Pre and Post Bat Gate Offesive Stats for the Bat Cheaters...

[RougeDawg]

Not sure that we need any further info on whether or not the Bear Bats were juiced all season. Here are the major offensive stats for them prior to Omaha and after the bats were confiscated.

574

[Saltydog]

nt

[Todd4State]

And if you take away the game against TCU, it's even worse. And that was a game where they had a double on a ball that should have been caught and in my opinion was an error that opened the door for them, and then in that same game you had an Orvis double that hit the chalk that was less than an inch from being foul.

It's also worth noting that TCU's pitcher had struggled in the SR's and was a freshman who was leaving the ball up in the zone.

[Esmerelda Villalobos]

Good god guys. Change the record.

[messageboardsuperhero]

In their defense, a lot of that has to do with playing in TD Ameritrade and facing some good pitching. Those numbers are still pretty damn dramatic though. Hopefully college umps start checking bats more.

[messageboardsuperhero]

And if you take away the game against TCU, it's even worse. And that was a game where they had a double on a ball that should have been caught and in my opinion was an error that opened the door for them, and then in that same game you had an Orvis double that hit the chalk that was less than an inch from being foul.

It's also worth noting that TCU's pitcher had struggled in the SR's and was a freshman who was leaving the ball up in the zone.

Also, TCU's pen was depleted coming off a 15 innings marathon against UVA.

[Todd4State]

In their defense, a lot of that has to do with playing in TD Ameritrade and facing some good pitching. Those numbers are still pretty damn dramatic though. Hopefully college umps start checking bats more.

Without question ballpark factors come into play. But one thing that stood out to me is the quality of the balls that Ole Miss hit. You would expect a team that hit over .300 with 42 home runs as a team would have gotten more balls to the wall and hit more balls hard. They hit a lot more like they did in 2013 than they did in 2014.

Texas Tech's starting pitcher had an ERA over 3, as did Virginia's starter in their final game. Pretty much every pitcher that they faced aside from TCU's shut them down.

[FISHDAWG]

I'm curious as to how many here actually believe this cheating conspiracy ... anyone compared our stats before and after ?

[messageboardsuperhero]

Without question ballpark factors come into play. But one thing that stood out to me is the quality of the balls that Ole Miss hit. You would expect a team that hit over .300 with 42 home runs as a team would have gotten more balls to the wall and hit more balls hard. They hit a lot more like they did in 2013 than they did in 2014.

Texas Tech's starting pitcher had an ERA over 3, as did Virginia's starter in their final game. Pretty much every pitcher that they faced aside from TCU's shut them down.

This is definitely something I noticed as well. You'd think a team that hit almost one HR/game in the regular season would at least hit some balls to the warning track in Omaha- but I don't think I ever saw them even come close to challenging the track all CWS. Honestly, they looked a lot like us offensively.

[Goat Holder]

Seems to me like nobody has been able to hit up there, ever since they began playing at that stadium. Combination of the field and elite pitching.

[DoctorDawg]

Does anyone know how many other teams had bats confiscated, and the number? I have heard the rebels claim that all teams had them taken, but have not seen proof.

[Todd4State]

I'm curious as to how many here actually believe this cheating conspiracy ... anyone compared our stats before and after ?

I don't KNOW that they cheated- I'm just saying it's pretty suspicious. And I wouldn't put cheating past them. I think people underestimate just how much our CWS run got under their skin last year.

[Todd4State]

Seems to me like nobody has been able to hit up there, ever since they began playing at that stadium. Combination of the field and elite pitching.

Teams haven't been able to hit home runs as much. But if you're a good hitting team, you're still going to be able to make quality contact at the same pace as before relatively speaking. And really the only elite pitcher that Ole Miss faced was Virginia's starter in game one and their two relief guys.

[Randy]

http://www.clarionledger.com/story/olemisssports/2014/06/14/ole-miss-bats-taken-day-two/10537589/

This says that all teams did, but they are probably lying to cover up for the Bears.

[Goat Holder]

Sorry, 'above average' pitching. The point is that it's theoretically the 8 best or hottest teams so obviously the quality of pitching is elevated.

