Stolen from Reddit: What highly touted FB player have we ruined? [Archive]

War Machine Dawg

06-23-2014, 10:24 AM

We didn't ruin Dontae, he ruined himself by dealing drugs and getting busted.

Nailed it. Dontae didn't have the "want to" that would've allowed him to capitalize on his talent. He was dealing drugs long before he came to State, then he proceeded to eat his way into one of the most hated seniors in school history.

If I'm picking, I'm going with JJ. JWS essentially abused him to run up the score on Bama in '98. He was never the same after that game and wound up being an NFL bust. JJ just couldn't seem to get healthy after that Bama game, always having hamstring/groin/knee issues. Speaking of which, how the heck have we not gotten him back involved with the program somehow? Imagine the reaction for a JJ True Maroon pre-game video.

AROB44

06-23-2014, 10:26 AM

drunkernhelldawg

06-23-2014, 10:33 AM

Nailed it. Dontae didn't have the "want to" that would've allowed him to capitalize on his talent. He was dealing drugs long before he came to State, then he proceeded to eat his way into one of the most hated seniors in school history.

If I'm picking, I'm going with JJ. JWS essentially abused him to run up the score on Bama in '98. He was never the same after that game and wound up being an NFL bust. JJ just couldn't seem to get healthy after that Bama game, always having hamstring/groin/knee issues. Speaking of which, how the heck have we not gotten him back involved with the program somehow? Imagine the reaction for a JJ True Maroon pre-game video.

The fact that our fans choose to hate him after he had done the work he did for the maroon and white is a psychological blow that could have had big effects. How many other schools have had large numbers of fans openly boo a player on Senior Day? I think that was wrong of us. Even though I didn't participate, it's still "us" who did it.

drunkernhelldawg

06-23-2014, 10:40 AM

I also think the Ref who called back his touchdown when he dove into the end zone made a very unfair call that this one of a long string of unfair calls on Dontae: Our fan's judgment, this idiot ref, and the judge who over sentenced him on the drug charges.

He may not have met our expectations, but I do think it's important to remember that our players are human beings. Discounting the feelings of a human being is not an admirable action. Trying to inflict pain on others by anonymously joining a chorus of jeers is not something I'd stand by and let my child participate in.

Big4Dawg

06-23-2014, 10:46 AM

deltadawg99

06-23-2014, 10:57 AM

Omar Conner or Kevin Fant would be my pick.

Omar would have been a stud in a spread type of offense. I also think that he could have been a really good WR if we would have started him off there and just left him instead of moving back and forth between QB & WR.

Fant took an absolutely beating when he was here.

Brahmabull

06-23-2014, 10:57 AM

Hard for me to think of guys the MSU ruined. Obviously, there are guys that may have had different careers had they gone elsewhere like Omar and Tyler. Everybody is ultimately responsible for their own actions.

FISHDAWG

06-23-2014, 11:02 AM

I agree with the one I saw on there, Dontae Walker

this kinda sounds like fodder for our competition to show future recruits ...... I don't know that WE "ruined" anyone ... we have had players with issues and players that didn't pan out but I swear - to say we ruined them ??????

TheRef

06-23-2014, 11:05 AM

this kinda sounds like fodder for our competition to show future recruits ...... I don't know that WE "ruined" anyone ... we have had players with issues and players that didn't pan out but I swear - to say we ruined them ??????

I guess I should've worded it differently. But I was using the title that was on Reddit. And to be fair, every school is presenting examples on there. Bears brought up Masoli.

Interpolation_Dawg_EX

06-23-2014, 11:07 AM

I wouldn't say ruined, but more of underutilized for Donald Lee. He could've created so many mismatches if TE's were used more effectively back then.

starkvegasdawg

06-23-2014, 11:09 AM

Yeah, Not sure we ruined anybody. We may have had some that did not live up to potential or we may could have used differently over the years, but that is about it. Based on some of the logic being used here one could almost make an argument for Tyler Russell. He never really played in a style that best suited his skill set. I still don't think that means we ruined him, though.

