Stoops is brilliant

[cheewgumm]

I love that guy

[msstate7]

I think he's really good. I like elko too, but not sure aTm picked the right one

[Offshore Dawg]

When Kentucky first hired him some fans posted that they got the dumb Stoops. I don't think they think that now. Time proved them to be somewhat wrong.

[Coursesuper]

They were very patient with him, I hope we can learn something from them.

[cheewgumm]

Patience with the right guy = brilliant

Patience with the wrong guy = idiocy

We could still have Moorhead.

[Pancho]

thank God we do not have JoMO

[Bdawg]

Seemed Stoops and Lebby were on the same page this week. Slow the game and play keep away. I don’t have the exact time of possession but I think KY had the ball much longer in the first half.

[chef dixon]

He's a good coach but every one of you would have been dog cussing him after the Carolina game. Things change week to week

[Todd4State]

They were very patient with him, I hope we can learn something from them.
2-10 in year one at Kentucky.

[Todd4State]

Patience with the right guy = brilliant

Patience with the wrong guy = idiocy

We could still have Moorhead.

The problem is our fans think we have the wrong guy after the first bad loss.

[cheewgumm]

The problem is our fans think we have the wrong guy after the first bad loss.

Agree. You have to give time to evaluate.

I am really encouraged by this week because it shows Lebby is willing to change the game plan given the situation. Smart.

Moorhead would not do that.

[Todd4State]

Agree. You have to give time to evaluate.

I am really encouraged by this week because it shows Lebby is willing to change the game plan given the situation. Smart.

Moorhead would not do that.

With Moorhead it's easy because he lost control of the team. Pretty sure that never has happened with Stoops.

Stoops has lost some bad games at Kentucky- to USM for example. That's as bad as MSU losing to Toledo.

[TrapGame]

Stoops is a good coach but Lane has been pumped up to be elite.

UK under Stoops reminds me of Jackie's teams in the late 90's.

And Lebby did something that Moorhead refused to do even after being shown how, twice. This tells me Lebby gets it.

[SPMT]

Agree. You have to give time to evaluate.

I am really encouraged by this week because it shows Lebby is willing to change the game plan given the situation. Smart.

Moorhead would not do that.

Mullen and Lebby adjust.

Croom and Moorehead did not.

Mullen was a master at that early on.

[SPMT]

Stoops is a good coach but Lane has been pumped up to be elite.

UK under Stoops reminds me of Jackie's teams in the late 90's.

And Lebby did something that Moorhead refused to do even after being shown how, twice. This tells me Lebby gets it.

Stoops is an MSU style coach.

[DownwardDawg]

Stoops is an MSU style coach.

He sure is. And I think Lebby may be also. The offense is looking like an MSU offense now. Dual threat QB and a heavy dose of running the ball. Add a stout defense and you win 7 to 9 games per season.

[StarkVegasSteve]

He sure is. And I think Lebby may be also. The offense is looking like an MSU offense now. Dual threat QB and a heavy dose of running the ball. Add a stout defense and you win 7 to 9 games per season.

That's not gonna be the offense most weeks. We obviously are going to run to set up the pass but we have far too many playmakers at the receiver position to go back to 2011 Mullen offense. It's also not Lebby's thing. We did that on Saturday because that was the gameplan to stay in the game and not info overload a true freshman QB on the road in his first ever collegiate start. We may even lean on that offense against UGA, although their secondary does not look incredible right now so some shots may open up. That's not saying we're not going to run the ball, it's just not going to be line up with a Joel Hanrahan at H back and run midline read option out of shotgun down people's throats. Lebby's offense is more get people in space based. Obviously we don't have all the horses to run it right now but go back to the 21 OM team and that is what it looks like with the right athletes. Fast, physical, aggressive, and will take shots.

[DownwardDawg]

That's not gonna be the offense most weeks. We obviously are going to run to set up the pass but we have far too many playmakers at the receiver position to go back to 2011 Mullen offense. It's also not Lebby's thing. We did that on Saturday because that was the gameplan to stay in the game and not info overload a true freshman QB on the road in his first ever collegiate start. We may even lean on that offense against UGA, although their secondary does not look incredible right now so some shots may open up. That's not saying we're not going to run the ball, it's just not going to be line up with a Joel Hanrahan at H back and run midline read option out of shotgun down people's throats. Lebby's offense is more get people in space based. Obviously we don't have all the horses to run it right now but go back to the 21 OM team and that is what it looks like with the right athletes. Fast, physical, aggressive, and will take shots.

I get that, and I understand the concept. But we keep proving over and over again that we can compete with the heavy run game coupled with a stingy defense. JoMo Auburn game is another example. A coach giving in to what his team can actually do then he goes back to square peg in round hole.
Hopefully Lebby can make it work. We shall see.

[StarkVegasSteve]

I get that, and I understand the concept. But we keep proving over and over again that we can compete with the heavy run game coupled with a stingy defense. JoMo Auburn game is another example. A coach giving in to what his team can actually do then he goes back to square peg in round hole.
Hopefully Lebby can make it work. We shall see.

Moorhead did that because Nick couldn't pass. We've seen MVB can. You still have to have the threat of a deep shot in the offense or have a hell of an O Line. We had a hell of an O Line in 18, we do not now.

[R2Dawg]

Patience with the right guy = brilliant

Patience with the wrong guy = idiocy

We could still have Moorhead.

Never a more true statement.

We gotta let it play out now. UK didn't know that had the right guy till some time passed, but they did. Stoops was smart enough to not bolt at first sign either. Dan was too proud to not recognize what he had going at MSU. Dan had stayed we make playoffs in 18, talent train would continue, we'd be one of SEC darlings right now. MSU just can't catch a break it seems.

Lebby hasn't had an early oh-no comment or action like Jomo did so he may be OK. Lebby seems much better than Jomo. Lebby has showed some discipline (players run off), hasn't made any dumb statements like clear your trophy case or size your rings, and he didn't take the team to the water park in fall camp.