I think it's much more than just home runs. Those balls are outs up there. Anything in the air dies and allows outfielders to run them down. It's a different game, and I personally think it sucks.

[PMDawg]

Get a grip. Big park plus elite pitching and fielding equals lower numbers. Move on.

[Randy]

But there is no way they beat ULaLa twice if they did not cheat. If we could not beat them, no one can.

[TheRef]

But there is no way they beat ULaLa twice if they did not cheat. If we could not beat them, no one can.

I smell a bear in these here woods.

[State82]

I smell a bear in these here woods.

And not even attempting to disguise it to boot.

[BossDawg]

I think people underestimate just how much our CWS run got under their skin last year.

This. +1....These people hired PIs to get after Sherrill for God's sake.

[messageboardsuperhero]

But there is no way they beat ULaLa twice if they did not cheat. If we could not beat them, no one can.

Someone boot this clown. You aren't even attempting to hide it. If you're going to troll, at least do it right.

[Percho]

I believe--------------------------------they cheat.

[Randy]

Bro. I ain't trolling. If we couldn't possibly beat them, how did they?

[TheRef]

Bro. I ain't trolling. If we couldn't possibly beat them, how did they?

You trolling.....just stop. You made it TOO obvious. Tell your bear friends that if they want to troll, at least don't make yourself look like a dumbass in the process. Now show your way out of this board.

[Randy]

True Maroon here. I take offense to being called a bear though. Maybe you're a bear.

[TheRef]

True Maroon here. I take offense to being called a bear though. Maybe you're a bear.

BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. You think I'M a bear? I'm literally laughing as hard as I can right now. I'M the one who wrote the article that pissed off just about every bear known to man. I am a student here at Mississippi State and I've never had a second thought about it. The fact that you said I might be a bear makes me laugh.

[Randy]

Well don't accuse me then. Just because I have different views.

[TheRef]

Well don't accuse me then. Just because I have different views.

It's not that you have different views. It's the fact that you are trying TOO hard to make it seem like you're a State fan. "If we can't beat them, no one can!" That's one of the calling cards of a troll. You were just making it way too easy to accuse you of being a troll.

[Randy]

My bad man. I'm new to this stuff. I've only been apart of one other message board.

[NewTweederEndzoneDance]

You guys have got to be joking, right? They did not win the CWS. fact. We are still a better baseball program. fact. Quit posting sour grapes and giving them things to talk about. Some of you, everyone expects you to be posting this sort of crap, and some of you are better than this. It makes you look small and unfortunately makes the rest of us look small. Focus on what we have, which is only looking better and better, and not on making excuses when they have some small success.

[BulldogDX55]

My bad man. I'm new to this stuff. I've only been apart of one other message board.

The Spirit or NAFOOM?

[Todd4State]

You guys have got to be joking, right? They did not win the CWS. fact. We are still a better baseball program. fact. Quit posting sour grapes and giving them things to talk about. Some of you, everyone expects you to be posting this sort of crap, and some of you are better than this. It makes you look small and unfortunately makes the rest of us look small. Focus on what we have, which is only looking better and better, and not on making excuses when they have some small success.

What would Ole Miss fans do if the shoe was on the other foot?

[shoeless joe]

This is too much...I bet every team in Omaha had a dramatic drop in offensive numbers. Get a grip. Damn

[NewTweederEndzoneDance]

What would Ole Miss fans do if the shoe was on the other foot?

Please tell me why I should care what an Ole Miss fan would do, ever? It's a simple analogy, but everyone's parents made the right one in this scenario: if "Todd" jumps off the bridge, that doesn't mean you have to do it too. Sorry, Todd, I only use your name because you were the response. The argument that "they would've sour grape'd harder" is not an argument at all.

Like I said, we went further last year. We still have the preeminent program. Quit with the BS.

[MaroonState]

What would Ole Miss fans do if the shoe was on the other foot?

