TR vs Dak discussion

[BeastMan]

I think everyone can agree that TR is superior to Dak throwing the ball. Lat year our offense rewrote school passing records but finished 9th in the SEC in scoring at 29.5 points per game.

Here's the question. Are we a better team with:

A) Tyler Russell throwing for approximately 2,900 yards, 24 TD's, and 10 ints

or

B) Dak Prescott throwing for 2,100 yards, 12 TD's, and 6 ints. Also 500 rushing yards and 5 TD's (I stayed very close to Relf's 2010 stats for arguments sake)




I guess part of this question is also, are we better pass first spread or running/throwing spread?

[Pollodawg]

Offenses take on the personality of theirQB. With TR, we will always be a finesse team--which is not what we were born to be. If it were me, I would take option number two if TR struggled this season. I don;t the O would be as herkyjerky if we ran an offense that Mullen and Koening were both more comfortable in and like to call plays out of.

[FISHDAWG]

great topic - I see a long thread developing ... I am a TR fan and I love to watch him back there as a gun slinger when it's working ... and that's the problem (when it's working) ... I think the added wrinkle of read-option is harder to defend and that translates into better consistency for the offense ... also wears the defense down much sooner ... so. I'm going against what I like to see (TR) in favor of what I believe would probably work better (Dak) .... but, you better have a healthy back-up QB that is capable of running the same offense

[FlabLoser]

Last year we traded rushing yards for passing yards. The real problem is we shouldn't have traded rushing. We should have added passing.

There just wasn't much flow to the offense. We needed to run better.

[BeastMan]

Bingo flab. A lot of fans got excited because of passing yards but when you look, we were the 59th passing offense in football. I didn't like the trade off for what it does to the defense

[Coach 57]

Option "B" or the Dak option and it's not even close! The reason for this is really simple. As JWS has said before "to beat the top teams like Florida or LSU we have to be abe to BEAT THEM UP because we can't outrun or out athlete teams with 5 stars". In context to this we need to understand this is a VERY sound philosophy. We have to make the game as ugly and as physical as possible and no matter what any of the Tyler lovers think WE CAN NOT DO THIS WITH HAVING A PASSING OFFENSE! We need to make the 2nd & 3rd levels of their defense to second guess where they are supposed to be on a specific play. And you can't do that with Tyler.

[KnoxvilleDawg]

It wasn't like we were completely ineffective running the ball last year. Seemed like our coaches decided tailoring our offense for TR meant abandoning the run and trying to bomb the ball 20 times a game (with short, slow receivers who get no separation).

Perkins can be a dynamic weapon for us with either QB, we just need to run him more and throw to him 4-7 times a game and our numbers will improve, no matter who the QB is.

[Coach 57]

But the fact of the matter is that with Dak it is an aggressive running offense the likes of which we haven't yet seen as he is FAR faster and more dynamic than Relf was. And a FAR better passer to boot.

[Goat Holder]

Right now it has to be Tyler. He's the Sr. veteran leader. He's a talented QB who could get himself drafted. You have to play that guy.

But I am in no way ignoring the fact that Mullen prefers a dual-threat QB. I realize that the offense will never be complete until we have that (which will be 2014 with an upper-class Prescott and hopefully a Sandberg behind him). But all things considered, at this point in our progression, you go with the Sr. and mold to his strengths the best you can.

[biscuit]

Last year we traded rushing yards for passing yards. The real problem is we shouldn't have traded rushing. We should have added passing.

There just wasn't much flow to the offense. We needed to run better.

Exactly. You HAVE to be able to run the ball in this conference.

