D1 Baseball singing our praises

[Coach34]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">.<a href="https://twitter.com/HailStateBB?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@HailStateBB</a> has no shortage of picks to click, and that?s why we?re high on the Bulldogs 📈 <br><br>We?re buying breakouts from <a href="https://twitter.com/rosshighfill2?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@rosshighfill2</a>, <a href="https://twitter.com/dylan_cupp?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@dylan_cupp</a> and <a href="https://twitter.com/nolanstevens3?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@nolanstevens3</a>, most notably among a host of breakout candidates. <a href="https://t.co/4McFBe0cMb">pic.twitter.com/4McFBe0cMb</a></p>&mdash; D1Baseball (@d1baseball) <a href="https://twitter.com/d1baseball/status/1880623694352937430?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">January 18, 2025</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

[Pancho]

ok for now

[schddog72]

They must be discounting the Lemonhead factor.

[HoopsDawg]

I'm skeptical. There's some talent for sure. But a lot of guys will have to step up for us to host.

[Todd4State]

They're never really critical of anybody. BUT I do agree with them that we have some very talented players who could step up and become stars for us.

[CaptainObvious]

They must be discounting the Lemonhead factor.
This is the correct answer.

[The Federalist Engineer]

It has to be all Parker.

MSU lost 3 starters. They ranked MSU as #18 because they think Parker can prepare new people.

Based on 2022 and 2023, you know that Lemonhead needs a very good PC.

[Tater]

The hate Lemonis gets here is wild sometimes.

Dude inherited a stud team in 19, yes. And didn't **** it up. 2020 we were looking great. 2021 he did what no other coach in State history ever did. And a lot of us said this was in spite of Foxhall at the time. 2022 - we were snakebit. That team changes wildly if Landon Sims is healthy. He stays healthy and we're a wildly different team with him having a much different MLB Career trajectory.

While Top Minds of Elitedawgs would have fired Foxhall after 22 (or even 21), you gotta roll the dice that 2022 was the anomaly with bad injury luck. It wasn't but hindsight is 20/20. He then hired a new guy for 24 with a proven track record and had a team that most agree if our projected stud wasn't hurt - we'd have been Omaha bound. Got us much further than 22 with similar situation - we call that "growth".

But yea it's "all Parker". People are gonna look back in 10-20 years and realize how good we have it right now. You don't have to agree with every single decision Lemonis makes - but you gotta respect the guy is solid. He didn't just Ed O or Gene Chizik his way into a natty. It was year 3 and he earned it.

[Todd4State]

The hate Lemonis gets here is wild sometimes.

Dude inherited a stud team in 19, yes. And didn't **** it up. 2020 we were looking great. 2021 he did what no other coach in State history ever did. And a lot of us said this was in spite of Foxhall at the time. 2022 - we were snakebit. That team changes wildly if Landon Sims is healthy. He stays healthy and we're a wildly different team with him having a much different MLB Career trajectory.

While Top Minds of Elitedawgs would have fired Foxhall after 22 (or even 21), you gotta roll the dice that 2022 was the anomaly with bad injury luck. It wasn't but hindsight is 20/20. He then hired a new guy for 24 with a proven track record and had a team that most agree if our projected stud wasn't hurt - we'd have been Omaha bound. Got us much further than 22 with similar situation - we call that "growth".

But yea it's "all Parker". People are gonna look back in 10-20 years and realize how good we have it right now. You don't have to agree with every single decision Lemonis makes - but you gotta respect the guy is solid. He didn't just Ed O or Gene Chizik his way into a natty. It was year 3 and he earned it.

Excellent post.

So far to me Lemonis's biggest mistake was holding on to Foxhall too long. Probably cost us at least a regional in 2023. And he had to have known about a lot of the things that were going on the pitching side.

Lemonis is solid. And he's recruiting well. He has shown what he can do with talent.

[Brobi-wan]

Excellent post.

So far to me Lemonis's biggest mistake was holding on to Foxhall too long. Probably cost us at least a regional in 2023. And he had to have known about a lot of the things that were going on the pitching side.

Lemonis is solid. And he's recruiting well. He has shown what he can do with talent.

