Kendall Rogers say: MSU possible National Seed with VERY strong SECT performance..

[CadaverDawg]

They are chatting right now, and he said both us and USC had a shot at that 8th National Seed if we have a Very strong showing this week. Now I hope we play to win.

Here's a link to his chat....

http://www.perfectgame.org/Articles/View.aspx?article=8457

[CadaverDawg]

Then a few questions later, he says that he thinks we are a solid host but the committee may not...so we need to win 2 games in the SECT to be sure.

[Ghost of Hank Flick]

If we don't lose, we'd play 5 games in 6 days with an off day on Friday. We could handle that I guess. If we did do that, we'd probably go through Mizzou, USC, Vandy, and then USC or Vandy again....plus likely LSU on the other side. If we pulled off a 5-0 that included beating Vandy twice and LSU once they'd have to present a mountain of evidence as to why we should not be a national seed.

I think' it'd be great to win the first 3 days, skip Friday and then whatever happens in the single elimination on Sat. or Sun. is no big deal - we had a great showing and beat Vandy.

[Sandman14]

Good grief. The more I read from the so-called "pundits," the more I realize that I know more than them, and I don't even do this for a living. I don't know what these guys' angles are.

[CadaverDawg]

Here's a question and answer about Hunter Renfroe......



Comment From NatsGM
Kendall, Great work as always and thanks for doing these chats. I am a big fan of Hunter Renfroe's bat, from watching him the past 2 summers in the Ripken League... Where do you and professional team project him to play defensively as a pro, and where is he projected to be drafted next month? Thanks-
2:08

Nats,
Though some think he could be an elite catcher at the next level, he'll stick on the outfield and be a very solid professional player. He really has taken that next step from an offensive standpoint, and always had the overall skill set before. As for the projection on where he'll go, he'll go in the Top 20 picks barring a huge surprise.

[CadaverDawg]

It's becoming more clear to me after everything Rogers says, that he has no clue. He went from saying we could play our way to a National Seed, to we need to win 2 games to secure a host spot, to the following just now....


Comment From Chip
Who is the last team in as a host? If they lose their spot who takes it?
2:17
Kendall Rogers: Chip,
Would say Mississippi State is my last team in as a host this week. And should something go wild and the Bulldogs lose that host site, I'm going to go with South Alabama ... or perhaps, long shot-wise, Arkansas. I think the RPI is going to be the death knell for the Hogs.

[Will James]

Yeah these clowns are like Joe Lunardi, what they say changes from day to day. Anybody can follow recent events and pick up where the trends are. There is no way Kendall Rogers knows any more about our team than we do who watch every game. He doesnt have a clue what 20 random MLB teams plans are for Renfroe.

[Ronny]

It's becoming more clear to me after everything Rogers says, that he has no clue. He went from saying we could play our way to a National Seed, to we need to win 2 games to secure a host spot, to the following just now....


Comment From Chip
Who is the last team in as a host? If they lose their spot who takes it?
2:17
Kendall Rogers: Chip,
Would say Mississippi State is my last team in as a host this week. And should something go wild and the Bulldogs lose that host site, I'm going to go with South Alabama ... or perhaps, long shot-wise, Arkansas. I think the RPI is going to be the death knell for the Hogs.

Let's see if I've got this right:

MSU might be national seed with solid showing in SECT. But hold on... MSU hosting status is precarious; might not host at all if don't win 2 in the tournament. Even though MSU has the potential to be a national seed, still must win 2 games in the SECT to feel safe. Even though MSU has potential to be national seed, the committee may give MSU's hosting spot to South Alabama or UPig.

I am assuming neither South Alabama nor UPig can secure a national seed with a strong showing in their tournaments. Did anybody ask Rogers that obvious follow-up question?

Here's my take: These people (especially Rogers) sounds like freakin' crack addicts.

From now on I would ignore his "chats."

[SaltyDawg]

Kendall Rogers is a clown. I honestly think he is just making this stuff up as he goes along- I wouldn't put much stock in anything he says at this point.

Last night, he listed UGA job opening as a Top 5 job in all of college baseball.

[601Dawg]

They are chatting right now, and he said both us and USC had a shot at that 8th National Seed if we have a Very strong showing this week. Now I hope we play to win.

Here's a link to his chat....

http://www.perfectgame.org/Articles/View.aspx?article=8457

Ok, so we need to win a game or two in the SEC tourney, what about Clemson and South Carolina? What gives them so much more of an edge over us to where they can go 2 and Que and not be effected?????

[Sandman14]

Kendall Rogers is a clown. I honestly think he is just making this stuff up as he goes along- I wouldn't put much stock in anything he says at this point.

Last night, he listed UGA job opening as a Top 5 job in all of college baseball.

you sure he didn't mean "top 5 available this year"?

just wondering. if he thinks its top 5 overall, he's smoking crack. It's not even top 5 in the SEC.

[Big4Dawg]

5th....overall. He said OM was 7th-12th.

[SaltyDawg]

you sure he didn't mean "top 5 available this year"?

just wondering. if he thinks its top 5 overall, he's smoking crack. It's not even top 5 in the SEC.

No, he clearly said and meant top 5 job in college baseball. Listed Texas, LSU, Florida, UGA and UCLA as top 5 college baseball coaching gigs.

[Todd4State]

Well, if you put out every possibility, then you are always technically going to be right. That way if someone challenges him, he can say, "well, I said MSU would be a National Seed right here."

[Todd4State]

They are chatting right now, and he said both us and USC had a shot at that 8th National Seed if we have a Very strong showing this week. Now I hope we play to win.

Here's a link to his chat....

http://www.perfectgame.org/Articles/View.aspx?article=8457


If we won the SEC Tournament- that would mean that we beat Mizzou, South Carolina, probably Vanderbilt twice and then probably LSU.

[Todd4State]

No, he clearly said and meant top 5 job in college baseball. Listed Texas, LSU, Florida, UGA and UCLA as top 5 college baseball coaching gigs.

Texas- the stock has gone down there now that A&M is in the SEC and the Big 12 is weaker as a conference.

LSU- agree.

Florida- I'd rate Miami or Florida State higher. Much easier to recruit at Miami and they have good support, and Florida State has much better support than Florida for baseball.

UGA- Maybe slightly better than GT just because it's in the SEC.

UCLA- Disagree. USC is better. And they are starved for baseball success right now after making 2-3 really crappy head coaching hires. A good coach can win there without leaving LA.


Mine would probably be:

1. LSU
2. USCw
3. Miami
4. Texas
5. Mississippi State- homer pick

[Todd4State]

5th....overall. He said OM was 7th-12th.

If they are then we are. We have better support and tradition not to mention before long we are about to upgrade our stadium. We also can get most of the top players in Mississippi as long as they aren't Ole Miss fans or LSU gets them. I think we benefit more than anyone else in the country from ESPN showing the regionals.

[engie]

you sure he didn't mean "top 5 available this year"?

just wondering. if he thinks its top 5 overall, he's smoking crack. It's not even top 5 in the SEC.

I'm with Kendall on this one.

Georgia is THE sleeping giant of college baseball. No "better" job out there -- from the perspective of a place where you can win huge and build your own legacy instead of following in footsteps of greatness. That means alot in coaching circles.

The day they decide they want to be serious about baseball will be identical to the day that LSU hired Bertman. May even happen more quickly -- since there is more baseball talent within a 100 mi radius of UGA than there is in the entire state of Louisiana. They also have a tremendous lottery scholarship system that would essentially send all the in-state players they recruit to school for free...

[SaltyDawg]

I'm with Kendall on this one.

Georgia is THE sleeping giant of college baseball. No "better" job out there -- from the perspective of a place where you can win huge and build your own legacy instead of following in footsteps of greatness. That means alot in coaching circles.

The day they decide they want to be serious about baseball will be identical to the day that LSU hired Bertman. May even happen more quickly -- since there is more baseball talent within a 100 mi radius of UGA than there is in the entire state of Louisiana. They also have a tremendous lottery scholarship system that would essentially send all the in-state players they recruit to school for free...

That's my point exactly. They aren't serious about baseball- so how can it be a Top 5 coaching job "right now". UGA may have the potential to be a Top 5 job, in no way does that make it a Top 5 job though.

I think you are off base with the LSU comment. If you play baseball in any part of LA then you dream of playing at LSU- they can hand pick players from LA and even out of state. I don't imagine players in GA regard UGA as having that same draw.

[engie]

That's my point exactly. They aren't serious about baseball- so how can it be a Top 5 coaching job "right now". UGA may have the potential to be a Top 5 job, in no way does that make it a Top 5 job though.
Potential plays a huge role in being a top job. MSU/OM are NOT top jobs despite what anyone wants to tell you -- because we don't give half the scholarship money of other places. Period. We have that overwhelming built in disadvantage. Georgia is obviously gearing up to be serious about baseball -- seeing how they fired their coach of 12 years this week and the job is being linked to huge names all around the college baseball scene.


I think you are off base with the LSU comment. If you play baseball in any part of LA then you dream of playing at LSU- they can hand pick players from LA and even out of state. I don't imagine players in GA regard UGA as having that same draw.
And NONE of that was true at LSU before Bertman -- which is exactly my point. You think we could waltz down to New Orleans and sign Will Clark today? Exactly. Not. Happening. Why in the world could the right coach not do the SAME thing at UGA? If we are being honest, they can -- and will at some point.