Lebby has to get his asst coaches figured out going into next year and has to get his recruiting figured out quick. Lebby has inherited a mess while Jomo inherited the 85 Bears and an SEC record setting QB and he played with his food.

[R2Dawg]

Stoops is a good coach but Lane has been pumped up to be elite.

UK under Stoops reminds me of Jackie's teams in the late 90's.

And Lebby did something that Moorhead refused to do even after being shown how, twice. This tells me Lebby gets it.

Agree on similarities with Jackie. Although I think the late 90s JWS teams were better than anything Stoops has had. 97-2000 D for 3 years was just plain nasty with Jackie.

I wish Lebby would either bring Jackie or Mullen back for some type of positive effect. Mullen brought Jackie in to help build on past success. We got two good decades, use it.

[R2Dawg]

He sure is. And I think Lebby may be also. The offense is looking like an MSU offense now. Dual threat QB and a heavy dose of running the ball. Add a stout defense and you win 7 to 9 games per season.

Dang straight. Just get the D back to MSU standards and we'll be back in business. History will tell the story of how the AR let the air out of MSU football. Wisconsin is in the same boat right now.

[R2Dawg]

That's not gonna be the offense most weeks. We obviously are going to run to set up the pass but we have far too many playmakers at the receiver position to go back to 2011 Mullen offense. It's also not Lebby's thing. We did that on Saturday because that was the gameplan to stay in the game and not info overload a true freshman QB on the road in his first ever collegiate start. We may even lean on that offense against UGA, although their secondary does not look incredible right now so some shots may open up. That's not saying we're not going to run the ball, it's just not going to be line up with a Joel Hanrahan at H back and run midline read option out of shotgun down people's throats. Lebby's offense is more get people in space based. Obviously we don't have all the horses to run it right now but go back to the 21 OM team and that is what it looks like with the right athletes. Fast, physical, aggressive, and will take shots.

Taking shots downfield is the adder we need. But the foundation is own the LOS, run ball and D. Own LOS and you can run, stop the run anytime you want or need to. If you can't do that, you are toast. Our run game is improving. Get Dinkins back and a few more maybe the D can improve by year end.

[StarkVegasSteve]

Taking shots downfield is the adder we need. But the foundation is own the LOS, run ball and D. Own LOS and you can run, stop the run anytime you want or need to. If you can't do that, you are toast. Our run game is improving. Get Dinkins back and a few more maybe the D can improve by year end.

And that's what Lebby is building. The foundation of his offense is being able to run the ball because that sets up the speed sweeps, pa game, rpo, and general quick game that you see. To run this offense effectively, eyes have to stay in the backfield at the snap. If you can't run it effectively, none of the other stuff works. I think that's why we had so much trouble moving the ball against ASU and Toledo, we had no run game.

[StarkVegasSteve]

Never a more true statement.

We gotta let it play out now. UK didn't know that had the right guy till some time passed, but they did. Stoops was smart enough to not bolt at first sign either. Dan was too proud to not recognize what he had going at MSU. Dan had stayed we make playoffs in 18, talent train would continue, we'd be one of SEC darlings right now. MSU just can't catch a break it seems.

Lebby hasn't had an early oh-no comment or action like Jomo did so he may be OK. Lebby seems much better than Jomo. Lebby has showed some discipline (players run off), hasn't made any dumb statements like clear your trophy case or size your rings, and he didn't take the team to the water park in fall camp.

Lebby has to get his asst coaches figured out going into next year and has to get his recruiting figured out quick. Lebby has inherited a mess while Jomo inherited the 85 Bears and an SEC record setting QB and he played with his food.

Lebby has also been at this level and called plays in this conference. Hell, he's called plays in this state and in our stadium. Moorhead had called plays for two years at the P5 level and he had the best RB in the country at the time to run his offense through. Teams always had to respect Barkley on the RPO game because if you didn't he'd go 75 yds up the middle untouched.

[Goldendawg]

Stoops now 14-28 against Top 25 teams. Overrated coach in my opinion but maybe their Dan Mullen, except he may stay and get the statue Dan didn't want after about his first 5 years.

[SPMT]

Stoops now 14-28 against Top 25 teams. Overrated coach in my opinion but maybe their Dan Mullen, except he may stay and get the statue Dan didn't want after about his first 5 years.

How many coaches actually have a 500 or better record against top 25?

It?s 10% or less.

We aren?t getting one if the coaches often, if ever.

[TrapGame]

Lebby has also been at this level and called plays in this conference. Hell, he's called plays in this state and in our stadium. Moorhead had called plays for two years at the P5 level and he had the best RB in the country at the time to run his offense through. Teams always had to respect Barkley on the RPO game because if you didn't he'd go 75 yds up the middle untouched.

And Moorhead was kept on a tight leash at Penn State. Franklin figured him out after a few games. The offense sputtered a few games until Franklin walked in to the offensive meetings and saw the chaos. He told Moorhead to choose his best ten plays and that's all he could call.

[StarkVegasSteve]

And Moorhead was kept on a tight leash at Penn State. Franklin figured him out after a few games. The offense sputtered a few games until Franklin walked in to the offensive meetings and saw the chaos. He told Moorhead to choose his best ten plays and that's all he could call.

The Moorhead era is just so damn puzzling. Like he has a veteran O Line, the all time leading rushing QB in conference history, a stable of great RBs, and he chooses to......try to run RPO passes.

[Pancho]

some folks simply know one way and aren't capable of adapting. JoMo fits that category

[BrunswickDawg]

Moorhead did that because Nick couldn't pass. We've seen MVB can. You still have to have the threat of a deep shot in the offense or have a hell of an O Line. We had a hell of an O Line in 18, we do not now.

Nick was a serviceable throwing QB - who didn't have a receiver who could catch a cold in 2018. When he had Fred Ross and Donald Gray he threw for almost 2500 yards in 2016. JoMo's SloMo passing attack was not suited to Nick's strengths, or anyone's really. Shrader and Stevens weren't any better.