Not just recruiting well, but continued to recruit well into the NIL era. There’s a lot to be said with his ability to keep that up with that massive change.

[Tater]

Excellent post.

So far to me Lemonis's biggest mistake was holding on to Foxhall too long. Probably cost us at least a regional in 2023. And he had to have known about a lot of the things that were going on the pitching side.

Lemonis is solid. And he's recruiting well. He has shown what he can do with talent.

We get the benefit of hindsight and to be fair some guys were right.

But man - winning our only natty... that combo deserved two more shots. It's amazing to fire the assistant of the year as quick as he did. If Lemonis is a true genius with foresight - yea he fires Foxhall and gets Parker in 2022 and we're probably still on our run of Supers every year. But there's no way you can reasonably justify not giving Foxhall two more chances.

Only thing he could have reasonably done was fire Foxhall earlier in 2023. Vandy series was probably the earliest he could have done it. Maybe we turn it around and win a few more and get back into the playoffs instead. Only other reasonable spots were after SCar series and after Auburn series. I don't think firing him after auburn gets us a W in the UTk series the next weekend and then he was gone.

I don't think 0-6 or 1-8 were realistic holes to climb out of without Foxhall that year though.

[Todd4State]

Not just recruiting well, but continued to recruit well into the NIL era. There’s a lot to be said with his ability to keep that up with that massive change.

Absolutely. Things are changing greatly in college baseball recruiting. We're not going to see classes of 25 guys coming in anymore and there are going to be fewer developmental guys taken because of the portal. Every roster spot has to be maximized.

[Todd4State]

We get the benefit of hindsight and to be fair some guys were right.

But man - winning our only natty... that combo deserved two more shots. It's amazing to fire the assistant of the year as quick as he did. If Lemonis is a true genius with foresight - yea he fires Foxhall and gets Parker in 2022 and we're probably still on our run of Supers every year. But there's no way you can reasonably justify not giving Foxhall two more chances.

Only thing he could have reasonably done was fire Foxhall earlier in 2023. Vandy series was probably the earliest he could have done it. Maybe we turn it around and win a few more and get back into the playoffs instead. Only other reasonable spots were after SCar series and after Auburn series. I don't think firing him after auburn gets us a W in the UTk series the next weekend and then he was gone.

I don't think 0-6 or 1-8 were realistic holes to climb out of without Foxhall that year though.

Foxhall's situation was pretty bizarre to me. I think he may have just gotten burned out or just lost it. Lots of rumors about him simply not coaching other than developing raw velocity essentially and basically letting guys do their own thing. Probably started before 2022 in reality. Landon Sims was too good for anyone to screw up and Bednar had a brother in MLB he could lean on for advice so not surprising that those two plus Preston Johnson and Houston Harding ended up being our best guys in 2021 as they were older guys who knew how to pitch.

I can understand Lemonis giving him another chance from an optics standpoint and I don't know what the discussions were behind the doors between him and Lemonis after 2022. Foxhall could have very well promised changes for 2023 and simply didn't deliver.

Lemonis was actually going to fire Foxhall after the Ole Miss series but the pitching staff stepped up and we won the series. Plus that would have been on the heels of the biggest win of the season after we beat Ole Miss after setting the attendance record. Then the staff melted down against Auburn.

[PGHBulldogBG]

Lemonis definitely gets a lot more hate here than he should. His biggest mistake he made was keeping Foxhall into 2023. No reason he should have been here to start that season. At the same time, I think Parker is an excellent pitching coach and was a great hire by Lemonis. With the talent we have, there is a chance to win a regional if it all comes together. Not sure about a super, but the potential is there to get to one

[Tater]

Foxhall's situation was pretty bizarre to me. I think he may have just gotten burned out or just lost it. Lots of rumors about him simply not coaching other than developing raw velocity essentially and basically letting guys do their own thing. Probably started before 2022 in reality. Landon Sims was too good for anyone to screw up and Bednar had a brother in MLB he could lean on for advice so not surprising that those two plus Preston Johnson and Houston Harding ended up being our best guys in 2021 as they were older guys who knew how to pitch.

