Baseball Pre Season Poll - D1

[The Federalist Engineer]

2024 Perfect Game Preseason Poll
1. Wake Forest
2. Arkansas
3. LSU
4. Florida
5. TCU
6. Vanderbilt
7. Texas A&M
8. Texas
9. Oregon State
10. Virginia
11. Tennessee
12. Stanford
13. South Carolina
14. North Carolina
15. Auburn
16. Iowa
17. East Carolina
18. UCLA
19. North Carolina State
20. Kansas State
21. Clemson
22. Oklahoma State
23. Duke
24. UC Santa Barbara
25. Coastal Carolina

[KOdawg1]

8 out of the top 15 from the SEC.. (9 if you count Texas)

Gonna be a brutal schedule as always. NCAAT or fired for Lem

[AlSwearengen]

It seemed like Stanford lost half of their starting lineup in the portal and still ranked 12.

[WPS]

Honestly surprised Arkansas is that high. Figured more like 10-12.

[CaptainObvious]

8 out of the top 15 from the SEC.. (9 if you count Texas)

Gonna be a brutal schedule as always. NCAAT or fired for Lem

I'm leaning toward the latter. Everybody in the SEC got better. So if the scale is sliding up for everybody else, State could be better and still finish in the bottom 4. He should not survive that. He made his bed by not building in 2021.

[maroonmania]

Well, you know it's bad when we've supposedly been passed up by freaking Iowa. Do they play baseball in a cornfield?***

[Pancho]

I thought they mixed that up with USM

[The Federalist Engineer]

It seemed like Stanford lost half of their starting lineup in the portal and still ranked 12.

Stanford and Clemson got their milkshakes drank a bit.

Auburn is not that good, with mid-level, competent pitching, MSU would have won the series at their place last year. Rolling out D3 talent like Hardin, Enema, and KC lost 2 of 3.

TAM is good but similar to Auburn, MSU rolls out D3 dudes, you're going to give up 15 runs. That's how you lose 2 of 3.

It's all down to how much Parker improves our pitching and helping the non-Strike throwers to D3 or to Foxy at Auburn.

[The Federalist Engineer]

Honestly surprised Arkansas is that high. Figured more like 10-12.

Every year, you are the most humble dude about your fine ball club.

Hogs are top 5, guaranteed

[WPS]

Every year, you are the most humble dude about your fine ball club.

Hogs are top 5, guaranteed

Haha just seems like the last few years they?ve lost 3/4 of the team from the previous season but DVH seems to always just find a way to put a solid team together.

The hitting gives me more pause than the pitching staff TBH.

[TNDawg35]

Haha just seems like the last few years they?ve lost 3/4 of the team from the previous season but DVH seems to always just find a way to put a solid team together.

The hitting gives me more pause than the pitching staff TBH.

Arkansas pitching is gonna be elite.

State will go as far as the pitching takes us. Our hitting will be damn good. We have some straight up dudes in the lineup. Thats why I can't understand why so many people have us regressing. Parker is a big upgrade from Foxhall just because he shows up to practice. I think we finish middle of the pack this year and Lemonis gets us back on track. Hell we finished 13th last year with absolutely no pitching, you can't tell me we are gonna be that bad with improved pitching and pretty much the same line up. I think we are gonna be sneaky good.

[CaptainObvious]

Arkansas pitching is gonna be elite.

State will go as far as the pitching takes us. Our hitting will be damn good. We have some straight up dudes in the lineup. Thats why I can't understand why so many people have us regressing. Parker is a big upgrade from Foxhall just because he shows up to practice. I think we finish middle of the pack this year and Lemonis gets us back on track. Hell we finished 13th last year with absolutely no pitching, you can't tell me we are gonna be that bad with improved pitching and pretty much the same line up. I think we are gonna be sneaky good.

Because everybody else above State got better in the off-season also.

[Todd4State]

Because everybody else above State got better in the off-season also.

Our pitching was extreme outlier bad. We probably closed more of a gap than the other SEC teams relatively speaking. I don't know how many games we lost late but it was a lot.

For us, it really is as simple as improving the rotation and to a lesser degree the defense. Which I believe we did.

And college baseball polls are laughable at this point. We'll probably end up in the top 25.

[BuckyIsAB****]

No excuses. LSU would?ve already fired the staff

[Coach34]

No excuses. LSU would?ve already fired the staff

We're not LSU and never will be. LSU has 7 titles.

Lemon got a last chance BECAUSE he won our only NC in any sport in school history. He has a Top 25 team. Get it done or he will be fired

[Saltydog]

Agreed.......Our portal haul was mediocre, at best...........I will believe the pitching is improved when I see it........I hope Lemonis gained 30 pounds in the off season.........

[StarkVegasSteve]

Our pitching was extreme outlier bad. We probably closed more of a gap than the other SEC teams relatively speaking. I don't know how many games we lost late but it was a lot.

For us, it really is as simple as improving the rotation and to a lesser degree the defense. Which I believe we did.

And college baseball polls are laughable at this point. We'll probably end up in the top 25.

I mean just off the top of my head I can think of 7 we definitely lost because of late game pitching. You could argue a few more were lost because of middle innings pitching.