[1eyedog]

Moorhead did that because Nick couldn't pass. We've seen MVB can. You still have to have the threat of a deep shot in the offense or have a hell of an O Line. We had a hell of an O Line in 18, we do not now.

I disagree, I watched Nick pass and run OM into the ground in the Velvet Ditch......was he a Heisman passer ....No......was he good enough to beat good teams with a run game in the game plan......**** yes.

[CaptainObvious]

If Mullen was STILL State's Head Coach, the Administration would be planning a Statue for him outside the stadium. He didn't like our Bermuda Grass and traded it in for St. Augustine! Dumbass!

[Todd4State]

Dang straight. Just get the D back to MSU standards and we'll be back in business. History will tell the story of how the AR let the air out of MSU football. Wisconsin is in the same boat right now.

If winning 9 games is letting the air out of MSU football then sign me up. That said, whatever scheme we want to run matters very little. MSU fans focus way too much on scheme and trying to outsmart the other team with X's and O's and the shift needs to go to player identification and recruiting the best players we can. If we have four star QB's, WR, OL, and RB's we will be able to throw and run effectively. The recruiting aspect of what Lebby can do with his offense that has some roots in the Air Raid is what excites me the most moreso than his actual scheme itself.

[Todd4State]

The Moorhead era is just so damn puzzling. Like he has a veteran O Line, the all time leading rushing QB in conference history, a stable of great RBs, and he chooses to......try to run RPO passes.

X and O's wise I don't think his offense is that bad. There is a reason he has the reputation that he does. His issue was 100% culture. Even if you have talent if there is no discipline you're setting yourself up for failure.

Now, are there things he could have done to take advantage of the talent we had at the time? Absolutely. Did we ever see a two back set with Aeries and Kylin Hill? Don't remember it if we did. And we should have Malik Dear more as an ATH/slot WR/RB. But even then the foundation just wasn't there and it was going to fail.

[Todd4State]

Stoops now 14-28 against Top 25 teams. Overrated coach in my opinion but maybe their Dan Mullen, except he may stay and get the statue Dan didn't want after about his first 5 years.

I actually think that's pretty good for a school like Kentucky or to be honest MSU. I wouldn't be surprised if Jackie has a worse record against top 25 teams from 1991-2000 and I know Dan does.

Assuming we play four OOC games against teams that aren't ranked and let's just assume we only play two SEC games against teams that aren't ranked and we win all of them. That's essentially going 2-4 against the rest of the schedule which would be an 8-4 season against a really difficult schedule because I kind of doubt we play that many top 25 teams a year normally.

[Todd4State]

Lebby has also been at this level and called plays in this conference. Hell, he's called plays in this state and in our stadium. Moorhead had called plays for two years at the P5 level and he had the best RB in the country at the time to run his offense through. Teams always had to respect Barkley on the RPO game because if you didn't he'd go 75 yds up the middle untouched.

Lebby reminds me of Bob Tyler. He used to coach at Ole Miss and I think that's a plus for us. He already understands that rivalry and it's not so much about just winning but also about recruiting and the BS that we have to deal with in state that usually take our coaches a cycle or two to learn. Both were big on recruiting and by the time Tyler had left he left us a team full of guys like Cooks, Keys, Hull, Haddix, McDole, Young, Collins, etc. He essentially left Bellard with a team with two first round picks in Cooks and Haddix and a bunch of other future NFL guys including Hull who may be a NFL HOF one day and a team good enough to beat Alabama.

Unlike Tyler we won't make him our AD and I doubt he will have to deal with the BS from the two coaches that groomed him for his first SEC job.

[R2Dawg]

If winning 9 games is letting the air out of MSU football then sign me up. That said, whatever scheme we want to run matters very little. MSU fans focus way too much on scheme and trying to outsmart the other team with X's and O's and the shift needs to go to player identification and recruiting the best players we can. If we have four star QB's, WR, OL, and RB's we will be able to throw and run effectively. The recruiting aspect of what Lebby can do with his offense that has some roots in the Air Raid is what excites me the most moreso than his actual scheme itself.

I know you are an AR guy and that is fine, but that approach really set our program back.

We won 9 games one of 3 years. I don't think we beat one good team with a winning record in that 9 either. I give Leach credit for getting the culture back better but all else wasn't best for MSU.

[BrunswickDawg]

I know you are an AR guy and that is fine, but that approach really set our program back.

We won 9 games one of 3 years. I don't think we beat one good team with a winning record in that 9 either. I give Leach credit for getting the culture back better but all else wasn't best for MSU.

Why do our fans always do this? So many spend so much energy on turning positives into negatives. We beat the teams we beat. All were roughly similar to us - and that's why you play the games.
In most cases, these games were toss ups and our win against any of these kept them from seeing their year as being "good/very good" by their typical W/L.

Memphis 7-6 (ranked as high as #25 in season)
Arkansas 7-6 (ranked as high as #10 in season)
Kentucky 7-6 (ranked #22 when we played)
Ole Miss 8-5 (ranked #20 when we played)
Illinois 8-5 (ranked as high as #14 in season)

Plus, we beat A&M who was ranked #17 when we played. So, we beat 5 teams with winning records, and beat a 6th team that was top 20 when we played them.
That's a damn good season. Why diminish it?

Even in '21 we had strong wins
NC State 9-3 (finished #20)
A&M 8-4 (Ranked #15 when we played)
Kentucky 10-3 (finished #18)
Auburn 6-7 (Ranked #16 when we played)

[R2Dawg]

Why do our fans always do this? So many spend so much energy on turning positives into negatives. We beat the teams we beat. All were roughly similar to us - and that's why you play the games.
In most cases, these games were toss ups and our win against any of these kept them from seeing their year as being "good/very good" by their typical W/L.

