Indiana is why we shouldn't give up hope

[msstate7]

They're in the best conference, and they've rose to the top while having no history and less resources than their rich conf neighbors.

[SPMT]

They're in the best conference, and they've rose to the top while having no history and less resources than their rich conf neighbors.

I?m unaware that we have a Mark Cuban.

[BlackSailsDawg]

They're in the best conference, and they've rose to the top while having no history and less resources than their rich conf neighbors.

Cig is a heck of a coach. He is not the norm. Not even close to the norm

[HoopsDawg]

Cig is a heck of a coach. He is not the norm. Not even close to the norm

One of the best coached teams I?ve ever seen. Perfect tackling and execution.

Amazing what NIL has done to the SEC the past 2 years.

[msugolf]

I?m unaware that we have a Mark Cuban.

Mark Cuban has zero to do with what their team is doing this year

[Coach34]

They're in the best conference, and they've rose to the top while having no history and less resources than their rich conf neighbors.

https://frontofficesports.com/how-indiana-quietly-became-a-big-spender-in-football/

They spent over $60MM on football- which is 20-plus million more than we spend.

"The Hoosiers also have an NIL warchest that’s competitive with the rest of the conference. After last year’s College Football Playoff berth, the team was able to retain most of its core rather than losing it to the transfer portal and make some expensive additions, too. Quarterback Fernando Mendoza has emerged as a Heisman Trophy frontrunner and is being paid $2 million, according to CBS Sports."

[PGHBulldogBG]

Mark Cuban is a convenient excuse for the Selmon and Lebby lovers to try and pretend that he couldn?t have been hired here or wouldn?t have wanted the job. This team has nothing to do with Cuban. Sure, Cuban might keep Cignetti there long term but he has nothing to do with this team.

[Turfdawg67]

Mark Cuban has zero to do with what their team is doing this year

He gave a "big number" to their Athletic Dept this year. I'm sure they used some of that money to pay their Heisman QB his $2 million salary, so yes he had something to do with their success this year. But their president has been boosting their athletic spending since she arrived in 2021.

http://https://frontofficesports.com/how-indiana-quietly-became-a-big-spender-in-football/ (https://frontofficesports.com/how-indiana-quietly-became-a-big-spender-in-football/")

[HoopsDawg]

How much rev share do we allocate to Women?s basketball? Because it should be 0.

[Prediction? Pain.]

What they've done the past two years is remarkable. The two years before Cig they were 2 - 10, 4 - 8, and 3 - 9. And check out the roster talent disparities they've faced this year:

https://i.postimg.cc/W3q669Yd/Screenshot-20260101-185305.png

https://i.postimg.cc/2S3qZ1KG/Screenshot-20260101-185245.png

[Brobi-wan]

Some of y?all are losers pretending to be the realist. That?s infinitely more annoying than the eternal optimist.

[Coach34]

Some of y?all are losers pretending to be the realist. That?s infinitely more annoying than the eternal optimist.

I'm sorry that facts hurt your feelings. No bottom spenders in college football are big winners. They simply arent

[SPMT]

Mark Cuban is a convenient excuse for the Selmon and Lebby lovers to try and pretend that he couldn?t have been hired here or wouldn?t have wanted the job. This team has nothing to do with Cuban. Sure, Cuban might keep Cignetti there long term but he has nothing to do with this team.

I?m certainly no Lebby fan. Cuban has impact.

Cignetti is an unbelievable coach. You can tell by his demeanor and how the team plays together and executes.

[msstate7]

I'm sorry that facts hurt your feelings. No bottom spenders in college football are big winners. They simply arent

Shut up. They made the playoffs last year when they didn't spend a ton

[parabrave]

I?m certainly no Lebby fan. Cuban has impact.

Cignetti is an unbelievable coach. You can tell by his demeanor and how the team plays together and executes.

And what a badass OL/DL he has put together. Thats what makes them a dam good team plus a well disciplined team. They don't make mistakes and they tackle pretty well.

[Dawgology]

Basically what everyone is telling you is that Mississippi State is THE only Division 1 school with no rich boosters or alumni out of the 170,000 alumni base and 400,000+ enrollees over the last 70 years. And those that do have money apparently hate their Alma mater

[Coach34]

Shut up. They made the playoffs last year when they didn't spend a ton

But they did program wise- 50% more than us. Think about that gap. Indiana spends more on football than 1/3 of the SEC. Almost half. All they did for 2025 was up their NIL. And now for 2026 they are going to double their spending on front office/coaching personnel. We arent doing that shit. Until we get a $50MM infusion into football which is about the equal of what we got into baseball last Spring-we arent going anywhere no matter who coaches us

[Coach34]

Shut up. They made the playoffs last year when they didn't spend a ton

Also you fail to acknowledge that Cig brought about 25 players to Indy with him that were successful and good already. Thats a helluva base to build a team around.

