Recruiting class ratings...

[maroonmania]

So I think most of us feel pretty decent about this class however it does concern me a little that when you look at the past 3 years we certainly fell off this year on avg. player rating for the guys we signed. Some here have even claimed this year's class is better than last year or the year before that. Here is the listing:

From 247
2014 - avg. player rating 84.77 (class rated 38th)
2013 - avg. player rating 85.97 (class rated 25th)
2012 - avg. player rating 85.92 (class rated 22nd)

Certainly missing out on some of the highest rated MS guys that OM got hurt the rating but is the biggest difference just that the MS prospects as a whole were lower rated? I mean even with that OM managed the 15th ranked class with an average player rating of 88.1. That's basically 3.5 points PER PLAYER better than us. Is our class just THAT underrated? Their class overrated?

[Madkinmecrazy]

First, OM only averaged 2.2 points better than us (using your numbers, math is hard).

I don't think the talent gap between 85.9 and 88.1 is meaningful in any way (on the whole). Hell, the people coming up with these numbers are journalists who change their opinions based on what colleges are recruiting the kid. I think the biggest differences in our class is a couple of playmakers they came away with that we weren't able to get. Not to say we didn't get any, but players like Pack make a big difference in the "rankings" but don't make a big difference on the field.

[CJDAWG85]

I believe player development is a much bigger factor than a rating of someone in HS. I believe it's about potential and getting the right mind set.

[Coach34]

Here is why I'm not concerned about this class, it's extremely undervalued:

Jessie Jackson and Gerri Green- these guys got injured and their ratings took a hit because of it. Green is probably the best overall player in Mississippi this year. Jackson is big physical WR and would have been the state's best had he stayed injury free. Mississippi had 3 quality WR's in 2014- we signed 2 of them

Elijah Staley and Nick Fitzgerald- both kids- like Prescott was a couple of years ago- are underrated. Staley is a 4-star talent that had problems with his coach. He is a good kid and there wont be any discipline problems with him- and I expect he will come in, work hard, and learn to be a college QB. But talent is one thing this guy doesnt lack. Fitzgerald? Might be the best runner we have at the QB position. Played in an option offense in HS and hasnt thrown the ball much. Needs a couple of years to develop mechanics and learn to read Secondary coverages- as he has done little of that. Fitzgerald is a faster Relf with more overall talent in the passing game.

And that is just those 4 players- I wont get into the Delta guys from Clarksdale that are always underrated because they are simply from the Delta.

We got the best RB in Mississippi
We got 2 of the 3 best WR's
We got the best LB in Miss
We got some good Secondary guys

SC finished 9th in the SEC this year recruiting- are you worried SC may stop winning 10 games per season?

[maroonmania]

First, OM only averaged 2.2 points better than us (using your numbers, math is hard).

I don't think the talent gap between 85.9 and 88.1 is meaningful in any way (on the whole). Hell, the people coming up with these numbers are journalists who change their opinions based on what colleges are recruiting the kid. I think the biggest differences in our class is a couple of playmakers they came away with that we weren't able to get. Not to say we didn't get any, but players like Pack make a big difference in the "rankings" but don't make a big difference on the field.

Uh, 88.1 - 84.77 = 3.33. You must using some kind of new math. Our player rating this year is 84.77, not 85.9, guess that's the difference.

[thunderclap]

While not an end all, I do think we should be doing better than 38. I guess we will see in a few years.

[maroonmania]

Here is why I'm not concerned about this class, it's extremely undervalued:

Jessie Jackson and Gerri Green- these guys got injured and their ratings took a hit because of it. Green is probably the best overall player in Mississippi this year. Jackson is big physical WR and would have been the state's best had he stayed injury free. Mississippi had 3 quality WR's in 2014- we signed 2 of them

Elijah Staley and Nick Fitzgerald- both kids- like Prescott was a couple of years ago- are underrated. Staley is a 4-star talent that had problems with his coach. He is a good kid and there wont be any discipline problems with him- and I expect he will come in, work hard, and learn to be a college QB. But talent is one thing this guy doesnt lack. Fitzgerald? Might be the best runner we have at the QB position. Played in an option offense in HS and hasnt thrown the ball much. Needs a couple of years to develop mechanics and learn to read Secondary coverages- as he has done little of that. Fitzgerald is a faster Relf with more overall talent in the passing game.

