Rick Ray down in Florida recruiting today.

[Intramural All-American]

He's recruiting at the IMG academy. Anyone have any idea who he's looking at?

[Dawg61]

Probably Oliver Black since he plays for them. Checking in on him I guess. Hope he adds 2 more shooters while he's there too.

[Intramural All-American]

Ah I didn't realize he was there. Scout shows him as being at Wingfield.

[msstate7]

Little hijack here...

I've heard how bad RR's recruiting has been, but I checked it out a little myself.

Oliver black offers include oklahoma, OM, Tulane, and Wichita st.

Maurice Dunlap has an OM offer and also LA tech.

Demetrius Houston has offers from Alabama, auburn, and seton hall.

Fallou ndoye had offers from Nevada, USCw, and Virginia tech.

While none of these are game changers, they are solid players. When you consider we're getting a walk on the quality of elijah staley and Travis Daniels is already performing well in practice, I think we're (myself included) being too tough on RR. Next year's team will be much more talented and deep than this year's team.

[Dawg61]

Ah I didn't realize he was there. Scout shows him as being at Wingfield.

Basketball recruiting websites are a joke. He transferred.
http://www.imgacademy.com/latest-headlines/2013-11-14/four-img-academy-basketball-student-athletes-put-pen-paper-national

[WeWonItAll(Most)]

Little hijack here...

I've heard how bad RR's recruiting has been, but I checked it out a little myself.

Oliver black offers include oklahoma, OM, Tulane, and Wichita st.

Maurice Dunlap has an OM offer and also LA tech.

Demetrius Houston has offers from Alabama, auburn, and seton hall.

Fallou ndoye had offers from Nevada, USCw, and Virginia tech.

While none of these are game changers, they are solid players. When you consider we're getting a walk on the quality of elijah staley and Travis Daniels is already performing well in practice, I think we're (myself included) being too tough on RR. Next year's team will be much more talented and deep than this year's team.

Shhhhh. They all suck.

[Dawg61]

Zero shooters outside of the rookie Dunlap and we still aren't using our 13th scholarship. Why? We will have 4 rookies playing next year so basically we are already down to 8 guys that have played college basketball before with 3 of those being Davis, Bloodman and Thomas. Are we just assuming we'll have zero turnover? Like that's happened. Ever. Plus we are always good for an injury or four right?

[msstate7]

Zero shooters outside of the rookie Dunlap and we still aren't using our 13th scholarship. Why? We will have 4 rookies playing next year so basically we are already down to 8 guys that have played college basketball before with 3 of those being Davis, Bloodman and Thomas. Are we just assuming we'll have zero turnover? Like that's happened. Ever. Plus we are always good for an injury or four right?

Unless there's some good shooters still out there, I'd rather actively recruit a transfer (known commodity) or two if someone on scholarship leaves

[Dawg61]

Unless there's some good shooters still out there, I'd rather actively recruit a transfer (known commodity) or two if someone on scholarship leaves

Works for me as long as they can play right away.

[Coach34]

We didnt have any turnover last year that I remember after the season

[C222]

I believe Dante Scott is at IMG as well.

[smootness]

I believe Dante Scott is at IMG as well.

He is, and I believe he could end up being a steal. Seems like he has Craig Sword-type athleticism with better size, a much better outside shot, and a higher basketball IQ.

[Corey♥DemDawgs]

IJ Ready & Jacoby Davis have shown flashes of being legit shooters, more game experience for both will benefit us soon.

[starkvegasdawg]

He heard they have a 5'6" shooting guard he wants to look at.***

[HailState39110]

Ray just tweeted this: @rickray1
I just saw our future Bulldog, Oliver Black, play down at IMG. LOVED what I saw, a long, athletic big that chases rebounds and affects shots

Isn't this a violation? I didn't think you could mention recruits by name until after you received an LOI?

[Intramural All-American]

He has already signed in November.

[HailState39110]

I figured that must be the case. Wasn't trying to be Bracky just was curious

[Dawg61]

We didnt have any turnover last year that I remember after the season

Not from April-July but I include Steele, Lewis and Applewhite in the turnover category

[Coach34]

Not from April-July but I include Steele, Lewis and Applewhite in the turnover category

Well, once school starts, we SOL on turnover- you can't plan for that

[Dawg61]

Well, once school starts, we SOL on turnover- you can't plan for that

I disagree. You force it. Hopefully not every year but I'd say this is a year you need to. Ray can't just hope it doesn't happen. He can not afford to not have a full 13 man roster next year. Be proactive not reactive.