Memphis 7-6 (ranked as high as #25 in season)
Arkansas 7-6 (ranked as high as #10 in season)
Kentucky 7-6 (ranked #22 when we played)
Ole Miss 8-5 (ranked #20 when we played)
Illinois 8-5 (ranked as high as #14 in season)

Plus, we beat A&M who was ranked #17 when we played. So, we beat 5 teams with winning records, and beat a 6th team that was top 20 when we played them.
That's a damn good season. Why diminish it?

Even in '21 we had strong wins
NC State 9-3 (finished #20)
A&M 8-4 (Ranked #15 when we played)
Kentucky 10-3 (finished #18)
Auburn 6-7 (Ranked #16 when we played)

I wasn't counting bowl games but OK we beat one or two. Just saying lets not act like we beat a lot a actual good teams to get 9 wins. Our O was still hard to watch. I didn't say it wasn't a good year, it was. Just not the cherry that everyone wants to claim. One good year in 3 years is not bringing down the house. Bout like Croom good year in 07. Jackie and Mullen had it going on in big stretches, that is it for MSU football since Bellard in 80-84.

[EdwardDrayton]

Not sure about 'football coach' and 'brilliant' in the same sentence. ****

[Homedawg]

With Moorhead it's easy because he lost control of the team. Pretty sure that never has happened with Stoops.

Stoops has lost some bad games at Kentucky- to USM for example. That's as bad as MSU losing to Toledo.
Moorhead was easy because he had a stacked roster that went 8-4. .... , but the major sign was he was an "offensive guru" that let the stud DE from uk rape us all night and we never ever doubled him, chipped him, nothing. I knew by the third quarter he was a lost cause.

[Todd4State]

I know you are an AR guy and that is fine, but that approach really set our program back.

We won 9 games one of 3 years. I don't think we beat one good team with a winning record in that 9 either. I give Leach credit for getting the culture back better but all else wasn't best for MSU.

Our offensive stats in 2021 and 2022 were basically identical to Dan Mullen's stats in 2016 and 1017. And that was with Leach using mostly Joe Moorhead recruits to run his scheme. It's sad that we never got to see his offense run with a QB like Kamario Taylor who can truly stretch the field with his arm and has the mobility to make plays with his legs.

Leach's offense isn't what set us back- it was Arnett deciding to blow everything apart to get back to the "Mississippi State football" way which has never really worked. If we hire Lebby in 2023 I guarantee you that we are much better off now than we are having had to deal with Arnett and Barbay.

There's a reason why Lebby running an offense that has some ties to Leach and the Air Raid was a popular decision among our fans.

[Todd4State]

Why do our fans always do this? So many spend so much energy on turning positives into negatives. We beat the teams we beat. All were roughly similar to us - and that's why you play the games.
In most cases, these games were toss ups and our win against any of these kept them from seeing their year as being "good/very good" by their typical W/L.

Memphis 7-6 (ranked as high as #25 in season)
Arkansas 7-6 (ranked as high as #10 in season)
Kentucky 7-6 (ranked #22 when we played)
Ole Miss 8-5 (ranked #20 when we played)
Illinois 8-5 (ranked as high as #14 in season)

Plus, we beat A&M who was ranked #17 when we played. So, we beat 5 teams with winning records, and beat a 6th team that was top 20 when we played them.
That's a damn good season. Why diminish it?

Even in '21 we had strong wins
NC State 9-3 (finished #20)
A&M 8-4 (Ranked #15 when we played)
Kentucky 10-3 (finished #18)
Auburn 6-7 (Ranked #16 when we played)

That Egg Bowl win in 2022 is actually pretty underrated if you look at how many teams had won in Oxford against Kiffin up until that point too. They had only lost two games at home in 2021-2022 to Alabama and to Mike Leach and Mississippi State.

[StarkVegasSteve]

That Egg Bowl win in 2022 is actually pretty underrated if you look at how many teams had won in Oxford against Kiffin up until that point too. They had only lost two games at home in 2021-2022 to Alabama and to Mike Leach and Mississippi State.

Up until Saturday, Lane had only lost one game as a home favorite at OM and it was the 22 Egg Bowl.

[Todd4State]

Up until Saturday, Lane had only lost one game as a home favorite at OM and it was the 22 Egg Bowl.

I was thinking about that last weekend. I knew that was their biggest home loss since we beat them in 2022.

[StarkVegasSteve]

I was thinking about that last weekend. I knew that was their biggest home loss since we beat them in 2022.

Now that's a bit of a loaded stat. I still am not completely sure how they were a favorite in that game. They had lost 3 out of 4, the wheels were coming off, and Kiffin to Auburn was all but confirmed. Add to that it was raining and it's still shocking they were a favorite at kick.

[TrapGame]

I'm hoping this turns into a "Beamer is brilliant" thread Saturday.

[StarkVegasSteve]

I'm hoping this turns into a "Beamer is brilliant" thread Saturday.

I'd feel better if I knew Sellers and Sanders were playing. If it's Ashford I have zero hope South Carolina can win and little hope they can keep it close

[TrapGame]

I'd feel better if I knew Sellers and Sanders were playing. If it's Ashford I have zero hope South Carolina can win and little hope they can keep it close

If Sellers and Sanders play and Beamer's DL pushes Lane's OL around like UK did, it might get ugly for OM.

[R2Dawg]

Our offensive stats in 2021 and 2022 were basically identical to Dan Mullen's stats in 2016 and 1017. And that was with Leach using mostly Joe Moorhead recruits to run his scheme. It's sad that we never got to see his offense run with a QB like Kamario Taylor who can truly stretch the field with his arm and has the mobility to make plays with his legs.

Leach's offense isn't what set us back- it was Arnett deciding to blow everything apart to get back to the "Mississippi State football" way which has never really worked. If we hire Lebby in 2023 I guarantee you that we are much better off now than we are having had to deal with Arnett and Barbay.

There's a reason why Lebby running an offense that has some ties to Leach and the Air Raid was a popular decision among our fans.

