Leo Lewis commits to Alabama

[Jacksondevildog]

Nm

[dogshiek]

OMG signing date is just around the... oh wait.

[starkvegasdawg]

He didn't have a commitable offer.***

[Coach34]

Not surprised...he's a good un

[RBritt]

Jimmy johns guys. That's who's been in his ear. Helluva role model to look up to. Sure hope he doesn't get like glanton got johns. Buy you a Toyota in Brookhaven from jimmy johns.

[ShotgunDawg]

Very disappointed with this, and kids growing up in Mississippi wanting leave. Leo, your state needs you and will offer you the same opportunity of getting to the NFL as Alabama. Very disappointing.

[ShotgunDawg]

One thing to remember fellas, let this play out and stay positive. This is very disappointing, and I think most of us are very sick of the myth that is Alabama football and this perception that they "produce" more players than anyone else. In actuality it is a front runner program.

MSU must stay positive and relentlessly recruit Leo till the end. If we lock up Peters, Adams, and Dear, we will have peers in his ear for the next year persuading him to come to MSU. Let it play out.

[Bark]

For those that don't follow recruiting that close who is Leo Lewis? Was he thought to be a lock for state?

[Coach34]

For those that don't follow recruiting that close who is Leo Lewis? Was he thought to be a lock for state?

LB from Brookhaven that was thought to be a Bama-State battle

It's hard to blame a kid that wants to play defense for Saban...hate to see him leave but that is part of it. We just have to keep working on the rest

[mic]

Not that surprising but is surprising that its this soon.. Figured he would be NSD commit or close to it
I wonder what excuse Mr David had... Maybe he can interview the mom and get the "real story"

[TheDogFather]

Jimmy johns guys. That's who's been in his ear. Helluva role model to look up to. Sure hope he doesn't get like glanton got johns. Buy you a Toyota in Brookhaven from jimmy johns.

I'm the biggest MSU fan there is. But how can you fault a guy for choosing Alabama over anybody? Be disappointed but don't be petty.

[ShotgunDawg]

I'm the biggest MSU fan there is. But how can you fault a guy for choosing Alabama over anybody? Be disappointed but don't be petty.

I respectfully disagree. When you are a Mississippi kid and your in state schools offer the same opportunities, it is very disappointing.

Remember, the reason Bama is good is because they get kids like Leo Lewis to go there. There is no magical water in Tuscaloosa. It is all about players.

[Coach34]

I'm the biggest MSU fan there is. But how can you fault a guy for choosing Alabama over anybody? Be disappointed but don't be petty.

RBritt is extremely close to the situation...he is telling it like it is

[Saltydog]

your ass on the bench for a couple of three years.

[ShotgunDawg]

Jimmy johns guys. That's who's been in his ear. Helluva role model to look up to. Sure hope he doesn't get like glanton got johns. Buy you a Toyota in Brookhaven from jimmy johns.

Why any kid would look up to or listen to Jimmy Johns is amazing to me.

Johns is just like the guy we all know. He made poor decisions in life, and instead of admitting his poor decisions, he decided to wait till the perfect opportunity to give everyone who said he made a poor decision, the middle finger. Just remember Jimmy, getting Leo to Bama doesn't make up for your bad career. You stink as a player and made poor life decisions.

[smootness]

Stinks, but we'll stay after him, and hopefully we can at least pull Caban. If we do, I don't consider it a huge loss.

[maroonmania]

Why any kid would look up to or listen to Jimmy Johns is amazing to me.

Well, I totally agree with this because Jimmy Johns proved himself to be a dumbass that had a lot of personal issues. But, I will admit, that while we offer a great opportunity we don't currently offer kids a chance to play for the national championship and Bama does. Hopefully at some point under Mullen we will but we've still got a long ways to go.

[TheDogFather]

I respectfully disagree. When you are a Mississippi kid and your in state schools offer the same opportunities, it is very disappointing.

Remember, the reason Bama is good is because they get kids like Leo Lewis to go there. There is no magical water in Tuscaloosa. It is all about players.

To say that MSU football offers all the same opportunities to a HS football prospect as Alabama football and those opportunities are equal is just not true. I hate to say it as much as any MSU fan.

[bluelightstar]

I agree -- really really hard to fault a kid for going to Bama.

[PassInterference]

To say that MSU football offers all the same opportunities to a HS football prospect as Alabama football and those opportunities are equal is just not true. I hate to say it as much as any MSU fan.

So why does the NFL pull players from butt**** state instead of just signing the entire sr class from Alabama every year?

At stud that comes to MSU has all the NFL chances as a guy that goes to Bama. NFL scouts are not swayed by prestige or football polls.

[ShotgunDawg]

So why does the NFL pull players from butt**** state instead of just signing the entire sr class from Alabama every year?

At stud that comes to MSU has all the NFL chances as a guy that goes to Bama. NFL scouts are not swayed by prestige or football polls.


This.

[TheDogFather]

One thing to remember fellas, let this play out and stay positive. This is very disappointing, and I think most of us are very sick of the myth that is Alabama football and this perception that they "produce" more players than anyone else. In actuality it is a front runner program.

MSU must stay positive and relentlessly recruit Leo till the end. If we lock up Peters, Adams, and Dear, we will have peers in his ear for the next year persuading him to come to MSU. Let it play out.

Yeah. Because MSU flipping players from Bama is so common.

[TheDogFather]

So why does the NFL pull players from butt**** state instead of just signing the entire sr class from Alabama every year?

At stud that comes to MSU has all the NFL chances as a guy that goes to Bama. NFL scouts are not swayed by prestige or football polls.

Sigh.

[Coach34]

Any good player has the same chance of making the NFL at State as he does by going to Bama

What State does not offer that Bama does is the chance to win a National Championship

[War Machine Dawg]

Sigh.

You should sigh. You're getting your ass kicked. Woe is Em Ess Yoo.

[TheDogFather]

You should sigh. You're getting your ass kicked. Woe is Em Ess Yoo.

Getting my ass kicked?

