Phil Steele not as high on Dak and Chris Jones apparently

[msugolf]

Has Dak at 4th team SEC behind Marshall, sunshine, and driskell. Also has Chris Jones on third team while putting RK on the first team.

Man football can't get here fast enough. Really want to prove the doubters wrong.

[Bothrops]

Doubter? Maybe. He sounds like an idiot to me.

[smootness]

Phil Steele is consistently overrated. He puts out a magazine that is massive and filled with numbers, and everyone thinks he's a genius.

[dawg21]

He has under estimated Mullen and State for the past 4 years. Hopefully the trend will continue.

[Dawg61]

Anyone that puts Bo Wallace as 2nd team All-SEC QB should find another profession. Maty Mauk, Dak and Marshall will all leave Bo in the dust.

[godlluB]

Who the hell is Phil Steele and why do we care what he thinks?

[Coach34]

Who the hell is Phil Steele and why do we care what he thinks?

Steele is the Will James of football

[I seen it dawg]

Steele is the Will James of football

And the Cartman, Clancy, and pioneer. Bet he never fn played either.

[BeastMan]

Putting Jeff Driskell anywhere in the top half of SEC QBs kills all credibility immediately. Sure he was the #1 dual threat QB coming out if HS but he has been horrible in college. A complete bust. Chris Jones on the third team doesn't really bother me. Let the season play out. He'll be a household name by mid season

ETA- in 3 years Driskell has approx 2,300 passing yards, 14 TDs and 10 INTS.

[Pollodawg]

Pretty much the only reason I buy Steele anymore is because I love all things college football. He's jam packed with numbers and neat stuff and says an awful lot..........never to actually say anything at all.

[RiverCityDawg]

Pretty much the only reason I buy Steele anymore is because I love all things college football. He's jam packed with numbers and neat stuff and says an awful lot..........never to actually say anything at all.

This. In the team previews he regurgitates information/numbers from the last four seasons and then might say one ambiguous statement about the upcoming year.

Also, I'm not surprised he has Dak forth… He's been on Driskel's nuts for going-on three years now.

[Political Hack]

Steele is better than Athlon and Lindeys a million times over. He looks a lot at experience and Dak and Jones don't have much experience. Dak has started and won 1 SEC game. We've created an awfully high expectation of him with little to lean on outside of potential and guts. This year is his chance to prove that the State fan base is right about him. Up til' now, it's pure speculation. The one thing that makes me nervous is that he split time last year and still couldn't stay healthy. If he can stay healthy this year, it becomes a fluke. If not, it becomes a pattern. The way we use him gives me hesitation in getting overly excited though. All those reservations aside, having Capt Bubble Screen ahead of him shows a lack of understanding about football talent and tells me that Steele won't be making a living any time soon projecting NFL drafts.

[msstate7]

Speaking of Chris jones... Anyone know his weight right now? Interested if he's slimmed up or still round 300

[drunkernhelldawg]

I think Dak will prove the doubters wrong. We do seem to be overlooking the fact that Dak is still on a learning curve as far as being the number 1 qb for us. If he can achieve the football IQ of Tyler Russell, he will be the best quarterback we've ever had.

[The Croom Diaries]

I heard Phil Steele say YESTERDAY on XM we would win 9-10 games this year, and 2 years ago he said we should win 10 but we probably won't. What do you want from this guy?

He is like Will James, he tries to gain an edge in prognostication by looking at numbers and historical precedence. I don't know why anyone would even look his player evaluations. He just presents info and you can use it to determine your own opinion or not. His magazine blows all the others away because of that.

[msstate7]

Isn't Steele who said OM has like the best rb's in the sec?

And yet OM couldn't run the ball for anything

[dawgs]

I heard Phil Steele say YESTERDAY on XM we would win 9-10 games this year, and 2 years ago he said we should win 10 but we probably won't. What do you want from this guy?

He is like Will James, he tries to gain an edge in prognostication by looking at numbers and historical precedence. I don't know why anyone would even look his player evaluations. He just presents info and you can use it to determine your own opinion or not. His magazine blows all the others away because of that.

Looking at numbers to determine individual performance in football is totally different than baseball though, baseball is almost isolated between the hitter and pitcher, sure guys on base might change things a bit and a good or bad D affects what balls become hits and outs, but over time that kinda stuff usually evens out. Football is the most team dependent sport for the individual numbers IMO. If you don't have a good OL it doesn't matter how good your RB is. If you have bad WRs, it's going to affect your QB, and even your running game because the box will be stacked, etc etc etc. football analytics go more into 4th down odds, how punting changes things relative to field position, etc. you can't really use metrics to isolate 1 player in football and predict their performance without taking into account 100 other variables. In baseball, if you put Barry bonds in the worst lineup of all time, he's still gonna hit. His RBIs and Rs would suffer a bit, but he's still gonna hit for average and power. But you stick a good WR on a team with a bad QB, and the WR ain't gonna produce like a good WR.

