OL?

[justwin]

Going into 2014, who are our top 9 OL? Then, how do the pieces fit? Seems that only two positions in C & LT have guaranteed starters...the rest is a mix match. Can Robinson be a LG?

[smootness]

My opinion, if I had to rank them, on how good each will be at their respective position next year:

1. Dillon Day
2. Blaine Clausell
3. Justin Malone
4. Jamaal Clayborn
5. Jocquell Johnson
6. Justin Senior
7. Norman Price
8. Ben Beckwith
9. Devon Desper
10. Damien Robinson?

I think it will be a decent group overall with the chance to be pretty good.

And no, Robinson isn't a G. We just need to accept that he won't be much of a contributor. At this point there is more than enough evidence of him actually in college to override his recruiting ranking. He just wasn't a 4-star talent.

ETA: I think Malone is also a guaranteed starter and that Clayborn will probably work his way into that as well. I think RT will be a real battle between Johnson and Senior.

[Westdawg]

Actually, most of the line looks good for the next couple of years, save the RT spot this year, and LT the year after this.

C:
Day - senior who has shown that he is more than capable of holding his own in SEC play. Very well might push for ALL SEC this coming year. I hope he has that kind of season.
Depser - really good player. Did not really hit the camp circuit so not much was out on him during HS. but the kid can play and has the size/ability to take over that spot after Day graduates. hope to see him get solid mop-up minutes this coming year.

OG:
Beckwith- a walkon from MAIS ( I think Benton Aca.) that has proved more than adequate against most competition. He has been beaten against some of the top flight DTs and NGs that we have faced, but done very well all things considered. a senior who has lots of game experience.
Malone - really good player that I am exicted about. very cerebral OL, which is often a great thing to have in your arsenal of skill sets. great length and hips and footwork.
Clayborne - REALLY good player. I expect him to win an OG spot very effectively. In the mold of Gabe Jackson....yes, that good or possibly even better.
ETA - Flowers is also in this mix. I like what I have heard about him in practice, just a matter of him developing a bit more
OT
Senior - lots of people forgot about this kid, but he may very well be one of the most athletic linemen we have ever had. great footwork and very long. I honestly think he could push for time at the RT spot, and if he turns out as good with Hevesy as good as Hevesy has mentioned in the past, then it might be we have already found our LT. I think he worked a lot at RT this year, but that is due to trying to get him on the field.
Thomas - I know a lot of ppl dogged him this year, but truth is most all OL go through and need to go through a RS year. I know that in HS, he flat destroyed Channing Ward, a 5 star that we lost out to OM for. Ward ended up not even trying during the mid-3rd and all the 4th quarter because he could not beat Thomas. Bottom line, the kid is raw, but has the possibility to make a push for an OT spot in another year. And truth is that OT, both LT and RT, are the hardest to learn on the OL because of the amount of skills that most be learned to defeat the pass rush they face in this conference. Yes, Tunsil does it for OM, but I will admit that kid is an anomaly for LTs, like maybe one or two every year or so can accomplish that, and even he wore down by the latter half of their season.
I hope that our juco guys can come in and fill some holes quickly for us while we finish developing at this position.
ETA - Carter - kid has shown moments where he shines. I forgot about him, but have heard he could push for some PT this year.

[Goat Holder]

I think about this a lot in my free time, mainly because we have to maintain a solid OL consistently to ever be, well, a consistent football team. Heart of the football team. Either way, here's my lineup:

2014:

LT: Clausell - Sr., Senior - So.
LG: Clayborne - So., Beckwith - Sr.
OC: Day - Sr., Desper - So.
RG: Malone - Jr., Carter - So. or Price - Jr.
RT: Johnson - Jr., Thomas - Fr.

2015:

LT: Senior - Jr., Flowers - So.
LG: Clayborne - Jr., Price - Jr./Sr.
OC: Desper - Jr., Rawlings - Fr.
RG: Malone - Sr., Carter - Jr.
RT: Johnson - Sr., Thomas - So.