Just because there is a gang of delusionals arguing doesn't make them right.

MSU = Alabama

It's even dumber when you write it down.

[TheDogFather]

Any good player has the same chance of making the NFL at State as he does by going to Bama

What State does not offer that Bama does is the chance to win a National Championship

If the chances are the same then why are there more than twice the number of Alabama alums in the nfl than MSU alums.

Opportunity is not the same thing as odds.

http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g114/dawgbydesign/Mobile%20Uploads/41F41A85-4B77-42C7-ADB0-6A369F671A8C.png (http://s54.photobucket.com/user/dawgbydesign/media/Mobile%20Uploads/41F41A85-4B77-42C7-ADB0-6A369F671A8C.png.html)

http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g114/dawgbydesign/Mobile%20Uploads/DD109963-381E-4792-A23E-85F042054556_1.png (http://s54.photobucket.com/user/dawgbydesign/media/Mobile%20Uploads/DD109963-381E-4792-A23E-85F042054556_1.png.html)

[Coach34]

If the chances are the same then why are there more than twice the number of Alabama alums in the nfl than MSU alums.

Because Alabama has recruited more than twice the number of NFL talented guys coming out of HS that State has

Anything else I can answer for you?

[TheDogFather]

Because Alabama has recruited more than twice the number of NFL talented guys coming out of HS that State has

Anything else I can answer for you?

I give up. Last post in this thread. Why a HS kid would choose Alabama over MSU is beyond me. They must be stupid.

[Todd4State]

This is disappointing for now, but I wouldn't give up quite yet. Every time Leo Lewis has gone on a recruiting visit anywhere it seems like he all of a sudden "leans" to that school.

A couple of weeks ago he was a lean to Ole Miss per their recruiting gurus after a visit there for the Grove Bowl even though there is no way he is going to go to Ole Miss.

If he comes to Big Dawg camp, that will tell me that we still have a chance. So, we'll see how it plays out.

[TexasDawg]

Any good player has the same chance of making the NFL at State as he does by going to Bama

What State does not offer that Bama does is the chance to win a National Championship

This all day. We have shown we can put young men in the NFL but up to this point, we nor any other program in the country has shown they can offer the postseason experience that Bama can. Our best hope to sway Lewis is to get Dear, Peters, Spivey, and other top in state recruits to commit. Also we NEED 10+ wins in order to ensure some of the top in state talent doesn't leave. Until that happens there will be a few casualties, thats just the way it is.

[Coach34]

I give up. Last post in this thread.

You should give up

Going to Bama doesnt give him any better chance of playing in the NFL- but it does give him an infinite better chance of winning a NC

We have Pro Days just like Bama does.
We have a great S&C program just like Bama does
We are coached well on D just like Bama is

Bama recruits more high end talent- and that is why they put more guys in the NFL draft

[ShotgunDawg]

I just don't get it with MSU fans. We are all OK with dogging Ole Miss, but the minute that anyone points out that only reason Alabama is good, is because of their recruiting, or that MSU offers the same schedule, NFL opportunity, and general opportunities as Alabama, we get people that are ignorant about how stuff actually works, coming to their defense.

Alabama is a myth, the Yankees are a myth, the Miami Heat are a myth, Kentucky basketball is a myth, and the Lakers are a myth. These teams are typically only good because they have better players, and they have better players because they convinced someone to go there because they won in the past. Do you not see the stupid self fulfilling cycle here folks?

1. Alabama win in the 60s and 70s

2. Idiots say, "can't blame a kid for going to Bama because they win."

3. Kid goes to Alabama because they win

4. Alabama wins because the kid went there

5. Wash repeat. Alabama wins forever because no one is willing to point out how ridiculous the cycle is, and why it's stupid and if any school in the country got Bama's players, they would be good.

I get it when states and universities having pride about winning with home grown talent, but Louisville and Kentucky talk about how great they are when no starter on either team is actually from the state of Kentucky. Where is the pride in that? Why does Leo Lewis care about Alabama, when he is from Mississippi?

These are rhetorical questions that I don't need an idiot answering for me, but when you actually think about the logic used in recruiting decisions, it makes you wonder.

[PassInterference]

If a top recruit wants to bet that he can win a NC at Bama during the 1 or 2 years that he can get on the field over there, so be it. Bama doesn't win a NC every year.

A player can weigh that vs coming to MSU and getting a lot more PT.

[ShotgunDawg]

If a top recruit wants to bet that he can win a NC at Bama during the 1 or 2 years that he can get on the field over there, so be it. Bama doesn't win a NC every year.

A player can weigh that vs coming to MSU and getting a lot more PT.

Would MSU win a national title if players like Leo Lewis came to MSU instead of Bama, or is Bama the only possible school that high level players can go to and win a championship?

[Coach34]

To win a NC- it takes multiple years of good recruiting classes. And that is why the Bama's, Auburn's, Florida's win it. They just keep recruiting at a top 10 level year in and year out.

It's like the Twanny Beckham example I used earlier- he couldnt start at State, He transferred to NBA pipeline school Kentucky and guess what? He was still a shitty back-up player that lacked talent. Going to Kentucky didnt make him any better.

NBA pipelines and NFL pipelines are that because they are able to sign 4 and 5 star recruits year after year based on a reputation built long ago.

Chris Jones didnt hurt his draft potential by coming to State
Benardrick McKinney will be just fine for the draft because he played at State
Vick Ballard did just fine coming to State- shit if he had gone to Bama- he might not have ended up being drafted because he wouldnt have played much considering who they had.
Gabe Jackson will be just fine this May in the draft because he went to State

Talented players get drafted no matter where they go these days

[Intramural All-American]

Shotgun, your inter makes sense, but your logic is off. It's not a level playing field. Alabama IS the most storied program in college football history. That is FACT, not MYTH. Alabama contends for NCs every year, MSU does not. You are right, it is absolutely a cycle. But that cycle is legitimate, and players see that. In your mind, should a kid from Wyoming go to Wyoming over USC just because it's his home state?

