WMD is right. We aren't on the same playing field with a log of the schools in the

[Saltydog]

SEC, namely UM when it comes to recruiting. This is the second time in 4 years they've flipped a big time recruit from us on signing day (CJ / Tee). We've go to level the playing field or this shit is going to conintue to happen to us. Bracky Brett be damned. This shit pisses me off to no end.

[War Machine Dawg]

It's ridiculous how obvious it is to everyone outside our administration. When you employ an LT Era incompetent, you get incompetent results. There's a reason literally every other SEC school employs either A) A lawyer, B) A former NCAA Compliance Office Official, or C) Both (lawyer who worked for NCAA Compliance) to run their compliance department. Dear Ol State? A ****ing PE teacher. We deserve the results we get.

[FlabLoser]

Guys - Ole Miss tried to flip several of our croots. They only got one. And the one they got isn't a sure thing. Chill.

[Dawgface]

Guys - Ole Miss tried to flip several of our croots. They only got one. And the one they got isn't a sure thing. Chill.

When was the last time we flipped one of theirs?

[War Machine Dawg]

Guys - Ole Miss tried to flip several of our croots. They only got one. And the one they got isn't a sure thing. Chill.

Says the guy with "Bracky Brett must go!" as his signature. Why is it they always flip at least 1 of our croots but we never manage to flip one of theirs?

[Saltydog]

class? Let's just lay down and let them continue to screw us and while we sit back and play the nice guy they come and pillage our recruits. Pisses me off to no end.

[Joe Schmedlap]

Can we get an "amen"?

[maroonmania]

SEC, namely UM when it comes to recruiting. This is the second time in 4 years they've flipped a big time recruit from us on signing day (CJ / Tee). We've go to level the playing field or this shit is going to conintue to happen to us. Bracky Brett be damned. This shit pisses me off to no end.

While the point is well taken, CJ flipped way before signing day.

[maroonmania]

When was the last time we flipped one of theirs?

Robert Elliott? That's the last one I remember that flipped to us from OM late. Given the current methods OM is using it would be extraordinary for us to flip one of their recruits to us late in the process.

[I seen it dawg]

4 out of 5 and trending higher

[Cash]

Guys - Ole Miss tried to flip several of our croots. They only got one. And the one they got isn't a sure thing. Chill.

Technically, they flipped two. Shepard and Rawlings. Either way, screw it. If they don't want to be here, let them go and they can second guess their decisions come November.

[deltadawg99]

They flip one every year it seems.

We flipped Robert Elliot and LaMarcus Williams in 2007 and they were both awesome......

Quay does not count because he committed to them when he was a sophomore.

[Really Clark?]

I say if recent history is any indication, let them keep flipping. It has cost them a lot more than hurt us. A whole lot more. CJ is the only one that has been ok for them. But has not lived up to his supposed ratings. Just do what I do when they start about flipping one of ours. Smirk at them and say good job and for them to let me know when one of them ends up worth damn, then I might care.

[esplanade91]

All the names mentioned in this thread minus the guys who haven't had a chance to prove themselves are flops or haven't been worth their ranking. Tells you all you need to know. CJ would be a back-up on our roster right now, so we're talking about losing a guy to JUCO...

Somehow or another we "got stuck with" Market who in limited playing time has been worthy of an SEC scholarship. The guy we whiffed on for him failed out of school.

[Saltydog]

solid player in '12 for them. He would likely start for us next year.

[starkvegasdawg]

Guys - Ole Miss tried to flip several of our croots. They only got one. And the one they got isn't a sure thing. Chill.

So what is the acceptable number they have to flip before we can get pissed? Two? Three? The point with me is not how many of ours they flipped compared to how many they tried to flip. The point is that every year it seems like this happens. Why does it happen? I'll leave that to be debated by others. I don't really care if it is because TSUN cheated their asses off or because Bucky is the best salesman this side of the Rockys. My guess is that it is a little bit of both. The point is I am tired of us self reporting everytime one of our players accidentally gets 7 nuggests in his 6 piece box. I'm not saying sink to SMU level of cheating but at least look out for our best interests and not do the NCAA's work for them and be the class tattletale.

[Political Hack]

nobody sinks to the SMU level of cheating anymore with the exception of one school and a lot of what they do is still on the up and up (e.g., publish 7 on 7 coaches book for him, etc...).

1) they have people who care about recruiting, 2) the town/party has bought in, 3) the people that care have lots of money, and 4) they have lawyers in place to DEFEND them at the university level, booster level, and player level.

It takes years to develop what they did... and it'll take years to stop it even after they get popped.

[Goat Holder]

So you're saying we should actively cheat? I disagree.

