Seeking informed feedback re: choice of university for Chem E.

[blacklistedbully]

Yes, I know we have a great program, and I'm a proud Bulldog alum. But we live in California and my eldest daughter would like to stay in Cali, taking advantage if in-state tuition, etc. There are several great programs out here, as well, though pretty much all of them are severely impacted.

Here's what if boils down to. She's been accepted into the Chem E programs at:
Cal Poly Pomona
Long Beach State
San Jose State

She's been wait-listed for Chem E at:
UC-Davis
UC-Irvine

She's been offered a spot in Pre-Chemistry at UC-Santa Barbara, and Bioengineering at UC-Merced.

Up until recently, she'd pretty much decided on Cal Poly Pomona, as their reputation for Engineering is top-notch, and they take a "Polytechnic approach", meaning it's very hands-on learning, and students are immersed in the actual engineering courses immediately. Their reputation is that their graduates with Bachelors are more "ready to work in the real world", rather than largely prepped to go for a masters or doctorate.

She had applied to SJSU almost as an after-thought, and because it was close to home and friends. But upon visiting the campus and meeting students, instructors, etc, she's now liking SJSU, mostly because she likes the campus and location.

My concerns are that they don't have the reputation CPP does (though it turns out the are ranked much higher than we knew for public schools), and don't seem to have as much support for internships and/or help getting jobs after graduation. The impression we get is that companies flock to CPP due in large part to their stellar reputation, but don't nearly as much as SJSU, a school that may be something of a "hidden treasure" for Chem E. The other thing I wonder about is quality of facilities. We haven't seen CPP yet, but are guessing their labs may be a notch above.

In any case, she has a hard choice coming up. We are scheduling a visit to CPP, and may go ahead and check out Long Beach State.

If anyone here has an informed opinion, we'd welcome the input. Does it really matter much where you get your degree when it comes to Chem E? Should the availability of internship opportunities play a huge role? Would appreciate input on these and any other items y'all deem worthy of consideration.

Thanks.

[Goat Holder]

My advice: All the schools are damn near the same and one degree is the same as the next 10 years after you graduate. I'd tell your daughter to visit all the schools and attend where she can get in, get the most scholarship money, and enjoy living there the most.

[Political Hack]

it's not about which college is the best performer, it's about where she'll perform the best and get the most of out it. Education and otherwise...

[SignalToNoise]

it's not about which college is the best performer, it's about where she'll perform the best and get the most of out it. Education and otherwise...

Hack nailed it.

Schools are like shoes in that some will fit you better than others. Take some visits and have her pick where she feels like she'll fit in, make friends, and excel.

[PassInterference]

it's not about which college is the best performer, it's about where she'll perform the best and get the most of out it. Education and otherwise...

I strongly agree with this. And take very seriously the "otherwise" notion.

I have known engineers from MIT that aren't worth shit. And I've known engineers from McNeese State who were outstanding.

It really is like sports and wanting to do well in the NFL one day. It is far, far more about the individual than the college.

That said, I'd certainly choose a good college over one that carries a little to zero notoriety. But time spent splitting hairs over which good college is better than other good colleges is time wasted.

I agree - find a place where she is comfortable, yet can be challenged.

[curmudgeon]

5-10 years after you graduate, it doesn't matter where you went to school. I know a guy that went to Cornell that rode that Cornell degree to a top level job five years after graduated, but they quickly figured out he was worthless and fired him. According to Facebook he's peddling an MLM product these days.

I, as well as most of you all are more successful than this guy with our po little mittippi tate degree.

[blacklistedbully]

These are all very valid points. That said, I have read articles from respected sources that make a strong case for "choice of college" mattering. One of them even said something about only 30-something of them really being "difference-makers".

We all know graduating from an Ivy-League school will give one a big leg-up in most cases, along with a much, much higher starting salary, and a fast-track to promotion if one then performs. Much is expected, but much is also invested.

And what about the value of establishing important contacts while at school? The higher end schools attract higher-end students, do they not? Those with established reputations are the ones where the seemingly most-talented or worthy students want to attend. Is it not also worthwhile to consider who her classmates might be, and the value that may pay off down the road?

[blacklistedbully]

And for any here that majored in degrees heavy in lab work, as Chem E would be, should the lab facilities be a major factor?

[PassInterference]

I didn't read any articles. But I did graduate from engineering school, have a good career, and observe some things for more than a couple decades.