[Dawgology]

But they did program wise- 50% more than us. Think about that gap. Indiana spends more on football than 1/3 of the SEC. Almost half. All they did for 2025 was up their NIL. And now for 2026 they are going to double their spending on front office/coaching personnel. We arent doing that shit. Until we get a $50MM infusion into football which is about the equal of what we got into baseball last Spring-we arent going anywhere no matter who coaches us

Who needs to fund football when you have the national prestige and money making capability of college baseball haahahahhaahha faaaaaaaaart

[Brobi-wan]

I'm sorry that facts hurt your feelings. No bottom spenders in college football are big winners. They simply arent

You’d have to try a lot harder to hurt my feelings. It’s just weird to constantly flex failure and never provide a solution out of it. The constant negative connotation makes for a boring back and forth. There are avenues which we can leverage to climb out of mediocrity. Will they be taken is another question

The only program people seem to care about is going to suffer if we don’t make sure we are included in realignment.

[msstate7]

But they did program wise- 50% more than us. Think about that gap. Indiana spends more on football than 1/3 of the SEC. Almost half. All they did for 2025 was up their NIL. And now for 2026 they are going to double their spending on front office/coaching personnel. We arent doing that shit. Until we get a $50MM infusion into football which is about the equal of what we got into baseball last Spring-we arent going anywhere no matter who coaches us

Show me a link of what they spend last year

[Turfdawg67]

Shut up. They made the playoffs last year when they didn't spend a ton

The link I posted above said they spent $62M, on football alone, in 2024. Up from $24M in 2021. That's some serious cash infusion to a program.

ETA... he posted the same link as well

[msstate7]

Here's sporting news on playoff NIL spending

https://www.sportingnews.com/us/ncaa-football/news/nil-money-school-how-texas-tech-playoff-teams-compare-2025/1113311c3c2de9dc001aacf1

[Coach34]

Show me a link of what they spend last year

I've already sent you a link. It clearly said they topped the conference median for spending in 2024. Wtf?

You morons need to understand college football of old is gone. It doesnt matter what the name on the jersey says. Dolla bills ya'll. You cant compare anything from 2022 and beyond to 2019 and earlier. It's a new age with new rules.

[Coach34]

Here's sporting news on playoff NIL spending

https://www.sportingnews.com/us/ncaa-football/news/nil-money-school-how-texas-tech-playoff-teams-compare-2025/1113311c3c2de9dc001aacf1

I saw that and its horribly wrong. Mississippi spent way more than that and there is no way to have so many NA's for public universities

[msstate7]

The link I posted above said they spent $62M, on football alone, in 2024. Up from $24M in 2021. That's some serious cash infusion to a program.

They didn't spend 62 million on NIL. Are you insane?

[msstate7]

I've already sent you a link. It clearly said they topped the conference median for spending in 2024. Wtf?

You morons need to understand college football of old is gone. It doesnt matter what the name on the jersey says. Dolla bills ya'll. You cant compare anything from 2022 and beyond to 2019 and earlier. It's a new age with new rules.

Conf median on football spending. That isn't NIL

[Turfdawg67]

They didn't spend 62 million on NIL. Are you insane?

Of course not. For all football operations.

[msstate7]

ChatGPT says miss state spend 35.55 million on football this season, but that's not NIL.

[Coach34]

Conf median on football spending. That isn't NIL

Holy crap- ok.

Football spending spending is about how much they spend on the program. Analysts. Front office personnel. Guys that spend all day watching recruits video. Guys that eval every school's rosters. All that shit. Their budget for all that is 50% larger than ours. Then they got a huge boost in NIL on top of that. I can assure your NIL doesnt match Indy's when they pay they starter 2MM and our entire QB room was 1.5

Argue all you want- other schools realize it takes money to fund the program. And we did it in baseball. We do it half ass in basketball. But in football we are bottom 10 in the P4 easy. Kansas spends more than us. Think about that.

[msstate7]

Of course not. For all football operations.

My whole point of this thread is Indiana isn't spending on NIL like Ohio st, Michigan, Penn st, Oregon, etc., yet they're succeeding big time. That should be something to place hope on for a program like us. The chances of us pulling it off are small, but it does show a path for a smaller program.