I think those are your 10 best each year. I figure Johnson will end up being the RT, and Price may redshirt depending on injuries and if he beats out Carter. I didn't even include Robinson and Muniz, because at this point, I'd rather just see the younger guys come in and get experience since they won't be starting anyway.

I'm also assuming Johnson is good enough. We might see Senior over there if he can't hack it.

[NCDawg]

What happened to Carter and Muniz? Seems to me we misjudge OL talent too much. We sign guys like Trapp, Knox, Lawson, and quite a few others that never do contribute. I think OL continues to be our primary weakness. Ole Miss pretty much shut down our running game, but Prescott's very accurate passing helped us win. If we ever hope to get to the next level, I think we have to get better OL talent.

[Goat Holder]

Carter will only be a redshirt sophomore next year. Muniz is just a bust, along with Robinson. They may contribute on special teams, though, I don't know. If so, that's probably why that unit sucks.

Trapp, Knox, Lawson, Redmond and Maiden were definitely busts. We can only hope that the two JUCOs can make up for it.

[Thick]

My opinion, if I had to rank them, on how good each will be at their respective position next year:

1. Dillon Day
2. Blaine Clausell
3. Justin Malone
4. Jamaal Clayborn
5. Jocquell Johnson
6. Justin Senior
7. Norman Price
8. Ben Beckwith
9. Devon Desper
10. Damien Robinson?

I think it will be a decent group overall with the chance to be pretty good.

And no, Robinson isn't a G. We just need to accept that he won't be much of a contributor. At this point there is more than enough evidence of him actually in college to override his recruiting ranking. He just wasn't a 4-star talent.

ETA: I think Malone is also a guaranteed starter and that Clayborn will probably work his way into that as well. I think RT will be a real battle between Johnson and Senior.

You left out Kent Flowers. He should be in the mix soon.

[Coach34]

What happened to Carter and Muniz? Seems to me we misjudge OL talent too much. We sign guys like Trapp, Knox, Lawson, and quite a few others that never do contribute. I think OL continues to be our primary weakness. Ole Miss pretty much shut down our running game, but Prescott's very accurate passing helped us win. If we ever hope to get to the next level, I think we have to get better OL talent.

Our run game got alot better when Dakota came in the game. OM was able to do alot of things defensively because they knew we werent going to take many chances with Williams at QB.

We can always use more talent on the OL- everybody can. But our OL is not bad at all. The constant carousel at QB was more our problem than it was the OL.

[smootness]

I don't know if Knox, Redmond, and Maiden were 'talent' busts, though. We don't really know how well we judged their talent, they just left the program for whatever reason. We misjudged something, just don't know if it was their ability.

Muniz, Trapp, and Lawson were obviously busts on some level as far as our staff is concerned; if they offered them, I hope they believed they would become contributors. But it looks like they were evaluated correctly by recruiting sites - none of them were thought to be good prospects, so I don't know how much I consider them true busts.

Robinson was a clear bust.

[smootness]

You left out Kent Flowers. He should be in the mix soon.

I know about him, just not sure he'll be better than those 10 next year. He may be ahead of Robinson, but I don't know.

[Barking 13]

Carter will only be a redshirt sophomore next year. Muniz is just a bust, along with Robinson. They may contribute on special teams, though, I don't know. If so, that's probably why that unit sucks.

Trapp, Knox, Lawson, Redmond and Maiden were definitely busts. We can only hope that the two JUCOs can make up for it.

I was wondering why nobody above mentioned him... He's got a cousin that would fit in nicely behind Day and Desper for 2015 if Hevesy would get his head out of his ass..

[Coach34]

For all the misses we have had on the OL- we have found more players that people werent on. Clausell and Day are proof of that. Malone, Clayborn and others as well.

[Johnson85]

Seems to me we misjudge OL talent too much. We sign guys like Trapp, Knox, Lawson, and quite a few others that never do contribute. I think OL continues to be our primary weakness.

We sign busts at OL because we don't have the option of signing sure things. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think Dillon Day had any big offers, I don't remember Clausell's recruitment at all (so I assume he wasn't a big prospect?), Malone was basically a private school basketball player. We seem to do an alright job finding some hidden gems, we just have to get in the game on more promising prospects.