[engie]

I disagree. You force it. Hopefully not every year but I'd say this is a year you need to. Ray can't just hope it doesn't happen. He can not afford to not have a full 13 man roster next year. Be proactive not reactive.

For goodness sake -- EVERYONE knows what "you say" at this point. And you can't HONESTLY try to frigging tell us that we "should know" that 3 players are going to leave after school starts.

You don't force turnover right now. That's a death knell to a program you are trying to rebuild to a different standard. But we know what dead horse you are going to beat on this -- so go ahead and do it.

[Dawg61]

For goodness sake -- EVERYONE knows what "you say" at this point. And you can't HONESTLY try to frigging tell us that we "should know" that 3 players are going to leave after school starts.

You don't force turnover right now. That's a death knell to a program you are trying to rebuild to a different standard. But we know what dead horse you are going to beat on this -- so go ahead and do it.

I will Engie. It's what I honestly think is best for our team. I'm sorry we don't agree on this but we just don't. I respect your stance and it doesn't upset me one bit. And you really have no room to be talking about beating dead horses. You're like the Kentucky Derby of beating dead horses. Only Will James on bunting and C34 on Stansbury have you topped. On what you might ask? Everything.

[smootness]

I disagree. You force it. Hopefully not every year but I'd say this is a year you need to. Ray can't just hope it doesn't happen. He can not afford to not have a full 13 man roster next year. Be proactive not reactive.

Geez. So now we're expecting Ray to tell the future, determine who will force themselves off the team ahead of time, and force them off first?

You have to see, at least on this point, that what you're asking is absurd. You're telling Ray to be proactive on who to kick off the team...meaning BEFORE they even do what it is that becomes the reason for kicking them off?

The only way to ensure a full 13 scholarships would be to kick everyone off and sign 13 guys for next year. We don't need 13 anyway. We need about 10-11.

[Dawg61]

Geez. So now we're expecting Ray to tell the future, determine who will force themselves off the team ahead of time, and force them off first?

You have to see, at least on this point, that what you're asking is absurd. You're telling Ray to be proactive on who to kick off the team...meaning BEFORE they even do what it is that becomes the reason for kicking them off?

The only way to ensure a full 13 scholarships would be to kick everyone off and sign 13 guys for next year. We don't need 13 anyway. We need about 10-11.

Kentucky signed eight guys last year. That was more than they could fit if everyone returned for the next season. They FORCED turnover.

[chef dixon]

Oliver Black has to be able to step in contribute defensively and on the boards next year. We can't be this thin in the post for 3 straight seasons. The 3 man rotation with Ware, Ndoye, and Black should help us tremendously rebounding and keeping Ware out of foul trouble. I'm pretty sure Ware goes to the bench for the last 10 minutes of the first half in 75% of our games. As far as post play goes, I think Ray is headed in the right direction. Ball handling and point guard play, I like what we will have in Bloodman, Ready, and even Davis next season. The Bloodman hate has got to stop, he's going to be an excellent player next season. We rarely had this many guys who can handle the ball with Stansbury, but on the flip side, we never shot as poorly as we do now. Which brings me to where I think Ray is not headed in the right direction, and that's bringing in players who can stroke it. I'm riding the Dunlap train until it crashes, which could be as soon as this November.

[smootness]

Kentucky signed eight guys last year. That was more than they could fit if everyone returned for the next season. They FORCED turnover.

No, they are an NBA Draft factory. Which means a) they know guys will leave; and b) they have studs to fill those spots. If Ray could go get 6 of the top 12 players in the country, he may make some room.

What you're advocating screams of, 'I'm an illogical fan who thinks everything can be treated like a video game without any repercussions'. 1) there aren't a bunch of stud shooters waiting for someone to offer them a scholarship; 2) Ray has no way of knowing what could happen in the offseason to precipitate guys leaving the team; and 3) if he were to treat the roster the way you suggest, it would irreparably damage our program.

Yes, Recruit's mother, I promise to take care of your son. And yes, Recruit, we are a stable, winning program. Please ignore the massive unexplainable turnover inside our program while losing on top of that. I cut them after telling their parents the same thing because, after all, scholarships are renewed every year!

I bet team chemistry would be off the charts once we treated it like a professional basketball factory.