[Coach34]

ChatGPT says miss state spend 35.55 million on football this season, but that's not NIL.

So Indiana spent almost twice as much as we did. There is your answer

[Coach34]

My whole point of this thread is Indiana isn't spending on NIL like Ohio st, Michigan, Penn st, Oregon, etc., yet they're succeeding big time. That should be something to place hope on for a program like us. The chances of us pulling it off are small, but it does show a path for a smaller program.

Yet they spent 2MM on 1 QB- while our entire QB room was 1.5

You arent making the point you thought you were

[msstate7]

Yet they spent 2MM on 1 QB- while our entire QB room was 1.5

You arent making the point you thought you were

So they made the playoffs last season and upped their lending this year, cool.

[Quaoarsking]

It's kinda ridiculous that every player's salary isn't public knowledge and easily searchable, like it is in the NFL.

Earlier I was trying to figure out which G5 schools spend the closest to the P4 on NIL/salary, and it's just not available. I assume the answer is Memphis and Boise State, but who else? Fresno State? North Texas?

[Coach34]

So they made the playoffs last season and upped their lending this year, cool.

Well- get ready to contribute 100K to keep KT after he has a great season in 26. Because if he does? It will take 3-5MM to keep him. He wont turn down 5MM from Ohio St or Bama to stay at State for 2MM

[bulldawg28]

Also you fail to acknowledge that Cig brought about 25 players to Indy with him that were successful and good already. Thats a helluva base to build a team around.

He brought James Madison players with him. Those players are Inexpensive and average football players. Nothing special or unique about them other than ultimate team players and he didn't have to build his team from the portal andr team chemistry.

[bulldawg28]

Well- get ready to contribute 100K to keep KT after he has a great season in 26. Because if he does? It will take 3-5MM to keep him. He wont turn down 5MM from Ohio St or Bama to stay at State for 2MM

You are the pessimistic of pessimist.

[bulldawg28]

They didn't spend 62 million on NIL. Are you insane?

Exactly, they're beating teams with a roster full of James Madison transfers. They were glad for the opportunity to play on the big stage.

[Coach34]

He brought James Madison players with him. Those players are Inexpensive and average football players. .

Apparently not. Mendoza is a 1st round draft pick. Soooooo no- they arent average. Tell Oregon they are average- they put 30 plus on their ass while TT couldnt do shit.

[bulldawg28]

Apparently not. Mendoza is a 1st round draft pick. Soooooo no- they arent average. Tell Oregon they are average- they put 30 plus on their ass while TT couldnt do shit.

That's one player. And he's throwing to #13 his top guy that's from the great James Madison academy. Kick rocks with that, I know better. It's coaching.

[msstate7]

Indiana recruiting rankings last year...
39th overall
49th composite
25th transfer

[Rawdawg]

They signed a generational talent that won the Heisman with NIL out of the transfer portal. Wtf are we talking about here.

[Coursesuper]

Indiana recruiting rankings last year...
39th overall
49th composite
25th transfer

What matters is bringing in the right players and they brought in a Heisman winner with others. You can’t quantify everything with a statistic. Someday you’ll figure it out.

[msstate7]

What matters is bringing in the right players and they brought in a Heisman winner with others. You can’t quantify everything with a statistic. Someday you’ll figure it out.

The point is they didn't go out and buy 5-stars

[msstate7]

They signed a generational talent that won the Heisman with NIL out of the transfer portal. Wtf are we talking about here.

They made the playoffs last year. Who was the heisman last year?

[Rawdawg]

Boise state made the playoffs last year too

[msstate7]

Boise state made the playoffs last year too

With a heisman finalist. How'd they follow it up this season?

[Coursesuper]

The point is they didn't go out and buy 5-stars

You have to bring in the right players, 5 star or not. And you still missing the point. They have elevated the entire spending structure for the program which is what it takes. Like usual y’all need to see the big picture here. There is not one thing that puts you ahead you have to do them all. But not doing one will hold you back every time.

[Rawdawg]

With a heisman finalist. How'd they follow it up this season?

That?s my point?

[msstate7]

You have to bring in the right players, 5 star or not. And you still missing the point. They have elevated the entire spending structure for the program which is what it takes. Like usual y’all need to see the big picture here. There is not one thing that puts you ahead you have to do them all. But not doing one will hold you back every time.

Fine, we will never win anything. Happy?

[Coach34]

They made the playoffs last year. Who was the heisman last year?