The next coach at UGA will have an opportunity to build a powerhouse like NO OTHER with a pretty damn big margin of error given the talent and scholarship money at his disposal. THAT makes it a top job -- regardless of what you may think about it...

If they pull a top name head coach from another big name program like is being rumored will it change your mind?

[SaltyDawg]

Potential plays a huge role in being a top job. MSU/OM are NOT top jobs despite what anyone wants to tell you -- because we don't give half the scholarship money of other places. Period. We have that overwhelming built in disadvantage. Georgia is obviously gearing up to be serious about baseball -- seeing how they fired their coach of 12 years this week and the job is being linked to huge names all around the college baseball scene.


And NONE of that was true at LSU before Bertman -- which is exactly my point. You think we could waltz down to New Orleans and sign Will Clark today? Exactly. Not. Happening. Why in the world could the right coach not do the SAME thing at UGA? If we are being honest, they can -- and will at some point.

The next coach at UGA will have an opportunity to build a powerhouse like NO OTHER with a pretty damn big margin of error given the talent and scholarship money at his disposal. THAT makes it a top job -- regardless of what you may think about it...

If they pull a top name head coach from another big name program like is being rumored will it change your mind?

I agree potential plays a big role in being a top job, but so does the current state of the program- regarding talent of current roster, fanbase, and school support among many others.

There aren't many Skip Bertman type coaches running around, at all- and there never will be. Skip Bertman would have won anywhere- maybe not to the extent he did at LSU, but he would've won regardless.

The next coach will have an opportunity to build a great program, I agree. But you think that makes it a Top 5 job right now? That's what the context of Kendall Rogers original statement was. You are telling me you can't name 5 other schools you would rather coach at RIGHT NOW?

[SaltyDawg]

Georgia is obviously gearing up to be serious about baseball -- seeing how they fired their coach of 12 years this week and the job is being linked to huge names all around the college baseball scene.

I would've fired my coach of 50 years if he had a record of 101-127 in the last four years considering the huge upside my program has, as you have mentioned.

[Sandman14]

engie trying to be smartest guy in the room...

why, then, did UGA not blow up after winning that national title? they had all the pieces in place, right?

why, then, did UGA not blow up after Polk took them to Omaha? they had all the pieces in place, right?

why, then, did UGA not blow up when they were runners up in 2008? they had all the pieces in place, right?

quit trying to be cool. you're flat wrong. you sound stupid. UGA is not top 5 in the SEC, much less the nation. It's not close. It's not debatable. It's just an absolute idiot (Kendall) who is being supported by a guy trying to be the smartest guy in the room (engie). ridiculous.

[CadaverDawg]

engie trying to be smartest guy in the room...

why, then, did UGA not blow up after winning that national title? they had all the pieces in place, right?

why, then, did UGA not blow up after Polk took them to Omaha? they had all the pieces in place, right?

why, then, did UGA not blow up when they were runners up in 2008? they had all the pieces in place, right?

quit trying to be cool. you're flat wrong. you sound stupid. UGA is not top 5 in the SEC, much less the nation. It's not close. It's not debatable. It's just an absolute idiot (Kendall) who is being supported by a guy trying to be the smartest guy in the room (engie). ridiculous.

I have a feeling this thread just went from being almost done with....to having several more pages. I've never known Engie to back down from a good argument

[engie]

I agree potential plays a big role in being a top job, but so does the current state of the program- regarding talent of current roster, fanbase, and school support among many others.
So, Texas, Miami, and USC aren't top jobs then? You could certainly argue all 3 of those schools currently lack at least 2 of 3 factors you mention.

College baseball is NOT as cut-throat as football -- meaning the immediate return on investment isn't seen or expected like it is in other sports. You are basically guaranteed the amount of time it takes to totally build YOUR team for 3-5 years. As such, the "current state" of a program means virtually nothing at the powerhouse jobs, which UGA is.

I contend that "current state" is only really important at "building block" jobs where guys want to turn it quickly and get the heck out of dodge -- not DESTINATION jobs.


There aren't many Skip Bertman type coaches running around, at all- and there never will be. Skip Bertman would have won anywhere- maybe not to the extent he did at LSU, but he would've won regardless.
Nor do they have to be to win and win big in Athens. There is a huge margin for error there to still build a national powerhouse. It's literally just like coaching at Miami or Florida St -- 2 places with "Ron Polkish" head coaches that quit recruiting long ago -- but have and will never quit winning on virtually their current levels.


The next coach will have an opportunity to build a great program, I agree. But you think that makes it a Top 5 job right now? That's what the context of Kendall Rogers original statement was. You are telling me you can't name 5 other schools you would rather coach at RIGHT NOW?
I couldn't think of 3 other schools that I'd rather coach at RIGHT NOW. I think the natural advantage and potential of that place is THAT great. That place has SO much potential to be epic.

[Will James]

I would've fired my coach of 50 years if he had a record of 101-127 in the last four years considering the huge upside my program has, as you have mentioned.

Haha I thought "Ronny" when reading this post.

[engie]

When you can't debate logically, making it personal is the first sign of a lack of actual intelligence. Glad you know more about college baseball than virtually everyone surrounding the actual game though -- who all, UNANIMOUSLY think it's a premiere job.


engie trying to be smartest guy in the room...
You imply this takes effort. I hate to inform you -- it's naturally occurring.


why, then, did UGA not blow up after winning that national title? they had all the pieces in place, right?
Obviously no, they didn't have the pieces in place. In 1991 -- the year after winning it all, they went 27-31(11-19). DEAD LAST in the SEC. They fell apart instead of building on success, which is indicative of shitty coaching and recruiting outside of snapshots where they either got lucky or bothered recruiting for ONE SINGLE offseason. Over the next decade, they went to the NCAA tournament ONCE(1992) and accumulated records of:
1991 - 27-31(11-19)
1992 - 35-25(12-11)
1993 - 30-29(10-18)
1994 - 22-35(9-19)
1995 - 29-29(9-17)
1996 - 24-30(9-21)
1997 - 28-27(8-22)
1998 - 24-30(8-21)
1999 - 25-30(8-20)
2000 - 32-26(14-15) -- year 1 with Polk and the beginning of the turnaround.
Do I need to post the pre-Bertman LSU records for comparison? That's the point you are trying to make, right? Laughable that you lack foresight and try to call those of us that see it how I do as "wrong" in some way. I bet you thought aTm was going to suck at football in the SEC too didn't you?


Because they fell apart and went 11 years without going back. The next year they were
why, then, did UGA not blow up after Polk took them to Omaha? they had all the pieces in place, right?
Obviously not. They went 32-29(15-15) the next year. Which brings back my initial point. They have never SUSTAINED the success necessary to blossom into the powerhouse that they inevitably one day become. Why? Because they've never had a coach that was worth a damn as a recruiter. Why do you think MSU is taking Adam Frasiers out of Georgia?


why, then, did UGA not blow up when they were runners up in 2008? they had all the pieces in place, right?
Again, obviously not -- because they promptly fell apart after the appearance. Doesn't look like they've had back to back winning conference records EXCEPT in Polk's 2 years in the 20+ years since college baseball became a big boy sport. This is the FIRST TIME they've hired a baseball coach with teams in their OWN DIVISION being profitable baseball schools. You think they are going to let SC continue to one-up them in facilities and dominate them on the field? Yeah, I didn't think so. The Foley Renovation is coming -- and it will happen SOON after hiring the new coach.


quit trying to be cool. you're flat wrong. you sound stupid.
LULZ.


UGA is not top 5 in the SEC, much less the nation. It's not close. It's not debatable. It's just an absolute idiot (Kendall) who is being supported by a guy trying to be the smartest guy in the room (engie). ridiculous.
Again -- totally hilarious. Thanks. Stick around -- I'll teach you something(else).

Please come back when they take a premiere coach -- recruit in the top 3 every year -- build a new $30+mil stadium -- and are in Omaha every other year winning it all a couple of times a decade. You can tell us then how it's not a premiere job and call everyone stupid again.

Dubmass.

[Sandman14]

Jobs better than UGA:

Mississippi State
Ole Miss
Texas A&M
Florida
South Carolina
LSU
Arkansas
Florida State
Texas
Virginia
North Carolina
Clemson
Fullerton
Miami
Vandy
Arizona
Arizona State

That's like 17. Maybe you can pick 4 or 5 to debate me on. You can't pick 10, not reasonably, anyway.

[Sandman14]

rookie, buying into this garbage. and as a matter of principle, keep in mind you are aligning yourself with Kendall, meaning there is about a 95% chance you are wrong from the get-go.

[engie]

Jobs better than UGA:

Mississippi State
Ole Miss
Texas A&M
Florida
South Carolina
LSU
Arkansas
Florida State
Texas
Virginia
North Carolina
Clemson
Fullerton
Miami
Vandy
Arizona
Arizona State

That's like 17. Maybe you can pick 4 or 5 to debate me on. You can't pick 10, not reasonably, anyway.