No, we need to form an alliance with whoever necessary (Urban Meyer is one who comes to mind, Mark Richt another, and now Utah) and collectively go to the NCAA over the rebel antics.

On the cheating thing, leave that to the big dogs. It's going to happen, you just don't talk about it. Publicly declaring we should do it is freaking stupid. It's what THEY are doing, that needs to be stopped. The 11th hour cash dropping bullshit, going after parents, playing games with paper on NSD.

[War Machine Dawg]

So what is the acceptable number they have to flip before we can get pissed? Two? Three? The point with me is not how many of ours they flipped compared to how many they tried to flip. The point is that every year it seems like this happens. Why does it happen? I'll leave that to be debated by others. I don't really care if it is because TSUN cheated their asses off or because Bucky is the best salesman this side of the Rockys. My guess is that it is a little bit of both. The point is I am tired of us self reporting everytime one of our players accidentally gets 7 nuggests in his 6 piece box. I'm not saying sink to SMU level of cheating but at least look out for our best interests and not do the NCAA's work for them and be the class tattletale.

Bingo. Couldn't have said it better. "Tattletale" is the perfect description of the MSU Compliance mentality under Bracky. Until we're willing to change the mentality, we'll continue to 'croot at a disadvantage compared to the other schools in our league.

[starkvegasdawg]

No, I am not advocating cheating. What I am advocating for is looking out for our best interests and not look for reaons to self report ourself over crap like a $100 handshake or a discount on a car. No other school would have a player suspended for things like that or getting someone to hold tires until his mom could pay for them. NOT ONE SCHOOL would ever do that. EVER. Except us. No, I do not want us setting up an escort service on our big recruiting weekend or handing out money like we were an ATM machine. I just want us to not be the first to tell on ourselves or do the NCAA's work for them. This might be stretching things but ever think that the Redmond situation may hurt us in recruiting? They see a kid that for all intents and purposes did not do anything wrong. At least nothing that is not done at every other school 50 times a day. They see him lose close to half his college career because of that. Would that make you think twice about going here knowing that if you screwed up just a little bit (even if it was unknowingly like Tiregate) that could be your fate when at every other school it would go no further than the coach telling you to be more careful next time?

[Goat Holder]

I get your point but I think the truth is in the middle. Obviously little things like the two you are referring to are minor (Fant, Redmond). But we messed up by TALKING about it. We are unorganized. The players talked, plus the booster f*cked with Devinner. You have to be SILENT. Does Bracky need to improve? Sure. Do I think we should cheat? No. Do I give a f*ck about a player getting a little gift here and there? Nope, ESPECIALLY when I don't know about it. And neither would the NCAA if people would shut their mouths and be smarter.

[Political Hack]

I get your point but I think the truth is in the middle. Obviously little things like the two you are referring to are minor (Fant, Redmond). But we messed up by TALKING about it. We are unorganized. The players talked, plus the booster f*cked with Devinner. You have to be SILENT. Does Bracky need to improve? Sure. Do I think we should cheat? No. Do I give a f*ck about a player getting a little gift here and there? Nope, ESPECIALLY when I don't know about it. And neither would the NCAA if people would shut their mouths and be smarter.

you know zero about which you speak.

[Political Hack]

So you're saying we should actively cheat? I disagree.

No, we need to form an alliance with whoever necessary (Urban Meyer is one who comes to mind, Mark Richt another, and now Utah) and collectively go to the NCAA over the rebel antics.

On the cheating thing, leave that to the big dogs. It's going to happen, you just don't talk about it. Publicly declaring we should do it is freaking stupid. It's what THEY are doing, that needs to be stopped. The 11th hour cash dropping bullshit, going after parents, playing games with paper on NSD.

if that's directed at me... no. I think SMU level cheating is scummy and robs kids of their true intentions and best chance to be successful over the next four years. Any kid I've ever spoken to about their college decision I've told this: Don't sell yourself for a 7-11 gas station attendant salary. It's not about here and now. it's about four years from now. invest in yourself. Go where you're comfortable and think you will have the best chance to succeed.

At state, cheating isn't paying players... "cheating" is telling them why they shouldn't accept big money from other schools.

[Goat Holder]

Come on, now. I will re-word it. Change "the booster f*cked with Devinner" to "Devinner was involved". If he wasn't, none of it would matter and all would be fine. Then the dominoes start falling and.....

I know exactly what I'm talking about.

[NCDawg]

Can we get an "amen"?

Yes, amen. If we had done what they did, the NCAA would be on our tail in a New York minute.

[Goat Holder]

if that's directed at me

Had nothing to do with you.

I agree with the rest though. But there are SOME players that SMU-ing appeals to. I know it's tough for us fans to imagine, but there are kids out there that don't really have an allegiance to any school, and they'll go wherever the money is best. They don't care.