Interpolation_Dawg_EX

06-23-2014, 11:09 AM

Bears brought up Masoli.
Or any of the other QB transfers they let in... Snead, Brunetti, and Schaeffer just off the top of my head.

MadDawg

06-23-2014, 11:10 AM

Wouldn't that be like saying we "ruined" Renardo Sidney? The only thing ruined having to so with Sidney was Stansbury's career.

Barkman Turner Overdrive

06-23-2014, 11:10 AM

Tyler Russell. Square peg in the round hole that is Mullin's offense.

drunkernhelldawg

06-23-2014, 11:13 AM

A lot of amazing athletes don't make the pros. That's mostly because of all of the amazing athletes that do make the pros. If you have developed your skills to the greatest extent possible, then it could be that the reason for failure is that you're just not at that level.

Dawg61

06-23-2014, 11:14 AM

Robert Elliott

Rick Danko

06-23-2014, 11:32 AM

Quay Evans. Don't believe we "ruined" him, more of he was highly touted and a bust.

PassInterference

06-23-2014, 11:33 AM

What else can we contribute to Ole Miss's playbook on how to steer recruits away from MSU?

TheRef

06-23-2014, 11:37 AM

What else can we contribute to Ole Miss's playbook on how to steer recruits away from MSU?

Sorry...feel free to move the thread or delete it altogether if you feel like it. I thought it would be a good panel for discussion. I was wrong, obviously. My bad.

Jack Lambert

06-23-2014, 11:38 AM

William Prince. Just never seemed to utilize him. Was a stud rb in high school. Don't really know if we ruined him or just wasted him. When we signed him, all I heard is "he's another Eric Dickerson".

I don't think either applies. He just was at State when we had some really good running backs.

HancockCountyDog

06-23-2014, 01:08 PM

I think the answer has to be Omarr Conner or Tyler Russell.

They both need a time machine so they can each other's coach. They both got screwed by the coach's offense they played under.

Conner would have been hell on wheels in Mullen's offense. Russell would have been the missing piece in Croom's traditional drop back style offense.

Its really amazing how well they would have each fit in those offenses. Now, Im not sure how well they each would have done, but based on what I saw, I think both would have thrived. Im not sure Russell would of had enough weapons, but still.

Dawg61

06-23-2014, 01:10 PM

What else can we contribute to Ole Miss's playbook on how to steer recruits away from MSU?

That is next to our other playbooks called "MSU Players In NFL","MSU Winners of 4 of last 5 Egg Bowls" and "Look At Our Ridiculous Facilities". Those three books recruit much better than this harmless thread on a slow summer Monday.

Tbonewannabe

06-23-2014, 01:18 PM

Robert Elliott had both knees rebuilt. Not many speed backs will make the NFL after that.

Dontae Walker was a cancer in the locker room. He would only do what he wanted to do. The only thing we didn't do was kick him off the team so maybe he could go somewhere else to get straightened out.

Johnson85

06-23-2014, 01:21 PM

Conner would have been hell on wheels in Mullen's offense. Russell would have been the missing piece in Croom's traditional drop back style offense.

Conner would have been ridiculous under Mullen. Russell would have been a godsend to Crooms, but I doubt he could have done more than make it not an embarrassing offense. If I was going to drop Russell into an offense, it would be the 98 and 99 offenses. I like Madkin, but I think you put Junior and Senior Russell in that spot instead of Freshman and Sophomore Madkin (or even Junior and Senior Madkin), and I think we are in the Sugar bowl one if not both years.

jumbo

06-23-2014, 01:23 PM

would love to see Conner is Mullen's O.

Johnson85

06-23-2014, 01:28 PM

I agree with the one I saw on there, Dontae Walker

Two ways to "ruin" a player:

(1) Enable him. This is what happened to a lot of UM's recruits in the last decade. I think it happened with Dontae Walker and probably several others in the latter Croom years. I don't think we have ruined any since Mullen got here. There are some players, and Dontae may have been one, that just can't be reached until they hit bottom. We obviously didn't ruin Quay Evans. I don't think there was anybody that could have done more, and I'll be even more sure if Nick James has really turned a corner. Similarly, Stansbury didn't ruin Renardo Sidney. He may have ruined Ravern Johnson. Ole Miss may not have ruined Braswell, but he didn't have a chance that close to Batesville. He may not have done any better anywhre else.