[PMDawg]

I think this is a misunderstanding that has been repeated by too many people. We are not a "finesse" team with Tyler. He is a very tough player. Throwing does not = finesse. I see another reply below that repeats what I feel is another misconception...that we "didnt" run enough. I think we COULDN'T run on better defenses. We tried and got stuffed. Our OL is not good at run blocking which is why we are seeing some under center stuff this spring. Add a TE and FB to the equation and we may get some more push up the middle and seal off the edges better. Back to the original theme, our problem with Tyler isn't a question of finesse vs ground and pound. I don't even think its scheme. It really boils down to two huge holes in Tyler's game. You could even argue they are one and the same. He holds the damn ball too long and he doesn't throw his receivers open. I don't know if he doesn't understand how, or if he doesn't trust the WRs enough, or if he's just too scared of the defense. Whatever the reason, he misses too many big plays and drive continuing conversions by not throwing the ball until he thinks a WR is wide ass open. He waits for the route to finish, no matter what. If he got the ball out quicker and developed a better sense of timing, there would be no need for this question. He would shatter all of our records with ease and we would've won 3 more games last year. As it is though, I still think its Tyler, only due to experience levels. We are bringing Dak along just right. If you throw him out there as the starter this year, you'd have to expect a lot of rookie mistakes. He needs to play a lot this year, but not start. Get him ready to start next year. If Tyler figures these two things out, we have a big year. He probably won't, so were looking at 6 or 7 wins. I doubt Dak could improve on that in the starters role.

[Pollodawg]

I think this is a misunderstanding that has been repeated by too many people. We are not a "finesse" team with Tyler. He is a very tough player. Throwing does not = finesse. I see another reply below that repeats what I feel is another misconception...that we "didnt" run enough. I think we COULDN'T run on better defenses. We tried and got stuffed. Our OL is not good at run blocking which is why we are seeing some under center stuff this spring. Add a TE and FB to the equation and we may get some more push up the middle and seal off the edges better. Back to the original theme, our problem with Tyler isn't a question of finesse vs ground and pound. I don't even think its scheme. It really boils down to two huge holes in Tyler's game. You could even argue they are one and the same. He holds the damn ball too long and he doesn't throw his receivers open. I don't know if he doesn't understand how, or if he doesn't trust the WRs enough, or if he's just too scared of the defense. Whatever the reason, he misses too many big plays and drive continuing conversions by not throwing the ball until he thinks a WR is wide ass open. He waits for the route to finish, no matter what. If he got the ball out quicker and developed a better sense of timing, there would be no need for this question. He would shatter all of our records with ease and we would've won 3 more games last year. As it is though, I still think its Tyler, only due to experience levels. We are bringing Dak along just right. If you throw him out there as the starter this year, you'd have to expect a lot of rookie mistakes. He needs to play a lot this year, but not start. Get him ready to start next year. If Tyler figures these two things out, we have a big year. He probably won't, so were looking at 6 or 7 wins. I doubt Dak could improve on that in the starters role.

Maybe finesse was the wrong word. But there is no denying that he isn't the physical player that Dak is. Tyler's problem--for a long time at any rate--was that he never had to overcome adversity of any sort on the football field. Hew as sacked a handful of times total his senior season at Meridian. He HAD ALL DAY to throw in high school because he played for one of the consistently best teams in the state. That's not a luxury he has at MSU. Here, he is dealing with meh wideouts and an offense line that can hold it's own, but not while he holds the ball for 15 mins. Plus, I just like the smash mouth style of football that Mullen is known for and Dak brings with him.

[Coach34]

Lots of good points in this thread

Tyler is going to be the QB until the offense looks like shit, he gets hurt, or the season starts going in the tank. We have made some changes that should help him a little. But I still dont see us going under center even half the time. Last year, our running scheme was terrible. Stretch play to the right- counter play to the left. No option, very little zone read, and no lead playfor the QB to hit it up inside. You have to do those types of things if you are going to stay in the shotgun every play.

I do agree that Tyler holds the ball too long and doesnt lead WR's open. When he is not doing that in his 4th season- that's a problem. He holds the ball like that in the NFL and he wont last long- he'll get killed.

Dak? Dak does some really good things-but still has some footwork issues. He is a better runner than Relf- altho probably not quite as durable. He is also a better thrower. Sandberg being on the team would be the wildcard in all this. If the offense with Russell isnt working and we are struggling, Mullen would be more likely to switch if Dakota had a back-up that was mobile as well. Sandberg's baseball background is also a big plus- because he already has some pretty good footwork that baseball players normally have.

For the record- I dont think we will end up with Dak at QB this year. I think the offense will be just good enough to keep playing Tyler and we limp on thru to 6-6- maybe a 7-5 if some certain things go right. The play action from under center and a good group of TE's could certainly play a huge factor in us improving a great deal on 3rd downs.