Amen Todd. Those whiny bastards never stop talking. Did they ever stop with the "Dan Mullen is a scientologist" bs? Didn't they hire PIs to stalk Jackie? And y'all are going to take up for them? Seriously? They make up shit about State just to pass the time. You apologists need to check yourselves. Never ever give them the benefit of doubt.

[DudyDawg]

I don't think he was taking up for them, just saying that we are better than that and don't need to stoop down to that level. I may be off base, but that's what I got from it

[War Machine Dawg]

This. +1....These people hired PIs to get after Sherrill for God's sake.

Yep. Don't know why some of our fans can't/don't understand this. NOTHING is too low for the BearSharks. And lest we forget, one of their biggest boosters is in jail for bribing judges.

[War Machine Dawg]

Amen Todd. Those whiny bastards never stop talking. Did they ever stop with the "Dan Mullen is a scientologist" bs? Didn't they hire PIs to stalk Jackie? And y'all are going to take up for them? Seriously? They make up shit about State just to pass the time. You apologists need to check yourselves. Never ever give them the benefit of doubt.

Yes. They stopped in order to accuse him of being an atheist.

[hacker]

"small sample size"

cmon

it's the same reason why people can hit .400+ in a month, but never in a full season

[Todd4State]

Please tell me why I should care what an Ole Miss fan would do, ever? It's a simple analogy, but everyone's parents made the right one in this scenario: if "Todd" jumps off the bridge, that doesn't mean you have to do it too. Sorry, Todd, I only use your name because you were the response. The argument that "they would've sour grape'd harder" is not an argument at all.

Like I said, we went further last year. We still have the preeminent program. Quit with the BS.

Sour grapes? I never in my wildest dreams thought that they might be cheating until the Clarion-Ledger reported that they had bats confiscated. Don't act like I just randomly decided to make this up out of the blue right after they won their SR.

Look- you're telling me to ignore a program that sued our coach because they were scared that he would bring us back from being the "dead program" that they want us to be- which they decided to do right when they realized that we weren't going to suck anymore and we weren't going to lay down as long as they gave our coach a box of cigars. A program that has slandered our coach- both Polk and Cohen- and our program to MLB scouts, recruits, and national publications such as Perfect Game ever since they hired Bianco. Pretty much their entire mission since they hired Bianco was to try to take our program down.

You "just ignore" someone that is trying to bully you- they are going to bully you. The only way to stop it is to stand up to it. If you want to choose to keep getting bullied, then that is your own choice, but I choose to stand up for MSU baseball. No one is making you participate either way.

And of course we are the pre-eminent program in Mississippi. I talked about that yesterday. There is mounting evidence of that- literally the only advantage that they have over us is in games at Smith-Wills Stadium and that is by one game in a series that they STILL have a losing record against us in. Anything else you want to measure- National Championship round appearances, CWS appearances, SEC Tournament Titles, SEC titles, Governor's Cup series, and regular season series- we have the advantage in ALL of that. This is not about that at all. It's more about paragraph two of this post. If they decide to stop with the mud slinging, then I'll stop. Period.

[Todd4State]

This is too much...I bet every team in Omaha had a dramatic drop in offensive numbers. Get a grip. Damn

That's definitely something to look at after the CWS is over that would be interesting. No doubt home runs will be down- but batting average shouldn't drop 200 points.

[messageboardsuperhero]

Any program that would orchestrate our coach being served a lawsuit on their field 10 minutes before first pitch of one of our games with them doesn't deserve to be given the benefit of the doubt from us in anything. **** that.

I honestly have no clue if they played with shaved bats all year, but I'm sure as hell not about to stand up for them. And we still have yet to see any source other than UM players or coaches saying that other teams got bats confiscated.

[MaroonState]

I don't think he was taking up for them, just saying that we are better than that and don't need to stoop down to that level. I may be off base, but that's what I got from it

I don't think we are stooping to their level. Just calling a spade a spade. We didn't make up the story about bats being confiscated. It's fact. Not slander.