No need to "debate" any further with a moron -- everyone already sees and realizes it. The fact that you list MSU and OM as premiere baseball jobs greater than UGA simply confirms the fact that you have no clue about the realities you are blabbering about.

Lol, Vandy a better job than Georgia? Another prime example that you don't have a clue. What were they before Corbin? Oh -- that's right -- it had been TWENTY FOUR YEARS since they last made the NCAA tournament. Premiere? What a joke.

You are wrong about this -- but the hilarity of your position is that you will disappear from this website FAR too soon to own it when they become the dynasty everyone(with common sense and foresight) expects them to be.

[Coach34]

Jobs better than UGA:

Mississippi State
Ole Miss
Texas A&M
Florida
South Carolina
LSU
Arkansas
Florida State
Texas
Virginia
North Carolina
Clemson
Fullerton
Miami
Vandy
Arizona
Arizona State

That's like 17. Maybe you can pick 4 or 5 to debate me on. You can't pick 10, not reasonably, anyway.


Sorry agree with Engie.

I could go to Georgia and have them in a Regional every year- I couldnt do that at State or OM. They are the Texas A&M of football- wasted years underperforming when any good coach could make them a power.

[engie]

rookie, buying into this garbage.
EL OH EL


and as a matter of principle, keep in mind you are aligning yourself with Kendall, meaning there is about a 95% chance you are wrong from the get-go.
I'm 110% confident that Kendall Rogers knows more about college baseball -- is better traveled -- and is MUCH better versed on the actual perceptions among coaches out there -- and potential program greatness and recruiting bases -- than YOU are. So, you are right -- I absolutely agree with him on this.

The fact that you use him as an example to cite your own excellence(in disagreement with him) is just another example of the extent of your own delusion.

[Sandman14]

so are you going to pick out the 13 jobs that are worse? you've named MSU, Ole Miss, and Vandy.

MSU has one of the top 5 coaches in the country and owns all of the top 20 alltime attendance marks as well as one of the most storied venues in college baseball. also great new facilities and more to come. sorry but I'd rather coach at MSU, bias aside.

Ole Miss has become a really nice gig as well. maybe you win on that and vandy. I reeled off 17, and you've taken issue with 3, yet you say UGA is top 5. I'll continue to wait. going at 3 jobs on the list of 17 doesn't come close.

[Sandman14]

Kendall Rodgers today said MSU is playing for a national seed and yet could altogether miss hosting with a loss to Mizzou. Sorry but that isn't true of any team in contention for a national seed right now.

[Sandman14]

Sorry agree with Engie.

I could go to Georgia and have them in a Regional every year- I couldnt do that at State or OM. They are the Texas A&M of football- wasted years underperforming when any good coach could make them a power.

yeah that's good stuff...dave perno can't do it but you can. good one. former coach of the year, but you could do better.

[engie]

so are you going to pick out the 13 jobs that are worse? you've named MSU, Ole Miss, and Vandy.
No -- because I already told you that I think it is top 5 -- at worse top 10. I don't feel the need to "explain" it to you -- just like you aren't explaining anything about your ridiculous position. Nor do I want you to attempt it lest I have to spend even more time ripping it to shreds. I don't feel the need to go through on a case-by-case basis and explain WHY I think that UGA is premiere. I do -- Coach does -- Will does -- all people that have proven over time to have pretty good foresight on these matters. It's basically unanimous outside of you.

It all comes back to locally available talent -- something Georgia has just as much or more of in the immediate vicinity than any other area of the country -- the best college town in the SEC -- tons of money -- HOPE Scholarships -- ETC. Literally all they lack is a capital investment in baseball that they can(and will) make without ever batting an eye to be great. What will your excuse be if they pull a Brian O'Conner out of Virginia or Dan McDonnell out of Louisville -- which they just might?


MSU has one of the top 5 coaches in the country
Yeah, you aren't a homer much. Here comes the hypocrisy -- LACKS the foresight to call UGA what they are -- but then turns right around and says something like this that can only be based TOTALLY on foresight. Look, I like Cohen -- and I've taken up for him at times when it was not popular(2010, first half of 2011, losing streaks in 2012 and 2013, etc...I got ROASTED on SPS this year when we struggled), but you are a damn fool if you are HONESTLY trying to tell me that, right now, he's one of the top 5 coaches in the country based on ANYTHING tangible that he's accomplished. How many trips to Omaha does he have again? There's two dozen coaches out there with more TITLES than Cohen has Omaha trips.

And let's face the facts. Had Cohen NOT been a son of MSU that played here, there is no chance in hell we would have pulled him from UK...


and owns all of the top 20 alltime attendance marks
Wrong. Haven't checked your recordbook recently have you?


as well as one of the most storied venues in college baseball
That's now the 5th best in the DIVISION -- soon to become SIXTH best. Hell, a case could be made that Plainsman is nicer -- just smaller. Dudy Noble is still great -- but let's not kid ourselves -- it's not NEARLY the story that it once was in the national eye. It's just another great SEC west venue JUST like Swayze, Baum, Blue Bell, Alex Box, and soon to be Sewell Thomas.


also great new facilities and more to come. sorry but I'd rather coach at MSU, bias aside.
And you are a damn fool -- and would be considered as such in coaching circles. Nice facilities and crowds are great -- You've LITERALLY got to convince kids to come play for 1/3 of the money they can get elsewhere in the SEC -- generally from other schools' backyards -- where they can get a superior education. You conveniently ignore the fact that we've got 30-40% of the scholarship money to give in your analysis. Yeah, "bias aside" alright**


Ole Miss has become a really nice gig as well.
LOL. You'll see how nice it isn't when they fire Bianco and start trying to hire his replacement.


maybe you win on that and vandy. I reeled off 17, and you've taken issue with 3, yet you say UGA is top 5. I'll continue to wait. going at 3 jobs on the list of 17 doesn't come close.
Repetitive ignorance is magnified ignorance. My position is and was well-stated LONG before you went full retard on it. I don't feel the need to go thru it all over again. Just watch their ascent into greatness. I'll be right there to tell you "I told you so". Assuming, of course, that you stick around.

Georgia baseball = Texas A&M football.

[engie]

yeah that's good stuff...dave perno can't do it but you can. good one. former coach of the year, but you could do better.

And Pat McMahon kicked ass in Starkville -- but couldn't keep a job in Gainesville. Do you have a point? Yeah, I didn't think so...

[Sandman14]

plenty of ad hominem attacks, I'll say that I got close myself when I said you sounded stupid arguing UGA was a top 5 job. still, it was Kendall I call an idiot. I just said you sounded like an idiot making this point. but surely, kindly keep going with your ad hominem attacks. they really make your point well.

I disagree UGA is top 10, but just glad to know you are backed off of top 5. there is no way you could rationally demonstrate that. And you won't even try.

As for Cohen, his marks at every stop have been quite impressive. I definitely think he is a top 5 college coach, based on what he's done. he's taken two deadbeat SEC programs and taken them right up the ladder. he won the SEC at UK, and he had a horrible MSU squad within 6 outs of Omaha. now he has MSU turned around and back into the top 15.

I guess Cohen at UGA would have 2 national championships by now. One thing is for sure: if John Cohen wasn't an MSU guy, he would be at a better job, not worse.

oh yeah, and how many of the top 20 on-campus crowds does MSU have? all of top 10 and maybe 15 of 20. forgive me...not that it takes away from my point.

[Sandman14]

what does pat mcmahon have to do with this? are you really arguing that UF is not a better job than UGA?

[engie]

what does pat mcmahon have to do with this? are you really arguing that UF is not a better job than UGA?

UF job = UGA job. Period - end of story. That's my point.

[Ronny]

Sorry agree with Engie.

I could go to Georgia and have them in a Regional every year- I couldnt do that at State or OM. They are the Texas A&M of football- wasted years underperforming when any good coach could make them a power.

You will be building your powerhouse within the beautiful confines of Foley Field, which seats 3,291 people.

Another Foley Field fun fact: The most recent [attendance] record set was during the regular season on March 21, 2009, as 3rd-ranked Georgia defeated Mississippi State 4-0 in front of 4,461 spectators.

Some of you are claiming UGA is one of the best jobs in the country when their record attendance is what MSU draws vs. South Alabama on a Tuesday.

Per the Foley Field wikipedia page, In 2012, UGA ranked 32nd among Division I baseball programs in attendance, averaging 2,050 per home game.

Miss State will have more than 2,050 on hand when Bryant plays Troy in the Starkville Regional.

Even Southern Miss (the baseball program) would find this level of attendance embarrassing.

I use fan interest as a litmus test: UGA fails this litmus test miserably.

You could build a LSU-level progam @ UGA & yet you would never cross the 5,000 attendance barrier, even if you hosted a super regional.

UGA baseball reminds me of Alabama baseball except most of Alabama's best players sign with Miss. State.

Considering how Georgia Tech hosts almost every year, it would appear most of (the state of) Georgia's in-state talent (if they choose to stay in-state) sign with Georgia Tech.

Just face it: Being the baseball coach @ UGA is not a good job. Just because they have all the proper pieces in place to make it a good job does not mean it's a good job. The UGA fanbase doesn't give a shit about the UGA baseball program. Or basketball either, for that matter. UGA is a hardcore football school & could give a shit about the "finesse sports."