It ain't just about stats. 16 was first year after Dak with a new QB. Also the D wa so bad in 16 it put us in a bad spot on O. 17 had Mullen looking so not best from the sideline either.

Leach using Moorhead talent was actually good for Leach because his talent went down and down.

Put a good QB in any O and it works better not just AR.

I see nothing that ties Lebby O to AR. People want to put AR on any team that throws the ball or any team that ain't running the wishbone.

Arnett was wrong hire at wrong time. Nothing to do with type O we run.

Agree Lebby should been hired in 2023.

Communism is popular in the US today with younger folks but that don't make it better.

[R2Dawg]

I'd feel better if I knew Sellers and Sanders were playing. If it's Ashford I have zero hope South Carolina can win and little hope they can keep it close

Agree Sellers plays they have a chance. USC wins Sat OM will implode, can't wait. It ain't better than MSU winning but this year I'll take it.

[Brobi-wan]

It ain't just about stats. 16 was first year after Dak with a new QB. Also the D wa so bad in 16 it put us in a bad spot on O. 17 had Mullen looking so not best from the sideline either.

Leach using Moorhead talent was actually good for Leach because his talent went down and down.

Put a good QB in any O and it works better not just AR.

I see nothing that ties Lebby O to AR. People want to put AR on any team that throws the ball or any team that ain't running the wishbone.

Arnett was wrong hire at wrong time. Nothing to do with type O we run.

Agree Lebby should been hired in 2023.

Communism is popular in the US today with younger folks but that don't make it better.

Where does one meet these communists? Oxford?

[StarkVegasSteve]

If Sellers and Sanders play and Beamer's DL pushes Lane's OL around like UK did, it might get ugly for OM.

If they lose Saturday then their season is shot. 7-5 is on the table for them, even 6-6. I mean lose Saturday and you're not winning the next week in Tiger Stadium. After that their schedule is Oklahoma, @Arky, UGA, @Florida, State. I don't know that I feel confident they could win 2 in that group.

[Brobi-wan]

If they lose Saturday then their season is shot. 7-5 is on the table for them, even 6-6. I mean lose Saturday and you're not winning the next week in Tiger Stadium. After that their schedule is Oklahoma, @Arky, UGA, @Florida, State. I don't know that I feel confident they could win 2 in that group.

Arkansas normally gives them a tough game. I’m not confident that we can put up resistance yet, but I do think they beat Florida. They’re about who I thought they were. 8-4. They were lucky last year. Last year they would’ve recovered that fumble in the end zone instead of Kentucky.

[StarkVegasSteve]

Arkansas normally gives them a tough game. I’m not confident that we can put up resistance yet, but I do think they beat Florida. They’re about who I thought they were. 8-4. They were lucky last year. Last year they would’ve recovered that fumble in the end zone instead of Kentucky.

Well I go back to what I said in December or January, they were 4 or 5-0 in one score games last year. They were going to come back to the mean on that. Law of Averages catches up to everyone.

[PGHBulldogBG]

Stoops is basically UKs version of Dan Mullen. He gets the most out of his recruits but he isn?t a good enough coach nor does he have enough overall talent to be a consistent 9 or 10 win program. I still will never understand the aTm fans revolting the hire just to hire Elko who was less proven.

[Cooterpoot]

A 3-2 coach is a genius? Nah, his DC is just really good. That offense has been dogshit since he got there, minus a season.

[TrapGame]

A 3-2 coach is a genius? Nah, his DC is just really good. That offense has been dogshit since he got there, minus a season.

White's a good DC. There's some speculation he might move on after this season.

[Brobi-wan]

Well I go back to what I said in December or January, they were 4 or 5-0 in one score games last year. They were going to come back to the mean on that. Law of Averages catches up to everyone.

And thank God for that

[Todd4State]

It ain't just about stats. 16 was first year after Dak with a new QB. Also the D wa so bad in 16 it put us in a bad spot on O. 17 had Mullen looking so not best from the sideline either.

Leach using Moorhead talent was actually good for Leach because his talent went down and down.

Put a good QB in any O and it works better not just AR.

I see nothing that ties Lebby O to AR. People want to put AR on any team that throws the ball or any team that ain't running the wishbone.

Arnett was wrong hire at wrong time. Nothing to do with type O we run.

Agree Lebby should been hired in 2023.

Communism is popular in the US today with younger folks but that don't make it better.

The reality is that the Air Raid worked as well with mostly Moorhead recruits as it did with Dan and a team full of his recruits. Was Dan looking when we beat the tar out of LSU, Kentucky, and Texas A&M in 2017? Bear in mind that the 2016 and 2017 teams had a QB that is one of the best rushing QB's in school history. Also, in 2016 Dan had to score what was it? Like 60-70 points because Samford scored 50+ on us running the Air Raid.

Many of Leach's recruits left after Arnett was hired or this past offseason. He also focused more on the offensive side of the ball and left the defensive side to Arnett. It's Arnett's side that is failing to deliver right now.

Leach was known for taking average QB's and getting them to put up big numbers and that happened at MSU as well.

Art Briles who invented the veer and shoot coached for Leach at Texas Tech and is on Leach's coaching tree as is Josh Heupel. And Lebby of course also coached under Briles putting him on an extended branch of the Leach tree. It's not at all about how many times the offense throws it. It's more about spreading the field, having a smaller package of plays, and the offense being extremely QB friendly. Our offense isn't the Air Raid but it is in the family with the Air Raid and the Run n' Shoot. What we do now is the second most pass friendly scheme we have run at MSU only second to the Air Raid. Obviously due to injuries to Shapen we will scale the passing back but as we saw against Texas as the game went on the playbook opened up.

[Todd4State]

Now that's a bit of a loaded stat. I still am not completely sure how they were a favorite in that game. They had lost 3 out of 4, the wheels were coming off, and Kiffin to Auburn was all but confirmed. Add to that it was raining and it's still shocking they were a favorite at kick.