[messageboardsuperhero]

If you want to read something funny, check out this old SPS thread about when Cohen was subpoenaed on UM's field right before our game with them in 2011. I love the UM fan trying to play it off like their program/school had nothing to do with it- like some random lawyer (who just happens to be a UM grad) could just walk uninterrupted onto the field and into the visiting team's dugout 10 minutes before first pitch and subpoena the opposing team's coach WITHOUT the stadium staff and people in their program knowing about it... Yeah, okay.***

Please never give these assholes the benefit of the doubt in anything. http://forums.sixpackspeak.com/archive/index.php/t-65992.html

[Todd4State]

I always found it extremely ironic that Ole Miss tried to sue us for hurting pitchers arms.

I remember when Bianco pitched his ace WHO WAS HURT against us in 2002 against us. I told my friends the night before that we were sweeping them. They were like "now don't be cocky"- and I told them yeah- well, I like our odds against a guy that's hurt. And sure enough we beat them.

And that's just the tip of the iceberg. Mark Holliman, Will Kline, TJ Beam, Scott Bittle- who the Yankees didn't sign because he failed a physical after his junior year, and etc. Lance Lynn is literally the only survivor- and that's because he has the body to take the abuse.

Why anyone would send their kid there as a pitcher is beyond me. And the word has gotten around too- Chris Ellis was rated as a top 50 pick and he lasted until the third round.

[messageboardsuperhero]

I always found it extremely ironic that Ole Miss tried to sue us for hurting pitchers arms.

I remember when Bianco pitched his ace WHO WAS HURT against us in 2002 against us. I told my friends the night before that we were sweeping them. They were like "now don't be cocky"- and I told them yeah- well, I like our odds against a guy that's hurt. And sure enough we beat them.

And that's just the tip of the iceberg. Mark Holliman, Will Kline, TJ Beam, Scott Bittle- who the Yankees didn't sign because he failed a physical after his junior year, and etc. Lance Lynn is literally the only survivor- and that's because he has the body to take the abuse.

Why anyone would send their kid there as a pitcher is beyond me. And the word has gotten around too- Chris Ellis was rated as a top 50 pick and he lasted until the third round.

Bobby Wahl also fell a good bit farther than most people projected, did he not?

[thf24]

It would be interesting to know what the other seven teams' numbers thus far look like compared to their season averages, since the park and competition are the main excuses being thrown around. Anyone willing to do that?

[bulldogcountry1]

I don't really care about their numbers in Omaha. I doubt you will find an offensive team who was able to continue to put up similar numbers at TD.

When I started noticing was before Omaha. Any time a team makes a sudden offensive jump, compared to the previous season, I get suspicious. Especially when it comes to home runs. Consider the fact that many of the UM fans I know told me that it was Omaha or bust for Bianco. Imagine the pressure he was under after falling short (no pun intended) so many times and us making it to the finals.

Average went up 8%
Slugging went up 13%
Home runs went up 83%

There have been several teams like since BBCOR that just come out of nowhere with offense, and it's obvious that there's little to no policing of bats until Omaha, so I guess we might as well get over it.

[Bubb Rubb]

Not sure that we need any further info on whether or not the Bear Bats were juiced all season. Here are the major offensive stats for them prior to Omaha and after the bats were confiscated.

574

To make this a more valid argument, you should do pre and post comparisons for all eight teams that made it to Omaha.

[J-Dawg]

I believe stats don't tell the whole story here. 1) TD Ameritrade. 2) It's the freaking CWS.... some of the best competition they've faced all year.......

Bats very well could have played a role but I'd attribute these 2 factors long before I'd blame the bats solely.

[DudyDawg]

I don't think we are stooping to their level. Just calling a spade a spade. We didn't make up the story about bats being confiscated. It's fact. Not slander.

Its fine to say that they had their bats taken. Thats the fact. Them cheating necessarily isn't. While I think they were cheating, I think we are taking it too far with like nine threads about it. Again, I think they cheated, and things like they did to Cohen show that they are the scum of the earth, but all these threads aren't going to change anything. I think it makes a lot of us look like sore losers and angry that they had a better year than us. At least if I was a third party that is how all of these threads would come off.

