In your opinion, who is the greatest hitter of all time?

[Will James]

.

[dickiedawg]

Mike Trout.

Did I get it right?

In my mind it is Ted Williams, but I haven't done endless statistical analysis or anything.

[CadaverDawg]

Tony Gwynn was the greatest pure hitter I've ever seen in my lifetime I think. Could spray it to all fields.

Of all time though, I'd probably go with Ted Williams. Hard to argue his average. But I'm not a baseball historian, so I really have no clue.

[Jacksondevildog]

I hate the guy, but you could make a valid argument for Barry Bonds.

[reddog]

Rod Carew

[Original48]

I say Rod Carew as well.

[Coach34]

1. Barry Bonds on steroids
1A. Ted Williams

(without steroids- Bonds was not as good as Williams)

[Todd4State]

Ty Cobb.

[Will James]

I think it's Ted Williams for many reasons.

1. He has the highest walk percentage ever. 20.6% of his plate appearances resulted in walks. Bonds is 2nd in BB% but his is massively inflated by the intentional walk. Bonds has 688 IBB's compared to Williams' 86. And Ted STILL bests him in BB%.

2. His BB% combined with his hitting ranks Ted number 1 in career OBP. Over an entire career, Williams had a .482 OBP. For comparasion, last year only 4 MLB players had a .400 OBP with Mauer being the highest at .416. Williams was 66 points higher than that FOR HIS CAREER.

3. Williams hit for power. His 521 HR is low consdering his best prime years were spent dealing with crazy ass Germans and Japs. After WW2 he resumed his playing only to be called back into service dealing with the Communists. The years he played from 1941-54 he averaged 33 HR. If we put those numbers in for the years he missed (they would probably be higher being in his prime) he would have finished with 686 career HR.


Williams is the perfect hitter, power with an eagle eye.

ETA so for me it goes
1. Williams
2. Ruth
3. Bonds

[RTO Dawg]

Pete Rose?

[Coach34]

The way Ruth changed the game was incredible also. He would hit more HR's than some teams did. What's impressive is he spent his few few years pitching- and was dominant

[cowbell9]

I third Carew.

[War Machine Dawg]

I don't thinks steroids helped Bonds as much as some would like to believe. Hitting is mostly hand-eye coordination. Steroids doesn't help that. You're either born with it or you aren't. Bonds also had an incredible feel for the strike zone and ability to take close pitches. Again, steroids doesn't help that.

This can be argued endlessly, but to me there are 2 guys clearly at the top:

1. Ted Williams
2. Barry Bonds

Other guys who deserve honorable mention: Tony Gwynn, Ty Cobb, Pete Rose, and Albert Pujols.

Before anyone rags on Pujols (I realize he's still playing), the guy is an absolute hitting machine. He's very likely to finish with a .300+ career BA. Massive power. Very similar knowledge of the strike zone as Bonds and the ability to take close pitches. I'll never forget watching a random Cards game a few years ago. In his first AB, Pujols reaches out and pulls an outside pitch down the LF line for a HR. In his next AB, facing the same pitcher, Pujols hits the exact same pitch in the exact same spot down the RF line for a double. It was one of the most impressive things I've seen a hitter do. There's literally no way to defend a guy who can do that.

[Todd4State]

I think with baseball, you have to also take into consideration that there are different eras. Back in the days of Cobb, they allowed dirty baseballs to be used and they played the game totally different. Pitchers didn't throw nearly as hard and contact hitting was more of a priority. Williams lost a few years in his prime to serving in World War II and then later Korea.

One name that I haven't seen mentioned is Rogers Hornsby- he had the highest batting average over a five year period of anyone in baseball history and to me is the greatest second baseman ever. Many consider him to be the best right handed hitter ever.

[Coach34]

I don't thinks steroids helped Bonds as much as some would like to believe. Hitting is mostly hand-eye coordination. Steroids doesn't help that. You're either born with it or you aren't. Bonds also had an incredible feel for the strike zone and ability to take close pitches. Again, steroids doesn't help that.
.

Steroids make you stronger, making your bat quicker,which allows you to see the ball longer before swinging- not to mention it keeps pitchers from being able to get in on your hands. Therefore, steroids indeed makes you a better hitter

Brady Anderson is the poster boy for steroids making you a better hitter- he played 17 seasons- and in 1996 Brady hit 50 HR's. He never hit higher than 24 in any other season, and only eclipsed 20 or more 2 other seasons in his career. Do you think he just had a magical season out of the blue in 1996?

Bonds got better because of steroids- it takes your abilities to a higher level

[Todd4State]

I don't thinks steroids helped Bonds as much as some would like to believe. Hitting is mostly hand-eye coordination. Steroids doesn't help that. You're either born with it or you aren't. Bonds also had an incredible feel for the strike zone and ability to take close pitches. Again, steroids doesn't help that.

This can be argued endlessly, but to me there are 2 guys clearly at the top:

1. Ted Williams
2. Barry Bonds

Other guys who deserve honorable mention: Tony Gwynn, Ty Cobb, Pete Rose, and Albert Pujols.