It's the same QB. So they had a heisman level QB for both these seasons. Obviously it makes a difference to have a 1st round QB leading your program dummy

[Coach34]

Fine, we will never win anything. Happy?

Exactly. Until we spend some money- we arent going to win shit. So hoping for success or blaming Lebby for losing games is ridiculous

[msstate7]

It's the same QB. So they had a heisman level QB for both these seasons. Obviously it makes a difference to have a 1st round QB leading your program dummy

Rourke was the qb

[Cowbell]

Apparently not. Mendoza is a 1st round draft pick. Soooooo no- they arent average. Tell Oregon they are average- they put 30 plus on their ass while TT couldnt do shit.

Mendoza didn't come from JMU. That was an addition. You gotta start doing better research if you want to be an expert on here man. Come on, coach. You're blowin the game.

[Coursesuper]

Fine, we will never win anything. Happy?

My God y’all are an impossible breed. We are simply pointing out that your hypothesis has holes. We are trying to elevate our situation but we are simply not able to do it as quickly, it would be very nice to have had a Mark Cuban in our pocket. If we had also not started out so far behind the eight ball it would’ve been helpful. But alas here we are.

[DEDawg]

That's one player. And he's throwing to #13 his top guy that's from the great James Madison academy. Kick rocks with that, I know better. It's coaching.

This is insane. No it is not only coaching. The level of head in the sand around here is crazy

[msstate7]

Mendoza didn't come from JMU. That was an addition. You gotta start doing better research if you want to be an expert on here man. Come on, coach. You're blowin the game.

He's an idiot

[Cowbell]

Exactly. Until we spend some money- we arent going to win shit. So hoping for success or blaming Lebby for losing games is ridiculous

You don't think Lebby blew some games for us this year?

[Cowbell]

He's an idiot
Under his thought process, we need to hire high school coaches at $100k a man and spend all the millions on the players. Maybe he's thinking that will get him a shot.

[Coach34]

He's an idiot

LOL

So what you are telling me is- Indiana spent 2MM to buy a QB to make them better. In addition to other spending.

Trap set and delivered. Indy spent money to win. They spent more money than us. Alot more. It takes money you morons. That is what I am trying to teach you

[msstate7]

LOL

So what you are telling me is- Indiana spent 2MM to buy a QB to make them better. In addition to other spending.

Trap set and delivered. Indy spent money to win. They spent more money than us. Alot more. It takes money you morons. That is what I am trying to teach you

You said it was the same qb last season. It wasn't.

[Cowbell]

LOL

So what you are telling me is- Indiana spent 2MM to buy a QB to make them better. In addition to other spending.

Trap set and delivered. Indy spent money to win. They spent more money than us. Alot more. It takes money you morons. That is what I am trying to teach you

Nobody here doesn't think it doesn't take money. You need to learn how to dialogue before you worry about teaching anything.

[bulldawg28]

This is insane. No it is not only coaching. The level of head in the sand around here is crazy


Explain what it is since your understand. They got a Qb transfer that's the brother to the backup. Mendoza was 12-14 as a Cal starter. Dude wasn't a winner until he came to Indiana. Indiana had 13 transfers from James Madison, that cost $30 million, right? Mendoza is a cog to this puzzle. The team is winning with lower ranked transfer players and great coaching.

[Quaoarsking]

A good coach can overperform a program's level of spending by a game or 2 (see Indiana). A bad coach can underperform a program's level of spending by a game or 2 (see Mississippi State). But yes, in general, spending and success will be strongly correlated.

[Bothrops]

They're in the best conference, and they've rose to the top while having no history and less resources than their rich conf neighbors.

We can't do what Indiana has done. Will never happen.

[HoopsDawg]

If Ole Miss can do it, so can we. It?s a long shot, but it?s possible. Need to make a move before the rules change.

[msstate7]

If Ole Miss can do it, so can we. It?s a long shot, but it?s possible. Need to make a move before the rules change.

C34 is gonna be so pissed at you

[WeWonItAll(Most)]

Indiana's not matching Oregon and Ohio State but they are spending similar to Ole Miss on NIL

Coaching gives them the extra advantage on the margins, but they are paying to be where they are.

There is no world where you coach a sub-$20m roster into the playoffs. You have to push $25m in order for all the other things (coaching, development, etc) to begin to factor in.

[Leeshouldveflanked]

Ole Miss has much better Leadership than MSU. MSU is ran by a Government Bureaucrat.