[TheDogFather]

You should give up

Going to Bama doesnt give him any better chance of playing in the NFL- but it does give him an infinite better chance of winning a NC

We have Pro Days just like Bama does.
We have a great S&C program just like Bama does
We are coached well on D just like Bama is

Bama recruits more high end talent- and that is why they put more guys in the NFL draft

Or kids choose Bama because they have a better chance of making it to the nfl.

You are leaving out the kid choosing part. In all of your recruiting expertise and inner workings with the athletic departments have you heard a kid say he chose Bama because he likes their colors?

Your argument is elegant but incomplete.

[Intramural All-American]

Or kids choose Bama because they have a better chance of making it to the nfl.

You are leaving out the kid choosing part. In all of your recruiting expertise and inner workings with the athletic departments have you heard a kid say he chose Bama because he likes their colors?

Your argument is elegant but incomplete.

No, your argument is flawed. As Coach said, some kids may actually hurt there draft stock going to Bama rather than going somewhere else. Some kids get buried on the depth chart there, where they may actually be stars somewhere else. Bama signs 4 and 5 star classes every year. We sign 2 and 3 star classes every year. Do you seriously not see the connection with why Bama has more in the NFL. If Bama signed our class from this past year, you wouldn't see any more of those getting drafted from there than you will see get drafted from here.

[ShotgunDawg]

No, your argument is flawed. As Coach said, some kids may actually hurt there draft stock going to Bama rather than going somewhere else. Some kids get buried on the depth chart there, where they may actually be stars somewhere else. Bama signs 4 and 5 star classes every year. We sign 2 and 3 star classes every year. Do you seriously not see the connection with why Bama has more in the NFL. If Bama signed our class from this past year, you wouldn't see any more of those getting drafted from there than you will see get drafted from here.

We don't sign 2 and 3 star classes. We sign 3 and 4 star classes. Can't stand when MSU skew the facts to make us look worse.

have you guys noticed how we do that?

[preachermatt83]

I respectfully disagree. When you are a Mississippi kid and your in state schools offer the same opportunities, it is very disappointing.

Remember, the reason Bama is good is because they get kids like Leo Lewis to go there. There is no magical water in Tuscaloosa. It is all about players.

I have no respect for a player who chooses to play out of state when he has the same opportunity at an in state school. It's his decision, not mine but I just simply don't respect it.

[Coach34]

Or kids choose Bama because they have a better chance of making it to the nfl. .

Wow- no wonder you are a Stands fan

They dont have a better chance at Bama. Bama recruits top 10 classes each year- thats why they put more in the NFL.

Brandon Heavens, Damien Robinson, Chris Smith, Mike Henig, and guys like that- playing at State is not why they arent in the NFL- they arent and wont make the NFL because they dont have the talent. On the flip side of that- Mark Ingram, Julio Jones, Trent Richardson, etc are still NFL players if they come to State. Going to Bama didnt help those guys anymore than them going anywhere else. They are supremely talented athletes that were NFL bound from the time they were 13 years old and all you had to do was not **** them up

[TheDogFather]

No, your argument is flawed. As Coach said, some kids may actually hurt there draft stock going to Bama rather than going somewhere else. Some kids get buried on the depth chart there, where they may actually be stars somewhere else. Bama signs 4 and 5 star classes every year. We sign 2 and 3 star classes every year. Do you seriously not see the connection with why Bama has more in the NFL. If Bama signed our class from this past year, you wouldn't see any more of those getting drafted from there than you will see get drafted from here.

All of this back and forth keeps leaving out the fact that a kid chooses.

The kid chooses for a reason. It's not a coin flip. Kids don't choose their future on a whim. They look at Bama and see a better future. And they are not all ignorant.

We an argue the shoulds and maybes all night but at the end if the day the kid chooses Bama. For a reason.

[PassInterference]

All of this back and forth keeps leaving out the fact that a kid chooses.

The kid chooses for a reason. It's not a coin flip. Kids don't choose their future on a whim. They look at Bama and see a better future. And they are not all ignorant.

We an argue the shoulds and maybes all night but at the end if the day the kid chooses Bama. For a reason.


You are right that kids choose for a reason. That reason could be complete bullshit, but if the player believes it, that's their reason.

[Intramural All-American]

All of this back and forth keeps leaving out the fact that a kid chooses.

The kid chooses for a reason. It's not a coin flip. Kids don't choose their future on a whim. They look at Bama and see a better future. And they are not all ignorant.

We an argue the shoulds and maybes all night but at the end if the day the kid chooses Bama. For a reason.

You are absolutely correct. Kids choose Bama for a brighter future. A brighter college future that is. They're not choosing bama because they are hoping to get to the NFL. They are picking Bama because they are the best collegiate program and they have a good shot at winning a national championship. If they pick state, they have just as good of a shot at the NFL, but nowhere near the shot of a championship. You really can't grasp that?

[Todd4State]

Wow- no wonder you are a Stands fan

They dont have a better chance at Bama. Bama recruits top 10 classes each year- thats why they put more in the NFL.

Brandon Heavens, Damien Robinson, Chris Smith, Mike Henig, and guys like that- playing at State is not why they arent in the NFL- they arent and wont make the NFL because they dont have the talent. On the flip side of that- Mark Ingram, Julio Jones, Trent Richardson, etc are still NFL players if they come to State. Going to Bama didnt help those guys anymore than them going anywhere else. They are supremely talented athletes that were NFL bound from the time they were 13 years old and all you had to do was not **** them up

Exactly. Alabama is simply getting more four-five star type guys, and they're getting the guys that by and large don't have character issues like Nkemdiche.

If we were getting about 5 five star, 15 4 star, and 5 three star type guys every year we would have about the same results on the field as they are having.

But coming to MSU is not going to hurt anyone's draft status. Dan is a good coach and good developer of talent. So, if you have elite talent and come to MSU you are going to be just fine. Derek Sherrod, Jonthan Banks, Fletcher Cox, Darius Slay, and now Gabe Jackson and in the future Chris Jones, Benardrick McKinney, Bear Wilson, Dak, and others will soon follow.