I guess it was because we were on the road? We had lost to Kentucky, Alabama, and LSU all on the road that year. Arizona was a road win but they were pretty bad. I don't really know how Las Vegas does things.

[Todd4State]

Well I go back to what I said in December or January, they were 4 or 5-0 in one score games last year. They were going to come back to the mean on that. Law of Averages catches up to everyone.

That is a good point. I looked back at their schedule to fact check my points and they had several close wins. Auburn, LSU, and heck they only beat us by 10.

[Todd4State]

A 3-2 coach is a genius? Nah, his DC is just really good. That offense has been dogshit since he got there, minus a season.


White's a good DC. There's some speculation he might move on after this season.

I would love to have White as our DC. I'm a little surprised that he is still there.

[TheLostDawg]

I would love to have White as our DC. I'm a little surprised that he is still there.

This is when 34 comes in and starts trashing starkville and saying how we won't be able to pull anyone like that because of it

[StarkVegasSteve]

This is when 34 comes in and starts trashing starkville and saying how we won't be able to pull anyone like that because of it

It may be a bit of trashing Starkville, but the reality is that Starkville isn't exactly a happenin place 25 weeks a year. And the town, for as long as I can remember, didn't ever try to market itself as anything other than that. They're at least trying in that facet now and that should be commended. But the fact of the matter is that Starkville is boring a lot of times. It is. Add in to that there's no real entertainment source outside of Mississippi State and you see why it is hard to get people to move to Starkville. I mean you have about 4 options of employment if you're gonna move to Starkville. I mean really think about it, are young people moving to Starkville? And if so, for what? Unless they work for the University there's not many options of employment.

I mean just for example, how many bars would appeal to young adults(25-35) in Starkville? I can think of maybe 3. And none of them are in the main entertainment area. Another example, if a family of 4 is living in Starkville, what are they supposed to do for entertainment during the summer? There's no Dave and Buster's. There's no waterpark. There's kind of a movie theater, if you want to call it that. I mean if Mississippi State is not having an athletic event, then what's that family supposed to do? I think some in our fan base has an overinflated view of Starkville because they only come when it's 100K people in town and there's a big event going on. They've never been on a random Tuesday night in November when there's nothing going on.

[DawgFromOxford]

It may be a bit of trashing Starkville, but the reality is that Starkville isn't exactly a happenin place 25 weeks a year. And the town, for as long as I can remember, didn't ever try to market itself as anything other than that. They're at least trying in that facet now and that should be commended. But the fact of the matter is that Starkville is boring a lot of times. It is. Add in to that there's no real entertainment source outside of Mississippi State and you see why it is hard to get people to move to Starkville. I mean you have about 4 options of employment if you're gonna move to Starkville. I mean really think about it, are young people moving to Starkville? And if so, for what? Unless they work for the University there's not many options of employment.

I mean just for example, how many bars would appeal to young adults(25-35) in Starkville? I can think of maybe 3. And none of them are in the main entertainment area. Another example, if a family of 4 is living in Starkville, what are they supposed to do for entertainment during the summer? There's no Dave and Buster's. There's no waterpark. There's kind of a movie theater, if you want to call it that. I mean if Mississippi State is not having an athletic event, then what's that family supposed to do? I think some in our fan base has an overinflated view of Starkville because they only come when it's 100K people in town and there's a big event going on. They've never been on a random Tuesday night in November when there's nothing going on.

All of this is true for Oxford as well though but you see it get bashed way less often. Both towns revolve around whatever is happening at the college.

Regardless, different strokes for different folks. Starkville is nice and has its own charm and makes for an easy way of life. If you?re looking for 24/7 big city entertainment then yeah there?s no way around it that Starkville probably isn?t where you want to be

[StarkVegasSteve]

All of this is true for Oxford as well though but you see it get bashed way less often. Both towns revolve around whatever is happening at the college.

Regardless, different strokes for different folks. Starkville is nice and has its own charm and makes for an easy way of life. If you?re looking for 24/7 big city entertainment then yeah there?s no way around it that Starkville probably isn?t where you want to be

You're 1000% correct. But Oxford markets itself 1000000x better than Starkville. The town revolves around the University. For the longest time, some of the citizens of Starkville thought the opposite. They saw the university as a hindrance and would get mad when anyone would mention that 99.999% of all the businesses that are in Starkville would not be there if not for Mississippi State.

Oxford also figured out The Square and markets the hell out of it. Starkville has 4 bars that get way too crowded on a weekend.

[MBDawg601]

All of this is true for Oxford as well though but you see it get bashed way less often. Both towns revolve around whatever is happening at the college.

Regardless, different strokes for different folks. Starkville is nice and has its own charm and makes for an easy way of life. If you?re looking for 24/7 big city entertainment then yeah there?s no way around it that Starkville probably isn?t where you want to be

Oxford is close to Memphis/Southaven, which has a lot to do. Downtown Memphis sucks, but the suburbs are nice and full of things to do. Flooded with Ole Miss alum too, so likeminded snobs running around that area.

[DawgFromOxford]

Oxford is close to Memphis/Southaven, which has a lot to do. Downtown Memphis sucks, but the suburbs are nice and full of things to do. Flooded with Ole Miss alum too, so likeminded snobs running around that area.

This gets overplayed. Its an 1-1.5 hours to those areas. Is it drivable, for sure but 99% of people aren't making trips to those places on a regular basis much. People aren't moving to oxford because there's a Trader Joe's 1.5 hours away in Germantown and they aren't driving to see a Bass Pro shop pyramid because it's a slow Tuesday afternoon in the summer.

I will agree with the above statement that Oxford has done a much better job of marketing their town, but that's always been their deal. They care about image more than anything but in this case it's actually helped them

[Goldendawg]

Stoops is basically UKs version of Dan Mullen. He gets the most out of his recruits but he isn?t a good enough coach nor does he have enough overall talent to be a consistent 9 or 10 win program. I still will never understand the aTm fans revolting the hire just to hire Elko who was less proven.