[Brad Stevens]

I will not hate on Bloodman (like I have privately and with friends in the past), but his ceiling is much lower than Davis or Ready. I am very thankful he gives us his all and maximizes his potential. He just doesn't have the quickness (physically or mentally) that IJ shows, but he will most definitely be an asset to have experience-wise next year. But let's not get ahead of ourselves and say he will be excellent. A good coach (on an opposing team) can completely limit his effectiveness in the half court game pretty easily. He excels most in open court, taking the ball to the basket and getting fouled situations. He just doesn't have the quickness or athleticism to truly ever "excel" in the half court game. However, I hope he proves me wrong next year.

[Coach34]

Bloodman is back-up PG that should get 14 mins/game. Ready will take over next year and play about 25 mins/game. And we'll be solid there

[chef dixon]

I will not hate on Bloodman (like I have privately and with friends in the past), but his ceiling is much lower than Davis or Ready. I am very thankful he gives us his all and maximizes his potential. He just doesn't have the quickness (physically or mentally) that IJ shows, but he will most definitely be an asset to have experience-wise next year. But let's not get ahead of ourselves and say he will be excellent. A good coach (on an opposing team) can completely limit his effectiveness in the half court game pretty easily. He excels most in open court, taking the ball to the basket and getting fouled situations. He just doesn't have the quickness or athleticism to truly ever "excel" in the half court game. However, I hope he proves me wrong next year.

Excellent is the wrong word, but he's the smartest guy we've got currently. I feel a lot more confident that a good decision will be made when he has the ball. No doubt Davis and specifically Ready, have a higher ceiling.

[Dawg61]

It's going to be the death of our program and of Rick Ray as the MSU HC if we continue to keep division 2 and SWAC players on our roster. We are in the SEC. That ain't changing. Ray MUST get shooters. I'd settle for Ray getting help by hiring a shooting coach/assistant but he hasn't done that. Are we just going to hope Davis, Bloodman, Sword and Thomas magically teach themselves how to shoot a basketball?

[Coach34]

We have shooting coaches- they are Ray and his assistants...no damn college programs are hiring "shooting coaches"

We will be a better team next year when we have a full squad and more experience

[engie]

I will Engie. It's what I honestly think is best for our team. I'm sorry we don't agree on this but we just don't. I respect your stance and it doesn't upset me one bit. And you really have no room to be talking about beating dead horses. You're like the Kentucky Derby of beating dead horses. Only Will James on bunting and C34 on Stansbury have you topped. On what you might ask? Everything.

Go ahead and point me to the dead horses that I'm beating -- and interjecting in every single thread on a given topic.

Even the Mullen deal -- I wasn't bringing it up until I was called out -- and I NEVER ONCE started threads basically to talk shit -- as you've done multiple times this week and CONSTANTLY every time we lose a game. So, the one example you could POSSIBLY have is bullshit in and of itself. But keep up the good work -- every time you talk about basketball it's essentially "opening your mouth and removing the doubt" from what everyone already knows about you on this topic. Hence why you don't have a SINGLE supporter of your position. You don't find that strange?

You are Shamoan on Collins -- and Patdog on Cohen at this point. You are the only one seeing something that literally no one else is seeing.

[Brad Stevens]

Do we really have to get in this again? You say the same things over and over. Number one: yes, we are in the SEC. No, it is (unfortunately) not one of the most desired conferences to play in for recruits. We just aren't that good on a national level. It's a fact. The prestige the SEC has for nationwide recruits in football just doesn't exist in basketball. Not at this point in time anyway. Number two: shooting is much more complex than just hiring a coach and POOF!!! All our players now have JJ Redick form. Sadly (again), if a kid isn't trained to shoot with proper mechanics from junior high on up, it is not really worth changing once he gets to college. People with bad-looking shots can become decent shooters. They just need to spend time in the gym working on it. Again, your insertion of "MUST" in all caps implies you know the answer as fact, and all naysayers are wrong. If you implied this as a humble opinion, I would not respond so strongly. Endure the trials this season and be patient. It is possible that in due time (whether next year or the next), that we actually could reap from the hard work that is currently being sown.

[engie]

No, they are an NBA Draft factory. Which means a) they know guys will leave; and b) they have studs to fill those spots. If Ray could go get 6 of the top 12 players in the country, he may make some room.