The difference is we have to take more guys that are raw and projectable and coach them up and develop them moreso than Bama has to.

[Intramural All-American]

We don't sign 2 and 3 star classes. We sign 3 and 4 star classes. Can't stand when MSU skew the facts to make us look worse.

have you guys noticed how we do that?

Yea, we have started to now. But why don't you go back and look at the classes that would be graduated by this point. Before 2010, our classes were littered with 2 stars. Even in 2010 and 2011 which will be RS Seniors and Juniors this year.

My post could have been worded better, but the point was clear.

[bluelightstar]

Kids don't just go to Alabama because of the NFL. You go to Alabama because Alabama plays legitimately meaningful games in November and after. I just refuse to find fault with a kid that chooses to sign with college football's most storied program, where they are guaranteed (at least lately) to get at least an SEC Championship ring if not more. If you can go to the NFL from either place, I get why a kid would go to the school that provides all those other benefits, especially if they didn't grow up a State fan.

[Todd4State]

You are right that kids choose for a reason. That reason could be complete bullshit, but if the player believes it, that's their reason.

One thing about Bama and Saban- I have to wonder how much longer he is going to be there. He's one of the older coaches in the SEC. I'd hate to go to Bama to play for Saban and then end up with Lane Kiffen as my head coach.

Similar to what happened after the Bear retired and then passed away. The guys that played for Bama in late 80's ended up being 7-8 win type teams playing in front of a bunch of nutso fans that all wanted the Bear to return from the grave. They never did come back until they brought Saban in 30 years later.

[bluelightstar]

One thing about Bama and Saban- I have to wonder how much longer he is going to be there. He's one of the older coaches in the SEC. I'd hate to go to Bama to play for Saban and then end up with Lane Kiffen as my head coach.

It will be a cold day in hell before Lane Kiffin is the head coach at Alabama, Todd. Ha

[Todd4State]

Kids don't just go to Alabama because of the NFL. You go to Alabama because Alabama plays legitimately meaningful games in November and after. I just refuse to find fault with a kid that chooses to sign with college football's most storied program, where they are guaranteed (at least lately) to get at least an SEC Championship ring if not more. If you can go to the NFL from either place, I get why a kid would go to the school that provides all those other benefits, especially if they didn't grow up a State fan.

There is no guarantee on that. If you played in the late 90's and chose MSU over Bama- our players probably played in as many if not more meaningful games than the guys that went to Bama. Things can and will change in the sports landscape.

[Todd4State]

It will be a cold day in hell before Lane Kiffin is the head coach at Alabama, Todd. Ha

Maybe- but as of right now he's the most qualified guy on their staff to keep thing going like they are.

[TheDogFather]

Wow- no wonder you are a Stands fan

They dont have a better chance at Bama. Bama recruits top 10 classes each year- thats why they put more in the NFL.

Brandon Heavens, Damien Robinson, Chris Smith, Mike Henig, and guys like that- playing at State is not why they arent in the NFL- they arent and wont make the NFL because they dont have the talent. On the flip side of that- Mark Ingram, Julio Jones, Trent Richardson, etc are still NFL players if they come to State. Going to Bama didnt help those guys anymore than them going anywhere else. They are supremely talented athletes that were NFL bound from the time they were 13 years old and all you had to do was not **** them up

All the arguments in the world can be hashed forever. At the end of the day the kids choose Bama. And not for Bamas sake. I guess they are all just dumbasses. Except the 60 or more that are currently playing in the nfl. They picked Bama cause roll tide sounded cute and just lucked up.

[smootness]

I have no respect for a player who chooses to play out of state when he has the same opportunity at an in state school. It's his decision, not mine but I just simply don't respect it.

Then you're a tool.

We shouldn't allow our fandom to cloud our minds from the realization that each person will make their own decision for all kinds of reasons, and chances are that we'll never know what those reasons all are. Going to an in-state school is no more noble or good than leaving the state. It is each kid's decision, it is a big decision, and it has no bearing on us. Frankly when I take a step back I have to scold myself for becoming so personally invested in it. Who are we to say where a kid should or shouldn't go, or to give that kid respect or not for his decision?

I assume, then, that you have no respect for a guy like Dak Prescott?

[I seen it dawg]

Jesus it's April

[TheDogFather]

Wow- no wonder you are a Stands fan

They dont have a better chance at Bama. Bama recruits top 10 classes each year- thats why they put more in the NFL.

Brandon Heavens, Damien Robinson, Chris Smith, Mike Henig, and guys like that- playing at State is not why they arent in the NFL- they arent and wont make the NFL because they dont have the talent. On the flip side of that- Mark Ingram, Julio Jones, Trent Richardson, etc are still NFL players if they come to State. Going to Bama didnt help those guys anymore than them going anywhere else. They are supremely talented athletes that were NFL bound from the time they were 13 years old and all you had to do was not **** them up


You are absolutely correct. Kids choose Bama for a brighter future. A brighter college future that is. They're not choosing bama because they are hoping to get to the NFL. They are picking Bama because they are the best collegiate program and they have a good shot at winning a national championship. If they pick state, they have just as good of a shot at the NFL, but nowhere near the shot of a championship. You really can't grasp that?

So what you are saying is that five star players have no interest in their future past college. And the college they choose - the college responsible for developing them for the next four years - is only of interest for the trophy that gives them no monetary value? These five star players are not concerned at all with what will give them the best opportunity to be financially stable and provide for their family down the road? You are saying that all this unionization talk is not about money? These five star players with the highest potential to play in the NFL? They don't think at all about the NFL when choosing a college?

Now that you put it that way it makes even less sense. I'm glad you made it clearer.

[smootness]

All the arguments in the world can be hashed forever. At the end of the day the kids choose Bama. And not for Bamas sake. I guess they are all just dumbasses. Except the 60 or more that are currently playing in the nfl. They picked Bama cause roll tide sounded cute and just lucked up.

