Kendall Graveman to start Friday game

[Coach34]

told ya ****ers

[Goat Holder]

Don't like this, unless it's some sort of matchup deal, ie UCA has a bunch of righties or something. I take it that Cohen and Co. have done their homework, seeing how we're very familiar with these teams. We really have no true ace anyways.

[SaltyDawg]

You didn't tell us he would start, you said you think he should start. That's not the same thing.

[Coach34]

You didn't tell us he would start, you said you think he should start. That's not the same thing.


seriously???? The guy I said I would start is starting- and damn near everybody else said Pollo- and that's your reply? I'm not claiming I predicted he would start. I'm saying that Graveman is the smart Starter- as I and CroomDiaries said

Enter Sandman14:

"Hilarious. Cohen has not thought for one single second about this. THat's why this debate is so interesting. One of the top 10 college baseball coaches in the country, who is our coach, has not thought for one second about pitching graveman. I promise you. He'd laugh his ass off. He's pitching Pollo and never even considered anything else."

[Hump4Hoops]

Trying to save our pen for game 2 I suppose. Unless Graveman shits the bed, anyway.

[SaltyDawg]

seriously???? The guy I said I would start is starting- and damn near everybody else said Pollo- and that's your reply? I'm not claiming I predicted he would start.

Enter Sandman14:

"Hilarious. Cohen has not thought for one single second about this. THat's why this debate is so interesting. One of the top 10 college baseball coaches in the country, who is our coach, has not thought for one second about pitching graveman. I promise you. He'd laugh his ass off. He's pitching Pollo and never even considered anything else."

The title of your post is "Kendall Graveman to start Friday game"- "told ya ****ers" implying that you told us he would start. That's not the case. There were multiple posts weighing both options (Pollo and Graveman) with stats and 'trends'.

I said multiple times either one was fine with me, but I thought Pollo should get the nod. But in no way am I upset that Graveman is throwing.

Sandman can answer for himself- that's not my problem. His thoughts were not reciprocated by me.

[Will James]

With Cohen there is no telling who will start beforehand. This, like many of his moves, leaves me scratching my dome.

[hometowndawg]

Stupid decision. Stupid Stupid Stupid. Game 2 is the most important game of the series, regardless of how the first one turns out. You save your best pitcher for game two.

Kendall Graveman = Best pitcher for MSU

[The Croom Diaries]

Good move. As we hashed out yesterday, I think Graveman is the best matchup because he as a little better control (although he did hit 3 vs. UCA this year) and is better at keeping runners from stealing bases...plus they have a predominately right handed lineup.

[CadaverDawg]

seriously???? The guy I said I would start is starting- and damn near everybody else said Pollo- and that's your reply? I'm not claiming I predicted he would start. I'm saying that Graveman is the smart Starter- as I and CroomDiaries said

Enter Sandman14:

"Hilarious. Cohen has not thought for one single second about this. THat's why this debate is so interesting. One of the top 10 college baseball coaches in the country, who is our coach, has not thought for one second about pitching graveman. I promise you. He'd laugh his ass off. He's pitching Pollo and never even considered anything else."

Yea, I kinda thought Sandman was setting himself up to look stupid with all of that "Legendary Coaches wouldn't change their rotation" talk. Ha.

I don't mind the swap, but I'm curious as to why. I think someone said that UCA had about 7 RH hitters in their lineup, and based on Mercer's short porch in RCF Engie and I were thinking that Mercer must have several Lefties in the lineup, so maybe that's what we're thinking with Pollo. What about USA's lineup? Who did we pitch down in Mobile?

It's bound to be about matchups.....I mean, look what coach we're talking about here. We should win with Graveman on the hill.

[The Croom Diaries]

The title of your post is "Kendall Graveman to start Friday game"- "told ya ****ers" implying that you told us he would start. That's not the case. There were multiple posts weighing both options (Pollo and Graveman) with stats and 'trends'.

I said multiple times either one was fine with me, but I thought Pollo should get the nod. But in no way am I upset that Graveman is throwing.

Sandman can answer for himself- that's not my problem. His thoughts were not reciprocated by me.

I will say Salty was saying he bets Cohen was going back and forth with the decision, whereas Sandman was just saying it was dumb to bring it up.

[The Croom Diaries]

Stupid decision. Stupid Stupid Stupid. Game 2 is the most important game of the series, regardless of how the first one turns out. You save your best pitcher for game two.