[SignalToNoise]

And for any here that majored in degrees heavy in lab work, as Chem E would be, should the lab facilities be a major factor?

My degree is in EE which is very heavy in lab work, and for me lab facilities would be important

[dickiedawg]

It sounds like she's pretty set on staying out West. But I'll just mention that since you're an alum, I believe half out-of-state would be waived (all of it if her mother is an alum as well) and they are fairly quick to waive it for good students.

Again, I know a lot more goes into the decision than cost. But from what I understand MSU is rarely beat on price.

[blacklistedbully]

It sounds like she's pretty set on staying out West. But I'll just mention that since you're an alum, I believe half out-of-state would be waived (all of it if her mother is an alum as well) and they are fairly quick to waive it for good students.

Again, I know a lot more goes into the decision than cost. But from what I understand MSU is rarely beat on price.

My mom still lives in-state. Can that count as "in-state"?

[blacklistedbully]

Also, she's got a weighted GPA in excess of 4.0, has been a varsity athlete all 4 years, has participated in several volunteer activities, was MVP one year, Most Inspirational this year and is team captain of softball. But things are so messed up here in Cali that she got wait-listed at UC-Davis & UC-Irvine. Supposedly, due to a combination of "impacted majors" and the fact that Cali schools are increasingly favoring out-of-state students and their higher tuition fees to offset state budget cuts, a lot of native Californians are getting shut out of the more prominent, nationally-renowned, most-selective universities.

[hailmari]

And for any here that majored in degrees heavy in lab work, as Chem E would be, should the lab facilities be a major factor?

I wasn't a Chem E major but I had a lot of Chem labs (along with Bio and Physics) at State, and I'd say facilities would make a big difference. My Chem labs would've been much more enjoyable (and quicker) if ~25 people didn't have to share very limited resources within just a couple hours. It could get very tedious and aggravating for me at least, especially organic chem. My Bio labs were much better about having availability and getting you out without high blood pressure.

[EAVdog]

Also, she's got a weighted GPA in excess of 4.0, has been a varsity athlete all 4 years, has participated in several volunteer activities, was MVP one year, Most Inspirational this year and is team captain of softball. But things are so messed up here in Cali that she got wait-listed at UC-Davis & UC-Irvine. Supposedly, due to a combination of "impacted majors" and the fact that Cali schools are increasingly favoring out-of-state students and their higher tuition fees to offset state budget cuts, a lot of native Californians are getting shut out of the more prominent, nationally-renowned, most-selective universities.

I really doubt anywhere in Cali would be a better value than State. I know you want to stay closer, just saying. Sounds like she could get some good scholly opportunities at State.

As someone who is in that 10-15 yr range out of school I am amazed at some of my colleagues still struggling with heavy student loan debt (I have minimal compared to them). We're all doing the same job and getting the same salaries although some folks paid 200k for their education while mine was like 50k total.

My boys will be going to the best valued school for undergrad at least.

[camsu]

Also live in NoCalif. My son visited all and had Acd scholarship offers from several and I ref sports at most of those schools. He ended up attending MSU and had a great experience. We go back for one FB per yr and we fly our State flag at our homes.

- CaPoly P - make sure your daughter feels safe in the area. School might be excellent but daughter needs to feel safe.
UC Irvine - area is just huge, just huge
San Jose S - most of kids drive in from the area, so different type of college atmosphere
Long Beach State - know the least but I would assume a lot like SJS

UC Davis: School has really improved it infrastructure and now can handle the volume of students. Wonderful school, a lot like MSU and always met with great kids. I am on campus 2/4 times per year and my favorite campus and kids.

[dickiedawg]

My mom still lives in-state. Can that count as "in-state"?

I'm no expert but I'm pretty sure not. With those credentials, though, I wouldn't think she'd have much trouble getting that waived. (Again, I don't speak for the University- just speaking based on anecdotal information that lots of out of state folks I went to school with paid in-state tuition and paid less than they would in their home state.)
Did she do well on ACT/SAT?

[sandjunky]

Be sure to check out Co-op office and opportunities for co-oping while in school. My youngest brother is graduating from state with a Chem E degree in May. While he had the Swalm scholarship, it didn't pay full tuition...

Needless to say, he co-oped. He will graduate debt free and 8-10K in the bank to start off with. Our parents didn't pay for our schooling either.