They choose Alabama, in part, because all the evidence points to the fact that Alabama puts more players in the NFL. Therefore, it's a much easier decision to say, 'I want to play in the NFL, so I'll choose Alabama' than it is to say, 'I want to play in the NFL, so I'll choose Mississippi State'. That does not mean that playing for Alabama gives you a better chance of playing in the NFL. Now, if you're playing for Alabama, chances are pretty good that you are very talented because they only take very talented players. So in that sense, you may have a better chance, but for each individual person, your talent level is going to be the same no matter where you go, and if you're good enough the NFL will find you.

Alabama does spend more on facilities, coaching staff, and in other areas, but they don't do it better necessarily because of this. I promise you Gabe Jackson's draft stock wouldn't be higher had he gone to Alabama, same with Benardrick McKinney. And I promise you CJ Mosely's stock wouldn't be lower if he had come to State. You'd be a fool to think that, and that alone proves that it doesn't matter so much where you go.

What does make a difference, as Coach pointed out, is that Alabama will probably be more successful while you're there because they are bringing in more talented players like yourself. But I guarantee you that if we had switched our last 4 recruiting classes with Alabama's, it would be us churning out 1st round pick after 1st round pick, not them. Again, you'd be a fool to think otherwise.

[I seen it dawg]

The first thing anybody has to do is forget thinking like a 30-45 yr old man. Ain't a damn one in that category ever got to pick a college to go to. I'd venture to say that 99.2% of all the assclowns on this board didn't have a fn clue what to do when they were 17-18 yrs old. The kids are gonna do things that are inexplicable just like they are going to make the "obvious" choice. Until we start winning some championships we ain't the "obvious" choice. It doesn't matter what any of you argue.

[smootness]

So what you are saying is that five star players have no interest in their future past college. And the college they choose - the college responsible for developing them for the next four years - is only of interest for the trophy that gives them no monetary value? These five star players are not concerned at all with what will give them the best opportunity to be financially stable and provide for their family down the road? You are saying that all this unionization talk is not about money? These five star players with the highest potential to play in the NFL? They don't think at all about the NFL when choosing a college?

Now that you put it that way it makes even less sense. I'm glad you made it clearer.

Of course they think about the NFL. But a high-school kid believing Alabama gives him the best chance of playing in the NFL because they send more kids to the NFL doesn't make it so.

It's seen as the safer option.

But if you believe what you're saying, then you must believe that if kids like Fletcher Cox care about the NFL and still choose State over Alabama, they must be stupid. Is that what you're saying?

[maroonmania]

What is most surprising to me is that with all of the bad things that happened to Jimmy Johns while he was in the Bama program that he is still a big supporter of theirs and would be influencing kids to go there. I would have thought he would have washed his hands of the Bammers long ago. They pretty much washed their hands of Johns.

[TheDogFather]

It's seen as the safer option.

WTH? That's the whole point. So you and I agree.

[ShotgunDawg]

What is most surprising to me is that with all of the bad things that happened to Jimmy Johns while he was in the Bama program that he is still a big supporter of theirs and would be influencing kids to go there. I would have thought he would have washed his hands of the Bammers long ago. They pretty much washed their hands of Johns.

John's made poor decisions in his life, and instead of admitting that he is a loser, failed, and made poor decisions, he decided he would SHOW everyone that told him he made poor decisions by waiting for the perfect opportunity to give them the middle finger. He is in denial due to his own failed career, but doesn't want to admit he was wrong.

Also, I have inkling that Johns could be on someones payroll to deliver Lewis. We complain about Ole Miss all the time, but Bama is the masters of this behavior. They are the Illuminati of underground recruiting.

[ShotgunDawg]

You are absolutely correct. Kids choose Bama for a brighter future. A brighter college future that is. They're not choosing bama because they are hoping to get to the NFL. They are picking Bama because they are the best collegiate program and they have a good shot at winning a national championship. If they pick state, they have just as good of a shot at the NFL, but nowhere near the shot of a championship. You really can't grasp that?

We get this, it is obvious, but it is also dumb. Under this logic, MSU fans will never have any hope of becoming a prominent program. If we always "understand" why top players choose to leave the state, then we will never progress. MSU, the state of Mississippi, boosters, coaches, etc.. can't allow what happened to today to happen. Is it the end of the world? No, but if we can't find fault in the logic and the ridiculousness of why every recruit, every year chooses Bama because they won last year, then what hope do we ever have of overcoming them and becoming prominent ourselves.

What you don't understand, is that we all are very very conscious of the reasons that uninformed, front running, easily persuaded kids would choose to go to Bama over MSU and completely understand them. But, what you must understand, is that we WON'T accept it. I won't accept it, Coach 34 won't accept it, Todd4State won't accept it, and the preacher damn sure isn't accepting it.

The hope of our program ever becoming prominent is contingent on the necessity that we care, and that we never loose hope that kids will one day see the truth rather than the perception. We may sound ridiculous to casual observers, and some may laugh at our logic, but that is because they fear it. We are not your grandpa's and fathers MSU, we honestly believe that MSU offers the best opportunity, facilities, fans, and schedule that any amateur athlete in America could ever desire, and when one of our own, Leo Lewis, tells us that we aren't good enough, then we feel insulted by that and will fight point out how ridiculous it is for someone to think that they are too good for us.

Kapeesh????

[Intramural All-American]

We get this, it is obvious, but it is also dumb. Under this logic, MSU fans will never have any hope of becoming a prominent program. If we always "understand" why top players choose to leave the state, then we will never progress. MSU, the state of Mississippi, boosters, coaches, etc.. can't allow what happened to today to happen. Is it the end of the world? No, but if we can't find fault in the logic and the ridiculousness of why every recruit, every year chooses Bama because they won last year, then what hope do we ever have of overcoming them and becoming prominent ourselves.