[TheLostDawg]

Agreed.......Our portal haul was mediocre, at best...........I will believe the pitching is improved when I see it........I hope Lemonis gained 30 pounds in the off season.........

Need more than just get in the tournament to survive. Two bad years, not capitalizing after a championship, poor portal results. He's got to do a lot this year. I hope that he does, I really do. Would be so much easier if so but if he doesn't make a jump then he should be out

[BuckyIsAB****]

We're not LSU and never will be. LSU has 7 titles.

Lemon got a last chance BECAUSE he won our only NC in any sport in school history. He has a Top 25 team. Get it done or he will be fired

We havent won more nattys so let?s accept the suck.

[Todd4State]

No excuses. LSU would?ve already fired the staff

Not true. They kept Paul Manieri around for awhile and many of their fans hated him.

[No BS Dawg]

Nobody knows anything. We can definitely be better on the mound, but may still be below average by SEC standards. We better score A LOT of runs to be safe. Good pitching usually beats good hitting too. Just too many unknowns and variables for anyone to have a clue about this upcoming season. SEC will be STRONG as usual, uphill battle for us, for sure.

[Coach34]

We havent won more nattys so let?s accept the suck.

Nobody is accepting anything. Our most successful coach is school history gets 1 last shot to show he deserves the job. We just arent LSU and there is nothing wrong with that. We arent Bama is football either and never will be.

We fired our coach in baseball- we hired about our 7th choice in Lemon. LSU fired/retired Maneiri- got their 1st choice. Too many of our fans act like we can just hire anybody. We just saw in football how we dont get established coaches. Kansas and Kansas St coaches would not even consider our job. Fritz wanted to coach at Houston more than take our job (obviously age and family weighed heavily there)- we have to get coordinator-types.

Lemon will prove he is the guy this Spring or he will lose it. It's pretty cut and dried

State baseball is about like Tennessee football

[State82]

State baseball is about like Tennessee football

I would say that is a pretty good comparison

[TALL DAWG]

Are we ranked 26th or 27th
All I saw was top 25

[sandjunky]

12-18 at best this season in SEC play

[TheLostDawg]

Nobody is accepting anything. Our most successful coach is school history gets 1 last shot to show he deserves the job. We just arent LSU and there is nothing wrong with that. We arent Bama is football either and never will be.

We fired our coach in baseball- we hired about our 7th choice in Lemon. LSU fired/retired Maneiri- got their 1st choice. Too many of our fans act like we can just hire anybody. We just saw in football how we dont get established coaches. Kansas and Kansas St coaches would not even consider our job. Fritz wanted to coach at Houston more than take our job (obviously age and family weighed heavily there)- we have to get coordinator-types.

Lemon will prove he is the guy this Spring or he will lose it. It's pretty cut and dried

State baseball is about like Tennessee football

Yes but look at who the AD was. He was going to get our number one until he botched the hire. If that doesn't happen we could have gotten just about anyone we wanted if we did it right out the gate at that time, exceptions being Mcdonald, Corbin, etc.

[Todd4State]

Nobody knows anything. We can definitely be better on the mound, but may still be below average by SEC standards. We better score A LOT of runs to be safe. Good pitching usually beats good hitting too. Just too many unknowns and variables for anyone to have a clue about this upcoming season. SEC will be STRONG as usual, uphill battle for us, for sure.

Offense wasn't an issue last year. And we return a lot of guys that have experience. The one freshman we will likely start- Dylan Cupp is not your typical freshman either. We'll score runs- I have no doubt about that. Hines and Dakota Jordan are both very good.

And you're right- we don't know what will happen. But if I was a betting man I would be willing to bet that our ERA is going to improve a good bit. If Parker gets it into the 5's which isn't that great that's still like a 4 run improvement over last year. That's very significant even if it isn't that impressive. The thing is- with our offense getting our pitching staff to average will likely get us in to a regional.


12-18 at best this season in SEC play

I think we'll be a little bit better than that. 13 SEC wins probably gets us in.


Yes but look at who the AD was. He was going to get our number one until he botched the hire. If that doesn't happen we could have gotten just about anyone we wanted if we did it right out the gate at that time, exceptions being Mcdonald, Corbin, etc.

That situation got weird because that team made it to Omaha and no one thought that was remotely possible when we fired Cann after the first weekend. TCU's AD pushed the situation and while Cohen made a lot of mistakes as an AD not announcing a new coach while we were in Omaha was the right move at that time. That was a case of too many people on both sides- Cohen and Schloss running their mouth too much. And it became the worst kept secret in the industry.

[The Federalist Engineer]

Off Topic...on Polls

I see MSU lost Sam Cozart's commitment. 6-7 RHP that is probably a High School 1st Rounder. A top national recruit.

He is uncommitted now

Recruiting class of 2025

[SPMT]

Arkansas pitching is gonna be elite.

State will go as far as the pitching takes us. Our hitting will be damn good. We have some straight up dudes in the lineup. Thats why I can't understand why so many people have us regressing. Parker is a big upgrade from Foxhall just because he shows up to practice. I think we finish middle of the pack this year and Lemonis gets us back on track. Hell we finished 13th last year with absolutely no pitching, you can't tell me we are gonna be that bad with improved pitching and pretty much the same line up. I think we are gonna be sneaky good.

