Comparison

[slickdawg]

Sylvester Croom with Ellis Johnson, JB Grimes, Melvin Smith, Cheese Harbison

vs.

Gus Malzhan with Ellis Johnson, JB Grimes, Melvin Smith, Cheese Harbison

[DownwardDawg]

Damn

[maroonmania]

Pretty easy, Malzahn's offense >>>>>>>>>>>> Sly's offense. Auburn's defense right now is 12th in the SEC in total defense while 6th in scoring defense. Certainly nothing to write home about but they are pretty good about not giving up a ton of points in the red zone.

[Westdawg]

Grimes and Johnson are REALLY GREAT coaches. When I saw Ellis Johnson leave us for a lateral position that was NOT in the Carolinas area, my eyes were finally opened to the dumpster fire known as the CROOM ERA. I really liked Croom....he is a great guy, but that defensive staff was VERY GOOD that he had. when they all started jumping ship I realized that Croom really was not gonna change and we were about to get MUCH WORSE as a team and program.

The biggest difference between those two sets of names/staffs is the first one in each list. Croom had a great idea of an offense....and truth be told, it is an offense that would have worked at a place like Bama where you could recruit top-tier talent to run it with. They are a pro-style school that can recruit players that fill those needs. MSU cannot and probably will never be able to run a West Coast offense. And when Croom said that it takes a QB almost 5 years to fully understand it, warning sirens went off like crazy. You may only have a QB for at most 5 years if he RSs and stays for a a full time of 4 years playing....not good thinking there, Croom.
JB Grimes is one heckuva OL coach, too. He LOVES running it over people. The scheme they run under Malzahn is probably giving Grimes happy dreams at night, thinking of what he can have his OL do to an opponent.
Malzahn's offense is the difference maker with those two staffs. Croom just could not get past himself or his loyalty to his close friends to see that he needed to change his offense to something that would fit the players he could recruit to MSU.

[Todd4State]

Grimes and Johnson are REALLY GREAT coaches. When I saw Ellis Johnson leave us for a lateral position that was NOT in the Carolinas area, my eyes were finally opened to the dumpster fire known as the CROOM ERA. I really liked Croom....he is a great guy, but that defensive staff was VERY GOOD that he had. when they all started jumping ship I realized that Croom really was not gonna change and we were about to get MUCH WORSE as a team and program.

The biggest difference between those two sets of names/staffs is the first one in each list. Croom had a great idea of an offense....and truth be told, it is an offense that would have worked at a place like Bama where you could recruit top-tier talent to run it with. They are a pro-style school that can recruit players that fill those needs. MSU cannot and probably will never be able to run a West Coast offense. And when Croom said that it takes a QB almost 5 years to fully understand it, warning sirens went off like crazy. You may only have a QB for at most 5 years if he RSs and stays for a a full time of 4 years playing....not good thinking there, Croom.
JB Grimes is one heckuva OL coach, too. He LOVES running it over people. The scheme they run under Malzahn is probably giving Grimes happy dreams at night, thinking of what he can have his OL do to an opponent.
Malzahn's offense is the difference maker with those two staffs. Croom just could not get past himself or his loyalty to his close friends to see that he needed to change his offense to something that would fit the players he could recruit to MSU.

Very well said. If I was a coach at MSU and I was just hell bent on running the West Coast offense- the FIRST thing I would do is go out to California and find a JUCO QB that could come in and run it immediately and then the second thing I would do is find a high school kid that was overlooked by USC, UCLA, Stanford, etc. that wants to play in the SEC that I could develop and run it. Unless there just happened to be a Tyler Russell, Chris Garrett, Ryan Buchanan in Mississippi that was coming out of high school that particular year.

The QB is so key in that offense, you have to be solid there or you are going to be in trouble. See the Croom era QB's. Mississippi produces enough players at the other positions where we would have been OK. But evenso, Croom would have needed to be a good developer of talent like Dan is to run it. It's a pass first offense and Croom tried to make it into a power running offense. So, basically we were running Jackie's offense out of WCO formations.

The other option- and probably better option- would have been to run something like what Mahlzahn is running and then as the talent amassed to where you could run a pro-style offense, do that. I do think that if you are a coach somewhere like MSU, it's better to be flexible because you just don't know what the state is going to produce from year to year. We might have a Tyler Russell one year, and then a J'Mar Smith the next. We might have a lot of WR's one year and then a lot of RB's the next.

[Political Hack]

Grimes and Johnson are REALLY GREAT coaches. When I saw Ellis Johnson leave us for a lateral position that was NOT in the Carolinas area, my eyes were finally opened to the dumpster fire known as the CROOM ERA. I really liked Croom....he is a great guy, but that defensive staff was VERY GOOD that he had. when they all started jumping ship I realized that Croom really was not gonna change and we were about to get MUCH WORSE as a team and program.