[Todd4State]

Indiana's not matching Oregon and Ohio State but they are spending similar to Ole Miss on NIL

Coaching gives them the extra advantage on the margins, but they are paying to be where they are.

There is no world where you coach a sub-$20m roster into the playoffs. You have to push $25m in order for all the other things (coaching, development, etc) to begin to factor in.

Outstanding post!

Money is a big part of it. But it's everything coming together that makes it work.

[Todd4State]

Ole Miss has much better Leadership than MSU. MSU is ran by a Government Bureaucrat.

I think when it comes to football they have better vision on how to make it work.

MSU on the other hand almost seems scared to compete in football sometimes. There is a lot of "we can't" from MSU football.

[Turfdawg67]

https://i.postimg.cc/Bbzk4xqq/IMG-6585.jpg

Maybe TT should've spent more on football operations and less on NIL??

[msstate7]

https://i.postimg.cc/Bbzk4xqq/IMG-6585.jpg

Maybe TT should've spent more on football operations and less on NIL??

No NIL is all that matters. I'd like that list to include all programs, playoffs or not

[bulldawg28]

Indiana's not matching Oregon and Ohio State but they are spending similar to Ole Miss on NIL

Coaching gives them the extra advantage on the margins, but they are paying to be where they are.

There is no world where you coach a sub-$20m roster into the playoffs. You have to push $25m in order for all the other things (coaching, development, etc) to begin to factor in.

I doubt Indiana's NIL was 25 million for 2025. The breakdown is needed not the total football department.

[Cowbell]

Explain what it is since your understand. They got a Qb transfer that's the brother to the backup. Mendoza was 12-14 as a Cal starter. Dude wasn't a winner until he came to Indiana. Indiana had 13 transfers from James Madison, that cost $30 million, right? Mendoza is a cog to this puzzle. The team is winning with lower ranked transfer players and great coaching.

Amazing how "experts" disappear when they realize their agenda can't be supported by facts and that they don't know how to dialogue on a mature level

[basedog]

I think when it comes to football they have better vision on how to make it work.

MSU on the other hand almost seems scared to compete in football sometimes. There is a lot of "we can't" from MSU football.

Ole Dixie has old tradition that they build on and have always done. 11 Sugar Bowl appearances is pretty impressive.

[Rawdawg]

Indiana's not matching Oregon and Ohio State but they are spending similar to Ole Miss on NIL

Coaching gives them the extra advantage on the margins, but they are paying to be where they are.

There is no world where you coach a sub-$20m roster into the playoffs. You have to push $25m in order for all the other things (coaching, development, etc) to begin to factor in.

This is correct, you don?t stand a chance to allow for coaching to matter without the players and investment to begin with.

[msstate7]

I doubt Indiana's NIL was 25 million for 2025. The breakdown is needed not the total football department.

This is the point everyone is ignoring. They didn't spend anywhere close to the big boys last year, and yet, they made the playoffs. That run is what fueled the funds to step it up a notch this season.

If we made a run to get to the playoffs next season, our NIL would explode going into to 2027.

[Coursesuper]

Indiana's not matching Oregon and Ohio State but they are spending similar to Ole Miss on NIL

Coaching gives them the extra advantage on the margins, but they are paying to be where they are.

There is no world where you coach a sub-$20m roster into the playoffs. You have to push $25m in order for all the other things (coaching, development, etc) to begin to factor in.

Stop this making complete sense business. You’re gonna make us look bad.

[DEDawg]

Explain what it is since your understand. They got a Qb transfer that's the brother to the backup. Mendoza was 12-14 as a Cal starter. Dude wasn't a winner until he came to Indiana. Indiana had 13 transfers from James Madison, that cost $30 million, right? Mendoza is a cog to this puzzle. The team is winning with lower ranked transfer players and great coaching.

Explain what? You said it in your post. They spent $30M on just 13 players according to you. It is insane to think anyone is winning anything with just good coaching these days.

[DEDawg]

Amazing how "experts" disappear when they realize their agenda can't be supported by facts and that they don't know how to dialogue on a mature level

Who are you talking to

[msstate7]

What fueled this season for Indiana started last season. I'm genuinely untested in what you guys think that class cost. Here's the breakdown on the 2 recruiting site leaders...

2024 Indiana 247:
17 HS (1 4-star)
31 transfers (2 4-star)
46th overall
30th transfer
66th overall

On3:
60th
Avg nil value - 61k

ETA... for reference, our 2024 class had an avg nil value of 93k.