[chef dixon]

Driskel could easily be the most trash QB in the SEC.

[dawgs]

steele gets really attached to * rankings for far too long. 4* and 5* guys become quality CFB and NFL players at a higher rate, sure, but there's plenty of 4* and 5* guys that bust. just because driskel was a highly regarded QB 3 or 4 years ago coming out of HS doesn't mean he's still going to become a stud. he hasn't shown any promise of becoming more than a mediocre, at best, sec QB. there nkemdiche was literally the 4th best freshman DL in the conference last fall. the only reason to put him 1st team all-sec is because you are still infatuated with his #1 recruit status.

[msstate7]

steele gets really attached to * rankings for far too long. 4* and 5* guys become quality CFB and NFL players at a higher rate, sure, but there's plenty of 4* and 5* guys that bust. just because driskel was a highly regarded QB 3 or 4 years ago coming out of HS doesn't mean he's still going to become a stud. he hasn't shown any promise of becoming more than a mediocre, at best, sec QB. there nkemdiche was literally the 4th best freshman DL in the conference last fall. the only reason to put him 1st team all-sec is because you are still infatuated with his #1 recruit status.
Exactly.

[PMDawg]

I'll tell you this much, if you're reading things like Lindy's, Athlon, or Sporting News and think they're good....I feel for you. Phil may not be great, but there really is no other competition that I'm aware of at this point.

[CadaverDawg]

steele gets really attached to * rankings for far too long. 4* and 5* guys become quality CFB and NFL players at a higher rate, sure, but there's plenty of 4* and 5* guys that bust. just because driskel was a highly regarded QB 3 or 4 years ago coming out of HS doesn't mean he's still going to become a stud. he hasn't shown any promise of becoming more than a mediocre, at best, sec QB. there nkemdiche was literally the 4th best freshman DL in the conference last fall. the only reason to put him 1st team all-sec is because you are still infatuated with his #1 recruit status.

You're exactly right. Most of these guys have to rank guys like Knedachni as All SEC and stuff, just to keep from losing credibility since they pimped them as the best high school player for so long. Think about it, you spend an entire year talking about Driskel being a "can't miss QB prospect" coming out of Highschool, and now he's a bust. It will make him look dumb if now he writes an article showing Driskel as the worst QB in the conference. If they wouldn't take shit to such an extreme, when it comes to stuff like OM's recruiting class 2 years ago, they wouldn't have to continue to ride out the lie of these guys being great players.

Same situation with OM's football team...none of these people truly think OM will be a contender this year, but as much as they blew them about their recruiting class a few years ago, it would make them look stupid and knowledgeless if they didn't at least rank them preseason with all those Starzzz they have on the team. That way, they can write an article in 2 years about how Hugh Freeze underachieved with all of his talent, and is now on the hot seat because he's nothing more than a recruiter.

[dawgs]

The problem with that ole miss class was it was extremely top heavy. They "lucked" into nkemdiche, treadwell, and tunsil, but after that, it was a pretty meh class, even by msu/ole miss standards. Especially with golson transferring. Connor is good but he's also from a HS ole miss usually carries. The 2014 class was fine. But the ole miss fluffing is literally because of 3 players, all true sophs. You need a lot more than 3 good players to have a good football team.

And from an overall perspective, I'm one of the biggest believers in the star system. On the whole, higher rated players tend to pan out at a higher rate than lower rated players. But 4 5* guys surrounded by below average sec talent doesn't make a sec contender. And after those 4 5* guys, I think ole miss is definitely below average.

[PMDawg]

I think some of you guys are selling ole miss short. The SECW this year is gonna be a dog fight between 6 really good teams. As much fun as it is to clown on Bo Dirt, he will be fine in that dink and dunk offense. Treadwell is a beast, engram, Sanders, and some others are pretty good too. The OL is thin, but it's strongest at the most important spot. LT. Tunsil is a future all pro. The RBs aren't great, but better than last year. On D they have RN, who put up similar number to Chris. I think Chris is better, but let's don't act like he's a bust. Then there's CJ, Shackleford, Gross, Ward, Hooks, Bennett. Hell, didn't they move Ward to TE? That DL is loaded. Bryant and DN are solid at LB and their DBs are sick. Prewitt is a legit AA, Conner is a stud in the making, Elston and Golsten are solid. Like it or not, they're good. I'm not saying they'll win the west or beat us, but neither is out of the realm of possibility. I say they are 3-6 points better than us on a neutral field, and we are pretty damn good ourselves.