And that is just those 4 players- I wont get into the Delta guys from Clarksdale that are always underrated because they are simply from the Delta.

We got the best RB in Mississippi
We got 2 of the 3 best WR's
We got the best LB in Miss
We got some good Secondary guys

SC finished 9th in the SEC this year recruiting- are you worried SC may stop winning 10 games per season?

What's the thought on Durr and Rayford? Since we got hosed on Tee those are the 2 true CBs we did sign but both seem to be rated fairly low.

[defiantdog]

What's the thought on Durr and Rayford? Since we got hosed on Tee those are the 2 true CBs we did sign but both seem to be rated fairly low.

Rayford is gonna be sick. May turn into a Safety though cause of his size. But he definitely has sub 4.4 speed. He had a low rating cause he went to a smaller school.... simply put. If he went to Hoover High or South Panola U, he'd be a 92 rated 4* with multiple offers. This guy is a steal. I don't know much about Durr.... he's most likely gonna be at Scooba for two years though.

[Madkinmecrazy]

Godamnit, I was looking at 2012.

I need to learn how to read. ****

[Coach34]

Rayford is gonna be sick. May turn into a Safety though cause of his size. But he definitely has sub 4.4 speed. He had a low rating cause he went to a smaller school.... simply put. If he went to Hoover High or South Panola U, he'd be a 92 rated 4* with multiple offers. This guy is a steal.

This is a good point. Hopefully Rayford turns out to be another like McKinney...or even Clayborn.

Clayborn last year was what- a low 3-star because he played private school ball? Had he been at MC- he would have been a solid 4-star. He is going to start as a true Soph and be good at it.

[ShotgunDawg]

This may seem like a homer post, but this year was an odd recruiting year, because so many of our top commits had injuries or discipline problems that cost them points.

1. Jesse Jackson was a 91 rating, but tore his ACL. If he hadn't torn his ACL, may he would have been 93 or even 94?

2. Jamoral Graham was a 92 rating at sat out numerous games, including the MS/AL All-Star game that boosted Epps. If Graham would have been healthy, maybe he woud've been a 93 or 95 rating.

3. Gerri Green tore his ACL and was only a 90 rating. This is severely underrated, but the recruiting network's hands were tied because he wasn't playing. Green may have been a 5 star player if he would've been healthy. After all, Chris Jones didn't reach 5 star status till the Under Armour game. Green never had that opportunity.

4. Brandon Bryant is a 4 star level talent that no one knew about and thus couldn't rank as a 4 star.

5. Corey Thomas - how the hell that guy is only a 3 star with all his offers is beyond me.

6. Nick Fitzgerald played in an option offense in high school, and was thus unable to show off his rocket arm that anyone that attended bowl practice would've seen that he had.

7. Deshon Cooper from Georgia is an excellent LB. Still trying to figure out how he isn't a 4 star.

8. Elijah Staley was would have almost factually been a 4 star if he wouldn't gotten kicked off his HS team and thus tying the hands of the recruiting networks. Not only is Staley not a 4 star, 247 has him rated as an 80 and therefore pulling down the average of the rest of our class.

9. Ronald Cochran is an non-evaluated 73 rating. He is also pulling the rating down, when I doubt we would offer a kid that wasn't at least an 84-85 type player.

Point is, due to injuries, Staley getting kicked off his high school team, and Cochran not being evaluated, our recruiting ranking is vastly out of whack with the level of talent we are bringing in, assuming those players come back healthy.

On the other end of the spectrum, Ole Miss brought in a nice class, but ALL of their players were rated as aggressively as possible. Rod Taylor got his 5 star late, Epps got his 4th star late, and numerous others are ranked like 90 when they are basically average 3 star players.

Therefore, in conclusion, this year just isn't a great year to make a star rating argument. We brought in a good class, and that should be evident in a few years.

