Confidence level

[BuckyIsAB****]

On a scale of 1-10 how confident are you that Lemonis and company will ever get us back to where we belong? Im about a 3 at best. He has beaten OM like a drum, and that is great. But if we are never going to get back to where we should be with him, every inning he is here is a waste. We are an improved team. We have a shot to not finish in 14th place in our league. But that is not us.

[Turfdawg67]

Let him finish the season. If we miss Hoover again, send him packing and wish you'd had the balls to do it at the end of last year's debacle.

[Leeshouldveflanked]

Minimum to retain his job is making a Regional. But next years team is going to be worse than this years team unless a lot of Portal Work is done and that definitely hasnt been a Lemonis strongpoint.

[DawgFromOxford]

Minimum to retain his job is making a Regional.

Which is not a great metric. I'm going to be ticked if we limp into a regional only to keep Lemonis so we have to endure another season of mediocre. Either do something special this season or hit the road.

[basedog]

We probably are a slight favor to win series. I think it’s 50/50.

[99jc]

0

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

Which is not a great metric. I'm going to be ticked if we limp into a regional only to keep Lemonis so we have to endure another season of mediocre. Either do something special this season or hit the road.

Agreed that's the worst possible outcome and it's what I've been screaming from the rooftops for a while.

This is the year to show us he can get us to the State standard. Not show us we are better than the past 2 seasons, not show us we can barely make a regional, but play at the State standard. Either host or make it out of a regional or at least be a tough hard out. Next year will be worse, so if he can't get us to the State standard today he won't next year. He's in his 6th season. Enough is enough.

But I worry that if we limp into a regional it'll be "you can't fire a coach after he showed so much improvement!"

[No BS Dawg]

For me, it is just time for a change. Regardless of what the rest of the season holds, we need fresh, fiery, hungry blood in the coaching staff. We need coaches that show their passion for winning in all that they do. We need a staff that is welcoming, proud, and honored to be at Mississippi State. I feel Lemonis and staff had that early, but that may have been some of the players we had giving off that vibe more than coaches. Again, I?m just ready for a change in an effort to get the excitement back in the program from the players, to the fans, to the coaches. There is NO other place like MSU and Dudy Noble for baseball. It is our gem in the crown, of not only MSU, but college baseball. I want it and the pride that comes with it on display 24/7.

[dawgoneyall]

Another....zero

[Quaoarsking]

Let him finish the season. If we miss Hoover again, send him packing and wish you'd had the balls to do it at the end of last year's debacle.

He's gonna have to do a whole lot more than making Hoover.

A winning SEC record and either host or barely miss hosting is the minimum. Not looking great, but there may be enough talent to get it done in spite of him.

[Goldendawg]

I keep reading here about our strong talent level, but it is not enough to beat some OOC teams this year or as with today a Tuesday afternoon game with Central Arkansas. And when we lose, the excuse, "That's Baseball" is often used. We have a HC that has followed a NC with some Alpha Dawgs who were mainly previous coaches' players with a 14TH AND 13TH place finish in our own conference the past two years. We also seem to have lowered our standards on what is acceptable improvement this year. What is our overall record and in the SEC the past two years and this season to date?

[Quaoarsking]

And when we lose, the excuse, "That's Baseball" is often used.

Yeah, it's pretty bad. Every team has a couple of "That's Baseball" games every year, but we've had 6 and counting. We scheduled a fairly weak non-conference schedule that's going to hurt our RPI, and then we're racking up bad losses on top of that. At this point, I wouldn't expect to make a Regional at all if we have a losing conference record, and I wouldn't expect to host unless we can get to 20+ SEC wins and leave the committee no choice.

We're digging ourselves a hole. Hopefully the talent on the team can brute force our way out of it.

[MaroonFlounder]

I keep hoping Lem proves he can push the right buttons like he did in '21.

I am quickly losing all sense of hope.

[Homedawg]

On a scale of 1-10 how confident are you that Lemonis and company will ever get us back to where we belong? Im about a 3 at best. He has beaten OM like a drum, and that is great. But if we are never going to get back to where we should be with him, every inning he is here is a waste. We are an improved team. We have a shot to not finish in 14th place in our league. But that is not us.

The same confidence level I have you will admit Will ever played badly. Glad to see you back after a loss though.

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

I keep hoping Lem proves he can push the right buttons like he did in '21.

I am quickly losing all sense of hope.

I waffle back and forth between trying to find positives (because I want State baseball back) and feeling hopeless.

At the end of the day, Lemo either will get it together or he won't, and we either will move on or we won't

[Bothrops]

Our roster is good, but there are probably 8-9 other rosters as good and better in our league. That makes it difficult to reclaim former glory.

[bulldogcountry1]

The team was sleepwalking today, and we ended up fielding our JV squad. Through 8 innings, I never got one hint that anyone wanted to win the game. I tuned it off after that.

I don?t know what the deal was today, but it looked like more than just an off day.

I?m at a 5.

[StarkVegasSteve]

I have been off the Lemonis train since about October-November of 21. I watched how the team was handling winning a National championship and was not liking what I saw. I then went to some fall ball games and did not like what I saw from Lemonis. It had me worried. That worry has never subsided. I posted, and was raked over the coals, that we should have fired him after 21. I just think a change in leadership is needed regardless of outcome. I just do not think he is the guy to lead the program going forward. It sucks because he is such a damn nice guy, but this is results business and he does not have the positive results to justify keeping him.

[Commercecomet24]

I have been off the Lemonis train since about October-November of 21. I watched how the team was handling winning a National championship and was not liking what I saw. I then went to some fall ball games and did not like what I saw from Lemonis. It had me worried. That worry has never subsided. I posted, and was raked over the coals, that we should have fired him after 21. I just think a change in leadership is needed regardless of outcome. I just do not think he is the guy to lead the program going forward. It sucks because he is such a damn nice guy, but this is results business and he does not have the positive results to justify keeping him.

Did I read that right and you would've fired him after 21? You would have fired him right after winning the national championship? 22 and 23 were bad but no one fires a coach right after winning a natty. That has to be a typo

[maroonmania]

Did I read that right and you would've fired him after 21? You would have fired him right after winning the national championship? 22 and 23 were bad but no one fires a coach right after winning a natty. That has to be a typo

I agree. That would have been the craziest firing in the history of college sports. Well, he just won a national championship but right after that we didn't like his practices so we fired him??? Talk about having no chance to hire anyone else worth a flip. Now going back to after the '23 season I thought he should have been let go but since he wasn't I was hoping it would work out but now I'm thinking 1 run losses may end up being his demise. We may not make the post-season because of a horrendous record in one run games. We think we are doing better because we do look much better as a team than we have the past 2 seasons but we are 1-7 in one run games. So 7 of our 11 losses are by 1 run. But you know how the committee views a 1 run loss? As a loss. Folks think we are through a difficult part of the schedule but there is no weekend in the SEC (except for maybe Missouri) where its going to be easy to take a series. Turns out LSU is not all that great and I think Florida is overrated. Right now I think its only 50/50 we take the series from GA. This team needs to learn to win competitive games fast or this season is not going to end with us in the post season. I've really never seen a team perform this poorly in clutch situations. We really only win games we dominate.

[Coach34]

People are just frustrated.

LSU lost to the SWAC last night

Was today ok? **** no. But it comes down to our SEC record and what we do there. Be good or you will be fired. Need to take Georgia this weekend

[Commercecomet24]

People are just frustrated.

LSU lost to the SWAC last night

Was today ok? **** no. But it comes down to our SEC record and what we do there. Be good or you will be fired. Need to take Georgia this weekend

This 100% the right answer. All comes down to sec play. Win or we'll have a new coach next year.

[StarkVegasSteve]

Did I read that right and you would've fired him after 21? You would have fired him right after winning the national championship? 22 and 23 were bad but no one fires a coach right after winning a natty. That has to be a typo

Nope it is not. Then again I did not want to hire him in the first place. I also knew 19-21 that he was just riding the talent of Cohen and Cann. You could see the cracks starting to form that 21 offseason and that came into fruition in the 22 season that culminated with Tennessee beating us I believe 27-2 on a Thursday night. I would have fired him then because you could tell he had zero clue how to turn it around. Lemonis has no clue how to coach in tight games and if the talent does not bail him out he will blow it with his decision making. 19 Louisville, 21 Virginia and Texas(talent bailed him out in the Virginia game and Texas Game 3), and every close game in 22 and 23

[CaptainObvious]

People are just frustrated.

LSU lost to the SWAC last night

Was today ok? **** no. But it comes down to our SEC record and what we do there. Be good or you will be fired. Need to take Georgia this weekend

What if State loses 2 of 3 this weekend in come from ahead fashion? Are you going to say, we need to take Ole Miss the next weekend? There is a Deer In Headlights Common Denominator to State baseball failures in '22, '23, and losing to crap teams in '24.

[Coach34]

What if State loses 2 of 3 this weekend in come from ahead fashion? Are you going to say, we need to take Ole Miss the next weekend? There is a Deer In Headlights Common Denominator to State baseball failures in '22, '23, and losing to crap teams in '24.