Foxhall didn?t show up to practice?

Was that a common and routine thing?

[Coursesuper]

Off Topic...on Polls

I see MSU lost Sam Cozart's commitment. 6-7 RHP that is probably a High School 1st Rounder. A top national recruit.

He is uncommitted now

Recruiting class of 2025

NIL.

[CaptainObvious]

Our pitching was extreme outlier bad. We probably closed more of a gap than the other SEC teams relatively speaking. I don't know how many games we lost late but it was a lot.

For us, it really is as simple as improving the rotation and to a lesser degree the defense. Which I believe we did.

And college baseball polls are laughable at this point. We'll probably end up in the top 25.

Your last statement is not only true, it is provable.

I'm old enough to remember State being ranked 4th to start the season one year removed from a National Championship and not even making the SEC tourney.

[Saltydog]

Nobody is accepting anything. Our most successful coach is school history gets 1 last shot to show he deserves the job. We just arent LSU and there is nothing wrong with that. We arent Bama is football either and never will be.

We fired our coach in baseball- we hired about our 7th choice in Lemon. LSU fired/retired Maneiri- got their 1st choice. Too many of our fans act like we can just hire anybody. We just saw in football how we dont get established coaches. Kansas and Kansas St coaches would not even consider our job. Fritz wanted to coach at Houston more than take our job (obviously age and family weighed heavily there)- we have to get coordinator-types.

Lemon will prove he is the guy this Spring or he will lose it. It's pretty cut and dried

State baseball is about like Tennessee football

He's not the most successful coach in school history and you know that. That's like saying Trent Dilfer is better than Dan Marino beause he won Super Bowl. It's ludicrous. Anybody with half a brain knows he won with Cann and Cohen's talent. Now that "the recruiter" has his players look at the result.

[DEDawg]

He's not the most successful coach in school history and you know that. That's like saying Trent Dilfer is better than Dan Marino beause he won Super Bowl. It's ludicrous. Anybody with half a brain knows he won with Cann and Cohen's talent. Now that "the recruiter" has his players look at the result.
Idk about this take. Winning our only NC holds a LOT of weight

[Saltydog]

So, Dilfer is better than Marino? I mean, one good year right? If bucket boy gets fired this year after another dismal season (and that's entirely possible) are you gonna say, there's the greatest coach in MSU history? If you can say "yes", then let's just agree to disagree.

[DEDawg]

So, Dilfer is better than Marino? I mean, one good year right? If bucket boy gets fired this year after another dismal season (and that's entirely possible) are you gonna say, there's the greatest coach in MSU history? If you can say "yes", then let's just agree to disagree.

No, that is a ridiculous comparison.

[Coach34]

He's not the most successful coach in school history and you know that. That's like saying Trent Dilfer is better than Dan Marino beause he won Super Bowl. It's ludicrous. Anybody with half a brain knows he won with Cann and Cohen's talent. Now that "the recruiter" has his players look at the result.

I used successful because it is the correct word. No coach at Miss State has ever been as successful as Lemon. He won a NC. That's as successful as you can get.

Is he the best or most innovative coach? No

Trent Dilfer was more successful than Marino. He was not better than Marino though. Championships matter.

[Hot Rock]

I used successful because it is the correct word. No coach at Miss State has ever been as successful as Lemon. He won a NC. That's as successful as you can get.

Is he the best or most innovative coach? No

Trent Dilfer was more successful than Marino. He was not better than Marino though. Championships matter.

Every once in awhile C34 and I see things alike. Lemonis is our most successful coach. Was it all his doing or can he repeat it? He gets one more chance with me but I get it if others feel differently. It?s been a bad two years.

[Coach34]

Yes but look at who the AD was. He was going to get our number one until he botched the hire. If that doesn't happen we could have gotten just about anyone we wanted if we did it right out the gate at that time, exceptions being Mcdonald, Corbin, etc.

Todd explained it pretty well. If our 1st choice really wanted the job- he would have been our coach. He decided he couldnt wait a week. Cant blame that on the AD.

[schddog72]

Nobody is accepting anything. Our most successful coach is school history gets 1 last shot to show he deserves the job. We just arent LSU and there is nothing wrong with that. We arent Bama is football either and never will be.

We fired our coach in baseball- we hired about our 7th choice in Lemon. LSU fired/retired Maneiri- got their 1st choice. Too many of our fans act like we can just hire anybody. We just saw in football how we dont get established coaches. Kansas and Kansas St coaches would not even consider our job. Fritz wanted to coach at Houston more than take our job (obviously age and family weighed heavily there)- we have to get coordinator-types.

Lemon will prove he is the guy this Spring or he will lose it. It's pretty cut and dried

State baseball is about like Tennessee football

I believe most State fans would disagree with this statement, strongly. Ron Polk was the most successful coach in school history. One natty doesn't outweigh all the great years Polk gave us. He made us relevant; Lemonhead has taken us from the top of the mountain to total irrelevancy in one year, and did nothing to alleviate that the next year.