[FISHDAWG]

I think the interceptions he threw as a freshman & sophomore contributes to holding the ball to long ... however, it also takes some time for the recvrs to clear or the route develop and has made some good plays as well just because of this ... holding onto the ball isn't always a bad thing, he just doesn't have the scramble factor to go with the arm ... but, still - it's not like he was sacked 3 or 4 times per game

[Coach 57]

PM you are kind of right and yet still kind of wrong. Do you honestly think that our 09'-10' OL was a great running line? I actually would argue our OL is as good if not better between the OTs last yr and this yr. But yet those first two Mullen teams WERE PHYSICAL football teams. On offense and in defense. There is an old sayin' coaches in many sports say and it applies here. You PLAY HOW YOU PRACTICE! If we practice throwing the ball rep after rep after rep (as we did much of last yr) you WILL (and we were last yr) become a finesse team. It's a fact! Then when they scrimmage and it's "LIVE" it starts a trickle down effect to the defense. The thing that bothered me most about the Egg Bowl last yr or that I saw coming was TSUN turned into a physical football team because if the physical offense they ran. They were FAR MORE physical than we were in the contest and if you couldn't see that then I don't know what else to tell you.

[fishwater99]

It doesn't matter, and we won't find out how good DAK is b/c TR is going to start and play QB next year, unless injured.

We Mullen needs to do is use a FB and get under center to run the ball, then use the play action to get TR some time to throw down-field.

TR is not a spread QB, and Mullen needs to adapt the offense to fit TR as he is a pro style QB. Time will tell..

[PMDawg]

The truly frustrating this is that TR has the talent to have kept this from ever being an issue. Substitute TR for a prolific pocket passer who gets the ball out quickly (Aaron Murray for instance) and then ask the question. It becomes an easy choice.

I agree that the mobile QB play book is more fun and creative though. I'm excited to see it with Dak for two full years.

[maroonmania]

To me its a no brainer and has nothing to do with the individual talent that Russell or Prescott have as QBs. Its all about Mullen's offensive philosophy and the fact that a Mullen offense works significantly better with a Prescott style QB than a Russell style QB. Once Tyler is gone I don't want to see us recruiting pro style QBs anymore as long as Mullen is here. But the first priority is getting Dak back healthy enough to be a force at QB for us this Fall. If that doesn't happen we are in a world of hurt with our QB situation being limited to a SR and 2 (maybe 1) true freshmen. I will say if we get both Sandberg and Williams on campus to go with Prescott for the next couple of years we will set to go for a while. All 3 fit Mullen's offensive style perfectly.

[col. forbin]

I think that we are the better team now and in the long run with TR. This is hard to explain through typing, but I believe the teams that have a pro-style qb rather than your dual-threat set them selves up better for long term success. Your big time RBs and WRs would rather play for the pocket passer,imo. If your RBs are a threat,which i think ours are, it gives more options for the D to key on and not just spy on the QB. Dak can throw the ball,dont get me wrong, but he is not the aerial threat that TR is.

[gravedigger]

I'm not sure that there is a hard and fast answer to the question but I will say that when the qb has a running option, defenses tend to give us better passing lanes. This allows us to move the ball and control clock better.

I'd certainly vote the Dak option, but not because I dont like Tyler or appreciate his talent. It's just that our offense doesnt function well when opposing defenses can put extra people in the box. NOW if Tyler were to start getting the ball in a more timely fashion to receivers or we ran a more short pass timing pattern type game, I could see either qb being a wash.

But as it stands, our personnel are geared towards a qb that has the running dimension. This is why Relf had any success passing on those occasions he did. They had to keep people near the line of scrimmage to keep him from destroying them to the tune of 7-10 yards a pop. This left a receiver open each play.

We need to start from scratch and design plays that DONT allow Tyler to ad lib in the pocket. Use his arm to hit the timing plays. If not, the running qb is our best option.