What you're advocating screams of, 'I'm an illogical fan who thinks everything can be treated like a video game without any repercussions'. 1) there aren't a bunch of stud shooters waiting for someone to offer them a scholarship; 2) Ray has no way of knowing what could happen in the offseason to precipitate guys leaving the team; and 3) if he were to treat the roster the way you suggest, it would irreparably damage our program.

Yes, Recruit's mother, I promise to take care of your son. And yes, Recruit, we are a stable, winning program. Please ignore the massive unexplainable turnover inside our program while losing on top of that. I cut them after telling their parents the same thing because, after all, scholarships are renewed every year!

I bet team chemistry would be off the charts once we treated it like a professional basketball factory.

It's amazingly how easy this is to see for the vast majority of us -- while it's completely lost on the other few. This is stated perfectly and is my viewpoint exactly.

[Coach34]

I'll do this aGAIN:

PG- Ready is going to play point next year and be backed up by Bloodman...they will be solid and Ready should be better all the way around as a Soph

SG- Sword, Davis, and maybe Dunlap...Sword is solid but has to develop a more consistent jump shot- like Jamont did. Davis is shooting 32..5% from 3 now as well as 80% from the FT. He is Freshman, he will be better. We'll see on Dunlap

SF- FTF will be improved. He is a good defender but has to get more consistent with 3-ball. He has raised his percentage almost 7 points over last year. That's encouraging. Houston is coming in to try and win this spot. People call him Ray's best signee to date.

PF- Daniels had better numbers than Pollard in juco. He is getting a year to redshirt and get even better. He would have made us a better basketball team had we had him this year. Roq Johnson is solid but a loose cannon. Ndoye would have played this year also and helped- but gets to redshirt. He will be a solid back-up for us in the paint.

C- Ware's numbers are improved. He still needs more work and he will. He should be solid next year. Black is someone that could possibly give us some minutes also inside.

Then add Elijah Staley coming on after the bowl game and he should help by late January.

I cant wait for next year

[Dawg61]

Dead horse 1. Ray and Cohen. Dumbest shit ever.
Dead horse 2. Baseball sight lines.
Dead horses 3-999 I don't read because you're blowing some gasket and copying and pasteurbating all over the page with Engie Statistics.

[Dawg61]

We have shooting coaches- they are Ray and his assistants

We have a BINGO. That's the problem. Nobody on this team can shoot and nobody on this team can teach them how to shoot better. And now for the finale. We aren't bringing in shooters to help this team out. Yet somehow you guys think that magically because we will have 12 basketball players instead of 8 we will suddenly become a good shooting team. I offer solutions. Y'all shoot them down. You offer zero solutions and expect the results to change. What's the definition of insanity again?

[smootness]

I don't think anyone claimed we would become a good shooting team next year. But 'hiring a shooting coach' is not a legitimate solution. The only solution is to recruit more shooters, and we're doing that. We also need help down low, and I think that is a bigger problem than our shooting problem - so bringing in a class full of shooters only hurts our post problem even more.

Dunlap is a shooter; Davis and Ready are shooters. Daniels can apparently knock down jump shots. And Thomas has the capability, just needs to get his confidence back.

So we are bringing in shooters, and the problem should gradually ease over the next few years.

[engie]

Dead horse 1. Ray and Cohen. Dumbest shit ever.
The fact that you still don't "get it" after it's been spelled out for you countless times speaks VOLUMES to the stupidity and hardheadedness of your approach. Literally everyone other than the "Ray sux -- fire him now!!1!1" crowd understands the analogy EXACTLY -- because it's a good one. That's why countless people agree with the analogy -- while you and TCdog and a handful of Ray haters are the only ones bitching about it.


Dead horse 2. Baseball sight lines.
Yet Scott Stricklin is doing EXACTLY what I WANTED -- when he spoke in many interviews about simply removing bleachers and doing a very mild renovation as recently as April of last year. What changed?


Dead horses 3-999 I don't read because you're blowing some gasket and copying and pasteurbating all over the page with Engie Statistics.
Ah -- gotta hate those statistics that always seem to support my arguments** Works out much better when you ignore what they actually tell you and continue talking out of your ass**

[tcdog70]

Bloodman is back-up PG that should get 14 mins/game. Ready will take over next year and play about 25 mins/game. And we'll be solid there

Bloodman has really improved. I think you are correct and they will be solid on offense. But defensively they will be sub-par. They can't stop dribble penetration and it is way to easy to shoot over them and post them up. Every really good point guard will have a field day with those two guarding them, especially in the half-court. Would like to see us sign a 6'3" or bigger point that can defend. And do the threes Ds on offense. Dribble, Drive and Dish.