If we lose the series this weekend then his job begins to come into play. Winning the series this weekend is very important to him making the NCAA Tourney. Miss that? You’re fired

[HoopsDawg]

If we lose the series this weekend then his job begins to come into play. Winning the series this weekend is very important to him making the NCAA Tourney. Miss that? You’re fired

You're right, huge series for Lemon this weekend. What some people don't want to acknowledge is that our weak noncon and play has made it necessary for us to win 15 SEC games. Tall order.

[Todd4State]

You're right, huge series for Lemon this weekend. What some people don't want to acknowledge is that our weak noncon and play has made it necessary for us to win 15 SEC games. Tall order.

We aren't going to have to win 15 SEC games to get into a regional. However, losing today pretty much means that the bare minimum is 13. And I think it really hurts us as far as having the potential to host if say we were to win 16 games. We took a pretty big RPI hit today because of this- from 45 down to 56.

That could definitely affect the overall outcome of the season and how the team finishes.

At the risk of blowing things out of proportion- this is pretty bad loss. And it's the kind of loss that makes me wonder if Lemonis doesn't come back that we look at it as the straw that broke the camel's back because of those postseason implications.

[Todd4State]

On a scale of 1-10 how confident are you that Lemonis and company will ever get us back to where we belong? Im about a 3 at best. He has beaten OM like a drum, and that is great. But if we are never going to get back to where we should be with him, every inning he is here is a waste. We are an improved team. We have a shot to not finish in 14th place in our league. But that is not us.

I think we definitely have the talent to. But the lack of attention to detail is very alarming. The fact that he seems to rely heavily on team leaders- whether it's Jake, TA, or Long to drive the team is alarming. Johnny Long's interview was very telling today. I don't think he was calling Lemonis out or anything but it does make Lemonis look bad because it makes you wonder why the hell he isn't getting the team focused? Or maybe it's the fact that Long seems a lot more in tune with what's going on and a lot less like "I don't know what happened. We're pissed off about it."


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HUEtprMv4JY

Lemonis is so hands off that it is his biggest weakness as a coach because then he has to rely on so many others to succeed. But I'm not sure that he is enough asshole CEO to drive those people to get the best out of them. Augie Garrido would have gone nuclear on the team today. Cohen would have too. One of the roles of the head coach is to push others and I'm just not sure that is happening enough based on what I am seeing on the field. Like how the hell do you allow Foxhall to do what he did for over a year and a half? And today he should have told Gautreau to instruct the team to shorten up and put the ball in play after the third inning. Maybe he did do that- but the message clearly didn't get through.

[Todd4State]

People are just frustrated.

LSU lost to the SWAC last night

Was today ok? **** no. But it comes down to our SEC record and what we do there. Be good or you will be fired. Need to take Georgia this weekend

Without a question the Georgia series just got a LOT bigger. As did every other SEC series.

[basedog]

It's crazy to me to think and say "only the Sec games" will define Lemonis future. Every game is important, you can't lay down on non-conference games. If players or coaches aren't giving 100% then they shouldn't be at Msu! If someone isn't giving 100% they want be successful. Dang.....

[basedog]

I think we definitely have the talent to. But the lack of attention to detail is very alarming. The fact that he seems to rely heavily on team leaders- whether it's Jake, TA, or Long to drive the team is alarming. Johnny Long's interview was very telling today. I don't think he was calling Lemonis out or anything but it does make Lemonis look bad because it makes you wonder why the hell he isn't getting the team focused? Or maybe it's the fact that Long seems a lot more in tune with what's going on and a lot less like "I don't know what happened. We're pissed off about it."


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HUEtprMv4JY

Lemonis is so hands off that it is his biggest weakness as a coach because then he has to rely on so many others to succeed. But I'm not sure that he is enough asshole CEO to drive those people to get the best out of them. Augie Garrido would have gone nuclear on the team today. Cohen would have too. One of the roles of the head coach is to push others and I'm just not sure that is happening enough based on what I am seeing on the field. Like how the hell do you allow Foxhall to do what he did for over a year and a half? And today he should have told Gautreau to instruct the team to shorten up and put the ball in play after the third inning. Maybe he did do that- but the message clearly didn't get through.

Hands off, hmmmm, if you only knew.

[Santiago]

People are just frustrated.

LSU lost to the SWAC last night

Was today ok? **** no. But it comes down to our SEC record and what we do there. Be good or you will be fired. Need to take Georgia this weekend

If we are comparing to LSU, then the better question, is if anyone sees LSU putting up with that for the next 3 seasons, and by then the fans saying "well if we can get into a regional lets let the coach stay".
Does anyone on this board see LSU in 3 years from now with bad seasons, holding on to the same coach and saying "that is just the SEC" or "we get to a regional then he should be safe".

[bulldogcountry1]

There's a lot to take in from that video, and none of it is good. He said a lot, but there was obviously a lot of restraint.

At this point, there are still a lot of issues that will keep this team from getting back where we need to be. The main thing is the mental aspect and the buy-in to a true team concept. The chest pound thing just needs to stop when half the lineup refuses to swallow their pride and protect the plate. I'm sure they are being taught to shorten up and think oppo, but the instruction isn't being executed. That is a shared responsibility, but it ultimately falls on the shoulders of the coaching staff.

Another major issues is that we have WAY too many non-competitive innings at the plate, and we tend to bunch those into 4-5-6 inning stretches of sleepwalking. Again, that is on the staff.

[Coach34]

If we are comparing to LSU, then the better question, is if anyone sees LSU putting up with that for the next 3 seasons, and by then the fans saying "well if we can get into a regional lets let the coach stay".
Does anyone on this board see LSU in 3 years from now with bad seasons, holding on to the same coach and saying "that is just the SEC" or "we get to a regional then he should be safe".

We’re not LSU and never will be. My point was the national champion lost to the SWAC. It happens in baseball.

Win the Georgia series and we are still in good shape. Lose it? Well things are getting tougher

[Santiago]

We?re not LSU and never will be. My point was the national champion lost to the SWAC. It happens in baseball.

Win the Georgia series and we are still in good shape. Lose it? Well things are getting tougher

We are not LSU in the number of CWS titles, but we are a top team as far as CWS appearances and that being our goal each year. Not that we will make it, but it is the goal.
We lose alot this season also, so how many more years will Lemonis need to "build his team".

[Churchill]

Confidence in Lemonis is going to fluctuate wildly during the season but in the end he's just not going to get the job done..... period.

[Todd4State]

Hands off, hmmmm, if you only knew.

I'm certainly open to enlightenment.

[Todd4State]

It's crazy to me to think and say "only the Sec games" will define Lemonis future. Every game is important, you can't lay down on non-conference games. If players or coaches aren't giving 100% then they shouldn't be at Msu! If someone isn't giving 100% they want be successful. Dang.....

Well it's true to an extent because how we do in the SEC determines if we get to the postseason or not.

But from there how we do in the postseason should we make it will determine his fate.

[Coach34]

We are not LSU in the number of CWS titles, but we are a top team as far as CWS appearances and that being our goal each year. Not that we will make it, but it is the goal.
We lose alot this season also, so how many more years will Lemonis need to "build his team".

We are not LSU period. They are THE program in their state- plus have a large following in our state (especially on the coast) as well as in southern Texas. They are located in a large city which allows them to have large crowds for every home game- not just weekend series. And obviously its easier to recruit to LSU than it is to State

Now to your 2nd point- We have too many fans confusing our successful run we had that Lemon finished off with a title with that little run being a "standard". I've said this for 20 years now when people wanted to fire Polk and then when people wanted to fire Cohen- having the CWS as your "standard" is ridiculous. We are in the 25th year of the 2000's and we have 5 CWS appearances. Doing something 20% of the time is not a "standard". People arent being realistic saying that.

What should our standard be? It should be to make a Super. Be in the Sweet 16 of baseball so to speak. That is realistic. We have been in a Super 10 times and that is doable most seasons.

Lemon's job is to get into the postseason and see what happens. We are in the middle of that process currently. Next year is next year- has no bearing on this season. We have no idea what the team will be next year. We shall see how it plays out.

[bulldogcountry1]

Confidence in Lemonis is going to fluctuate wildly during the season but in the end he's just not going to get the job done..... period.


I think he is narrowing the window of how the season is going to end up. It's going to range from just missing the tourney to a 2 seed. That's just not where State baseball should be, and Lemonis shouldn't be allowed to lower State standards.

While improvement is obvious, is it enough? He has failed with the portal, and that's just not acceptable in this day and age. The roster looks thin for next year, so why hang on if we know he's going to have another down year next year?

I just don't believe that "motivating" players is a strength of Lemonis. The fire that was lit under him might have made him do more in that regards, but it will fade as soon as his job is secure again.

[Commercecomet24]

It's crazy to me to think and say "only the Sec games" will define Lemonis future. Every game is important, you can't lay down on non-conference games. If players or coaches aren't giving 100% then they shouldn't be at Msu! If someone isn't giving 100% they want be successful. Dang.....

