Hev Whiffs Again

[msstate7]

Well actually we are overall a productive offense but the problem is when we play teams that have really talented defensive lines. Like Bama every year, LSU most years, or even UNM (in 2014 and 2015). When we get against those type teams we can't run the ball and our QB gets sacked over and over because our OL gets totally exposed. Hev is fine if we are satisfied with being average to good on offense (i.e 6-8 wins per year most years) but that is our ceiling with the current level of OL play we have. And a lot of that is based on how experienced we happen to be. 2014 we had just average talent on the OL but they had all played together for 3-4 years.

Lsu got us good in sacks, but aTm and bama were 1-2 in sec in sacks and only got 3 combined (all 3 by bama which was one of their lowest totals on the year)

If you take the average of lsu, aTm, and bama sacks per game, it comes out to 3.2 per game. Against those 3, we gave up 9 sacks, so 3.0 per game... less than their normal

[Irondawg]

I have no doubt we were better last year but it's because we had some experience there but we were razor thin. We've been relatively fortunate with injuries but if we had 2 guys go down we'd be in big trouble I fear.
Plus the argument is really his recruiting and can he convince guys to play here.

We just don't win a lot of those and you have multiple reports that he's really bad at recruiting. So thinknif we could get him more talent because overall the coaching itself has been fine.

[Dawg61]

but the problem is when we play teams that have really talented defensive lines. Like Bama every year, LSU most years,

Don't be another victim of Saban destroying football programs. Nobody can run on Saban. Nobody! He has been top 10 in the nation vs the run every year he has been at Bama and FOUR OF THOSE TIMES he had the #1 rushing defense in the country. Saban is driving everyone in the SEC to destroy their programs and try with someone new because NOBODY can beat him. Florida is on its second coach since Meyer left and they are still not happy at all. Georgia fired Richt and aren't very happy with the new guy. Tennessee is on their 3rd coach since firing Fulmer and are a 6-6 season away from turning on Butch. South Carolina = not happy. Missouri = not happy. Kentucky wasn't happy till the end of this last year. Vanderbilt is the only school in the East currently feeling pretty solid with their coach that won't turn on him very quickly. Auburn = not happy and about to fire Gus this next year probably. Old Misses is a disaster. aTm is not happy and wants to fire their coach. Arkansas is not happy and are 50/50 on firing fat Burt. LSU just fired their coach and will turn on Ogre as soon as he can't beat Bama.

The reason all these schools are not happy is ultimately because of Saban and Bama. Everyone wants what they got. Everyone wants to be that good. Nobody is that good every year but Saban. Don't let Saban do to us what he has done to every other SEC fanbase except Vanderbilt.

[maroonmania]

Don't be another victim of Saban destroying football programs. Nobody can run on Saban. Nobody! He has been top 10 in the nation vs the run every year he has been at Bama and FOUR OF THOSE TIMES he had the #1 rushing defense in the country. Saban is driving everyone in the SEC to destroy their programs and try with someone new because NOBODY can beat him. Florida is on its second coach since Meyer left and they are still not happy at all. Georgia fired Richt and aren't very happy with the new guy. Tennessee is on their 3rd coach since firing Fulmer and are a 6-6 season away from turning on Butch. South Carolina = not happy. Missouri = not happy. Kentucky wasn't happy till the end of this last year. Vanderbilt is the only school in the East currently feeling pretty solid with their coach that won't turn on him very quickly. Auburn = not happy and about to fire Gus this next year probably. Old Misses is a disaster. aTm is not happy and wants to fire their coach. Arkansas is not happy and are 50/50 on firing fat Burt. LSU just fired their coach and will turn on Ogre as soon as he can't beat Bama.

The reason all these schools are not happy is ultimately because of Saban and Bama. Everyone wants what they got. Everyone wants to be that good. Nobody is that good every year but Saban. Don't let Saban do to us what he has done to every other SEC fanbase except Vanderbilt.