[Dawg61]

You said show you dead horses. I did. You trying to add value to Rick Ray by using John Cohen's NC appearance is pathetic. Our basketball program sucks assholes and you Engie are helping it to suck.

[Dawg61]

Do we really have to get in this again? You say the same things over and over. Number one: yes, we are in the SEC. No, it is (unfortunately) not one of the most desired conferences to play in for recruits. We just aren't that good on a national level. It's a fact. The prestige the SEC has for nationwide recruits in football just doesn't exist in basketball. Not at this point in time anyway. Number two: shooting is much more complex than just hiring a coach and POOF!!! All our players now have JJ Redick form. Sadly (again), if a kid isn't trained to shoot with proper mechanics from junior high on up, it is not really worth changing once he gets to college. People with bad-looking shots can become decent shooters. They just need to spend time in the gym working on it. Again, your insertion of "MUST" in all caps implies you know the answer as fact, and all naysayers are wrong. If you implied this as a humble opinion, I would not respond so strongly. Endure the trials this season and be patient. It is possible that in due time (whether next year or the next), that we actually could reap from the hard work that is currently being sown.

You seem defeated towards recruiting players from the Southeast. If Ray would ease his stance of not recruiting AAU players it wouldn't be that difficult to find quality players in the South. Just cause you recruit AAU players and sign them doesn't mean you're not playing by the rules. He can keep his moral high ground stance and still sign AAU players. Is he on a two man mission with Scott Stricklin vs the rest of the college basketball and AAU? Good luck with that.

[Brad Stevens]

You seem defeated towards recruiting players from the Southeast. If Ray would ease his stance of not recruiting AAU players it wouldn't be that difficult to find quality players in the South. Just cause you recruit AAU players and sign them doesn't mean you're not playing by the rules. He can keep his moral high ground stance and still sign AAU players. Is he on a two man mission with Scott Stricklin vs the rest of the college basketball and AAU? Good luck with that.

I will try to be clearer. Your definition of a quality player is an athlete that plays AAU. From all you've implied, if he is tall and can do a windmill dunk, he is a "quality player." My definition of a quality player is a guy who may be slightly smaller in size but knows the game of basketball, is a student of the game, has a chip on his shoulder, and out-works his more athletic counterparts.

Both athleticism and hard work ethic combined with fundamentals is rare in the southeast. You can find those players in other parts of the country, except they usually would rather play in better conferences (and rightfully so). Thus the dilemma -- of players that DESIRE to play in the SEC, we have slim pickings. Kentucky can succeed with the out-athletic-you players. We cannot. Simple.

[Dawg61]

I will try to be clearer. Your definition of a quality player is an athlete that plays AAU. From all you've implied, if he is tall and can do a windmill dunk, he is a "quality player." My definition of a quality player is a guy who may be slightly smaller in size but knows the game of basketball, is a student of the game, has a chip on his shoulder, and out-works his more athletic counterparts.

Both athleticism and hard work ethic combined with fundamentals is rare in the southeast. You can find those players in other parts of the country, except they usually would rather play in better conferences (and rightfully so). Thus the dilemma -- of players that DESIRE to play in the SEC, we have slim pickings. Kentucky can succeed with the out-athletic-you players. We cannot. Simple.

I'm not in love with AAU the players are. The big majority of players skilled enough to play college basketball play AAU basketball. It is what it is. They don't have enough time with each other to develop structured disciplined organized basketball. Thus the best athletes shine brightest in this scenario. I'm not saying we should rely on AAU alone for the players we sign. I am saying we should not eliminate players from recruiting if they play AAU basketball. They still play for their high school teams. It's basically just freestyle basketball with uniforms. They are playing against a better collection of players on one team than they'll see almost the entire season in high school. Connections are made when you recruit AAU. You are able to go watch the top 50-100 players in one area of the country all in one setting at the same time. That's hours and days of travel and homework saved by just attending the AAU events and taking notes. Have MSU representation at these events. Let the players see MSU Maroon&White in the stands watching. They will notice.