End of story.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foley_Field

[Sandman14]

Regarding your claim that UGA=UF, no, it does not. UF has better proximity to talent. UF has as much or more money to work with.

UF has the following regional appearances:

1958, 1960, 1962, 1977, 1979, 1981, 1982, 1984, 1985, 1988, 1989, 1991, 1992, 1994, 1996, 1997, 1998, 2000, 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012

UF has the following appearance in the CWS:

1988, 1991, 1996, 1998, 2005, 2010, 2011, 2012

UF has better facilities.

UGA regional appearances:

1987, 1990, 1992, 2001, 2002, 2004, 2006, 2008, 2009, 2011

UGA CWS appearances:

1987, 1990, 2001, 2004, 2006, 2008

You can argue about potential all day long. The fact is that UGA has been in a position to move forward on numerous occasions and has failed to do so.

There is no way to argue that UGA is as good a job as UF. You have tried, but you have only provided McMahon as rationale. That does not get it done. To the extent you think they are close, well, maybe. I'm not arguing UGA is not a decent job. I'm arguing that it sounds stupid to argue UGA is a top 5 job. And I'm correct.

[engie]

plenty of ad hominem attacks
Which you started. Period.


I'll say that I got close myself when I said you sounded stupid arguing UGA was a top 5 job. still, it was Kendall I call an idiot. I just said you sounded like an idiot making this point. but surely, kindly keep going with your ad hominem attacks. they really make your point well.
I was making my points WITHOUT making jackshit personal until AFTER you did. You tried to go message board cool -- at which point, you opened the can of worms.


I disagree UGA is top 10, but just glad to know you are backed off of top 5.
I didn't back off shit. There is a difference between saying "what they are" and "what you think they will be." What I think they are is a top 10 position. What I think they will be is a top 5 team. EXACTLY same scenario as aTm football.


there is no way you could rationally demonstrate that. And you won't even try.
I already did. About 10 times. Being blind to it doesn't mean it hasn't been done.
Feel free to show me another program that can put together multiple losing seasons, followed by Omaha, followed by losing seasons, and back to Omaha with no in between...if you can? Fact is -- they've already PROVEN they can be great(one of only 3 SEC TEAMS to ever win a title) -- they've just got to find a coach that recruits Atlanta relentlessly and there is no limit to how good they CAN be.


As for Cohen, his marks at every stop have been quite impressive. I definitely think he is a top 5 college coach, based on what he's done. he's taken two deadbeat SEC programs and taken them right up the ladder. he won the SEC at UK, and he had a horrible MSU squad within 6 outs of Omaha. now he has MSU turned around and back into the top 15.
One year in the top 15 does not make someone a top 5 coach. Sorry -- it just doesn't.


I guess Cohen at UGA would have 2 national championships by now. One thing is for sure: if John Cohen wasn't an MSU guy, he would be at a better job, not worse.
So, where would he be? He'd still be @ UK -- where they OFFERED HIM the biggest contract in the history of college baseball along with a $30 mil stadium if he would have stayed there. But yes -- a top 5 coach at UGA would have been to Omaha MULTIPLE times at UGA already. Hell, Polk was there for TWO YEARS and took them to Omaha -- and we know his old ass wasn't out on the road recruiting.


oh yeah, and how many of the top 20 on-campus crowds does MSU have? all of top 10 and maybe 15 of 20. forgive me...not that it takes away from my point.
And what does a "crowd" have to do with how good a job is...besides just being another drop in a bucket? Certainly FAR LESS too irrelevant to a coach to overcome the scholarship restrictions that we deal with.

MSU and OM are hugely successful programs with the "natural" disadvantages playing against us in our locations. That doesn't mean they are considered great jobs overall in coaching circles(or even "really good" jobs) -- just that we both consistently overachieve based on what we're given because we both care so damn much. There's a big difference between fan perception and coach perception.

[Sandman14]

You will be building your powerhouse within the beautiful confines of Foley Field, which seats 3,291 people.

Another Foley Field fun fact: The most recent [attendance] record set was during the regular season on March 21, 2009, as 3rd-ranked Georgia defeated Mississippi State 4-0 in front of 4,461 spectators.

Some of you are claiming UGA is one of the best jobs in the country when their record attendance is what MSU draws vs. South Alabama on a Tuesday.

Per the Foley Field wikipedia page, In 2012, UGA ranked 32nd among Division I baseball programs in attendance, averaging 2,050 per home game.

Miss State will have more than 2,050 on hand when Bryant plays Troy in the Starkville Regional.

Even Southern Miss (the baseball program) would find this level of attendance embarrassing.

I use fan interest as a litmus test: UGA fails this litmus test miserably.

You could build a LSU-level progam @ UGA & yet you would never cross the 5,000 attendance barrier, even if you hosted a super regional.

UGA baseball reminds me of Alabama baseball except most of Alabama's best players sign with Miss. State.

Considering how Georgia Tech hosts almost every year, it would appear most of (the state of) Georgia's in-state talent (if they choose to stay in-state) sign with Georgia Tech.

Just face it: Being the baseball coach @ UGA is not a good job. Just because they have all the proper pieces in place to make it a good job does not mean it's a good job. The UGA fanbase doesn't give a shit about the UGA baseball program. Or basketball either, for that matter. UGA is a hardcore football school & could give a shit about the "finesse sports."

End of story.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foley_Field

BOOM

[Sandman14]

Am I the only one on this board that thinks MSU is a better college baseball job than UGA?

[engie]

No, it is not. UF has better proximity to talent.
Just shut the **** up. Seriously. You have NO IDEA what you are talking about.


UF has as much or more money to work with.
Irrelevant. BOTH have 10x the money that MSU does and double the money of LSU.


UF has the following regional appearances:

1958, 1960, 1962, 1977, 1979, 1981, 1982, 1984, 1985, 1988, 1989, 1991, 1992, 1994, 1996, 1997, 1998, 2000, 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012

UF has the following appearance in the CWS:

1988, 1991, 1996, 1998, 2005, 2010, 2011, 2012

UF has better facilities.

UGA regional appearances:

1987, 1990, 1992, 2001, 2002, 2004, 2006, 2008, 2009, 2011

UGA CWS appearances:

1987, 1990, 2001, 2004, 2006, 2008

You can argue about potential all day long. The fact is that UGA has been in a position to move forward on numerous occasions and has failed to do so.
4 CWS last decade = 4 CWS last decade. OHHHH -- you are arguing ANCIENT history to try to make a point about the recent past(which goes against your argument) and future.

Georgia has already announced they are building a new baseball facility. The timing of which will be soon -- and it will be EXTENSIVE.


There is no way to argue that UGA is as good a job as UF.
Sure there is.


You have tried, but you have only provided McMahon as rationale.
What about POLK as rationale? 2 years -- 1 CWS. Left MSU and went to UGA.


That does not get it done. To the extent you think they are close, well, maybe. I'm not arguing UGA is not a decent job. I'm arguing that it sounds stupid to argue UGA is a top 5 job. And I'm correct.
Does not get what done?

Arguing about "potential" is stupid -- and I'm done with it. You'll see I'm right in due time -- and fear not, I won't let you forget about it either.

[engie]

Am I the only one on this board that thinks MSU is a better college baseball job than UGA?

If coaches were polled, it would be OVERWHELMING for UGA -- which Kendall is/was relaying

[Sandman14]

engie: still waiting on you to make the claim that UGA is better than 13 of the 17 teams I noted.

You've got Vandy and Ole Miss so far. I'm reluctant to agree with Ole Miss. I disagree with MSU based on the tangible facts. But I'll give you Vandy.

Glad to see that you cannot demonstrate that UGA is top 5, past present or future. Glad to see you've backed off to top 10. That's much safer (but still wrong). You have fun winning all these ancillary points, but know you are dead wrong arguing UGA is top 5, and sound silly trying...which is the point we are arguing.

[Sandman14]

And I'm sorry, but Ron Polk was still quite the coach when he went over to UGA. Even Skip Bertman and Ron Frasier admit he was the father. When he went to UGA, he brought them up quickly, but as you can see, they fizzled immediately without a top coach.

So UGA is better than UF because Ron friggan Polk took them to Omaha in year 2 and because Pat McMahon could not win at UF. makes sense.

[Sandman14]

This is like Field of Dreams..."If you build it, they will come." LOL.

[Will James]

I am just in shock and awe that someone claims Cohen is a top 5 coach in the country.

[Sandman14]

You and Ronny. Congrats on "elite" company.

Que?

I doubt everyone on this board but me truly believes UGA is a better job than MSU. So, you think that as Cohen grows MSU, UGA is just gonna skyrocket past us? Oh wait, they are already better...so poor ole MSU will be lagging behind the juggernaut that is UGA baseball for years to come. great stuff.

[Sandman14]

I am just in shock and awe that someone claims Cohen is a top 5 coach in the country.

This is a MUCH closer call than UGA being a top 5 job.

[CadaverDawg]

I have a feeling this thread just went from being almost done with....to having several more pages. I've never known Engie to back down from a good argument

The only one that we know has been 100% correct in this thread and can prove it....is me. Because I said this^^ a few pages back.

Carry on.

