a good idea.. You can't.

SaltyDawg

06-20-2013, 10:41 AM

See, you can't even follow. The K/BB ratio was talking about Child, not Fry.

Tell me why it would be smart to let Fry get one inning? All Im asking of you is to justify how Fry over Moore is a good idea.. You can't.

Sorry, it's sometimes hard to weed through the immense amount of bullshit in your posts.

My original argument was based on stats not telling you everything- go back and read. And then I went on to say that if Moore wasn't starting then there was a reason. What reason? Hell, I don't know- but there is a reason nonetheless and probably a good one considering it is a win or go home game.

theloungeinleft

06-20-2013, 12:21 PM

See, you can't even follow. The K/BB ratio was talking about Child, not Fry.

Tell me why it would be smart to let Fry get one inning? All Im asking of you is to justify how Fry over Moore is a good idea.. You can't.

Do your formulas and stats work for all sports? if so, I've been wondering why Les Miles started Jefferson over Lee in the national championship for about a year and a half now?...

theloungeinleft

06-20-2013, 12:28 PM

Bwahaha I sure hope so. Look at that K/BB rate for the righty in Engies post. And the lefty has 4 innings.

hahahaha i know right?!?! Silly them.

FreeBoosie

06-20-2013, 02:26 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5DmYLrxR0Y8

Bo Darville

06-21-2013, 08:13 AM

Oh my God can we ban this phrase?

Anytime I have an opinion on here you trolls come out from under your bridge with this "well he's a coach so he knows". Make your own damn points if you disagree with me don't fall back on that. Its a cop-out.

I just want to know from somebody why Fry is a better option than Moore? and PS saving him for Saturday doesn't count, not in a win or go home. We have the luxury of saving Kendall if we want to.

I'm in agreement with you Will on the pitching issues. I will say that "he's a coach so he knows" is not always a cop-out. We saw that with Porter. Cohen knew of the eye issue because he was the coach. You did not know of it. I knew of it but was not going to spill it on a message board until Trey was ready to make it known. You called me a moron for it and harassed me a little in chat, but I'm a big boy and can take it. Aren't we all glad Porter didn't turn his shit in and quit, as some said he should? He would have missed out on a lifetime memory and we might have been put in the loser's bracket. Trust me that there is often times a lot of stuff going on behind the scenes that you, me, or anyone else knows nothing about. I think you are a helluva poster and I enjoy your anaylsis. Just remember that you aren't the only one in this world, or on this board for that matter, that knows a little about baseball. Not everybody is an idiot.

LiterallyPolice

06-21-2013, 08:46 AM

I'm in agreement with you Will on the pitching issues. I will say that "he's a coach so he knows" is not always a cop-out. We saw that with Porter. Cohen knew of the eye issue because he was the coach. You did not know of it. I knew of it but was not going to spill it on a message board until Trey was ready to make it known. You called me a moron for it and harassed me a little in chat, but I'm a big boy and can take it. Aren't we all glad Porter didn't turn his shit in and quit, as some said he should? He would have missed out on a lifetime memory and we might have been put in the loser's bracket. Trust me that there is often times a lot of stuff going on behind the scenes that you, me, or anyone else knows nothing about. I think you are a helluva poster and I enjoy your anaylsis. Just remember that you aren't the only one in this world, or on this board for that matter, that knows a little about baseball. Not everybody is an idiot.

I agree with Will that it's a bit of a cop out. Or, at least, it's answering a different question than Will is answering. Will is answering the question "Who would you pitch if you were the coach, knowing only what you know now". A person who says "I agree with whatever Cohen decides" isn't really answering that question, and it's a boring post that doesn't really add value to the discussion...

(But... I guess you could argue this post doesn't really add value either).

fishwater99

06-21-2013, 09:04 AM

So who is starting for the Beavers today?

Will James

06-21-2013, 09:09 AM

So who is starting for the Beavers today?

http://www.registerguard.com/rg/sports/30051819-81/moore-fry-state-bulldogs-casey.html.csp

Still not sure. If Fry goes, he will be on a 50 pitch limit apparently.

Bo Darville

06-21-2013, 09:20 AM

A person who says "I agree with whatever Cohen decides" isn't really answering that question, and it's a boring post that doesn't really add value to the discussion...

(But... I guess you could argue this post doesn't really add value either).

Agreed. But someone who has a different opinion on who to pitch than Will (or a different opinion than you, me, whoever) isn't necessarily an idiot or a moron. If one guy says Graveman and the other says Pollo, there might be merit on both sides.

gravedigger

06-21-2013, 09:35 AM

Wouldn't gentrys performance against South Carolina drop your 100% number a bit? I mean there was nothing but a gut feeling there. That is what coaches do. They have inside info on players and their abilities in situations based on their opponent that us message boarders don't have. Excuse me for a second....I have to go remove my contacts. Slept in them last night.

CadaverDawg

06-21-2013, 09:37 AM

I quit reading about halfway up, but in my opinion Will is correct. It MAY work out for them if they start Fry, but it WOULD be a dumb call if Moore is healthy, rested and on their bench. Could you imagine us going into a win or go home scenario with a rested Graveman, and starting Woodruff, Preston Brown, or John Mark Shelly right now? No. That is what you are essentially saying though.

John Cohen is "a coach that knows his team" too, but that doesn't mean everything he does is a "smart" move. It's quite Jeanspage to throw the "he's a coach so he knows more than you" phrase out as a defense to your point. This is a message board full of opinions. Either back shit up with facts and stats or whatever else you can find, or admit you may be wrong. I know it's popular to bash Will James and his stats....he definitely has some that are useless in my opinion. But at least it's SOMETHING to back his argument. Fry's k/bb ratio means nothing to me....but the fact that Moore is their Saturday starter and is 14-1 on the year with a sub 1.50 ERA tells me they would be insane to go into an elimination game without starting him. There is no tomorrow so saving him is DUMB. It doesn't take a lot of stats in this argument to know that.

But, hey, just my opinion.

Will James

06-21-2013, 09:42 AM

Agreed. But someone who has a different opinion on who to pitch than Will (or a different opinion than you, me, whoever) isn't necessarily an idiot or a moron. If one guy says Graveman and the other says Pollo, there might be merit on both sides.

Absolutely. But I was debating Fry vs Moore most of this thread. Starting Fry would, in my less than humble opinion, be moronic.