Again I'm not saying strictly rely on AAU but to include it as a recruiting avenue. Along with high school, Juco, transfers, smaller college bball and foreign players. Add all that up and you're getting into the thousands of basketball players per year that MSU can choose to recruit. How the **** can you not find and sign four basketball players per year out of 5,000 candidates? I wouldn't only sign those "glue" type players you like so much either. I'd blend great athletes amongst them so they can do what they are best at. Gluing or jellying that chemistry together. Athletic or glue but either way they need to be able to shoot the basketball. Shooters please.

[Brad Stevens]

I don't know where you get these random numbers from. You really don't think anyone on our team was in the top 5000 when they came out of high school? And you do realize that the guys who play AAU also play high school ball, too, right? I can't say for certain, but I bet most of our players played for some AAU team growing up. We just didn't play the dirty AAU-game which is really just a glorified prostitution ring where the kid gets sold to the highest bidder for college. And I'm okay with us not playing that game.

If you're watching the UNC v FSU game now, watch Leslie McDonald for UNC. I played against him in high school. He hung about 30 on my team when he was a freshman in high school. One reason why I like him a lot, and that he is successful, is that he has the athletic ability but also has the fundamentals. They don't HAVE to be mutually exclusive. But when you get a kid from the southeast (Memphis) with both extreme athleticism and fundamentals, he goes to UNC over MSU or Ole Miss ten times out of ten, and that's just how it is.

[Goat from MSU]

Brad who did you play for in High School ,McDonald either played for St.George or Briercrest not sure.Just think I thought you were a big of wind .You do know something about the old round ball then.
I don't know where you get these random numbers from. You really don't think anyone on our team was in the top 5000 when they came out of high school? And you do realize that the guys who play AAU also play high school ball, too, right? I can't say for certain, but I bet most of our players played for some AAU team growing up. We just didn't play the dirty AAU-game which is really just a glorified prostitution ring where the kid gets sold to the highest bidder for college. And I'm okay with us not playing that game.

If you're watching the UNC v FSU game now, watch Leslie McDonald for UNC. I played against him in high school. He hung about 30 on my team when he was a freshman in high school. One reason why I like him a lot, and that he is successful, is that he has the athletic ability but also has the fundamentals. They don't HAVE to be mutually exclusive. But when you get a kid from the southeast (Memphis) with both extreme athleticism and fundamentals, he goes to UNC over MSU or Ole Miss ten times out of ten, and that's just how it is.

[Dawg61]

5,000 is just the number I threw out for the pool of players. As in the total amount of players available for colleges to recruit from. Every single player on MSU scholarship would be in that 5,000. That's the total of players. I have no clue what that total number is. Nobody does. It's just used for discussion purposes.

I will watch him now that you pointed him out. Thanks.

[Brad Stevens]

Haha I won't reveal who I played for. McDonald played at Briarcrest. I was a junior when we played him when he was a freshman. They also had another player named Gregg Wooten who went on to play D-1 ball at Samford. Greg Hardy was a senior (I think) that year with Briarcrest too. They were a tough matchup for us.

[Intramural All-American]

I can vouch for Brad, here. He knows more about the game of basketball than 95% of the people posting on this board.

[Dawg61]

I can vouch for Brad, here. He knows more about the game of basketball than 95% of the people posting on this board.

Haha Brad I think you've found a keeper here. She knows her sports and she's got your back.

[Intramural All-American]

Haha Brad I think you've found a keeper here. She knows her sports and she's got your back.

Don't worry 61, you are obviously in the 5%.

[smootness]

Ray recruits AAU players. What are you talking about?

[Goat from MSU]

Haha I won't reveal who I played for. McDonald played at Briarcrest. I was a junior when we played him when he was a freshman. They also had another player named Gregg Wooten who went on to play D-1 ball at Samford. Greg Hardy was a senior (I think) that year with Briarcrest too. They were a tough matchup for us.

i lived in Memphis ,Did you play FACS I might have seen you played then. I saw McDonald back then when FACS played them.

[Dawg61]

Ray recruits AAU players. What are you talking about?

Good. Let's keep it that way.

[RougeDawg]

Bloodman is back-up PG that should get 14 mins/game. Ready will take over next year and play about 25 mins/game. And we'll be solid there

Question that has been in my mind since the previous regime. Why in God's name can't these kids play 32-36+ minutes anymore these days? Even in the NBA players don't play the minutes they used to play. Have the players gotten that soft? Seems like we used to have guys that rarely came out of games, usually right before a timeout, to maximize their rest, and then right back in the damn game. What has changed, besides the pussification of America?