[RougeDawg]

This is too much...I bet every team in Omaha had a dramatic drop in offensive numbers. Get a grip. Damn

Ok here's your dramatic decline of 50% in numbers for EVERYONE!!! Compiled the stats for 6 of the 8 teams. Left our UCI and UL due to time contsraints. If I remember correctly TCU and TX Tech were the other teams who had multiple bats taken, and their stats speak for themselves as well. No other team had the dramatic drop that OM did, but then again, no other team had the majority of their bats confiscated either. Enjoy doubters. The only consensus drop was runs, but for all other categories, the number of bats taken effects the percentage of the season stats that were accumulated during the CWS. The major glaring stat of having juiced bats taken away is the Slugging Percentage. I can compile the other two teams if needed, but I think this body of work suffices that OM was in fact cheating all season, to get somewhere they haven't been since the 2nd World War.**

OM AB's Hits Tot Bases Runs Avg Slg %
CWS AVG 30.75 5.75 7 2.5 0.187 0.228
2014 AVG 35.4 10.7 14.9 6.1 0.303 0.421
87% 54% 47% 41% 62% 54%

UVA AB's Hits Tot Bases Runs Avg Slg %
CWS AVG 37.67 9 11.33 3 0.239 0.301
2014 AVG 33.3 9.3 12.6 5.5 0.279 0.377
% AVG 113% 97% 90% 55% 86% 80%

Vandy AB's Hits Tot Bases Runs Avg Slg %
CWS AVG 33.7 8.75 10.5 3.75 0.259 0.311
2014 AVG 32.8 9.3 12.7 5.8 0.282 0.388
103% 94% 83% 65% 92% 80%

Texas AB's Hits Tot Bases Runs Avg Slg %
CWS AVG 32 6.5 11 3 0.203 0.344
2014 AVG 33 8.8 11.9 4.6 0.263 0.353
95% 74% 93% 65% 77% 97%

TCU AB's Hits Tot Bases Runs Avg Slg %
CWS AVG 38 6.7 8.7 3 0.175 0.228
2014 AVG 34.8 9.7 12.2 5.1 0.278 0.352
109% 69% 71% 59% 63% 65%

TX Tech AB's Hits Tot Bases Runs Avg Slg %
CWS AVG 34 7.5 10.5 1.5 0.221 0.309
2014 AVG 33.9 9.6 13.8 6.0 0.285 0.406
100% 78% 76% 25% 77% 76%

[hacker]

Ok here's your dramatic decline of 50% in numbers for EVERYONE!!! Compiled the stats for 6 of the 8 teams. Left our UCI and UL due to time contsraints. If I remember correctly TCU and TX Tech were the other teams who had multiple bats taken, and their stats speak for themselves as well. No other team had the dramatic drop that OM did, but then again, no other team had the majority of their bats confiscated either. Enjoy doubters. The only consensus drop was runs, but for all other categories, the number of bats taken effects the percentage of the season stats that were accumulated during the CWS. The major glaring stat of having juiced bats taken away is the Slugging Percentage. I can compile the other two teams if needed, but I think this body of work suffices that OM was in fact cheating all season, to get somewhere they haven't been since the 2nd World War.**

OM AB's Hits Tot Bases Runs Avg Slg %
CWS AVG 30.75 5.75 7 2.5 0.187 0.228
2014 AVG 35.4 10.7 14.9 6.1 0.303 0.421
87% 54% 47% 41% 62% 54%

UVA AB's Hits Tot Bases Runs Avg Slg %
CWS AVG 37.67 9 11.33 3 0.239 0.301
2014 AVG 33.3 9.3 12.6 5.5 0.279 0.377
% AVG 113% 97% 90% 55% 86% 80%

Vandy AB's Hits Tot Bases Runs Avg Slg %
CWS AVG 33.7 8.75 10.5 3.75 0.259 0.311
2014 AVG 32.8 9.3 12.7 5.8 0.282 0.388
103% 94% 83% 65% 92% 80%