[Political Hack]

Had nothing to do with you.

I agree with the rest though. But there are SOME players that SMU-ing appeals to. I know it's tough for us fans to imagine, but there are kids out there that don't really have an allegiance to any school, and they'll go wherever the money is best. They don't care.

and we don't need or want those kids at state.

as for the other post, when people show up at your doorstep with their hand out and you tell them to screw off, bad things happen. Refusing to get more involved when prompted is actually what caused the fire storm. In essence, it's the exact opposite of what you said.

[War Machine Dawg]

I get your point but I think the truth is in the middle. Obviously little things like the two you are referring to are minor (Fant, Redmond). But we messed up by TALKING about it. We are unorganized. The players talked, plus the booster f*cked with Devinner. You have to be SILENT. Does Bracky need to improve? Sure. Do I think we should cheat? No. Do I give a f*ck about a player getting a little gift here and there? Nope, ESPECIALLY when I don't know about it. And neither would the NCAA if people would shut their mouths and be smarter.

Bracky does shit like actively getting the VIN number of our players' vehicles and checking to see who they are registered to. Name one other compliance office in the SEC that does that shit. But keep defending the tattletale mentality while bitching about being "Miss Stake" as you like to say. Geebus, I have no idea why you're still allowed to post here.

[Goat Holder]

Bracky does shit like actively getting the VIN number of our players' vehicles and checking to see who they are registered to.

Bracky may suck, but he doesn't do this type stuff unless he has to. Come on, the guy is an MSU fan himself. He wouldn't do that. Think before you go on ridiculous tirades.

[Goat Holder]

Never said we did. My point was that some of those guys do go on to pretty good careers. Eric Dickerson for example. The problem is, we don't want those guys having their good careers at Ole Miss, thus the reason we should team up (can't do it ourselves, obviously) and take them down.

[Saltydog]

difference IMO.............

[esplanade91]

solid player in '12 for them. He would likely start for us next year.

Maybe. But I'm thinking that had he come to MSU he would have actually played at his projected position, LB. Obviously he's having a good amount of success with a hand on the ground, so he could play the KJ Wright role... but I don't see him beating out a player we have for a LB spot. I still think he would have been brought in to play MLB with his length though and McKinney is right at the standard we thought CJ would be for us.

Now, with us signing a better prospect out of Alabama last season (Brown) and another solid one whose soul is damned to hell for not signing with the University of Ole Miss, he probably would be pushed to DE this season... but if Coleman gets 3-6 sacks I think the whole thing is a push.

Makes me think about what McKinney could do with a hand on the ground, honestly.

[Political Hack]

BMac will have his hand on the ground some next season. Not a lot, but some.

I know a lot of people like this idea but if they do it any other time than 3rd and 9+ I'll lose my lunch. Why we'd ever take that guy out of the middle of our defense is beyond me.

[Joe Schmedlap]

No, I am not advocating cheating. What I am advocating for is looking out for our best interests and not look for reaons to self report ourself over crap like a $100 handshake or a discount on a car. No other school would have a player suspended for things like that or getting someone to hold tires until his mom could pay for them. NOT ONE SCHOOL would ever do that. EVER. Except us. No, I do not want us setting up an escort service on our big recruiting weekend or handing out money like we were an ATM machine. I just want us to not be the first to tell on ourselves or do the NCAA's work for them. This might be stretching things but ever think that the Redmond situation may hurt us in recruiting? They see a kid that for all intents and purposes did not do anything wrong. At least nothing that is not done at every other school 50 times a day. They see him lose close to half his college career because of that. Would that make you think twice about going here knowing that if you screwed up just a little bit (even if it was unknowingly like Tiregate) that could be your fate when at every other school it would go no further than the coach telling you to be more careful next time?

THIS all day long and twice today since it is Sunday. SEC is big time business. I am not here to advocate cheating, but why in the world would we handicap ourselves with a Bracky led compliance department? It reeks of incompetence and does not instill confidence in potential recruits (as pointed out above) or in potential major donors. Who really wants to invest in a company when the board of directors of that company are apparently incompetent and unqualified? It is inexcusable from my standpoint that State's compliance department does not have a lawyer at the top of the organizational chart. Once again, I am not advocating for wholesale cheating or whoring out our daughters, but Bracky spending all his time as a damned tattle tell and constantly reminding us of what we cannot do is not the way to play. How about allowing a little activity in the so called gray area? That is where we need an attorney. With Bracky as our compliance director, we are our own worst enemy, end of story. What happened to Redmond over what amounts to almost nothing is despicable and indefensible. Bracky's ass should have been canned immediately over that outcome alone. It just pisses me off and does not instill confidence in me when it comes to our athletic department. What are Stricklin and Keenum thinking? I will now hang up and listen.