What you don't understand, is that we all are very very conscious of the reasons that uninformed, front running, easily persuaded kids would choose to go to Bama over MSU and completely understand them. But, what you must understand, is that we WON'T accept it. I won't accept it, Coach 34 won't accept it, Todd4State won't accept it, and the preacher damn sure isn't accepting it.

The hope of our program ever becoming prominent is contingent on the necessity that we care, and that we never loose hope that kids will one day see the truth rather than the perception. We may sound ridiculous to casual observers, and some may laugh at our logic, but that is because they fear it. We are not your grandpa's and fathers MSU, we honestly believe that MSU offers the best opportunity, facilities, fans, and schedule that any amateur athlete in America could ever desire, and when one of our own, Leo Lewis, tells us that we aren't good enough, then we feel insulted by that and will fight point out how ridiculous it is for someone to think that they are too good for us.

Kapeesh????

Um, why did you just lecture me? I never said anything about acceptance. I said why players do it, which you obviously "understand". You are just a blabbering idiot.

[1bigdawg]

Yeah. Because MSU flipping players from Bama is so common.

You really are Mr Negative.

[1bigdawg]

If the chances are the same then why are there more than twice the number of Alabama alums in the nfl than MSU alums.

Opportunity is not the same thing as odds.



While true, compare the number of 4 and 5 stars (ie. obviously talented) players that each of these schools get in recruiting and you will see that Bama is no better at placing them proportionally in the NFL than any of the schools you mentioned. Appreciate you helping me out.

[sbcmortgageman]

It's so early. His recruiting is far from over. We are not backing off.

[PassInterference]

While true, compare the number of 4 and 5 stars (ie. obviously talented) players that each of these schools get in recruiting and you will see that Bama is no better at placing them proportionally in the NFL than any of the schools you mentioned. Appreciate you helping me out.

That idea assumes star rankings are accurate. Bad idea.

[1bigdawg]

That idea assumes star rankings are accurate. Bad idea.

Individually star ranking are often inaccurate. However, taken as a group they are a good indicator.

The race goes not always to the swift or the battle to the strong, but that is the way to bet.

[AlSwearengen]

So, how does this work with Jimmy Johns? Is he a legend in brookhaven? All he did at bama was get off the bench long enough to get lit the 17 up by De'mon Glanton on special teams and run a couple of plays at qb to prove Croom wrong. Other than that he got in trouble for drugs and fighting dogs. I can't believe he has any love for bama. He is a good bit older than Leo Lewis, so I guess he just walks up and quotes a price to gain interest.

I guess Johns is promised a finders fee if he can be successful as an agent and deliver Lewis. I imagine Johns is probably hard up for money, so why not do it.

It also appears that olemiss is seriously pissed. They must have been under the impression that the deal was done for them.

[Todd4State]

So, how does this work with Jimmy Johns? Is he a legend in brookhaven? All he did at bama was get off the bench long enough to get lit the 17 up by De'mon Glanton on special teams and run a couple of plays at qb to prove Croom wrong. Other than that he got in trouble for drugs and fighting dogs. I can't believe he has any love for bama. He is a good bit older than Leo Lewis, so I guess he just walks up and quotes a price to gain interest.

I guess Johns is promised a finders fee if he can be successful as an agent and deliver Lewis. I imagine Johns is probably hard up for money, so why not do it.

It also appears that olemiss is seriously pissed. They must have been under the impression that the deal was done for them.

I'm pretty sure he is a legend in Brookhaven. He's definitely a well- known local from working at the Toyota car dealership there at the very least.

I'm not sure why Ole Miss is pissed about this. I just can't see Leo Lewis going there and he always leans to wherever he visits. They have to learn how to spend their money better it sounds like.

[defiantdog]

Lewis almost committed to Bama on his first visit there. There's honestly a long way to go with this one. I have a feeling he's gonna take a few more trips there and see Reggie Ragland (Junior ILB), Reuben Foster (Sophmore ILB), and Shaun Hamilton (Freshman ILB), and not to mention they just recruited Rashaan Evans who will be either ILB or OLB (the guy is a monster). And I don't see Bama recruiting Lewis to put his hand in the ground like he did his Sophmore year in high school. We just better hope our coaches don't give up on his recruitment because I have a strong feeling he's going to start doubting his decision come January when he realizes where he's going to be in the rotation.

And speaking of stealing recruits from the state of Alabama.... here's one that may be a stud --> http://247sports.com/Player/Amonte-Caban-36870

[ShotgunDawg]

Lewis almost committed to Bama on his first visit there. There's honestly a long way to go with this one. I have a feeling he's gonna take a few more trips there and see Reggie Ragland (Junior ILB), Reuben Foster (Sophmore ILB), and Shaun Hamilton (Freshman ILB), and not to mention they just recruited Rashaan Evans who will be either ILB or OLB (the guy is a monster). And I don't see Bama recruiting Lewis to put his hand in the ground like he did his Sophmore year in high school. We just better hope our coaches don't give up on his recruitment because I have a strong feeling he's going to start doubting his decision come January when he realizes where he's going to be in the rotation.

And speaking of stealing recruits from the state of Alabama.... here's one that may be a stud --> http://247sports.com/Player/Amonte-Caban-36870

I don't think our coaches will back off. Also, in many ways, this slows down Lewis' recruitment, which could allow Tony Hughes more time to work him.

[TUSK]

I'm gonna take "myth" and lay the points for 500, Alex.



I just don't get it with MSU fans. We are all OK with dogging Ole Miss, but the minute that anyone points out that only reason Alabama is good, is because of their recruiting, or that MSU offers the same schedule, NFL opportunity, and general opportunities as Alabama, we get people that are ignorant about how stuff actually works, coming to their defense.

Alabama is a myth, the Yankees are a myth, the Miami Heat are a myth, Kentucky basketball is a myth, and the Lakers are a myth. These teams are typically only good because they have better players, and they have better players because they convinced someone to go there because they won in the past. Do you not see the stupid self fulfilling cycle here folks?