[msstate7]

What's the lowest 3-year avg composite recruiting ranking to win a natty? We probably looking at history this season

[Rawdawg]

What's the lowest 3-year avg composite recruiting ranking to win a natty? We probably looking at history this season

No idea but if you look at our in state recruiting since 2020 it?s absolutely putrid. We?ve missed on a ton of kids.

[msstate7]

No idea but if you look at our in state recruiting since 2020 it?s absolutely putrid. We?ve missed on a ton of kids.

And until we show a pulse, we will continue to. We will absolutely have to pony up money, but the way things are now, we have to offer way more than our competition

[DEDawg]

What's the lowest 3-year avg composite recruiting ranking to win a natty? We probably looking at history this season

My guess is 2010 Auburn. Which if accurate shows coaching isn't as important as the players. You need a Heisman level guy at QB (Cam, Mendoza, Chambliss, Moore) and really good pieces around him. Cam is a bit of an exception though, I know Fairley was on that team, but I can't really remember much else, Cam was just literally superman in college.

[Pinto]

In state recruiting should be a fill a spot plan. Not our primary focus. Kiffin said that himself and he?s right especially when it comes to the offense. The state does produce defense players at a higher level but only about 3 to 5 high quality players for offense.

Thinking we need to dominate high school recruiting in this state is very old head thinking.


And until we show a pulse, we will continue to. We will absolutely have to pony up money, but the way things are now, we have to offer way more than our competition

[Maroon Glasses]

What fueled this season for Indiana started last season. I'm genuinely untested in what you guys think that class cost. Here's the breakdown on the 2 recruiting site leaders...

2024 Indiana 247:
17 HS (1 4-star)
31 transfers (2 4-star)
46th overall
30th transfer
66th overall

On3:
60th
Avg nil value - 61k

ETA... for reference, our 2024 class had an avg nil value of 93k.

I'm with you 7. I'm confused also on some of the NIL references. This Indiana team is full of G-5 players and a once mediocre QB. The system the coaches built around him along with the technicality of this team in every aspect is phenomenal. One of the best coaching jobs I have ever seen, if not the best.

[Turfdawg67]

I'm with you 7. I'm confused also on some of the NIL references. This Indiana team is full of G-5 players and a once mediocre QB. The system the coaches built around him along with the technicality of this team in every aspect is phenomenal. One of the best coaching jobs I have ever seen, if not the best.

That?s fine and I agree. This thread got all out of wack because the goal posts moved. ?Lack of resources?, when proved otherwise was false, became NIL. Indiana?s football spend, including off-field staff that can go out and find a Chambliss (ranked 60th in the portal last year) has increased from $21M to $60M in four years. Cuban stated he finally donated ?a large number? to the athletic department due to Cignetti and that number will only grow. So now they?ll have a strong base and a potential Phil Knight ready to take it to another level. Can they be a blueprint for us? Sure. But we need to start spending more money and building that foundation up. Indications are that we are doing more of that so that?s good. Wouldn?t hurt to find another Curt Cignetti either.

[HoopsDawg]

What's the lowest 3-year avg composite recruiting ranking to win a natty? We probably looking at history this season

I saw that Indiana?s average age on offense is 22.5 years old. They don?t have a single offensive starter under 21. So they are playing with full grown men who have multiple years in college. A lot of guys who don?t have NFL talent but are 5 year veterans.

[bulldawg28]

Explain what? You said it in your post. They spent $30M on just 13 players according to you. It is insane to think anyone is winning anything with just good coaching these days.

No sir. I shouldn't have left off the asterisks. They 1000% didn't pay top dollar for James Madison recruits that followed their coach to Indiana. Indiana is winning with great coaching and team players. The NIL didn't win them games. Mendoza was a losing Qb until he came to Indiana. Coaching made him what he is.

[bulldawg28]

I saw that Indiana?s average age on offense is 22.5 years old. They don?t have a single offensive starter under 21. So they are playing with full grown men who have multiple years in college. A lot of guys who don?t have NFL talent but are 5 year veterans.

This also males a difference. BYU back in the day with Mormon missions was similar. Those dudes were full grown men with families.

[msstate7]

I saw that Indiana?s average age on offense is 22.5 years old. They don?t have a single offensive starter under 21. So they are playing with full grown men who have multiple years in college. A lot of guys who don?t have NFL talent but are 5 year veterans.

That is very interesting. Maybe we should be targeting guys like this

[Percho]

The best thing that could happen for Mississippi State Football would be for Ole Piss to win it all. Would piss off the money people of MSU.