[Dawg61]

Here's the wtf shocker of the day. Fred Thomas leads the team in minutes played by 24 total and by over 2 minutes per game at 30min per game over every other player. Wtf. That's terrible.

[esplanade91]

I don't know where you get these random numbers from. You really don't think anyone on our team was in the top 5000 when they came out of high school? And you do realize that the guys who play AAU also play high school ball, too, right? I can't say for certain, but I bet most of our players played for some AAU team growing up. We just didn't play the dirty AAU-game which is really just a glorified prostitution ring where the kid gets sold to the highest bidder for college. And I'm okay with us not playing that game.

If you're watching the UNC v FSU game now, watch Leslie McDonald for UNC. I played against him in high school. He hung about 30 on my team when he was a freshman in high school. One reason why I like him a lot, and that he is successful, is that he has the athletic ability but also has the fundamentals. They don't HAVE to be mutually exclusive. But when you get a kid from the southeast (Memphis) with both extreme athleticism and fundamentals, he goes to UNC over MSU or Ole Miss ten times out of ten, and that's just how it is.

I'm not okay with not playing the AAU game. I'm not advocating whatever the hell 61 is talking about, I do think our players' talent is beneath where it has been in just about forever, but until the NCAA fixes the glorified prostitution ring we need to be involved in it. Are we so high and mighty? Is the general public (the general public that also has no idea who MSU is) going to frown upon ole Mississippi State and think we're a bunch of dirty ass fans because we somehow smuggle shoe money to high schoolers? Until we get a coach like K or Self whose very name brings players to MSU or the NCAA fixes the AAU culture, which ever comes first, we need to be doing it.

And I'm also implying that we need to let good kids like Steele have some leeway. Guy was a solid student and gave 110%, yet he wants to redshirt for 2 reasons (1 being a good one) and we tell him to kick rocks.

There's got to be somewhere in the middle between what ever the hell we're doing now and what Stans got himself into at the end. This team is horrible, and pardon my thinking that this roster won't be better given an offseason after an offseason just made this team just as mediocre.

[mic]

Here's the wtf shocker of the day. Fred Thomas leads the team in minutes played by 24 total and by over 2 minutes per game at 30min per game over every other player. Wtf. That's terrible.

Why is that a shock.?? who should lead in minutes played.?? Maybe it because Fred guards well and stays out of foul trouble. Lots of factors go into minutes played.. 2 quick fouls in the first half and you are riding pine till the 2nd. And I doubt very many 4's and 5's lead their respective teams in minutes played.. IJ is a freshman who has had some injury issues. Plus Bloodman has played very well for us this year..

[Dawg61]

I'll say this about Steele. I didn't want him to take up a scholarship for next year because I was under the assumption we had plans of using all 13 scholarships on other players. As of right now we still have an open scholarship so it looks pretty stupid to deny Steele his redshirt when he would for sure be by far our best 3point shooter. Stupid.

[Dawg61]

Why is that a shock.?? who should lead in minutes played.?? Maybe it because Fred guards well and stays out of foul trouble. Lots of factors go into minutes played.. 2 quick fouls in the first half and you are riding pine till the 2nd. And I doubt very many 4's and 5's lead their respective teams in minutes played.. IJ is a freshman who has had some injury issues. Plus Bloodman has played very well for us this year..

It's a shock because he constantly makes horrible decisions on offense. You'd think Ray would pull him some for a little coaching time in his ear every once in awhile thus reflecting on his minutes played. By the looks of it Flat Shot hasn't been pulled often if at all for his bad decision making.

[mic]

It's a shock because he constantly makes horrible decisions on offense. You'd think Ray would pull him some for a little coaching time in his ear every once in awhile thus reflecting on his minutes played. By the looks of it Flat Shot hasn't been pulled often if at all for his bad decision making.

That's the problem.. We don't have the bench to pull kids when they make mistakes for coaching reasons.. Other teams do.. And its all not about scoring.. Fred is on of our better defenders. has the size, speed and length to guard the 2 and the 3. Im sure he has had to even guard the 4 at times.