1. Alabama win in the 60s and 70s

2. Idiots say, "can't blame a kid for going to Bama because they win."

3. Kid goes to Alabama because they win

4. Alabama wins because the kid went there

5. Wash repeat. Alabama wins forever because no one is willing to point out how ridiculous the cycle is, and why it's stupid and if any school in the country got Bama's players, they would be good.

I get it when states and universities having pride about winning with home grown talent, but Louisville and Kentucky talk about how great they are when no starter on either team is actually from the state of Kentucky. Where is the pride in that? Why does Leo Lewis care about Alabama, when he is from Mississippi?

These are rhetorical questions that I don't need an idiot answering for me, but when you actually think about the logic used in recruiting decisions, it makes you wonder.

[Bully13]

I don't have the time to read this entire thread, but I will take the time to tell you TUSK to suck my dick

[smootness]

WTH? That's the whole point. So you and I agree.

No. I said it is seen as the safer option, not that it actually is.

You seem to equate the opinions of 18-year-olds with fact. People will often take the road that is seemingly easier; most don't look past, 'Well, they put more people in the NFL'. In reality, those players are making the NFL b/c of their talent level, not because Bama prepared them better than State did.

[ShotgunDawg]

I'm gonna take "myth" and lay the points for 500, Alex.

So you believe there is something magical about Alabama football, and that if any other school happened to pay and convince the same players to come to their school, they would not be as successful as Alabama?

Please provide logic and an explanation to your response

[hells bells]

OMG signing date is just around the... oh wait.

Good grief! Is this a case where Robin tells Batman, "holly exodus Batman we are loosing the class in April with February right around the corner".

[mic]

As good as Leo is and he might be great in college. There are 3 guys in Mississippi that we need more than him.
Peters
Patterson
Nelson

[defiantdog]

The difference is.... Saban sells these kids on the fact that they will be in the NFL after their 3rd season at Bama. We don't sell recruits that.... we sell education and family atmosphere. And that's why these kids go to Alabama with the NFL mentality because it is recruited into their heads. Some kids fall for it and some don't.

Look at McAdory High (which is 45 minutes from Tuscaloosa).... we got Dez Harris and Cory Thomas from there. Hell, De'Runnya Wilson is from just south of B'ham as well. We didn't get these guys because we were lucky or because Auburn or Alabama didn't want them. We got them because of what the coaches sold them. Why do you think Beniquez Brown chose us over Auburn? I like our coaches approach.... it brings in quality players. Look at OM.... look at the type of players they bring in. Georgia is the same way. Besides, you guys realize this is the first 4 or 5* player Alabama has taken from Mississippi since 2011 and his name is Malcolm Faciane.... who? Exactly

[defiantdog]

As good as Leo is and he might be great in college. There are 3 guys in Mississippi that we need more than him.
Peters
Patterson
Nelson

Scratch Patterson.... not too hopeful on that one. Input Dear.... and I understand there's character issues there, but hell he's a 4*.... isn't that all that matters? ****

[smootness]

I'm not sure about the character issues on Dear, I haven't heard anything other than innuendo based on his social media, and it seems like most of that was misunderstanding.

And who is Nelson? Is that Fletcher Adams?

[maroonmania]

The difference is.... Saban sells these kids on the fact that they will be in the NFL after their 3rd season at Bama. We don't sell recruits that.... we sell education and family atmosphere. And that's why these kids go to Alabama with the NFL mentality because it is recruited into their heads. Some kids fall for it and some don't.

Look at McAdory High (which is 45 minutes from Tuscaloosa).... we got Dez Harris and Cory Thomas from there. Hell, De'Runnya Wilson is from just south of B'ham as well. We didn't get these guys because we were lucky or because Auburn or Alabama didn't want them. We got them because of what the coaches sold them. Why do you think Beniquez Brown chose us over Auburn? I like our coaches approach.... it brings in quality players. Look at OM.... look at the type of players they bring in. Georgia is the same way. Besides, you guys realize this is the first 4 or 5* player Alabama has taken from Mississippi since 2011 and his name is Malcolm Faciane.... who? Exactly

There is a lot more to it than that. Alabama, especially for kids in the South, sells itself for the most part although admittedly Saban is one of the best recruiters out there. They will always have players though regardless because there are a lot of HS football players that grow up in the South wanting to one day wear that Crimson Tide jersey. That's why Bama can have reasonably successful teams even when they hire incompetent coaches like Dubose and Shula. We don't have that factor, so that is something we have to fight if we are indeed recruiting a kid that Bama also wants. If we were to hire a Dubose or Shula we would be fortunate if they even got as good of results as Croom did.

[TUSK]

Bama wins bc they care more. That's an indictment.


So you believe there is something magical about Alabama football, and that if any other school happened to pay and convince the same players to come to their school, they would not be as successful as Alabama?

Please provide logic and an explanation to your response

[mic]

I'm not sure about the character issues on Dear, I haven't heard anything other than innuendo based on his social media, and it seems like most of that was misunderstanding.

And who is Nelson? Is that Fletcher Adams?

yeah sorry Adams...

[Goat Holder]

I just don't get it with MSU fans. We are all OK with dogging Ole Miss, but the minute that anyone points out that only reason Alabama is good, is because of their recruiting, or that MSU offers the same schedule, NFL opportunity, and general opportunities as Alabama, we get people that are ignorant about how stuff actually works, coming to their defense.

Alabama is a myth, the Yankees are a myth, the Miami Heat are a myth, Kentucky basketball is a myth, and the Lakers are a myth. These teams are typically only good because they have better players, and they have better players because they convinced someone to go there because they won in the past. Do you not see the stupid self fulfilling cycle here folks?

1. Alabama win in the 60s and 70s

2. Idiots say, "can't blame a kid for going to Bama because they win."

3. Kid goes to Alabama because they win

4. Alabama wins because the kid went there

5. Wash repeat. Alabama wins forever because no one is willing to point out how ridiculous the cycle is, and why it's stupid and if any school in the country got Bama's players, they would be good.