(2) Misuse them. I don't think 'ruin' is the right word here. It should probably just be 'waste'. We wasted Omar Conner. We didn't waste Tyler Russell although it's true he probably didn't get to live up to his potential with the offense we ran and the OL and WR we provided him. We wasted Kevin Fant. Eric Moulds is kind of like Russell. We certainly didn't waste him, but he didn't reach his potential.

War Machine Dawg

06-23-2014, 02:18 PM

Omarr Conner. Would have been really good under Mullen. Was the #9 QB. http://recruiting.scout.com/a.z?s=73&p=8&c=1&nid=222837&pg=7

Derek Pegues. Was #41 overall player, didn't even sniff the NFL. http://mississippistate.scout.com/a.z?s=136&p=8&c=1&nid=1215658

Omar Conner or Kevin Fant would be my pick.

Omar would have been a stud in a spread type of offense. I also think that he could have been a really good WR if we would have started him off there and just left him instead of moving back and forth between QB & WR.

Fant took an absolutely beating when he was here.

Damn, great choices. Forgot all about Omarr, DP, and Fant. I'd definitely take any of those 3 over JJ. Fant might be the toughest SOB I've ever seen play QB with some of the beatings he took thanks to his alleged offensive line.

deltadawg99

06-23-2014, 02:33 PM

Would Brent Schaefer go under the ruined or bust category? He would have been a stud in a spread offense, but Eddie O decided to put him under center instead.

Masoli ruined himself, he was lucky to be playing anywhere but lucky for him OM had that Parks and Recreation grad program that he was so passionate about. ha

Tbonewannabe

06-23-2014, 02:39 PM

Damn, great choices. Forgot all about Omarr, DP, and Fant. I'd definitely take any of those 3 over JJ. Fant might be the toughest SOB I've ever seen play QB with some of the beatings he took thanks to his alleged offensive line.

DP didn't play in the league because he ran something like a 4.8 in the 40 when they timed him. I think he just had a horrible trainer to get ready for the draft. It is like an interview and he bombed it bad.

Reminds me of Pig Prather, he just chose to do nothing for the draft and his work ethic showed. I remember watching the draft and he was the best available by Mel Kiper since the 3rd or 4th round. He got picked up by Cincy as a FA and immediately got cut.

dickiedawg

06-23-2014, 02:41 PM

I wouldn't say ruined, but more of underutilized for Donald Lee. He could've created so many mismatches if TE's were used more effectively back then.

Yeah, Donald Lee turned out OK.

bulldawg28

06-23-2014, 03:06 PM

What else can we contribute to Ole Miss's playbook on how to steer recruits away from MSU?

Robert Elliott had both knees rebuilt. Not many speed backs will make the NFL after that.

Dontae Walker was a cancer in the locker room. He would only do what he wanted to do. The only thing we didn't do was kick him off the team so maybe he could go somewhere else to get straightened out.

Donate wasn't a cancer nobody blamed him It was the coaches that gave him superstar status.

Johnson85

06-23-2014, 03:18 PM

DP didn't play in the league because he ran something like a 4.8 in the 40 when they timed him. I think he just had a horrible trainer to get ready for the draft. It is like an interview and he bombed it bad.

Reminds me of Pig Prather, he just chose to do nothing for the draft and his work ethic showed. I remember watching the draft and he was the best available by Mel Kiper since the 3rd or 4th round. He got picked up by Cincy as a FA and immediately got cut.

I don't think anybody did anything wrong with Pegeus, either coaches or Pegeus. He was a good college football player but didn't have the freak measurables required to be an NFL player. 4.8 may have been a little slow for him, but I don't think he quite had NFL athleticism. Our strength and conditioning did leave something to be desired, so maybe that's all he was missing, but I don't think he stands out as somebody that didn't reach his potential.

Pig Prather was different because he was definitely a draftable prospect. If he had stayed in the same shape he was in during the season (or at least the prior season), he would have easily been drafted.