Kendall Graveman = Best pitcher for MSU

Maybe so, but Pollo is gutsy and a winner. I like having him for Game 2.

[Coach34]

The title of your post is "Kendall Graveman to start Friday game"- "told ya ****ers" implying that you told us he would start. That's not the case.
.

ok- I meant "told ya ****ers" in the sense of "I thought Graveman was the smart move here- almost none of you agreed- but Cohen does"

Glad we are on the same page now

[Will James]

Maybe so, but Pollo is gutsy and a winner. I like having him for Game 2.

Ill see your gutsy and winner and raise you a fly ball rate which can be measured. Against teams that mash like Mercer and USA id like a ground ball pitcher. I feel that Pollo-Graveman gives us the best chance at a 3 game weekend

[38843dawg]

Don't like this, unless it's some sort of matchup deal, ie UCA has a bunch of righties or something. I take it that Cohen and Co. have done their homework, seeing how we're very familiar with these teams. We really have no true ace anyways.

Central Arkansas definitely has more right handed batters which may be Cohen's thinking. Not to mention like others have mentioned, Cohen probably has more hope in Graveman throwing strikes compared to Pollo.

[Eric Nies Grind Time]

told ya ****ers

I am glad he went this way. Our strength is the bullpen, and Graveman gives us the best chance to go deep in the game and save the pen for Game 2 and 3. Hopefully the defense plays a lot better than they did in the SEC tourney.

[hometowndawg]

Central Arkansas definitely has more right handed batters which may be Cohen's thinking. Not to mention like others have mentioned, Cohen probably has more hope in Graveman throwing strikes compared to Pollo.

As Cohen has proved over and over this season he puts a ton of faith into the matchup situations. Both on offense and defense. Between switching pitchers, DH, and Hendo/Robson combo our scoresheet at the end of a game has to look like a mess.

[Coach34]

Ill see your gutsy and winner and raise you a fly ball rate which can be measured. Against teams that mash like Mercer and USA id like a ground ball pitcher. I feel that Pollo-Graveman gives us the best chance at a 3 game weekend

I dont think we will see but 4 innings of Pollo anyway on Saturday- should be a big bullpen game.

[The Croom Diaries]

Ill see your gutsy and winner and raise you a fly ball rate which can be measured. Against teams that mash like Mercer and USA id like a ground ball pitcher. I feel that Pollo-Graveman gives us the best chance at a 3 game weekend

How bout measuring actual hits via a fly ball like a double or triple in the gap and home runs. As far as I can see, Pollo has given up 2 home runs and Graveman 4. So far, advantage Pollo vs. these power teams.

[Quaoarsking]

I don't get it, but we should win the Regional regardless.

[CadaverDawg]

I dont think we will see but 4 innings of Pollo anyway on Saturday- should be a big bullpen game.

Even more reason to go with Pollo in game 1 so we could have a day of rest for our bullpen when Kendall throws Game 2. Oh well, I just hope this shit works out.

[CadaverDawg]

How bout measuring actual hits via a fly ball like a double or triple in the gap and home runs. As far as I can see, Pollo has given up 2 home runs and Graveman 4. So far, advantage Pollo vs. these power teams.

You continue to throw that stat out there, but ignore that Pollo has thrown 20 less innings, and that he also threw to midweek teams early in the year that were less likely to go Yack. Not trying to start an argument, but if we're going to use numbers let's make sure they're apples to apples or as close as possible.

[Coach34]

I don't get it, .

1. Cohen views UCA just as dangerous as USA or Mercer- and I agree.
2. Runners dont steal on Graveman- 1 in 92 innings this year
3. They have a RH'ed dominate line-up

It's pretty much common sense

I think the problem you guys are having is with seeding numbers- I dont view any of the other teams as any better than UCA. We have to win game 1- period. Take no chances and put your best foot forward

[cowbell9]

told ya ****ers

nm

[Coach34]

Even more reason to go with Pollo in game 1 so we could have a day of rest for our bullpen when Kendall throws Game 2. Oh well, I just hope this shit works out.

You always want to save your bullpen as much as possible. If we have to go to it early Game 1, that hurts because those guys may be needed for Game 2

[CadaverDawg]

You always want to save your bullpen as much as possible. If we have to go to it early Game 1, that hurts because those guys may be needed for Game 2

Meh. Why haven't we done it the other 60 games then? I'm not buying that logic. We have done well going with Pollo and Pen on Friday, Graveman +1 on Saturday, and then Lindgren and the whole pen on Sunday....that way the entire pen is only throwing on Friday and Sunday instead of Sat and Sun. But whatever, I dont really care what we do as long as we win. I dont have any problem with it since they have a lot of RH batters, plus Graveman had 7 K's in 5 innings against them on a cold day, so that sounds good.