[Pollodawg]

I think some of you guys are selling ole miss short. The SECW this year is gonna be a dog fight between 6 really good teams. As much fun as it is to clown on Bo Dirt, he will be fine in that dink and dunk offense. Treadwell is a beast, engram, Sanders, and some others are pretty good too. The OL is thin, but it's strongest at the most important spot. LT. Tunsil is a future all pro. The RBs aren't great, but better than last year. On D they have RN, who put up similar number to Chris. I think Chris is better, but let's don't act like he's a bust. Then there's CJ, Shackleford, Gross, Ward, Hooks, Bennett. Hell, didn't they move Ward to TE? That DL is loaded. Bryant and DN are solid at LB and their DBs are sick. Prewitt is a legit AA, Conner is a stud in the making, Elston and Golsten are solid. Like it or not, they're good. I'm not saying they'll win the west or beat us, but neither is out of the realm of possibility. I say they are 3-6 points better than us on a neutral field, and we are pretty damn good ourselves.

I say aint nobody here to fluff that rebel dick. Nobody said they would suck. Most in here are just pointing out that State is better suited depth wise than they are.

[The Croom Diaries]

Looking at numbers to determine individual performance in football is totally different than baseball though, baseball is almost isolated between the hitter and pitcher, sure guys on base might change things a bit and a good or bad D affects what balls become hits and outs, but over time that kinda stuff usually evens out. Football is the most team dependent sport for the individual numbers IMO. If you don't have a good OL it doesn't matter how good your RB is. If you have bad WRs, it's going to affect your QB, and even your running game because the box will be stacked, etc etc etc. football analytics go more into 4th down odds, how punting changes things relative to field position, etc. you can't really use metrics to isolate 1 player in football and predict their performance without taking into account 100 other variables. In baseball, if you put Barry bonds in the worst lineup of all time, he's still gonna hit. His RBIs and Rs would suffer a bit, but he's still gonna hit for average and power. But you stick a good WR on a team with a bad QB, and the WR ain't gonna produce like a good WR.

I was referring to teams, not individuals. That's why I said I didn't know why anyone would look at his player evaluations.

[Acid mouth]

This is the same Phil Steele that said Jevon Snead was one of the best QBs in the nation. I don't understand how this hack continues to get any credibility

[Coach34]

I say aint nobody here to fluff that rebel dick. Nobody said they would suck. Most in here are just pointing out that State is better suited depth wise than they are.

PMDawg is a resident Rebel defender

[msudawg1200]

Pretty much the only reason I buy Steele anymore is because I love all things college football. He's jam packed with numbers and neat stuff and says an awful lot..........never to actually say anything at all.

I agree. That's the reason I buy his magazine also. He always spouts off about being accurate, and how his Most Improved Teams do, etc. However, he only tells you about the ones that do well not the three or four that don't. He hits about 60-65 percent on predictions. I still can't understand why everyone is on Bo Wallace's jock. Very, very average. R. Kmendiche is rated high by name and name alone. They all had him as the top rated player out of high school, and they don't want to see him fail.

[msudawg1200]

I'll tell you this much, if you're reading things like Lindy's, Athlon, or Sporting News and think they're good....I feel for you. Phil may not be great, but there really is no other competition that I'm aware of at this point.

True point. I used to buy the Athlon magazine for every region until about 2009. It had gotten very bad by then.

[mic]

I think some of you guys are selling ole miss short. The SECW this year is gonna be a dog fight between 6 really good teams. As much fun as it is to clown on Bo Dirt, he will be fine in that dink and dunk offense. Treadwell is a beast, engram, Sanders, and some others are pretty good too. The OL is thin, but it's strongest at the most important spot. LT. Tunsil is a future all pro. The RBs aren't great, but better than last year. On D they have RN, who put up similar number to Chris. I think Chris is better, but let's don't act like he's a bust. Then there's CJ, Shackleford, Gross, Ward, Hooks, Bennett. Hell, didn't they move Ward to TE? That DL is loaded. Bryant and DN are solid at LB and their DBs are sick. Prewitt is a legit AA, Conner is a stud in the making, Elston and Golsten are solid. Like it or not, they're good. I'm not saying they'll win the west or beat us, but neither is out of the realm of possibility. I say they are 3-6 points better than us on a neutral field, and we are pretty damn good ourselves.

So who is the next 11 on defense and offense for them??
I'm not sure who Golsten is? Maybe you meant Golsen. And I doubt he even starts for them so no he isn't solid.
We all agree that they have a very good starting 11 on defense, but I'm not as sold as you are on the next 11
And to say their OL is thin is an understatement.
Hooks?? Just because he was a 5* juco doesn't mean he will dominate. He may very we'll have a great year but he did nothing last year. And to move Ward to TE is mind boggling. Bet that kid wishes he had never gone there. And with the WR core, Vince Sanders had basically the same numbers last year as Joe Morrow. They are thin there and will have to play a lot of unproven players and frosh again..