[esplanade91]

Why is that a shock.?? who should lead in minutes played.?? Maybe it because Fred guards well and stays out of foul trouble. Lots of factors go into minutes played.. 2 quick fouls in the first half and you are riding pine till the 2nd. And I doubt very many 4's and 5's lead their respective teams in minutes played.. IJ is a freshman who has had some injury issues. Plus Bloodman has played very well for us this year..
Not Fred Thomas.

I'd rather Sword play with 2 fouls at the end of the first half and foul out with 2 minutes to play in the 2nd and us be winning or it be close than us get blown out before the 1st is over and have Sword able to go in the final minutes.

Hell, I'd be ok with Roq getting the most minutes. He might not be as good on D but he doesn't make stupid ass fouls with .00000001 seconds left in the half and his offense doesn't cost us 0-18 runs.

[Dawg61]

That's the problem.. We don't have the bench to pull kids when they make mistakes for coaching reasons.. Other teams do.. And its all not about scoring.. Fred is on of our better defenders. has the size, speed and length to guard the 2 and the 3. Im sure he has had to even guard the 4 at times.

This is false. We have 11 basketball players not eight. Maybe just ten now that it sounds like Ray ran off Alabama's Mr. Basketball. We have plenty of bench to be able to pull a player after bad decision making.

[smootness]

Maybe just ten now that it sounds like Ray ran off Alabama's Mr. Basketball.

I thought for a while you were trying to evaluate honestly but were just quick to see the negative. Now it seems you're just another guy that will try to use anything and everything to bash our coach.

[MadDawg]

I thought for a while you were trying to evaluate honestly but were just quick to see the negative. Now it seems you're just another guy that will try to use anything and everything to bash our coach.

So he's coach34 in training?

[mic]

I thought for a while you were trying to evaluate honestly but were just quick to see the negative. Now it seems you're just another guy that will try to use anything and everything to bash our coach.

I am not sure what's worse.. A post about FT leading our team in minutes played, or me actually trying to explain why that may be..

[dickiedawg]

I cant wait for next year

Gosh I wish I shared this sentiment re: our basketball team. You are far more optimistic than I am.

[Dawg61]

I thought for a while you were trying to evaluate honestly but were just quick to see the negative. Now it seems you're just another guy that will try to use anything and everything to bash our coach.

I just call it like I see it. I give Ray credit for there being no suspension this year and for using the S&C program. But as far as only playing eight guys when you've got eleven/ten should get discussed as well.

[Brad Stevens]

Easy explanation - you play ten or eleven players if they are capable of running the offense and defense and/or if they are decent players. So, in Ray's eyes, the guys we don't play either simply aren't good players or they don't know the system well enough.

How many college or high school teams do you watch who have a full bench, but still only play 8-10 guys? Lots of them.

[Coach34]

The threads that never ends

[TheRef]

The threads that never ends

This is the thread that never ends.
It goes on and on my friends.
Some people started posting it, not knowing where it'd go.
And they'll continue posting in it forever just because.
(repeat for infinity)

[engie]

How many college or high school teams do you watch who have a full bench, but still only play 8-10 guys? Lots of them.

The key to me is the flexibility to go beyond that if/when you NEED to. Ray doesn't have that. So, when players aren't there mentally, are lazy, practice badly, etc -- he can't exactly bench them to teach them a lesson yet. IMO that contributes to the faltering we're seeing going down the stretch here.

[Dawg61]

The threads that never ends

Atleast for the most part the basketball bitch pong is kept in one area instead of 10 different threads

[Goat from MSU]

I am keeping it alive . Hey Dawg61 who is the Juco guard from Ala. who you keep talking about and check out the Commerical Appeal article on Willie Atwood at Conners St.
Atleast for the most part the basketball bitch pong is kept in one area instead of 10 different threads

[Dawg61]

I am keeping it alive . Hey Dawg61 who is the Juco guard from Ala. who you keep talking about and check out the Commerical Appeal article on Willie Atwood at Conners St.

Jay Watkins at Gadsden State, 4th in the nation at 25.2 points a game and avg 9.4 rebounds. He's a forward and not a 3point shooter though. http://stats.njcaa.org/sports/mbkb/2013-14/div1/players/jaywatkinsefn7

Can you copy paste the article, you have to be a subscriber to view it

[Dawg61]

I am keeping it alive . Hey Dawg61 who is the Juco guard from Ala. who you keep talking about and check out the Commerical Appeal article on Willie Atwood at Conners St.

Nice find on Atwood. http://www.jucorecruiting.com/willie-atwood-recruitment-heating/