I 100% agree that every game counts. Heck I almost threw my laptop through the wall in my office yesterday when we didn't finish that comeback. When I say the sec schedule determines the year it's because how we do in the sec will determine whether or not we make the tournament(not hoover), the ncaa tournament, and if we do make it what seed we get. The next 3 weeks will go a long way in determining our post season future and lemonis future.

[Commercecomet24]

We are not LSU period. They are THE program in their state- plus have a large following in our state (especially on the coast) as well as in southern Texas. They are located in a large city which allows them to have large crowds for every home game- not just weekend series. And obviously its easier to recruit to LSU than it is to State

Now to your 2nd point- We have too many fans confusing our successful run we had that Lemon finished off with a title with that little run being a "standard". I've said this for 20 years now when people wanted to fire Polk and then when people wanted to fire Cohen- having the CWS as your "standard" is ridiculous. We are in the 25th year of the 2000's and we have 5 CWS appearances. Doing something 20% of the time is not a "standard". People arent being realistic saying that.

What should our standard be? It should be to make a Super. Be in the Sweet 16 of baseball so to speak. That is realistic. We have been in a Super 10 times and that is doable most seasons.

Lemon's job is to get into the postseason and see what happens. We are in the middle of that process currently. Next year is next year- has no bearing on this season. We have no idea what the team will be next year. We shall see how it plays out.

Pretty dang accurate.

[Goldendawg]

Ads on this page: sneakers from ebay on top of page to wear when you book your travel on "indus"to Dubai, Australia, or New Zealand( bottom of page).**** Most of these ads are total garage. Update: "Cheapest Airlines" & "Progressive Leasing" added to page. "Lost Plane Found After Decades"also added back to top. This is a joke!

[Santiago]

We are not LSU period. They are THE program in their state- plus have a large following in our state (especially on the coast) as well as in southern Texas. They are located in a large city which allows them to have large crowds for every home game- not just weekend series. And obviously its easier to recruit to LSU than it is to State

Now to your 2nd point- We have too many fans confusing our successful run we had that Lemon finished off with a title with that little run being a "standard". I've said this for 20 years now when people wanted to fire Polk and then when people wanted to fire Cohen- having the CWS as your "standard" is ridiculous. We are in the 25th year of the 2000's and we have 5 CWS appearances. Doing something 20% of the time is not a "standard". People arent being realistic saying that.

What should our standard be? It should be to make a Super. Be in the Sweet 16 of baseball so to speak. That is realistic. We have been in a Super 10 times and that is doable most seasons.

Lemon's job is to get into the postseason and see what happens. We are in the middle of that process currently. Next year is next year- has no bearing on this season. We have no idea what the team will be next year. We shall see how it plays out.

Your 25 year of the 2000's, the first decade was marred with all the Polk 2 stuff. We lost alot of ground back then in our recruiting base and methods, with getting complacent while suddenly Bianco started out recruiting us and built ole miss from nothing.
I do not want our program going back to those days. Has nothing to do with a "standard".

And in the 90's - was it CWS in 5 of the 10 years?
What about the past 12 years? In the CWS title game twice, and knocked on the door a few more times. So all the 80's and 90's success, it has been the last 11 years that we were in the title game twice. But we are told, things are different now and we should not get our hopes up for that anymore.

Sorry, but we do have a great history, and we should always strive to get there instead of saying "he he got us in a regional this year....not too shabby". That is not to say we should be mad every year not in the CWS. I am clearly saying we should always strive (and donate to NIL) for the goal of getting there, and in that effort we do land there every few years.

Otherwise, lets just enjoy a hopeful invite to a regional, and enjoy our LFL and smoke every year and be told to be happy to just even compete now in the SEC...and mid week games ***

[Coach34]

Having a Super as your standard is not lowering the bar at all. We all know Lemon has not been good the last 2 years. Get the job done this year or you will be unemployed.

The big thing is to let it play out. Almost nobody here thought we would be 4-5 in the SEC right now. It was all this “we gonna be 1-8” chatter. Win the series against Georgia and we are still on track to accomplish our goals. Pretty simple

[Coach34]

And in the 90's - was it CWS in 5 of the 10 years?

And see? This is a perfect example of what I'm talking about.

We made the CWS 3 times in the 90's- not 5

[confucius say]

On a scale of 1-10 how confident are you that Lemonis and company will ever get us back to where we belong? Im about a 3 at best. He has beaten OM like a drum, and that is great. But if we are never going to get back to where we should be with him, every inning he is here is a waste. We are an improved team. We have a shot to not finish in 14th place in our league. But that is not us.

Define "where we belong"

[ScottH]

The worst thing that can happen is achieving only the bare minimum required to stay the course.

I have no idea what that level is. But for the good of the program we need to miss it or achieve it by a good bit.

Escape the gray area.

[Santiago]

And see? This is a perfect example of what I'm talking about.

We made the CWS 3 times in the 90's- not 5

I was not stating fact, I was asking without having to look it up.
The point you intentionally ignore is --- In the CWS championship twice in the past 11 years, right? Despite all the old MSU baseball history and posters here saying it will never be like the old days of dominating in the SEC.

The past 2 years, and seeing a roster this year that will deplete us for next season is a big concern.

[Coach34]

I was not stating fact, I was asking without having to look it up.
The point you intentionally ignore is --- In the CWS championship twice in the past 11 years, right? Despite all the old MSU baseball history and posters here saying it will never be like the old days of dominating in the SEC.

The past 2 years, and seeing a roster this year that will deplete us for next season is a big concern.

Nobody is saying we cant be in the Final 2 times in 11 years- but acting like us not making the CWS is a letdown year is ridiculous to me.

Stevens
Cupp
Mershon
Downs
Chance
Spalitta
Highfill??
O'Brien
Plus other freshmen buried right now because of who is ahead of them
Add a couple of portal guys
(Remember last year and even before the season people saying Hugesak was a bust and cant hit??? That looks like a bad take now doesnt it???)

That's a solid start to next season position-wise. We also have plenty of young pitchers. Not sure why everybody is whining about next year right now

[Commercecomet24]

Nobody is saying we cant be in the Final 2 times in 11 years- but acting like us not making the CWS is a letdown year is ridiculous to me.

Stevens
Cupp
Mershon
Downs
Chance
Spalitta
Highfill??
O'Brien
Plus other freshmen buried right now because of who is ahead of them
Add a couple of portal guys
(Remember last year and even before the season people saying Hugesak was a bust and cant hit??? That looks like a bad take now doesnt it???)

That's a solid start to next season position-wise. We also have plenty of young pitchers. Not sure why everybody is whining about next year right now

Also have a nice class coming in. Im gonna call it Lemonis Derangement Syndrome lol. Pretty simple though if he doesnt win this year we'll have a new coach handling this next year.

[Santiago]

Nobody is saying we cant be in the Final 2 times in 11 years- but acting like us not making the CWS is a letdown year is ridiculous to me.

Stevens
Cupp
Mershon
Downs
Chance
Spalitta
Highfill??
O'Brien
Plus other freshmen buried right now because of who is ahead of them
Add a couple of portal guys
(Remember last year and even before the season people saying Hugesak was a bust and cant hit??? That looks like a bad take now doesnt it???)

That's a solid start to next season position-wise. We also have plenty of young pitchers. Not sure why everybody is whining about next year right now


I have never said not making the CWS this season is a let down. What I have criticized is what has come across after the past 2 seasons of a fan base just being thrilled to get in a regional.
Or what I have seen posted on here recently telling us that the SEC is different and we are no longer in the old days. That is when I speak up and say well we made it twice to the championship in these new days, so stop lowering the bar of goals. We should strive every season for it.

We do not have a full team for next year without some big portal hauls and talent evaluation.

[Todd4State]

Also have a nice class coming in. Im gonna call it Lemonis Derangement Syndrome lol. Pretty simple though if he doesnt win this year we'll have a new coach handling this next year.

Our fans in general are not very good at predicting player career arcs and thus have to "see it".

[Todd4State]

I have never said not making the CWS this season is a let down. What I have criticized is what has come across after the past 2 seasons of a fan base just being thrilled to get in a regional.
Or what I have seen posted on here recently telling us that the SEC is different and we are no longer in the old days. That is when I speak up and say well we made it twice to the championship in these new days, so stop lowering the bar of goals. We should strive every season for it.

We do not have a full team for next year without some big portal hauls and talent evaluation.

We'll be fine. The biggest thing we need out of the portal is a closer and maybe a third baseman.

[Santiago]

Our fans in general are not very good at predicting player career arcs and thus have to "see it".

Is that not the case for anything in baseball , that you have to prove yourself and "see it". We can see potential in players, but the mental aspect is so important as well.

[Coach34]

Is that not the case for anything in baseball , that you have to prove yourself and "see it". We can see potential in players, but the mental aspect is so important as well.