Before anyone rags on Pujols (I realize he's still playing), the guy is an absolute hitting machine. He's very likely to finish with a .300+ career BA. Massive power. Very similar knowledge of the strike zone as Bonds and the ability to take close pitches. I'll never forget watching a random Cards game a few years ago. In his first AB, Pujols reaches out and pulls an outside pitch down the LF line for a HR. In his next AB, facing the same pitcher, Pujols hits the exact same pitch in the exact same spot down the RF line for a double. It was one of the most impressive things I've seen a hitter do. There's literally no way to defend a guy who can do that.


I totally agree with you about steroids. There are still only TWO guys that have ever hit 70 home runs in a season. What people fail to mention is that the steroid era also featured two expansion teams and there were very few elite pitchers at that time. It was pretty much Clemens, Maddux, Randy Johnson, Glavine, Pedro, and maybe Curt Schilling. Then you had a small echelon of very good pitchers. A team having more than two really good pitchers at that time was kind of rare. Also, players realized that if they hit 30-40 home runs, they were going to get PAID. Vince Coleman was still a fairly productive player in 1996-1997 in terms of speed and what he could do, but he was basically became a AAAA player because he wasn't what teams wanted to do at that time. He got stuck in the wrong era. I think some of these guys like Billy Hamilton are going to bring that back a little bit.

Being a Cardinals fan, I got to enjoy Albert Pujols for many years. It appears as if injuries are going to derail his career unfortunately. Because of that, he may be kind of seen like a hitting version of Sandy Koufax. My favorite Albert Pujols story was watching him one time in batting practice- he hits four home runs in a row- first one to left field, second one to dead center, third one to right field and the fourth in the upper deck.

I was also at the game against the Cubs where he knocked out the "I" in Big Mac Land with a home run. And then another time, I saw Louis Coleman pitching for the Royals knock Albert down. Albert gets up and sends a missle into the left field seats on the next pitch, and I pray that whoever was sitting in that seat didn't end up in the hospital.

I actually think Pujols could have been even better because to me, it seemed like he stopped using the entire field for some reason, which has hurt both his power and his average.

[Coach34]

Well, just remember that since A-Rod has had to stop juicing- he isnt half the player he was. That's not an accident. Manny had to stop also- and suddenly nobody wanted him. Steroids simply increase your ability somewhat- Big Mac went from a 35-40 HR guy to 58, 70, 65 HR guy...Palmeiro couldnt average 10 HR's a season his first 5 years- then suddenly he's cranking out 30-40 per season...


and let me add that I dont care if they roid up or not- I'd actually prefer it. But it makes them better players- the numbers of that ERA dont lie. Not to mention that since baseball started testing- HR numbers are way down

[Todd4State]

Well, just remember that since A-Rod has had to stop juicing- he isnt half the player he was. That's not an accident. Manny had to stop also- and suddenly nobody wanted him. Steroids simply increase your ability somewhat- Big Mac went from a 35-40 HR guy to 58, 70, 65 HR guy...Palmeiro couldnt average 10 HR's a season his first 5 years- then suddenly he's cranking out 30-40 per season...


and let me add that I dont care if they roid up or not- I'd actually prefer it. But it makes them better players- the numbers of that ERA dont lie. Not to mention that since baseball started testing- HR numbers are way down

I won't deny that they help players, but I do think that the overall effect is overstated.

And to tell you the truth, I don't think steroids ever will be out of baseball. It's just a matter of making sure you cover up what you are doing. We're seeing more and more guys throwing 100, and at the same time, we are still seeing guys hit home runs. Last year six guys hit 40 or more home runs, so it's not like homers are going extinct either.

The thing about McGwire is he hit 49 as a rookie and set the rookie record for home runs. The main reason he took steroids was to try to stay in shape and stay healthy so that he could get out there on the field. He lost large parts of seasons in the early 90's due to injury. He can still hit home runs even though he is in his late forties, early fifties now. A lot of players took steroids to try to get one more season so that they could get paid for one more year or two.

Manny Ramirez is an idiot and he's not very well liked as a teammate. That's the reason no one wanted him. The Red Sox were unanimously happy as a team when they dumped him.

A-Rod is getting old- he is breaking down which could have happened with or without steroids.

Palmeiro also matured as a hitter later in his career as well. He played in two pretty good hitters ball parks in Camden Yards and in Arlington. The Rangers stadium is almost as live as Coors field.

[Coach34]

The thing about McGwire is he hit 49 as a rookie and set the rookie record for home runs- which Canseco talked about McGwire roiding up that season after they met the year before when McGwire was called up in September

Manny Ramirez is an idiot and he's not very well liked as a teammate. That's the reason no one wanted him- that and those 50 game suspensions he drew for testing positive for steroids

A-Rod is getting old- he is breaking down- which happens more easily to guys no longer doing roids

Palmeiro also matured as a hitter later in his career as well. He played in two pretty good hitters ball parks in Camden Yards and in Arlington. The Rangers stadium is almost as live as Coors field.- yet he couldnt hit HR's at Wrigley Field???? C'mon Todd



gg

[Will James]

Home runs going down Todd.