[CaptainObvious]

Haha! To all our fans who call baseball a niche sport and can't get over the lack of support for basketball, notice this thread on the Sunday after our first or many SEC basketball losses!

Many are moving on to baseball 1 SEC game into the season.

I sure do love our Niche Sport. Maybe bucket boy can get them playing to potential this spring.

[Saltydog]

EXACTLY, and it's not even close.......

[Mjoelner34]

Haha! To all our fans who call baseball a niche sport and can't get over the lack of support for basketball, notice this thread on the Sunday after our first or many SEC basketball losses!

Many are moving on to baseball 1 SEC game into the season.

I sure do love our Niche Sport. Maybe bucket boy can get them playing to potential this spring.

I usually move on to baseball after our bowl game. This year I started thinking about baseball after the LSU game.

[Coach34]

I believe most State fans would disagree with this statement, strongly. Ron Polk was the most successful coach in school history. One natty doesn't outweigh all the great years Polk gave us. He made us relevant; Lemonhead has taken us from the top of the mountain to total irrelevancy in one year, and did nothing to alleviate that the next year.

It doesnt matter who disagrees- facts are facts.

Lemon won a championship. Polk did not.

[Saltydog]

Polk is in the CBB Hall of Fame. Lemon is not and never will be. Facts are Facts......

[CaptainObvious]

Polk's overall SEC Record is 444-329

Lemonis overall SEC Record is 58-62.
Lemonis has to go 17-13 this season to get back to .500 in the conference. Parker better be a damn miracle worker to get State to 14-16 SEC.

[Coach34]

Lemon has the ring. He is a champion.

Polk is not. Polk is the bridesmaid.

[Coach34]

Polk's overall SEC Record is 444-329

Lemonis overall SEC Record is 58-62.
Lemonis has to go 17-13 this season to get back to .500 in the conference. Parker better be a damn miracle worker to get State to 14-16 SEC.

I expect us to be 15-15 this year. Too much talent even with an insane SEC schedule. We will be Top 3 in draft picks come 2024 MLB draft

[Coach34]

Put it this way- Big Country is expected by scouts to be a Top 5 SP in the SEC this year

[CaptainObvious]

I expect us to be 15-15 this year. Too much talent even with an insane SEC schedule. We will be Top 3 in draft picks come 2024 MLB draft

So the talent is here. Just the Coaching Sucks!

I think we have reached agreement.

[confucius say]

Put it this way- Big Country is expected by scouts to be a Top 5 SP in the SEC this year

What scouts? I've not had a single one say that.
Would be awesome if he is a top 5 SP though.

[Coach34]

What scouts? I've not had a single one say that.
Would be awesome if he is a top 5 SP though.

MLB scouts

[CaptainObvious]

MLB scouts

Which ones? There are at least 4 MLB scouts who reside in Mississippi/Alabama. Which ones share their reports on MSU players with you?

[confucius say]

MLB scouts

Which ones? Bc I haven't had any say that.
I just hope they're right. Would be incredible.

[preachermatt83]

Lemonis earned this year. He deserved one more. But this year it’s ncaa tourney as atleast a 2 seed or he’s shown the door.

[The Federalist Engineer]

NIL.

LSU must be NIL'ing everyone. I was looking for the scout that says Colby Holcombe is a top-5 SEC starter when I saw that LSU is destroying all other programs in recruiting. Not even close.

Even Cam Caminiti (MLB legacy) decommitted Vandy for LSU. These out of region superstars had been the Vandy staple.

[Todd4State]

Our fans crack me up.

Polk was a great teacher of the game. Maybe the best baseball fundamental teacher of all time behind maybe George Kissell of the St. Louis Cardinals. MLB teams use his book to teach their minor leaguers. That says it all. The reason he doesn't have a National Championship IMO is because he lacked that ruthless killer instinct. Augie Garrido, Cliff Gustafson, and Skip Bertman weren't nearly as good at teaching the game as Polk but the difference is they would ruin a kids career by pitching him 10+ IP in a regional final on 2 days rest to win a title. Polk wasn't going to do that.

Cohen was probably our best X an O's baseball coach. Yeah- he sucks as an AD but he was pretty high level when it came to baseball. Switching pitchers in the middle of an AB? Bunting at unusual times and stealing some hits? Double steals? Constantly changing lineups based on splits? Sure sometimes it blew up in his face but a lot of the time it worked and it was a big reason why we made it to the finals in 2013 and turned our program around. We were using openers way before it was cool and had a lot of success with it. I think he would have won a NC eventually- maybe by 2021. He got the hair brained idea to become AD right when everyone finally bought in on him after the 2016 SEC title.

Lemonis is your typical baseball coach. He's a CEO coach. Which means his success is basically almost directly based on how good his assistants are. Most of what Lemonis does is make sure everyone shows up to practice, seals the deal in recruiting on visits, makes out the lineup card, and then answers Joel Coleman's question about if he thought Hunter Hines grand slam was a big moment in the game during the postgame interview. Sure, he makes a few decisions here and there about whether to steal base or not and signs off on some things. But think back to 2021- how many truly key decisions did he make? Tanner Leggett's PH and pinch running Brayland Skinner to get to the finals is really the only one I can think of. And even that move- he pinch hit Leggett for Lane Forsythe and pinch ran for Kellum Clark who was as slow as Christmas. Not exactly Tony LaRussa level chess there. The five worst posters on this board know to bring in Landon Sims when the game is on the line.