Would you rather have Stoops of Lebby at this time? Even with growing pains (Worse ones hiring of inexperienced buddy at AD and an almost total whiff on the 53 non-SEC talent portal class), I think Libby has a higher ceiling in the years to come. Stoops has reached his ceiling and is what he is at KY.

[MBDawg601]

This gets overplayed. Its an 1-1.5 hours to those areas. Is it drivable, for sure but 99% of people aren't making trips to those places on a regular basis much. People aren't moving to oxford because there's a Trader Joe's 1.5 hours away in Germantown and they aren't driving to see a Bass Pro shop pyramid because it's a slow Tuesday afternoon in the summer.

I will agree with the above statement that Oxford has done a much better job of marketing their town, but that's always been their deal. They care about image more than anything but in this case it's actually helped them

Oh no doubt. No-one is hoofing it to Memphis on a Tuesday night, but weekends without sports could be a little more tolerable. That would be the only difference in the two, to me.

We need some groups to pump money into the cotton district and surrounding areas. Get some cool bars with indoor/outdoor areas and market the hell out of it. We are in the same situation in Flowood. Nowhere cool to eat and hangout. Makes for a boring nightlife.

[StarkVegasSteve]

Oh no doubt. No-one is hoofing it to Memphis on a Tuesday night, but weekends without sports could be a little more tolerable. That would be the only difference in the two, to me.

We need some groups to pump money into the cotton district and surrounding areas. Get some cool bars with indoor/outdoor areas and market the hell out of it. We are in the same situation in Flowood. Nowhere cool to eat and hangout. Makes for a boring nightlife.

You are correct. I think it's getting better, The Landing should be a pretty cool spot, but still a far ways from Oxford in terms of nightlife unfortunately. Starkville needs more all ages bars. No one over 25 wants to be cramped inside of Drifters, Klaasroom, The Bin, etc on a weekend. The District needs a Funkys, Library, etc.

[R2Dawg]

The reality is that the Air Raid worked as well with mostly Moorhead recruits as it did with Dan and a team full of his recruits. Was Dan looking when we beat the tar out of LSU, Kentucky, and Texas A&M in 2017? Bear in mind that the 2016 and 2017 teams had a QB that is one of the best rushing QB's in school history. Also, in 2016 Dan had to score what was it? Like 60-70 points because Samford scored 50+ on us running the Air Raid.

Many of Leach's recruits left after Arnett was hired or this past offseason. He also focused more on the offensive side of the ball and left the defensive side to Arnett. It's Arnett's side that is failing to deliver right now.

Leach was known for taking average QB's and getting them to put up big numbers and that happened at MSU as well.

Art Briles who invented the veer and shoot coached for Leach at Texas Tech and is on Leach's coaching tree as is Josh Heupel. And Lebby of course also coached under Briles putting him on an extended branch of the Leach tree. It's not at all about how many times the offense throws it. It's more about spreading the field, having a smaller package of plays, and the offense being extremely QB friendly. Our offense isn't the Air Raid but it is in the family with the Air Raid and the Run n' Shoot. What we do now is the second most pass friendly scheme we have run at MSU only second to the Air Raid. Obviously due to injuries to Shapen we will scale the passing back but as we saw against Texas as the game went on the playbook opened up.

I'll never understand the obsession with the AR and linking it to every type O that is out there. While we're at it give Emery Bellard some credit for the wishbone O that is embedded in every successful O of today.

[Todd4State]

I'll never understand the obsession with the AR and linking it to every type O that is out there. While we're at it give Emery Bellard some credit for the wishbone O that is embedded in every successful O of today.

Oh Emory should get plenty of credit for what he did. I'm actually glad and think it's cool that we had both as him and Leach as our head coaches and both were successful here.

Leach was a little more impactful IMO. I think what the Air Raid did is really help bring the shotgun to the forefront in football whereas before it was mostly under center drop back passing.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ggr-4KZEk4Y

This is from the NFL. This isn't from some MSU fan.

[msugolf]

It may be a bit of trashing Starkville, but the reality is that Starkville isn't exactly a happenin place 25 weeks a year. And the town, for as long as I can remember, didn't ever try to market itself as anything other than that. They're at least trying in that facet now and that should be commended. But the fact of the matter is that Starkville is boring a lot of times. It is. Add in to that there's no real entertainment source outside of Mississippi State and you see why it is hard to get people to move to Starkville. I mean you have about 4 options of employment if you're gonna move to Starkville. I mean really think about it, are young people moving to Starkville? And if so, for what? Unless they work for the University there's not many options of employment.

I mean just for example, how many bars would appeal to young adults(25-35) in Starkville? I can think of maybe 3. And none of them are in the main entertainment area. Another example, if a family of 4 is living in Starkville, what are they supposed to do for entertainment during the summer? There's no Dave and Buster's. There's no waterpark. There's kind of a movie theater, if you want to call it that. I mean if Mississippi State is not having an athletic event, then what's that family supposed to do? I think some in our fan base has an overinflated view of Starkville because they only come when it's 100K people in town and there's a big event going on. They've never been on a random Tuesday night in November when there's nothing going on.

And if you wanted to join the Starkville country club for the family, good luck. They have a waiting list over 200

[R2Dawg]

Would you rather have Stoops of Lebby at this time? Even with growing pains (Worse ones hiring of inexperienced buddy at AD and an almost total whiff on the 53 non-SEC talent portal class), I think Libby has a higher ceiling in the years to come. Stoops has reached his ceiling and is what he is at KY.

Yep agree. Stoops has a real bad loss coming at some point and they will be wanting to fire him.

[DEDawg]

Oxford is close to Memphis/Southaven, which has a lot to do. Downtown Memphis sucks, but the suburbs are nice and full of things to do. Flooded with Ole Miss alum too, so likeminded snobs running around that area.