[engie]

engie: still waiting on you to make the claim that UGA is better than 13 of the 17 teams I noted.
There is no possible way you are this dense. No way. I've addressed this 5 ****ing times already.


You've got Vandy and Ole Miss so far. I'm reluctant to agree with Ole Miss. I disagree with MSU based on the tangible facts. But I'll give you Vandy.
You are a one trick pony on repeat.


Glad to see that you cannot demonstrate that UGA is top 5, past present or future. Glad to see you've backed off to top 10. That's much safer (but still wrong). You have fun winning all these ancillary points, but know you are dead wrong arguing UGA is top 5, and sound silly trying...which is the point we are arguing.
More irrelevant babble.

I can't believe you really want me to "prove" what I believe to be true about the FUTURE -- and you won't give up on it. Yet, you've proven nothing. At all. You know why? Because the future is UNPROVABLE -- that's why it's SPECULATED ON. I can't produce "numbers" to PROVE UGA will be elite in the future -- I just know it to be true. Exactly like I did with aTm in football.

It's going to be hilarious watching you crawfish on this when they pull a head coach from a team with a host site this year.

[Coach34]

yeah that's good stuff...dave perno can't do it but you can. good one. former coach of the year, but you could do better.

I'm a "coach of the year" winner myself- multiple times. Les Miles is too and people call him a ****ing idiot. Mark Hudspeth was single A Academy coach at one time. I could recruit circles around Ron Polk and he made State into a respected national program.

I'm not saying I'm special- but I am saying plenty of guys like myself could go to Georgia and recruit well enough to make them the Top 15-20 program they should be. Georgia has a plethera of talent and they have scholarship advantages- basically Georgia baseball is LSU football before Saban. All it would take is a solid coach that figured out how to get the surrounding talent in Georgia on campus.

[Todd4State]

Potential plays a huge role in being a top job. MSU/OM are NOT top jobs despite what anyone wants to tell you -- because we don't give half the scholarship money of other places. Period. We have that overwhelming built in disadvantage. Georgia is obviously gearing up to be serious about baseball -- seeing how they fired their coach of 12 years this week and the job is being linked to huge names all around the college baseball scene.


And NONE of that was true at LSU before Bertman -- which is exactly my point. You think we could waltz down to New Orleans and sign Will Clark today? Exactly. Not. Happening. Why in the world could the right coach not do the SAME thing at UGA? If we are being honest, they can -- and will at some point.

The next coach at UGA will have an opportunity to build a powerhouse like NO OTHER with a pretty damn big margin of error given the talent and scholarship money at his disposal. THAT makes it a top job -- regardless of what you may think about it...

If they pull a top name head coach from another big name program like is being rumored will it change your mind?

If we can get a lottery system in place, I think we would level the field immensely. Wasn't there something started a few years ago where you can put money towards your child's college tuition in Mississippi? Maybe if that comes to fruition, it will help us out in a few years. Mississippi is always behind on stuff like lottery scholarships.

[engie]

And I'm sorry, but Ron Polk was still quite the coach when he went over to UGA. Even Skip Bertman and Ron Frasier admit he was the father.
"Father" = FIRST. NOT BEST. Polk sucked from the day Cohen walked off the field in Rosenblatt in 1990 forward. You are a total moron ignorant of our OWN history to maintain otherwise. He had one tremendous recruiting class in 1994 thanks to Shoop and other hotshot assistants that carried a "comeback" in 97 and 98 that prevented the 90s from being just as inept as the 00s under his tutelage. You fit the stereotypical ignorance in our baseball fanbase to a T -- blinded by the 80s into believing that Polk could do no wrong despite being reduced to second-rate beginning on the day that Bertman arrived.


When he went to UGA, he brought them up quickly, but as you can see, they fizzled immediately without a top coach.
"Fizzled" = 3 Omaha trips in 12 years and playing for one championship. With a shitty coach and even shittier recruiter. I rest my case.


Polk is a top coach.
Too. Damn. Funny.


So UGA is better than UF because Ron friggan Polk took them to Omaha in year 2 and because Pat McMahon could not win at UF. makes sense.
Straw man bullshit. I'd say you are better than that -- but you aren't.

Georgia JOB = Florida JOB. You'll see why soon enough.

[Sandman14]

what will it prove if they break the bank to get a coach? any team with money can do that?

irrelevant babble is what you are spewing about your prediction that all the sudden UGA is a major player in college baseball. they aren't. it's simple.

the farther we go, the more you distance yourself from tangible, factual support. you are pretty much solely arguing on something built up in you mind. I'm arguing on what we have to go off of.

you can't support you argument that UGA is a top 5 job. period. it's fiction. can UGA be a top 10 job one day in about 5 years? maybe. will UGA ever be a top 5 job? HIGHLY unlikely. certainly it is not as of now.

[engie]

I'm a "coach of the year" winner myself- multiple times. Les Miles is too and people call him a ****ing idiot. Mark Hudspeth was single A Academy coach at one time. I could recruit circles around Ron Polk and he made State into a respected national program.

I'm not saying I'm special- but I am saying plenty of guys like myself could go to Georgia and recruit well enough to make them the Top 15-20 program they should be. Georgia has a plethera of talent and they have scholarship advantages- basically Georgia baseball is LSU football before Saban. All it would take is a solid coach that figured out how to get the surrounding talent in Georgia on campus.

Exactly. It takes a total idiot to not have them consistently in the top 15 or 20. It is MUCH, MUCH harder at MSU and Ole Miss than it is at UGA.

[Sandman14]

more ad hominem...nothing to see here..you refuse to address this issue before you and instead keep going off on rabbit trails.

you sound silly arguing that UGA is a top 5 job. that's all I said. and it's the truth. there are at least 10 better jobs, but undoubtedly 5. no basis for any argument to the contrary.

[engie]

If we can get a lottery system in place, I think we would level the field immensely. Wasn't there something started a few years ago where you can put money towards your child's college tuition in Mississippi? Maybe if that comes to fruition, it will help us out in a few years. Mississippi is always behind on stuff like lottery scholarships.

If we had a lottery scholarship system equal to Georgia in place, we'd go from borderline top 20 jobs -- to easy top 10 jobs. That much, I agree with...

[Sandman14]

Exactly. It takes a total idiot to not have them consistently in the top 15 or 20. It is MUCH, MUCH harder at MSU and Ole Miss than it is at UGA.

you are good at ad hominem attacks, I'll give you that. and glad to know perno is a total idiot. I never really liked him, but glad to know he's a total idiot.

Perno:

2 SEC Championships
5 NCAA Regionals
3 Super Regionals
3 College World Series
1 CWS finals appearance
Awards
2004 Baseball America Coach of the Year
2008 SEC Coach of the Year

[Sandman14]

so todd, are you in the camp that puts UGA as a better job than MSU?

[engie]

what will it prove if they break the bank to get a coach? any team with money can do that?
It proves they are serious. If they are serious, they will DOMINATE -- as that is ALL that has reasonably held them back all this time.


irrelevant babble is what you are spewing about your prediction that all the sudden UGA is a major player in college baseball. they aren't. it's simple.
There's a reason they are called PREDICTIONS.


the farther we go, the more you distance yourself from tangible, factual support.
You haven't gotten any farther away -- because you went full retard from the very beginning.


you are pretty much solely arguing on something built up in you mind.
PREDICTING THE FUTURE.


I'm arguing on what we have to go off of.
What did we have to go off of when I said aTm would dominate in football? Exactly. Some of us see the big picture. Some don't. You don't. It's really that simple.


you can't support you argument that UGA is a top 5 job. period. it's fiction.
Watch them kick ass and learn. You can't argue that Tennessee is top 20 -- but they pulled a top 10 coach didn't they?
Here's another prediction for you -- That Tennessee team is ON THE BRINK of being very good.


Can UGA be a top 10 job one day in about 5 years? maybe.
Yet you couldn't find a single college baseball coach in AMERICA that doesn't think they are a top 10 job RIGHT NOW. Their pledged investments into the baseball program guarantees it.


will UGA ever be a top 5 job? HIGHLY unlikely. certainly it is not as of now.
We heard you the first 300 times.

[engie]

you are good at ad hominem attacks, I'll give you that. and glad to know perno is a total idiot. I never really liked him, but glad to know he's a total idiot.

Perno:

2 SEC Championships
5 NCAA Regionals
3 Super Regionals
3 College World Series
1 CWS finals appearance
Awards
2004 Baseball America Coach of the Year
2008 SEC Coach of the Year

This is supposed to make your point, how? How can you argue that a guy is a great coach that is in Omaha one year and can't make the SEC tournament the next CONSISTENTLY throughout his career? There is SIMPLY TOO MUCH talent there to fail any worse than Perno did. Time will prove just how inept Perno was -- just like time will tell(and is already beginning to) just how inept Polk had become at MSU for his last 15 years here.

Perno MISSED SIX REGIONALS at UGA. UGA won't miss 6 regionals in the next 30 years.

[Sandman14]

oh really? won't miss 6 in 30 years. this is getting good.

the way it proves my point is that you said perno was a total idiot. I was showing you facts that demonstrate he is not a total idiot. you aren't big on these little details called "facts" are you?

[Sandman14]

when you say "we," are you meaning you and Kendall?