[Westdawg]

I completely forgot about Carter and Flowers. Both have shown promise in practices but still have some growing to do in skill level. I have heard that they have both had moments where they just shine, but still have room to improve before they see a lot of action. I thinkFlowers ended up at OG and Carter appears to be growing into an OT spot.

[engie]

We sign busts at OL because we don't have the option of signing sure things. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think Dillon Day had any big offers, I don't remember Clausell's recruitment at all (so I assume he wasn't a big prospect?), Malone was basically a private school basketball player. We seem to do an alright job finding some hidden gems, we just have to get in the game on more promising prospects.

EVERYONE signs "busts" on the OL. It's far and away the hardest position to evaluate correctly in recruiting. Saban has basically missed on almost 50% of the OL that he's signed while at Alabama -- and he's only going after the closest thing to can't miss prospects out there.

[Political Hack]

I've always thought that we should take 6-7 OL every year. We would have at least 22+ on campus at all times. That's enough to give us a solid two deep on varsity and the scout/freshman teams. Everyone basically has to win a spot and then assume that role. Also provides plenty of depth for the times when a Jr or Sr just isn't panning out like they should. If you get it right 50% of the time, and use redshirts effectively, you should have 9 guys who are 3+ years into the program ready to go.

[justwin]

I like the way you laid this out. Lot of unproven guard play in 2014...worrisome. Are the assignments easier or harder for a guard than tackle? I would think easier.

What's up with Price? Is he a guard? will he compete for PT?



I think about this a lot in my free time, mainly because we have to maintain a solid OL consistently to ever be, well, a consistent football team. Heart of the football team. Either way, here's my lineup:

2014:

LT: Clausell - Sr., Senior - So.
LG: Clayborne - So., Beckwith - Sr.
OC: Day - Sr., Desper - So.
RG: Malone - Jr., Carter - So. or Price - Jr.
RT: Johnson - Jr., Thomas - Fr.

2015:

LT: Senior - Jr., Flowers - So.
LG: Clayborne - Jr., Price - Jr./Sr.
OC: Desper - Jr., Rawlings - Fr.
RG: Malone - Sr., Carter - Jr.
RT: Johnson - Sr., Thomas - So.

I think those are your 10 best each year. I figure Johnson will end up being the RT, and Price may redshirt depending on injuries and if he beats out Carter. I didn't even include Robinson and Muniz, because at this point, I'd rather just see the younger guys come in and get experience since they won't be starting anyway.

I'm also assuming Johnson is good enough. We might see Senior over there if he can't hack it.

[Westdawg]

I've always thought that we should take 6-7 OL every year. We would have at least 22+ on campus at all times. That's enough to give us a solid two deep on varsity and the scout/freshman teams. Everyone basically has to win a spot and then assume that role. Also provides plenty of depth for the times when a Jr or Sr just isn't panning out like they should. If you get it right 50% of the time, and use redshirts effectively, you should have 9 guys who are 3+ years into the program ready to go.

I agree. We have two things hurtng us right now. We have only got about 4-5 OL in classes of late and have had some leave the program or not pan out. Second, our current roster does not give much in terms of opening up spots for additional prospects. It s why I actually like our staff's approach much more than just going after stars. We need surer signees even it means it might take an additional year or two to get them ready because the room for error is slim at best.

[Coach34]

I like the way you laid this out. Lot of unproven guard play in 2014...worrisome.

How so?

Malone has started for a season
Beckwith has started a full season
Clayborn has played alot the 2nd half of the season

We have lots of experience at Guard

[Goat Holder]

This is one of those 'out of the box' type things I'm always saying we should do. We aren't going to beat anybody by over-talenting them. So we definitely need to do something different.....keeping a neverending OL stream is one of them.

[Bo Darville]

How so?

Malone has started for a season
Beckwith has started a full season
Clayborn has played alot the 2nd half of the season

We have lots of experience at Guard

I agree with Coach. I am definitely more concerned about tackle than guard.