Like I've said, most years our OL is serviceable enough to win 7-8 games if we have a decent defense. This year we didn't have a decent defense so we were down at 5 wins. Now in 2015, running wasn't just a Bama problem, it was the fact we couldn't run on anyone, not even Troy. So that year we just let Dak throw it or scramble out of the pocket 90% of the time. And that worked a lot until Dak almost got killed by the pass rush of the Bama and UNM DLs. This year we improved significantly on that. Hev is a pretty decent OL coach and we do luck up into enough developmental talent that we can usually field a competitive offense overall. SO, if it is going to take having offenses multiple years at the bottom of the NCAA rankings (like we had defensively this year) then you are right, Hev will be here forever, because that is unlikely to happen. But I don't realistically ever see us being a real factor to challenge for the West with the current quality of Hev's unit either except on very rare occasions like 2014 where a bunch of guys have played together a LONG time.

[lamont]

There are 2-3 teams every year that we can't block- it's not just Bama

2014- it was OM, UPig, and Bama
2015/ it was Bama, LSU, and OM until the game was out of reach and we scored on the last 2 drives in the 4th
2016- it was LSU, Auburn, and Bama

Our lack of talent on the OL will always keep us in the 6-8 win range. The SEC is a LOS league.

[HoopsDawg]

Like I've said, most years our OL is serviceable enough to win 7-8 games if we have a decent defense. This year we didn't have a decent defense so we were down at 5 wins. Now in 2015, running wasn't just a Bama problem, it was the fact we couldn't run on anyone, not even Troy. So that year we just let Dak throw it or scramble out of the pocket 90% of the time. And that worked a lot until Dak almost got killed by the pass rush of the Bama and UNM DLs. This year we improved significantly on that. Hev is a pretty decent OL coach and we do luck up into enough developmental talent that we can usually field a competitive offense overall. SO, if it is going to take having offenses multiple years at the bottom of the NCAA rankings (like we had defensively this year) then you are right, Hev will be here forever, because that is unlikely to happen. But I don't realistically ever see us being a real factor to challenge for the West with the current quality of Hev's unit either except on very rare occasions like 2014 where a bunch of guys have played together a LONG time.

Never argue with just one person. There is always going to be one or two posters that don't get it.

[Dawg61]

There are 2-3 teams every year that we can't block- it's not just Bama

How many SEC programs have averaged 9.5 wins a year for the last 8 years?

[msstate7]

There are 2-3 teams every year that we can't block- it's not just Bama

2014- it was OM, UPig, and Bama
2015/ it was Bama, LSU, and OM until the game was out of reach and we scored on the last 2 drives in the 4th
2016- it was LSU, Auburn, and Bama

Our lack of talent on the OL will always keep us in the 6-8 win range. The SEC is a LOS league.

Isn't that true for every team in the sec save bama?

[Commercecomet24]

Isn't that true for every team in the sec save bama?

Yes.

[lamont]

How many SEC programs have averaged 9.5 wins a year for the last 8 years?

We don't average 9.5 wins per year under Mullen

Under 8 years of Mullen we have:

2 5 win seasons
2 6 win seasons
3 8 win seasons
1 10 win season

50% of Mullen's tenure we have won 6 games or less. And we also play the easiest OOC every season in the SEC. We have rarely played another P5 school outside the SEC in the regular season

And those are the kinds of results you expect with our OL recruiting

[msstate7]

Yes.

Kinda what I thought. So if we get rid of our oline coach that obviously does a decent to good job, will we be guaranteed to recruit olinemen better than aTm, lsu, auburn, etc?

[msstate7]

We don't average 9.5 wins per year under Mullen

Under 8 years of Mullen we have:

2 5 win seasons
2 6 win seasons
3 8 win seasons
1 10 win season

50% of Mullen's tenure we have won 6 games or less. And we also play the easiest OOC every season in the SEC. We have rarely played another P5 school outside the SEC in the regular season

And those are the kinds of results you expect with our OL recruiting

Yet smart won 8 games this year according to you.