[Pancho]

it's truly a dam shame if they aren't pissed already

[parabrave]

No sir. I shouldn't have left off the asterisks. They 1000% didn't pay top dollar for James Madison recruits that followed their coach to Indiana. Indiana is winning with great coaching and team players. The NIL didn't win them games. Mendoza was a losing Qb until he came to Indiana. Coaching made him what he is.

This all day long.

[parabrave]

That is very interesting. Maybe we should be targeting guys like this

Got to have a coach who holds his player accountable for mistakes and have a very well disciplined O/D Lines who do what they are coached to do. Plus they tackle very well.

[BlackSailsDawg]

C34 is gonna be so pissed at you

C34 isn't wrong. You are stuck on the word NIL even though it was not just NIL C34 was talking about. Indiana is spending money. Way more than us. Never did C34 say just in NIL. Cig is making over 11.6 million per year there. He has another 11 PLUS to spend on staffing. ETC.

In short, they did not get the cart before the horse. They got the off field staff that produces. The on field staff that produces. And now the NIL to keep it going.

[BlackSailsDawg]

This is correct, you don?t stand a chance to allow for coaching to matter without the players and investment to begin with.

Correct

[Coursesuper]

C34 isn't wrong. You are stuck on the word NIL even though it was not just NIL C34 was talking about. Indiana is spending money. Way more than us. Never did C34 say just in NIL. Cig is making over 11.6 million per year there. He has another 11 PLUS to spend on staffing. ETC.

In short, they did not get the cart before the horse. They got the off field staff that produces. The on field staff that produces. And now the NIL to keep it going.

Yep, this is why this thread is just so off base in the most Missippy Tate kinda way.

[msstate7]

C34 isn't wrong. You are stuck on the word NIL even though it was not just NIL C34 was talking about. Indiana is spending money. Way more than us. Never did C34 say just in NIL. Cig is making over 11.6 million per year there. He has another 11 PLUS to spend on staffing. ETC.

In short, they did not get the cart before the horse. They got the off field staff that produces. The on field staff that produces. And now the NIL to keep it going.

Even with their increased spending this season, they were 7th in the big 10 behind Rutgers.

The whole point of the thread was if you catch lightning in a bottle one season, it can totally elevate your program (spending for players, coaches, etc). Fine though, if you guys believe we have to spend top half of the sec to have any success, congrats then... we will never do anything.

I'm of the opinion that some coaches can totally raise the level of their players. Leach was one of these guys. He could win with guys that other teams couldn't compete with at all. This is why his lack of recruiting totally murdered our program bc no one else here could do that. I believe cignetti is another one of these guys, but he has some actual good players.

[msstate7]

Yep, this is why this thread is just so off base in the most Missippy Tate kinda way.

Wut? You guys argument is basically we can't win, ever.

[msstate7]

I asked ChatGPT about big 10 football only spending, and here's the answer...

Big Ten Football Spending (Estimated, Football-Only)
Tier 1: National Super-Spenders ($110?130M+)
These programs are consistently top-10 nationally in football expenses.
Ohio State
Michigan
Penn State

Tier 2: Power Programs ($90?110M)
High coaching salaries, major recruiting, strong travel & facilities spend.
Oregon
USC
Wisconsin
Iowa

Tier 3: Upper-Middle Spend ($75?90M)
Competitive budgets but below national elite.
Michigan State
Nebraska
Washington
UCLA

Tier 4: Mid-Level Spend ($65?75M)
Minnesota
Maryland
Illinois

Tier 5: Lower Big Ten Spend ($55?65M)
Purdue
Rutgers
Indiana
Northwestern

[BlackSailsDawg]

Even with their increased spending this season, they were 7th in the big 10 behind Rutgers.

The whole point of the thread was if you catch lightning in a bottle one season, it can totally elevate your program (spending for players, coaches, etc). Fine though, if you guys believe we have to spend top half of the sec to have any success, congrats then... we will never do anything.

I'm of the opinion that some coaches can totally raise the level of their players. Leach was one of these guys. He could win with guys that other teams couldn't compete with at all. This is why his lack of recruiting totally murdered our program bc no one else here could do that. I believe cignetti is another one of these guys, but he has some actual good players.

That's a little warped. Leach had no problems in recruiting and in coaching. He did not leave our team in shambles. It was tooled for his offense and the next guy tried to put a square peg into a round hole. Rehashing the past isn't going to make State better.