I see that our team is ranked currently

[Homedawg]

Your 25 year of the 2000's, the first decade was marred with all the Polk 2 stuff. We lost alot of ground back then in our recruiting base and methods, with getting complacent while suddenly Bianco started out recruiting us and built ole miss from nothing.
I do not want our program going back to those days. Has nothing to do with a "standard".

And in the 90's - was it CWS in 5 of the 10 years?
What about the past 12 years? In the CWS title game twice, and knocked on the door a few more times. So all the 80's and 90's success, it has been the last 11 years that we were in the title game twice. But we are told, things are different now and we should not get our hopes up for that anymore.

Sorry, but we do have a great history, and we should always strive to get there instead of saying "he he got us in a regional this year....not too shabby". That is not to say we should be mad every year not in the CWS. I am clearly saying we should always strive (and donate to NIL) for the goal of getting there, and in that effort we do land there every few years.

Otherwise, lets just enjoy a hopeful invite to a regional, and enjoy our LFL and smoke every year and be told to be happy to just even compete now in the SEC...and mid week games ***

We went to the CWS 3 times in the 90's 2 times in the 80's

[Santiago]

I see that our team is ranked currently

agree, and we do seem to have a better mental toughness this year.
My take is nothing on the players, but that we should all want to challenge anyone , any time, this year. Be the team end of the year that no one wants to face.

Just did not agree with some fans posting , just being happy to be there at a regional and it is a good year.

[StarkVegasSteve]

We are not LSU period. They are THE program in their state- plus have a large following in our state (especially on the coast) as well as in southern Texas. They are located in a large city which allows them to have large crowds for every home game- not just weekend series. And obviously its easier to recruit to LSU than it is to State

Now to your 2nd point- We have too many fans confusing our successful run we had that Lemon finished off with a title with that little run being a "standard". I've said this for 20 years now when people wanted to fire Polk and then when people wanted to fire Cohen- having the CWS as your "standard" is ridiculous. We are in the 25th year of the 2000's and we have 5 CWS appearances. Doing something 20% of the time is not a "standard". People arent being realistic saying that.

What should our standard be? It should be to make a Super. Be in the Sweet 16 of baseball so to speak. That is realistic. We have been in a Super 10 times and that is doable most seasons.

Lemon's job is to get into the postseason and see what happens. We are in the middle of that process currently. Next year is next year- has no bearing on this season. We have no idea what the team will be next year. We shall see how it plays out.

I agree with a lot of your point about us not being LSU level and fans expectations being a little too unrealistic. I think they are that way because from 2013-2023 we went to 4 CWS, 6 Supers, and 7 Regionals. I mean we were on a hell of a 10 year run and Lemonis derailed it. Whether by injuries, mismanagement, or bad hiring it was derailed. All he had to do was just not screw it up, but he has managed to really screw it up. I think we are coming out of the 2 year low and getting back to respectability but to get back to the level we were at the end of Cohen is going to take some time. I also think our stadium being as palatial as it is has set a standard. I have said time and time again that stadium was not built for April. It was built for June. So when you build a stadium for that time of year, then the expectation is that you will be playing that time of year almost every year.

[HoopsDawg]

We slide into the tournament this year as a 2. Lemon keeps his job. We miss the tournament next year and look for a new coach.

[Coach34]

I agree with a lot of your point about us not being LSU level and fans expectations being a little too unrealistic. I think they are that way because from 2013-2023 we went to 4 CWS, 6 Supers, and 7 Regionals. I mean we were on a hell of a 10 year run and Lemonis derailed it. Whether by injuries, mismanagement, or bad hiring it was derailed. All he had to do was just not screw it up, but he has managed to really screw it up. I think we are coming out of the 2 year low and getting back to respectability but to get back to the level we were at the end of Cohen is going to take some time. I also think our stadium being as palatial as it is has set a standard. I have said time and time again that stadium was not built for April. It was built for June. So when you build a stadium for that time of year, then the expectation is that you will be playing that time of year almost every year.

And I agree with this. We shouldnt miss the Tourney but once a decade- maybe twice if something happens like in 2022 when we had devastating injuries to our top pitchers. I guess that's the difference between me and most others here. Lemon got a pass for 2022 from me. Losing what we lost to graduation and then injuries was too much to overcome. He obviously gets no pass for 2023. So here we are in 2024 waiting on the verdict.

The team competes, hustles, and works to win. Find a closer and let's get a good spot in the Tourney. If not? Let's hire someone else and get to work.

[StarkVegasSteve]

And I agree with this. We shouldnt miss the Tourney but once a decade- maybe twice if something happens like in 2022 when we had devastating injuries to our top pitchers. I guess that's the difference between me and most others here. Lemon got a pass for 2022 from me. Losing what we lost to graduation and then injuries was too much to overcome. He obviously gets no pass for 2023. So here we are in 2024 waiting on the verdict.

The team competes, hustles, and works to win. Find a closer and let's get a good spot in the Tourney. If not? Let's hire someone else and get to work.

I think the closer is the biggest piece to our success for the rest of the season. I think that would allow Schuelke to be the SU guy so as to not stretch him too much. So whether it be Stevens, Dohm, Auger, Davis, etc. Someone is going to have to step into that role. I think you could say that about the 22 and 23 team as well. Not having a closer has costs us way too many games in the past 2.5 years. Obviously that is not something you typically recruit for, but nonetheless we need to find one.

[Commercecomet24]

And I agree with this. We shouldnt miss the Tourney but once a decade- maybe twice if something happens like in 2022 when we had devastating injuries to our top pitchers. I guess that's the difference between me and most others here. Lemon got a pass for 2022 from me. Losing what we lost to graduation and then injuries was too much to overcome. He obviously gets no pass for 2023. So here we are in 2024 waiting on the verdict.

The team competes, hustles, and works to win. Find a closer and let's get a good spot in the Tourney. If not? Let's hire someone else and get to work.

I view it the same exact way. Even with the players we lost to graduation in 22, if Sims, Simmons, Auger and the other pitchers we lost don't go down with injuries we would've still made it to post seaston play, so yeah i give him a pass for 22. 23 no excuse so this is make or break. Pee or get off the pot. Imperative to find someone, anyone who can close, even if it's a commitee of matchups in the 9th have to find a way to close games.

[Commercecomet24]

I think the closer is the biggest piece to our success for the rest of the season. I think that would allow Schuelke to be the SU guy so as to not stretch him too much. So whether it be Stevens, Dohm, Auger, Davis, etc. Someone is going to have to step into that role. I think you could say that about the 22 and 23 team as well. Not having a closer has costs us way too many games in the past 2.5 years. Obviously that is not something you typically recruit for, but nonetheless we need to find one.

Yeah closer has been a huge problem the last 2 years. In 22 we blew 13 games when we had the lead after the 7th, last year was also double figures. Toughest 3 outs in baseball and there's a reason why closers are so valuable.

[StarkVegasSteve]

Yeah closer has been a huge problem the last 2 years. In 22 we blew 13 games when we had the lead after the 7th, last year was also double figures. Toughest 3 outs in baseball and there's a reason why closers are so valuable.

So how do you recruit that? I truly don't know because I don't follow baseball recruiting very close. I mean is that just going to find a fireballer and kind of penciling him in to be the closer? I know with Sims, he was brought in to be a starter and lost out on the weekend rotation the first weekend of the 21 season and kind of found the closer role because of what he did to Texas.

Also, to go into that stat a little, a closer may not win all those 13 games, but just say you turn 8 of them around you are 35-18 and SAFELY in the NCAA tournament and depending on the 8 you may be vying for a hosting spot. So close, yet so far away.

[Commercecomet24]

So how do you recruit that? I truly don't know because I don't follow baseball recruiting very close. I mean is that just going to find a fireballer and kind of penciling him in to be the closer? I know with Sims, he was brought in to be a starter and lost out on the weekend rotation the first weekend of the 21 season and kind of found the closer role because of what he did to Texas.

Also, to go into that stat a little, a closer may not win all those 13 games, but just say you turn 8 of them around you are 35-18 and SAFELY in the NCAA tournament and depending on the 8 you may be vying for a hosting spot. So close, yet so far away.

Recruiting a closer in college is tough because everyone wants to get drafted. To get drafted high in mlb looks to draft pitchers who have shown they can start and then mlb can convert them to relief if they can't start. They very rarely draft a pitcher just to be a closer. So to find a pitcher to close in college you have to have a sims like situation where he can close for a year or so and then start when he's going to be draft eligible. Or find a guy that maybe borderline and convince him the way to be drafted is to close. Sometimes you find a guy that just wants to close. It's not as easy as it sounds to recruit a guy just to close in college. I would look for a guy that's got a live fastball and a Bulldog mentality, that's mentally tough and can deal with blowing one every now and then and comeback the next day and shut it down. Sims really was a perfect fit for the role.

ETA I'm like you I wouldn't expect to win all 13 but as you said 8 or 9 would put you in post season. Yes so very close but so very far!

I believe in 21 we only blew 2 games when we had the lead after 7.