[Really Clark?]

There are 2-3 teams every year that we can't block- it's not just Bama

2014- it was OM, UPig, and Bama
2015/ it was Bama, LSU, and OM until the game was out of reach and we scored on the last 2 drives in the 4th
2016- it was LSU, Auburn, and Bama

Our lack of talent on the OL will always keep us in the 6-8 win range. The SEC is a LOS league.

Wait a minute, as someone who wants Hev replaced, I can't let you cherry pick like that. That is completely intellectual and statistically dishonest. You can't just be aribitrary like that. You could take any team, even Bama, and make that type of accusation and make it hold up statistically that an OL has trouble with 2-3 teams a year. You have to have a baseline, context, a bigger sample size, similar opponents, and if you are going over multiple years you have to have a specific criteria. You cannot just take 2-3 arbitrary teams each season, with that also not exactly same, that we struggled with and say it's always 2-3 teams without some specific criteria. You can say that about every team in the country, college or pro, and made a weakness sound worse.

Conversely, same applies the opposite direction. You can't just cherry pick the best 2-3 games either. The man is an albatross as a recruiter and because of other issues he needs to be replaced. But he can coach football and the OL. Coach57, whom many many on here have respect for, as said it multiply times. That's not the issue. There are not many OL coach who are decent recruiters and I don't care if they are because they need to be a coach first and last. He just can't overcome his negative recruiting at this point (from the outside as well) to make up for it with his coaching.

[msstate7]

Never argue with just one person. There is always going to be one or two posters that don't get it.

Apparently Mullen doesn't get it either. If only Mullen were as smart as us on ED...

[lamont]

Yet smart won 8 games this year according to you.

Smart was 7-5 in the regular season. That's where you are judged

[msstate7]

Smart was 7-5 in the regular season. That's where you are judged

Bama should be champions... they were 12-0 in regular season and Clemson was only 11-1.

[lamont]

Wait a minute, as someone who wants Hev replaced, I can't let you cherry pick like that. That is completely intellectual and statistically dishonest. You can't just be aribitrary like that. You could take any team, even Bama, and make that type of accusation and make it hold up statistically that an OL has trouble with 2-3 teams a year. You have to have a baseline, context, a bigger sample size, similar opponents, and if you are going over multiple years you have to have a specific criteria. You cannot just take 2-3 arbitrary teams each season, with that also not exactly same, that we struggled with and say it's always 2-3 teams without some specific criteria. You can say that about every team in the country, college or pro, and made a weakness sound worse.

Conversely, same applies the opposite direction. You can't just cherry pick the best 2-3 games either. The man is an albatross as a recruiter and because of other issues he needs to be replaced. But he can coach football and the OL. Coach57, whom many many on here have respect for, as said it multiply times. That's not the issue. There are not many OL coach who are decent recruiters and I don't care if they are because they need to be a coach first and last. He just can't overcome his negative recruiting at this point (from the outside as well) to make up for it with his coaching.

Hev is a very good OL coach- I've never said different. But I do say that we simply don't recruit enough talent on the OL to have a serious chance at winning the SEC

[lamont]

Bama should be champions... they were 12-0 in regular season and Clemson was only 11-1.

You are just being thick headed on purpose right now.

Bama was judged on their regular season and chosen for the playoffs.
We were judged on our regular season and played a nobody from a shit conference

[msstate7]

Hev is a very good OL coach- I've never said different. But I do say that we simply don't recruit enough talent on the OL to have a serious chance at winning the SEC

Apparently neither does lsu, Georgia, Florida, aTm, etc

[msstate7]

You are just being thick headed on purpose right now.

Bama was judged on their regular season and chosen for the playoffs.
We were judged on our regular season and played a nobody from a shit conference

Postseason games count. You telling me our win over Michigan in '10 was less than our win over Alcorn state?