[DCdawg]

The difference is really in the defense, in my opinion. When Relf was QB we had a pretty good defense. They also were rested better from series to series. How often did Relf and his offense go 3 and out compared to Russell? It seems like it was pretty often that we went 3 and out this past season and our defense got worn down pretty quickly. With Dak you can pound it and probably run down much more of the clock and rest your defense too. Last year with TR we couldn't really do that. Running the clock and holding the ball was the difference in many of Relf's games.

[maroonmania]

I think that we are the better team now and in the long run with TR. This is hard to explain through typing, but I believe the teams that have a pro-style qb rather than your dual-threat set them selves up better for long term success. Your big time RBs and WRs would rather play for the pocket passer,imo. If your RBs are a threat,which i think ours are, it gives more options for the D to key on and not just spy on the QB. Dak can throw the ball,dont get me wrong, but he is not the aerial threat that TR is.

For us to be successful with a pocket passer though we need an elite one. And whether you realize it or not we are really in an uphill battle in recruiting elite pocket QBs. Those guys almost always gravitate to the very high profile programs. Tyler is probably near the absolute top end of what we can recruit talent wise as a pure pocket passer and we got him primarily because he is MS guy that grew up following MSU. But given the fact that MS High Schools don't produce many high end pocket QBs then it becomes even harder for us to recruit to that style.

[War Machine Dawg]

Everyone knows where I stand on this: I'd personally start Dak.

TR is a very good pro style passing QB. Can't believe I'm saying, but he might have actually been the guy to make Crxxm's Gulf Coast Offense actually capable of moving the ball and scoring points. And I respect the hell out of TR sticking with us after Crxxms left and waiting his turn behind Relf. He's had his moments where he's shown he can be a very good SEC QB. But he's also had some Henigesque moments, most notably the Gator Bowl.

That said, Dak is the guy that's absolutely tailor made for what we want to do on offense now. He's a gym rat that's built like a damn Sherman tank. I was told Saturday he's up to 235 now. He can definitely handle the punishment running QBs take in this league. He's had some really nice runs for us, makes the defense have to account for him, and brings a real toughness to our team. He's also a very good passer. He's not TR, but he's already much better than Relf. So I think you're probably short-changing him by projecting his numbers based off Relf's. Plus, he has better WRs to throw to than Relf did.

My main reason for Dak over TR has been stated by others: We're a finesse team with TR at QB. I can't overemphasize how much I HATE finesse football teams. That shit might work in the Big 12 or Pac 12, but you better be physical in the SEC. Dak makes us a much, much more physical offense.

I also think Flab made an excellent point: Last year we simply swapped rushing yards for passing yards. We need to add passing yards to the pre-existing rush yards, not swap one for the other. There are only a limited number of ways to do that - a) Go more pro style or b) Have a true dual threat QB. We likely won't do A. And even if we try, there's a good chance we won't do it very well because our offensive staff isn't comfortable calling that scheme. To me, that means B is the better solution. With all respect for Relf, he wasn't a true dual threat QB. He was a RB that happened to have a big arm. He worked his ass off and greatly improved his passing, but his limited pass experience in HS and the "coaching" he received from Wxxdy really hindered him. Dak, on the other hand, is a true dual threat. He ran a very similar offense in HS. He threw a lot. Hell, he might have been a better passer coming out of HS than Relf was when he graduated. Our best chance at adding passing yards to our rush yards instead of swapping them lies with Dak.

All that said, we all know TR will start and get at least 75% of the snaps. I know this is a fun topic to kick around, but it's really pretty pointless. Hopefully we'll have big success out of the one back. We also need to wise up and give the bulk of the RB carries to J-Rob. Perk is a match-up nightmare if we'd use him in a more versatile role. Regardless, I'm getting pretty damn excited for football. We desperately need to find a way to make a bowl this year to keep the program's momentum moving forward, despite our brutal schedule.

[Coach34]

I think that we are the better team now and in the long run with TR. This is hard to explain through typing, but I believe the teams that have a pro-style qb rather than your dual-threat set them selves up better for long term success. .

Tebow, Cam Newton, and Johnny Manziel disagree with this.

We have a much better chance of getting good mobile QB's to Miss State than we do upper level dropback QB's. That's a certified fact. All those QB's had something else in common- good offensive lines. I think we have to get better in our recruiting here also.