I can understand Lemonis giving him another chance from an optics standpoint and I don't know what the discussions were behind the doors between him and Lemonis after 2022. Foxhall could have very well promised changes for 2023 and simply didn't deliver.

Lemonis was actually going to fire Foxhall after the Ole Miss series but the pitching staff stepped up and we won the series. Plus that would have been on the heels of the biggest win of the season after we beat Ole Miss after setting the attendance record. Then the staff melted down against Auburn.

Yea - a lot of people (some here too) were calling for Foxhall's head mid 2021. I remember the opening weekend in the Texas Snow round robin. We had 6 guys that were legit. Foxhall had an embarrassment of riches and we succeeded in spite of him it feels like when looking with hindsight.

I mean the Cerantola mismanagement was a huge indictment. McLeod melting down the stretch. And we still won the natty.

[Coach34]

Lemonis definitely gets a lot more hate here than he should. His biggest mistake he made was keeping Foxhall into 2023. No reason he should have been here to start that season. At the same time, I think Parker is an excellent pitching coach and was a great hire by Lemonis. With the talent we have, there is a chance to win a regional if it all comes together. Not sure about a super, but the potential is there to get to one

If Parker can get the SP pitching right- our staff has a chance to be really good. We have quality guys on the back end this year- so that takes a little pressure off the SP's. Give us 5 every week and we should be ok.

[ArrowDawg]

Excellent post.

So far to me Lemonis's biggest mistake was holding on to Foxhall too long. Probably cost us at least a regional in 2023. And he had to have known about a lot of the things that were going on the pitching side.

Lemonis is solid. And he's recruiting well. He has shown what he can do with talent.

I don't hate Lemonis. He's a decent coach, and he will surely always be remembered for winning a natty. My problem is that I don't feel like he's capable of building a team that can win another one, and I get the impression from a lot of State fans that they're okay with that. I didn't just want us to win a natty and call it a century. I wanted us to build on it and get the program to a fairly consistent level of hosting regionals and taking shots at winning another title. I especially want another one after those scumbags in Oxford matched us just a year later. Instead, since then we've gone three years with only one post-season appearance and it was on the road. It feels like we really dropped the ball. You probably won't see the Vols slacking off anytime soon.

[Todd4State]

I don't hate Lemonis. He's a decent coach, and he will surely always be remembered for winning a natty. My problem is that I don't feel like he's capable of building a team that can win another one, and I get the impression from a lot of State fans that they're okay with that. I didn't just want us to win a natty and call it a century. I wanted us to build on it and get the program to a fairly consistent level of hosting regionals and taking shots at winning another title. I especially want another one after those scumbags in Oxford matched us just a year later. Instead, since then we've gone three years with only one post-season appearance and it was on the road. It feels like we really dropped the ball. You probably won't see the Vols slacking off anytime soon.

I don't think State fans hate him. Maybe they hate the performance in 2022-2023 but I don't think it's that personal.

I disagree that he isn't capable of building a team that can win another one. A lot of the most talented players on this years team will be around for 2026- Stevens, Grant, Cupp, Reese, Dotson, etc. and I think our talent is going to increase significantly in the next couple of years and will be pretty close to on par with what we expect and what we saw from 2016-2021. We have at least five players listed as top 100 prospects and none are listed as probable first round picks at this time with three being from Mississippi and one being a MSU legacy from South Carolina. If the MLB draft is kind to us we could really load up this offseason and easily be a NC contender the next few years. We also got some pretty exciting freshmen on campus too despite being hit fairly hard by the draft- Foster, Stone, and O'Leary have weekend rotation potential and Ryan McPherson and Dane Burns are really talented players as well. Lukas Butkner is probably going to be our second baseman and he is going to be your typical MSU dirtbag guy. The 2027 class is more of the same.

Part of our issue in 2022 and 2023 was the toll being paid for multiple coaching changes in a three year span and Cann almost completely ignoring recruiting for one cycle as well multiple pitching coach changes.

We also won 17 SEC games last year and that was good enough to host most years. We were screwed by the committee period. You can say we should have won our OOC games but at the same time that's kind of like saying we had to win 40ish regular season games to host a regional. That's kind of ridiculous when you think about it that way. There were definitely politics involved beyond our control and that's why I don't use hosting a regional as any kind of baseline for anything. I do like to use SR appearances and we need to get back to that.