[jimbo352]

Yes, I know we have a great program, and I'm a proud Bulldog alum. But we live in California and my eldest daughter would like to stay in Cali, taking advantage if in-state tuition, etc. There are several great programs out here, as well, though pretty much all of them are severely impacted.

Here's what if boils down to. She's been accepted into the Chem E programs at:
Cal Poly Pomona
Long Beach State
San Jose State

She's been wait-listed for Chem E at:
UC-Davis
UC-Irvine

She's been offered a spot in Pre-Chemistry at UC-Santa Barbara, and Bioengineering at UC-Merced.

Up until recently, she'd pretty much decided on Cal Poly Pomona, as their reputation for Engineering is top-notch, and they take a "Polytechnic approach", meaning it's very hands-on learning, and students are immersed in the actual engineering courses immediately. Their reputation is that their graduates with Bachelors are more "ready to work in the real world", rather than largely prepped to go for a masters or doctorate.

She had applied to SJSU almost as an after-thought, and because it was close to home and friends. But upon visiting the campus and meeting students, instructors, etc, she's now liking SJSU, mostly because she likes the campus and location.

My concerns are that they don't have the reputation CPP does (though it turns out the are ranked much higher than we knew for public schools), and don't seem to have as much support for internships and/or help getting jobs after graduation. The impression we get is that companies flock to CPP due in large part to their stellar reputation, but don't nearly as much as SJSU, a school that may be something of a "hidden treasure" for Chem E. The other thing I wonder about is quality of facilities. We haven't seen CPP yet, but are guessing their labs may be a notch above.

In any case, she has a hard choice coming up. We are scheduling a visit to CPP, and may go ahead and check out Long Beach State.

If anyone here has an informed opinion, we'd welcome the input. Does it really matter much where you get your degree when it comes to Chem E? Should the availability of internship opportunities play a huge role? Would appreciate input on these and any other items y'all deem worthy of consideration.

Thanks.

UC Santa Barbara was my dream school. Tried like hell for an athletic scholarship, and just about everything else one could apply for. Nothing ever came. Well, at least not enough to make a big difference.

I loved it there when i visited.

[camsu]

UC Santa Barbara - yes favorite campus for just enjoying. Great beaches, more bikes than students, I swear. Was there in Feb for a tourn and it was wonderful. As the girls from UoW said we never see this much sun we are staying over to hit the beach for an extra day. School who knows but the campus right on the water what can you say. Of course, they just had the drunken gathering in town - you don't have to go to MX for spring break saves money

[blacklistedbully]

I'm no expert but I'm pretty sure not. With those credentials, though, I wouldn't think she'd have much trouble getting that waived. (Again, I don't speak for the University- just speaking based on anecdotal information that lots of out of state folks I went to school with paid in-state tuition and paid less than they would in their home state.)
Did she do well on ACT/SAT?


Pretty good. She has ADHD, but took the test without any accommodation, just like everyone else, In retrospect we should have asked, as she wasn't able to get to all the questions.

SAT:
CR 610
Math 590
Writing 690

ACT:
English 25
Math 26
Reading 24
Science 24

[SkinnyDawg]

I can't give an opinion on any of the schools, but I can say I would strongly advise her to do internships/co-ops. I graduate in May from Mechanical Engineering and all of my buddies that did an internship have a full time job locked down before graduation. On the other hand, most of the people I know who did not intern are having a very hard time finding a full time job - even with GPAs in the high 3s. Employers are putting A LOT of stock into internships/co-ops

[Fred Garvin]

Cal Poly Pomona or UC Davis. Really have not met anybody from the Cal State schools that have impressed me.

[blacklistedbully]

Cal Poly Pomona or UC Davis. Really have not met anybody from the Cal State schools that have impressed me.

The Cal Polys are actually part of the Cal State system, but are different. Most in Cali consider them equivalent to mid-upper UCs like UC-Davis, UC-Irvine, UCSB, but with a polytechnic approach. Polytechnic seems to be an especially good fit for engineering.

[dawgoneyall]

Lets just be clear. Nothing there is better than MSU especially in CEing.

Just depend on the level she is willing to accept.

[PassInterference]

+1 for co-op/internship. A job could be locked up. Or a company not to work for could be identified. And a little work experience is obtained.

[rcsteph1]

My mom still lives in-state. Can that count as "in-state"?

All you have to do is list that as her address and they will mail her school things there and yes she could be considered in-state. I have done that for three colleges in MS and one in AL. It's more of a don't offer up more info than needed