We have to be good on defense, and control the ball on offense. That is the Miss State way. Why you ask?

We are NEVER going to have the best WR's in the SEC
We are NEVER going to have an elite QB.
But what can we have? Good offensive linemen, good RB's, and a solid, mobile QB

[biscuit]

Tebow, Cam Newton, and Johnny Manziel disagree with this.

We have a much better chance of getting good mobile QB's to Miss State than we do upper level dropback QB's. That's a certified fact. All those QB's had something else in common- good offensive lines. I think we have to get better in our recruiting here also.

We have to be good on defense, and control the ball on offense. That is the Miss State way. Why you ask?

We are NEVER going to have the best WR's in the SEC
We are NEVER going to have an elite QB.
But what can we have? Good offensive linemen, good RB's, and a solid, mobile QB

This is the way JWS won so many games in the 90s. D first, ST second and run, run, run

[BeastMan]

We are NEVER going to have the best WR's in the SEC
We are NEVER going to have an elite QB.
But what can we have? Good offensive linemen, good RB's, and a solid, mobile QB


I believe this as well. We need to be a running team who throws well, maybe not great, to have the highest success we can. Our history proves this too

[gravedigger]

We have a much better chance of getting good mobile QB's to Miss State than we do upper level dropback QB's. That's a certified fact. All those QB's had something else in common- good offensive lines. I think we have to get better in our recruiting here also.

We have to be good on defense, and control the ball on offense. That is the Miss State way. Why you ask?

We are NEVER going to have the best WR's in the SEC
We are NEVER going to have an elite QB.
But what can we have? Good offensive linemen, good RB's, and a solid, mobile QB

I agree with the idea of controlling the ball. When we limit other teams opportunities to score, we put pressure on them to take stupid chances.

Dan's offenses just dont require you have the best Wr's in the conference because his offense is looking for mismatches. A qb that can recognize this and MAKE the defense pay for dropping too many back by being able to run, OR can see the box loaded and make the quick throw is what offsets the talent difference between our skill players and the sec's dominant defenses. Otherwise we are forced to be like Bama and have a qb that has the wonder gift of running backs and wr's that are MORE talented than the defenses they face. I just dont think that will be likely to happen very often and so what if it doesnt. Dan's offense isnt a gimmick. It just requires you have all skill players on the offense able to get the yards that the defense gives them rather than trying to force the qb and wr's to make the all world plays that are required to beat sec defenses.

We can most certainly get an elite qb. We can get all sec wr's. But our offense cannot depend upon those things happening to be successful. We are going to have to out think our competition. The defense we have now is more than enough to keep us within reach of the better teams.

The offense can be too. But in order to be successful with the current play selection that Tyler gives us, we'd have to be playing non sec defenses. That isnt an option. Neither is hoping lightning to strike by waiting for anthony dixon, eric moulds and tyler russell to be on the same team at the same time.

[Coach34]

I dont consider Tyler an "elite" QB. Also, we wouldnt even have him had he not been from Mississippi. Highly-rated QB's arent leaving other states to come to Sville.

Almost all of our top players at every position in school history have been from Mississippi. This is why I say we wont have "elite" QB's and WR's- Mississippi just doesnt produce that many.

[FlabLoser]

Nice sig.

[gravedigger]

I dont disagree with Tyler not being one...or at least he hasnt risen to that level. What I mean is that the elite players go to teams that win on a national stage and get national coverage. We can get those elite qb's wr's and rb's but they will come from outside MS when we succeed at the strengths of our coach and our team and play on those stages.

And we cannot afford to wait to get them from MS at the rate we have gotten players in the past. We are going to have to win nationally to bring them here and it isnt going to happen by trying to be good in a philosophy of offense that our coach does not proscribe to.

What I am thinking is not winning a NC or even an SEC title game. What I'm thinking is that we are going to have to put a couple of 2010's together and find a way into a bcs non championship game sort of like Arkansas did a few years back. The elite players will follow and it will not require being more talented than Bama, LSU or Florida in the mean time.

What I also think must happen is that we must RID ourselves of the 4 patsy non con schedule. I'm perfectly aware our conference schedule is already too difficult, but in order to attract kids nationally, we are going to have to play an OSU calibre team EACH year so they can see our highlights on Espn, and listen to the announcers talk about us.