I get it when states and universities having pride about winning with home grown talent, but Louisville and Kentucky talk about how great they are when no starter on either team is actually from the state of Kentucky. Where is the pride in that? Why does Leo Lewis care about Alabama, when he is from Mississippi?

These are rhetorical questions that I don't need an idiot answering for me, but when you actually think about the logic used in recruiting decisions, it makes you wonder.

Absolutely awesome. One of the best, and most true, posts on the subject that I've ever seen.

[smootness]

Bama wins bc they care more. That's an indictment.

Oh please. They may have cared more in the past, but that isn't the case anymore. However, caring more in the past, or at least making the right decisions in the past, has put them in a position where they have more resources and more built-in advantages than we do.

We can't suddenly say, 'We care to the degree Alabama does,' and success just comes to us the same way. It doesn't work like that. Alabama has built a bigger fanbase, and the resources will continue to be at their disposal much more than to the degree we have access to them.

[AlSwearengen]

Scratch Patterson.... not too hopeful on that one. Input Dear.... and I understand there's character issues there, but hell he's a 4*.... isn't that all that matters? ****


I wish people would quit spouting this shit, even if it is an inside joke. The problem is that not everyone knows the inside joke. ****!

[KB21]

You know, at 17 and 18 years of age, it is easy to get blinded by the bright lights and flare of a program like Alabama. Most of them probably do not look at draft reports or follow the NFL draft. If they did, I wonder what they would say when they read about Alabama players coming into the league with significant injury questions because Nick Saban forces you to play injured? There is also a general feeling that Alabama players come into the league already maxed out as far as their ability goes. I don't think that is the case with everyone that comes out of there, but there are a lot of players from Alabama that just do not pan out in the NFL.

[TUSK]

No.


Oh please. They may have cared more in the past, but that isn't the case anymore.

[LC Dawg]

In Alabama's case I think a lot of kids, especially out-of-staters, are committing to Saban more than they are to the program. Saban has a little bit of a mystique about him right now. If Nick Saban showed up at practice at a Mississippi high school it may shut down practice. Jimbo Fisher just beat Gus Malzahn for the national championship and if both those guys showed up at a practice I'm not sure most of the players would know who they are.

[sandwolf]

Oh please. They may have cared more in the past, but that isn't the case anymore.

Gotta disagree with you here.....I feel like the Bama fans absolutely care more than almost any other fanbase. I mean, they have 73k at this years spring game and that is considered a huge disappointment because they typically have 90,000+. I think that it would be almost impossible to make a legitimate argument that the MSU fanbase, as a whole, cares just as much as the Bama fanbase.

[ShotgunDawg]

No.

You mean white trash care more, right?

Because I'm pretty sure everyone in this board cares just as much about MSU than any Bama alum cares about Bama. Sure, it looks like Bama cares more when your much of your uneducated white trash fanbase does something dumb, but they do that because they are uneducated white trash. You just happen to have a stranglehold on the front runner, trashy segment of the population. I don't think there is anything wrong with that, but don't say Bama cares more when the examples are uneducated white trash that has nothing else going for them.

[LC Dawg]

You mean white trash care more, right?

Because I'm pretty sure everyone in this board cares just as much about MSU than any Bama alum cares about Bama. Sure, it looks like Bama cares more when your much of your uneducated white trash fanbase does something dumb, but they do that because they are uneducated white trash. You just happen to have a stranglehold on the front runner, trashy segment of the population. I don't think there is anything wrong with that, but don't say Bama cares more when the examples are uneducated white trash that has nothing else going for them.

Thanks for that, I enjoyed it. It wasn't until I went to a game in Tuscaloosa that I realized that the majority of Alabama's fanbase is just a bunch of hillbillies who will spend a month's pay on giant tattoos of the Bear and Saban for their backs and chests. And that's just the women.

[smootness]

Gotta disagree with you here.....I feel like the Bama fans absolutely care more than almost any other fanbase. I mean, they have 73k at this years spring game and that is considered a huge disappointment because they typically have 90,000+. I think that it would be almost impossible to make a legitimate argument that the MSU fanbase, as a whole, cares just as much as the Bama fanbase.

Alabama has a bigger fanbase, and that is largely due to the fact that they've been successful. Those are the results of winning, they're not causes of it.

[HereComesTheSpiral]

You mean white trash care more, right?

Because I'm pretty sure everyone in this board cares just as much about MSU than any Bama alum cares about Bama. Sure, it looks like Bama cares more when your much of your uneducated white trash fanbase does something dumb, but they do that because they are uneducated white trash. You just happen to have a stranglehold on the front runner, trashy segment of the population. I don't think there is anything wrong with that, but don't say Bama cares more when the examples are uneducated white trash that has nothing else going for them.
Please, do not call someone else stupid if you cannot form a coherent sentence.

[defiantdog]

Gotta disagree with you here.....I feel like the Bama fans absolutely care more than almost any other fanbase. I mean, they have 73k at this years spring game and that is considered a huge disappointment because they typically have 90,000+. I think that it would be almost impossible to make a legitimate argument that the MSU fanbase, as a whole, cares just as much as the Bama fanbase.

They scheduled their spring game on Easter weekend.... that's why attendance was down

[TUSK]

I'd say every segment of the bammer fan base cares more. From white trash trailer dwellers on up to the Logan Youngs ilk.

And please don't delude yourself into thinking all schools don't have some of each. Bammer just has more people of all kinds that have skewed financial priorities.


You mean white trash care more, right?

Because I'm pretty sure everyone in this board cares just as much about MSU than any Bama alum cares about Bama. Sure, it looks like Bama cares more when your much of your uneducated white trash fanbase does something dumb, but they do that because they are uneducated white trash. You just happen to have a stranglehold on the front runner, trashy segment of the population. I don't think there is anything wrong with that, but don't say Bama cares more when the examples are uneducated white trash that has nothing else going for them.

[Raytoraid83]

Yancy is already claiming how Lewis, Marquell Harell (who he had all his followers believing was an ole miss lock and then he committed to auburn a couple days ago) and Linton are all gonna flip to ole miss.