Downtown Memphis has way more fun things to do than Germantown and Collierville

[Todd4State]

Downtown Memphis has way more fun things to do than Germantown and Collierville

Yeah. I can't imagine being a college student at Ole Miss and being like "Hey man- let's go to Panera Bread in Germantown."

[Pancho]

I know multiple Memphis baseball players. Several of their cars had windows busted out or tires slashed multiple times in downtown gated areas. Memphis isn't good after dark, especially if one is one foot for any distance.

[DEDawg]

I know multiple Memphis baseball players. Several of their cars had windows busted out or tires slashed multiple times in downtown gated areas. Memphis isn't good after dark, especially if one is one foot for any distance.

This is such an overplayed stereotype. The whole city is like this it?s nothing to do with downtown lol

[Pancho]

A buddy just transferred with fed ex to houston Tx from memphis and he lived downtown. go walk around unarmed there after 9pm lol

[DEDawg]

A buddy just transferred with fed ex to houston Tx from memphis and he lived downtown. go walk around unarmed there after 9pm lol

I currently am right now, as I do every night lol

[TheLostDawg]

I currently am right now, as I do every night lol

Your crazy then unless you're on mud island. Also you obviously not a female. It wasn't but a little over a year ago that Fletcher was abducted and killed.

[DownwardDawg]

A buddy just transferred with fed ex to houston Tx from memphis and he lived downtown. go walk around unarmed there after 9pm lol

Uuuummmmm, Houston is just as bad in a lot of places.

[Tripp McNeely]

Your crazy then unless you're on mud island. Also you obviously not a female. It wasn't but a little over a year ago that Fletcher was abducted and killed.

That wasn't anywhere near downtown! That was around the U of Memphis in the same neighborhood as million dollar homes

[TheLostDawg]

That wasn't anywhere near downtown! That was around the U of Memphis in the same neighborhood as million dollar homes

Yes my point exactly.

[Tripp McNeely]

Yes my point exactly.

...but the earlier poster was talking about walking downtown, and you called him crazy and made a reference to Eliza Fletcher who was running 10(ish) miles away from downtown? What am i missing?

[DEDawg]

...but the earlier poster was talking about walking downtown, and you called him crazy and made a reference to Eliza Fletcher who was running 10(ish) miles away from downtown? What am i missing?

You arent missing anything, they just want to be right about all the scary news stories they here about Memphis even tho theyve been here probably less than 10 times

[TheLostDawg]

...but the earlier poster was talking about walking downtown, and you called him crazy and made a reference to Eliza Fletcher who was running 10(ish) miles away from downtown? What am i missing?

That if it can happen there it can certainly happen downtown

[TheLostDawg]

You arent missing anything, they just want to be right about all the scary news stories they here about Memphis even tho theyve been here probably less than 10 times

I actually lived there not too long ago, have friends and family that still live there. You have no clue what I've seen while I was there.

[DEDawg]

I actually lived there not too long ago, have friends and family that still live there. You have no clue what I've seen while I was there.

Hahaha okay you got me. Hope you are recovering from your time here

[Pancho]

Maybe if your 70 yr old aunt was mugged in her driveway with a pistol to her head as she unloaded her trader joe's groceries in the middle of the afternoon.. I had family there but now they have all recently moved back to MS and changed jobs and enjoy living in areas with less crime, especially the violent kind. A cousin was assaulted in a restaurant parking lot at 7 pm but he fought his way out of the parking lot. and neither of these accounts even made the news due to not enough information. the woke PoPo just shrugged they shoulders at them. It's a personal choice to live there.

[Brobi-wan]

Maybe if your 70 yr old aunt was mugged in her driveway with a pistol to her head as she unloaded her trader joe's groceries in the middle of the afternoon.. I had family there but now they have all recently moved back to MS and changed jobs and enjoy living in areas with less crime, especially the violent kind. A cousin was assaulted in a restaurant parking lot at 7 pm but he fought his way out of the parking lot. and neither of these accounts even made the news due to not enough information. the woke PoPo just shrugged they shoulders at them. It's a personal choice to live there.

Let us not forget the random killing spree because that dude was bored that they eventually caught in Southaven.

[Goldendawg]

Bump. Stoops exposed OM, but he is hardly "brilliant". In fact, KY is 2-10 in their last 12 SEC games after the loss yesterday to Vandy.

[Pancho]

the sharts might be stoops only sec win this year

[DEDawg]

Bump. Stoops exposed OM, but he is hardly "brilliant". In fact, KY is 2-10 in their last 12 SEC games after the loss yesterday to Vandy.

Outside of Alabama I haven?t watched them but? is it possible Vandy is actually good and the GSU loss was a fluke?

[Todd4State]

Bump. Stoops exposed OM, but he is hardly "brilliant". In fact, KY is 2-10 in their last 12 SEC games after the loss yesterday to Vandy.

That's hard to believe. The other win must have been over Arnett and Barbay.

[Todd4State]

Outside of Alabama I haven?t watched them but? is it possible Vandy is actually good and the GSU loss was a fluke?

It's certainly possible. Georgia State may have happened to have their best game ever against them. When we say that someone beats a team 2 out of 10 times sometimes those 2 may happen on the first try.

[StarkVegasSteve]

It's certainly possible. Georgia State may have happened to have their best game ever against them. When we say that someone beats a team 2 out of 10 times sometimes those 2 may happen on the first try.

As I've said multiple times, Vandy is improved and they are improved because of Jerry Kill. That offense was still working out some kinks when they had to play at GSU. They also didn't win TOP. They are undefeated when they win the TOP. When they don't.....they haven't won. Kill has figured out that they don't have the greatest defense so the best way to win is keep that defense off the field.

Kill will get some looks this offseason to get back into a HC job. Whether he takes it will be the key. He's had numerous health issues over the years so I don't know that a big time program can take a risk like that if the health issues creep back up. However, there may be a program out there to take a shot. If I'm Maryland or Baylor or Cincinnati I would probably take a gamble with it