And speaking of Ole Miss- you talk about dropping the ball- they have been worse than we have since they won it. I'm not worried Tennessee any more than I am LSU, Arkansas, Texas A&M, etc. Welcome to life in the SEC. If history is any indicator someone other than Tennessee is going to win it all.

[HoopsDawg]

I don't hate Lemonis. He's a decent coach, and he will surely always be remembered for winning a natty. My problem is that I don't feel like he's capable of building a team that can win another one, and I get the impression from a lot of State fans that they're okay with that. I didn't just want us to win a natty and call it a century. I wanted us to build on it and get the program to a fairly consistent level of hosting regionals and taking shots at winning another title. I especially want another one after those scumbags in Oxford matched us just a year later. Instead, since then we've gone three years with only one post-season appearance and it was on the road. It feels like we really dropped the ball. You probably won't see the Vols slacking off anytime soon.

Lemonis is neither elite or terrible. That's puts us in a precarious spot.

[Johnson85]

Lemonis definitely gets a lot more hate here than he should. His biggest mistake he made was keeping Foxhall into 2023. No reason he should have been here to start that season. At the same time, I think Parker is an excellent pitching coach and was a great hire by Lemonis. With the talent we have, there is a chance to win a regional if it all comes together. Not sure about a super, but the potential is there to get to one

I am fine with Lemonis but it sure seemed like we were poorly coached across the board in '22 and '23. May just be one of those things where when you can't rely on your pitching, everybody presses and starts making mistakes and every mistake is more noticeable because they're either costing you a win or contributing to a blowout.

This year is going to tell the tale I think. If we step back from last year, and that's a peak in the cycle? That's obviously a very bad sign. We take a step forward and host, and it will look like he has us back on track. Maybe he's not elite and the '19-'21 stretch was lightning in a bottle, but host this year and he will have shown he can basically rebuild a team from scratch and have us basically where we can't complain. I mean, obviously we'll complain, but if he has us at 17 wins and hosting discussion in '24 and then we host this year, he will have done what he needs to do to start adding to his goodwill rather than drawing it down like he did in '22 and '23.

[schddog72]

They must be discounting the Lemonhead factor.

I think they totally forgot about it!!

[StateDawg44]

I think they totally forgot about it!!

You just replying to yourself now?

[Pancho]

probably too much celebratory trump drink

[BeardoMSU]

You just replying to yourself now?

Lolz

[Coach34]

probably too much celebratory trump drink

or forgot to change usernames

[RockyDog]

Lemonis is neither elite or terrible. That's puts us in a precarious spot.

Lemons is elite. He won a natty. Cohen is a tick below, he played for a natty. Cholk is a full rung below that. He failed to play for a natty in an era where nobody else in his conference cared about the sport.

[The Federalist Engineer]

Lemons is elite. He won a natty. Cohen is a tick below, he played for a natty. Cholk is a full rung below that. He failed to play for a natty in an era where nobody else in his conference cared about the sport.

If you gave both guys the 2009 situation for MSU: basically a dead program

(1) We know that Cohen would have you in the National Championship game by 2013.
(2) Lemonis would have maybe made Hoover once or twice. A regional once or so.

Vitello and Van Horne are elite, lemons is pretty much ok. If lemons were good, Texas would have been calling last year. They broke the bank and decency codes for an elite guy, Schlossnagle.

[Ezsoil]

I don't hate Lemonis. He's a decent coach, and he will surely always be remembered for winning a natty. My problem is that I don't feel like he's capable of building a team that can win another one, and I get the impression from a lot of State fans that they're okay with that. I didn't just want us to win a natty and call it a century. I wanted us to build on it and get the program to a fairly consistent level of hosting regionals and taking shots at winning another title. I especially want another one after those scumbags in Oxford matched us just a year later. Instead, since then we've gone three years with only one post-season appearance and it was on the road. It feels like we really dropped the ball. You probably won't see the Vols slacking off anytime soon.