[defiantdog]

5. Corey Thomas - how the hell that guy is only a 3 star with all his offers is beyond me.


Honestly, McAdory High School is 5A (maybe 6A now because of the new structure) in Alabama and doesn't play the same competition as the 7A schools like Hoover, Prattville, etc. The media does not like giving high ratings to athletes that don't come from the big schools. Dez Harris came from McAdory as well and he was a stud there.

[maroonmania]

This may seem like a homer post, but this year was an odd recruiting year, because so many of our top commits had injuries or discipline problems that cost them points.

1. Jesse Jackson was a 91 rating, but tore his ACL. If he hadn't torn his ACL, may he would have been 93 or even 94?

2. Jamoral Graham was a 92 rating at sat out numerous games, including the MS/AL All-Star game that boosted Epps. If Graham would have been healthy, maybe he woud've been a 93 or 95 rating.

3. Gerri Green tore his ACL and was only a 90 rating. This is severely underrated, but the recruiting network's hands were tied because he wasn't playing. Green may have been a 5 star player if he would've been healthy. After all, Chris Jones didn't reach 5 star status till the Under Armour game. Green never had that opportunity.

4. Brandon Bryant is a 4 star level talent that no one knew about and thus couldn't rank as a 4 star.

5. Corey Thomas - how the hell that guy is only a 3 star with all his offers is beyond me.

6. Nick Fitzgerald played in an option offense in high school, and was thus unable to show off his rocket arm that anyone that attended bowl practice would've seen that he had.

7. Deshon Cooper from Georgia is an excellent LB. Still trying to figure out how he isn't a 4 star.

8. Elijah Staley was would have almost factually been a 4 star if he wouldn't gotten kicked off his HS team and thus tying the hands of the recruiting networks. Not only is Staley not a 4 star, 247 has him rated as an 80 and therefore pulling down the average of the rest of our class.

9. Ronald Cochran is an non-evaluated 73 rating. He is also pulling the rating down, when I doubt we would offer a kid that wasn't at least an 84-85 type player.

Point is, due to injuries, Staley getting kicked off his high school team, and Cochran not being evaluated, our recruiting ranking is vastly out of whack with the level of talent we are bringing in, assuming those players come back healthy.

On the other end of the spectrum, Ole Miss brought in a nice class, but ALL of their players were rated as aggressively as possible. Rod Taylor got his 5 star late, Epps got his 4th star late, and numerous others are ranked like 90 when they are basically average 3 star players.

Therefore, in conclusion, this year just isn't a great year to make a star rating argument. We brought in a good class, and that should be evident in a few years.

Good point about Cochran. A 73 definitely dings up the average. I assume since he shows up in our list he has a full offer and not just a grayshirt. Is that accurate?

[engie]

class of 2011:
Avg player ranking - 83.75
composite - 34th
4 composite 4*s -- none of which were unanimous 4*s across sites.
In my "reranking" that class below, I see somewhere around 10 4*s and a 5*. So about 11 4* and 5* actual players. Hence why I'm not going to let any of these 'crootin sites tell me what I should think about a class -- I'm going to wait and judge it on the field for myself. I messed up and jumped the gun on judging the 2011 class before(really since the day it was signed) -- learned a lesson from it -- and won't be doing it again.

Arrington - .9149 Coming back as a rsJR. May have been slightly overrated at this point with plenty of time to earn the ranking. For fairness, let's call him an 88 3*.
PJ Jones - .9000 SR starting DL. About right on this one.
Maiden - .8900 Overrated and never contributed.
Fossellman - .8900 Overrated and never contributed
Cox - .8800 Underrated. Should have been a 91-93 4* on athleticism alone.
Prescott - .8700 Underrated. Should have been a low 90s on video alone -- if they didn't even bother scouting intangibles. 95ish if we're being real.
Market - .8700 Underrated. Should have been in the 89-91 range.
Zach Jackson - .8600 Slightly underrated. Should have been about an 88 with the ability to go higher in the future.
Scott - .8600 No clue. Never made it to MSU and eventually went to UAB.
Calhoun - .8500 Underrated. Should have been a mild 4*. 91-92 talent.
McKinney - .8400 LOL underrated. Should have been a 97-98 5*.
Malone - .8400 Underrated. 90ish 4* talent at least and could be higher than that. Will likely be a 4 year starter in the SEC.
J-Rob - .8400 Underrated. Should have been a 91-92 4*.
Rufus - .8300 No clue yet. We'll call it about right.
Perry - .8300 No clue. Never played for us.
Morrow - .8300 Underrated at 24/7. Overrated on other sites. Should have been about an 87-88 3*.
Milton - .8200 Will never know. Will say it was about right or maybe slightly underrated.
Slay - .8200 LOL underrated. Should have been a 92-94 4*.
Knox - .8100 About right. Bust that never contributed.
Redmond - .7900 About right. Bust that never contributed.
Preston Smith - .7900 LOL Underrated. Should have been at least a 90 4*.
John Harris - .7800 About right -- has never contributed yet.
Trapp - .7700 Probably overrated. Never contributed.
Cherry - n/r Underrated in that regard.