[chainedup_Dawg]

I think some of you guys are selling ole miss short. The SECW this year is gonna be a dog fight between 6 really good teams. As much fun as it is to clown on Bo Dirt, he will be fine in that dink and dunk offense. Treadwell is a beast, engram, Sanders, and some others are pretty good too. The OL is thin, but it's strongest at the most important spot. LT. Tunsil is a future all pro. The RBs aren't great, but better than last year. On D they have RN, who put up similar number to Chris. I think Chris is better, but let's don't act like he's a bust. Then there's CJ, Shackleford, Gross, Ward, Hooks, Bennett. Hell, didn't they move Ward to TE? That DL is loaded. Bryant and DN are solid at LB and their DBs are sick. Prewitt is a legit AA, Conner is a stud in the making, Elston and Golsten are solid. Like it or not, they're good. I'm not saying they'll win the west or beat us, but neither is out of the realm of possibility. I say they are 3-6 points better than us on a neutral field, and we are pretty damn good ourselves.

Umm, they moved Ward to TE because he couldn't hack it at DE, not because other DEs were all world. Not saying their not but Ward was lost. The discussion was about depth anyway

[smootness]

This is the same Phil Steele that said Jevon Snead was one of the best QBs in the nation. I don't understand how this hack continues to get any credibility

Thank you. These magazines are all the same. Those who put any credibility into Athlon and Lindy's are no worse than those who put credibility into Phil Steele.

His magazine may be more interesting to read, but I constantly hear people (even smart people, like Chuck Oliver) talk about what Phil Steele projects as though it's gold. He's just guessing like everybody else.

And his numbers aren't anything even approaching actual analytics. It's not as though it's anything groundbreaking. He's just doing things like taking the number of tackles lost from players who graduated and dividing it by the total number of tackles the team had. That's pretty much the extent of his evaluation of numbers. It's incredibly elementary.

[msudawg1200]

Umm, they moved Ward to TE because he couldn't hack it at DE, not because other DEs were all world. Not saying their not but Ward was lost. The discussion was about depth anyway

Exactly. That guy is a 5 star bust. I think the Bears are pretty good, but they are waaaay over hyped. This comes mostly from ESPN wanting them to do good because they rated that 2013 class so high. They are much like us. Could go anywhere from 6-6,7-5 on the low end to 9-3, 10-2 on the high end. If they are a Top 20 team so are we.

[msudawg1200]

Thank you. These magazines are all the same. Those who put any credibility into Athlon and Lindy's are no worse than those who put credibility into Phil Steele.

His magazine may be more interesting to read, but I constantly hear people (even smart people, like Chuck Oliver) talk about what Phil Steele projects as though it's gold. He's just guessing like everybody else.

And his numbers aren't anything even approaching actual analytics. It's not as though it's anything groundbreaking. He's just doing things like taking the number of tackles lost from players who graduated and dividing it by the total number of tackles the team had. That's pretty much the extent of his evaluation of numbers. It's incredibly elementary.

They also cater to the bigger teams in order to sell more magazines. That's why Florida and Driskell are rated high, etc.

[PMDawg]

PMDawg is a resident Rebel defender

You're retarded. I hate those mother ****ers. I just try not to let it bias me and I don't lose my shit and cry over what they do. I want MSU to win. Everything else is noise. I'll tell you this much too, my predictions for them and for us have put yours to shame over the last 3 years. I can't remember the last time you predicted us to be worse than 10-2.

[PMDawg]

So who is the next 11 on defense and offense for them??
I'm not sure who Golsten is? Maybe you meant Golsen. And I doubt he even starts for them so no he isn't solid.
We all agree that they have a very good starting 11 on defense, but I'm not as sold as you are on the next 11
And to say their OL is thin is an understatement.
Hooks?? Just because he was a 5* juco doesn't mean he will dominate. He may very we'll have a great year but he did nothing last year. And to move Ward to TE is mind boggling. Bet that kid wishes he had never gone there. And with the WR core, Vince Sanders had basically the same numbers last year as Joe Morrow. They are thin there and will have to play a lot of unproven players and frosh again..

You may be right. I don't know much about their 2nd string, although they did manage to beat LSU with a lot of starters injured. I know if Bo, Tunsil, or Morris go down, they're screwed. I know they can take some hits on the DL and still be OK. Other than that, I don't know much about their depth although I'd be willing to guess it's good in the secondary. Sorry my phone auto corrected Golsten. Please forgive me Mr spell check. But to the original point, I don't know a lot about their depth, but their first 22 will be good. Who can predict injuries? I'm sure they'll have some, but who knows where they will occur? We are a lot alike. We can absorb injuries most anywhere outside of OL and QB and S.