[StarkVegasSteve]

Recruiting a closer in college is tough because everyone wants to get drafted. To get drafted high in mlb looks to draft pitchers who have shown they can start and then mlb can convert them to relief if they can't start. They very rarely draft a pitcher just to be a closer. So to find a pitcher to close in college you have to have a sims like situation where he can close for a year or so and then start when he's going to be draft eligible. Or find a guy that maybe borderline and convince him the way to be drafted is to close. Sometimes you find a guy that just wants to close. It's not as easy as it sounds to recruit a guy just to close in college. I would look for a guy that's got a live fastball and a Bulldog mentality, that's mentally tough and can deal with blowing one every now and then and comeback the next day and shut it down. Sims really was a perfect fit for the role.

ETA I'm like you I wouldn't expect to win all 13 but as you said 8 or 9 would put you in post season. Yes so very close but so very far!

I believe in 21 we only blew 2 games when we had the lead after 7.

That's a great stat til you realize we didn't lead after 4 in many games much less 7.

[Commercecomet24]

That's a great stat til you realize we didn't lead after 4 in many games much less 7.

21 was the championship year we lead in most games that year

The Sims factor

[SPMT]

Nobody is saying we cant be in the Final 2 times in 11 years- but acting like us not making the CWS is a letdown year is ridiculous to me.

Stevens
Cupp
Mershon
Downs
Chance
Spalitta
Highfill??
O'Brien
Plus other freshmen buried right now because of who is ahead of them
Add a couple of portal guys
(Remember last year and even before the season people saying Hugesak was a bust and cant hit??? That looks like a bad take now doesnt it???)

That's a solid start to next season position-wise. We also have plenty of young pitchers. Not sure why everybody is whining about next year right now

We don?t get paid enough to be worried about this shit?.nonetheless, from 2011 - 2021 we missed the tournament one time. That?s clearly the minimum line.

We made super 7 years out of that span. That?s the real line.

Obviously 2020 was irrelevant.

For me make tournament every year is minimum. You get a pass of two years max. Better make super at a 50% clip.

[StarkVegasSteve]

21 was the championship year we lead in most games that year

The Sims factor

My bad. Was thinking 22 since we were talking about blown leads. What are the two games that we blew? Was it TCU and South Carolina?

[Commercecomet24]

My bad. Was thinking 22 since we were talking about blown leads. What are the two games that we blew? Was it TCU and South Carolina?

No worries. Lol at my age the years run together for me all the time and find myself having to double and triple check! Tcu was one but I'll have to look on the other one. PJ as setup and Sims closing gave us a big 8-9 inning double punch.

[maroonmania]

Having a Super as your standard is not lowering the bar at all. We all know Lemon has not been good the last 2 years. Get the job done this year or you will be unemployed.

The big thing is to let it play out. Almost nobody here thought we would be 4-5 in the SEC right now. It was all this ?we gonna be 1-8? chatter. Win the series against Georgia and we are still on track to accomplish our goals. Pretty simple

None of our baseball coaches have had any job issues while making Supers. Outside of 2007 when we went on a very unexpected run, I don't think Polk 2 ever made a Super. And with Lemonis, we are coming off of missing Hoover 2 straight years. Talk about what should be unacceptable, that's it. You can't even finish in the Top 12 of a freakin' 14 team league? No realistic MSU fan expects to make the CWS every year. We do expect to at least make a regional every year or close to it and with what we pour into our baseball program I think that is more than reasonable.

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

We slide into the tournament this year as a 2. Lemon keeps his job. We miss the tournament next year and look for a new coach.

The worst of options, but I agree it's highly likely. We should have moved on end of last year and started the rebuild. I fear we'll have wasted 2 years by hanging on to a sub par coach (this year and next), but I hope I'm wrong

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

Also have a nice class coming in. Im gonna call it Lemonis Derangement Syndrome lol. Pretty simple though if he doesnt win this year we'll have a new coach handling this next year.


Our fans in general are not very good at predicting player career arcs and thus have to "see it".

This is year 6 of Lemo. Forgive me if I'm no longer buying the narrative that he just needs to get "his guys" in here, or that Jake G will "coach up" the hitters. We get talent yes, I'm not saying the recruiting is bad... I'm saying that last year and this year are completely Lemos team so why would another year of Lemo recruits be the key to victory?

At what point does "one more year to get his guys" become the definition of insanity?

Make it to a regional final or get out. Jake G and Cheese too. Parker can stay. That's as charitable to Lemo as I can be.

[Commercecomet24]

This is year 6 of Lemo. Forgive me if I'm no longer buying the narrative that he just needs to get "his guys" in here, or that Jake G will "coach up" the hitters. We get talent yes, I'm not saying the recruiting is bad... I'm saying that last year and this year are completely Lemos team so why would another year of Lemo recruits be the key to victory?

At what point does "one more year to get his guys" become the definition of insanity?

Make it to a regional final or get out. Jake G and Cheese too. Parker can stay. That's as charitable to Lemo as I can be.

I never said once wait til he gets his guys. I said we have a nice class coming in but also said he either wins or we'll have a new coach dealing with it next year.

I definitely agree with you though, win or go!

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

People are just frustrated.

LSU lost to the SWAC last night

Was today ok? **** no. But it comes down to our SEC record and what we do there. Be good or you will be fired. Need to take Georgia this weekend

You are 100% correct that crappy midweek loses happen to good teams. That alone isn't reason to get dramatic.

The thing to me is that this is the year Lemo needs to put up or shut up and yet... we're as borderline of a team as you can be. I could see us getting Dohm back and being a high 2 seed and winning a regional. I could also see the UF and midweek losses causing us to unravel a bit, the offense cool off to what we saw pre SEC play, and us missing the postseason with just 12 or 13 SEC wins. Either outcome is very possible.

Yes Lemo should be judged by how it ends. But I think we all see that this team is the definition of "borderline" and that's scary after the last 2 seasons. Hard to not feel nervous

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

I never said once wait til he gets his guys. I said we have a nice class coming in but also said he either wins or we'll have a new coach dealing with it next year.

I know you didn't say it directly, but what is the point of bringing up the recruiting class if not to imply something like "the future is bright with these Lemo recruits"? Not trying to put words in your mouth, I genuinely don't see what else you could have meant by bringing up recruiting

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

(Remember last year and even before the season people saying Hugesak was a bust and cant hit??? That looks like a bad take now doesnt it???)

I'll happily accept being wrong on him. But don't act like you're an expert either. I remember when you said all 3 of Holcomb, Loo, and Loftin would be big contributors because they were "too talented" not to be. Only Loo is. I remember you saying Simmons and Auger would come back from injury and be studs. Cupp was praised on here by some and he's just not ready for SEC pitching. We have all been disappointed in Kohler. Highfill is the example that you will usually loose somebody to injury- either a key hitter or a weekend starter but it will happen.

At the end of the day a lot of it is pretty hard to predict. Guys like Cupp, Stevens, Spalitta, O'Brien, and a Portal transfer could all be studs/a new Ledbetter. Or they could not be close to ready. Some guys like Mershon could become key leaders, but we didn't see a leader in '22 or '23 so that's not a given. Jordan and Hines and Dohm and Loo are big pieces to replace. Could be done for sure but it's not a given by any means.

[Commercecomet24]

I know you didn't say it directly, but what is the point of bringing up the recruiting class if not to imply something like "the future is bright with these Lemo recruits"? Not trying to put words in your mouth, I genuinely don't see what else you could have meant by bringing up recruiting

No I was literally saying it's a nice class we have nothing to do with keeping or letting him go. As I stated in the same post he has to win or we'll have someone else. Yeah I can actually look at a recruiting class because I know a lot of these kids and say it's a nice class without inferring anything about Lemonis staying. Same way I can look at lsu or Vandy or anyone else and say that's a nice class. So yeah you were putting words in my mouth with no idea of my mindset. Smh

ETA I'm not a person who thinks retaining a coach should be tied to his recruiting class coming in. If he can recruit but can't coach he can move on down the road.

[Coach34]

This is year 6 of Lemo. Forgive me if I'm no longer buying the narrative that he just needs to get "his guys" in here, or that Jake G will "coach up" the hitters. We get talent yes, I'm not saying the recruiting is bad... I'm saying that last year and this year are completely Lemos team so why would another year of Lemo recruits be the key to victory?

At what point does "one more year to get his guys" become the definition of insanity?

Make it to a regional final or get out. Jake G and Cheese too. Parker can stay. That's as charitable to Lemo as I can be.

He has his guys- we are watching it play out. We are ranked. Whats the problem?

[Coach34]

I know you didn't say it directly, but what is the point of bringing up the recruiting class if not to imply something like "the future is bright with these Lemo recruits"? Not trying to put words in your mouth, I genuinely don't see what else you could have meant by bringing up recruiting

It means he is recruiting well as our classes remain highly ranked

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

He has his guys- we are watching it play out. We are ranked. Whats the problem?

Our RPI is 46 and we've lost 3 of the last 4. We've also seen LSU fall off a cliff so that series doesn't say as much as we hoped. Honestly the Florida series is more impressive at this point.