[Will James]

How bout measuring actual hits via a fly ball like a double or triple in the gap and home runs. As far as I can see, Pollo has given up 2 home runs and Graveman 4. So far, advantage Pollo vs. these power teams.

Seriously you look at just HR numbers and claim advantage Pollo? I don't think anyone buys that.

Pollorena has given up 17 doubles to Kendall's 10. Pollorena gives up over twice as many fly balls as Graveman.

Graveman's line drive % is 18% to Pollorena's 26%.

I want Graveman against these teams.

[mparkerfd20]

I would have expected Pollo, but am ok with Graveman. To be honest, UCA scares me more than any other team in the bracket. Yes that's predicated on the fact they've already taken 2 of 3 from us this year. Also depending on number of pitches in game 1 could he not give us another 30-40 pitches in a 2nd Championship game if it comes to that potentially on only a few days rest?

[Coach34]

Meh. Why haven't we done it the other 60 games then? I'm not buying that logic. .

because on SEC weekends- it's just 3 games...a Regional could be as many as 5 games in 4 days- big ****ing difference

[CadaverDawg]

because on SEC weekends- it's just 3 games...a Regional could be as many as 5 games in 4 days- big ****ing difference

If it's more than 3 games then it doesn't matter because you will be forced to use your bullpen or non-weekend starters for the last two games anyway. So yea, it's a big difference, but it still shouldn't change your rotation. Again, I'm cool with the move but the amount of games doesn't matter if you're pitching your weekend guys the first 3 games regardless.

I would rather have our bullpen a day of rest on Saturday when Graveman typically gives it to them....so that we have all hands on deck in game 3 and 4 without having them pitch back to back days unless there is a 4th game. In your scenario, the bullpen could be forced to play 4 long outings IN A ROW if our starting pitching does as they usually do. The only normal long outing we get is Graveman. So I'm not sure what your point is.

ETA: In other words, if Graveman is the only guy we feel like can give us 7-9 innings....If you pitch him Friday, then we are counting on the bullpen to play a huge part in game 2, 3, 4& 5 (if necessary). That would be up to 4 games in a row of likely long relief bullpen use.

BUT, If you throw Graveman Saturday.....You likely use the bullpen in game 1, then they get a rest in game 2, and then they are charged up for help in game 3, 4&5 if necessary. That one day of rest is much more beneficial in the middle of the weekend, than at the beginning in my opinion.

Of course, if we close this bitch out in 3 like we should, then all of this is meaningless. Neither of us is right or wrong I wouldn't say, but we just disagree on theories. Like I said, as long as we win, I dont care when Graveman pitches. I just like the bullpen getting a potential breather in between game 1 and game 3

[Hump4Hoops]

Stupid decision. Stupid Stupid Stupid. Game 2 is the most important game of the series, regardless of how the first one turns out. You save your best pitcher for game two.

Kendall Graveman = Best pitcher for MSU

Correction, Kendall Graveman = Best starting pitcher for MSU.

Cohen recently said he isn't as concerned about starting pitchers as he is about the bullpen. In other words, he's acutely aware that all of our starting options mostly suck and are bound to **** it up and get the hook early. It's the choice between Mitchell, Girodo, Bracewell, Gentry, Bradford, and Holder that really matters.

[tenureplan]

Seriously you look at just HR numbers and claim advantage Pollo? I don't think anyone buys that.

Pollorena has given up 17 doubles to Kendall's 10. Pollorena gives up over twice as many fly balls as Graveman.

Graveman's line drive % is 18% to Pollorena's 26%.

I want Graveman against these teams.

Pollo is more of a junk baller and will do better keeping a power hitting team off balanced. Line drive rate is meaningless because someone just trying to make contact can hit a line drive.

[CadaverDawg]

Correction, Kendall Graveman = Best starting pitcher for MSU.

Cohen recently said he isn't as concerned about starting pitchers as he is about the bullpen. In other words, he's acutely aware that all of our starting options mostly suck and are bound to **** it up and get the hook early. It's the choice between Mitchell, Girodo, Bracewell, Gentry, Bradford, and Holder that really matters.