Texas AB's Hits Tot Bases Runs Avg Slg %
CWS AVG 32 6.5 11 3 0.203 0.344
2014 AVG 33 8.8 11.9 4.6 0.263 0.353
95% 74% 93% 65% 77% 97%

TCU AB's Hits Tot Bases Runs Avg Slg %
CWS AVG 38 6.7 8.7 3 0.175 0.228
2014 AVG 34.8 9.7 12.2 5.1 0.278 0.352
109% 69% 71% 59% 63% 65%

TX Tech AB's Hits Tot Bases Runs Avg Slg %
CWS AVG 34 7.5 10.5 1.5 0.221 0.309
2014 AVG 33.9 9.6 13.8 6.0 0.285 0.406
100% 78% 76% 25% 77% 76%



Again, look up "sample size"

Your stats mean absolutely nothing.

[RougeDawg]

Again, look up "sample size"

Your stats mean absolutely nothing.

What are you talking about? Let's hope you were inebriated during your post. That's the only explanation. These stats show that, yes all teams numbers dropped 10-25% in Omaha, mainly in runs scored. But one team had every major offensive category drop 50% after bats were taken. That same team had a majority of their bats taken between the drastic drops in production. The other two teams who had multiple bats taken had more dramatic drops than the norm in Omaha but not as bad as the team who had more bats taken. Take away: more bats taken=larger drop from season average. If that tells you nothing, I pray to God you don't have an occupation that consists of data interpretation.

[Bear@Work]

Sorry, 'above average' pitching. The point is that it's theoretically the 8 best or hottest teams so obviously the quality of pitching is elevated.

I think it's much more than just home runs. Those balls are outs up there. Anything in the air dies and allows outfielders to run them down. It's a different game, and I personally think it sucks.

Personally, I think Goat nails it. You theoretically have the best pitchers going against you and a difficult park to play in. You have to admit that hitters have to change their approach at TDA because even shots to the gaps in the air that should be easy doubles get pushed down for pop outs. I noticed a lot of downward approaches and ground ball outs for this exact reason whic throws hitters off of their typical game. It sucks, but that happened to every team.

I hate the bears, but I think some of you that believe all of this have gone off the deep end. Especially Todd. He's taking it pretty hard that the Bears advanced as far as they did.

[hacker]

What are you talking about? Let's hope you were inebriated during your post. That's the only explanation. These stats show that, yes all teams numbers dropped 10-25% in Omaha, mainly in runs scored. But one team had every major offensive category drop 50% after bats were taken. That same team had a majority of their bats taken between the drastic drops in production. The other two teams who had multiple bats taken had more dramatic drops than the norm in Omaha but not as bad as the team who had more bats taken. Take away: more bats taken=larger drop from season average. If that tells you nothing, I pray to God you don't have an occupation that consists of data interpretation.

Are you serious? Anything can happen in 4 ****ing games. Especially when those games are in the postseason and more nerves are involved. That is the point.

I pray that you work at the burger stand if you think you can extrapolate any meaning out of a sample size of 4 games.

[hacker]

They could've all caught a deadly fart disease that affected their hitting over 4 games. You are truly stupid, RougeDawg.

[RougeDawg]

Are you serious? Anything can happen in 4 ****ing games. Especially when those games are in the postseason and more nerves are involved. That is the point.

I pray that you work at the burger stand if you think you can extrapolate any meaning out of a sample size of 4 games.

Then why did the biggest drops come to those teams with bats taken? Explain that to me? Why did every team outside of OM TXTexh and TCU ( all of whom had bats taken) remain relatively close to season normals. That's why I used averages. I'm sure if you break down the bears season into 4 game allotments, and look at those averages compared to the CWS it will show the same thing. I would bet my entire worth that you are one that typically misses the forest for the trees.

[hacker]

Your suggestion that I can take any 4 games and produce meaningful stats leads me to believe you don't understand statistics on a fundamental level. I can't believe I have to explain this to you, but you are making a hasty generalization. If you had 69 people (the number of games OM played this year) participating in a clinical trial, you can't just take the results of 4 people to try to extrapolate anything meaningful. Correlation is not causation.