All I'm saying is we are not exactly playing at the "super regional" standard of play you say is our standard. We might get there, I could see it happening with Dohm back. But we have not been playing at that level on the whole this season

[Coach34]

None of our baseball coaches have had any job issues while making Supers. Outside of 2007 when we went on a very unexpected run, I don't think Polk 2 ever made a Super. And with Lemonis, we are coming off of missing Hoover 2 straight years. Talk about what should be unacceptable, that's it. You can't even finish in the Top 12 of a freakin' 14 team league? No realistic MSU fan expects to make the CWS every year. We do expect to at least make a regional every year or close to it and with what we pour into our baseball program I think that is more than reasonable.

Cohen got the Super after 3 years. Cohen played for the Natty in Y5. Cohen made 2 Supers or better in 7 seasons. Why do sooooo many of our fans live in Revisionist history?

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

Cohen got the Super after 3 years. Cohen played for the Natty in Y5. Cohen made 2 Supers or better in 7 seasons. Why do sooooo many of our fans live in Revisionist history?

1) Odd that you leave off his 8th season, where we won the SEC outright and made the Supers as a national seed (lost to the eventual runner up). This is the definition of cherrypicking stats that you took his first 7 seasons but not his full 8.

2) Cohen had to rebuild from Polk 2 in a pre Portal, pre 1 time immediate eligibility transfer era world. It only took 2 lost seasons to get it rolling. Year 3 on: Super, regional, CWS runner up, regional, missed tourney (which he aggressively addressed via JuCo transfers), SR as a national seed and SEC champs. Then Cann comes along and somehow makes a Super with like 3 serviceable SEC pitchers, and then Henderson took a very distracted team to Omaha.

[Coach34]

1) Odd that you leave off his 8th season, where we won the SEC outright and made the Supers as a national seed (lost to the eventual runner up). This is the definition of cherrypicking stats that you took his first 7 seasons but not his full 8.

2) Cohen had to rebuild from Polk 2 in a pre Portal, pre 1 time immediate eligibility transfer era world. It only took 2 lost seasons to get it rolling. Year 3 on: Super, regional, CWS runner up, regional, missed tourney (which he aggressively addressed via JuCo transfers), SR as a national seed and SEC champs. Then Cann comes along and somehow makes a Super with like 3 serviceable SEC pitchers, and then Henderson took a very distracted team to Omaha.

Ahhhhhhhhhhh and here we go.

I did that because half the fanbase wanted Cohen fired after Y2. I was online supporting Cohen and explaining that Polk 2 was ridiculously lazy. He has lost for 2 seasons and people didnt think State should have that happen. Raffo told me on the phone they wouldnt recruit my players unless they came to camp. 2 went to LSU and 1 to UPig. People were pissed Greg didnt let Polk make Raffo the HC. Then- not only did our fans want to fire Cohen after 2 years- they wanted to fire him again in 2015. He bunted too much. He missed the Tourney. He was letting our program fall. Our program was losing life.

Then we went on our best run in history. Point? Fans arent the best judge of when coaching changes need to happen. Fan is short for fanatic for a reason

[Coach34]

and to make the comparision- one of the big arguments to fire Arnett was not only was the rebuild going bad but recruiting in the future wasnt very rosey. We were in the 30's in recruiting for football.

For this recruiting class- Lemon/State is 10th in the country this cycle in recruiting rating. That's why people in the know or higher up arent white knuckling right now

[Quaoarsking]

I did that because half the fanbase wanted Cohen fired after Y2.

That's revisionist history. You can go through the archives at SPS and see that it's not true. There were a few people here and there who wanted him fired, but he had clear majority support of the fanbase, even though there was a consensus that he had to make a Regional in Year 3.

[Coach34]

That's revisionist history. You can go through the archives at SPS and see that it's not true. There were a few people here and there who wanted him fired, but he had clear majority support of the fanbase, even though there was a consensus that he had to make a Regional in Year 3.

oh thats 100% wrong. 80% of Sixpack wanted Cohen fired in his 2nd year. It was me and a couple others defending him. Most were saying Cohen wasnt ready for this big job and we ****ed up not hiring Raffo

[SPMT]

oh thats 100% wrong. 80% of Sixpack wanted Cohen fired in his 2nd year. It was me and a couple others defending him. Most were saying Cohen wasnt ready for this big job and we ****ed up not hiring Raffo

Seems most hated cohen, because he said too many dirty words. Wes give a left nut for that passion now.

[Commercecomet24]

Seems most hated cohen, because he said too many dirty words. Wes give a left nut for that passion now.

I don't approve of profanity but I sure did love playing for intense coaches and sometimes those types have to let a few fly, lol!

You gotta be who you are as a coach!

[SPMT]

I don't approve of profanity but I sure did love playing for intense coaches and sometimes those types have to let a few fly, lol!

You gotta be who you are as a coach!

I hear you! It can be overused and I grew up around profanity and use it too much, but do believe coaches of most all sports need intensity, regardless of their method. No need to direct it toward a player specifically but young men respond to intense coaches more often than not, as long as they aren’t whiners or blamers.

Baseball, especially can use an intense coach. Let’s face it, baseball often lacks the toughness required from other sports, especially physically, which often ties into mentally, where it is probably the most difficult of modern American sports. Baseball is a true sport of life.

[Commercecomet24]

I hear you! It can be overused and I grew up around profanity and use it too much, but do believe coaches of most all sports need intensity, regardless of their method. No need to direct it toward a player specifically but young men respond to intense coaches more often than not, as long as they aren?t whiners or blamers.

Baseball, especially can use an intense coach. Let?s face it, baseball often lacks the toughness required from other sports, especially physically, which often ties into mentally, where it is probably the most difficult of modern American sports. Baseball is a true sport of life.

I loved being coached hard when I played and I coached that way myself(although I didn't use profanity) but you can get your point across without it lol! Lot of kids now can't handle being coached like that but the ones that can will make better ball players. I had some that couldn't handle it and went somewhere else. You're right about baseball it truly is a sport of life and i believe it truly is the most difficult of sports.

My oldest son is a high school baseball and football coach and the parents love him because he's tough and he sticks up for his players.

[Todd4State]

Is that not the case for anything in baseball , that you have to prove yourself and "see it". We can see potential in players, but the mental aspect is so important as well.

Yes, but it's also reasonable to expect players to improve as they mature as players. Does every player pan out? No. But the odds of a guy like Nolan Stevens getting better are pretty high for example. The odds of a Dylan Cupp getting better are high. Guys that play in National All Star games that we get to campus like the PG All American Classic tend to pan out more times than not. Even a guy like Bryce Chance that I expect to be here as a fifth year senior- odds are he is going to be an even better player in two years than he is now.


This is year 6 of Lemo. Forgive me if I'm no longer buying the narrative that he just needs to get "his guys" in here, or that Jake G will "coach up" the hitters. We get talent yes, I'm not saying the recruiting is bad... I'm saying that last year and this year are completely Lemos team so why would another year of Lemo recruits be the key to victory?

At what point does "one more year to get his guys" become the definition of insanity?

Make it to a regional final or get out. Jake G and Cheese too. Parker can stay. That's as charitable to Lemo as I can be.

What is this about year six and Lemonis having his guys? No one has said anything about that. Everyone knows his guys are here now. Are you getting this confused with some Genespage post from 2005?

Whether Lemonis coaches these players next year or not is irrelevant. The fact of the matter is he has shown that he can win with enough talent- 2019-2021. That's not an endorsement for keeping him- actually quite the opposite if he keeps underachieving with his recruits. Because if he isn't our coach then someone that does come in is basically going to walk into a really good situation that can be turned around very quickly. To me, I don't care who coaches them as long as they produce.


That's revisionist history. You can go through the archives at SPS and see that it's not true. There were a few people here and there who wanted him fired, but he had clear majority support of the fanbase, even though there was a consensus that he had to make a Regional in Year 3.

It wasn't just about Polk and Raffo and Cohen. You had fans that wanted Steve Smith, some that wanted Brian Shoop, and some that wanted someone else. The biggest thing Cohen had going for him was his track record as a coach. I can't tell you how many people would come up to me and talk about how big of an asshole Cohen was in 2009 and 2010- but would then follow up with "he's going to win a National Championship here though." So there were certainly a lot of fans that didn't like him but I think on some level they also knew that's what we needed as a baseball coach. And honestly in hindsight he absolutely built our program into what we expect and want to be even moreso than Polk did. 2016-2021 was the best run for MSU baseball ever. And that's because of Cohen. 2011-2013 was pretty darn good too.

Also- fans say stupid things when we're losing too. Especially MSU fans.

[Commercecomet24]

Yes, but it's also reasonable to expect players to improve as they mature as players. Does every player pan out? No. But the odds of a guy like Nolan Stevens getting better are pretty high for example. The odds of a Dylan Cupp getting better are high. Guys that play in National All Star games that we get to campus like the PG All American Classic tend to pan out more times than not. Even a guy like Bryce Chance that I expect to be here as a fifth year senior- odds are he is going to be an even better player in two years than he is now.