[Saltydog]

If he had that type of speed there would've been folks crawling all over him and there wasn't.......

[defiantdog]

Cox - .8800 Underrated. Should have been a 91-93 4* on athleticism alone.


247 got it right after he spent 2 years @ Scooba. They gave him a 92 rating.


At least our busts aren't as bad as another team's.... Channing Ward, Nickolas Brassell, Tobias Singleton, Carlos Thompson, Patrick Patterson, Craig Drummond, Raymond Cotton, Brent Shaeffer, etc. -- and all of these guys were 4*

[engie]

We still have more 4* "busts" than we do with 2*s is the crazy thing. We take a no/low-offer 2* or low 3* late in the process, everyone is going to complain, and that guy is going to almost unanimously turn into a really good player for us.

At some point, you'd think we would learn to quit melting about it -- and I think we're getting pretty close to that point collectively.

[SPMT]

We can make all the excuses we want, there is some validity to class ranking. The teams that are at the top at the end of the year are also at the top in recruiting. Very rarely is there a team outside of the top ten that is in the national championship hunt.

[Really Clark?]

We can make all the excuses we want, there is some validity to class ranking. The teams that are at the top at the end of the year are also at the top in recruiting. Very rarely is there a team outside of the top ten that is in the national championship hunt.

Personally I think we need to take the next step before we worry about the national title hunt. And by hunt do you mean teams who played in the BCS games? Because there have been teams who played in the games and their 4 year average in the rankings before that time were below a Top 10 ranking. And even a winner. If you are talking about teams being ranked in the Top 10 or so being classified as a national contender then you will find several of those. Lets just get to averaging 8-10 wins a year then worry about taking that next step. A solid build will take us much further than trying a quick fix. No team has come from our history and become a contender quickly.

[engie]

We can make all the excuses we want, there is some validity to class ranking. The teams that are at the top at the end of the year are also at the top in recruiting. Very rarely is there a team outside of the top ten that is in the national championship hunt.

But are they ranked that highly because they recruited well -- or are they "recruiting that well" because they consistently rank that highly? Which is driving which? There is a lot of redundance in the recruiting rankings that prevent people from knowing whether the horse is driving the cart or viceversa.

Do you really want to tell me that Michigan St, Oklahoma St, Mizzou, Wisconsin, Virginia Tech, Kansas St etc are recruiting in the 40s in reality every year while pumping out consistent NFL talent and having consistent top 20 teams? Or are they just better at actual talent analysis than these retired accountants running a recruiting website? Do they have some magic pill that makes them just that much better at developing players than everyone else in the country? There are certainly ingredients of everything -- but the punch line is that these sites are short selling these players leaving HS because of their school choice in the same way I feel like they have done with us quite often. Same kids would be ranked higher if they committed elsewhere. And therein lies the redundancy.

[bully99]

Engie, most of those schools you mentioned don't compete in the sec. Big difference in going against 10 or 12 of the largest athletic budgets in the country. We are in the sec. When you're 13 of 14, that's what you have to compare it to, not Kansas or west Virginia. Too many people want to justify recruiting failures by pointing out non sec teams recruiting. No comparison.