Cig is a great coach. Nobody can deny that. But Cig is susceptible as any other coach. Talent is needed. There is no way that Bama, nor OSU should have lost to them based on talent. These are teams getting by on talent alone. Bama lived off their talent this year. That coach will not be there after next year!

In short there are multiple paths a team can approach to be a competitive team.

- Great talent and decent coaching.
- Ok talent with great coaching.
- Great talent and great coaching.

And all in between.........

The issue comes to these. Where is there another Cigibaby? Are we going to throw money at "maybe he is"? Because we all know there are few Cigibabies in this world. Or, you can have decent coaching and pay top NIL money for a complete team. Do we have that top dollar to out bid the world? OR, maybe we get a good coach and spend more on NIL finding a middle ground in all of this.

[BlackSailsDawg]

Wut? You guys argument is basically we can't win, ever.

That's not what they argued. They are simply pointing out that money is going to make or break a team at this point. And that's not a NIL comment alone. You want to offer Cig 15 to 20 Million per year? Then you got to have 15 to 20 million to pay if he accepts. It's not just NIL.

And here it is for you. Should we have a playoff moment next year, Either we step up to pay Lebby 12 million, our QB 4 Million plus others along with staff increases or they will all be gone. See... That's not just NIL we are talking about.

[BlackSailsDawg]

I asked ChatGPT about big 10 football only spending, and here's the answer...

Big Ten Football Spending (Estimated, Football-Only)
Tier 1: National Super-Spenders ($110?130M+)
These programs are consistently top-10 nationally in football expenses.
Ohio State
Michigan
Penn State

Tier 2: Power Programs ($90?110M)
High coaching salaries, major recruiting, strong travel & facilities spend.
Oregon
USC
Wisconsin
Iowa

Tier 3: Upper-Middle Spend ($75?90M)
Competitive budgets but below national elite.
Michigan State
Nebraska
Washington
UCLA

Tier 4: Mid-Level Spend ($65?75M)
Minnesota
Maryland
Illinois

Tier 5: Lower Big Ten Spend ($55?65M)
Purdue
Rutgers
Indiana
Northwestern

So their tier 5 is spending more than us. You are making our point.

[Coursesuper]

Wut? You guys argument is basically we can't win, ever.


In my opinion you have the cart before the horse. There is no lightning in a bottle. It’s build the foundation properly and work your ass off after that. Unlike your get rich quick scheme. Indiana invested, built the infrastructure and got a good guy. This investment preparation and hard work is paying off for them in a big way. They used the portal for the right guys for their program, which is the most valuable thing to have.

[msstate7]

So their tier 5 is spending more than us. You are making our point.

This is the OP...

Indiana is why we shouldn't give up hope
They're in the best conference, and they've rose to the top while having no history and less resources than their rich conf neighbors.

...
what do you disagree with that on?

[msstate7]

In my opinion you have the cart before the horse. There is no lightning in a bottle. It’s build the foundation properly and work your ass off after that. Unlike your get rich quick scheme. Indiana invested, built the infrastructure and got a good guy. This investment preparation and hard work is paying off for them in a big way. They used the portal for the right guys for their program, which is the most valuable thing to have.

I literally just posted where they're in the bottom tier of big 10 spending .

[Coursesuper]

I literally just posted where they're in the bottom tier of big 10 spending .

Chat GTP ain’t exactly the kinda concrete data points I’m looking for. I agree with you that Indiana is a nice story and it would be nice to replicate what they are doing. That said our situations are not exactly similar.

[Quaoarsking]

Indiana is literally a "get rich quick" success story. They had 3 straight losing, non-bowl seasons (with a combined 3 conference wins across them) from 2021 to 2023. Then they fired their coach and got a really good one, and spent a lot of money on players and transfers and immediately made the playoffs in 2024 and by 2025 were blowing out Alabama as the #1 team.

I'm not saying we can easily replicate what they did, but the idea that they spent years laying down a foundation is just not true. They just spent money AND got a really good coach.

[Quaoarsking]

Wut? You guys argument is basically we can't win, ever.

The "Missippy Tate" people are the ones who say we can't possibly expect better than 7-17 (1-15) so we should just be happy with it.

[BlackSailsDawg]

This is the OP...

Indiana is why we shouldn't give up hope
They're in the best conference, and they've rose to the top while having no history and less resources than their rich conf neighbors.

...
what do you disagree with that on?

I don't think anybody has an issue with any of that.

[msstate7]

I don't think anybody has an issue with any of that.

I've literally had to depend that the whole thread