And with coaches that don't have a pitching background like Lemonis in college especially- they let the pitching coach manage the pitching staff for the most part. Most of the pitch selection was done by Foxhall. Most of the bullpen management was done by Foxhall. Why do y'all think there is that meme out there where Lemonis is cussing out Foxhall during the Auburn series last year? Our pitching staff got better after Foxhall was fired- slightly. It was too far gone at that point for anyone to do anything realistically. Although Roy Oswalt wanted to come help but we turned him down for whatever reason. Not sure how much it would have mattered but it wouldn't have hurt either.

So Lemonis's success is tied to Jake, Cheese, and now Parker. So the only way I can see this not working out is if:

A. Jake suddenly tanks like Foxhall. Which there is zero indication of that happening.

B. Parker is a bad hire. Which would be very surprising given that we hired the guy who had the second best team ERA in the SEC last year which was better than Wes Johnson, Schlossnagle and friends, and Tim Corbin's staff.

[Todd4State]

LSU must be NIL'ing everyone. I was looking for the scout that says Colby Holcombe is a top-5 SEC starter when I saw that LSU is destroying all other programs in recruiting. Not even close.

Even Cam Caminiti (MLB legacy) decommitted Vandy for LSU. These out of region superstars had been the Vandy staple.

Cam Caminiti is going to go in the first round unless he is injured. What's going to happen with Vanderbilt is because of NIL they're going to lose their hardship scholarship advantage that they used to have because now MSU, LSU, Arkansas, and Tennessee are going to be able to essentially match them.

This is a different SEC than when Skip Bertman was around. A lot more parity. I'd be really surprised if you see a true dynasty emerge. I think it's just going to be a bunch of random SEC teams dominating the rest of the country. Already happening really- MSU, LSU, Arkansas, Ole Miss, Vanderbilt, and Florida have all played for or won NC over the past 6 years. Then you have Oklahoma in there too. The only other team in that mix is Oregon State who probably will decline now without the PAC 12. That doesn't include Tennessee who could very well play for one soon, Auburn who Butch has rolling and has Cohen as AD, and Georgia who I think will get better with Wes Johnson, South Carolina, and A&M has Schloss. Alabama could be on the rise too if they can ever get some stability.

As far as Colby Holcombe- let's not all sit around and pretend like we haven't seen guys like Ethan Small, Chris Stratton, and Dakota Hudson make massive jumps later in their MSU careers.

[Todd4State]

Which ones? Bc I haven't had any say that.
I just hope they're right. Would be incredible.

I could probably make a strong case that Colby Holcombe was our most misused and poorly coached pitcher last year. We were asking him to pitch in a way that didn't fit him at all. It was painful to watch. And he knew it too- which is why he got frustrated in game with the pitch selection at times very openly on the mound. I typically don't condone that- but I understand why.

I don't know if he is top five in the SEC or not and I'm not a scout but I could definitely see him having a break out year this year and becoming a first round pick.

[SPMT]

It doesnt matter who disagrees- facts are facts.

Lemon won a championship. Polk did not.

Gene Chizik is more successful than Pat Dye

[SPMT]

Our fans crack me up.

Polk was a great teacher of the game. Maybe the best baseball fundamental teacher of all time behind maybe George Kissell of the St. Louis Cardinals. MLB teams use his book to teach their minor leaguers. That says it all. The reason he doesn't have a National Championship IMO is because he lacked that ruthless killer instinct. Augie Garrido, Cliff Gustafson, and Skip Bertman weren't nearly as good at teaching the game as Polk but the difference is they would ruin a kids career by pitching him 10+ IP in a regional final on 2 days rest to win a title. Polk wasn't going to do that.

Cohen was probably our best X an O's baseball coach. Yeah- he sucks as an AD but he was pretty high level when it came to baseball. Switching pitchers in the middle of an AB? Bunting at unusual times and stealing some hits? Double steals? Constantly changing lineups based on splits? Sure sometimes it blew up in his face but a lot of the time it worked and it was a big reason why we made it to the finals in 2013 and turned our program around. We were using openers way before it was cool and had a lot of success with it. I think he would have won a NC eventually- maybe by 2021. He got the hair brained idea to become AD right when everyone finally bought in on him after the 2016 SEC title.

Lemonis is your typical baseball coach. He's a CEO coach. Which means his success is basically almost directly based on how good his assistants are. Most of what Lemonis does is make sure everyone shows up to practice, seals the deal in recruiting on visits, makes out the lineup card, and then answers Joel Coleman's question about if he thought Hunter Hines grand slam was a big moment in the game during the postgame interview. Sure, he makes a few decisions here and there about whether to steal base or not and signs off on some things. But think back to 2021- how many truly key decisions did he make? Tanner Leggett's PH and pinch running Brayland Skinner to get to the finals is really the only one I can think of. And even that move- he pinch hit Leggett for Lane Forsythe and pinch ran for Kellum Clark who was as slow as Christmas. Not exactly Tony LaRussa level chess there. The five worst posters on this board know to bring in Landon Sims when the game is on the line.