[engie]

oh really? won't miss 6 in 30 years. this is getting good.
Georgia Tech has missed THREE in the past 30 years. Surely you don't think they are "naturally" a better baseball program than Georgia?
Crash and burn, bitch.
http://my.jetscreenshot.com/12222/m_20130521-yi1h-43kb.jpg


the way it proves my point is that you said perno was a total idiot.
Time will prove that true. High "highs" doesn't replace half of his tenure being a total trainwreck. Consistency builds programs. Not flashes in a pan. Ole Miss didn't build Swayze in 2005 -- they built it in 2009. EIGHT years after they started consistently winning.


I was showing you facts that demonstrate he is not a total idiot.
Missing regionals half the time in one of the nation's hotbeds for baseball talent = TOTAL IDIOT. Cohen misses 6 of 12 at MSU, he's a total idiot too -- and his job is much, much harder than the job at UGA.


you aren't big on these little details called "facts" are you?
I'm bigger on "facts" than anyone you will ever meet. It's unfortunate that you do not bring any.

[engie]

when you say "we," are you meaning you and Kendall?

Me, Kendall, Coach, Will, Aaron Fitt, the entire college and professional baseball fraternities, everyone in America that pays attention outside the state of Mississippi = WE.

[Sandman14]

I was unaware that Coach, Todd, Will, as well as Aaron Fitt believe UGA is a top 5 job in college baseball. Can I get some confirmation of this?

[Sandman14]

And another thing, the ad hominem...it's continuing but still not working...excuse me for calling Kendall an idiot, which he is, and saying that you sound like an idiot arguing that UGA is a top 5 job. That was an error on my part, but surely you have made up for it and can lay aside all the trashiness. Bitch?

crash and burn because Ga Tech has missed 3 regionals in 30 years? That's a testament to the jackets and the nice work they have been doing, but in no way do I believe that it makes UGA a lock to miss 6 or less regionals in the next 30 years. I don't believe Ga. Tech has faced the level of competition the last 30 years that UGA will face in the SEC for the next 30. But whatever.

And no I don't think UGA will ever enjoy the home field advantage that MSU enjoys. I don't think it is easier to win home games at UGA than MSU now, and I don't think that will change any time soon, either. I think UGA enjoys a nice advantage with its in-state deal, but no, I don't think overall they have more advantages than MSU has. That's just my opinion. It does not have anything to do with the fact that UGA is not a top 5 coaching job.

[CadaverDawg]

I was unaware that Coach, Todd, Will, as well as Aaron Fitt believe UGA is a top 5 job in college baseball. Can I get some confirmation of this?

I don't know exactly how I would rank a top 5 in the country, but that UGA job is an absolute sleeping giant. When it is put in the right hands, and their new stadium is built...watch out. In my eyes, it is definitely a better job than MSU and I can probably agree that it is a Top 5 job in the country. I don't think you realize just how many elite athletes that area produces. UGA is probably the most underachieving athletics program in the country year in and year out.

So, count me in the group that agrees with Engie...but I can't speak for Coach, Todd, Will, or Aaron.

And I'm not here to argue about it.

[Quaoarsking]

I wouldn't call Georgia a top 5 job right now, but it certainly has the potential to turn into one.

[Sandman14]

fair enough, cadaver thinks UGA is a top 5 job.

What about Texas. Is UGA a better job than Texas? What about LSU? What about South Carolina? UGA is better than UF? UGA is better than FSU? Better than Fullerton? Fullerton has never had a losing season in D-I. I can't say UGA is better than Arkansas with their average attendance of 8K and the nice run they are on...better than Stanford? better than Arizona?

I just cannot wrap my mind around this assertion. But I can respectfully disagree. I just think it's based on pure speculation. To me, Arizona State is as much of a sleeping giant than UGA. But hey, I've been wrong before.

[CadaverDawg]

fair enough, cadaver thinks UGA is a top 5 job.

What about Texas. Is UGA a better job than Texas? What about LSU? What about South Carolina? UGA is better than UF? UGA is better than FSU? Better than Fullerton? Fullerton has never had a losing season in D-I. I can't say UGA is better than Arkansas with their average attendance of 8K and the nice run they are on...better than Stanford? better than Arizona?

I just cannot wrap my mind around this assertion. But I can respectfully disagree. I just think it's based on pure speculation. To me, Arizona State is as much of a sleeping giant than UGA. But hey, I've been wrong before.

Like I said, Im not arguing about it because I don't care about it enough. But Im looking at it more in terms of potential. I mean, you bring up Texas, and I agree that Texas is a Top 5...but they finished last in the Big 12 this year. So based on your Georgia logic, how can you use Texas as a comparison?

And yes, I think Georgia is a better "job" than Florida AND South Carolina. You have to be able to differentiate between the word "job" and attendance, recent success, current record, etc. If we are talking best college baseball programs in history according to wins, losses, and attendance numbers, then obviously many of us would have different opinions.

[Coach34]

I was unaware that Coach, Todd, Will, as well as Aaron Fitt believe UGA is a top 5 job in college baseball. Can I get some confirmation of this?

I think it's a top 10 baseball job with a good hire. Hell, as they said, Polk's lazy ass went there and had them in a WS by his 2nd year just on talent he inherited. They have too much money. talent, and scholarship program not to be. Hopefully they make another bad hire- but I'm not counting on it this time- Dooley is gone. They appear to be committing to baseball finally

[Sandman14]

I'm going off common sense with Texas. It and LSU are the two top jobs in the nation, without a doubt, in my mind. Their performance in the last couple years does not take away from their dominance over the last 30 years or whatever.

I think South Carolina is a serious power. Is that all on Tanner? Maybe. But UGA will be hard pressed to build a field as nice as USC. In fact, they'll have to start from scratch for sure, which they may do. I don't have the inside knowledge on their stadium plans.

[Sandman14]

so coach is out.

when did Aaron Fitt agree with Kendall? Maybe so but that would surprise me.

[Coach34]

But UGA will be hard pressed to build a field as nice as USC. In fact, they'll have to start from scratch for sure, which they may do. I don't have the inside knowledge on their stadium plans.

well, 30MM should build them a pretty damn good one

[engie]

You need to learn to differentiate between the RIGHT NOW indicated by the past -- and the expected future. That's where your disconnect is with what I(and others) are attempting to say.


What about Texas. Is UGA a better job than Texas?
No. Absolute potential to be on the same tier.


What about LSU?
Georgia currently = LSU before Bertman. Ticking time bomb that will go off at some point. Just a matter of when. But no, not today, it's not a better job than LSU -- but certainly SHOULD be on the same tier in time. THAT is what makes the job so attractive. The ability to build instead of just maintain. Having the chance to build something like that is pretty rare in college sports -- and ALL coaches are well aware of the potential of that program.


What about South Carolina?
You need to differentiate between transcendent teams and transcendent coaches. South Carolina doesn't belong on the previous tier as a program IMO until they maintain Tanner's success under Holbrook or another coach. Yes, I realize they had some success in the 80s...


UGA is better than UF?
Equal.


UGA is better than FSU?
Equal.


Better than Fullerton?
If that job was so amazing, how do you explain Serrano at Tennessee? From a talent perspective Equal.


Fullerton has never had a losing season in D-I.
OK? Just proves they've had tremendous coaches continually. I mean, seriously. Look at the names -- it's a who's who.


I can't say UGA is better than Arkansas with their average attendance of 8K and the nice run they are on...better than Stanford? better than Arizona?
So, Arkansas' measure of success is fan support -- while the rest of these teams rest solely on their on-field accomplishments? Doesn't make sense.


I just cannot wrap my mind around this assertion. But I can respectfully disagree.
If you had done that initially, this pissing match never would have happened...


I just think it's based on pure speculation. To me, Arizona State is as much of a sleeping giant than UGA.
Nothing sleeping about Arizona St. They are simply on probation and under scholarship reductions still. Were in Omaha 4 times in the 6 years leading up to their probation.

Omaha trips since 2001:

Cal State Fullerton - 6
South Carolina - 6
Rice - 5
North Carolina - 5
Miami - 5
Florida - 4
LSU - 4
Georgia - 4
Stanford - 4
Arizona St - 4
Arkansas - 3
Oregon St - 3
Nebraska - 3
Florida St - 3
Clemson - 3

So, tied for 6th -- and tied for best in the SEC.

That's with 2 coaches who I've asserted many times now that I think were subpar -- and absolutely terrible matches for the Atlanta recruiting scene -- that were incapable of bringing the culture changes necessary for that program to become what I believe that it can be. That's all I'm trying to say.

[Will James]

With the new conference setup Texas will have to devote 110% of it's time and resources to Foosball and parity is exposing Augie. Tejas's days at the top have passed by.

[engie]

With the new conference setup Texas will have to devote 110% of it's time and resources to Foosball and parity is exposing Augie. Tejas's days at the top have passed by.

I dunno about that Will. Texas has more resources than football could use up in 100 lifetimes. Last year, they earned $1.15 BILLION endowment INTEREST. MSU and OM's combined total endowments are worth about $800 million -- and we lost $11 mil last year combined.