OM's drubbing at the hands of Texas had no negative affect on their team at the end of the season. They could have easily scheduled another patsy and had 8 wins. But they would have lost the exposure the game gave them.

Elite players will cross state lines if the tradeoff is national exposure.

[PMDawg]

Yeah, the defense looked pretty gassed the first 4 series vs Bama and the first 5 vs A&M. While our 3 and outs didnt help, they sure didnt cause the defensive shittiness that we displayed in the first qtr of both games. And I disagree with the premise. Against the LSUs and Bamas of the world, the Relf Coast Offense looked pretty shitty too. It was not hard for them to sniff out the read option and stonewall us.

[maroonmania]

I dont consider Tyler an "elite" QB. Also, we wouldnt even have him had he not been from Mississippi. Highly-rated QB's arent leaving other states to come to Sville.

Almost all of our top players at every position in school history have been from Mississippi. This is why I say we wont have "elite" QB's and WR's- Mississippi just doesnt produce that many.

Which raises an interesting question, IF Cord Sandberg makes it to campus would he likely be the best out-of-state QB prospect we've ever gotten? He was rated 4 star or very high 3 star by most recruiting sites but I personally believe his rating was lowered slightly because of his likelihood to be a baseball signee.

[Goat Holder]

What I am thinking is not winning a NC or even an SEC title game. What I'm thinking is that we are going to have to put a couple of 2010's together and find a way into a bcs non championship game sort of like Arkansas did a few years back. The elite players will follow and it will not require being more talented than Bama, LSU or Florida in the mean time.

This will only help us if the Mullen Regime stays in place, things continue as they are, etc. Yeah, Arkansas was put back on the map, but as soon as Petrino left, so did Arkansas' chances of doing anything significant.

The ONLY way to elevate ourselves long-term is to find a different niche and up our donations. That's it.

[War Machine Dawg]

I'm going to disagree. I think hiring Bielema was an absolute steal for UPig. His smashmouth style will fit perfectly in the SEC. And they've always got big, nasty OL players and RBs up there. It won't be flashy, but they'll be an offense that will be physical as hell. And it'll help out their D, too. I'm really baffled why everyone seems to think Bielema will fall flat.

[gravedigger]

No. John Bond will still hold that title unless Cord does something beyond a new years day bowl.

[Goat Holder]

but I believe the teams that have a pro-style qb rather than your dual-threat set them selves up better for long term success.

Only teams with superior talent. The pro-style stuff cuts down on turnovers as it is more conservative, that's why teams like Alabama and USC use it. All things being equal, yes, pro-style is the way to go. That's why you see it in the NFL, talent gap between best and worst is much smaller.

We don't have superior talent and likely won't for the foreseeable future, unless we get a T-Boone gift. So we have to find a niche. Right now, it's the Mullen spread that uses the QB as a real weapon, not just a 'threat' to run. Also, we need to utilize athletes that come from MS, and typically those are mobile QBs.


Your big time RBs and WRs would rather play for the pocket passer,imo.

I think this is overblown. While it's technically true (all these guys want to make it to the NFL, so they like playing in pro-style sets), what they should be looking for is a system that utilizes their talent best. Terrelle Pryor made a huge mistake going to Ohio State because he thought their pro-style would prepare him for the NFL. Had he gone to Michigan, he'd have likely looked much like Cam Newton.

[gravedigger]

The ONLY way to elevate ourselves long-term is to find a different niche and up our donations. That's it.

what would you define as a 'different niche' ?

[gravedigger]

I think this is overblown. While it's technically true (all these guys want to make it to the NFL, so they like playing in pro-style sets), what they should be looking for is a system that utilizes their talent best. Terrelle Pryor made a huge mistake going to Ohio State because he thought their pro-style would prepare him for the NFL. Had he gone to Michigan, he'd have likely looked much like Cam Newton.

absolutely agree with this. So I think i'm understanding your 'niche'.