And with coaches that don't have a pitching background like Lemonis in college especially- they let the pitching coach manage the pitching staff for the most part. Most of the pitch selection was done by Foxhall. Most of the bullpen management was done by Foxhall. Why do y'all think there is that meme out there where Lemonis is cussing out Foxhall during the Auburn series last year? Our pitching staff got better after Foxhall was fired- slightly. It was too far gone at that point for anyone to do anything realistically. Although Roy Oswalt wanted to come help but we turned him down for whatever reason. Not sure how much it would have mattered but it wouldn't have hurt either.

So Lemonis's success is tied to Jake, Cheese, and now Parker. So the only way I can see this not working out is if:

A. Jake suddenly tanks like Foxhall. Which there is zero indication of that happening.

B. Parker is a bad hire. Which would be very surprising given that we hired the guy who had the second best team ERA in the SEC last year which was better than Wes Johnson, Schlossnagle and friends, and Tim Corbin's staff.


I recall many many people lamenting the virtues of Lemonis in 2021. The guy was untouchable until halfway/end of 2022. Many many people talked about how good of a job he did in 2022.

My take is, he was very good, then lack of drive and now……we Weill see

[Todd4State]

I recall many many people lamenting the virtues of Lemonis in 2021. The guy was untouchable until halfway/end of 2022. Many many people talked about how good of a job he did in 2022.

My take is, he was very good, then lack of drive and now……we Weill see

I don't think it's lack of drive. I think it's lack of pitching coach. He gambled that Foxhall would turn it around and he lost.

[smootness]

I recall many many people lamenting the virtues of Lemonis in 2021. The guy was untouchable until halfway/end of 2022. Many many people talked about how good of a job he did in 2022.

My take is, he was very good, then lack of drive and now……we Weill see

Huh? Who said he did a good job in 2022?

[Coach34]

The main thing is we have talent. And thats whats needed. The mocks that started coming out after Fall ball have us with 5 Top 100 College players and 3 of them are pitchers. Just look at this mock:

https://futurestarsseries.com/mlb-draft-2024-the-top-200-college-prospects-jac-caglianone/

In the Top 100- Vandy has 7, State, Tenn, and LSU with 5. UPig has 4 and other SEC teams with 1 or 2.

Jordan
Hines
Dohm
Cijntje
Holcombe

We are a Top25 team in 2024

[Todd4State]

The main thing is we have talent. And thats whats needed. The mocks that started coming out after Fall ball have us with 5 Top 100 College players and 3 of them are pitchers. Just look at this mock:

https://futurestarsseries.com/mlb-draft-2024-the-top-200-college-prospects-jac-caglianone/

In the Top 100- Vandy has 7, State, Tenn, and LSU with 5. UPig has 4 and other SEC teams with 1 or 2.

Jordan
Hines
Dohm
Cijntje
Holcombe

We are a Top25 team in 2024

And that's just the draft eligible players. That doesn't include guys like Highfill, Dylan Cupp, Mershon or seniors like Larry, Kohler, and Hujsack.

Cam Schuelke is going to help out the bullpen a lot too.

Oh and we get Simmons and Auger back too.

[The Federalist Engineer]

The main thing is we have talent. And thats whats needed. The mocks that started coming out after Fall ball have us with 5 Top 100 College players and 3 of them are pitchers. Just look at this mock:

https://futurestarsseries.com/mlb-draft-2024-the-top-200-college-prospects-jac-caglianone/

In the Top 100- Vandy has 7, State, Tenn, and LSU with 5. UPig has 4 and other SEC teams with 1 or 2.

Jordan
Hines
Dohm
Cijntje
Holcombe

We are a Top25 team in 2024

If we get SEC Ace level performances from two dudes, then yes. I think something we have learned is that draft prospect and college performance is not 1:1

In all seriousness, I think I saw more written about Stinnett and KC Hunt potential than Ethan Small or ever heard about Pilk.

We have many candidates for a leap, need 6 or 7 decent dudes to step up and 1 or 2 arms to really step up. Holcombe is could be that guy.

[BrunswickDawg]

I think people are going to be shocked at how much Foxhall just killed us the past 2 seasons. He set us back tremendously in development his whole time here and it caught up with us the last 2 seasons.
Everybody regressed. We masked that in '21 with talent, depth, and age/maturity - and by having 24 pitchers throw that season.

[AlSwearengen]

since it has been awhile now and I saw pitchers allude to it somewhat in post fall interviews. To what extent was Foxhall removed from coaching? Was he missing practices and workouts and how often was it? What was the deal? I can't imagine just missing work all the time.

[Randolph Dupree]

since it has been awhile now and I saw pitchers allude to it somewhat in post fall interviews. To what extent was Foxhall removed from coaching? Was he missing practices and workouts and how often was it? What was the deal? I can't imagine just missing work all the time.