[mic]

Check out the size of our guys. basically all are 6'1 or taller. only 2 guys Durr and Graham( who may be the most talented player) are under 6'0
LB's Green and Cooper 6'5 and 6'4
Jackson good size and speed
Long DL guys with Cory and Will both around 6'6
Grant has good size and hopefully a chip on his shoulder
Braxton true DT good size
Qb's both big and athletic
Aries TRUE PURE RB great size and speed
Lee wants to be here and will prob find a spot with his attitude just may not be at RB
athletic DB's with Bryant and JT and Rayford good size over 6'0 and over 200
6'7 260 TE
OL may be very underrated and will wont be expected to come in and play can learn and get better (except for Johnson)
Hell even the punter is huge 6'5 200

[defiantdog]

Well let's get a top 10 recruiting class in 2015.... we have to start by getting guys like this....

http://i61.tinypic.com/zvem2h.jpg

[Really Clark?]

Engie, most of those schools you mentioned don't compete in the sec. Big difference in going against 10 or 12 of the largest athletic budgets in the country. We are in the sec. When you're 13 of 14, that's what you have to compare it to, not Kansas or west Virginia. Too many people want to justify recruiting failures by pointing out non sec teams recruiting. No comparison.

But we are getting caught up with an historic SEC run that will not continue. Especially our division. It will come back down and we have to be prepared to rise when that happens. Then when it ramps up again be in a better position to withstand and compete with a better foundation.

[engie]

Engie, most of those schools you mentioned don't compete in the sec. Big difference in going against 10 or 12 of the largest athletic budgets in the country. We are in the sec. When you're 13 of 14, that's what you have to compare it to, not Kansas or west Virginia. Too many people want to justify recruiting failures by pointing out non sec teams recruiting. No comparison.

Those schools compete against schools that bring in just as much money as we do at this point. And in many cases are about as good on the field. And CERTAINLY have players with success in the NFL, which kills the basis of your argument being that those schools aren't actually recruiting talent. And at least one of the schools I mentioned DOES play in the SEC and finished this year in the top damn 5 in the country

It's stupid to take the approach of "we've got to outrecruit LSU and Bama to compete with them" -- because it is NEVER, EVER going to happen with their current paces. It's a frigging pipe dream. Read that 100 times till you understand it. Even when we do outrecruit them -- it won't show on paper -- because the same kid will be rated higher for them than they will be for us and we'll still show up behind them on these recruiting websites. That's the self-prophecy of recruiting rankings by always putting the 10-12 traditional powers in the top 15 in recruiting regardless of how good or bad they actually do in a given year. Much how the same fools never dropped Polk recruiting classes out of the top 20 regardless, the last several of which were TOTALLY lulzable.

The correct recipe for success at MSU is the same one used at the schools I listed. Gnash your teeth about it -- and bitch about Cohen's recruiting some more because he missed on a 2016 Georgia prospect that's going to be a #1 overall pick if it makes you feel better -- but it's our reality.

[codeDawg]

Those schools compete against schools that bring in just as much money as we do at this point. And in many cases are about as good on the field. And CERTAINLY have players with success in the NFL, which kills the basis of your argument being that those schools aren't actually recruiting talent. And at least one of the schools I mentioned DOES play in the SEC and finished this year in the top damn 5 in the country

It's stupid to take the approach of "we've got to outrecruit LSU and Bama to compete with them" -- because it is NEVER, EVER going to happen with their current paces. It's a frigging pipe dream. Read that 100 times till you understand it. Even when we do outrecruit them -- it won't show on paper -- because the same kid will be rated higher for them than they will be for us and we'll still show up behind them on these recruiting websites. That's the self-prophecy of recruiting rankings by always putting the 10-12 traditional powers in the top 15 in recruiting regardless of how good or bad they actually do in a given year. Much how the same fools never dropped Polk recruiting classes out of the top 20 regardless, the last several of which were TOTALLY lulzable.

The correct recipe for success at MSU is the same one used at the schools I listed. Gnash your teeth about it -- and bitch about Cohen's recruiting some more because he missed on a 2016 Georgia prospect that's going to be a #1 overall pick if it makes you feel better -- but it's our reality.

10/10. Would read again.