What is this about year six and Lemonis having his guys? No one has said anything about that. Everyone knows his guys are here now. Are you getting this confused with some Genespage post from 2005?

Whether Lemonis coaches these players next year or not is irrelevant. The fact of the matter is he has shown that he can win with enough talent- 2019-2021. That's not an endorsement for keeping him- actually quite the opposite if he keeps underachieving with his recruits. Because if he isn't our coach then someone that does come in is basically going to walk into a really good situation that can be turned around very quickly. To me, I don't care who coaches them as long as they produce.



It wasn't just about Polk and Raffo and Cohen. You had fans that wanted Steve Smith, some that wanted Brian Shoop, and some that wanted someone else. The biggest thing Cohen had going for him was his track record as a coach. I can't tell you how many people would come up to me and talk about how big of an asshole Cohen was in 2009 and 2010- but would then follow up with "he's going to win a National Championship here though." So there were certainly a lot of fans that didn't like him but I think on some level they also knew that's what we needed as a baseball coach. And honestly in hindsight he absolutely built our program into what we expect and want to be even moreso than Polk did. 2016-2021 was the best run for MSU baseball ever. And that's because of Cohen. 2011-2013 was pretty darn good too.

Also- fans say stupid things when we're losing too. Especially MSU fans.

Excellent post!

[Tbonewannabe]

If someone wanted to fire Cohen after year 2, they weren't being realistic. He had a massive exodus with Polk poisoning the team against him. He had to completely rebuild the program.

And his actual dip in 2015 was due to having a team built for the dead ball and the NCAA changing that before the season. Ross Mitchell went from one of the best relievers in SEC history to throwing BP.

Cohen quickly adjusted and got right back to kicking azz.

Lemonis is slowly regressing the program but I am willing to see what he does this year. We at least haven't been run ruled this year.

[sleepy dawg]

3

[maroonmania]

Cohen got the Super after 3 years. Cohen played for the Natty in Y5. Cohen made 2 Supers or better in 7 seasons. Why do sooooo many of our fans live in Revisionist history?

Revisionist?? What the heck are you talking about? Very, very few people had any issues with Cohen after we started going to Supers. That is why I didn't even bother to mention him. Heck, playing for the 2013 NC was SO much better than anything Polk had done for years and years that it was a breath of fresh air. There is nothing to revise. Four out of five MSU fans I talk to wish he would have remained our baseball coach and stayed out of the AD business. He was very good as a college baseball coach but was a terrible AD. I'm VERY glad Auburn took him off our hands.

[Todd4State]

If someone wanted to fire Cohen after year 2, they weren't being realistic. He had a massive exodus with Polk poisoning the team against him. He had to completely rebuild the program.

And his actual dip in 2015 was due to having a team built for the dead ball and the NCAA changing that before the season. Ross Mitchell went from one of the best relievers in SEC history to throwing BP.

Cohen quickly adjusted and got right back to kicking azz.

Lemonis is slowly regressing the program but I am willing to see what he does this year. We at least haven't been run ruled this year.

I'm not sure how anyone can say that we're regressing. We're a respectable 5-5 in the SEC and we almost have as many wins as we had all of last year.

We're not where we want to be but compared to the last two years I don't think we're going backwards.

[Tbonewannabe]

I'm not sure how anyone can say that we're regressing. We're a respectable 5-5 in the SEC and we almost have as many wins as we had all of last year.

We're not where we want to be but compared to the last two years I don't think we're going backwards.
I was talking about Lemonis walking into a program that has been a top 10 program since 2016 and has now dropped the bar to hoping we are a 2 seed somewhere.

2016 - National Seed and won the SEC
2017 - a few outs away from Omaha
2018 - a few outs away from playing for the National Title
2019 - Omaha
2021 - National Title
2022 - garbage year - obviously didn't maintain standard
2023 - worst pitching performance in MSU history (over 150 years)
2024 - fan base now hoping to make a Regional

Not sure what you see but I see a guy that was handed an Omaha built program and he has slowly regressed it. Look at his time at Indiana and it is similar. He doesn't seem to be the guy to lift up a program.

[Coach34]

If someone wanted to fire Cohen after year 2, they weren't being realistic. He had a massive exodus with Polk poisoning the team against him. He had to completely rebuild the program.

And his actual dip in 2015 was due to having a team built for the dead ball and the NCAA changing that before the season. Ross Mitchell went from one of the best relievers in SEC history to throwing BP.

Cohen quickly adjusted and got right back to kicking azz.

Lemonis is slowly regressing the program but I am willing to see what he does this year. We at least haven't been run ruled this year.

Sure they did and were loud about it- saying the same things they say now. “We’re Miss State- we should never have a losing season.” Plus all the other takes when he couldn’t get 10 SEC wins in Y2.

[Coach34]

How is our confidence today?

[Quaoarsking]

Medium. The team is gutsy and rising above our substandard coach, but he's still holding us back.

On top of that, our poor RPI means 13-17 likely doesn't get us a Regional at all, and we'll need 19 or 20 SEC wins to host, meaning we probably will be underseeded in the NCAA Tournament (assuming we make it at all, which we probably will), giving us a harder path to Omaha.

Longterm confidence is lower since all of our good players are leaving after this year, so we really need to make a run to Omaha now, because next year will be a step back unless we hit the portal jackpot.

[BuckyIsAB****]

Ballsy win from the program. Culture may just be back

[basedog]

Helped my confidence today 34.

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

How is our confidence today?

We had 3 games vs UGA at home and all 3 games were close late.

So I'd say my confidence level is at "we're about the same as UGA".

Is UGA good enough? They're like the 9th best team in the conference

[Coach34]

So I'd say my confidence level is at "we're about the same as UGA".

Is UGA good enough? They're like the 9th best team in the conference

Mizzou swept Florida- so we're worse than Mizzou with that line of thinking

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

Mizzou swept Florida- so we're worse than Mizzou with that line of thinking

Ok, fair enough I guess. I think this weekend cemented is as "mediocre".

We beat LSU and thought we had something, but they're one of the worst teams in the conference so we went 2-1 vs one of the easiest weekends. Went to A&M and got a win, solid showing. Went to a decent UF team and got 1 and fought hard, again decent showing. Then we get another home series vs one of the easier teams on the schedule and have to fight like hell to BARELY defend our home.

That's the definition of "mid" -as I think the kids you coach say- isn't it?

We aren't bad we're just not at the State standard and it will be a fight to get to 14 wins

[Commercecomet24]

We're top 7 in conference right now. It could
Move up or down depending on what happens the rest of the way.

[Coach34]

We aren't bad we're just not at the State standard and it will be a fight to get to 14 wins

I guess the issue remains what the "State standard" is. We've hosted 4 times in the last decade going back to 2013 since 2020 was killed. Doing something less than half the time will never be a "standard"

[Todd4State]

I guess the issue remains what the "State standard" is. We've hosted 4 times in the last decade going back to 2013 since 2020 was killed. Doing something less than half the time will never be a "standard"

Our standard should also never be based on something decided by a committee. That's why a SR is my personal standard.

[Todd4State]

Medium. The team is gutsy and rising above our substandard coach, but he's still holding us back.

On top of that, our poor RPI means 13-17 likely doesn't get us a Regional at all, and we'll need 19 or 20 SEC wins to host, meaning we probably will be underseeded in the NCAA Tournament (assuming we make it at all, which we probably will), giving us a harder path to Omaha.

Longterm confidence is lower since all of our good players are leaving after this year, so we really need to make a run to Omaha now, because next year will be a step back unless we hit the portal jackpot.

Our RPI actually went down 3 today. It's like 47 so it's a concern.

[Coach34]

Our standard should also never be based on something decided by a committee. That's why a SR is my personal standard.

I actually agree here. When you make a Super- it’s been a successful season without a doubt

[Quaoarsking]

I think a team that hosts (especially as a top 8 seed) and loses its Regional generally had a better season that a 3 seed who happens to win a Regional.

Now maybe there are a few specific examples where this isn't clear, and if that 3 seed goes deep into Omaha, maybe not. But baseball is too random and fickle to let one bad weekend derail a season. I prefer to judge the quality of the season on SEC record, RPI (I know, it's not a great system but it's what we have), and what seed we get. Making a deep run to Omaha is awesome, but I'm going to be more comfortable with Lemonis going forward if we host and lose than if we don't host, but lose in the Supers.

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

I guess the issue remains what the "State standard" is. We've hosted 4 times in the last decade going back to 2013 since 2020 was killed. Doing something less than half the time will never be a "standard"

Why can't we have a "standard" of top 16? We are too 16 in history, facilities, fan support, coaching salary, recruiting, and probably are near it in NIL.

Why would we accept a "standard" that's less than the average of our parts?

But moreover, if we are in the hosting discussion (and don't go 0-2 in the regional) absolutely nobody will be demanding we fire Lemo. Myself included. So don't act like my "state standard" I mean "host or be fired". Also, we won't be in the hosting discussion will we? We will be a bubble team counting wins till the last weekend and hoping for a win in Hoover. That's a little bit different from hosting isn't it?