That's hard to say and I'm not sure you could ever get the truth but my impression was it was quite a bit. I know he missed at least one prospect camp (had Cole Gordon filling in at that one) and I was told he missed another. It may have not been so much the physical absence as much as it was disengaged. That and I get the impression that there was a lot of in season tinkering with things and guys got uncomfortable and lost confidence. At this point in the year your pitchers are what they are. You can make slight tweaks to mechanics as things get out of whack (like golfers do) but for the guys that are going to be a major piece in the rotation, they should only be getting their arms stretched and perfecting mechanics.

[State82]

Oh and we get Simmons and Auger back too.

Are they pushing two years post-op after TJ surgery?

[Todd4State]

Are they pushing two years post-op after TJ surgery?

I think right now they're close to two years out come opening day.

[Todd4State]

That's hard to say and I'm not sure you could ever get the truth but my impression was it was quite a bit. I know he missed at least one prospect camp (had Cole Gordon filling in at that one) and I was told he missed another. It may have not been so much the physical absence as much as it was disengaged. That and I get the impression that there was a lot of in season tinkering with things and guys got uncomfortable and lost confidence. At this point in the year your pitchers are what they are. You can make slight tweaks to mechanics as things get out of whack (like golfers do) but for the guys that are going to be a major piece in the rotation, they should only be getting their arms stretched and perfecting mechanics.

I think Foxhall got burned out and lost his way.

Then again even in 2021 there were signs- Cerentola didn't develop. MacLeoud regressed and later we found out he got hurt. Fristoe also regressed. It's just that Bednar, Sims, Harding, and Preston Johnson covered up a lot that year.

[CaptainObvious]

That's hard to say and I'm not sure you could ever get the truth but my impression was it was quite a bit. I know he missed at least one prospect camp (had Cole Gordon filling in at that one) and I was told he missed another. It may have not been so much the physical absence as much as it was disengaged. That and I get the impression that there was a lot of in season tinkering with things and guys got uncomfortable and lost confidence. At this point in the year your pitchers are what they are. You can make slight tweaks to mechanics as things get out of whack (like golfers do) but for the guys that are going to be a major piece in the rotation, they should only be getting their arms stretched and perfecting mechanics.

It seemed to me that the new Strike zone in 2023 affected our pitchers more than other teams. Maybe Foxhall was old school and just couldn't get his pitchers adapted to the new tighter zone where they no longer got the call 4 inches off the plate. The hitters knew they didn't have to chase those any more and Foxhall couldn't get his pitchers to try and pitch to weak contact.

[Coach34]

Are they pushing two years post-op after TJ surgery?

Yeah- they should both be 100%

[DawgFromOxford]

If Lemonis doesn't make a super regional or at the least get eliminated in the last game of a regional, I think it's time to move on. No excuses if you're coaching MSU baseball and go 3 years in a row without finishing in the top 32 teams.

[Todd4State]

It seemed to me that the new Strike zone in 2023 affected our pitchers more than other teams. Maybe Foxhall was old school and just couldn't get his pitchers adapted to the new tighter zone where they no longer got the call 4 inches off the plate. The hitters knew they didn't have to chase those any more and Foxhall couldn't get his pitchers to try and pitch to weak contact.

I think we had a lot of issues going on. We had the same pattern with our pitchers too much and had too many guys with similar stuff and arm angles which makes it easy for SEC hitters to sit and eliminate pitches.

We also left guys in way too long.

[Todd4State]

If Lemonis doesn't make a super regional or at the least get eliminated in the last game of a regional, I think it's time to move on. No excuses if you're coaching MSU baseball and go 3 years in a row without finishing in the top 32 teams.

I agree.

[BrunswickDawg]

It seemed to me that the new Strike zone in 2023 affected our pitchers more than other teams. Maybe Foxhall was old school and just couldn't get his pitchers adapted to the new tighter zone where they no longer got the call 4 inches off the plate. The hitters knew they didn't have to chase those any more and Foxhall couldn't get his pitchers to try and pitch to weak contact.

He had pitchers intentionally pitching up in the zone like they had 105 heat who didn't, and then had them nibble on the corners knowing they had tightened the zone. Just bad all around.

[basedog]

I think people are going to be shocked at how much Foxhall just killed us the past 2 seasons. He set us back tremendously in development his whole time here and it caught up with us the last 2 seasons.
Everybody regressed. We masked that in '21 with talent, depth, and age/maturity - and by having 24 pitchers throw that season.

No doubt about the lack of development by Foxhall, it was like he was in a fog.

[Commercecomet24]

He had pitchers intentionally pitching up in the zone like they had 105 heat who didn't, and then had them nibble on the corners knowing they had tightened the zone. Just bad all around.

100%! I can give you a perfect example of this. Landon Gartman ,I've watched this kid pitch since he was a young'un. Heavy sinker and got a ton of ground balls and never walked many or gave up many hrs. What did foxhall do to him? Had him start pitching up in the zone with 92-93 instead of using what worked for him and he wasn't the same pitcher. He did that to more than one. He used a a cookie cutter, one size fits all approach to our pitchers instead of accentuating their strengths and what they did best.

[basedog]

100%! I can give you a perfect example of this. Landon Gartman ,I've watched this kid pitch since he was a young'un. Heavy sinker and got a ton of ground balls and never walked many or gave up many hrs. What did foxhall do to him? Had him start pitching up in the zone with 92-93 instead of using what worked for him and he wasn't the same pitcher. He did that to more than one. He used a a cookie cutter, one size fits all approach to our pitchers instead of accentuating their strengths and what they did best.