Time has exposed Deloss Dodds IMO -- who now has 3 overpaid, underperforming, past-their-prime coaches in all of the big 3 sports and has failed to make changes with any of them. At this point, the prevailing sentiment in Austin is that Dodds doesn't get to make any of the "tough" decisions they are facing -- and his days in control are numbered -- as in, out of control before football season next year if not by the end of baseball season this year. I agree though -- it's time for Augie to bow out.

[Sandman14]

Engie thanks for the directives, but I disagree that "I need" to do those things. But that's not the point. I just enjoyed how you wrote that.

If some of you won't agree that Texas is a better job than UGA, then this is borderline ridiculous. Texas is a mecca of college baseball, similar to LSU. UGA does not "belong on that tier" until they can prove they can actually perform as a program at the level of LSU and USC. They haven't even broken ground on any stadium. Just because you feel potential exists, that in no way makes UGA a top 5 job, now or in some future dream or premonition. There are many program that are actually doing it. Those programs are better until some tangible inclination arises to suggest that a change in the balance of power is occurring.

Further, all I can see is that they have approved a couple million in renovation to a terrible stadium. A 10 Million proposal has been introduced. Has it passed? When is this 30 Million deal happening?

"The big-picture facility changes are still in the distant future, and McGarity hesitates to place a timetable on when to expect a completed project. Selecting contractors and gaining the board's funding approval will take time. Plus he told the board members he wants to raise at least $5 million of the necessary funds before bringing the full renovation project request before them at a future meeting."

http://espn.go.com/colleges/georgia/story/_/id/8034732/georgia-bulldogs-baseball-stadium-foley-field-sees-impressive-improvements

Maybe something has occurred that I don't know about, but from what I can tell, this is high talk which remains a ways away. I think some folks are building this "awakening" up a bit more than reality indicates.

Please enlighten me. And I'm not jackassing anyone. I want to know. If they are breaking ground on a new 30 million stadium, well, that's impressive. I can't say, from what I've seen, that anything exists that would warrant this talk of top 5 programs.

[engie]

Engie thanks for the directives, but I disagree that "I need" to do those things. But that's not the point. I just enjoyed how you wrote that.

If some of you won't agree that Texas is a better job than UGA, then this is borderline ridiculous. Texas is a mecca of college baseball, similar to LSU. UGA does not "belong on that tier" until they can prove they can actually perform as a program at the level of LSU and USC. They haven't even broken ground on any stadium. Just because you feel potential exists, that in no way makes UGA a top 5 job, now or in some future dream or premonition. There are many program that are actually doing it. Those programs are better until some tangible inclination arises to suggest that a change in the balance of power is occurring.
You, again, fail to separate the difference between what HAS happened in the past and what is expected to happen in the future. What was Florida football in 1990? Same exact scenario from where I'm sitting. I see Georgia baseball as an IMMINENT powerhouse. Doesn't have ANYTHING to do with history -- has to do with the future and what I already KNOW to be true about the recruiting opportunity within an hour and a half of that campus -- and these types of things are generally obvious to people who pay attention to what goes on behind the scenes.

All those programs that are allegedly "doing it" -- yet only 5 programs have more trips to Omaha than UGA does in the previous decade. What gives there? You apparently think that is UGA's ceiling. I think that is UGA's basement.

I didn't HAVE to see aTm become a powerhouse to know it was coming -- I didn't HAVE to see Florida under Spurrier to know they were going to be tremendous -- I didn't need to see Vandy under Corbin to know they had tremendous potential -- I didn't HAVE to see Tennessee under Serrano to know they are about to become a very competitive squad -- and I don't HAVE to SEE a power shift ACTUALLY HAPPEN in the east to know it IS COMING -- and UGA will be at the very top of the heap.


Further, all I can see is that they have approved a couple million in renovation to a terrible stadium. A 10 Million proposal has been introduced. Has it passed? When is this 30 Million deal happening?

"The big-picture facility changes are still in the distant future, and McGarity hesitates to place a timetable on when to expect a completed project. Selecting contractors and gaining the board's funding approval will take time. Plus he told the board members he wants to raise at least $5 million of the necessary funds before bringing the full renovation project request before them at a future meeting."

http://espn.go.com/colleges/georgia/story/_/id/8034732/georgia-bulldogs-baseball-stadium-foley-field-sees-impressive-improvements

Maybe something has occurred that I don't know about, but from what I can tell, this is high talk which remains a ways away. I think some folks are building this "awakening" up a bit more than reality indicates.

Please enlighten me. And I'm not jackassing anyone. I want to know. If they are breaking ground on a new 30 million stadium, well, that's impressive. I can't say, from what I've seen, that anything exists that would warrant this talk of top 5 programs.
I've got sources at UGA for baseball -- and there has been a recent shift in their perception among the people controlling that program to actually caring -- presumably from seeing South Carolina's baseball accounting and realizing what kind of potential that they have to actually make money with it and give an amazing experience to students. Trust me -- they are working on plans to rebuild Foley on that spot(playing a year in a combination of Coolray and Turner) and building it into a virtual Coolray clone(think Trustmark Park with more premium seating). Plans calls for tiers to be cut into their right field ivy hill for students -- basically creating a larger outfield version of what Ole Miss has. All this is being put in fastforward(at least in what is being spread around the program) in the luring stage of a new coach. THAT is how they change perception longterm -- and "become LSU". They give the students tremendous experiences that they want to come back and relive in their post-college lives. When those students become teachers and parents, that "love" gets passed on -- and kids in Atlanta grow up dreaming about Athens AND Atlanta(the biggest current problem is that too many of them ONLY dream of Atlanta -- because neither Tech nor UGA have ever really given a damn about baseball despite being very good at times). That's now changing in Athens. Once this process really takes hold, you've got a sustained powerhouse of epic proportions.

Took Ole Miss 8 years of sustained success to "build" Swayze -- and their talent base, recruiting base, and "reach" is 1/10 that of UGA. I think UGA can begin to have very good success by year 2 or 3 under a new coach -- but it's going to take awhile with consistency to sustain the fanbase in such a way that it becomes a self-sustaining powerhouse.

Can you find anything in print about the Dudy Noble renovation? Do you know that it's coming? Virtually the same thing...

[Sandman14]

So by this line of thought, if I hear through my "sources" that we are instituting a state lottery for in-state tuition, and I hear through my "sources" that Dudy Noble is being renovated, I can make the correlation that MSU will be a top 5 program?

No, I don't agree. I think once we learn that we are actually getting a lottery similar to UGA's, and once the plan has been approved to do the renovation and ground has been broken, only then can I make assertions regarding what is reasonably expected.

Apart from that, it is mere speculation, as opposed to reasonable conjecture.

All I see is you trying too hard to make this point and doing it without any sound, credible evidence.

Epic proportions? C'mon man. Let's just try to avoid being the worst team in the SEC first.

[engie]

So, you weren't flaming and wanted an honest response -- so you could start right back flaming? Got it**


So by this line of thought, if I hear through my "sources" that we are instituting a state lottery for in-state tuition, and I hear through my "sources" that Dudy Noble is being renovated, I can make the correlation that MSU will be a top 5 program?
How much baseball talent is within an hour and a half of MSU? Exactly. No -- you still couldn't even REMOTELY say that. Nice analogy failure.


No, I don't agree.
I'm shocked by this**


I think once we learn that we are actually getting a lottery similar to UGA's, and once the plan has been approved to do the renovation and ground has been broken, only then can I make assertions regarding what is reasonably expected.
What are you even talking about? Georgia HAS a lottery -- and announcement on the stadium could come as early as the next few months. How do you think I know those details...if you can't find them online? Clearly I know something you don't on the matter. So cry me a river and call it speculation.

You probably doubted it when we said it was just a matter of time before Sewell Thomas would be built into a palace too didn't you? But wait -- they haven't broken ground yet -- so "maybe" it's not coming? Do you see how ridiculous this sounds? COMMON SENSE tells you what's coming. Something you've repeatedly shown that you ABSOLUTELY lack in regards to this subject matter -- which has been proven by you failing to realize and admit the talent base in Atlanta despite REPEATEDLY being told about it.

IDGAF if you "believe" it or not. Just shut up and quit questioning MY OPINION(also known as the "common" opinion here) on something that is NOT PROVABLE IN ANY WAY IN THE CURRENT TENSE. We already know your thoughs. You know mine and everyone else with any sense here is different. Why keep attempting to argue about something you will NEVER gain any traction with? Let it go already.


Apart from that, it is mere speculation, as opposed to reasonable conjecture.
Mere speculation? Lulz. You are actually going to doubt that I know what I'm talking about on this? You waltz in here -- sign up for 3 days -- and go to questioning me on baseball stuff that YOU ALREADY KNOW FOR 100% SURE YOU DON'T KNOW A DAMN THING ABOUT? Hilarity in it's own right.


All I see is you trying too hard to make this point and doing it without any sound, credible evidence.
Rightttt****


Epic proportions? C'mon man. Let's just try to avoid being the worst team in the SEC first.
Lulz***

[Sandman14]

I'm not flaming. I'm debating. And I don't understand all the caps lock and asterisks. And the ad hominem is played out. Re-read your last post. It is ridiculous.

This is not about who has signed up when. It is about you getting your feelings hurt. Me doubting you have "inside sources" at UGA? Why, yes. I'm more concerned with tangible points. Please don't play the "inside sources" card.