This makes sense.

I wouldn't be surprised if this entire decision to pitch Graveman was based off of who Cohen and Butch like to use out of the pen behind Kendall, and how that reliever matches up with UCA. I wouldn't be surprised to see Myles Gentry as a first relief after what he did against them the first time and how he pitched in the SECT. That may be Cohen's thought.....that he can get by in game 1 just using Kendall and Gentry, and then he's got damn near everybody ready to go for what turns in to a 2 game series with all hands on deck. I can live with that

[The Croom Diaries]

You continue to throw that stat out there, but ignore that Pollo has thrown 20 less innings, and that he also threw to midweek teams early in the year that were less likely to go Yack. Not trying to start an argument, but if we're going to use numbers let's make sure they're apples to apples or as close as possible.

Yesterday I said that ALL of Pollo's HR allowed and ALL of Graveman's HR allowed were in SEC play. That takes away any and all mid-week games. Graveman gives up a HR every 16 IP, Pollo every 24 IP. And they both gave up only one home run last year. I don't see how anyone can say Pollo will give up more HR than Graveman. Sure, Graveman is a ground ball pitcher and Pollo is not. But it doesn't have to mean he will give up HR. Maybe Graveman is more apt to make a mistake and groove one right down the middle.

[The Croom Diaries]

Seriously you look at just HR numbers and claim advantage Pollo? I don't think anyone buys that.

Pollorena has given up 17 doubles to Kendall's 10. Pollorena gives up over twice as many fly balls as Graveman.

Graveman's line drive % is 18% to Pollorena's 26%.

I want Graveman against these teams.

I don't care how many fly balls a guy gives up, I just care if it goes over the fence or hits the fence. The doubles stat doesn't say anything about whether they were hit down the line or not. Graveman is just as if not more susceptible to that as Pollo. The double count would only really be relevant here when talking about gappers.

Dudy Noble Field is a big ball park. I don't care if Pollo gets more fly balls outs as opposed to ground ball outs. They are still outs. If he locates his pitches they won't find the barrel of the bat....and that's where him being gutsy and a winner come into play. Pollo can get the job done.

[hometowndawg]

Thank you for that correction. I posted it when it was just a Pollo/Graveman debate so obviously talking about starters.

[hometowndawg]

Hey C34, can we get some odds on starting pitching next time this happens.

i.e. Who will start Friday evening? Pollo or Graveman. You woulda bet dat ass and cashed out big time

[CadaverDawg]

Yesterday I said that ALL of Pollo's HR allowed and ALL of Graveman's HR allowed were in SEC play. That takes away any and all mid-week games. Graveman gives up a HR every 16 IP, Pollo every 24 IP. And they both gave up only one home run last year. I don't see how anyone can say Pollo will give up more HR than Graveman. Sure, Graveman is a ground ball pitcher and Pollo is not. But it doesn't have to mean he will give up HR. Maybe Graveman is more apt to make a mistake and groove one right down the middle.

Do you not realize the major flaw in your Homerun stat? I don't care how many HR's each gave up in SEC play. What I'm saying is, Pollo has thrown 20 less innings than Graveman. In other words, it is not apples to apples because Graveman has thrown more innings thus having more opportunities to give up HR's. It's not that hard to understand.

And no, nobody can say Pollo WILL give up more HR's, but it is far more likely when you look at the style of pitcher each is. Will's stats show that because Pollo gives up far more fly balls and line drives.

Obviously there is no way of knowing what will happen, but it is far more likely for your ground ball pitcher who also happens to be your best pitcher to give up less homeruns against a power team than a guy that gives up more linedrives and fly balls. It's not nearly as difficult as you are trying to make it IMO

[CadaverDawg]

I don't care how many fly balls a guy gives up, I just care if it goes over the fence or hits the fence. The doubles stat doesn't say anything about whether they were hit down the line or not. Graveman is just as if not more susceptible to that as Pollo. The double count would only really be relevant here when talking about gappers.

Dudy Noble Field is a big ball park. I don't care if Pollo gets more fly balls outs as opposed to ground ball outs. They are still outs. If he locates his pitches they won't find the barrel of the bat....and that's where him being gutsy and a winner come into play. Pollo can get the job done.

Graveman is extremely gutsy and a winner as well. And I dont see how you don't think a guy whose pitches have sink, is not better against a power team than a pitcher whose pitches are more flat. You say you don't care who gives up more fly balls, but that is a pretty important thing when it comes to HR's....if it's on the ground it ain't going over the fence. If it's in the air, it could.