Sounds exactly like Cade. His breaking ball was his out pitch and he could throw it for strikes on any count. He also was throwing 93-94 up in zone with Foxhall. That wasn't Cade.

[Mjoelner34]

100%! I can give you a perfect example of this. Landon Gartman ,I've watched this kid pitch since he was a young'un. Heavy sinker and got a ton of ground balls and never walked many or gave up many hrs. What did foxhall do to him? Had him start pitching up in the zone with 92-93 instead of using what worked for him and he wasn't the same pitcher. He did that to more than one. He used a a cookie cutter, one size fits all approach to our pitchers instead of accentuating their strengths and what they did best.

Sims and Bednar were the worst things to happen to Foxhall. After the success of those two, he fell in love with the high 4-seamer and tried to turn the entire staff into Sims and Bednar. Lazy? Incompetent? Or both?

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

Nobody is accepting anything. Our most successful coach is school history gets 1 last shot to show he deserves the job. We just arent LSU and there is nothing wrong with that. We arent Bama is football either and never will be.

We fired our coach in baseball- we hired about our 7th choice in Lemon. LSU fired/retired Maneiri- got their 1st choice. Too many of our fans act like we can just hire anybody. We just saw in football how we dont get established coaches. Kansas and Kansas St coaches would not even consider our job. Fritz wanted to coach at Houston more than take our job (obviously age and family weighed heavily there)- we have to get coordinator-types.

Lemon will prove he is the guy this Spring or he will lose it. It's pretty cut and dried

State baseball is about like Tennessee football

And if Huepel won a Natty, then finished 14th and 13th in the SEC the next 2 seasons, he'd be fired.

[the_real_MSU_is_us]

End of the summer last year I had a lot of arguments with Todd and C34 on this. Todd said we had to keep Lemo to keep the recruiting class together, C34 said the Natty got him an extra year, btoh of them said we wouldn't be able to hire anyone. I said he already had a suck year to wake him up and this 13rd place finish was the best he could do, so it's unlikely he'll turn it around in '24.

It's all in the past now. Lemo has to put up or shut up. C34 is correct we have top 25 talent, probably top 15 honestly. But these past 2 seasons we certainly had Hoover talent and yet we didn't make it. At the end of the day, what's best for State is for me to be wrong and Lemo to get back to Supers. There's no excuses this year, as we'll loose the bulk of the lineup in '25 and probably be worse overall. Now or never. Sure hope I'm eating crow in 5 months

[CaptainObvious]

Or.... Lemonis lays another egg, but because the Admin postponed the inevitable, 2024 and 2025 are a complete bomb out. And we hire our 8th choice this time and it takes 5 years to figure out he ain't the right guy either!

[Todd4State]

100%! I can give you a perfect example of this. Landon Gartman ,I've watched this kid pitch since he was a young'un. Heavy sinker and got a ton of ground balls and never walked many or gave up many hrs. What did foxhall do to him? Had him start pitching up in the zone with 92-93 instead of using what worked for him and he wasn't the same pitcher. He did that to more than one. He used a a cookie cutter, one size fits all approach to our pitchers instead of accentuating their strengths and what they did best.

It's insane. I'm not even sure why anyone would think to do that especially a SEC level pitching coach. Which is why I think he simply lost his way.


Sims and Bednar were the worst things to happen to Foxhall. After the success of those two, he fell in love with the high 4-seamer and tried to turn the entire staff into Sims and Bednar. Lazy? Incompetent? Or both?

Sims and Bednar happen to have stuff that fit what Foxhall wanted to do. It works IF you have that skill set. The thing is as we have discussed everyone has different skill sets and the pitching coach has to figure out the best plan for each pitcher to succeed. What's sad is we have the pitching lab that a lot of pitching coaches would kill to have and Foxhall basically used it to chase velocity.


End of the summer last year I had a lot of arguments with Todd and C34 on this. Todd said we had to keep Lemo to keep the recruiting class together, C34 said the Natty got him an extra year, btoh of them said we wouldn't be able to hire anyone. I said he already had a suck year to wake him up and this 13rd place finish was the best he could do, so it's unlikely he'll turn it around in '24.

It's all in the past now. Lemo has to put up or shut up. C34 is correct we have top 25 talent, probably top 15 honestly. But these past 2 seasons we certainly had Hoover talent and yet we didn't make it. At the end of the day, what's best for State is for me to be wrong and Lemo to get back to Supers. There's no excuses this year, as we'll loose the bulk of the lineup in '25 and probably be worse overall. Now or never. Sure hope I'm eating crow in 5 months

And we were right. Just be glad you weren't able to find out or we would be starting a bad three year stretch followed by a major rebuild. He'll either turn it around or he won't- but the reality is all of our top head coaching candidates are still available and basically in the same spot they were last year- and we're now even more likely to get them because if Lemonis fails the new guy will inherit a ton of talent not just from what we have on campus now- but also what we will be adding in the next class.

Fortunately we have enough baseball leaders that understand that this isn't football and cutting our nose to spite our face isn't the right move.