[TopDog58]

I think that AT MSU, a QB like Dak, if he puts up the stats, could possibly pull off a win or 2 that we may not otherwise get with a dropback passer. However, go back and look at the stats. With the Dan/Urban Meyer offenses, each QB put up MONSTER statistics. And I'm just not sure that can happen at MSU when we have to play the big boys each and every year.

Josh Harris, Bowling Green senior year - 65% completions 3813 yards 27 TD; 830 rushing yards 13TD
Alex Smith, Utah senior year - 67.5% completion 2952 yards 32 TD; 631 yards rushing 10 TD
Tim Tebow, Florida sophomore year (Heisman) - 67% completions 3286 yds 32 TD; 895 yards 23 TD

Two of those guys put up big numbers against less than stellar competition. The other won a Heisman and his numbers have since been eclipsed by 2 more Heisman winners in Newton and Manziel.

I agree with some others that said this type of offense helps us with some of the recruiting deficiencies we will always have. We are never going to consistently get the 5* receivers and running backs. But it also takes a special QB and we aren't guaranteed to have one of those on campus every year either. For MSU, Tyler is a special QB. It's up to Dan to get the most he can out of him for this year, then we can move on to his bread and butter style of offense.

[Pollodawg]

People knock Mullen's recruiting, but look how well Petrino did at Arky running A SYSTEM. I'm honestly not sure he ever hauled in more than one class ranked in the top 25. Mullen's system can work, if Mullen will play the guys that make it go.

In the SEC, we will have to go after big, mean D lineman. We will need Offensive linemen who are quick on their feet and smart. People don't realize how smart an O lineman has to be to be effective. I love that O line is intact this year.

We've done that the the d lineman. There won't be a starter on our d line that wasn't a four star out of high school this year if Nick and Quay play along with Eulls and Autry.

[col. forbin]

Only teams with superior talent. The pro-style stuff cuts down on turnovers as it is more conservative, that's why teams like Alabama and USC use it. All things being equal, yes, pro-style is the way to go. That's why you see it in the NFL, talent gap between best and worst is much smaller.

We don't have superior talent and likely won't for the foreseeable future, unless we get a T-Boone gift. So we have to find a niche. Right now, it's the Mullen spread that uses the QB as a real weapon, not just a 'threat' to run. Also, we need to utilize athletes that come from MS, and typically those are mobile QBs.



I think this is overblown. While it's technically true (all these guys want to make it to the NFL, so they like playing in pro-style sets), what they should be looking for is a system that utilizes their talent best. Terrelle Pryor made a huge mistake going to Ohio State because he thought their pro-style would prepare him for the NFL. Had he gone to Michigan, he'd have likely looked much like Cam Newton.


I agree with what you said and do believe that we have to find an athletic qb for us to be successful in the immediate future. If we can ever susatin success and thats a big if, thats when we should/could start going after your elite pro styles. Long story short, I just dont like dual threat qbs as much as pro style.

[CadaverDawg]

I think everyone can agree that TR is superior to Dak throwing the ball. Lat year our offense rewrote school passing records but finished 9th in the SEC in scoring at 29.5 points per game.

Here's the question. Are we a better team with:

A) Tyler Russell throwing for approximately 2,900 yards, 24 TD's, and 10 ints

or

B) Dak Prescott throwing for 2,100 yards, 12 TD's, and 6 ints. Also 500 rushing yards and 5 TD's (I stayed very close to Relf's 2010 stats for arguments sake)




I guess part of this question is also, are we better pass first spread or running/throwing spread?

B

Because we KNOW Mullen can coach an offense run by Relf/Dak. And we have a good OLine and RB core. Everything is set up better for this team to be a Relf Coast Offense team run by Dak. But it won't happen.

[Goat Holder]

Lots of things. As far as talent goes, we have to get through different avenues, rather than just go out and sign the best like Alabama does. We have to hit the JUCOs (a strength in MS). We have to have a brand outside 'championship football'. We have to do hashtags/flashy uniforms/godzillatrons. We have to run an innovative type of offense.

Basically, since we're not on a level playing field with Bama/LSU, we can't expect to beat them at their own game. But I say this again....none of it takes the place of dynamic playmakers and money. Take a Cam Newton and a Nick Fairley and the talent is damn near neutralized vs. anybody.