[tenureplan]

Do you not realize the major flaw in your Homerun stat? I don't care how many HR's each gave up in SEC play. What I'm saying is, Pollo has thrown 20 less innings than Graveman. In other words, it is not apples to apples because Graveman has thrown more innings thus having more opportunities to give up HR's. It's not that hard to understand.

And no, nobody can say Pollo WILL give up more HR's, but it is far more likely when you look at the style of pitcher each is. Will's stats show that because Pollo gives up far more fly balls and line drives.

Obviously there is no way of knowing what will happen, but it is far more likely for your ground ball pitcher who also happens to be your best pitcher to give up less homeruns against a power team than a guy that gives up more linedrives and fly balls. It's not nearly as difficult as you are trying to make it IMO

Graveman's HR to Batter faced % is 1.1% while Pollo's is .7%

[CadaverDawg]

Graveman's HR to Batter faced % is 1.1% while Pollo's is .7%

Correct....in 20 less innnings pitched. 20 innings equals at minimum 60 batters. So you are giving Pollo a 60 batter cushion in that stat. So is that a relevant stat to use in comparing the two? Not IMO

[Will James]

Graveman's HR to Batter faced % is 1.1% while Pollo's is .7%

My point is that because they've given up so few it's dumb to just look at it as 4>2. Taking the entire fly ball rate into account says Pollo is more likely to give one up because fly ball pitchers always give up more home runs. This is magnified when facing teams built around power. The odds are that neither will give up a HR but Pollo is more likely.

[CadaverDawg]

My point is that because they've given up so few it's dumb to just look at it as 4>2. Taking the entire fly ball rate into account says Pollo is more likely to give one up because fly ball pitchers always give up more home runs. This is magnified when facing teams built around power. The odds are that neither will give up a HR but Pollo is more likely.

I agree.

[State82]

Don't like this, unless it's some sort of matchup deal, ie UCA has a bunch of righties or something. I take it that Cohen and Co. have done their homework, seeing how we're very familiar with these teams. We really have no true ace anyways.

Looks like they will probably start 6 righties in the lineup.

[The Croom Diaries]

Do you not realize the major flaw in your Homerun stat? I don't care how many HR's each gave up in SEC play. What I'm saying is, Pollo has thrown 20 less innings than Graveman. In other words, it is not apples to apples because Graveman has thrown more innings thus having more opportunities to give up HR's. It's not that hard to understand.


Well you aren't looking at the HR per IP or the HR per batter faced like tenureplan pointed out.

I am not arguing that Pollo is less likely than Graveman to give up a home run. But I think the idea that we shouldn't pitch Pollo because Mercer (not even the 2 seed USA) is full of power hitters is dumb because A) the stats say that he is not more likely to give up a HR than Graveman B) we shouldn't manage this Regional from a position of fear. C) we may not even see Mercer

[The Croom Diaries]

Graveman is extremely gutsy and a winner as well. And I dont see how you don't think a guy whose pitches have sink, is not better against a power team than a pitcher whose pitches are more flat. You say you don't care who gives up more fly balls, but that is a pretty important thing when it comes to HR's....if it's on the ground it ain't going over the fence. If it's in the air, it could.

1. I'd like to approach the Regional from a point of aggression as we are the #1 seed, not in fear of what other teams have.
2. I believe Graveman gives us our better opportunity to win vs. UCA because he has a little better control, is right handed, but mostly because he has only had one SB against him all year. If he can keep a few more guys off the base paths and a few more from stealing 2nd base and getting into scoring position, it will probably save us a couple runs and may be the difference in the game.
3. If we face South Alabama in Game 2 they have basically the same offensive numbers we do. If we were to lose Game 1 I'd hate to say we may have had a better matchup vs. UCA but didn't use it because we were afraid of facing a power hitting team with Pollo - but as it turns out we lost to UCA and we aren't even facing Mercer.

[bulldogcountry1]

Stupid decision. Stupid Stupid Stupid. Game 2 is the most important game of the series, regardless of how the first one turns out. You save your best pitcher for game two.

Kendall Graveman = Best pitcher for MSU

That's a bit of an exaggerated response. While I preferred to have Graveman pitch game 2, there is logic in pitching him in Game one. 1. UCA is disciplined at the plate. Who is our best started for that? 2. Tons of righties. Who is our best starter for that?