Every year from 1998-2004 had more home runs than 2006-2012

[CadaverDawg]

Meh, I'm with Coach on this one. I think that's an awful lot of coincidences that you are claiming about these players maturing as hitters with age, or breaking down due to age, etc. I think steroids help you tremendously as a baseball player.
I just think baseball purists are in denial about what it did to America's past time, so they say things like you did in the above post to try and explain these coincidences.

That being said, I hope you're right and that they are coincidences....and for the record, I wouldn't care if they made steroids legal. After all, it's not a contact sport, so it wouldn't put players in danger of being hurt by other players. They would just be hurting themselves. I would hate it for the guys that wanted the game to be played without steroids though, because they would be at a huge disadvantage, and would have to choose between doing steroids and risk potentially harming themselves...or losing a large sum of money over time by not taking steroids.

[archdog]

I believe you have to rate them for what you want

Overall Hitter
1. Ted Williams
2. Barry Bonds
3. Ty Cobb
4. Ken Griffey Jr.
5. Babe Ruth
6. Albert Pujols

HR Hitters in their prime (with or without Steriods)
1. Barry Bonds
2. Mark McGuire
3. Sammy Sosa - Wasn't on Steroids long enough
4. Babe Ruth
5. Hank Aaron - for longevity
6. Willie Mays

Average and based on swing mechanics
1. Ted Williams
2. Tony Gwinn
3. Ken Griffey

Interesting Topic. I would like to run through the best pitchers of all time tomorrow.

[Will James]

I think steroids help you tremendously as a baseball player.

You're damn right they do. No more 60-70 HR years lately.

I don't think they should be legal though.

[CadaverDawg]

I don't think they should be legal though.

Yea, the more I think about it, it would not be fair to the players that wanted to do things the right way. And it would absolutely make the past history of baseball and statistics irrelevant.

[Will James]

Yea, the more I think about it, it would not be fair to the players that wanted to do things the right way. And it would absolutely make the past history of baseball and statistics irrelevant.

And it would be back in college and high school where you'd have to keep up with the Jones' to get a look. Who cares if you get caught because once they draft you it's legal.

[MidTNDawg]

Ted Williams - also he was the best jet fighter pilot (USMC) I ever saw sit in the seat of a flight simulator. Unbelievable hand / eye coordination.

[Political Hack]

Ichiro is the best slap hitter ever.

[Duke Silver]

I think it's Ted Williams for many reasons.

1. He has the highest walk percentage ever. 20.6% of his plate appearances resulted in walks. Bonds is 2nd in BB% but his is massively inflated by the intentional walk. Bonds has 688 IBB's compared to Williams' 86. And Ted STILL bests him in BB%.

2. His BB% combined with his hitting ranks Ted number 1 in career OBP. Over an entire career, Williams had a .482 OBP. For comparasion, last year only 4 MLB players had a .400 OBP with Mauer being the highest at .416. Williams was 66 points higher than that FOR HIS CAREER.

3. Williams hit for power. His 521 HR is low consdering his best prime years were spent dealing with crazy ass Germans and Japs. After WW2 he resumed his playing only to be called back into service dealing with the Communists. The years he played from 1941-54 he averaged 33 HR. If we put those numbers in for the years he missed (they would probably be higher being in his prime) he would have finished with 686 career HR.


Williams is the perfect hitter, power with an eagle eye.

ETA so for me it goes
1. Williams
2. Ruth
3. Bonds

I know he missed a lot of games last year but my boy Votto had a obp of .474 last year, also tied for lead in walks despite of missing all that time. As for the best of all time, I'd say ted williams is the best followed by ruth, dimaggio, and pujols.

[Will James]

I know he missed a lot of games last year but my boy Votto had a obp of .474 last year, also tied for lead in walks despite of missing all that time. As for the best of all time, I'd say ted williams is the best followed by ruth, dimaggio, and pujols.

You're right, he didn't qualify on the Fangraphs leaders.

[M.Fillmore]

The order of the top three can be argued.

1. Cobb .367 over 24 years. Cobb's believed in keeping rallies alive by keeping men on base to keep pressure on the pitcher. Cobb could hit for power when he wanted. Late in his career, Cobb got sick of hearing the press rave about Babe Ruth and Cobb publically announced he would swing for the fences the next two games. Cobb poled 5 HRs in two games and said he had proven his point and he would go back to contact hitting. I know two games is a small sample size, but it is still a good point to announce it and then do it.

2. Teddy Ballgame. 521 HRs with a .344 BA over 19 years with OB% pushing .500 while missing 4.5 seasons due to military service.

3. Babe Ruth 714 dingers and batting average of .342 over 22 years and not being a great runner when skinny and a lousy runner when fat. The cat could swing a stick. All time best OPS. He could have been one of the best pitchers of all time too if his bat wasn't so good. Fat or not, the best all around player ever, and it ain't real close.

Todd is right. Rogers Hornsby gets overlooked too often.

I know these are all old farts who played segregated ball (exception for Williams). But baseball was the only show in town too. The top three sports were baseball, horse racing and boxing. Baseball got all the athletes. Now black/Hispanics are included but the talent pool in diluted by lots of other sports.