I'm debating whether your opinion is reasonable. That is all. I don't think it is reasonable to conclude that UGA is a top 5 job. Not based on the past, the present, or future indicators. It may well be a job on the rise, but there is nothing to base you opinion on other than rank speculation. That is all I'm arguing.

So yes, when UGA is winning 1 out of 2 national championships, you will be right. When they have some palace built that holds 10K and they are skull draggin the SEC baseball powers, then yes, you'll be right.

But as far as this debate, you are reaching big time and it's evident by your anger as evinced by your caps lock, your astericks, and your ad hominem attacks.

And no, your points don't hold extra water because you are a long-time and I just signed up. This is about debate. Rationale debate. And clearly I think that logic is on my side that UGA is not a top 5 job.

[engie]

I'm not flaming. I'm debating.
Insinuating that I don't know what I'm talking about IS the very definition of flaming. That is ALL you've done here. Attack my opinion -- then deflect when it starts flying back at you.


And I don't understand all the caps lock and asterisks.
You've been following these boards for awhile obviously**


And the ad hominem is played out. Re-read your last post. It is ridiculous.
Reread your entire opinion -- which has been virtually nothing but an attack on my opinion. That's what is ridiculous.


This is not about who has signed up when.
It's about who knows what. I do on baseball -- and I've taken great care to prove that repeatedly over time. Coming here questioning/doubting that on day 1 is insulting as hell -- which was no doubt your initial intention seeing as the topic is "unprovable" in the short term and can only be determined in the future. Disagreeing is one thing. Questioning the validity of MY opinion is something else ENTIRELY -- and your damn right it pisses me off. Did I question the validity of your opinion? No. So, what gives you the right to question mine -- which has been proven as logical and well-founded by the majority of people agreeing with my stance in general?


Me doubting you have "inside sources" at UGA? Why, yes. Please don't play the "inside sources" card.
Would a picture of an official 95 World Series ball signed by every Braves player to go along "family" pictures of myself with a coach on that team -- and his son who in one year older than me and played at UGA under Polk -- all of which remain close to people at UGA and in Atl highschool baseball -- suffice as evidence that I probably have a little better idea of what is going on with the UGA baseball program than you do? Probably not, huh?


I'm more concerned with tangible points.
Yet you make none. You want to base an argument on distant history -- while I want to base it on recent history and future projections. All of your "points" have been made. No better than the 18th best job in America, remember?


I'm debating whether your opinion is reasonable. That is all.
No -- you are flaming my opinion despite it being backed statistically and consistently proven to be well-founded -- on an argument that you LITERALLY can not win. Thus why your continued attempts to argue are nothing but a flame.


I don't think it is reasonable to conclude that UGA is a top 5 job.
NO. JOKE.


Not based on the past, the present, or future indicators.
You've made it abundantly clear this is what you think. No need to tell us for the 35th time in this thread.


It may well be a job on the rise, but there is nothing to base you opinion on other than rank speculation. That is all I'm arguing.
No. You are arguing for the sake of arguing.


So yes, when UGA is winning 1 out of 2 national championships, you will be right. When they have some palace built that holds 10K and they are skull draggin the SEC baseball powers, then yes, you'll be right.
And I'm sure you'll be around to own it**


But as far as this debate, you are reaching big time and it's evident by your anger as evinced by your caps lock, your astericks, and your ad hominem attacks.
No. You questioning my baseball tact while displaying a lack of your own pissed me off. Simple as that. How many times can you use the phrase ad hominem in one thread?


And no, your points don't hold extra water because you are a long-time and I just signed up. This is about debate. Rationale debate. And clearly I think that logic is on my side that UGA is not a top 5 job.
And clearly others disagree. Time to Let. It. Go.

You are not changing my mind. Team has been to the 6th most CWS in the past 12 years -- In your opinion, they are no better than the 18th best job in America despite lackluster coaching and absent recruiting. Got it**

I'm done "debating" this.

[Sandman14]

Engie: I got half way down and realized that I am sorry. I did not mean to get so deep. I am a newcomer. I don't want to spoil the community. It's not my place. You guys have a good thing going here. If you see me get overly argumentative, call me out and remind me of this post. I don't want to do that. I think you guys have better baseball insight here than the sixpack board...it's more concentrated. I enjoy all comments. College baseball is my favorite.

We just disagree. That is all. So be it.

[Todd4State]

I'll only reply since I was asked my opinion and I haven't been able to since I am at work.

I listed my top five earlier. It is in the eye of the beholder to a degree. To me, the MSU job would be extremely attractive and in my top five and my personal number one, but I also have allegiances to MSU baseball.

Georgia is definitely in the top 10. Engie is correct with everything he is saying about the recruiting in the area. Perfect Game is based out of there and they have massive tournaments at the East Cobb sports complex. Every baseball prospect goes through there at some point unless you are under the radar like Hunter Renfroe. Perfect Game has changed the baseball climate in Georgia, and that coupled with the fact that there is a MLB team there makes a huge difference. It has become the fourth big baseball state- along with California, Texas, and Florida. Because of those changes, what happened in 2001 with Georgia baseball is irrelevant because it has changed so much.

If Georgia got a good coach that could recruit there- with or without support, see Vanderbilt, they could be a powerhouse. Now that said, I do have my doubts about the support that they are going to get from the University and they also are competing with Joe Fan with the Atlanta Braves- so they have a disadvantage there.

That's not to say we are a bad program- but we have to do things differently given our advantages and disadvantages. We have a LOT of loyal fans in Mississippi that raise their kids on MSU baseball. We have to identify the top players in the state and we must recruit Mississippi to be successful for that reason. Also, a lot of times those Mississippi kids have a lot of pride and they sometimes play over their ability because of their pride. That said, realistically, Mississippi does not produce enough talent year in and year out to field a Nationally competitve team. That's why it is also important for us to recruit the surrounding areas such as Memphis, Alabama, and Louisiana- which is a very underrated state as far as baseball talent in my opinion, and then try to get a few players from the large population states of California, Texas, Florida, and yes, Georgia.

My formula for us to be nationally competitive with a typical class:

5-8 from Mississippi with 8 being very high end.
1-2 players from each of the following- Memphis, Alabama, and Louisiana.
1 player from each of the big population states.

[Sandman14]

Ok so now that I've come back into threads to eat crow, and now that UGA has hired Kent State's coach to guide their magnificent program to the promised land, does anyone want to come back on here and eat a little crow himself? Is Stricklin or whatever the hell his name is a top 5 coach?

UGA sucks at baseball. They ain't building shit.

Meanwhile John Cohen IS a top 5 baseball coach, and MSU IS building itself into an elite power, and MSU IS a better job than UGA.

[engie]

I'll "eat crow" when they aren't a constant staple in Omaha in 3-4 years that nobody wants to see.

How good of coach is Stricklin? You tell me. He took the first MAC team to Omaha in 26 years last year--and made a higher percentage of regionals at Kent St than Perno did at UGA. He won his division in the MAC 7 of 9 years. He was the first to take a team from Ohio to Omaha in 43 years. Basically, he's won on the highest level he could possibly win at. Sometimes the best hire isn't the sexiest name. You are kidding yourself if you don't think there was tremendous interest in that job throughout college baseball.

Here's his "talent pool" in Ohio(2013 draft).
http://my.jetscreenshot.com/12222/m_20130611-e2xx-90kb.jpg

Here's(just the top half of) his "talent pool" in Georgia(2013 draft).
http://my.jetscreenshot.com/12222/m_20130611-fzng-101kb.jpg

Notice how Perno only successfully recruited ONE of the top 25 players in their own state in this class -- and only put ONE player in the top 20 rounds. There were 42 kids drafted from the state of Georgia this year -- only 3 at UGA. By comparison, Kennesaw St got 4. Only 3 of the top 42 @ UGA.

What do you honestly see happening when they start getting half -- or even 30% -- of these guys yearly? It's common sense and almost idiot proof to anyone that can simply recruit those players right up the road and get them to school. These are JUST the ones that were drafted. THIS year.

[Sandman14]

Yeah I'm just horsing around, generally speaking, but I will say that he's indisputably not one of the top 5 or 7 coaches in college baseball. I think that maybe there had been some comment about UGA going out and getting one of the big names.

[engie]

Yeah I'm just horsing around, generally speaking, but I will say that he's indisputably not one of the top 5 or 7 coaches in college baseball. I think that maybe there had been some comment about UGA going out and getting one of the big names.

I said they had interest from several of the big names -- as was actively reported by Aaron Fitt and Kendall Rogers. I never said they were going to hire a "big name" over the "best fit". Yes, Stricklin was one of the hottest names in coaching this year -- and I think they got one of the best coaches out there overall. He's also a guy with deep recruiting ties to the Atlanta area.

Again, just getting 30-40% of that Atlanta talent(not even talking about the first and second round guys) to UGA = a dominant powerhouse. Even if the coach is a total idiot. All these Atlanta kids coming out of highschool are generally as highly-developed as anywhere in the country. They are ready-made to walk onto a college campus and start as freshmen. If he successfully recruits Atl(whether or not he can coach), they are about to kick ass and take names.