The biggest difference between those two sets of names/staffs is the first one in each list. Croom had a great idea of an offense....and truth be told, it is an offense that would have worked at a place like Bama where you could recruit top-tier talent to run it with. They are a pro-style school that can recruit players that fill those needs. MSU cannot and probably will never be able to run a West Coast offense. And when Croom said that it takes a QB almost 5 years to fully understand it, warning sirens went off like crazy. You may only have a QB for at most 5 years if he RSs and stays for a a full time of 4 years playing....not good thinking there, Croom.
JB Grimes is one heckuva OL coach, too. He LOVES running it over people. The scheme they run under Malzahn is probably giving Grimes happy dreams at night, thinking of what he can have his OL do to an opponent.
Malzahn's offense is the difference maker with those two staffs. Croom just could not get past himself or his loyalty to his close friends to see that he needed to change his offense to something that would fit the players he could recruit to MSU.

post more often.

[mstatefan91]

Anthony Dixon was on twitter the night of the Iron Bowl talking about pretty much exactly this.

Interesting..

[Brahmabull]

Hindsight being what it is, red flags and sirens should have gone off in Croom's very first press conference when he said we were going to run the West Coast offense and Woody McCorvey was going to be the offensive coordinator, but Woody didn't know the West Coast offense and would have to learn it on the job from Croom!

[ShotgunDawg]

I think this is where the MSU fanbase has improved so much over the past 6-8 years. We have become smarter, and by becoming smarter, we will be able to sniff out bullshit quicker in the future, and thus help prevent the Croom era from ever happening.

We have learned over the past few years what type of athletes the State of MS produces on a yearly basis, what type of players we can pull from out of state, and what type of offensive scheme we will to run to mesh the two.

Therefore, 20 years from now when our AD wants to hire a coach that runs a rhythm passing offense, MSU fans will be able to call BS and stop it before it starts.

Our ability to "hash" this stuff out on message boards has made us smarter and thus better at holding our leaders accountable.

[Coach34]

but that defensive staff was VERY GOOD that he had. when they all started jumping ship I realized that Croom really was not gonna change and we were about to get MUCH WORSE as a team and program.

I told everybody that would listen EJ was leaving because Crooms was a sinking ship and he was tired of carrying him. The excuses on SPS were hilarious.

[maroonmania]

I told everybody that would listen EJ was leaving because Crooms was a sinking ship and he was tired of carrying him. The excuses on SPS were hilarious.

No doubt EJ is a very good coach but Harbison and Smith stayed with Croom after EJ left and our defense dropped off quite a bit. The defensive staff that Auburn has is a pretty good staff but Auburn is not winning at the level they are this year because of their defense. As I stated, Auburn is toward the very bottom of the SEC in total defense.

[dawgs]

total defense is a worthless stat these days. per play defense and turnovers created are much better indicator for Ds and eliminates pace of play from the equation.

[Coach34]

No doubt EJ is a very good coach but Harbison and Smith stayed with Croom after EJ left and our defense dropped off quite a bit. The defensive staff that Auburn has is a pretty good staff but Auburn is not winning at the level they are this year because of their defense. As I stated, Auburn is toward the very bottom of the SEC in total defense.

Auburn is 6th in scoring D
They are 3rd in sacks
They are 3rd in 3rd down conversions D
They are 3rd in passes defended
They are 2nd in Red Zone D

They are not that bad on D and have improved over the season as the young DL has grown up

[Westdawg]

No doubt EJ is a very good coach but Harbison and Smith stayed with Croom after EJ left and our defense dropped off quite a bit. The defensive staff that Auburn has is a pretty good staff but Auburn is not winning at the level they are this year because of their defense. As I stated, Auburn is toward the very bottom of the SEC in total defense.

You can have quality assistants, but you MUST have a coordinator with the knowledge and know-how to teach it to his assistants and explain how to implement and carry it out. Ellis Johnson is very good at that. He was not a great head coach and definitely did not do well at USM, but that guy can build one NASTY defense. There is not a lot of "wow" factor with him, but his defenses will just knock you n the mouth. They don't give you much. Expect Auburns defense to be very strong next year....very strong.

[Westdawg]

post more often.

Will do. Now that football season is over I hope to do more posting. For the rest of you FB coaches on here, hope you had a great season and enjoy some time with family.
Hope to add a lot more over the next couple weeks before Christmas break. Then I plan on hitting I-20 and making my way back to da Sip for a couple weeks of relaxation.