Don't think he is capable of building a team that is capable of winning a championship? ....I would say that the 21 was built by him.....the ENTIRE pitching staff was his recruits and signees... with the exception of Jordan and Allen ...there were no other contributors from the team he inherited.... Hatcher was a detriment. While you can argue that Jordan and Allen were key, you can't say that the pitching wasn't the heart and soul of that team. all of which were recruited by him.

[Coach34]

If you gave both guys the 2009 situation for MSU: basically a dead program

(1) We know that Cohen would have you in the National Championship game by 2013.
(2) Lemonis would have maybe made Hoover once or twice. A regional once or so.

Vitello and Van Horne are elite, lemons is pretty much ok. If lemons were good, Texas would have been calling last year. They broke the bank and decency codes for an elite guy, Schlossnagle.

Lemon is not elite but he is greater than Polk. He is our best baseball coach in school history. He has assembled another very good team in an SEC that is tougher than ever. Hail State

[HoopsDawg]

Lemon is not elite but he is greater than Polk. He is our best baseball coach in school history. He has assembled another very good team in an SEC that is tougher than ever. Hail State

That's quite a hot take. I think Cohen was clearly better than Lemon. Polk wouldn't cut players so never won a tilte. In some ways, maybe that makes him a poor coach. But 8 trips to the CWS is a better resume than Lemon.

[Coach34]

That's quite a hot take. I think Cohen was clearly better than Lemon. Polk wouldn't cut players so never won a tilte. In some ways, maybe that makes him a poor coach. But 8 trips to the CWS is a better resume than Lemon.

CWS Title > anything Polk did. Title trumps all. You can give Polk credit for longevity and building the program. But he was never as successful as Lemon or Cohen.

Lemon is just entering his 6th season and he has a title. He was cheated in 2020 of possibly another because that team was possibly our best of all-time. They got cheated so badly. You are comparing 29 seasons of Polk vs 5 seasons of Lemon. Polk had 6 CWS seasons in 29 seasons- Lemon has a title and 2 in 5 seasons.

[schddog72]

You just replying to yourself now?

Well . . . . . . yes, actually; because the more I thought about it, the more strongly I felt about it. And that was before the Trumpfest!!

[HoopsDawg]

CWS Title > anything Polk did. Title trumps all. You can give Polk credit for longevity and building the program. But he was never as successful as Lemon or Cohen.

Lemon is just entering his 6th season and he has a title. He was cheated in 2020 of possibly another because that team was possibly our best of all-time. They got cheated so badly. You are comparing 29 seasons of Polk vs 5 seasons of Lemon. Polk had 6 CWS seasons in 29 seasons- Lemon has a title and 2 in 5 seasons.

You are saying Larry Coker and Gene Cheesedick were 2 of the best college football coaches of all time.

[The Federalist Engineer]

CWS Title > anything Polk did. Title trumps all. You can give Polk credit for longevity and building the program. But he was never as successful as Lemon or Cohen.

Lemon is just entering his 6th season and he has a title. He was cheated in 2020 of possibly another because that team was possibly our best of all-time. They got cheated so badly. You are comparing 29 seasons of Polk vs 5 seasons of Lemon. Polk had 6 CWS seasons in 29 seasons- Lemon has a title and 2 in 5 seasons.

It's ok that you like Lemons, end of the day, he's the coach MSU has. I hope he does better than I expect him to do.

I think the championship prejudice becomes relevant at 3 to 5 championships like Skip Bertman. The singleton guys can't really claim better track records than Polk, Mike Martin, or Schlossnagle. I would have traded our singleton for Vitello before last year, Vitello has been clearly superior for several years now. The new Oregon State dude is a potential giant.

[Todd4State]

We have had 6 50 win seasons in baseball.
Polk has 3 of those. Cohen has 1. Lemonis has 2. So he has one less than Polk and has a very good chance to tie him at some point.

Polk coached in a different era. The SEC had never won a NC in baseball until 1990. We had never even won a game ever in Omaha until 1979. If I went in a Time Machine and kidnapped 1984-1990 Ron Polk we probably have some NC's with him.

Lemonis's biggest issue is we have fans hung up on Vitello. But i guarantee you that if we hired him our fans would immediately try to neuter him and his antics like they complained about Cohen's cussing. But now Lemonis doesn't show enough emotion to many of those same fans. Our fans can't decide what they want other than the complete opposite of what MSU has at that time.