[Coach34]

I think a team that hosts (especially as a top 8 seed) and loses its Regional generally had a better season that a 3 seed who happens to win a Regional.

Now maybe there are a few specific examples where this isn't clear, and if that 3 seed goes deep into Omaha, maybe not. But baseball is too random and fickle to let one bad weekend derail a season. I prefer to judge the quality of the season on SEC record, RPI (I know, it's not a great system but it's what we have), and what seed we get. Making a deep run to Omaha is awesome, but I'm going to be more comfortable with Lemonis going forward if we host and lose than if we don't host, but lose in the Supers.

Totally disagree. If you are national seed and dont win your Regional??? Failed season and underachieved

[dawgday166]

Right now ... I'm cautiously optimistic.

Hadn't said anything yet but since the beginning of SEC play I been watching and I've thought this team has potential.

FWIW here are a couple of my thoughts on lineup (nothing drastic):
I'm not crazy about Larry as leadoff. I'd move him to the 8 or 9 hole. His BA is too low and he just doesn't make enough happen at the top of the order IMO. I mention this cause I just am really bugged at the lack of productivity there. If he starts hitting really good again, he can be moved back up there maybe.
I'd move Merchon to leadoff. He makes things happen and is more of a prototype leadoff to me, just needs to cut down on the Ks and make more consistent contact. He also don't need to be doing stupid stuff like getting picked off 2nd either.
Chance is who I'd probably move to the 2 slot. He'll also get better pitches to hit with DJ behind him. He's been hitting the ball pretty well since I been watching. And he also makes contact a lot and doesn't K hardly at all. Good hit & run/run & hit guy.
I'd leave the rest of it about as is.
Overall we need to cut down on the Ks. But I will say most of the guys don't SO looking too often.
Hitting with RISP is pretty darn good IMO. At least that's my perception without looking at the stats. My perception is we hit better with runners on than off base. We also seem to hit better when behind too.
I love how mentally tough and how good they are at coming from behind. Huge Sac's big base running blunder (damn he don't need to be doing that) could've sucked the wind out of a lot of teams but this team just keeps scrapping. I love that.

Pitching:
I ain't always following Lemon's management of the staff in later innings. He may have a long term outlook I ain't seeing and some pitch count or some other analytics I'm not aware of. I have gotten irritated a couple of times when he's been slow to get someone up in the pen. He could also still be trying to figure a few things out with the staff. IMO, overall staff management is decent tho.

A question I sorta had, but it might be cause Lemon wants him to focus on maximizing his RHP ability is ... if Jurrangelo can pitch both ways, why not switch arms when the other team is starting to find their groove with him in later innings. Just a thought I had. He does seem to be better as a righty and Lemon/Parker may be saying let's focus on maximizing that side. Or, and this may have been done before, use him as a reliever in another weekend game with him pitching lefty.

Davis looked good today and has low ERA so he might evolve into the closer. I kinda like submariners for that too, and I think Schuelke might be good there too.

Overall I think we're improving and we need to keep doing that. I ain't too concerned about dominating right now like Arky & KY seem to be, but would like to get warmed up good and then hot going into the postseason.

ETA: And players also don't need to be doing stupid stuff like what Long did last night. That was a baseball play and GA player did nothing wrong there.

Gotta quit the stupid stuff. Getting picked off at 2nd, Huge Sak's blunder today, Long last night ... stupid stuff.

[Coach34]

Why can't we have a "standard" of top 16? We are too 16 in history, facilities, fan support, coaching salary, recruiting, and probably are near it in NIL.

Because its something we cant accomplish even half the time

Something cant be a "standard" if you dont do it 3/4 of the time. Thats the standard you WANT- but its not reality

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

Because its something we cant accomplish even half the time

Something cant be a "standard" if you dont do it 3/4 of the time. Thats the standard you WANT- but its not reality

You're mixing up "minimum acceptable performance" with "standard". A "standard" is what you expect to hit on average. A "minimum acceptable performance" means you fire the coach any season they don't hit it.

Nobody is saying to fire a baseball coach when he doesn't host. We're saying that over say, a 3 year period, the "standard" should average top 16. You can view that as a "regular season" (ie host a regional) or "post season" ie make a Super. That's what Todd sets as his standard. Most of us will forgive a non-host regular season if they perform in the postseason, and understand that baseball is a fickle game and some postseason underperformances will happen so a Super isn't always going to happen even if you host.

You know what's NOT at any "standard"? a 3 year period consisting of missing Hoover, missing Hoover, and being decent but struggling to make the tournament at all. That's below ANY "state standard" you could ask for. Even if you disagree with whatever you want to pretend I demand, you can't possibly say that in Lemos "put up or shut up" season a to the last weekend nailbiter to make the tournament is "putting up".

You're setting up EXACTLY what I feared would happen. I said Lemo would do just enough to make the tournament, people like you would say that's improvement and we should keep Lemo, and we'd waste yet another year with a sub par coach. You're already trying to attack the "standard" so you can say barely sneaking into the tourny is fine.

BUt please, tell me: What does State lack that prevents top 16 from being a reasonable average? Tell me, do we not pay top 16 coaching income? Do we not have top 16 facilities? What am I missing that weighs us down?

[Coach34]

But we arent struggling to make the Tournament this year- we are about to be ranked inside the Top 20. U know who is struggling to make the tournament? LSU and Mississippi

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

But we arent struggling to make the Tournament this year- we are about to be ranked inside the Top 20. U know who is struggling to make the tournament? LSU and Mississippi

Our RPI is in the high 40s and we need 14 SEC wins. Half the famed conference is ranked ahead of us. Yes it'll be a battle to get to the tournament unless our hitters get hot and stay hot or we find a stud 3rd pitcher

[Coach34]

Our RPI is in the high 40s and we need 14 SEC wins. Half the famed conference is ranked ahead of us. Yes it'll be a battle to get to the tournament unless our hitters get hot and stay hot or we find a stud 3rd pitcher

After the next 2 series we will be a borderline 1 seed unless we choke them away. We arent struggling to make the Tourney

[Quaoarsking]

After the next 2 series we will be a borderline 1 seed unless we choke them away. We arent struggling to make the Tourney

2 years ago 2 SEC teams with 17 and 18 SEC wins and RPIs in the top 20 didn't get to host.

We are a long way off from hosting.

[Todd4State]

I think a team that hosts (especially as a top 8 seed) and loses its Regional generally had a better season that a 3 seed who happens to win a Regional.

Now maybe there are a few specific examples where this isn't clear, and if that 3 seed goes deep into Omaha, maybe not. But baseball is too random and fickle to let one bad weekend derail a season. I prefer to judge the quality of the season on SEC record, RPI (I know, it's not a great system but it's what we have), and what seed we get. Making a deep run to Omaha is awesome, but I'm going to be more comfortable with Lemonis going forward if we host and lose than if we don't host, but lose in the Supers.

In this era most regionals are at least two mid majors and then one other ACC, old PAC 12, or Big 12 team. Sure there are exceptions like 2018 when it was MSU, Florida State, and Oklahoma in a regional but unless you're in THAT one my example is what you're looking at in general.

In other words regionals are a lot of times easier than what we face on a typical SEC weekend.

So yeah- if we have a 40 win season and then get knocked out in a regional it's a major disappointment. Or 35 wins.

The ONLY way I would ever somewhat excuse a regional knockout is if we were to win the SEC or the SEC Championship.

[Todd4State]

2 years ago 2 SEC teams with 17 and 18 SEC wins and RPIs in the top 20 didn't get to host.

We are a long way off from hosting.

Our RPI probably needs to be 16 or higher because recently that's how the committee has been assigning them. We have work to do. Closer to time we'll see if there are any weird outliers but losing to Central Arkansas really hurt us badly. We have zero margin for error as far as hosting.

[Todd4State]

After the next 2 series we will be a borderline 1 seed unless we choke them away. We arent struggling to make the Tourney

I'm guessing our most likely path is to sweep Ole Miss, Auburn, and Mizzou which would put us at 15, beat Alabama 2/3, and win a game against Vandy. And don't lose to UAB, Alcorn (Lemonis should be fired for that), Memphis, and the Governor's Cup. I'm assuming we won't play North Alabama. Then we have Arkansas who will be tough on the road.

That's going to be really difficult especially for our team which seems to make gross mistakes at times and has a major incident with SEC officials every other week. And we can't figure out who our closer is.

[ScoobaDawg]

After the next 2 series we will be a borderline 1 seed unless we choke them away. We arent struggling to make the Tourney

Going into todays game we were 51 in rpi per Boyds.
Au was 25, UM was 30. Really need to go 5-1 vs those two. 4-2 at worse.

[Todd4State]

Going into todays game we were 51 in rpi per Boyds.
Au was 25, UM was 30. Really need to go 5-1 vs those two. 4-2 at worse.

I think we're 47 now based on the site I use. Florida losing to Mizzou really hurt us in addition to us losing to UCA.