This spring it is time for some young guys to step up. Desper and Carter will enter the fall of 2014 as third-year sophomores. It is time to show that they can contribute. Maybe not start, but they must be ready to at least be a capable backup. If you can't be a capable backup in your 3rd year, I doubt you will ever be a starter. Flowers and Jake Thomas can take another year to develop, but Desper and Carter must make a push for reps.

[Coach 57]

It's actually not THAT hard to evaluate OL. But you have had to had been in the trenches to assess them. I can tell you this from my playing days. I wasn't the fastest, strongest, or most gifted athletically kid but I did watch ALOT of film on the kid I faced. It made me a better evaluator of it as I got older. Couple of things. Instead of watching tendancies. Watch things like: his reaction time off the snap. How good are his hips IF he has to go from kick step to power over? Are his feet (steps) long & lumbering (bad sign) or are they like the stroke of a small block Chevy engine short & definitive? How good is he IF he misses his initial "punch"? How good is his punch? What's his counter to the punch? Does he like contact? (Body language). And regardless of which side of the ball: How good is his "motor"? Daddy always said "if it's got a bad motor....leave it at the lot."

These are some critical things. Especially the hips, motor & physicality thing. You can teach a kid HOW to punch & all this other stuff. But it's hard to improve lazy hips. Lack of physicality and a poor motor. Guys like Tempelton Hardy & Robinson have had these issues from high school. No need in wasting schollies on them. It's ingrained in their DNA by the time they get to campus.

[HoopsDawg]

It's actually not THAT hard to evaluate OL. But you have had to had been in the trenches to assess them. I can tell you this from my playing days. I wasn't the fastest, strongest, or most gifted athletically kid but I did watch ALOT of film on the kid I faced. It made me a better evaluator of it as I got older. Couple of things. Instead of watching tendancies. Watch things like: his reaction time off the snap. How good are his hips IF he has to go from kick step to power over? Are his feet (steps) long & lumbering (bad sign) or are they like the stroke of a small block Chevy engine short & definitive? How good is he IF he misses his initial "punch"? How good is his punch? What's his counter to the punch? Does he like contact? (Body language). And regardless of which side of the ball: How good is his "motor"? Daddy always said "if it's got a bad motor....leave it at the lot."

These are some critical things. Especially the hips, motor & physicality thing. You can teach a kid HOW to punch & all this other stuff. But it's hard to improve lazy hips. Lack of physicality and a poor motor. Guys like Tempelton Hardy & Robinson have had these issues from high school. No need in wasting schollies on them. It's ingrained in their DNA by the time they get to campus.

small ankles. #thekang

[justwin]

Malone, clay born are talented, yes but neither has played a ton. I know Justin split with Tobias and had growing pains in 12. More worried about experience in terms of being a full year unquestioned starter and it sounds like don't have a guard like that other than beckwith? Whatever 2 win the guard spots will be short on experience



How so?

Malone has started for a season
Beckwith has started a full season
Clayborn has played alot the 2nd half of the season

We have lots of experience at Guard

[justwin]

Gotcha, I'm oppo and more comfy w tackle cuz we only need to replace one vs two guard spots. But, yeah someone else needs to grow up.

I like Malone as one of our more talented & bright guys so hopefully that translates on the field when he's back? Is he back?


I agree with Coach. I am definitely more concerned about tackle than guard.

This spring it is time for some young guys to step up. Desper and Carter will enter the fall of 2014 as third-year sophomores. It is time to show that they can contribute. Maybe not start, but they must be ready to at least be a capable backup. If you can't be a capable backup in your 3rd year, I doubt you will ever be a starter. Flowers and Jake Thomas can take another year to develop, but Desper and Carter must make a push for reps.

[Political Hack]

Malone, Beckwith, and Clayborn are back at OG. We only lose Gabe.

[Coach34]

Malone, clay born are talented, yes but neither has played a ton. I know Justin split with Tobias and had growing pains in 12.

Malone basically started 8 games in 2012 and Tobias started 5 even though they fudged the numbers. I remember 2 games Tobias played 1 series and then sat out the rest of the game. Then he spent an entire Spring and then August practice as the #1 guy.

Experience for Malone is not a worry at all.