I think the reality is Lemonis is still growing as a coach. Can he win another NC? Maybe. He's starting to recruit at a high enough level to have a chance to do it. Winning a NC is hard in baseball. Ask Arkansas and Florida State.

[Todd4State]

If you gave both guys the 2009 situation for MSU: basically a dead program

(1) We know that Cohen would have you in the National Championship game by 2013.
(2) Lemonis would have maybe made Hoover once or twice. A regional once or so.

Vitello and Van Horne are elite, lemons is pretty much ok. If lemons were good, Texas would have been calling last year. They broke the bank and decency codes for an elite guy, Schlossnagle.

I would take Lemonis over Van Horn.

[Todd4State]

If you gave both guys the 2009 situation for MSU: basically a dead program

(1) We know that Cohen would have you in the National Championship game by 2013.
(2) Lemonis would have maybe made Hoover once or twice. A regional once or so.

Vitello and Van Horne are elite, lemons is pretty much ok. If lemons were good, Texas would have been calling last year. They broke the bank and decency codes for an elite guy, Schlossnagle.

We're probably never going to lose a head baseball coach to Texas. Our job is as good or better. Heck- they pulled Garrido from a mid major in Cal State Fullerton and before Schlossnagle their coach came from Tulane. Schlossnagle is a Texas guy and that whole thing was weird.

[AlSwearengen]

I would take Lemonis over Van Horn.

Arkansas may win it all this year, but it feels like they haven't made it to omaha in awhile despite being top 5 preseason every year in recent memory. Vitello on the other hand.

[Coach34]

You are saying Larry Coker and Gene Cheesedick were 2 of the best college football coaches of all time.

Titles matter. It's not the only measure of a coach- but it does weigh heavily.

I'd rather be Larry Coker with my 2 titles than Kyle Whittingham with no titles

[BeardoMSU]

I have high hopes for this team as well, especially from the the pitching staff....

Our hitting coach, on the other hand....doesn't have me particularly brimming with confidence. Is there another gear we can expect to see from Gautreau this season, or nah?

[Coach34]

I have high hopes for this team as well, especially from the the pitching staff....

Our hitting coach, on the other hand....doesn't have me particularly brimming with confidence. Is there another gear we can expect to see from Gautreau this season, or nah?

This staff is super talented. We dont even have any expectations right now for Loftin- and he is a guy that could be a weekend SP if he gets it together and stays healthy.

The hitting talent is there. No excuses.

[Brobi-wan]

Titles matter. It's not the only measure of a coach- but it does weigh heavily.

I'd rather be Larry Coker with my 2 titles than Kyle Whittingham with no titles

And titles should REALLY matter to a school that never had one before 2021.

[MStateDawg]

I think the championship prejudice becomes relevant at 3 to 5 championships like Skip Bertman.
There's only been 6 coaches in history that have 3 or more titles.
Rod Dedeaux x11
Augie Garrido x5
Skip Bertman x5
Pat Casey x3
Jerry Kindall x3
Bobby Winkles x3



The new Oregon State dude is a potential giant.
The "new'" coach is Mitch Canham who was hired just one year after Lemonis was hired at State. In those five years, he never won the Pac12 (despite having the most talent in that league) and he's never made it to Omaha. This "potential giant" sure hasn't shown much potential.

[Coach34]

There's only been 6 coaches in history that have 3 or more titles.
Rod Dedeaux x11
Augie Garrido x5
Skip Bertman x5
Pat Casey x3
Jerry Kindall x3
Bobby Winkles x3



The "new'" coach is Mitch Canham who was hired just one year after Lemonis was hired at State. In those five years, he never won the Pac12 (despite having the most talent in that league) and he's never made it to Omaha. This "potential giant" sure hasn't shown much potential.

So basically no current coach in college baseball has 3 titles. So I guess nobody is elite in college baseball today

[Coach34]

I would take Lemonis over Van Horn.

VH has 7 CWS appearances in 21 seasons at UPig. That's 1 trip every 3 seasons.

Lemon is averaging 1 trip every 2.5 seasons