[Political Hack]

Ha-Ha took money from a coach and laughed all the way to the bank.

[Schultzy]

and we don't need or want those kids at state.

as for the other post, when people show up at your doorstep with their hand out and you tell them to screw off, bad things happen. Refusing to get more involved when prompted is actually what caused the fire storm. In essence, it's the exact opposite of what you said.

Hack, do we get to know your side of the story on Devinnergate? I've never heard your side of it and think you deserve for it to be heard because it sounds like you have some points to make in your own defense.

[Political Hack]

in due time...

[Johnson85]

So you're saying we should actively cheat? I disagree.



Nobody in the SEC is forming an alliance with anybody because there are no clean hands. We aren't all-in on recruiting like Ole Miss and Auburn, but we aren't squeaky clean. The problem is schools like Ole Miss and Auburn get pissed about being little brother in their state and go 17ing crazy. It's not good for anybody for people to start going all out in recruiting. That just ends with multiple SEC schools going on probation.

[NCDawg]

Nobody in the SEC is forming an alliance with anybody because there are no clean hands. We aren't all-in on recruiting like Ole Miss and Auburn, but we aren't squeaky clean. The problem is schools like Ole Miss and Auburn get pissed about being little brother in their state and go 17ing crazy. It's not good for anybody for people to start going all out in recruiting. That just ends with multiple SEC schools going on probation.

I disagree. You're not going to see "multiple SEC schools going on probation". They are too smart for that. They have Counsel that tells them what they can and cannot do. We don't have that luxury. Ole Miss recruits can take OVs to LSU and Alabama and still sign with the Rebels. If one of our recruits visits those campuses, they are good as gone most of the time. You can't tell me that under the table inducements don't have something to do with it.

[Perpetual Underachiever]

Bracky has to go. The guy is in way over his head. Someone with their BS and Masters in Education should be an assistant principal at starkville high, not the chief compliance officer for a $70 million dollar company, i.e. our athletic department. His body of work over the past 12 years should be worthy of firing his ass alone. Time for Stricklin to completely overhaul the most dated, under-qualified, and under-performing department within athletics.

[Johnson85]

I disagree. You're not going to see "multiple SEC schools going on probation". They are too smart for that. They have Counsel that tells them what they can and cannot do. We don't have that luxury. Ole Miss recruits can take OVs to LSU and Alabama and still sign with the Rebels. If one of our recruits visits those campuses, they are good as gone most of the time. You can't tell me that under the table inducements don't have something to do with it.

I didn't think this needed explanation, but when I said "nobody has clean hands", I meant everybody provides impermissible benefits to recruits.

There are two problems we have. One is self-induced: we are simply not playing the game as well as most teams. This is not a lack of resources; we used to do fine. We have internal issues to address, and they are being addressed more slowly than they otherwise would be because we don't have a coach that is 'all-in'. (and if that's somehow not clear, I mean that while Mullen may not be going around threatening to disassociate boosters, he still to my knowledge is not as comfortable with it as some coaches.

A second is simply that recruiting is basically a game of chicken for the have-nots. The reason we have trouble beating out Bama and LSU for recruits is that they're freaking Bama and LSU. We either have to (1) haev a strong tie with a recruit for some reason really hit it off with him or (2) we have to out pay them. One is hard to do. Two is easy in the short term, it's just that the end result is either prices being driven up until the MSU and UM's can['t compete and/or so much smoke being generated that the NCAA has to hammer somebody (in which case it likely won't be Bama or LSU that the NCAA makes an example of). UM generated a shit ton of smoke last year. We'll see whether things continue to escalate or whether it gets tamped down by the SEC.

[maroonmania]

Look, it was pretty unanimous that MSU folks wanted Keenum when we got him, but HE is the issue with Bracky and evidently supports him. HE is the guys that has to have his mind changed on the issue. Listen, if Greg Byrne, as strong a personality as he was as AD couldn't do anything about canning Bracky are moving his job assigment to other areas then you can forget ANY MSU AD ever having the influence to do that.

[quickstrike2]

Bracky has to go. The guy is in way over his head. Someone with their BS and Masters in Education should be an assistant principal at starkville high, not the chief compliance officer for a $70 million dollar company, i.e. our athletic department. His body of work over the past 12 years should be worthy of firing his ass alone. Time for Stricklin to completely overhaul the most dated, under-qualified, and under-performing department within athletics.

I agree with this. I think most compliance offices works with the coaches and boosters letting them know what they can and can't do. I get the feeling Bracky only tell them what they can't do.

[dawg27]

5 out of 6 is coming!