Tbonewannabe

06-23-2014, 03:24 PM

Donate wasn't a cancer nobody blamed him It was the coaches that gave him superstar status.

I agree that it was the coaches that didn't keep him in line. He should have been kicked off the team before he even made it to Senior Day.

bulldawg28

06-23-2014, 03:38 PM

I agree that it was the coaches that didn't keep him in line. He should have been kicked off the team before he even made it to Senior Day.

He was kicked off the team after senior day.

quickstrike2

06-23-2014, 03:45 PM

We didn't ruin them, but I loved when we got CoEric Riley and Tony Burks. We absolutely had nobody to get them the ball though. Seemed like CoEric couldn't keep away from dumb penalties to stay on the field.

BoomBoom

06-23-2014, 03:50 PM

Who was the lineman an NFL scout at the combine called the most out of shape player he had ever seen?

Goat Holder

06-23-2014, 04:35 PM

Croom ruined Conner (and Henig's collarbone).

You could say King Jackie ruined a lot of guys there at the end, through lackluster recrootin and/or lack of discipline. But his guys always sort of ran wild - he just was always pretty good about controlling it until there at the end.

Mullen did not ruin Russell like others said, that's idiotic. He had a good career and owns some passing records - far from "ruined".

AlSwearengen

06-23-2014, 07:17 PM

War Machine Dawg

06-23-2014, 08:08 PM

Pegues was a good college player, but he didn't have the speed for the nfl.

DP was a whole lot faster than that 4.8 or whatever it was he put up at the Combine. Supposedly he ran closer to 4.4 or 4.5 at our Pro Day that year. But I also partially blame our S&C program for him. He got way too muscle bound, for lack of a better term, his SR season. He lost some of the flexibility and agility that made him great as a JR. Not to mention Crxxm never found a way to get him any offensive touches during his career. I'd kill to see what Mullen & Balis could've turned DP into.

Tbonewannabe

06-23-2014, 09:57 PM

He was kicked off the team after senior day.

He quit after Senior Day and I said he should have been kicked off before like in September.

Schultzy

06-23-2014, 10:15 PM

Jevon Snead.

I seen it dawg

06-23-2014, 10:15 PM

Schultzy

06-23-2014, 10:16 PM

Laramie Tunsil.

Schultzy

06-23-2014, 10:18 PM

Fat Freddie Kitchens. Alabama's mr football, we beat him here and there.

Schultzy

06-23-2014, 10:21 PM

Jimmy johns. We lit him up.

Schultzy

06-23-2014, 10:29 PM

Denard Robinson. Michigan qb of course.

War Machine Dawg

06-23-2014, 10:54 PM

Bulldog or not he was a drug dealer. Drug dealer.

Exactly. And he was a dealer even before he came to State. He didn't become a dealer because of some persecution complex. He wasn't "over sentenced" or whatever other bull is being spewed. He made a conscious choice early in life. Dontae got exactly what he deserved. Don't expect me to feel sorry for a guy who could've been an elite player and blew it because he'd rather deal and have street cred. Oh, and who then proceeded to compound his problems by refusing to stop eating.

bulldawg28

06-24-2014, 03:08 AM

He quit after Senior Day and I said he should have been kicked off before like in September.

He did not quit the seniors voted and he was unable to return. Being that I was there I think I should know a little something about the situation.

I seen it dawg

06-24-2014, 05:59 AM

Exactly. And he was a dealer even before he came to State. He didn't become a dealer because of some persecution complex. He wasn't "over sentenced" or whatever other bull is being spewed. He made a conscious choice early in life. Dontae got exactly what he deserved. Don't expect me to feel sorry for a guy who could've been an elite player and blew it because he'd rather deal and have street cred. Oh, and who then proceeded to compound his problems by refusing to stop eating.

Exactly. **** dontae

Tbonewannabe

06-24-2014, 08:45 AM

He did not quit the seniors voted and he was unable to return. Being that I was there I think I should know a little something about the situation.

So why was he unable to return? He had to have either quit or kicked off to be unable to return. Still doesn't change the fact that he was a bad apple that seemed to have issues that affected the team. I have a friend that was on the team but he says Dontae was just lazy and the coaches just ignored it.